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View Full Version : Are AW & the board out of touch with the fans?



budesonide
24-05-2011, 08:50 PM
I got ths from another poster on a blog somewhere; and I believe this typifies the shocking disconnect between Arsene/the board and the fans:

All he {wenger} has to say is “This season has not been good enough, we have underperformed and i will do everything in my power to make it right”

to which the board would say

“Arsene has identified players to sign in the summer, we will do everything to make it happen, next season you will see the real Arsenal”

Now that is a statement of intent!!


And I fully agree with this. Frankly, some of the comments AW has been coming out with is seriously disrespectful. This is the sign of a man who has lost touch; the same goes for PHW and I am sure his cohorts on the board.

EDIT: The above comment was in regard to AW's comments when was asked about the away fans' chant to "spend some fuck*ing money".

The Wengerbabies
24-05-2011, 08:52 PM
In a word, yes.

In two words, hell yes.

Xhaka Can’t
24-05-2011, 08:54 PM
Never more so has this been as true as it is today.

Darth Vela
24-05-2011, 08:58 PM
I think he tries to be too smart in interviews imo which leads to some silly comments. He tries to tread a line where he's not outright lying but nor is he particularly saying anything, the truth but not the whole truth if you like.

Anyway, haven't we actually said that? I seem to remember reading a quote from Wenger saying that we have a list of targets and we're looking to strengthen and anyone who can get anything other than 'we haven't been good enough and will try to improve next year' from the myriad comments Wenger has made about it is an idiot.

Edit: I should probably mention that I do think there's something of a disconnection between the board/Wenger and the fans, just not in that particular statement.

Niall_Quinn
24-05-2011, 09:05 PM
He's counter-balanced that with the financial doping and "sensible" spending line as well, "sensible" being not enough to get in the room, as we know. Isn't this the same trick pulled every year? Make bold statements about signing players and then shrug when the £2.50 offer is rejected? I'm surprised Wenger doesn't starve to death, I can see him going around Tesco with a trolley and complaining at every price tag, trying to get more money off in the reduced section until the store manager loses patience and throws him out.

budesonide
24-05-2011, 09:07 PM
I think he tries to be too smart in interviews imo which leads to some silly comments. He tries to tread a line where he's not outright lying but nor is he particularly saying anything, the truth but not the whole truth if you like.

Anyway, haven't we actually said that? I seem to remember reading a quote from Wenger saying that we have a list of targets and we're looking to strengthen and anyone who can get anything other than 'we haven't been good enough and will try to improve next year' from the myriad comments Wenger has made about it is an idiot.

Edit: I should probably mention that I do think there's something of a disconnection between the board/Wenger and the fans, just not in that particular statement.

I am sure you will forgive these idiots because it so happens that whatever passable owning up wenger does, it is masked in a load of excuses, insults to intellligence, strawmen and red herrings and sanctimonious pap.

Master Splinter
24-05-2011, 09:09 PM
I'm surprised Wenger doesn't starve to death, I can see him going around Tesco with a trolley and complaining at every price tag, trying to get more money off in the reduced section until the store manager loses patience and throws him out.

:haha:

This is the funniest thing you've said in a while.

budesonide
24-05-2011, 09:13 PM
I'm surprised Wenger doesn't starve to death, I can see him going around Tesco with a trolley and complaining at every price tag, trying to get more money off in the reduced section until the store manager loses patience and throws him out.

He tried that (well, not literally that) at Monaco and he got sacked.

Marc Overmars
24-05-2011, 09:41 PM
Well you only have to read comments coming out of the club over the past month to know how out of touch they are. PHW threatening to cut off the supporters trust because they dared question what was going on and now Wenger's patronising comments about needing to be sensible in the market, like we're all Football Manager raving lunatics that want to spend 40m on one player.

There has been an increased feeling of alienation from the club this season which can't be denied.

Cripps_orig
24-05-2011, 09:44 PM
Very much so.

Its a case of us and them now. They i believe are in it for the money. Increasing the season ticket prices, not spending, being happy with top 4 rather than going all out for the title and so on is proof of that.

