Seriously: can we expect Wenger to do this again?

[notwist]

Apart from the fans, who don’t deserve this, the person I feel sorry for is Wenger. Every season he starts with the guts ripped out of a team he has spent the previous season furiously beating in to shape while trying to hang on to the coat-tails of the elite, sneak in to fourth place, and keep the Arsenal accountants happy. Apart from his signature bounce of a water bottle, and dark mutterings of “financial fair play”, he feigns to show no outward signs of strain. But that’s wrong. His face and body are now utterly wracked in frustration and dismay. How he manages to motivate himself, let alone his players, for yet another Sisyphusian task of the utmost futility is beyond me. The man is a human marvel, a Goddamn streak of superannuated willpower as wide as a barge.

I think the Arsenal Board need to be reported to the European Court of Humans Rights. It's just downright cruel.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Apart from the fans, who don’t deserve this, the person I feel sorry for is Wenger. Every season he starts with the guts ripped out of a team he has spent the previous season furiously beating in to shape while trying to hang on to the coat-tails of the elite, sneak in to fourth place, and keep the Arsenal accountants happy. Apart from his signature bounce of a water bottle, and dark mutterings of “financial fair play”, he feigns to show no outward signs of strain. But that’s wrong. His face and body are now utterly wracked in frustration and dismay. How he manages to motivate himself, let alone his players, for yet another Sisyphusian task of the utmost futility is beyond me. The man is a human marvel, a Goddamn streak of superannuated willpower as wide as a barge.

I think the Arsenal Board need to be reported to the European Court of Humans Rights. It's just downright cruel.

Don't worry this wil be his last season with us anyways. I think he needs to stand up to the board and stop conning the fans, I don't think its all his fault but he is not faultless in this.

he is the only person putting pressure on himself and it can not be good for his health.

But the board pay him not us so he will do as they say, His Loyalty for this club is the one thing that blinds him at times.

[KSE Comedy Club]

He'll be fine as long as he wears his glasses.

Did anyone notice if he had them on today during the game?

[Globalgunner]

Failure is a self fulfilling prophecy, the more you fail the more likely you will continue to fail. At some time in 2006 the Arsenal board decided it was too expensive to compete at the top end, so now we exist in a region just above where the spuds live.....For now

[gooners]

Apart from the fans, who don’t deserve this, the person I feel sorry for is Wenger. Every season he starts with the guts ripped out of a team he has spent the previous season furiously beating in to shape while trying to hang on to the coat-tails of the elite, sneak in to fourth place, and keep the Arsenal accountants happy. Apart from his signature bounce of a water bottle, and dark mutterings of “financial fair play”, he feigns to show no outward signs of strain. But that’s wrong. His face and body are now utterly wracked in frustration and dismay. How he manages to motivate himself, let alone his players, for yet another Sisyphusian task of the utmost futility is beyond me. The man is a human marvel, a Goddamn streak of superannuated willpower as wide as a barge.

I think the Arsenal Board need to be reported to the European Court of Humans Rights. It's just downright cruel.

I don't buy any of that.

The board's fault is that wenger's deluded philosophy meant/means they don't have to shell out for shit -- which as moneymen is heaven! It poses no risks at all to their investments as long as we acheive 4th place.

Why not allow wenger to do whatever the fuck he wants then. They don't have to put him under any pressure. He delivers the bare minimum.

[notwist]

I think the fans have all cottoned on now. We aren't stupid (well, not all the time). This club realised some time ago that you get the same reward for finishing fourth as you do finishing first, and it costs hell of a lot less money. That, and this vague notion that "it'll all come right when financial fair play comes in" - who know's it might? - is what drives the club.

That's the deal. They also know 60,000 will turn up regardless, so it's win-win for them.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I don't buy any of that.

The board's fault is that wenger's deluded philosophy meant/means they don't have to shell out for shit -- which as moneymen is heaven! It poses no risks at all to their investments as long as we acheive 4th place.

Why not allow wenger to do whatever the fuck he wants then. They don't have to put him under any pressure. He delivers the bare minimum.

Well according to most gooners they do thats why we are in this mess. Like you said the money men are in heavn and even if AW left do you think they will bring in a man who will stand up to them?

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Wenger surrounds himself with yes men because he is not prepared to have his increasingly autocratic regime at the club challenged, because of the fiasco of the wage structure, transfer dealings and contract negotiations......he is as much responsible for this current shambles if not more so than the board.
Because the board is so arrogant and self-righteous, they won't bring back the only man in the world Wenger will listen to and that is David Dein. I am not saying Dein is a saint, selling out his shares in Arsenal to that Putin Apparatchik Usmanov was disgraceful...but Dein in tandom with Fiszman, Edelman and Wenger made the club what it was.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Wenger surrounds himself with yes men because he is not prepared to have his increasingly autocratic regime at the club challenged, because of the fiasco of the wage structure, transfer dealings and contract negotiations......he is as much responsible for this current shambles if not more so than the board.
Because the board is so arrogant and self-righteous, they won't bring back the only man in the world Wenger will listen to and that is David Dein. I am not saying Dein is a saint, selling out his shares in Arsenal to that Putin Apparatchik Usmanov was disgraceful...but Dein in tandom with Fiszman, Edelman and Wenger made the club what it was.

