Match reaction v Swansea

[The Wengerbabies]

:haha:

[gunnerrrrr]

He has to go....its not about disrespect, he looks utterly clueless out there....

[cheesy bites]

Fuck this team

Fuck the board

Fuck the manager

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Fuck em!!!! they're not getting any more of my money until Wenger is gone!!!

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

"When I arrived, Pat Rice told me, if you don't win a trophy every year, it's a failure. That was the standard." - Freddie Ljungberg

what went wrong?

[Xhaka Can’t]

Try not to slag each other off, lets keep the vitriol for the club.

[Kano]

what else is there to say after another of these

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Not one of those ****s out there today looked as if they cared fuck them all tbh!

[PGFC]

Great performance, just like the Arsenal of old, shame it was by Swansea.

****s

[Xhaka Can’t]

Fuck em!!!! they're not getting any more of my money until Wenger is gone!!!

Yep.

I'm out.

[hymppi]

As I said in match thread:
This is Arsenal nowadays. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anEuw8F8cpE
Hint: we're not dr. Jones.

Well, AW can take his swordsmen and fuck off, Hill-Wood also.

[milla]

Few more loses this Dec and he doesn't have to worry about winter's transfer window. Wumger :bow:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Come back Pat Rice, all is forgiven.

Also, we're tenth. :bow:

[notwist]

I suppose looking on the positive side it is one game closer to Wenger going. I just hope he calls it quits in mid-table and not after he relegates us.

[BOBN]

this is why I say jenkinson is a horrible, useless, championship player. and you got fools saying its ok to lose sagna because of this plum :blink:


anyone with that sentiment is co-signing the year on year arsenal asset strip

[gooners]

"When I arrived, Pat Rice told me, if you don't win a trophy every year, it's a failure. That was the standard." - Freddie Ljungberg

what went wrong?

pat rice also meant the 4th place trophy!

[Arsenal Fan]

utter joke

[Master Splinter]

Michu :bow:.

Must Get.

Arsenal :lol:.

Must Not Watch.

[Marc Overmars]

We are garbage, worse than last season and that takes some doing.

The Spurs win was a huge fluke.

[fakeyank]

This is not about the board. Our starting XI was as close to our strongest team and we couldnt beat Swansea AT HOME.

No point hiding behind Kroenke or PHW anymore. The first man that needs to be kicked out of Arsenal is Wenger.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Yep.

I'm out.

I'm sure like me you can think of better things to spend £30+ on.

[gunnerrrrr]

this is why I say jenkinson is a horrible, useless, championship player. and you got fools saying its ok to lose sagna because of this plum :blink:


anyone with that sentiment is co-signing the year on year arsenal asset strip

you cant blame the youngest player on the pitch for the loss......it was Swansea....we are Arsenal.....only one man to blame for the scoreline

[hymppi]

Any official after match words from AW yet?

[Gervinho's Forehead]

This is not about the board. Our starting XI was as close to our strongest team and we couldnt beat Swansea.

No point hiding behind Kroenke or PHW anymore. The first man that needs to be kicked out of Arsenal is Wenger.

He is killing Arsenal on the pitch that I support.

[gooners]

Try not to slag each other off, lets keep the vitriol for the club.


:censored:

:tiphat:

[cheesy bites]

I'm now fully onboard with it. No doubt whatsoever. Wenger has to go.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Any official after match words from AW yet?

He'll probably go off in a hump and not speak to anyone and blame the goals on the ref or something, the man is deluded.

[Joker]

This has been coming for a while, we've only performed well in a handful of games this season, and either good luck or opposition mistakes have covered up how shit we really are.

I honestly can't see how any Arsenal fans can still everything's alright at the club. There are enormous issues at this club, from top to bottom, and IMO the only way we can get our Arsenal back is for the manager and the board to fuck off. This is not to disrespect the achievements of Wenger, but he is a major reason for our decline over the last 5 seasons.

[Kano]

“So to show we can do it the way we do it with the club in a good financial situation and with the players coming out from our youth development as well, I think it’s important for the game."
until we have a manager willing to play the premiership game as it is today, then we're fucked

[gunnerrrrr]

this is actually funny -
Piers Morgan ‏@piersmorgan
THE EQUATION: Highest ticket prices + highest paid manager & CEO = sell all best players to rivals, worst start in League since '94.

[gunnerrrrr]

He'll probably go off in a hump and not speak to anyone and blame the goals on the ref or something, the man is deluded.

he practically sprinted down the tunnel

[Gervinho's Forehead]

this is actually funny -
Piers Morgan ‏@piersmorgan
THE EQUATION: Highest ticket prices + highest paid manager & CEO = sell all best players to rivals, worst start in League since '94.

It's not even the fucking start of the league anymore!

[selassie]

huh...i dont care anymore...not worth the hassle. this rotten regime needs to end, from the board to the manager I want them gone.

[BOBN]

This is not about the board. Our starting XI was as close to our strongest team and we couldnt beat Swansea AT HOME.

No point hiding behind Kroenke or PHW anymore. The first man that needs to be kicked out of Arsenal is Wenger.
rangel > jenkinson
michu > giroud
dyer > oxlade chamberlain
pablo hernandez (I know he didnt play today)>>>>> any of our forward players

they have better players than us simple

[Gervinho's Forehead]

he practically sprinted down the tunnel

He can't take it that the fans aren't happy and I bet he doesn't know why!!!

"We thank you for your interest in our affairs"

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

thats what you get for selling song and not replacing.

michu and britton with acres of space in the middle. no DM closing them down.

arteta looks at jack to make a tackle, jack looks at cazorla, cazorla looks at arteta. no specified role for any player to get stuck in.

fucks sake.

[Xhaka Can’t]

This has been coming for a while, we've only performed well in a handful of games this season,

Only if your name is Captain Hook.

[Joker]

This is not about the board. Our starting XI was as close to our strongest team and we couldnt beat Swansea AT HOME.

No point hiding behind Kroenke or PHW anymore. The first man that needs to be kicked out of Arsenal is Wenger.

Wenger still unfortunately has a lot of support, read the comments section on Arseblog and you'd think that the last 5 years didn't happen, and that he's still the greatest thing since sliced bread. It cannot be denied that these days he is a poor manager. He is unable to make the right substitutions at the right time, he's tactically inflexible and fails to get the best out of his players. His ego has grown so large that he will stubbornly continue with failed methods rather than change and admit he was wrong. Not only that, he's totally in agreement with the board's free market philosophy which has decimated this football club, robbed it of its soul and in its place is a cold, corporate entity existing solely to feather the beds of shareholders. What a fucking sellout.

[Newguy]

Wenger's time as manager of this club is actually coming to end... .he's lost it now. He doesn't help himself with decisions such as starting with gervinho instead of Giroud, but overall he's just gone stale and it's time for a change or we will end up out of the top six. I think the loss of Song has hurt us more than fans though it would, arteta can't do the job song did, and you can see the fullbacks struggling as they don't have Song who always looked for the ball from our back lines.

Surely this is the cup season

[Özil's Panoramic View]

This is a new low.

Unimaginable depths of the abyss we're at now.

Our best manager ever being our worst manger ever - fucking mind boggling - just like trying to imagine the end of the universe.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Only if your name is Captain Hook.

I's disgusting how abou hamza is treated on here.

[Kano]

Wenger still unfortunately has a lot of support, read the comments section on Arseblog and you'd think that the last 5 years didn't happen, and that he's still the greatest thing since sliced bread. It cannot be denied that these days he is a poor manager. He is unable to make the right substitutions at the right time, he's tactically inflexible and fails to get the best out of his players. His ego has grown so large that he will stubbornly continue with failed methods rather than change and admit he was wrong. Not only that, he's totally in agreement with the board's free market philosophy which has decimated this football club, robbed it of its soul and in its place is a cold, corporate entity existing solely to feather the beds of shareholders. What a fucking sellout.
apart from the use of that tiresome 'free market' slogan, that's a good post.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Where's ollie? I'm waiting for him to defend wenger now.