I used to back the board and manager 18 odd months ago but times have changed...well times have but the team hasnt and we are as shit now as we were then.

Xhaka Can’t
24-05-2011, 10:19 PM
He's counter-balanced that with the financial doping and "sensible" spending line as well, "sensible" being not enough to get in the room, as we know. Isn't this the same trick pulled every year? Make bold statements about signing players and then shrug when the £2.50 offer is rejected? I'm surprised Wenger doesn't starve to death, I can see him going around Tesco with a trolley and complaining at every price tag, trying to get more money off in the reduced section until the store manager loses patience and throws him out.
He shops at Waitrose Whetstone and occaisionally eats at The Rotisserie. Not that I stalk him. :ninja:

http://www.london-eating.co.uk/6674.htm

Niall_Quinn
24-05-2011, 10:52 PM
He shops at Waitrose Whetstone and occaisionally eats at The Rotisserie. Not that I stalk him. :ninja:

http://www.london-eating.co.uk/6674.htm

Only because he got thrown out of Tesco, Morrisons, Walmart and initially Aldi. Apparently Poundstretcher have his mugshot in all their stores in case he tries to come back again.

LDG
25-05-2011, 08:30 AM
Of course they're out of touch.

We lost The Arsenal as soon as we moved stadia. Replaced with "Arsenalisation" and Americanisation.

The soul has gone from the club. The fans are the only thing that link our history with this current set of cunts; Players, manager and board alike. We're a brand in all senses of the word. Right down to the football on the pitch.

"Play attractive football" get the fans in, make the money, job done. Sorry you cunts, but it's backfired like a sunday morning turd.

Letters
25-05-2011, 08:32 AM
Of course they're out of touch.

We lost The Arsenal as soon as we moved stadia. Replaced with "Arsenalisation" and Americanisation.

The soul has gone from the club. The fans are the only thing that link our history with this current set of cunts; Players, manager and board alike. We're a brand in all senses of the word. Right down to the football on the pitch.

"Play attractive football" get the fans in, make the money, job done. Sorry you cunts, but it's backfired like a sunday morning turd.

Whilst I mostly agree, I don't think this is a problem which is unique at Arsenal.
Football isn't a sport any more, it's a business, and Arsenal are run like any business is run, to maximise income.

Özim
25-05-2011, 08:40 AM
Whilst I mostly agree, I don't think this is a problem which is unique at Arsenal.
Football isn't a sport any more, it's a business, and Arsenal are run like any business is run, to maximise income.
Maybe but I think the other big clubs at least try and deliver in some form, whether it be by winning trophies or by spending money to try and win trophies.

Arsenal fans get none of that, we get cheap nobodies, sky high ticket prices and ridiculed if we dare to question anything.

Some of the comments that have been made have been plain out of order, but they seem to think they can get away with it...you wouldn't hear other big companies ridiculing clients.

If we are a business, then what is it they say...."the customer is always right".

IBK
25-05-2011, 09:27 AM
Whilst I mostly agree, I don't think this is a problem which is unique at Arsenal.
Football isn't a sport any more, it's a business, and Arsenal are run like any business is run, to maximise income.

Correct. I think that the real problem at Arsenal, however, is that an obvious arrogance has developed at manager/Chairman level which is unusual (bar the odd Freddie Shepherd). There is a clear mentality that all Gooners (or at least those who, having been patient for a long time, are starting to question what is going on) are small-minded and short-sighted idiots.

2 reasons for this, IMO. At board level there is a failure to comprehend how, having been given a new stadium and CL football, the fans can be anything but deleriously happy.

And at managerial level its part and parcel of the fact that AW, since DD's departure appears to be able to brook no questioning whatsoever of his methods. If that's true at board /executive level, its really not difficult to imagine that he genuinely looks down on the fans.

Flavs
25-05-2011, 09:57 AM
As i have been saying fro about 10 years now, dont pay any attention to what Wenger or the board say, its PR advised, over egged hype for the fans.

