Wenger's future, possible extension and possible... departure?

[Bumble]

If we look a tier down we'll end up 2nd rate unfortunately, we need to attract a top manager who can build a team, otherwise we're really not a big club.

But nobody is a top manager straight away - Wenger was an unknown and for 7-8 years was great. You never know though - a tier 2 manager could become a tier 1 manager given the chance. I know nothing about the Dortmund guy so cant really comment. I don't really watch any non-English football. A fair bit of work needs to be done to the squad, I cant see Mustafi suddenly knowning how to defend with a new manager in place and still not sure on what Xhaka does.

Interesting that we seem to be willing to let Wilshere and Ramsey go but extend Eleney contract.

[Globalgunner]

In the EPL alone, amongst current managers. I would take anyone except Hughes, Pardew and Moyes. Yes even Allardyce would be an improvement on Wenger.

But really why can we just go for Luis Enrique. Hes available and is better imo than Tuchel. Announce it today.

[Özim]

You're an idiot because you clearly have no clue about what happened during Tuchel's spell at Dortmund or his career and yet are making bold pronouncements on here calling Tuchel a loser, amateur, failure etc etc because he didn't win the treble during his time there. That's the simplicity of your intellectual thought process to this - infantile.

I note you've conveniently avoided rebutting the points I made about the reason why he was sacked at Dortmund - I guess you weren't aware of them. At least I hope you'll now stop using that to put him down.


And yes it does. Even the best managers have a bad game here and there - it was a shocker conceding three goals in the manner they did after steam rollering Liverpool in the first half and seemingly having the tie in the bag. I've already admitted he's a bit more defensively naive compared to a Simeone or an Allegri but the attacking football he plays is miles better which more than compensates for it. And that's the format that's current succeeding in the PL with Pep and Klopp and the style we should hope to emulate.


According to Raphael Honigstein on TF pod the Bayern top brass had been frantically trying to persuade him to reverse his mind the past few days but he's already signed a deal with a top foreign club that he's going to honour. Though unlike Kicker, RH thinks it's probably either Chelsea or PSG and not us.

He's good enough for Bayern and probably Chelsea or PSG but no according to internet poster Zimmerman on GW he's not good enough for The Arsenal.

We deserve four more years of Wenger with thinking like this. We let the likes of Pep & Klopp slip away when they were available & gettable because the board & some fans were too afraid of taking a chance on a promising manager and we're about to do same thing if Tuchel does go elsewhere. Infuriating.

Thing is I don't care, had he been successful you can bet your bottom dollar he wouldn't have got the sack, they sacked him for their own reasons and clearly didn't value him enough not to, because as I said before he's totally unproven, no record of success and inherited an already top team from Klopp, a team who had largely down very well in the CL.

As for your point about beng close to Bayern, 10 and 18 points isn't close in my book, close would be within a few points maybe but not 10 or 18 and his current record if very relevant, it's all we have to judge him by therefore what he's achieved is important and right now it's not impressive at all.

As for other clubs wanting him, so what, I couldn't care less, as PNG said they have infinite resources and mickey mouse could win the league with them.

I've noticed how some people get hold of the names of some unproven nobodies (whether it be players or managers) and then become somewhat fixated on the fact they are the best thing since sliced bread, remember people going nuts over Isaksson and he proved rubbish, howabout we let someone prove themselves and have some success before we start to think they're a gift from the gods, remember Moyes, he was flavour of the day once upon the time and then employed by Man U, we all know what happened next.

As for the football, Dortmund played amazing football before he arrived under Kloppp (much like Liverpool do) so let's not go overboard, Klopp built Dortmund, getting them to CL finals and challenging Bayern, Tuchel just took over an already well established club with top players.

The guy is flavour of the day, who knows we're he'll be in a few years, as for comparisons to Pep etc, not even close, those managers have actually had success this is entirely different.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

If we replace Wenger, great. A risk is better than taking no risk. But again, being linked with PSG and Bayern doesn't impress me. Those are two clubs that can outspend their nearest rival twice over and even poach the players off their nearest league rivals to put the odds in their favour. Chelsea is a different story and more of a risk.

We're not a club that can out spend our rivals and need some serious defensive work. The fact that Tuchel's defensive record is sketchy is a concern. What happened against Liverpool can't be ignored. Also, doesn't it concern you that he fell out so quickly with the people around him in two seasons? Worst still, one of the guys he fell out with works here. If we're looking for someone that's not a dictator and can work with staff around him, shouldn't this be a red flag?

Zim has some harsh words but calling him an idiot for some of the points raised is just as harsh. With only two seasons at Dortmund, it's hard to get a full scope of what he's capable of. But I'd take him over Joachim Low, Arteta or Henry. That's a definite.

It's one thing saying you'd prefer X guy instead or you don't want him, it's another thing making up ignorant shit like he's mediocre, a loser, overrated or he "failed" when it's clear he has zero idea about how his spell at Dortmund went which is why I called him that.

And if losing 4 - 3 at Anfield to a Klopp Liverpool side makes you a shit manager then god forbid, I'd like to hear your opinion on Pep. It was one bad result where they threw away what should have been a sure win.

And I don't think he's any worse at organising a defence than say a Pep is. Moreover it matters less for managers like them because they utterly dominate team offensively to the point where it rarely matters how well their defence is as long as they have some reasonably competent people back there. In fact there's a famous anecdote about how he met Pep for lunch during his gap year and they spent two hours talking and discussing tactics using the salt & pepper shakers.

