lol just lol at the Messi V Ronaldo debate. Everyone whose username on GW begins with 'S' knows that Iniesta has been the most talented player in world football over the last 20 years. Messi gets the credit because he's just a runningpastpeopleandscoringmorethaneveryoneelse merchant.
His passing is extremely average. No variation to it, just a bunch of through-balls. Compare that to people like Maradona, who could playmake to a world class level. My concern is not the Ronaldo comparisons, its the Maradona and other all-time greats comparisons.Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...
Sensible people meaning who agrees with you?Funny when you make nonsensical statements like putting "wonder kid" up there. Who calls him a wonder kid now? I really don't think he needs to do it in a World Cup to be considered an all-time great, he has done it in the Champions League more than enough times already.
He's not an agility/acceleration merchant, his passing has been rather special for the last few years, which gets lost because of the amount of goals he scores. His role for Argentina is more akin to Xavi or Iniesta than it is for what he does for Barcelona, therefore even if he is a agility/acceleration merchant (which sounds like a rather bizarre backhanded compliment for somebody with talent), like Xavi or Pirlo, his longevity should be fairly secure as he won't be needing those facets to his game. Just the vision and passing range and short five yard movement.
I don't understand the disdain some give to him. I sometimes think the Premier League wants to vicariously live through Ronaldo and thus tries to nail Messi as some kind of one trick pony that is nowhere near his level.
A player like Ronaldo is the perfect image of a player the Premier League and England would create, or even, did create.
I say sensible people because logical people must surely know a theory must be tested in different environments to hold. How do we know Messi is great when he has only done it under one set of circumstances? A circumstance where he has the best pair of Spanish midfielders of all time in Xavi and Iniesta (Tested and proven. They have translated Tika-Taka to international football and dominated. They are the common denominator.) feeding him an unprecedented amount of ball, after dominating with unprecedent percentages of possession. No forward has ever had that. I think I read somewhere that Messi lost the ball more than anybody in 2012 La Liga. Oh yeah and La Liga is toilet these days with their TV deals, shame.
It would be unrealistic to expect Messi to join another (lesser) team so now hes got to do something with Argentina. I refuse to let him take the "best of all time" tag through the backdoor. Tip-toeing off with his little legs with that title when hes done dikk all outside of his little nest.
I thought Copa America 2011, which was held, yep you guessed it, IN ARGENTINA, would be the one but nope. Hes was comical. I made a point of watching all Argentinas games just so I could laugh at them and seriously, he was do-do.
Then people say "oh Argentina only have strikers". Well, its a wonder that, given the plaudits they all get. Messi, Aguero, Higuain....its a wonder that they dont just say "forget about midfields" and blow teams away. Brazils front 3 did it in 2002.
Nah, Messi MUST do something for Argentina. All I ask is a semi final appearance with him leading the way. Its not too much to ask tbf.
Oh sorry I forgot to say....we counting the Olympics? Lolz
What kind of passing do you expect in an advanced role? Fairly sure his short passing is ok too, he plays tiki-taka just like everyone else in the team. Compare the passing to Maradona, sure, whatever you like, his (Maradona's) goalscoring level was nowhere near the same though.
It's not a theory, this isn't some submitted piece of work that is asked by the science fraternity to verify or discard like Higgs-Boson or something. It's merely peoples opinions that he is one of the best of all time, whether they consider him the best varies from person-to-person. Some might think he is way ahead of Ronaldo (overall in career terms) but not near Maradona. Others might think he is. I don't know how much of Maradona you got to see but for me, it's very little, it might be well why I consider Messi to be the best player that I have seen but I can't decide on something I haven't seen.
He may have lost possession the most but I presume that's through dribbling, which is very hard to get right lots of times and part of the reason why I do consider him so highly. It's the most difficult skill to get right when clubs will get players to hone in on players of that type and when it works, it's what I love to see from football. There is also another stat that Xavi has given one direct assist to Messi over the last few seasons (this was true beore the start of this season). Iniesta is a different matter but then look at Ronaldo with Özil, he publically bemoaned his departure as he knew his movements. Should that detract from Ronaldo he has a player that knows where to pass it and when? I don't think so. The best players will end up with the best players surrounding them.
If La Liga is toilet then how can the possession lost stat hold any relevance? By mentioning it, it suggests players are actually getting the ball off Messi, they aren't standing off him like seems to be the impression.
Argentina have a very poor defence and goalkeeper which is going to hold them back, whereas Spain, don't. Other teams, so many teams are too good tactically and in personnel now for only one player to lead others to glory or close to it, no matter how good they are.
Why is it that Maradona is allowed to get away with not winning a European Cup? He was good enough to 'win the World Cup on his own' so why not at a competition that had (at least then) less prestige?
And yes BOBN, counting the Olympics. It's treated extremely seriously in South America, just like the FIFA Club World Cup is (Messi specifically requested to miss the start of Barcelona's season in 2008 to appear in it when Guardiola had initially banned him from being chosen). It isn't here because we don't have a recognised team we can enter but it doesn't surprise me that the attitudes over here are so full of derision, it's the same for the Europa League, when teams from Spain or Portugal take it seriously.
BOBN is a refined, more imaginative Cripps.
Big fan of his me.
A next gen WUM, if you like.
BOBN is the evolved form of Cripps.
Crippsachu, I choose you!
NOTE: The location of this post has been moved and the thread title (which was previously Wenger is Leaving) has been manipulated by a notorious pro-Wenger moderator. What was previously a message that contained no profanity and made a comment on a real life event has now been manipulated by a deliberately provocative title. An old and crude propaganda and censorship technique.
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