The real thing to do is wonder not what Arsene is saying but why he is saying it. You can also do the same with Fergie, Moronio and all the otehr top managers.

Flavs
25-05-2011, 09:59 AM
Maybe but I think the other big clubs at least try and deliver in some form, whether it be by winning trophies or by spending money to try and win trophies.

Arsenal fans get none of that, we get cheap nobodies, sky high ticket prices and ridiculed if we dare to question anything.

Some of the comments that have been mafe have been plain out of order, but they seem to think they can get away with it...you wouldn't hear other big companies ridiculing clients.

If we are a business, then what is it they say...."the customer is always right".

Actually the real success in business is simply to make the customer think they are always right

IBK
25-05-2011, 10:35 AM
As i have been saying fro about 10 years now, dont pay any attention to what Wenger or the board say, its PR advised, over egged hype for the fans.

The real thing to do is wonder not what Arsene is saying "ut why he is saying it. You can also do the same with Fergie, Moronio and all the otehr top managers.

Ironic how AW prides himself on 'doing it the right way' in terms of his football - but is one of the leading exponents of doublespeak; misleading and ambiguous statements; moving goalposts and mind games when it comes to the fans.

selassie
25-05-2011, 10:45 AM
Yup, AW & the board (especially PHW) are way out of touch with the fans. It's like a dictatorship, you've got PHW saying stuff like fans are stupid people if we dare question the way the club/team is being managed.

We've got a Manager who harps on about the ethics of finances & fair market rules.

On top of that there is a 6% increase on ST, we already pay the highest prices by a distance.

Yet we hardly invest a penny in the team, it's actually quite comical.

You certainly don't get what you pay for at Arsenal.

budesonide
25-05-2011, 10:52 AM
As i have been saying fro about 10 years now, dont pay any attention to what Wenger or the board say, its PR advised, over egged hype for the fans.

The real thing to do is wonder not what Arsene is saying but why he is saying it. You can also do the same with Fergie, Moronio and all the otehr top managers.

Well, then that's some awful PR we've got then. Because I don't think you will find any company in the world -- at least similar in stature to arsenal -- that would have their top brass speak down so arrogantly to its 'customers'.

As pointed out by others, all these folks at the top and wenger have to do is merely speak in terms that satisfy the paying customer. But that even seems to be beyond these bunch these days. When AW and PHW arrogantly dismiss the 'customers' concerns and reformulate these concerns into exaggerated nonsense, that is taking the biscuit.

As to why AW says these things, well, because he can. And that's the problem methinks.

The Wengerbabies
25-05-2011, 10:56 AM
On top of that there is a 6% increase on ST, we already pay the highest prices by a distance.

Yet we hardly invest a penny in the team, it's actually quite comical.

You certainly don't get what you pay for at Arsenal.

Not to mention the football is boring and predictable.

Özim
25-05-2011, 11:02 AM
Actually the real success in business is simply to make the customer think they are always right
That's true but I wasn't saying they are always right, just using the saying which means you agree with them to keep them happy and deal with the issue in hand to their satisfaction.

The point is these guys tell the fans they are wrong without hesitation....doesn't make great business sense.

Flavs
25-05-2011, 11:20 AM
Well, then that's some awful PR we've got then. Because I don't think you will find any company in the world -- at least similar in stature to arsenal -- that would have their top brass speak down so arrogantly to its 'customers'.

As pointed out by others, all these folks at the top and wenger have to do is merely speak in terms that satisfy the paying customer. But that even seems to be beyond these bunch these days. When AW and PHW arrogantly dismiss the 'customers' concerns and reformulate these concerns into exaggerated nonsense, that is taking the biscuit.

As to why AW says these things, well, because he can. And that's the problem methinks.

I think its more a case that they are saying the same things that they have been for years its just now the team isnt performing as they should be it all looks a little out of context. That doesnt change the fact that Wenger has never been "truthful" in the media and has always been more of a spin doctor

As for PHW he is right most football fans are morons most of the time tbh.

budesonide
25-05-2011, 11:37 AM
As for PHW he is right most football fans are morons most of the time tbh.

