Summer Transfer Speculation and Shit

[Dein-machine]

Even if teams play with one striker they never counter with just one player. That's the whole point of counter attacks - the quick transition between defense and attack, with two or three other players anticipating it and bursting forward quicker than our midfielders.
When we attack one of our fullbacks goes up too, depending on which side we're attacking. With the way Ramsey plays he is normally high up the pitch too when the opponents win the ball from us. So during a counter attack we usually have the 2 CBs, 1 fullback and the DM back. We can easily get into 3v4 (their attackers vs our defenders) or 4v4 situations, and we did last season and every season before that.

Our defenders are good enough to defend against an equal number of attackers, but remember it is much harder to defend when you're running backwards. Taking away the DM in those situations is just suicide. Even the 'shit' teams can mess you up if you give them the chance, so why give them the chance?

Our inability to break teams down has nothing to do with playing a DM. The invincibles side was one of the best attacking sides I've ever seen and that was with Gilberto Silva, the most passive of all DMs as a regular in the side. The reason we can't break down teams is because we play a stale brand of slow-paced possession football without enough inventiveness, directness or risk-taking in the final third. Adding another attacker won't change that, it will just make us weaker defensively.


If it's 'rubbish tactics', why does every top team play with a DM?

Firstly, every top teams that plays a DM "every game" will play with attacking full backs "every game". We don't.

When teams counter us at the Emirates they are under strict instruction to not loose shape & numbers at the back. If you look at the Palace game, even when they countered with a hoof up to the striker, they really only had Chamakh, Puncheon & Bolassie joining in. But they would have had to run half the length of the pitch as well because they were behind the ball when our move broke down. That's why a couple of hard working midfielders, like Rambo & Santi will have also run back tracking the Palace midfield. Even when smaller teams counter at the Emirates, we still have enough no's to deal with it because they will never over commit. Bit different when we play the likes of City & Liverpool.
Watch the game again & see what Arteta did. He spent 80% of his time picking the ball of Kos & Chambers from 10 yards away & then passing it 10 yards to Rambo or Jack - total waste of time, Kos & Chambers should have been playing those balls, they had no one on them. Arteta simply slows us down getting the ball forward.

You mention Silva in the Invincible side, but look at the forward contributions from the likes of Cole & Lauren compared to that of Sagna & Gibbs. As I've said before DM every game all well & good if you play with attacking full backs, but not when you don't. We scored goals then because we ripped teams apart in numbers & dragging defences all over the place. This is because Cole & Lauren pushed forward, dragging their full backs wide, leaving gaps for the likes of Henry, Pires & Freddy.
At the moment we are playing a DM without attacking full backs - that basically means that in the final 3rd of the pitch we will only have 5 guys max & that we will have to try & pass it down the middle due to lack of width to get anywhere. Any one that has watched us for a past few years knows that is exactly what we see week in, week out. Jacks wonder goal against Norwich sums up the way we try to play but it comes off once in a blue moon. The tippi tappi play around the box is also the NO 1 reason for teams to counter attack because we are trying to many passes to get anywhere & we therefore give the ball away more.

[Penguin]

I'm not sure what you mean when you say we don't play with attacking full backs. We've always had attacking full backs in Wenger's teams. Whatever side we are attacking in, the full back will come and join the attack on that side, and that's a tactic that hasn't changed since the day Wenger joined the club. Clichy, Eboue, Gibbs, they all love getting forward. Debuchy bombs up and down the flank tirelessly. Sagna was probably the most 'defensive' one but he was always an outlet on the right and I wouldn't be surprised if he has the highest number of crosses into the box of any Arsenal player in the last decade. It could be argued that the current lot aren't good enough at attacking, which might be true, but that doesn't make a difference to what we're debating. They will still be on the wrong side of the pitch to defend the counter attack.

Basically we agree that the underlying problem is the tippy-tappy football we play. I still haven't figured out why you think adding another body to our attack will change that though. Playing Ox, Santi or whoever instead of a DM won't magically transform us into Real Madrid. We'll still play exactly the same way, pussyfooting around their ten man wall but we'll leave ourselves even more vulnerable on the break.

The likes of Real Madrid and Barca use DMs in every game, and they steamroll 90% of the teams in La Liga. We're in the Premier League where anyone can take points off the big teams. I'll stick to the tried and tested DM thanks.

[Master Splinter]

Only 3 games in. Wenger usually puts new forwards into a fitness bootcamp to toughen them up. Only 3 games in. Wenger kept saying he wanted to keep Campbell and since we're well stocked in that position, he had no reason to keep him if he doesn't rate him. Only 3 games in.

No.

Wemger hates him has put a contract out on his mum.

[Power n Glory]

I'm not sure what you mean when you say we don't play with attacking full backs. We've always had attacking full backs in Wenger's teams. Whatever side we are attacking in, the full back will come and join the attack on that side, and that's a tactic that hasn't changed since the day Wenger joined the club. Clichy, Eboue, Gibbs, they all love getting forward. Debuchy bombs up and down the flank tirelessly. Sagna was probably the most 'defensive' one but he was always an outlet on the right and I wouldn't be surprised if he has the highest number of crosses into the box of any Arsenal player in the last decade. It could be argued that the current lot aren't good enough at attacking, which might be true, but that doesn't make a difference to what we're debating. They will still be on the wrong side of the pitch to defend the counter attack.

Basically we agree that the underlying problem is the tippy-tappy football we play. I still haven't figured out why you think adding another body to our attack will change that though. Playing Ox, Santi or whoever instead of a DM won't magically transform us into Real Madrid. We'll still play exactly the same way, pussyfooting around their ten man wall but we'll leave ourselves even more vulnerable on the break.

The likes of Real Madrid and Barca use DMs in every game, and they steamroll 90% of the teams in La Liga. We're in the Premier League where anyone can take points off the big teams. I'll stick to the tried and tested DM thanks.

Agreed. An extra body up top won't stop the clutter in the middle. Just look at Ramsey and Wilshere when playing together and then throw in Cazorla and Ozil. It's a bad balance. Too many passers to feet and not enough players with smart off the ball movement and willing to take risks. There is a reason why Theo and Ramsey are our top scorers. They make the off the ball runs into space and are always looking for a chance on goal.

The issue with the DM and fullbacks is just a quality issue. Our fullbacks are attacking(always have been as you rightly say) and with Monreal and Debuchy, I'd argue we are likely to see more quality from their crosses. But they're still not the quickest off the mark and that's probably why they don't seem all that effective when going forward. We need quicker overlaps to help break down teams.

The DM position is another quality issue. If we had someone comfortable on the ball and able to navigate there way into open space intelligently, able to make the smart pass, it frees up the players ahead of him and they'd be more confident going forwards knowing that the DM won't buckle user pressure. It would be nice if he had the type of player that can spin off his man with ease and then lay the ball off. It's a real shame we haven't addressed this issue but I'm hoping Wenger gives Coquelin a chance this season and he really performs.

[Injury Time]

So maybe he wasn't the Messiah, just being linked to us has caused injury...
http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014/...ter-transfer/?

[mr_brighterside]

not sure if this is the place for this but a few sites on Newsnow reckon we could be in for Cavani.

not being cheap but would want him for less than PSG paid!

[selassie]

not sure if this is the place for this but a few sites on Newsnow reckon we could be in for Cavani.

not being cheap but would want him for less than PSG paid!

It's just paper talk IMO, Cavani would cost an arm and leg in both fees and wages. We could afford him but I am not so sure Wenger sees signing a striker as a priority now that he signed Welbeck.