[Xhaka Can’t]

If the Mancs win, we are as close to them as we are QPR.

[Mr. Lahey]

Arseblog:lol: guy doesnt even know if he is coming or going. No wonder there are a bunch of twats on his site supporting him, Wenger is a has been. He needs to check out before it gets worse.

[BOBN]

you cant blame the youngest player on the pitch for the loss......it was Swansea....we are Arsenal.....only one man to blame for the scoreline
leave him hes young....ever the excuse.

I didnt have a problem with him until we started buying into the idea that he'd be an adequate replacement for an international class right back. wenger and the board have got done a number on people. its impossible to keep doing this year on year and to keep getting away with it.

this is the year the chickens come home to roost. top 4 is off the table.

[gooners]

We simply can't compete with swansea's resources; we have to be financially responsible, you know.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Fuck! we're 10th now

Stoke's above us :haha:

[Boss]

Sack Wenger tbh!!! We suck!!!

/kneejerk

[Gervinho's Forehead]

We simply can't compete with swansea's resources; we have to be finanacially responsible, you know.

:gp:

swansea, villa, fulham, norwich are all killing us financially so we can't compete with them to get the top players.

That's one of wengers fucking lines which will forever piss off the fans.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Sack Wenger tbh!!! We suck!!!

/kneejerk

You really think this is kneejerk?

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Fuck! we're 10th now

Stoke's above us :haha:

:haha:



:ilt:

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Where's ollie? I'm waiting for him to defend wenger now.

Unfair that you should single Ollie out like that

He's not the only Wenger-ite on here tbh

[Marc Overmars]

This has to be Wenger's nadir really. As bad as the 8-2 was, we always know we're in for a pasting at Old Trafford. To be outplayed at home by a side that probably cost a fraction of ours did says a lot.

There are no more excuses, we've only won 5 games this season for god sake and struggled against an aray of teams with lesser resources than us.

You cannot defend the indefensible, Wenger and his team are in decline.

[Xhaka Can’t]

You really think this is kneejerk?

It is neither 'knee' nor 'jerk'.

[Globalgunner]

Fuck! we're 10th now

Stoke's above us :haha:

I think we just might avoid relegation.....Just

God, this stuff isnt even funny anymore.......

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Unfair that you should single Ollie out like that

He's not the only Wenger-ite on here tbh

hmmmm maybe you're right.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

I think we just might avoid relegation.....Just

God, this stuff isnt even funny anymore.......

The choice is to either laugh or cry.

[Kano]

Unfair that you should single Ollie out like that

He's not the only Wenger-ite on here tbh

well its not about having a go at each other because we're all here for the same thing. all that animosity should be toward the team, manager and board because they'll come and go and we'll still be together, supporting whoever follows.

[notwist]

All this so and so is better than so and so is so much twonk. The TEAM sucks. In a strange way I'm not sorry we lost because we must hit rock bottom soon and then the only way is Wenger out and the team up. Or will he NEVER leave. Oh nightmare! nightmare!

[Xhaka Can’t]

Unfair that you should single Ollie out like that

He's not the only Wenger-ite on here tbh

There are people who are pro or anti Wenger, but there are only Arsenal fans. That is why we are here - except for SIB

[Marc Overmars]

You really think this is kneejerk?

That is the sad part.

There's absolutley nothing kneejerk about what is being said about the club now.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

That is the sad part.

There's absolutley nothing kneejerk about what is being said about the club now.

Today could be the game changer, it's been coming for sometime.

[gooners]

God, this stuff isnt even funny anymore.......


considering this is a new team, if we don't find a win soon it is going to be very difficult to pick up points when confidence get any lower!

scary times

[Marc Overmars]

Today could be the game changer, it's been coming for sometime.

I'm not even that angry really. When I heard the result it was more a case of :rolleyes: than anything else.

It's there in black and white for all to see, the facts speak for themselves and we are in big trouble.

[gunnerrrrr]

The way i look at it is with the same players how would a Mourhinio, Ferguson etc do....i think with the players we have, if used in a better way, and with actual tactics applied this crop could be very good...i mean improving on our defending alone is wortha few extra results.

[BOBN]

thats what you get for selling song and not replacing.

michu and britton with acres of space in the middle. no DM closing them down.

arteta looks at jack to make a tackle, jack looks at cazorla, cazorla looks at arteta. no specified role for any player to get stuck in.

fucks sake.
its a useless, feeble trio. theyre not even creative.

we badly miss diaby.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

The way i look at it is with the same players how would a Mourhinio, Ferguson etc do....i think with the players we have, if used in a better way, and with actual tactics applied this crop could be very good...i mean improving on our defending alone is wortha few extra results.

Very true the defence is woeful, it's like steve bould isn't even there, he's just another pat rice. We are also missing the one magical player that made so much of a difference to us last season.

[fakeyank]

The way i look at it is with the same players how would a Mourhinio, Ferguson etc do....i think with the players we have, if used in a better way, and with actual tactics applied this crop could be very good...i mean improving on our defending alone is wortha few extra results.

:gp:

Exactly. Player for Player (on paper), I think our top 14 would be among the top 4 sides without a doubt. Its the useless tactics, managerial foolishness and lack of any direction from the manager that has absolutely robbed this team.

Redknapp or Coyle? Fuck, I'd take a deranged donkey over Wenger any day!

[The Wengerbabies]

I'm not even that angry really. When I heard the result it was more a case of :rolleyes: than anything else.

It's there in black and white for all to see, the facts speak for themselves and we are in big trouble.

Yep not angry, not upset. They're just not worth the time or effort anymore.

[cheesy bites]

To everyone saying this is the result that creates changes, no, no it's not. Wenger will stay, we'll play like shit. And miss out on the Champions League next year. Walcott and Sagna will leave.

[Marc Overmars]

The way i look at it is with the same players how would a Mourhinio, Ferguson etc do....i think with the players we have, if used in a better way, and with actual tactics applied this crop could be very good...i mean improving on our defending alone is wortha few extra results.

Wenger has become so warped in his ways he's totally forgotton about the fundamental basics. You need to learn to walk before you can run and I can't believe just how weak this Arsenal team has become, in defence and now right the way through to the attack.

[gooners]

To everyone saying this is the result that creates changes, no, no it's not. Wenger will stay, we'll play like shit. And miss out on the Champions League next year. Walcott and Sagna will leave.

the resident nostradamus :bow:

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Wenger has become so warped in his ways he's totally forgotton about the fundamental basics. You need to learn to walk before you can run and I can't believe just how weak this Arsenal team has become, in defence and now right the way through to the attack.

It's more than that it seems he is completely devoid of ideas.

[fakeyank]

AW's post match reaction?

[Master Splinter]

Arsenal.com ‏@Arsenal


I have been a manager for 52 years. I know when someone (Giroud) is in the red zone. #AFCvSCFC


We do not doubt the attitude and desire. I will not speculate on our quality.#AFCvSCFC


It was not illusionary, no. The handbrake was exceptionally dominant today. #AFCvSCFC

[gunnerrrrr]

AW's post match reaction?

hes like a little kid after these types of results...dont expect anything for a while

[Xhaka Can’t]

I think it has got so bad, we are so far away from the prospect of 4th - despite being only 5 points back that the Board may not sanction any spending in the January window.

[fakeyank]

To everyone saying this is the result that creates changes, no, no it's not. Wenger will stay, we'll play like shit. And miss out on the Champions League next year. Walcott and Sagna will leave.

Oh, it'll be a while before there is change at this club. Missing out on CL would be the first one but I think with the continuity of these shit results and the continuation of boos, there just might be a chance for change. May be Wenger will have some shame and quit himself. Long shot for a money grabbing c*nt like him to quit but I am hoping for a miracle :pray:

[Kano]

and we were supposed to be having a laugh at chelsea after this weekend ffs

[gooners]

It's more than that it seems he is completely devoid of ideas.

matey, he loves the club --- give the guy a break :console:

[The Wengerbabies]

AW's post match reaction?