Well, he has every right to think that. Charging the highest ticket prices around and still getting the stadium filled with no sign of winning anything. Football fans are indeed morons most of the time.

What he fails to realise is that not all fans are morons all of the time. He should wait till the end of next season when we see the same shi*t on the pitch again.

Flavs
25-05-2011, 11:40 AM
Well, he has every right to think that. Charging the highest ticket prices around and still getting the stadium filled with no sign of winning anything. Football fans are indeed morons most of the time.

What he fails to realise is that not all fans are morons all of the time. He should wait till the end of next season when we see the same shi*t on the pitch again.

Oh i think unless we are there or thereabouts at Xmas Wenger will be replaced.

The Wengerbabies
25-05-2011, 04:24 PM
Oh i think unless we are there or thereabouts at Xmas Wenger will be replaced.
Trouble is we will be there or there abouts at Xmas, its after that when we will collapse.

LDG
25-05-2011, 04:28 PM
:lol:

:crying:

Dicks and chicks
11-01-2013, 11:01 PM
yes.

GP
11-01-2013, 11:25 PM
Stop bumping old threads ffs.

Kano
11-01-2013, 11:33 PM
I got ths from another poster on a blog somewhere; and I believe this typifies the shocking disconnect between Arsene/the board and the fans:

All he {wenger} has to say is “This season has not been good enough, we have underperformed and i will do everything in my power to make it right”

to which the board would say

“Arsene has identified players to sign in the summer, we will do everything to make it happen, next season you will see the real Arsenal”

Now that is a statement of intent!!


And I fully agree with this. Frankly, some of the comments AW has been coming out with is seriously disrespectful. This is the sign of a man who has lost touch; the same goes for PHW and I am sure his cohorts on the board.

EDIT: The above comment was in regard to AW's comments when was asked about the away fans' chant to "spend some fuck*ing money".
by their very nature, any board will be out of touch with the fans because of the money they earn and their status, so no surprise there.

wenger is the ultimate football politician who would fit in perfectly at uefa or fifa if he chose to go that route - or even amongst the real knobheads in parliament.

nothing is different from when he first arrived. back then he gave exactly the same answers.

the difference now is that we notice it more because we are no longer winning things.

Xhaka Can’t
12-01-2013, 08:19 AM
Stop bumping old threads ffs.

I don't have an issue with this thead being bumped.

In answer to the thread title - they are out of touch, but I honestly don't think they give a damn other than the day or two a year Gazidis has to face the fans.

'Thank-you for your interest in our affairs' tells you all you really need to know about where we stand.

Dicks and chicks
12-01-2013, 09:22 AM
Stop bumping old threads ffs.

did it to show how little our club has progressed.

McNamara That Ghost...
12-01-2013, 09:34 AM
did it to show how little our club has progressed.

If you're going to do it, at least contribute something construtive to the thread when you do so. Hence why I've deleted the most recent posts on the Bischoff thread.

Kano
12-01-2013, 02:03 PM
did it to show how little our club has progressed.
without meaning to sound too rude, are you little bit spaz?

Maestro
12-01-2013, 08:10 PM
:haha:
without meaning to sound too rude, are you little bit spaz?

:haha:

I know your question is sincere. Tbf he's spammed the board with bumped threads

fakeyank
13-01-2013, 04:36 AM
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4740935/Wojciech-Szczesny-Arsene-Wenger-is-still-God-at-Arsenal.html

Pretty much said what most intelligent fans knew.. AW is untouchable at the club.

The other parts of the interview are nice too..

Xhaka Can’t
13-01-2013, 08:47 AM
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4740935/Wojciech-Szczesny-Arsene-Wenger-is-still-God-at-Arsenal.html

Pretty much said what most intelligent fans knew.. AW is untouchable at the club.

The other parts of the interview are nice too..

So?

A player shouldn't cross a Manager at any Club.

Wenger needs to go - there are many valid reasons for this, there are people within the Club and a person that owns the Club that can easily make this happen.

An 'intelligent' fan should have at least a rudimenatary understanding of how a company is structured. If Wenger was losing money for the Board year on year, how 'untouchable' would he be?

