Coronavirus Pandemic

[Ollie the Optimist]

It shouldn’t be up to supermarket workers to enforce the mask mandate.

That said, everyone has lost the plot. Probably because of the complete lack of leadership. Last year we had government ministers tripping up and contradicting themselves over whether a scotch egg was a meal or not.

This year, it’s ok to be maskless in pubs and clubs, but you’d better have a mask on when buying scotch eggs in a store.

Seriously, what the fuck?

I wear a mask and continue to do by choice. It’s a precaution and besides it’s a Calgary Flames mask which came from…erm…China.

I don’t see the big deal I’m wearing a mask for the limited times I’m in a crowd with other people.

If you don’t want to wear a mask, I’m ok with that as long as you keep a sensible distance from me.

It’s the complete lack of logic that annoys me. We got an email from the golf club yesterday saying that if we go into the pro shop, we have to wear a mask yet in the clubhouse literally next to it, we do not. Can Covid tell the difference between the two?

If you want masks to be worn, mandate it everywhere as before. How can we be in a situation where if you go into the supermarket for 2 mins its legally required to wear one yet if you go to the theatre for 3 hours, you do not.


Personally I’m still not sold on how effective masks are. Both Scotland & wales kept them while England relaxed the rules yet their rates are higher than ours I believe. I think it was germany (could be Austria) mandated everyone wore specific FPP2 masks rather than just simply cloth ones and their cases are through the roof.

[Letters]

I think masks are effective if used properly, but they're not used properly.
And yes, the inconsistencies are annoying. Twas ever thus.

[Niall_Quinn]

It’s the complete lack of logic that annoys me. We got an email from the golf club yesterday saying that if we go into the pro shop, we have to wear a mask yet in the clubhouse literally next to it, we do not. Can Covid tell the difference between the two?

If you want masks to be worn, mandate it everywhere as before. How can we be in a situation where if you go into the supermarket for 2 mins its legally required to wear one yet if you go to the theatre for 3 hours, you do not.


Personally I’m still not sold on how effective masks are. Both Scotland & wales kept them while England relaxed the rules yet their rates are higher than ours I believe. I think it was germany (could be Austria) mandated everyone wore specific FPP2 masks rather than just simply cloth ones and their cases are through the roof.

Yep. The complete lack of logic in terms of what we are instructed to obey, that's pretty much top of my list too. The detention camps, forced vaccinations, segregation, it's all annoying to a degree, but nowhere near as infuriating as not having clear instructions on when I must stick a mask over my face. Drive me NUTS!

[Niall_Quinn]

Just a quick reminder from doctors in SA.

Moronic Variant is HARMLESS for 99.99% of people on planet Earth.

Please bear in mind while panicking and grovelling to the state.

[Letters]

Something must be done!

Well, yes. I believe this is a situation which required a response.

I know, let's send the army to grab people

Well, no. The Australian response is excessive. One could argue that it has worked, their Covid stats are orders of magnitude better than ours.
But I don't believe it's worth the restriction on people's civil liberties. Which is the balance every country has had to try and strike.

I don't believe it's possible to deal with this situation without any restrictions on liberties. If there's an airborne virus then one key tactic to deal with it is to stop people mixing. You could ask people nicely but people are, on average, bloody idiots. They didn't just ask people nicely to close their curtains during the War or ask people nicely to not panic buy, they enforced the blackout and implemented rationing. Do you think they shouldn't have?

