Coronavirus Pandemic

[Mac76]

Or, to look at it another way, freedom as you define it is impossible within a society.
There's a value exchange to being in a society, you give up certain freedoms but you get things like infrastructure and safety.
Most of the time we don't actually give up too much freedom so in general people think it's worth it. Yes, we grumble about taxes but we want our bins to be collected and our roads to be maintained etc.
I'd be interested to know how you think true freedom in the way you're defining it can happen within a complicated society.

he doesn't

he thinks everyone should go around putting their fists down other people's throats if they disagree with their views and generally disregarding any rules they happen to disagree with

the irony is i'm betting he's a total loser who wouldn't last five minutes in an environment like that

[Niall_Quinn]

he doesn't

he thinks everyone should go around putting their fists down other people's throats if they disagree with their views and generally disregarding any rules they happen to disagree with

the irony is i'm betting he's a total loser who wouldn't last five minutes in an environment like that

You've already cried about that, haven't you? And run a mile when challenged on the facts. I already told you how you can find out if you'd win that bet. Offer stands. You up for it or just full of air? You're a big blouse with a big mouth who doesn't have the guts to stand by your words in person.

[Globalgunner]

This is the video that NQ mentioned. For what its worth i am posting it and suggest we watch it

No bias, no slant just a scientist who knows what he`s talking about giving his opinion

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwPK...eJimmyDoreShow

[Niall_Quinn]

Or, to look at it another way, freedom as you define it is impossible within a society.
There's a value exchange to being in a society, you give up certain freedoms but you get things like infrastructure and safety.
Most of the time we don't actually give up too much freedom so in general people think it's worth it. Yes, we grumble about taxes but we want our bins to be collected and our roads to be maintained etc.
I'd be interested to know how you think true freedom in the way you're defining it can happen within a complicated society.

I think you probably can't comprehend what freedom actually is. That may be the problem.

I don't care if you want to live in the society you describe. It's not my business if you want that. It's not my business if that's what you build with likeminded individuals. Go for it. It's a desperate society that rewards every evil and feeds on goodness, but if that's what you want then go right ahead.

However, why do you demand I be part of it too? Your understanding of freedom seems to imply that once a majority has enough strength in numbers it is legitimate to force their will on the rest. That's the absolute opposite of freedom.

Where's your objection to you doing your thing and me doing mine? I don't want your so-called infrastructure and safety. I'll look after myself thanks. Does your "free society" "allow" such a thing?

[Mac76]

You've already cried about that, haven't you? And run a mile when challenged on the facts. I already told you how you can find out if you'd win that bet. Offer stands. You up for it or just full of air? You're a big blouse with a big mouth who doesn't have the guts to stand by your words in person.

answer the question - how long do you think you would last in a world where people could just be randomly violent without sanction just because they objected to 'authoritarian' rules - so they broke into your house and stole all your stuff, or your car or attacked your family - how would you argue against them saying they had the 'freedom' and the 'right' to do it under your own bullshit view of the world?

[Niall_Quinn]

answer the question - how long do you think you would last in a world where people could just be randomly violent without sanction just because they objected to 'authoritarian' rules - so they broke into your house and stole all your stuff, or your car or attacked your family - how would you argue against them saying they had the 'freedom' and the 'right' to do it under your own bullshit view of the world?

So right here is the classic demonstration of the conditioned ignorance that is instinctively applied to block all notion of progress. We cannot change a broken system because it would have to be done overnight and therefore everything would fall apart. It's a transparent but surprisingly effective framing of the issue designed to curtail further investigation.

We could also say, we have rats in the basement but if we drop a nuclear bomb on them we will all be killed too. Therefore let the rats proliferate because there is no solution to the problem. Of course the rats are most pleased by this.

[Letters]

However, why do you demand I be part of it too? Your understanding of freedom seems to imply that once a majority has enough strength in numbers it is legitimate to force their will on the rest. That's the absolute opposite of freedom.

I'm not demanding anything. You choose to live in this country. And you (I assume) use all the infrastructure so you've bought in to the contract of living in a society which provides it.
I've said before that if you want to go and live on a desert island with a group of like-minded people then go nuts. Then you can do what you like.
A more practical way if you want to continue to live in this country is to live in a commune I guess. If you do that in a self sustaining way then I guess that's as close as you're going to get to having the freedom which I think you want.

Where's your objection to you doing your thing and me doing mine? I don't want your so-called infrastructure and safety. I'll look after myself thanks. Does your "free society" "allow" such a thing?

I don't have any objection, but I suspect that in practice you do want some of the infrastructure. If you're ill then you want to be able to go to a doctor or hospital, if your house catches fire and you dial 999 you want someone to pick up. You probably do want to be able to drive or travel places and have your bins collected.
As I said, I think living in a commune is the best you're going to get while you're living in a country if you really don't want those things.
You'd still be subject to the country's laws of course but you can effectively opt out of a lot of things if you're self sustaining.

You can't have it both ways. You can't use all the infrastructure and then grumble about the societal contract which allows it all to exist.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm not demanding anything. You choose to live in this country. And you (I assume) use all the infrastructure so you've bought in to the contract of living in a society which provides it.
I've said before that if you want to go and live on a desert island with a group of like-minded people then go nuts. Then you can do what you like.
A more practical way if you want to continue to live in this country is to live in a commune I guess. If you do that in a self sustaining way then I guess that's as close as you're going to get to having the freedom which I think you want.



I don't have any objection, but I suspect that in practice you do want some of the infrastructure. If you're ill then you want to be able to go to a doctor or hospital, if your house catches fire and you dial 999 you want someone to pick up. You probably do want to be able to drive or travel places and have your bins collected.
As I said, I think living in a commune is the best you're going to get while you're living in a country if you really don't want those things.
You'd still be subject to the country's laws of course but you can effectively opt out of a lot of things if you're self sustaining.

You can't have it both ways. You can't use all the infrastructure and then grumble about the societal contract which allows it all to exist.

I don't want ANY of your infrastructure. Can I say it more plainly? I do not want your goods, I do not want your services and I do not want anything from you at all - except your commitment to refrain from violent theft and enforced membership of this society you brag about. If you actually look at your society you will see it is evil at the very core.

Btw, I did not choose to live in this country. My parents did. You have to be born somewhere. Is your argument that the accident of birth commits you to a contract even when you don't consent. This is the very definition of slavery.

It seems you reserve the "right" to dictate to me, while I reserve the genuine right to resist you by all means necessary. My position is naturally lawful, yours is not.

[Niall_Quinn]

BTW, you infrastructure is outrageously expensive, run by incompetents and in decline at an alarming rate. Your NHS threw all its patients on the street so it could service a big pharma profit drive - even worse than the U.S. healthcare system. Your schools committed child abuse at the behest of the same profiteers. Your BBC is a propaganda arm of the same corporate criminals. The question should not be why I don't want to be associated with your so-called infrastructure, it should be why on earth you are so keen.

[Niall_Quinn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsVEbPgrhxA

It seems you vaccinated people are in for a rough ride. You don't have my commiserations because you were warned in advance. Yet you still went ahead and let the state pump an experimental substance into your body. You wouldn't let me do that to you. But you trust the state. I mean - how ludicrous is that? Are you totally oblivious to the state's rap sheet?

Oh fuck, I keep forgetting. Yes you are. Totally oblivious.

Well anyway, enjoy.