Spot on fella.

[tpyo]

Peter Hill Wood doesn't get a look-in? Chairman since 82.

[Cripps_orig]

He gets £6m a year, has no pressure to produce trophies from the board, is the only person ever to pick his new boss pretty much guaranteeing he keeps his job, deluded fans who will back him no matter what

Yeah i wouldnt feel too sorry for him

[The Wengerbabies]

Wenger is as much responsible for the mess as the board.

If he didn't like the direction the club was heading he could have left.

[gunnerrrrr]

Wenger made his bed, he can lay in it

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Wenger is as much responsible for the mess as the board.

If he didn't like the direction the club was heading he could have left.

this.

it was wenger's over reliance on the youth project that got us into this mess in the first place. now he's complaining. what gives?

[Joker]

Wenger's also responsible for our fall from grace IMO. I know some people believe he is constrained by the board, who are unwilling to release funds and have told him to try and finish 4th while also making a net profit in terms of player transfers. However, I get the impression that Wenger is fine with this strategy, that he believes that the economic cost of trying to spend a lot of money to compete with City, Chelsea, Utd etc is greater than the economic benefit that you get from winning the league. I'm sure Wenger thinks it is impossible to compete with teams who in his mind have "financially doped" and therefore their titles are in some way tainted. Because he believes Man City and Chelsea's titles are tainted, he probably isn't too fussed that we haven't won the league, because in his mind he probably believes they don't count as much as our titles in 97-98, 01-02 and 03-04.

[cricketsi]

because in his mind he probably believes they don't count as much as our titles in 97-98, 01-02 and 03-04.
He'd be right really, to my mind. They're tainted small scale achievements considering the ridiculous (and they were truly ridiculous) sums of money spent.

You can say the history books won't record any of that, but I don't feel much connection or pride to our victories of many decades ago, so you can largely screw the history books. In the future I will remember triumphs I saw in my time as a fan, and blowing the competition out of the water with pure financial power wouldn't give me the same satisfaction as a fan.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

He gets £6m a year, has no pressure to produce trophies from the board, is the only person ever to pick his new boss pretty much guaranteeing he keeps his job, deluded fans who will back him no matter what

Yeah i wouldnt feel too sorry for him

Not really he never told nina to sell her shares to him did he or Danny Fizzman not much he could have done to stop the guy coming in.

Oh and he gets £7m a year :haha:Not that i give a shit what he earns if the footballers can be greedy why can't managers.

[gunnerrrrr]

The thing people need to understand is the very best players will leave if they feel they are playing for an average club....and when i say average, forget tradition and history, to these modern players average means a club which is not competitive with the very best.

Wenger advocates a "fair salary" deal across his players...which means the Squallachis, Djourous, Diabys etc of this world are rewarded very handsomely.

Apologies for using USD, as i got this from ESPN...but Man Utd average weekly pay is $106,081, and Arsenal's is $101,541. You know why...cos we play average, and lets be honest shit footballers alot of money.

Wenger also gave the green light to but Chamack, Park, Squalchi etc....What have they done for us, how often have they featured...not to mention all the pther guys on our bench with ridiculous salaries who rarely every play.

Then to cover up all these failing we simply harp on about City, Chelsea etc being able to pay zillions more.....i dont see Bayern Munich players cambering to leave...why cos they are competitive.

Players like Henry, Viera etc thought hard about leaving us, because we were winning not paying the best money.

The above doesn't even take into question Wengers ability as a football manager of late during games, the shocking subs, the inflexibility to change formation during a game, the shocking disorganisation of our defence for years.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I get the impression that Wenger is fine with this strategy

Of course he is, he obviosuly belives it would work but he is too stubborn to admit it is a failure hence how he is changing things bit buy but not hugely he does not want to appear wrong.

[Cripps_orig]

Not really he never told nina to sell her shares to him did he or Danny Fizzman not much he could have done to stop the guy coming in.

He interviewed Gazidis....

[Olivier's xmas twist]

He interviewed Gazidis....

Would not have had the power to hire him that was all down to hillwood, of course he would interwiev him they will be working together have to see if they can't get on. Every manger would do the same.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

The thing people need to understand is the very best players will leave if they feel they are playing for an average club....and when i say average, forget tradition and history, to these modern players average means a club which is not competitive with the very best.

Wenger advocates a "fair salary" deal across his players...which means the Squallachis, Djourous, Diabys etc of this world are rewarded very handsomely.

