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Thread: Wenger's future, possible extension and possible... departure?

  1. #361
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    Mo for prime minister

  2. #362
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Emirates Gallactico View Post
    Christ you're an idiot.

    Do you even know why Tuchel got sacked? It wasn't due to performances - it was three days after the guy won them their first trophy in five years. It was because he fell out spectacularly with the management team for several reasons:

    - He felt they didn't do enough to defend the club after the bomb attack (getting the fixture replayed)
    - He was livid after they sold three of their best player the summer before (Hummels, Mkhi & Gundogen) despite getting assurances that two at most would only depart
    - His now much publicised clashes with Sven (who he felt was interfering too much)


    Honestly Zim, you constantly (and rightly) bleat on about Wenger being a placid manager who doesn't do enough to demand success and yet you're attacking a manager who was abrasive enough to push back when his best players got sold from under his nose, reducing their competitivity.


    And why do you keep saying his record in Europe is poor? He's not Wenger who's been in Europe for years - he's only been in it for two years. First season EL QF and lost to Liverpool despite seemingly having the match buried (ten minute brainfart at Anfield - it happens). Second season QF of the CL and lost to an excellent Monaco team (Mbapee, Lemar, Mendy, Silva, Bakakyo etc ..... all of them were poached by the top European clubs after that) after their team coach got bombed before a match.

    I'm an idiot? You're the one who after well over a decade of having a loser in charge wants to replace him with another one, where's the logic in that, bring someone decent in, we deserve that after years of failure.

    As for the cup win, do me a favour, domestic cups are mickey mouse trophies that noone really values.

    As for the defeat to Liverpool, no it doesnt' just happen when Liverpool needed 3 goals twice, that's amateurish, he's got no record of success at club level that's a fact.

    Honestly some of you guys always buy into the hype for unproven players/managers etc you'd think you'd learn your lesson at some point.

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    goonersweb at its finest

  4. #364
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    I haven't followed his career closely but a lot of the football writers seemed to be enamoured with Tuchel when he was at Dortmund and having read the debate between you lot I'm somewhat split. I do think Em Goonie has presented some legitimate mitigation worth considering though. Not least of all is the effect of the Dortmund bus bombing. I also think if you scrutinise the career to date of literally any manager in world football you can make a decent case for not hiring them.

    On a slightly separate note....

    I never understand the idea that we aren't an attracvtive proposition for top managers though. We offer one of the best salaries in football for managers, are located in the middle of London, have history and a reasonably talented squad of players with a few decent youth prospects as well as a senior management set up that doesn't just aim to fire and hire managers willy nilly and heap disproportionate pressure on them. Fans who are relatively pretty patient too.

  5. #365
    Asian Clique Head Bhaiya The Emirates Gallactico's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Özim View Post
    I'm an idiot? You're the one who after well over a decade of having a loser in charge wants to replace him with another one, where's the logic in that, bring someone decent in, we deserve that after years of failure.

    As for the cup win, do me a favour, domestic cups are mickey mouse trophies that noone really values.

    As for the defeat to Liverpool, no it doesnt' just happen when Liverpool needed 3 goals twice, that's amateurish, he's got no record of success at club level that's a fact.

    Honestly some of you guys always buy into the hype for unproven players/managers etc you'd think you'd learn your lesson at some point.
    You're an idiot because you clearly have no clue about what happened during Tuchel's spell at Dortmund or his career and yet are making bold pronouncements on here calling Tuchel a loser, amateur, failure etc etc because he didn't win the treble during his time there. That's the simplicity of your intellectual thought process to this - infantile.

    I note you've conveniently avoided rebutting the points I made about the reason why he was sacked at Dortmund - I guess you weren't aware of them. At least I hope you'll now stop using that to put him down.


    And yes it does. Even the best managers have a bad game here and there - it was a shocker conceding three goals in the manner they did after steam rollering Liverpool in the first half and seemingly having the tie in the bag. I've already admitted he's a bit more defensively naive compared to a Simeone or an Allegri but the attacking football he plays is miles better which more than compensates for it. And that's the format that's current succeeding in the PL with Pep and Klopp and the style we should hope to emulate.


    According to Raphael Honigstein on TF pod the Bayern top brass had been frantically trying to persuade him to reverse his mind the past few days but he's already signed a deal with a top foreign club that he's going to honour. Though unlike Kicker, RH thinks it's probably either Chelsea or PSG and not us.

    He's good enough for Bayern and probably Chelsea or PSG but no according to internet poster Zimmerman on GW he's not good enough for The Arsenal.

    We deserve four more years of Wenger with thinking like this. We let the likes of Pep & Klopp slip away when they were available & gettable because the board & some fans were too afraid of taking a chance on a promising manager and we're about to do same thing if Tuchel does go elsewhere. Infuriating.

  6. #366
    Asian Clique Head Bhaiya The Emirates Gallactico's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice View Post
    I haven't followed his career closely but a lot of the football writers seemed to be enamoured with Tuchel when he was at Dortmund and having read the debate between you lot I'm somewhat split. I do think Em Goonie has presented some legitimate mitigation worth considering though. Not least of all is the effect of the Dortmund bus bombing. I also think if you scrutinise the career to date of literally any manager in world football you can make a decent case for not hiring them.

    On a slightly separate note....

    I never understand the idea that we aren't an attracvtive proposition for top managers though. We offer one of the best salaries in football for managers, are located in the middle of London, have history and a reasonably talented squad of players with a few decent youth prospects as well as a senior management set up that doesn't just aim to fire and hire managers willy nilly and heap disproportionate pressure on them. Fans who are relatively pretty patient too.
    I don't think Zim understands just how far the deck is stacked towards Bayern in Germany in terms of resources. It's not like England where the TV money has mitigated things to an extent among the top six (although City & Utd can push to levels the others can't). Their commercial income from leveraging their worldwide popularity puts them streets ahead of the others - Dortmund constantly have their best player raided by Bayern nearly season after season (Lewandowski, Hummels, Gotze etc).