We lack a little bit sharpness.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

I think it has got so bad, we are so far away from the prospect of 4th - despite being only 5 points back that the Board may not sanction any spending in the January window.

Well if they're not gaurenteed their £30mil in May, they won't want to eat into profit by buying players.

[BOBN]

wilsheres being found out now he doesnt have fabregas to do the actual productive stuff.

guardiola was right when he said hes got 5 wilsheres in the youth. he'd be a dime a dozen on the continent.

[Özim]

This for me now puts the Everton result in perspective....that was a great result.

[fakeyank]

This for me now puts the Everton result in perspective....that was a great result.

City result was a miracle. Probably need to take out a DVD of that game.

[RomfordPele]

Nah, it's panic buy time I reckon.

[gooners]

mathematically, we can still win the league -- no need to panic :good:

[cheesy bites]

mathematically, we can still win the league -- no need to panic :good:
We can also still get relegated. Both outcomes are as ludicrous as each other.

[gooners]

We can also still get relegated. Both outcomes are as ludicrous as each other.

not an optimist then? ;)

[cheesy bites]

not an optimist then? ;)

Thinking we can win the league is not optimism it's pure dream-world fantasy.

We are facing an almighty war for 4th place, and it's not looking good at the moment.

[Globalgunner]

its a useless, feeble trio. theyre not even creative.

we badly miss diaby.

This is the thing that gets to me. How can we miss a player that hardly ever plays fort us, who has never impacted significantly one 1 season in 5 years. diaby is another crap Wenger illusion. he never had a chance to be good enough so we could miss him. Pity but true.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

This is the thing that gets to me. How can we miss a player that hardly ever plays fort us, who has never impacted significantly one 1 season in 5 years. diaby is another crap Wenger illusion. he never had a chance to be good enough so we could miss him. Pity but true.

I have to agree as Arsenal fans we always put hope in the players that are out injured for long periods of time and believe that when they come back will add stability to the team.

[gooners]

I have to agree as Arsenal fans we always put hope in the players that are out injured for long periods of time and believe that when they come back will add stability to the team.

rosicky will come back and win us the league; watch this space :good:

[fakeyank]

rosicky will come back and win us the league; watch this space :good:

He is back already. Him, Diaby and Ramsey will tear the bitches* a new hole.

* = Arsenal

[BOBN]

This is the thing that gets to me. How can we miss a player that hardly ever plays fort us, who has never impacted significantly one 1 season in 5 years. diaby is another crap Wenger illusion. he never had a chance to be good enough so we could miss him. Pity but true.
completely agree.

it was critical that we bought a physical midfielder to replace song. these idiots in charge, when the club misses out on top 4 theyll finally know about it.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Oh look the **** is scoring more valuable goals for united.

[Joker]

Wenger's reaction:


on explaining the defeat...
We were not creative, nor sharp. Swansea were more creative and more sharp. They had a lot of possession, but without going anywhere. We tried to change things and took a lot of risks. In the end it turned against us. Maybe we should have made a 0-0 and in the end we were not cautious enough to play the 0-0. The quality of our game was not there. It was a bit frustrating because we lacked a bit of decisiveness and creativity.

on whether Swansea deserved to win...
Yes. It is very frustrating, but it is the truth.

on whether they surprised him...
No, I knew they could play well. I knew the question before the game could be that we could be a bit jaded because we had many players on the edge who had played a lot of hard games recently. We had just come back from two very difficult away games physically and it was a bit like that today. We are guilty of losing a game at the moment when we should not have lost it.

on the booing at the end…
My response is I can understand that.

on it being a challenging period…
We are in this job to turn things around, and I am confident we will [because of] the quality of the players and the spirit we have in the team. It is a good moment to stick together.

on turning things around…
At the moment it looks like, away from home, we are quite consistent and our results are positive. But at home we have not produced the performances since the beginning of the season that you would expect from us, and that is where we have to find the solution.

on slipping down to 10th spot…
Of course [it is painful]. I am not so much worried about places, even if that is not the place you want to be, but I believe what is important is we get the quality of our game back. Then the places change.

on spending money in January…
It’s difficult to answer that straight away after a game like that. I cannot say no, but I believe the support from the board is there to spend the money if we find the players.

on how the result affects upcoming games…
It affects the thinking for Olympiacos. There are many players who need a rest, because they are on the verge of getting injured. Some played with knocks today. We’ll see tomorrow. We hope that we get a good performance at Olympiacos. It’s important for us. Away from home, I’m not too concerned. We look like we play a little bit with the handbrake at home. It’s not fluent. There might be a psychological component in there as well.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Oh shut it Wenger! Just pack your bags and go!

[gooners]

I believe the support from the board is there to spend the money if we find the players.

ahem...


but of course, he is just saying that :sulk:

[fakeyank]

Wenger's reaction:

Board backing Wenger to spend. Not one quote ever that said anything otherwise.

Board needs to sort their shit and fire the french c*nt asap!

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Donut to whoever mentioned the "handbrake" first

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Wenger is still great at identifying the (game playing) problems, he just can't do anything about it anymore.

[gooners]

Wenger is still great at identifying the (game playing) problems, he just can't do anything about it anymore.


he just hasn't got the great individual players he used to have to bail him out anymore :good:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Well, yeah probably. Although players can have a vibrancy but ultimately fall short, ours don't even have the gallant loser there within them.

[Power n Glory]

ahem...


but of course, he is just saying that :sulk:

He is speaking in code. That means he doesn't have the backing of the Board.

[Alpha]

A very sad day today . Not even worthy of making a comment . The only comment is no comment . I can't believe what is happening .

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

its a useless, feeble trio. theyre not even creative.

we badly miss diaby.

i remember when the transfer window shut shit loads of arsenal fans were saying things like 'good luck trying to get the ball back from a midfield of wilshere, arteta and cazorla'.

well that hasnt been the problem.

we havent had the ball in the first place.

[Marc Overmars]

Well, yeah probably. Although players can have a vibrancy but ultimately fall short, ours don't even have the gallant loser there within them.

That's the shittest part. I can accept not winning but not in such a turgid and uninspiring way, where's the hope?

[fakeyank]

i remember when the transfer window shut shit loads of arsenal fans were saying things like 'good luck trying to get the ball back from a midfield of wilshere, arteta and cazorla'.

well that hasnt been the problem.

we havent had the ball in the first place.

Oh come on mate. When we are passing in our own half, no sons of bitches can take the ball from us. Wenger and the team were not aware that we needed to go beyond the half way line and do something creative. And wait, wasnt today's game part of TT Cup (Tippy Tappy)? And didnt we win?

[notwist]

Who cares what Wenger says? He can't change the result that's just gone and he never says anything which will change the one coming up.

Creativity, sharpness, quality, decisiveness - what do those words mean? Can you make yourself those things just by saying it?

Why can't he just admit the team is crap?

[fakeyank]

Who cares what Wenger says? He can't change the result that's just gone and he never says anything which will change the one coming up.

Creativity, sharpness, quality, decisiveness - what do those words mean? Can you make yourself those things just by saying it?

Why can't he just admit the team is crap?

Coz he is genuinely deluded. He is a certified retard!

[Kano]

Wenger is still great at identifying the (game playing) problems, he just can't do anything about it anymore.
that's interesting. do you mean the personnel isn't there or he doesn't know how to implement the changes?

[Power n Glory]

I can't even describe this as shocking because it's not. The manager has lost the dressing room. The standards at our club have eroded so badly that we've moved past the point of looking at how far behind the league leaders we are, we're now more concerned about clawing our way back to 4th place. It's beyond ridiculous and I look forwards to the day Wenger steps down because I'm beyond sick of the results, it's to the point of numbness now. The outrage just isn't there and I just want someone to change the record for fucks sake.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

that's interesting. do you mean the personnel isn't there or he doesn't know how to implement the changes?