Come to think of it, how much knowledge would an employee equivalent to Szczesny in your organisation have of the inner workings of the company Boardroom?

Consider that, then come back and discuss 'intelligence'.

McNamara That Ghost...
13-01-2013, 09:07 AM
Players punished for going against manager shocker.

Maestro
13-01-2013, 09:59 AM
Irrespective of who the manager is, players cannot and should not dare cross the manager or off they go. No crime against Wenget here. Fakeyank show us a manager who would stand for that?

fakeyank
13-01-2013, 10:18 AM
Irrespective of who the manager is, players cannot and should not dare cross the manager or off they go. No crime against Wenget here. Fakeyank show us a manager who would stand for that?

Just a few weeks back it was suggested (and readily accepted by many here) that Theo was playing down the middle despite being asked to play on the right, leaving Sagna exposed... While I do not agree with players revolting for the sake of revolting but whenever a player has stood up and made proper demands about signings- V. Persie, Henry, Nasri... they have all been let go. In this case, I think the players were 100% right.

Power n Glory
13-01-2013, 10:20 AM
Well, it may seem obvious to you guys but just last week Ollie was saying Theo was playing for himself and going against the managers instructions. Arseblog even suggested the same thing and there have been past discussions about the sort of respect Wenger commands in the team. The lack of effort from players week in week out has people wondering about the level of respect he commands with his team. Wenger being described in that way is different from the sort of passive, fatherly and 'arm around the shoulder' type of impression we get of him. It's worth thinking about instead of shooting down.

I've been wondering why the players don't press teams hard when on the ball and at first I thought it was down to laziness but now I think it's a tactic. We defend a lot deeper than what we used to and we're getting a lot more space behind defenders to attack space when before we used to have teams pinned back in the penalty box. It's probably a tactic by Wenger. I remember last season he was talking guff about Song and encouraging him to leave gaps behind him so the opposition would try and attack the space. Not sure if people remember that. But again, there was a suggestion back then that Song was disobeying Wenger but he later revealed it was a tactic and instruction.

In short, maybe he hasn't lost the dressing room, just lost the plot. Either way it's no good.

Power n Glory
13-01-2013, 10:21 AM
Just a few weeks back it was suggested (and readily accepted by many here) that Theo was playing down the middle despite being asked to play on the right, leaving Sagna exposed... While I do not agree with players revolting for the sake of revolting but whenever a player has stood up and made proper demands about signings- V. Persie, Henry, Nasri... they have all been let go. In this case, I think the players were 100% right.

:lol: Read my mind.

fakeyank
13-01-2013, 10:26 AM
So?

A player shouldn't cross a Manager at any Club.

Wenger needs to go - there are many valid reasons for this, there are people within the Club and a person that owns the Club that can easily make this happen.

An 'intelligent' fan should have at least a rudimenatary understanding of how a company is structured. If Wenger was losing money for the Board year on year, how 'untouchable' would he be?

Come to think of it, how much knowledge would an employee equivalent to Szczesny in your organisation have of the inner workings of the company Boardroom?

Consider that, then come back and discuss 'intelligence'.

Crossing a manager is one thing but being called God is another.

I agree the board/owner can sack him anytime.. never disagreed with that. I am just saying AW is a powerful man at Arsenal... way too powerful for the club's own good. Why he is untouchable or who is responsible for him being untouchable was never my point.. unless I typed something I cant read.

Xhaka Can’t
13-01-2013, 11:04 AM
He is not untouchable. He clearly delivers what us required. If he did not, he'd be gone.

That what he delivers is not what you or I want seems to be immaterial.

fakeyank
13-01-2013, 04:06 PM
Before a season starts, every club has best case scenario expectations and worst case acceptable expectation.

Our minimum is 4th place from what I can gather and best is obviously if we can win everything, if possible. Sure the board is very conservative and hasnt put the right pressure on AW. What really riles me is AW's lackluster attitude about it all.. this is a manager who won the title without losing a single game in a season and who seemed better than SAF for a better part of early 2000s. It was the move to Emirates that changed it all... a move which was heavily favored and engineered by AW. After the move, AW changed from a football manager to an economics manager.