    Bayern are about to win the Bundesliga for the sixth year in a row and only Tuchel has come close to even putting up a challenge against that run. Doing that and getting Dortmund into the QF's is punching above expectations for a club their size.

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    There aren't 3 Bayerns in the PL. There's one PSG (great on their day, shit on other days), and a whole stream of pub shite. Utd, the chavs, Pool, the spuds? Are these the Bayerns? Don't think so. We get a new manager in and we might not be able to step it up to PSG level right away but we'll be mixing it with our fellow pubbers in no time flat. Wenger's not good enough to manage a pub team - he's proven that season after season after season. And yet some still think he's comparable to even semi-competent managers. So this Dortmund bloke got one spanking and didn't win the CL? Well he has a long way to go to catch up to our specialist fuck up who gets a good spanking on a routine basis and has had two decades to do something in Europe. Mark Hughes would be an improvement on Wenger, so if we ended up with a manager like Tuchel that would leaping fifty levels up from the rancid shit bastard we have in charge of wrecking the place right now.
    Für eure Sicherheit

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Emirates Gallactico View Post
    Christ you're an idiot.

    Do you even know why Tuchel got sacked? It wasn't due to performances - it was three days after the guy won them their first trophy in five years. It was because he fell out spectacularly with the management team for several reasons:

    - He felt they didn't do enough to defend the club after the bomb attack (getting the fixture replayed)
    - He was livid after they sold three of their best player the summer before (Hummels, Mkhi & Gundogen) despite getting assurances that two at most would only depart
    - His now much publicised clashes with Sven (who he felt was interfering too much)


    Honestly Zim, you constantly (and rightly) bleat on about Wenger being a placid manager who doesn't do enough to demand success and yet you're attacking a manager who was abrasive enough to push back when his best players got sold from under his nose, reducing their competitivity.


    And why do you keep saying his record in Europe is poor? He's not Wenger who's been in Europe for years - he's only been in it for two years. First season EL QF and lost to Liverpool despite seemingly having the match buried (ten minute brainfart at Anfield - it happens). Second season QF of the CL and lost to an excellent Monaco team (Mbapee, Lemar, Mendy, Silva, Bakakyo etc ..... all of them were poached by the top European clubs after that) after their team coach got bombed before a match.




    The likes of Bayern don't go hunting for poor managers PnG. And neither do PSG & Chelsea who are the other teams he's also linked with.

    He could have done better in the second season against Ancelotti's Bayern but that was the season where his three best players sold from under his nose and still despite that was able to perform admirably with him bringing through players like Dembele. Not much else he could do in the first season when he had Pep's Bayern accumulating points at the same rate City are right now and they finished second with the points tally that most teams usually win the league with.

    And maybe he won't be able to overcome them, especially City given their financial might, but at the very least we'd be competing against them which would be a whole of a lot better than our current situation where we're basically a joke. He'd be a good manager and the only one I'd take over him would be Simeone.
    If we replace Wenger, great. A risk is better than taking no risk. But again, being linked with PSG and Bayern doesn't impress me. Those are two clubs that can outspend their nearest rival twice over and even poach the players off their nearest league rivals to put the odds in their favour. Chelsea is a different story and more of a risk.

    We're not a club that can out spend our rivals and need some serious defensive work. The fact that Tuchel's defensive record is sketchy is a concern. What happened against Liverpool can't be ignored. Also, doesn't it concern you that he fell out so quickly with the people around him in two seasons? Worst still, one of the guys he fell out with works here. If we're looking for someone that's not a dictator and can work with staff around him, shouldn't this be a red flag?

    Zim has some harsh words but calling him an idiot for some of the points raised is just as harsh. With only two seasons at Dortmund, it's hard to get a full scope of what he's capable of. But I'd take him over Joachim Low, Arteta or Henry. That's a definite.

  9. #369
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Overmars View Post
    Nah. Was poor at Liverpool bar that one season and his buys weren’t great. Suarez carried that team.

    What he’s doing now at Celtic couldn’t be more irrelevant as well.
    If Rodgers had left the season after they lost Suarez, opinions would probably differ. That's why I hesitate on Tuchel. Again, if Tuchel ends up at Bayern, it's about as competitive as the Scottish League!

    Tuchel may turn out to be a great manager but there are still question marks. If he had stayed a season or more with Dortmund how would things have turned out?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn View Post
    There aren't 3 Bayerns in the PL. There's one PSG (great on their day, shit on other days), and a whole stream of pub shite. Utd, the chavs, Pool, the spuds? Are these the Bayerns? Don't think so. We get a new manager in and we might not be able to step it up to PSG level right away but we'll be mixing it with our fellow pubbers in no time flat. Wenger's not good enough to manage a pub team - he's proven that season after season after season. And yet some still think he's comparable to even semi-competent managers. So this Dortmund bloke got one spanking and didn't win the CL? Well he has a long way to go to catch up to our specialist fuck up who gets a good spanking on a routine basis and has had two decades to do something in Europe. Mark Hughes would be an improvement on Wenger, so if we ended up with a manager like Tuchel that would leaping fifty levels up from the rancid shit bastard we have in charge of wrecking the place right now.
    Mark Hughes? Stop it! I can't understand how the same English managers get chance after chance in this league whilst other young coaches got no chance or given the boot within the first signs of trouble.

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