I think the quality is there but he can't get them to play in a way that would actually bring results i.e have at least four players sparking off each other at any one time. It seems like there is no joy in the way we play and there should be. Certainly we shouldn't be milling around tenth.

Syn pointed out that he doesn't make substitutions according to the game but for the most part it's scientifically based. Waiting until the 70th minute for changes isn't going to help anyone.

[Kano]

i tend to agree with that. everything seems stagnant, with no spark in any individuals game and no one taking the bull by the horns. wenger seems lost standing at the side of the game, like some sort of researcher who can't quite understand how the results differ from what the formula predicts.

[Power n Glory]

We should have enough quality to beat Swansea and a manager like Wenger shouldn't be getting out thought by managers new to the league and with less experience than him. He gets done over every time and even if we had a team that was under par, he should have the knowledge and experience to make our team difficult to beat and to play our players to there strengths even if limited. Shit, it's what people like Fat Sam, Moyes, Pulis....do all the damn time. It's how such teams always get one over us.

[gooners]

We should have enough quality to beat Swansea and a manager like Wenger shouldn't be getting out thought by managers new to the league and with less experience than him. He gets done over every time and even if we had a team that was under par, he should have the knowledge and experience to make our team difficult to beat and to play our players to there strengths even if limited. Shit, it's what people like Fat Sam, Moyes, Pulis....do all the damn time. It's how such teams always get one over us.

we simply don't have city's resources to compete; we have to be financially responsible, you know.

[BlindFaith_8]

To be truthful, after watching Swansea destroy the Albion midweek, I was quite fearful we'd get turned over today so I am not as surprised as most of the football world. It just proves that you don't have to spend big to have a great team, but you do need a manager/coach who has the tactical ability to change games and can read the game and the make the changes as and when needed. I would almost put my house on it, that the following managers, Martinez, Laudrup and even AVB would challenge the top 2 and get the best out of our current squad.

[Grebbo]

Not renewing my season ticket a few years ago was the best decision I ever made.

[fakeyank]

To be truthful, after watching Swansea destroy the Albion midweek, I was quite fearful we'd get turned over today so I am not as surprised as most of the football world. It just proves that you don't have to spend big to have a great team, but you do need a manager/coach who has the tactical ability to change games and can read the game and the make the changes as and when needed. I would almost put my house on it, that the following managers, Martinez, Laudrup and even AVB would challenge the top 2 and get the best out of ur current squad.

Welcome mate and great first post. All this talk about blaming the board for literally everything is frankly a load of BS. The board just needs to get their cojones and fire Wenger. Absolutely clueless manager.

[IBK]

That was the worst atmosphere I have witnessed for a long time.

Swansea didn't even play that well.

We were naive; rudderless; lacking ideas; no passion; no drive; no confidence.

Wenger has lost the dressing room. maybe not in the traditional way, but these players do not believe in what they are being told to do.

Wenger is playing a method of football that is 7 years out of date. Telling players to express themselves might work with top players, experienced and with football brains - that he fortuitously had in the early 2000's. It will not work with inferior players who might pass his technical test, but do not have the character to understand his philosophical approach to the game. There are far fewer of these types of players around anyway, because the world away from Wenger is taking players from a young age and coaching the fuck out of them. Everything is being covered in terms of preparation for the game, and Wenger's players are coming up against this and thinking 'shit - we don't know what to do!'.

That Wenger is too stubborn and lacking in the objectivity to see this is shocking. This is a train crash on the football pitch while the club hold press conferences to boast how good we are commercially.

[gooners]

Welcome mate and great first post. All this talk about blaming the board for literally everything is frankly a load of BS. The board just needs to get their cojones and fire Wenger. Absolutely clueless manager.

the board won't do that --- because it is wenger who makes THE BANK OF ARSENAL click.

they wont find another manager that gives so much shit about profiteering :good:

[Niall_Quinn]

LOL. Didn't watch it. After Villa and Everton there was no way I was getting stung a third time. Wenger deserves much stick, the team too because most of them don't give a shit about this club and you can see it in the way they play. But I hope the more sensible fans reserve some fire for the profiteers who have raped the club. It all started with them and their stink has filled every nook and cranny. There's nothing good going on at this club, can't think of a thing.

[Özim]

Not renewing my season ticket a few years ago was the best decision I ever made.
I second that, that was indeed the best decision you ever made.

[Özim]

the board won't do that --- because it is wenger who makes THE BANK OF ARSENAL click.

they wont find another manager that gives so much shit about profiteering :good:

Pretty much, they'll be telling us how lucky and ungrateful we are soon enough.

Wenger has the best and easiest job in football, 7 million to achieve nothing, no questions asked.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Not renewing my season ticket a few years ago was the best decision I ever made.

You forgot about joining GW

[Grebbo]

Can you imagine paying £2,000 a year to watch that tripe?

:haha:

I'd have kept it if the atmosphere was any good but it's shocking. No fucker sings.

Arsenal FC is in terminal decline.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Can you imagine paying £2,000 a year to watch that tripe?

:haha:

I'd have kept it if the atmosphere was any good but it's shocking. No fucker sings.

Arsenal FC is in terminal decline.

:gp: :haha:

[BlindFaith_8]

I used to recall that the general remit of any Arsenal manager was to challenge for the league champonship and to keep your job you had to win an FA Cup or League Cup as a bare minimum, Wenger has certainly devalued the manager's job at AFC. What's saved Wengers job over the past 7 years the Champions League 3rd and 4th spot, but this season for the first time in a long time Wenger has worthy comeptition in Everton and the spuds and possible oustiders in Swansea and WBA. We used to be the envy of every club, first club to have under floor heating at Highbury, the first club to travel first class on the train whilist the others all went 2nd class, the first club to wear suits to matches!! Don't be fooled, Arsenal are a historic and prestigious club and I can assure you any top class manager would never turn down the offer to manage this once great club. We used to be called the bank of england due to financial the vast resources we had at our disposal, and now Wenger has turned us in to a club that should be happy to finish 4th to play in a competition we have no chance of winning. I don't get it. Oh how I wish we had the old Arsenal back.

[Cripps_orig]

Me and my brother have decided not to renew the season ticket for next season. Might change our minds if Wenger leaves before then but its unlikely. Worst Arsenal team I have seen managed by the worst manager I have seen. Fuck this team.

[Marc Overmars]

On a side note, Swansea are class.

Mini Dortmund. :bow:

[Marc Overmars]

I see the "tired" excuse has been churned out again. What a load of BS.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

On a side note, Swansea are class.

Mini Dortmund. :bow:

:sick:

[Gervinho's Forehead]

I see the "tired" excuse has been churned out again. What a load of BS.

Is this the excuse you're using also for saying that swansea are class?

[Marc Overmars]

Is this the excuse you're using also for saying that swansea are class?

:unsure:

[Dennis Bendtner]

The quality of player in our squad has progressively declined down the years (o hai captain obvious. Still rather that than Captain Vermaelen). But it means when we're in bad form and come across a team like Swansea in good form that there is a good chance we'll get our asses kicked. MOTD highlights showed so many occasions of them virtually playing FIFA Street around some lost children. The quality of player is not there to ensure we're sure to win this sort of game and without the requisite quality it will continue to be a regular struggle when we're in blippy and crisis periods. I can't say I was surprised hearing the result - more :rolleyes: followed by...yeah, that makes sense really.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

:unsure:

That you're tired? :lol:

[Gervinho's Forehead]

The quality of player in our squad has progressively declined down the years (o hai captain obvious. Still rather that than Captain Vermaelen). But it means when we're in bad form and come across a team like Swansea in good form that there is a good chance we'll get our asses kicked. MOTD highlights showed so many occasions of them virtually playing FIFA Street around some lost children. The quality of player is not there to ensure we're sure to win this sort of game and without the requisite quality it will continue to be a regular struggle when we're in blippy and crisis periods. I can't say I was surprised hearing the result - more :rolleyes: followed by...yeah, that makes sense really.