Apologies for using USD, as i got this from ESPN...but Man Utd average weekly pay is $106,081, and Arsenal's is $101,541. You know why...cos we play average, and lets be honest shit footballers alot of money.

Wenger also gave the green light to but Chamack, Park, Squalchi etc....What have they done for us, how often have they featured...not to mention all the pther guys on our bench with ridiculous salaries who rarely every play.

Then to cover up all these failing we simply harp on about City, Chelsea etc being able to pay zillions more.....i dont see Bayern Munich players cambering to leave...why cos they are competitive.

Players like Henry, Viera etc thought hard about leaving us, because we were winning not paying the best money.

The above doesn't even take into question Wengers ability as a football manager of late during games, the shocking subs, the inflexibility to change formation during a game, the shocking disorganisation of our defence for years.

:gp:

[selassie]

Got this off the other board, made me chuckle!

- - -

A conversation between Hill Wood and Kroenke.

Hill Wood: I've sold another player your highness

Kroenke: Well done, what did we get for him?

Hill Wood: 20m sir

Kroenke: Excellent. That's two players in a week and 45m profit.
I love soccer, I am making a fortune out of it.

Hill Wood: The supporters aren't very happy your excellency.

Kroenke: The supporters, are they the people that turn up every week and also give me loads of money?

Hill Wood: Yes sir

Kroenke: I'm not bothered about them because I don't go to any soccer matches, I don't like them much.
Right, where's my paying in book, I need to pay in these cheques

- - -

But yeah, Arsene is as much to blame as the board with his failed Youth Policy, sad thing is, all of the gems from that Youth Policy have walked away, they didn't share his vision.

[GP]

Wait a minute, you can't have it both ways.

Either you're saying they want to win, or they want to make money. If it's the latter, then the 'youth policy' has been a resounding success.

[selassie]

Wait a minute, you can't have it both ways.

Either you're saying they want to win, or they want to make money. If it's the latter, then the 'youth policy' has been a resounding success.

What's the purpose of a Football Club? To make money and WIN, I don't understand why it needs to be one or the other and I don't understand why the club see it this way either.

[fakeyank]

He gets £6m a year, has no pressure to produce trophies from the board, is the only person ever to pick his new boss pretty much guaranteeing he keeps his job, deluded fans who will back him no matter what

Yeah i wouldnt feel too sorry for him

:gp:

:lol: @ calling him a human marvel and somehow depicting him as the victim when he is the chief architect of the shit we are in!

[Olivier's xmas twist]

:gp:

:lol: @ calling him a human marvel and somehow depicting him as the victim when he is the chief architect of the shit we are in!

So's your face.

But you not wrong.

[SayNoMore]

The onus is on Wenger to push the board into improving the squad. He is a man who has great power at this club, i am disappointed he has allowed it to get this far.

[Power n Glory]

People can't divorce Wenger from this situation. As heard over the past few weeks regarding transfer and contract talks, RVP sat with both Wenger and Gazidis to discuss his future, Ferguson spoke with Wenger about selling RVP and said he was playing hardball with negotiations. We've just gotten rid of Song and many people on here believe Wenger made the call to sell. In the past, people would assume that contracts and deals were being made without Wenger's consent and set the board up as the scapegoats. I suppose it's been easier to blame them to point the finger at Wenger.

[Ollie the Optimist]

People can't divorce Wenger from this situation. As heard over the past few weeks regarding transfer and contract talks, RVP sat with both Wenger and Gazidis to discuss his future, Ferguson spoke with Wenger about selling RVP and said he was playing hardball with negotiations. We've just gotten rid of Song and many people on here believe Wenger made the call to sell. In the past, people would assume that contracts and deals were being made without Wenger's consent and set the board up as the scapegoats. I suppose it's been easier to blame them to point the finger at Wenger.

what the actual fuck are you talking about, of course a manager will make a fucking decision on wehter to sell a player or keep him and of course he will be having meetings with his captain about his future. what a fucking stupid post

[Power n Glory]

what the actual fuck are you talking about, of course a manager will make a fucking decision on wehter to sell a player or keep him and of course he will be having meetings with his captain about his future. what a fucking stupid post

You say of course, but you know how long people have tried to make out that Wenger is getting shafted by the Board as if he has no say? You might have been one of the dumb ass people making constant excuses in the past. Might explain the aggression. Take a chill pill and relax or shut the fuck up! :lol:

[SayNoMore]

what the actual fuck are you talking about, of course a manager will make a fucking decision on wehter to sell a player or keep him and of course he will be having meetings with his captain about his future. what a fucking stupid post

Relax darling

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Tone down the language, Ollie.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Tone down the language, Ollie.

apologies. jsut ahd a shit night and snapped

[Kano]

no, this is the seasmn it finally catches up with wenger. 5t

[Boss]

no, this is the season it finally catches up with wenger. 5th or even 6th this time round.