This article really puts everything into place for me as to what a manager at a top club should aspire to be..

http://www.soccerway.com/news/2013/January/06/mourinho-envies-wengers-stability/

bignev
14-01-2013, 12:15 PM
During yesterdays games with Man City the commentators said something that really stuck out, "This wasn't the kind of game we were expecting". At this point we were down to 10 men, 0-2 down and not looking like turning it around. Apart from having a man sent off, the game went exactly how I expected.

Now if you are realistic you could say we're never going to be able to compete with City. They have spent 500M+ on their team after all. However this is football and that isn't always how it works. It seemed to me that right from kick off we expected and actually prepared to lose. I have no problem with us losing to a team like City but I expect us to put some effort in and try to win. On the flip side I expect Wenger and the Board to try and improve the team where possible. This is quite clearly not happening.

I have no confidence in the team to do well in ANY game. We are in serious trouble now I think. I know that seems OTT when we are still top 6 but I look at the team and there is no fight in them and the board/Wenger don't want to do anything about it.

I don't even look forward to our games any more and I know that other fans are starting to feel the same. We're already starting to see empty seats and I can only see that getting worse.

All in all :(

selassie
14-01-2013, 01:34 PM
I have no confidence in the team to do well in ANY game. We are in serious trouble now I think. I know that seems OTT when we are still top 6 but I look at the team and there is no fight in them and the board/Wenger don't want to do anything about it.

I don't even look forward to our games any more and I know that other fans are starting to feel the same. We're already starting to see empty seats and I can only see that getting worse.

All in all :(

Yeah feel the same way mate. I've really lost interest lately, it's become a hassle to watch Arsenal. It's not that I don't care, it's just that history tells me nothing is going to be done.

I don't care who is to blame, I just want to see the club strengthen the team/squad anyway it can.

Marc Overmars
14-01-2013, 01:47 PM
I don't care who is to blame, I just want to see the club strengthen the team/squad anyway it can.

Little chance of that happening when the manager incredibly doesn't feel like there is anyone out there better than what we have.

bignev
14-01-2013, 01:52 PM
Little chance of that happening when the manager incredibly doesn't feel like there is anyone out there better than what we have.

THIS is what gets me! Why say that when he must know it isn't true?

Marc Overmars
14-01-2013, 01:57 PM
THIS is what gets me! Why say that when he must know it isn't true?

Bringing players in would be an admittance that things need to be improved and he'd have to kill some of his love children.

bignev
14-01-2013, 02:01 PM
Yeah feel the same way mate. I've really lost interest lately, it's become a hassle to watch Arsenal. It's not that I don't care, it's just that history tells me nothing is going to be done.

I don't care who is to blame, I just want to see the club strengthen the team/squad anyway it can.

It's not even that we're not winning anything. I supported Arsenal for 20+ years and we haven't always been competitive during that time. I still looked forward to our games. The difference is even when we weren't winning things we tried to win matches and we attempted to improve our squad.

There is a feeling of malaise hanging over the club and we can't seem to shake it.

What annoys me more than anything is Wenger. I am really starting to hate the constant stream of stock phrases he uses - "Like a new signing", "People want us to sign Lionel Messi", "We're looking for top quality players" etc. If we don't have money to buy players then just say so. Don't come out and say we have money but there is no one good enough out there to buy. That is quite obviously bollocks.

Newguy
21-01-2013, 10:24 PM
http://www.gazette.com/articles/springs-150004-million-centers.html?

Nice to see the Owner is starting to spend some cash....

Injury Time
21-01-2013, 10:37 PM
http://www.gazette.com/articles/springs-150004-million-centers.html?

Nice to see the Owner is starting to spend some cash....
"investments include sports stadiums..." :ilt:

Niall_Quinn
22-01-2013, 02:33 AM
He's done some stand up work converting our place in to a shopping centre too. Some great bargains to be had. Like Robin van Persie, for example.