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Thread: "Currants Bw..."

  1. #28471
    Member Mac76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Letters View Post
    You are wrong! It was 42%, which is still pretty feeble Maybe only 27% of people voted for AV?
    And while AV is demonstrably more representative, it was too complicated for many to understand.
    Cameron figured he could give Clegg the referendum, knowing there was a pretty good chance it would get defeated and so it turned out.
    You have made up some scenarios above so yeah, there could be issues but we have the current real issues I have outlined.
    And as I've alluded to, the very fact we have the current FPTP changes the way people vote. I'd suggest that any system which means people feel they have to vote tactically or vote for the "least bad" option which they feel can win rather than who they want to vote for is inherently bad.

    From what I understand Germany has been using PR fairly successfully. I'm sure they have issues, there is no perfect system, but as a country they seem to have done OK.
    yes, the 2011 vote was a complete stitchup which Clegg got as a concession for supporting austerity and completely contradicting the Lib Dems' promise on tuition fees - nice one Nick...

  2. #28472
    Member IBK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mac76 View Post
    Rory Stewart wrote a great book about travelling across Afghanistan - 'The Places in Between' - thoroughly recommended.

    not sure about him as PM though - the trouble with any Tory PM is they end up giving in to the lunatics in the party, of which there are way too many.

    if Clegg hadn't sold out the Lib Dems we'd have a genuine third party to keep the Tories and socialists under control - i actually think if we could have a decent system of PR then we'd have genuine coalition governments (the LD-Tory one was basically the Tories with the LDs as their scapegoats) where no-one could do anything too extreme - i actually think that's the best way to do things
    100%
    Putting the laughter back into manslaughter

  3. #28473
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    All fair & reasonable points made by letters & mac.

    Suspect none of will change each other’s minds on this but enjoyable to debate it.

  4. #28474
    Administrator Letters's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mac76 View Post
    yes, the 2011 vote was a complete stitchup which Clegg got as a concession for supporting austerity and completely contradicting the Lib Dems' promise on tuition fees - nice one Nick...
    Our local MP at the time came to a couple of events at our church (he's a Tory, a Christian and a Gooner, so only 1/3rd bad!) around the time of that election, once before and once after. I remember chatting to him about it all. Before the election when it was all looking close he said he couldn't see the Tories going in to coalition with the Lib Debs. That's exactly what happened of course, which is nothing to do with him, he was just a back bencher. So after the election he was at another event and I said that I didn't see what Nick Clegg was getting out of it. The MP said "he gets to be deputy PM!". Which is a bit like being made milk monitor. It was a disaster for Clegg and the Lib Dems.

  5. #28475
    ***** Niall_Quinn's Avatar
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    How far can the warmism loons go before the average person sees through their bullshit?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFSYFG7ygCw

    These nutters want to reduce carbon dioxide levels on an already carbon dioxide starved planet, they want to get rid of animals, transport and travel. They want you to eat insects. And they want to replace efficient energy with inefficient non-alternatives that pollute even more.

    These people are utterly crazy and yet the average bod in the street will just accept this is a thing. No evidence, no facts, no data - just crappy computer models and an endless propaganda drive.

    Now they are busy destroying data and reports that easily disprove their bullshit. Just like Orwell's 1984 and the great communist tragedies of the past, unwanted history is simply being discarded or rewritten to suit the crackpot agenda.

    And, as always, a small group of corporate interests are on standby to cash in.

    It's so ridiculously transparent you have to wonder how anyone is fooled by it.
    Für eure Sicherheit

  6. #28476
    Member Mac76's Avatar
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    Oh dear, here he is with the usual lengthy BS - on the bottle early tonight are we...?

  7. #28477
    Administrator Letters's Avatar
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    Michael Collins

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56921562

    Often forgotten about, but a big part of the Apollo 11 mission.

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    Member Mac76's Avatar
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    Definitely, RIP

  9. #28479
    Administrator Letters's Avatar
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    Can you expand on these two points?

    Quote Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn View Post
    These nutters want to reduce carbon dioxide levels on an already carbon dioxide starved planet
    Now they are busy destroying data and reports that easily disprove their bullshit.
    And, out of interest, what is your position on global warming, exactly?

    Is it that it isn't happening? I mean, I'm mid 40s - although hurtling towards 50 with disconcerting speed. But there's a clear difference in the climate in this country since I was a kid. We used to get regular, deep snow. It's rare now. I remember when I'd go and see fireworks it was foot-numbingly cold. Now a light jacket will suffice. I'd suggest the fact that the climate has changed in the UK at least is pretty much undeniable.

    Is it that you concede it's happening but you don't think it's caused by human action so there's no point in doing anything about it?
    Or is it that you do think we are contributing to it but you don't think the counter-measures being suggested will help. Or you don't think it's going to cause big problems so it doesn't really matter?

    Or none of the above in which case fill in your own answer.

    I mean, it seems to me that it is happening. We are causing it, or certainly contributing. And it causing and will continue to cause problems.
    So I'm generally on board with "we should probably do something". I'm less sure about what. And have to say when I've been to places like India I have thought "oh what's the bloody point?!". As Sean Lock said, doing a bit or recycling feels like turning up to the aftermath of an earthquake with a dustpan and brush.
    But, like Covid, I do think there's a situation which demands a response.

  10. #28480
    Member Mac76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Letters View Post
    Can you expand on these two points?



    And, out of interest, what is your position on global warming, exactly?
    it's all a lefty, lizard-people conspiracy of course, aren't you paying attention...?

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