A lot of your post is a "slippery slope" argument. What I keep pointing out to you is that there is no slippery slope.
At times there have been more restrictions, at times there have been less. And that has followed the data.
In January there was full lockdown, if you look at the data back then you can see that some response was required.
Since June there has been almost no restrictions.
I'd be surprised if we get through this winter without any restrictions, the mask thing has already been announced of course.
But...it depends on the data.
If you're saying they're faking the data then...what, at times they're faking good numbers so they can remove restrictions?

you might like to pause and wonder if those fears are warranted in the first place. We just skip over any genuine analysis of the actual threat, even if we don't bother piercing the propaganda and fake data that has inflated the threat tenfold. Let's take the overblown threat without question and then compare it to the response

Right. This is a reasonable point. Is the response proportionate to the situation. This is why I don't agree with the Australian response. It's way out of proportion to the situation. But looking at the hospitalisation data last winter, looking at the deaths data. I do believe this is a situation which required a response. And as I said, my conversation with that ICU doctor tells me that there was a real situation, not an imagined one. The debate is what that response should be.

A disease that is 99.9% survivable.

This is simply not true. Over 80 countries are reporting a deaths per million rate of over 0.1%. So even if you assume that everyone in that country caught Covid - which is obviously not true - more than one in a thousand died. The death rate in developed countries is about 1% - because they have a population which is skewed towards the elderly who are more vulnerable.

What do you think the response should have been? Or do you think there shouldn't have been one at all?
My answer to the first question is that the government should have taken quicker and more decisive action last year, lock down quicker, put restrictions on the borders quicker. Had they done that then I think we'd have had significantly fewer deaths and restrictions wouldn't have lasted so long.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I’m having an antigen test as are my family because we hope to go to Reykjavik tomorrow.

My son doesn’t need the test but he’s having it anyway because last time we went to Iceland, easyJet tried to deny us boarding because he didn’t have a test the Icelandic government clearly stated he didn’t need. I showed the person in charge of boarding the official information stating those born “in 2005 or later” didn’t need one.

But nope, she had a piece of easyJet headed paper that said 2006.

She wouldn’t even look at the official information. It was only when the security guard who was called to escort me out when I politely* tried to explain the official information, took pity, read what it said and informed her, that she called Border Force.

They presumably confirmed I was right. I have never seen someone so gutted to let someone on a plane. No apology and no eye contact as she said we could board, despite what she put my son through as he was clearly devastated.

* (and I do mean politely - even when she said we were denied boarding, whilst delivering a smirk Pritti Patel would be proud of)

[Niall_Quinn]

I’m having an antigen test as are my family because we hope to go to Reykjavik tomorrow.

My son doesn’t need the test but he’s having it anyway because last time we went to Iceland, easyJet tried to deny us boarding because he didn’t have a test the Icelandic government clearly stated he didn’t need. I showed the person in charge of boarding the official information stating those born “in 2005 or later” didn’t need one.

But nope, she had a piece of easyJet headed paper that said 2006.

She wouldn’t even look at the official information. It was only when the security guard who was called to escort me out when I politely* tried to explain the official information, took pity, read what it said and informed her, that she called Border Force.

They presumably confirmed I was right. I have never seen someone so gutted to let someone on a plane. No apology and no eye contact as she said we could board, despite what she put my son through as he was clearly devastated.

* (and I do mean politely - even when she said we were denied boarding, whilst delivering a smirk Pritti Patel would be proud of)

Reduced to a child, or imbecile or domesticated animal status - paraphrasing Lewis Carroll IIRC. You are a more patient and temperate man than I. I've already resolved what I'll do if these lunatics come anywhere near my kids.

What sucks beyond measure is that nobody else stood with you, I'm assuming as you don't mention otherwise. If every time these bastards tried it on we all stood together and faced them down this would all be over very quickly. But people tend to look at their shoes these days when they run into inconvenient situations where another human being might require support.

[Niall_Quinn]

Well, yes. I believe this is a situation which required a response.


Well, no. The Australian response is excessive. One could argue that it has worked, their Covid stats are orders of magnitude better than ours.
But I don't believe it's worth the restriction on people's civil liberties. Which is the balance every country has had to try and strike.

I don't believe it's possible to deal with this situation without any restrictions on liberties. If there's an airborne virus then one key tactic to deal with it is to stop people mixing. You could ask people nicely but people are, on average, bloody idiots. They didn't just ask people nicely to close their curtains during the War or ask people nicely to not panic buy, they enforced the blackout and implemented rationing. Do you think they shouldn't have?