But FFS! we're THE fucking ARSENAL!!! We shouldn't be going oh well 0-2 to swansea was predictable!

[Dennis Bendtner]

But FFS! we're THE fucking ARSENAL!!! We shouldn't be going oh well 0-2 to swansea was predictable!

Well we're talking in the context of today. Swansea came into it playing better and a lot more fluently than Arsenal. That negates the On Paper inferiority that exists. Then it's anyone's game. And Arsenal don't happen to have too many matchwinners who can overcome all that. We all know what happened to the last one. So yeah, Mikachu finishes a couple of Swansea moves and it's their game.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Well we're talking in the context of today. Swansea came into it playing better and a lot more fluently than Arsenal. That negates the On Paper inferiority that exists. Then it's anyone's game. And Arsenal don't happen to have too many matchwinners who can overcome all that. We all know what happened to the last one. So yeah, Mikachu finishes a couple of Swansea moves and it's their game.

Oh I agree with you 100% I just mean it's pretty shit in generall that we're bracing ourselfs for a home defeat to swansea.

[Özim]

To be honest looking at their chances, it could easily have been 4 or 5 today, Chesney made some excellent saves.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

To be honest looking at their chances, it could easily have been 4 or 5 today, Chesney made some excellent saves.

That he did! I don't rate him as 1st choice keeper anymore, he's been found out big time, but he certainly earned his money today with some very good saves. Sadly he does tend to cause more problems than save us from them.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Shit's fucking depressing.

I can't even string a cogent sentence describing the debilitating effects this farce of a team is having on me. It's fucking dire.

This is not my Arsenal. Those imposters are not worthy of being called Arsenal players. They simply aren't of the fabric. For this, Wenger must be put to the sword. It was he who brought every single one of those pieces of shit here -the shameless, worthless, odious dregs that threaten to drag us through the depths of the grimmiest sewers.

This travesty against our great and illustrious club needs to be checked. The slimy profit mongering vampires at the top, sucking away every blood of pride, need to be staked as well.

From top to bottom, every nook and cranny, every crevice, every square inch, all the rot, the stink emanating from within the walls of the club, all need to be cleansed. This is not some hurry come up club. This is a club of class, with envied history and grandeur. This is the fucking Arsenal.

Fuck off Stan Kroenke

Fuck Peter Hill-Wood

Fuck off Ivan Gazidis

Fuck off Arsene Wenger

Fuck off shameless pile of dross players - all unfit to even wear a hand me down Arsenal shirt.

[Niall_Quinn]

Just watched the first half. If we had better players than Gervinho and Walcott we'd have gone in with a fairly straightforward lead. I think what's happening here is people are remembering the end of the game and a loss and applying it to what was a fairly even first half in terms of meaningful incidents.

Swansea were as poor as we are. They are very open at the back and down the flanks. But they have better players than us in the final third. But certainly nothing special. We stood off them and failed to put any pressure on the ball and they used the space competently. Nothing more. Can't understand all the plaudits they are getting. Maybe they improved in the second half, we'll see.

[Niall_Quinn]

Gibbs was appalling for the first 45 minutes.

[Niall_Quinn]

Cazorla very ordinary and Wilshere nowhere near top form.

[Niall_Quinn]

I don't like the cheating by Gervinho and Cazorla either. Horrible.

[Niall_Quinn]

Terrible performance by Gervinho up to being subbed, which was his best moment. A very low quality player. Walcott is not much better, 90% of what he does is awful. Whether the other 10% is worth it, hard to say. If we replace those two with quality we could bring Podolski and Giroud into games a lot more.

[Niall_Quinn]

Score line didn't reflect the game at all. Very much a gift courtesy of our poor central defenders, including Merts who seems to get a free pass these days. Second goal was a mistake by Jenkinson. However, the failure of anyone to support the kid when he was man on was telling. They'd given up at a goal down. Not many players with character in this team.

Ironically a better performance today, better passing, better crossing. But a loss instead of a draw. Swansea very average but took their gift well.

Ches, good show.
Jenkinson, one of the better players up until a key mistake.
Gibbs, terrible
Arteta, a shadow
Verm, average
Merts, average
Cazorla, lacks bottle
Wilshere, not back to his best
Gervinho, waste of a shirt
Podolski, not being utilised, a lazy German?
Walcott, guy can't do even the basics

Wenger. Stupid to start Gervinho over Giroud. And even then Gervinho should never have been allowed back on the pitch after the break. We may well have bagged 3 points today if it Giroud had started.

The defense is a shambles. Worsens bad as ever. Don't think we'll ever get that sorted.

Not a terrible performance, overreaction here is crazy, unlucky to lose, Swansea nothing special either. Better decisions from Wenger and better players than Gervinho and Walcott and we could turn this back around.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

I guess we're also unlucky to be 10th too, right?

How the heck else do you expect folks to react to this kind of shit?

[Niall_Quinn]

I guess we're also unlucky to be 10th too, right?

How the heck else do you expect folks to react to this kind of shit?

I'm talking about one match, not the season so far. I expect some people to watch the game and react accordingly. I expect others to have a hysterical breakdown. Depends on the person. But no way was that performance today as poor as the two that have gone before. Much better passing today, and by that I mean we weren't awful. Better crossing. A few shots going in. Still too slow, still shit in the final third but an improvement from what is a very average side these days. That's why I say we were unlucky. It was a 50/50 game with two typically tragic defensive moments at the end to throw a point away. That's what actually happened. What else do you want me to say?

[DJ Philosophe]

So much standing around by this team in the attacking 1/3, and when they do run the movement off the ball was predictable and easy to defend. Desperately need some class strikers that opponents fear and more midfield players willing to run for 90 minutes. Cazorla needs to play CAM to free him up to create with less defensive responsibilities and our dreaded "CDM" position goes unfilled almost every game now. No one closing down or covering the back four, which draws the CBs out of position every time. So simple to see, but still nothing is done to change this....

Now the part that really scares me is that there seems to be certain entitlement built into the mentality of these players, as if they feel they are "better" than Swansea so no need to press or show any heart on the pitch. We've seen what these players are capable of and the inconsistency is seriously appalling. I've played and coached on inconsistent teams and its SO hard to get motivated for matches and you can clearly see it in this squad. They play scared to make mistakes and also scared to take chances to unlock the defense. I don't know if is an after effect of RVPs dominance last season for AFC but it seems all are looking for others to do the work, which is a recipe for disaster. A new manager might fix the issue, but the MAIN under lying problem still remains and needs to be dealt with...we've sold our best players for many years in row and replaced with players of less quality in the hopes they will blossom at Arsenal. I'm not sure where we go from here and neither does Wenger or his crew...but its very disheartening and I hope AW or SB can do something to re-motivate these players before they to lose hope.

/end rant

COME ON ARSENAL. SORT IT OUT!

[Özil's Panoramic View]

I'm talking about one match, not the season so far. I expect some people to watch the game and react accordingly. I expect others to have a hysterical breakdown. Depends on the person. But no way was that performance today as poor as the two that have gone before. Much better passing today, and by that I mean we weren't awful. Better crossing. A few shots going in. Still too slow, still shit in the final third but an improvement from what is a very average side these days. That's why I say we were unlucky. It was a 50/50 game with two typically tragic defensive moments at the end to throw a point away. That's what actually happened. What else do you want me to say?

Well, it seems a well played loss doesn't really offer much solace to fans who are fed up with being fed shit week in week out.

A few improved passes and crosses are easily be overshadowed by losing to Swansea, especially at home. Fuck any form of pretence of objectivity at this point. We don't need to hear that it was 50/50 or we played better against Swansea than we did against villa or Everton.