And you can't have it both ways PnG. You can't at one point dismiss Bayern & PSG wanting him by saying even Wenger would win the league there but then at the same time clamour for someone like Allegeri who also wins league titles in a league where one club has it dominated. And for the record, I'd be ecstatic with Allegri.

In the EPL alone, amongst current managers. I would take anyone except Hughes, Pardew and Moyes. Yes even Allardyce would be an improvement on Wenger.

But really why can we just go for Luis Enrique. Hes available and is better imo than Tuchel. Announce it today.

Wouldn't go that far on Allardyce. He'd make us defensively more secure certainly but we'd struggle to even create a single shot on target.

Everton fans already want him gone.


And Tuchel > Luis Enrique tbh.

The latter didn't do well at Roma.

[Özim]

Bayern are about to win the Bundesliga for the sixth year in a row and only Tuchel has come close to even putting up a challenge against that run. Doing that and getting Dortmund into the QF's is punching above expectations for a club their size.

Again no, Dortmund have been a top side over the years, they had a dip then Klopp brought them back into the limelight, player wise they've had Germany's 2ns best team for years, not coming 2nd is a bad season.

[Özim]

Moreover the top managers all build teams who can defend as well as attack, not interested in getting a manager who is defensively naive because you'll never win anything of note with a dodgy defence, over a decade of that should be conclusive proof, Guardiola etc build teams with good defences, that's one of the reasons they win stuff, when the attack doesn't play well they can still grind out results.

[Özim]

It's one thing saying you'd prefer X guy instead or you don't want him, it's another thing making up ignorant shit like he's mediocre, a loser, overrated or he "failed" when it's clear he has zero idea about how his spell at Dortmund went which is why I called him that.

And if losing 4 - 3 at Anfield to a Klopp Liverpool side makes you a shit manager then god forbid, I'd like to hear your opinion on Pep. It was one bad result where they threw away what should have been a sure win.

And I don't think he's any worse at organising a defence than say a Pep is. Moreover it matters less for managers like them because they utterly dominate team offensively to the point where it rarely matters how well their defence is as long as they have some reasonably competent people back there. In fact there's a famous anecdote about how he met Pep for lunch during his gap year and they spent two hours talking and discussing tactics using the salt & pepper shakers.

And you can't have it both ways PnG. You can't at one point dismiss Bayern & PSG wanting him by saying even Wenger would win the league there but then at the same time clamour for someone like Allegeri who also wins league titles in a league where one club has it dominated. And for the record, I'd be ecstatic with Allegri.





Wouldn't go that far on Allardyce. He'd make us defensively more secure certainly but we'd struggle to even create a single shot on target.

Everton fans already want him gone.


And Tuchel > Luis Enrique tbh.

The latter didn't do well at Roma.

Whether you rate Enrique or not and I'm not a big fan, he won the treble including the CL which is a much better achievement than anything Tuchel has done, so right now Enrique is certainly better, Tuchel hasn't proved anything right now.

[Özim]

But nobody is a top manager straight away - Wenger was an unknown and for 7-8 years was great. You never know though - a tier 2 manager could become a tier 1 manager given the chance. I know nothing about the Dortmund guy so cant really comment. I don't really watch any non-English football. A fair bit of work needs to be done to the squad, I cant see Mustafi suddenly knowning how to defend with a new manager in place and still not sure on what Xhaka does.

Interesting that we seem to be willing to let Wilshere and Ramsey go but extend Eleney contract.

No but you always take a chance with unknowns, in all likelyhood they're more likely to fail than succeed.

Let's no use Wenger as an example, I never want another guy like him at the helm, we've had to endure years of frustration because of him and we can question his management ability based on the last 14 years as well.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Will reply to the other laughable post later on as I've got to head off soon.

Again no, Dortmund have been a top side over the years, they had a dip then Klopp brought them back into the limelight, player wise they've had Germany's 2ns best team for years, not coming 2nd is a bad season.

Tuchel won more points in his first season in charge (78) than Klopp did when he first won the BL (75) and only three less than Klopp in his second BL (81).

The only difference was that Bayern weren't as utterly dominant back during that period as they've have been over the last half decade. You're being incredibly hackish here by not factoring in how the scope of German domestic football has changed over the past few years after Bayern decided to get their shit in order after losing those back to back titles to Klopp.

[Özim]

Will reply to the other laughable post later on as I've got to head off soon.



Tuchel won more points in his first season in charge (78) than Klopp did when he first won the BL (75) and only three less than Klopp in his second BL (81).

The only difference was that Bayern weren't as utterly dominant back during that period as they've have been over the last half decade. You're being incredibly hackish here by not factoring in how the scope of German domestic football has changed over the past few years after Bayern decided to get their shit in order after losing those back to back titles to Klopp.

What difference does that make, he came 2nd, Klopps achievement is superior because he won it, to compare it is pointless, it was a different situation with different teams and players.

The point is that Tuchel hasn't achieved anything, his record in the CL isn't that great, he then got knocked out in a pretty embarrassing way of the Europa leauge and Dortmund ended up 3rd in the league which considering their players and that they are the 2nd best team is poor as well.

The reality is he's totally unproven and his record is nothing special and that's my point, would prefer someone with some sort of record of success.