A lot of your post is a "slippery slope" argument. What I keep pointing out to you is that there is no slippery slope.
At times there have been more restrictions, at times there have been less. And that has followed the data.
In January there was full lockdown, if you look at the data back then you can see that some response was required.
Since June there has been almost no restrictions.
I'd be surprised if we get through this winter without any restrictions, the mask thing has already been announced of course.
But...it depends on the data.
If you're saying they're faking the data then...what, at times they're faking good numbers so they can remove restrictions?



Right. This is a reasonable point. Is the response proportionate to the situation. This is why I don't agree with the Australian response. It's way out of proportion to the situation. But looking at the hospitalisation data last winter, looking at the deaths data. I do believe this is a situation which required a response. And as I said, my conversation with that ICU doctor tells me that there was a real situation, not an imagined one. The debate is what that response should be.


This is simply not true. Over 80 countries are reporting a deaths per million rate of over 0.1%. So even if you assume that everyone in that country caught Covid - which is obviously not true - more than one in a thousand died. The death rate in developed countries is about 1% - because they have a population which is skewed towards the elderly who are more vulnerable.

What do you think the response should have been? Or do you think there shouldn't have been one at all?
My answer to the first question is that the government should have taken quicker and more decisive action last year, lock down quicker, put restrictions on the borders quicker. Had they done that then I think we'd have had significantly fewer deaths and restrictions wouldn't have lasted so long.

You win. I don't have the stamina or limited mental faculty to go around the loop endlessly. I made my points. You ignored them. Let's leave it there and find some celebrity video to talk about.

[Niall_Quinn]

The vaccine vaccines vaccines plus booster are our line of defence. The bald, fascist, con-artist said so.

So it stands to reason both vaccinated and unvaccinated cattle need to self isolate if the fake tests show positive or if they have been in contact with a confirmed plague carrier. It also makes sense travellers must quarantine regardless of vaccination status.

This proves the vaccine vaccines vaccines plus booster work.

The sick and the healthy, the vaccinated and unvaccinated all must wear masks in shops. More proof of the effectiveness of the vaccines we have been forced to spend billions on.

Essentially we are back to where we were a year ago. If you are dumb enough to take a fake test, or forced into it by some coercive instruction, and you are unlucky enough to spin up positive, into the hole you and your family go.

Yet more proof the vaccine vaccines vaccines plus booster work.

And Christmas will be celebrated with glad tidings of great joy mumbled through face nappies again.

The vaccine vaccines vaccines plus booster made all the difference.

And if this is how we respond to an entirely predictable mutation of an endemic disease, endemic meaning it will now be with us forever more, can we assume the undeniably highly effective vaccine vaccines vaccines plus booster will mean we go through this drama every time an entirely predictable variant arrives?

Following the logic, it seems the vaccine vaccines vaccines plus booster is so effective we will never be returning to a condition where the state relinquishes its "emergency" power to shut us away for the sniffles.

Like the war on terrorism, this war has been constructed in such a way it can never be won.

Then again, it's only for three weeks.

14 trillion dollars and counting up.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Reduced to a child, or imbecile or domesticated animal status - paraphrasing Lewis Carroll IIRC. You are a more patient and temperate man than I. I've already resolved what I'll do if these lunatics come anywhere near my kids.

What sucks beyond measure is that nobody else stood with you, I'm assuming as you don't mention otherwise. If every time these bastards tried it on we all stood together and faced them down this would all be over very quickly. But people tend to look at their shoes these days when they run into inconvenient situations where another human being might require support.

Nobody. We were at the front of the line as I got Speedy Boarding because I came with my onboard luggage allowance.

We were amongst the last people to board.

I just wanted to get my son there because he was really keen to see the volcano erupting. So was I as it happens.

It was spectacular.