Mario 64.
The only game I've bought from the Wii Shop Channel. Still looks as fresh as anything out today.
Mario 64.
The only game I've bought from the Wii Shop Channel. Still looks as fresh as anything out today.
Wind Waker
Still looks absolutely stunning
I missed out on the Gamecube generation tbh.
Sucks to be you.Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
Pretty much.
In regards to the rest of your post, to avoid this becoming the General Chat equivalent of one of those endlessly circular debates I should clarify I love most Rare games. I've mentioned it loads of times here too probably. Goldeneye, Banjo-Kazooie and Killer Instinct are some of my favourite and most-played games ever. My point is just that their originality in design and gameplay shines through more when they were doing something quite different from Nintendo themselves. It's well-known how much influence Nintendo has on their second-party studios (and when they co-develop something with a third party studio), so they were obviously the ones very much behind the output of similar racing games and platformers. Nintendo are often quite conservative with their external studios, so it's actually impressive how much ground-breaking and edgy stuff Rare were allowed to get away with. I wasn't criticising the quality of Rare's games at all. If you have such a talented team though, I'd say it's always preferable to see them break boundaries rather than stay within them.
On the subject of Nintendo, I didn't actually become a fan until the N64. I had a SNES, but mainly played beat 'em ups and action games on it. I definitely think that Nintendo's best games have a little extra super quality. That doesn't mean no other studios match their best, because many do, but usually in different genres. When you think of the seminal Nintendo franchises, it's often the case that they defined the genre or sub-genre in the first attempt and little after has come close to matching it. When you play a Mario World/Galaxy or Ocarina Of Time/Link's Awakening or Metroid Prime or Pokemon, every element just comes together perfectly. Everything from the movement of the character to the progression to the difficulty curve are usually pitch perfect. The central gameplay and level/world/course design has always been what I feel is most important in a game. Nintendo being the only one of the console-makers (Sega) to still put the primary focus on games which are proud to be games, rather than trying to be movie-like experiences, is probably why they appeal to me more.
If you find this overly effusive, I could talk about other developers too.
Last edited by Master Splinter; 15-11-2012 at 03:41 AM.
Rogue Squadron II was a launch game. Eleven years old. It still looks amazing.Wind Waker
Still looks absolutely stunning
And F-Zero GX. And Metroid Prime. And the Resident Evil remake. And Resident Evil 4.
Nothing I played on the Xbox (which was the most powerful of that generation of consoles) looked as awlsome as these, technically or artistically. Panzer Dragoon Saga and Ninja Gaiden were impressive though. That Riddick game and the Conker remake were supposed to be two of the best-looking games, though I've never played them.
Gamecube.
MO.
I think Rare did push what can be done with a polygon filled platformer, both with B-K and B-T, although B-T wasn't as good. I wouldn't say their gameplay 'shines through' in other game as in, it's there in other games but it isn't in their platformers, I think it is - you just need to do more looking for it and to be honest that's exactly what a lot of their games are about - exploring. With Mario 64 that's true to a certain extent (outside the castle) but because the levels are broken up with 'episodes' that is one of the key differences between the games/series.Pretty much.
In regards to the rest of your post, to avoid this becoming the General Chat equivalent of one of those endlessly circular debates I should clarify I love most Rare games. I've mentioned it loads of times here too probably. Goldeneye, Banjo-Kazooie and Killer Instinct are some of my favourite and most-played games ever. My point is just that their originality in design and gameplay shines through more when they were doing something quite different from Nintendo themselves. It's well-known how much influence Nintendo has on their second-party studios (and when they co-develop something with a third party studio), so they were obviously the ones very much behind the output of similar racing games and platformers. Nintendo are often quite conservative with their external studios, so it's actually impressive how much ground-breaking and edgy stuff Rare were allowed to get away with. I wasn't criticising the quality of Rare's games at all. If you have such a talented team though, I'd say it's always preferable to see them break boundaries rather than stay within them.
On the subject of Nintendo, I didn't actually become a fan until the N64. I had a SNES, but mainly played beat 'em ups and action games on it. I definitely think that Nintendo's best games have a little extra super quality. That doesn't mean no other studios match their best, because many do, but usually in different genres. When you think of the seminal Nintendo franchises, it's often the case that they defined the genre or sub-genre in the first attempt and little after has come close to matching it. When you play a Mario World/Galaxy or Ocarina Of Time/Link's Awakening or Metroid Prime or Pokemon, every element just comes together perfectly. Everything from the movement of the character to the progression to the difficulty curve are usually pitch perfect. The central gameplay and level/world/course design has always been what I feel is most important in a game. Nintendo being the only one of the console-makers (Sega
If you find this overly effusive, I could talk about other developers too.
Also Mario 64 have more traditional platform 'sections' (moving blocks, jumping from one to the other) than B-K does. If B-K does have those sections it only makes up part of the level whereas say in the case of Tick Tock Clock it is the level. I've always felt that as great as the Mario games are, they've always lacked that extra small detail I appreciate in games and on the flipside the Rare games have always had that within them (it's still there, even on Kinect Sports). It's also one of the things I really about the GTA games, they too put details in that can go overlooked.
If B-K is indeed a clone of Mario 64 and I still maintain that it is not, it's merely that it came after a landmark game but if it is all those comparisons surely go out the window with the pre-Gruntilda battle? I can't imagine Nintendo would ever put something like that in to their games and that's because it just wouldn't fit. Also on the point of how easy it is for a game to be labelled as a 'clone', wasn't Crash Bandicoot labeled as such? Despite it only coming out a few months after Mario 64 did!
Nintendo do have their defining games and so they should as one of the main game developers but I have an issue with saying Nintendo's primary focus being on games proud to be games - is that what the Wii was about or was it to try and bring in a different kind of consumer? Of course Nintendo have their franchise games that they can put on to most games, they will sell really well and probably be really good but after that, what do they have? Obviously this is different with the Wii U now big third party designers can make games of a similar standard to the PS3 and 360 but on the Wii, after that was gimmicks.
My Wii doesn't often get played because there are just so few games to keep my interest, most of my friends have had a Wii but have eventually sold because they too just ended up not playing anymore - I would imagine that's true for quite a few people, the motion control aspect just doesn't have the longevity. After the Mario games, perhaps the Zelda games too, not a huge amount is there to be played. The fact I am finding myself going back to Gamecube games to play on the Wii, rather games that the Wii was intended for is not a great sign that their primary focus was on games, being games. With the N64, it was different.
All this talk will definitely see me getting the N64 out this weekend.
Do it, do it, do it.
Mine is always out, just not plugged in.
Mine is packed away in the garage along with the Mega Drive and Snes.
Retro gaming weekend.
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