[Niall_Quinn]

Now the part that really scares me is that there seems to be certain entitlement built into the mentality of these players

Completely agree and it has been going on for years. Back in the day it was a good thing because the players were good enough to warrant their high opinion of themselves. But once the quality had been sold out the attitude didn't drop to a realistic level. Ramsey is one of the worst culprits, the way he casually strokes his misplaced passes to the opposition.

[Niall_Quinn]

Well, it seems a well played loss doesn't really offer much solace to fans who are fed up with being fed shit week in week out.

A few improved passes and crosses are easily be overshadowed by losing to Swansea, especially at home. Fuck any form of pretence of objectivity at this point. We don't need to hear that it was 50/50 or we played better against Swansea than we did against villa or Everton.

You may not want to hear certain things but on a public forum you run the risk of encountering differing opinions. I didn't say the fans should seek solace in a loss. I said we played better today than we have done in recent weeks, although still nowhere near the level I expect from a supposedly top flight team. But I've seen comments about how good Swansea were - not in my opinion, I thought they were average. We gifted them a couple of late goals otherwise it would have been a poor goalless draw which would have been the fair result based on play. When I say unlucky I don't mean the defensive lapses weren't scandalous - particularly the second where the team had given up. I mostly mean we are unlucky as fans that Gervinho plays for us. What a shit player. I'm not tipping us for the title. All I'm saying is the performance was nowhere near as bad as some are painting it, although the result was bad of course.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Get most of what you're saying. I agree that some people on here are tipping the scale somewhat by saying Swansea is actually anything barring being pubbers. But they did pull off a win no matter how average they were against us. Kind of speaks volumes about the character of our team when a pub team can be average against us and still beat us by 2 goals at our home.

Shows we have no drive, no determination, no guile, no killer instinct, no winning mentality, no pride or passion for the shirt; just a rudderless, toothless pack of mongrels selected by a stubborn old mule who should have been relieved of his duties some 3 years ago. With all the money at his disposal, he buys and handsomely pays the likes of Gervinho, Ramsey, Santos, Koscielny, Arteta, Chamakh, Bendtner, Vela, Denilson, Vermaelen, Squilacci, etc, all unworthy of being Arsenal players.

Oh, and while you're rightfully at Gervinho's throat, calling him out for the shit he is, it would also be fair to apportion some of the slating to whoever it was that picked him ahead of Giroud and persisted with him for however long today.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

So much standing around by this team in the attacking 1/3, and when they do run the movement off the ball was predictable and easy to defend. Desperately need some class strikers that opponents fear and more midfield players willing to run for 90 minutes. Cazorla needs to play CAM to free him up to create with less defensive responsibilities and our dreaded "CDM" position goes unfilled almost every game now. No one closing down or covering the back four, which draws the CBs out of position every time. So simple to see, but still nothing is done to change this....

Now the part that really scares me is that there seems to be certain entitlement built into the mentality of these players, as if they feel they are "better" than Swansea so no need to press or show any heart on the pitch. We've seen what these players are capable of and the inconsistency is seriously appalling. I've played and coached on inconsistent teams and its SO hard to get motivated for matches and you can clearly see it in this squad. They play scared to make mistakes and also scared to take chances to unlock the defense. I don't know if is an after effect of RVPs dominance last season for AFC but it seems all are looking for others to do the work, which is a recipe for disaster. A new manager might fix the issue, but the MAIN under lying problem still remains and needs to be dealt with...we've sold our best players for many years in row and replaced with players of less quality in the hopes they will blossom at Arsenal. I'm not sure where we go from here and neither does Wenger or his crew...but its very disheartening and I hope AW or SB can do something to re-motivate these players before they to lose hope.

/end rant

COME ON ARSENAL. SORT IT OUT!

Spot on, so much arrogance in this sqaud we seen it not from this season but for the last few. The players are just a disgrace its ok blaming the manager but they need to fucking man up and stop being lazy ****. Lets be honest were at a disadvantage before we even get on the pitch anyways the sqaud is no good and we are seeing the results of lack of quality.

[Lord Nelson]

The quality of player in our squad has progressively declined down the years (o hai captain obvious. Still rather that than Captain Vermaelen). But it means when we're in bad form and come across a team like Swansea in good form that there is a good chance we'll get our asses kicked. MOTD highlights showed so many occasions of them virtually playing FIFA Street around some lost children. The quality of player is not there to ensure we're sure to win this sort of game and without the requisite quality it will continue to be a regular struggle when we're in blippy and crisis periods. I can't say I was surprised hearing the result - more :rolleyes: followed by...yeah, that makes sense really.talking of MOTD, those ****s love it when we lose! Especially that big eared wanker Lineker!

[Kano]

everything on the left hand side of the team yesterday was absolutely terrible and swansea took full advantage. podolski couldn't be bothered to run, gibbs was a joke and verm just gets worse week on week.

[Niall_Quinn]

everything on the left hand side of the team yesterday was absolutely terrible and swansea took full advantage. podolski couldn't be bothered to run, gibbs was a joke and verm just gets worse week on week.

I noticed that about Podolski too. He's settled in quickly then.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

everything on the left hand side of the team yesterday was absolutely terrible and swansea took full advantage. podolski couldn't be bothered to run, gibbs was a joke and verm just gets worse week on week.

He does not want to be hear tbh. His attitude and his perfomances suggest that. Maybe Theo is thinking the same, though i guessing he was as bad as the rest. The attitude of the players on the pitch says they rather be elsewhere.

So much talk but fuck all action from them. Just pisses me off so much.

[Kano]

He does not want to be hear tbh. His attitude and his perfomances suggest that. Maybe Theo is thinking the same, though i guessing he was as bad as the rest. The attitude of the players on the pitch says they rather be elsewhere.

So much talk but fuck all action from them. Just pisses me off so much.
Vermaelen - I’m very happy with our mentality

“Mentality-wise, there is nothing wrong with the team. Everybody works hard and there is no one who doesn't work for the team, and that will give you results. From that point of view I am very happy.”

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/vermaelen-i-m-very-happy-with-our-mentality

what's not to be happy about collecting that sort of wage no matter how much of a fuck up you become

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Vermaelen - I’m very happy with our mentality

“Mentality-wise, there is nothing wrong with the team. Everybody works hard and there is no one who doesn't work for the team, and that will give you results. From that point of view I am very happy.”

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/vermaelen-i-m-very-happy-with-our-mentality

what's not to be happy about collecting that sort of wage no matter how much of a fuck up you become

Yep the guy is an embarresment tbh, Its clear he wants to go. Only he won't who would want to sign him up after how woeful he has been. Wumger for once will keep one of his captains.

All these players spout rubbish in the media but do feck all to back it up, then leave like bitches when offered the easy way out.

Too many players at this club with no fucking pride.

[Özim]

The reason the players believe this sh*t is that Wenger's comes out with cr*p like this and supports them all the time.....if he stopped making excuses and came down a bit harder on these clowns you might see a different atttitude, the players are satisfied and so is the manager...we're not winning games but that's due to tiredness and bad luck, you can't fault the spirit and fight.

[Niall_Quinn]

We've been humbled so we need to get an attitude that fits. Back to basics please. More water carrying, less swagger.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

The reason the players believe this sh*t is that Wenger's comes out with cr*p like this and supports them all the time.....if he stopped making excuses and came down a bit harder on these clowns you might see a different atttitude, the players are satisfied and so is the manager...we're not winning games but that's due to tiredness and bad luck, you can't fault the spirit and fight.

Sorry they play for Arsenal that should be enough. They should show pride that comes from within not a manager. Easy to blame the manager for everything. Its time these ****s stood up and were counted for.


f he stopped making excuses and came down a bit harder on these clowns you might see a different atttitude, the players are satisfied and so is the manager...we're not winning games but that's due to tiredness and bad luck, you can't fault the spirit and fight

This i agree with.