People have been saying that for the last 5 years.

Top four is guaranteed.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

People have been saying that for the last 5 years.

Top four is guaranteed.

Not really, with us you just never know.

[Joker]

Not really, with us you just never know.

I reckon we'll get top 4, even in recent seasons when it looked very likely that we'd drop out, other teams have suffered collapses (Spurs in 05-06 and last season, Villa in 08-09) and we managed to blunder our way in.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

You say of course, but you know how long people have tried to make out that Wenger is getting shafted by the Board as if he has no say? You might have been one of the dumb ass people making constant excuses in the past. Might explain the aggression. Take a chill pill and relax or shut the fuck up! :lol:


what the actual fuck are you talking about, of course a manager will make a fucking decision on wehter to sell a player or keep him and of course he will be having meetings with his captain about his future. what a fucking stupid post


Tone down the language, Ollie.

Yet only Ollie was told to tone it down while Png was not.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I reckon we'll get top 4, even in recent seasons when it looked very likely that we'd drop out, other teams have suffered collapses (Spurs in 05-06 and last season, Villa in 08-09) and we managed to blunder our way in.

IMO depends on what we do in the next ten days in the window and what other clubs do too.

[Marc Overmars]

I don't think top 4 can be taken for granted anymore but despite everything that goes on, we somehow manage to scrape in every year. I don't have much confidence in Wenger to deliver the biggest prizes but I do think we're more than good enough for 4th minimum.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

People can't divorce Wenger from this situation. As heard over the past few weeks regarding transfer and contract talks, RVP sat with both Wenger and Gazidis to discuss his future, Ferguson spoke with Wenger about selling RVP and said he was playing hardball with negotiations. We've just gotten rid of Song and many people on here believe Wenger made the call to sell. In the past, people would assume that contracts and deals were being made without Wenger's consent and set the board up as the scapegoats. I suppose it's been easier to blame them to point the finger at Wenger.

Those that say AW is to blame are not wrong, those who say the board are to blame are not wrong, lets not pretend its one and not the other and all this Wenger vs the board stuff needs to stop all as bad as the other.

[Power n Glory]

People have been saying that for the last 5 years.

Top four is guaranteed.

I'm confident about a top four finish. Our teams stronger than what it was last year, even with the loss of RVP and Song. All our new signings from last summer have had a full year to settle, plus I think the new players we've signed this year are good players. Besides our improvements, our rivals have taken a step back. Spurs have changed their coach, have lost Modric and I think it will take them time to adjust. They've already lost their first game. Liverpool have changed coaches too and I don't think Rogers can transform that team to playing the style of football he wants them to play over night. The one team I'm wary of is Newcastle because they're building on from last season and haven't lost key players or swapped coaches. But I don't think they'll have the experience to dig deep. We should be fine and hope we push on to win a cup this year.

[Cripps_orig]

Im more confident about a top 4 finish this season than i was last season

However if we give Spuds or any other team challenging us for a top 4 place as much as a lead as we did last season, then we wont make it up this season.

Also just finishing top 4 doesnt mean it will be a good/great season. We've finished top 4 every season for the last 7 trophyless years and every single one of us can safely say its been a car crash of a 7 years, well every single one of us unless you're a tard.

I dont mind finishing top 4 if we are challenging for the title. If we aim for top 4 and dont give a fuck about the title, Wenger can fuck the fuck off tbh

[Kano]

People have been saying that for the last 5 years.

yep. not me. i've always thought top four. even after our 8-2 last season.

this time round, we will not get away with changing half the team around.

this is the season it finally doesn't work.

[selassie]

I think we'll be just about OK for top 4, but we won't credibly challenge for the title and I don't think we'll be able to retain any standout performers at the end of the season.

Top 4 is not enough, it's not a suistainable model because we gut the team of it's star performers every summer.

This yearly transistion will continue until things change, something has to give.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I'm confident about a top four finish. Our teams stronger than what it was last year, even with the loss of RVP and Song. All our new signings from last summer have had a full year to settle, plus I think the new players we've signed this year are good players. Besides our improvements, our rivals have taken a step back. Spurs have changed their coach, have lost Modric and I think it will take them time to adjust. They've already lost their first game. Liverpool have changed coaches too and I don't think Rogers can transform that team to playing the style of football he wants them to play over night. The one team I'm wary of is Newcastle because they're building on from last season and haven't lost key players or swapped coaches. But I don't think they'll have the experience to dig deep. We should be fine and hope we push on to win a cup this year.

So what your saying is we'll finish top 4

[GP]

I don't think we'll win the league but we'll definitely be in the top 1.

[The Ogg Monster]

Thats not funny or clever ^ I hope you feel bad.

Wenger can turn water into wine so I'm sure he can hack another PL season.