Coronavirus Pandemic

[Letters]

First they came for the clubbers, and I did not speak out—because I was not a clubber.

[Niall_Quinn]

Needing a vaccine passport to get into a nightclub and committing mass genocide are of course, exactly the same thing.

They are not the same thing. But the people who stand back and let either happen are the same. You haven't even got enough guts to own your cowardice.

[Niall_Quinn]

First they came for the clubbers, and I did not speak out—because I was not a clubber.

Serious question. Are you genuinely oblivious to what's happening in France and in our own parliament? We aren't as far down the road yet, but it's the same road. Are you ignorant of the world around you or are you aware but don't care? Or are you aware and don't see these developments as dangerous? It's intriguing to see how far this can be taken and how many people will play along.

[Letters]

Serious question. Are you genuinely oblivious to what's happening in France and in our own parliament? We aren't as far down the road yet, but it's the same road. Are you ignorant of the world around you or are you aware but don't care? Or are you aware and don't see these developments as dangerous? It's intriguing to see how far this can be taken and how many people will play along.

I am, admittedly, a bit ignorant - I don't follow what is going on in our parliament as closely as I probably should, let alone what is going on in other parliaments. But a useful metric, I'd suggest, is how much things affect my day to day life. Some of the things you have highlighted I would agree are legitimate concerns. Wasn't there something about restrictions on people protesting? That, I agree, is of concern. But that didn't stop a load of idiots gathering to protest on Monday about lockdowns, literally the day the restrictions were lifted . Point being yes, I agree some of these powers could be misused, I'm sceptical as to whether they are are really as Draconian as you imagine though. Those people weren't dragged off and incarcerated because, end of the day, we don't have an authoritarian regime.

Yes, most of the things we do can be tracked and I know some people care about that on principle but my take is: what difference does it make? People have been wringing their hands about surveillance for decades, it hasn't actually made any difference to my life, has it yours?

The thing I don't understand is you claim we live in an authoritarian regime while observing people going about their day to day business at the height of the first lockdown. You know they weren't all rounded up, there was no consequence. Because, fundamentally, the government have no interest in having the micro control over our day to day lives that you seem to imagine. I may be misrepresenting your views, but what exactly are you worried about?

You said I have to see people marching down my street before I think anything is going on. I don't know about that but there has to be some impact on my life. Obviously the last year has been an outlier, as it has in many countries, but most restrictions have already been lifted. I suspect some will be reimposed because cases are going through the roof - but so far hospitalisations and deaths aren't so we might get away with it. More by luck than judgement if so.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I disagree with vaccine passports in principle

What about if they’re blue?

[Niall_Quinn]

I am, admittedly, a bit ignorant - I don't follow what is going on in our parliament as closely as I probably should, let alone what is going on in other parliaments. But a useful metric, I'd suggest, is how much things affect my day to day life. Some of the things you have highlighted I would agree are legitimate concerns. Wasn't there something about restrictions on people protesting? That, I agree, is of concern. But that didn't stop a load of idiots gathering to protest on Monday about lockdowns, literally the day the restrictions were lifted . Point being yes, I agree some of these powers could be misused, I'm sceptical as to whether they are are really as Draconian as you imagine though. Those people weren't dragged off and incarcerated because, end of the day, we don't have an authoritarian regime.

Yes, most of the things we do can be tracked and I know some people care about that on principle but my take is: what difference does it make? People have been wringing their hands about surveillance for decades, it hasn't actually made any difference to my life, has it yours?

The thing I don't understand is you claim we live in an authoritarian regime while observing people going about their day to day business at the height of the first lockdown. You know they weren't all rounded up, there was no consequence. Because, fundamentally, the government have no interest in having the micro control over our day to day lives that you seem to imagine. I may be misrepresenting your views, but what exactly are you worried about?

You said I have to see people marching down my street before I think anything is going on. I don't know about that but there has to be some impact on my life. Obviously the last year has been an outlier, as it has in many countries, but most restrictions have already been lifted. I suspect some will be reimposed because cases are going through the roof - but so far hospitalisations and deaths aren't so we might get away with it. More by luck than judgement if so.

Have you ever read a history book about Germany between the years of 1918 and 1933? Or Russia leading up to 1917? If you have then you should already be aware of what's going on and you should have no illusions. If you haven't then I suggest you do. Seriously. History is a wheel. It goes around. The environment changes but the intent and the consequences never change. We all see ourselves as distinct from what went before but that's a conceit. In the future the historians will write about us in as distracted and detached manner as we view the events of our own past. But the human condition hasn't changed at the core.

It is not a good thing to be ignorant. But it is an understandable thing in the modern world. Not a desirable thing, ever, EVER - but I get why it happens.

However, it is never a good thing to be ignorant and yet confident in your perception of reality, despite the absence of facts.

[Letters]

What about if they’re blue?

[Mac76]

Is this really important enough to have an entire thread dedicated to it?

[Ollie the Optimist]

Have you ever read a history book about Germany between the years of 1918 and 1933? Or Russia leading up to 1917? If you have then you should already be aware of what's going on and you should have no illusions. If you haven't then I suggest you do. Seriously. History is a wheel. It goes around. The environment changes but the intent and the consequences never change. We all see ourselves as distinct from what went before but that's a conceit. In the future the historians will write about us in as distracted and detached manner as we view the events of our own past. But the human condition hasn't changed at the core.

It is not a good thing to be ignorant. But it is an understandable thing in the modern world. Not a desirable thing, ever, EVER - but I get why it happens.

However, it is never a good thing to be ignorant and yet confident in your perception of reality, despite the absence of facts.

There are times when i wonder if you have ever read said history book.

One of the biggest reasons that Hitler was able to come to power was because of the treaty of Versailles. That crippled the German economy through harsh reparation payments, taking away their navy & the Rhineland which stopped their industrial power costing jobs. The french especially at the treaty wanted to cripple Germany & demanded the harshest of punishments as they felt they had suffered teh most from the German invasion.

It caused rampant inflation as the Weimar government printed more money and it allowed Hitler to gain support. Demanding that Germany stand up to their oppressors, take back the Rhineland & naval forces etc. He also blamed many for surrendering the war, especially the Jews, as he thought htey could win if htey kept going.



We dont have rampant inflation, we not have countries forcing us to give up our naval forces, part of our land & pay huge bills. I suspect you may counter with the EU brexit deal but bear in mind that we entered into that freely which is not comparable whatsoever to 1920s. There is also no war taht has been lost.

These Covid rules are not compareable to nazi Germany in the slightest.

[Niall_Quinn]

There are times when i wonder if you have ever read said history book.

One of the biggest reasons that Hitler was able to come to power was because of the treaty of Versailles. That crippled the German economy through harsh reparation payments, taking away their navy & the Rhineland which stopped their industrial power costing jobs. The french especially at the treaty wanted to cripple Germany & demanded the harshest of punishments as they felt they had suffered teh most from the German invasion.

It caused rampant inflation as the Weimar government printed more money and it allowed Hitler to gain support. Demanding that Germany stand up to their oppressors, take back the Rhineland & naval forces etc. He also blamed many for surrendering the war, especially the Jews, as he thought htey could win if htey kept going.



We dont have rampant inflation, we not have countries forcing us to give up our naval forces, part of our land & pay huge bills. I suspect you may counter with the EU brexit deal but bear in mind that we entered into that freely which is not comparable whatsoever to 1920s. There is also no war taht has been lost.

These Covid rules are not compareable to nazi Germany in the slightest.

Painful.

I actually said, "The environment changes but the intent and the consequences never change.", but you have fixated on an idea to the exclusion of all else. I'm betting you are a university graduate.