[Özim]

Sorry they play for Arsenal that should be enough. They should show pride that comes from within not a manager. Easy to blame the manager for everything. Its time these ****s stood up and were counted for.
Wenger is the club these days, the manager's attitude filters down the the players that's why you see the difference when a top manager comes in. It's the manager's problem for sure, playing for Arsenal doesn't mean what it use to, that's what happens when you don't win anything for years and have people telling you it's ok and that you've done well coming 4th.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Wenger is the club these days, the manager's attitude filters down the the players that's why you see the difference when a top manager comes in. It's the manager's problem for sure, playing for Arsenal doesn't mean what it use to, that's what happens when you don't win anything for years and have people telling you it's ok and that you've done well coming 4th.

Don't buy that, players should have pride. Easy to blame the manager for everything. The players need to step up, can't just be lazy and poor and its ok cause its the managers fault. The players go out they they are the ones who need to show passion and show they want to be here.


playing for Arsenal doesn't mean what it use to, that's what happens when you don't win anything for years and have people telling you it's ok and that you've done well coming 4th.

Rubbish, thats why all the players we signed came in saying they wanted to win trophies. Arsenal are still a big club and players know that. Its silly to say otherwise.

Just cause they tell you top 4 is ok does not mean the players don't want to win stuff or are happy not too.

They just need to man up stop being lazy and do their job.

[Özim]

Don't buy that, players should have pride. Easy to blame the manager for everything. The players need to step up, can't just be lazy and poor and its ok cause its the managers fault. The players go out they they are the ones who need to show passion and show they want to be here.
Our players aren't natural leaders or winners, they need someone to tell them and instill the right values, sadly we don't have that someone.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Our players aren't natural leaders or winners, they need someone to tell them and instill the right values, sadly we don't have that someone.

True. When your captain looks and plays like he don't want to be there you have trouble.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Sorry they play for Arsenal that should be enough. They should show pride that comes from within not a manager. Easy to blame the manager for everything. Its time these ****s stood up and were counted for.



This i agree with.

What's there to be proud of when most of them have achieved didly squat in their careers as professional footballers?? Practically all of them can count their trophy hauls with one hand- and none of them have made any significant impact internationally. I'd find it hard to be proud with this sort of record- or should finishing at the bottom half of the 4 man league qualifying for the CL every year be what we expect to motivate them?? Or would it be their amazingly gallant defeat to Birmingham in the CC final that should do this??

Let's be honest, its silly to think our current crop of players will self-motivate themselves with their average personal achievements that really can't differentiate them from any of the players we recently faced from Swansea, Villa or Everton.

Only one person in our current setup has something to be proud of; he's the only one that was world acclaimed, that can truly boast that he is better than imaginary 4th place trophies, losing a final to relegation fodder and being 10th after a 1/3 of the season is gone. He's actually the one who most unbiased observers would hold responsible for the motivation we are now speaking of. Even the players would say he was the one who recruited them on the premise that they were better than what they had achieved prior to joining us, and what they have achieved these past 7 years( I mean he tells us that publicly everyday, no??). Only he had/ has the power to recruit (something he has never done) or just even retain the few self-motivated player we have had that could show records of personal success ( Vieira, Henry, TheWhore, Fab, RVP etc.). But in his wisdom he chose and still chooses not to.

He keeps saying he hasn't changed and this is the system that has worked for him and he has used since day one when he joined the club. To be fair to him, he is right. I just think he and a lot of fans were so deluded that they never realised that a main reason he was able to motivate no-name players to regular winners and challengers then was that he already had a solid foundation of proven winners/leaders who knew the turf then and when the last of Graham's men left, so did all the success and proven motivators in Arsenal- at least on the pitch.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

What's there to be proud of when most of them have achieved didly squat in their careers as professional footballers?? Practically all of them can count their trophy hauls with one hand- and none of them have made any significant impact internationally. I'd find it hard to be proud with this sort of record- or should finishing at the bottom half of the 4 man league qualifying for the CL every year be what we expect to motivate them?? Or would it be their amazingly gallant defeat to Birmingham in the CC final that should do this??

Let's be honest, its silly to think our current crop of players will self-motivate themselves with their average personal achievements that really can't differentiate them from any of the players we recently faced from Swansea, Villa or Everton.

Only one person in our current setup has something to be proud of; he's the only one that was world acclaimed, that can truly boast that he is better than imaginary 4th place trophies, losing a final to relegation fodder and being 10th after a 1/3 of the season is gone. He's actually the one who most unbiased observers would hold responsible for the motivation we are now speaking of. Even the players would say he was the one who recruited them on the premise that they were better than what they had achieved prior to joining us, and what they have achieved these past 7 years( I mean he tells us that publicly everyday, no??). Only he had/ has the power to recruit (something he has never done) or just even retain the few self-motivated player we have had that could show records of personal success ( Vieira, Henry, TheWhore, Fab, RVP etc.). But in his wisdom he chose and still chooses not to.

He keeps saying he hasn't changed and this is the system that has worked for him and he has used since day one when he joined the club. To be fair to him, he is right. I just think he and a lot of fans were so deluded that they never realised that a main reason he was able to motivate no-name players to regular winners and challengers then was that he already had a solid foundation of proven winners/leaders who knew the turf then and when the last of Graham's men left, so did all the success and proven motivators in Arsenal- at least on the pitch.


What's there to be proud of when most of them have achieved didly squat in their careers as professional footballers?? Practically all of them can count their trophy hauls with one hand- and none of them have made any significant impact internationally. I'd find it hard to be proud with this sort of record- or should finishing at the bottom half of the 4 man league qualifying for the CL every year be what we expect to motivate them?? Or would it be their amazingly gallant defeat to Birmingham in the CC final that should do this??

I never said anything about being proud of what they won. Im saying show pride in themselves, show they can be as good as the rest. Too many players like to talk a good game and don't back it up.

No point saying we can win the league then have a shocker in the next few games.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I never said anything about being proud of what they won. Im saying show pride in themselves, show they can be as good as the rest. Too many players like to talk a good game and don't back it up.

No point saying we can win the league then have a shocker in the next few games.

They say the can win the league, because our manager (who happens to be among a select few who have won it several times) tells them they can. Despite their woeful past, despite most independent experts not rating their chances and even the bookies making it pretty clear it ain't going to happen, our players put their trust in a Manager who has done it all- and that's the way it should be.

I mean its like expecting a schoolboy who does track not to believe he has a realistic chance of being an Olympic champion when the guy who discovered Bolt tells him he feels he has the potential to be a better than Bolt. Its a trust thing - and just like in the Armed Forces trust is a BIG thing in sport. If players or professional athletes don't perform the way they'd expect or been told they would, they almost always put the blame on their coaches. I mean how many times did most experts tell Murray he had the abilty to be a grand slam winner, and when he had a succession of near misses the thing he'd change/blame was his coach. Roll on a few coaches later and he's achieved his potential. During that time did you hear of Federer changing his??

Personally I think the problem we have now is since AW has been wrong so many times our players don't rate his word that much anymore- at least all the smart ones anyway- and that why almost all our long serving players wanted by good clubs end up leaving. The Cesc situation was my first real confirmation of this, just before he left he stopped making the rounds saying all the Bull you'd expect from a captain. Even on the field he didn't show he believed in the team anymore in those last days. Then you have Captain RVP who demanded the club show ambition before he'd sign- does that sound like someone with a 100 perecent trust in our world acclaimed manager?? I wonder why he didn't ask Fergie to make sure he signed a few world class players this season before joining so he'd be sure Man U would challenge for the title this season?? You see where I'm going.

Honestly no one intelligent or that has been around the game long enough can believe in this manager- and this has to be as a result of saying something at the start or every season and shifting the goalpost as soon as it becomes clear you are faltering. As far as AW is concerned, by the way he always measures success in January with his imaginary cups, he has been successful every single year at Arsenal. Do you currently feel like the fan of a successful club??

