That's the odd trust around the country, most hospitals aren't overrun, even if they were there's those nightingale hospitals they never used much back in spring. The press are always all over these, remember Italy and how they showed loads of footage of hospitals back in March and then completely stopped reporting on it when things improved.Originally Posted by Letters
The press seem to love to focus on the negative.
Last edited by Özim; 03-11-2020 at 01:01 PM.
Was it needed though? There's lot of evidence now the figures used to convince Johnson were out of date and based on a death rate of a 1000 people a day at the beginning of November, plus there's also evidence of cases slowing down. The figures were very dubious though, 4000 a day, even 2000 a day, no country has seen anywhere near this, not even the US and there's already measures in place to slow the spread. Right now the average is about 250 or something, way off.
The trouble with all of this is it's based on modelling, a model isn't real life and is only as accurate as the data you put in, there's a lot of factors it simply can't account for as well. There's loads of experts totally against lockdowns as they believe they don't work and cause a lot of other issues (and deaths) in society.
Last edited by Özim; 03-11-2020 at 01:06 PM.
Well sure, it's one trust which was in Tier 3. That's why it was in Tier 3. But the issue was spreading which was why more areas were moving up the tiers and in the end they decided to lockdown. I'm not sure it was the right thing to do but I'm less sure than I was that it was the wrong thing.
The press seem to love to focus on the negative.The ironing is delicious...
We're not running a Chinese or Soviet style regime here yet. As the Soviets themselves eventually realised, state propaganda is far more effective when citizens believe it. In Russia people would laugh at the media, not believing a word of it. But they had to do it in secret because an iron fist would smash them in the face if they did it in public.
In the west we operate a far more sophisticated model that relies on the people policing themselves. Dissent is useful and necessary, provided it is constrained within pre-defined boundaries. So we can dispute Boris Johnson's handling of the crisis and even mutter how another establishment tool like Starmer might be a better leader. That's all fine and doesn't step outside the boundaries. But where's the investigative reporting into the testing procedures upon which this entire "crisis" is built, for example? You get a few "loons" out there (loon meaning limited audience and lack of resources) who explain in fine detail how the testing is entirely fraudulent. But you won't see it on the BBC or Sky or in the mainstream "news"papers.
But provided you see it somewhere, unless it is genuinely toxic to the establishment and therefore blanket banned, the claim can always be made there is a debate. The "debate" is good for division too. Keep the people divided and fighting each other and the few can dictate to the many. Those fights then become the focus, rather than science, data, evidence, historical precedent, etc. It's a clever system that relies on three people like you ensuring one person like me is applauded if I stay within prescribed confines and condemned if I stray beyond them. That's the public face of the debate.
In private, I suspect many people laugh at the media, not believing a word of it. But they won't do it in public because the steel fist of public opinion will smash them in the face.
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Right. I completely agree with this. It's based on the models. The thing they're modelling is complex and yeah, 4,000 deaths a day isn't happening in the US where there are a lot of Trump supporters injecting themselves with bleach. Strain on the NHS seems to be one of the main drivers here and it does sound like in certain areas this is becoming an issue, hence the Tier thing. But that was spreading so there was a case to send us all to our rooms again. But the cost of closing parts of the economy is going to be massive. The Furlough scheme may save jobs in the short term but we're all going to end up paying anyway and a load of businesses are going to go under anyway.
Is it true that not-so-pretty Patel has just limited protest to two individuals maximum? Sounds very bold to me, an overconfident overreach to put it mildly.
If Police start breaking up protests of more that two people, and I'm not sure all Police will enforce this anyway, it signifies beyond question the government (and we wait to see what Police do) has openly declared the police state.
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The government models have been comprehensively debunked. They model across a period that has already occurred (pre-lockdown) and have already been proven to be out by 400% Johnson and his two fraud minders are fully aware of this but will proceed anyway. The model they are using has already been updated and significantly differs from the fake data Whitty and Valance pushed last week. They are determined to have their lockdown, data and reality be damned.
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The models shown during Boris's press conference weren't government ones, they were ones from your friends at Imperial college but there were others from other places too. Think Cambridge Uni was one? They all said much the same thing.
Why do you think they want lockdown?
Cambridge, primarily.
Best guess so far, the obvious stuff - vaccines, global ID systems, recapturing the Whitehouse, tighter control over a growing population (threat), alignment with their warmism agendas, Agenda 2030 (I expect to see redundant office space in the cities being converted to mass accommodation next year), limitations on travel, cowardice in the face of the multinationals, etc, etc. Lots of converging interests.
But the catalyst? I wonder was it Deutsche Bank? Right before this all began they were hanging on by a thread and they were sitting on an extinction level amount of debt.
Some will say they made a mistake and are now prepared to kill thousands and destroy the economy because they won't own up to it. That won't be the actual reason, but it could be the reason that is eventually settled on to explain this all away. And I bet Boris knows that too, which is probably why senior figures in his party are getting nervous.
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