[Letters]

I can't even describe this as shocking because it's not. The manager has lost the dressing room. The standards at our club have eroded so badly that we've moved past the point of looking at how far behind the league leaders we are, we're now more concerned about clawing our way back to 4th place. It's beyond ridiculous and I look forwards to the day Wenger steps down because I'm beyond sick of the results, it's to the point of numbness now. The outrage just isn't there and I just want someone to change the record for fucks sake.
The part in bold is what I think too. We've got a decent group of players but they don't look like they're playing for each other. There's no leadership out there, no fight and, despite what Wenger says, no spirit. I don't believe Wenger can turn it round. It's sad. I will always be thankful for the heights he took us to but that was a long time ago now and while I think he's done well to keep us top 4 for as long as he has you just can't keep ON selling your best players year on year without replacing them and expect to stay there.

Now we have players openly questioning the club's ambition. Van Persie left for a club who could match his ambitions, who can blame him? Sagna's questioned out ambition. Theo is stalling over a contract because he's not happy with the position he's playing in. If Wenger's lost the dressing room then he needs to go. We have a squad who can finish top 4 but not playing like this and if they're not playing for Wenger then we need to find a manager they will play for.

:(

[Olivier's xmas twist]

They say the can win the league, because our manager (who happens to be among a select few who have won it several times) tells them they can. Despite their woeful past, despite most independent experts not rating their chances and even the bookies making it pretty clear it ain't going to happen, our players put their trust in a Manager who has done it all- and that's the way it should be.

I mean its like expecting a schoolboy who does track not to believe he has a realistic chance of being an Olympic champion when the guy who discovered Bolt tells him he feels he has the potential to be a better than Bolt. Its a trust thing - and just like in the Armed Forces trust is a BIG thing in sport. If players or professional athletes don't perform the way they'd expect or been told they would, they almost always put the blame on their coaches. I mean how many times did most experts tell Murray he had the abilty to be a grand slam winner, and when he had a succession of near misses the thing he'd change/blame was his coach. Roll on a few coaches later and he's achieved his potential. During that time did you hear of Federer changing his??

Personally I think the problem we have now is since AW has been wrong so many times our players don't rate his word that much anymore- at least all the smart ones anyway- and that why almost all our long serving players wanted by good clubs end up leaving. The Cesc situation was my first real confirmation of this, just before he left he stopped making the rounds saying all the Bull you'd expect from a captain. Even on the field he didn't show he believed in the team anymore in those last days. Then you have Captain RVP who demanded the club show ambition before he'd sign- does that sound like someone with a 100 perecent trust in our world acclaimed manager?? I wonder why he didn't ask Fergie to make sure he signed a few world class players this season before joining so he'd be sure Man U would challenge for the title this season?? You see where I'm going.

Honestly no one intelligent or that has been around the game long enough can believe in this manager- and this has to be as a result of saying something at the start or every season and shifting the goalpost as soon as it becomes clear you are faltering. As far as AW is concerned, by the way he always measures success in January with his imaginary cups, he has been successful every single year at Arsenal. Do you currently feel like the fan of a successful club??

Nope, i feel like a fan whose club seems to be in a transition. The Lowest i have felt being a gooner.

[GP]

Reminds me of the Williams F1 team of the 90's.

Frank Williams always believed that his engineering was so good that the driver was of secondary importance. Eventually the team fell so far, they didn't win a race for 8 years.

[Letters]

I used to recall that the general remit of any Arsenal manager was to challenge for the league champonship and to keep your job you had to win an FA Cup or League Cup as a bare minimum, Wenger has certainly devalued the manager's job at AFC. What's saved Wengers job over the past 7 years the Champions League 3rd and 4th spot, but this season for the first time in a long time Wenger has worthy comeptition in Everton and the spuds and possible oustiders in Swansea and WBA. We used to be the envy of every club, first club to have under floor heating at Highbury, the first club to travel first class on the train whilist the others all went 2nd class, the first club to wear suits to matches!! Don't be fooled, Arsenal are a historic and prestigious club and I can assure you any top class manager would never turn down the offer to manage this once great club. We used to be called the bank of england due to financial the vast resources we had at our disposal, and now Wenger has turned us in to a club that should be happy to finish 4th to play in a competition we have no chance of winning. I don't get it. Oh how I wish we had the old Arsenal back.
With respect, that just isn't true. If you look back over our history, Arsenal have had 2 periods of big success, one in the 30s and the other in the 90s and early noughties.
That apart our success has been patchy. From the 50s to the 80s we won the following:

League Title 1989, 1971, 1953
FA Cup: 1979, 1971, 1950
League Cup: 1987
Fairs Cup: 1970

8 trophies in 40 years. Nothing at all from 1954 to 1969 inclusive.

I don't know how old you are but it's not true to say that the success from '89 onwards is typical of Arsenal's longer history. This sense of entitlement is quite a recent thing and it's partly because of Wenger, we'd do well to remember that before slating him. Yes, he needs to go now but to say he's devalued the manager's job at AFC, I can't agree with that. His record compares favourably with pretty much any other Arsenal manager you could mention.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

The part in bold is what I think too. We've got a decent group of players but they don't look like they're playing for each other. There's no leadership out there, no fight and, despite what Wenger says, no spirit. I don't believe Wenger can turn it round. It's sad. I will always be thankful for the heights he took us to but that was a long time ago now and while I think he's done well to keep us top 4 for as long as he has you just can't keep ON selling your best players year on year without replacing them and expect to stay there.

Now we have players openly questioning the club's ambition. Van Persie left for a club who could match his ambitions, who can blame him? Sagna's questioned out ambition. Theo is stalling over a contract because he's not happy with the position he's playing in. If Wenger's lost the dressing room then he needs to go. We have a squad who can finish top 4 but not playing like this and if they're not playing for Wenger then we need to find a manager they will play for.

:(

Spot on and even if you do sell then, don't sell then to your "rivals". Wenger once said "If you keep selling your good players, you can't call yourself a big club. This season it is looking more and more the truth.

Like you say we have players their who don't want to show pride or play for him. We have a captain who looks like he wants to be elsewhere.

Wenger was a excellent manager, now he is just a good one, and as good as he is, imo he is not good enough for us, if that makes sense.

He looks ill, he does not look motivated and even he looks like he don't want to be here anymore. Players like Gev and Theo are looking around and thinking wtf. Now i know Gev is poor alot of the time. IMO he is not motivated either. I believe it was him who was pissed off just after he signed, cause he was promised he play with Nasri and nasri was sold days later.

How many of the players we have are really ambitious?

[Letters]

So much standing around by this team in the attacking 1/3, and when they do run the movement off the ball was predictable and easy to defend:gp:

So static. No-one moving for each other, no-one helping each other (as NQ said, the 2nd goal was partly Jenkinson's fault but no bugger went to help him and he got caught).

[Olivier's xmas twist]

:gp:

So static. No-one moving for each other, no-one helping each other (as NQ said, the 2nd goal was partly Jenkinson's fault but no bugger went to help him and he got caught).

Is it true the players, were arguing with each other, at timres yesterday? heard this from a fan on the radio.

[BlindFaith_8]

I was travelling back from overseas during the game, but I did pick up the sunday papers and listened to the usual 5live and talkshite and by all accounts we were totally outplayed and outclassed by Swansea, even reports suggesting the score could have easily of been nil 4 or more! With the greatest respect to Swansea, Villa and Norwich, our first eleven should be good enough to beat the 2nd tier premiership clubs and the so clalled lesser teams, but I suppose when your manager is preaching pre-season that 4th spot is the target, beacuse Man Ure and Citeh and Chelski have the financial resources to win the league, that must feed down to the players and gives them a comfort zone and allowance to have a few bad games.