Thatcher.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Dead.

[GP]

RIP :rose:

[Marc Overmars]

Even SSN have this on their yellow bar. :lol:

:rose:

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

wenger :doh:

[PGFC]

RIP :rose:

[Letters]

wenger :doh:

:lol:

Wonder what they'll do about this song in Billy Elliot


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NWB5wdDAyQ

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Did Ramsey score in training?

[Letters]

No need to thank me.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

I imagine the minute's silences will be... interesting.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

:lol:

Can't see Liverpool adhering to it somehow, nor many of the Northern clubs.

[Syn]

Nobody's doing work. Every **** is on Facebook waiting for their northerner friend to make a controversial comment so they can watch an argument unfold.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Don't know why I was of the thinking she'd made the transition years ago. :doh:

R.I.P, Iron Lady. :rose:

[Letters]

Coney simply said "Hooray!!!" and posted a link to "Ding! Dong! The Witch is Dead"

Classy.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=304948.0

:lol:

A thread with the sensitivity I expected to see.

[WMUG]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHQLQ1Rc_Js

[Letters]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-22067155


UK Independence Party leader Nigel Farage called Lady Thatcher a "great inspiration"

A ringing endorsement.

[Joker]

Celebrating someone's death is quite unsavory but in some ways I can understand why Liverpool fans would react in this way. Her policies destroyed the manufacturing industries of the North and destroyed the collective strength of the working class through her anti-trade union policies. Some of the economic problems we currently face (especially in terms of the financial institutions in the City) can be directly attributed to her "Big Bang" deregulation of the City.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=304948.0

:lol:

A thread with the sensitivity I expected to see.


Will she get a state funeral? Or will all of the North dig down to hell to hand her over to Satan personally?

:haha:

[Syn]

Livingstone's just ripped into her on sky news. They had to cut him off :lol:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BHVCdg-CIAA1NI2.jpg

CNN. :doh:

[GP]

Don't know why I was of the thinking she'd made the transition years ago. :doh:

R.I.P, Iron Lady. :rose:

Interestingly, she wasn't actually made of iron, it was just a nickname.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Interestingly, she wasn't actually made of iron, it was just a nickname.

No way. Proof?

[McNamara That Ghost...]

No way. Proof?

She'd have been in this.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/70/Ironmanposter.JPG/220px-Ironmanposter.JPG

[Özil's Panoramic View]

She'd have been in this.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/70/Ironmanposter.JPG/220px-Ironmanposter.JPG

Actually, a bit of deviation from script there...

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

:lol:

Can't see Liverpool adhering to it somehow, nor many of the Northern clubs.
It wouldn't just be us, as you say. Scotland, Yorkshire, Wales, Ireland, North East, Midlands.

I guess we'll see just how much Old Trafford does reverberate sound tonight...

[Letters]

:lol:

They wouldn't attempt a minute's silence...would they?!

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Quite lucky that Liverpool or Everton aren't playing tonight - would have imagined there would have been quite a few chants.


I'll treat her death like any other death of someone who I don't know personally. Sympathies to the family and standard R.I.P message. I wasn't around when she was in power but from what I've read about her and her policies to certain sections of society she seems like a pretty horrible and despicable woman. Still now that she's dead there's no real point taking this any further.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Labour leader Ed Miliband says former PM was 'unique figure' who 'reshaped the politics of a generation'

Sufficiently neutral.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHQLQ1Rc_Js

Top Comment: I imagine the views on this will shoot up today

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Iron Lady currently trending on Twitter.

Not sure many of those tweeting actually knew her. Either that or no scouser have discovered the feed as yet.

#LotsOfKindWords.

[Letters]

Loads of flags I can see from the window at half mast!

[Letters]

:lol: Now there's a bloke outside moving our flag to half mast!

[GP]

Some boyband douche tweeted RIP Margaret Thatcher...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BHVM-cACYAAAIQF.jpg

:lol:

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Galloway is a fucking mong who deserves deportation.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2305760/Margaret-Thatcher-dead-George-Galloway-leads-chorus-celebration-left.html


Still, it's quite amusing to see the Daily Mail jump in to defend her honour.




Can't help thinking that the Daily Mail pouring outrage to the campaign from some quarters to get "Ding Dong The Witch is Dead" to number one in the charts is going to backfire - it's only going to increase it's publicity.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

"@DailyMirror: Margaret Thatcher's death hailed as a "great day" for coal miners http://t.co/RMQTzYrrXq #Thatcher"


Can feel the love here.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Galloway is a fucking mong who deserves deportation.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2305760/Margaret-Thatcher-dead-George-Galloway-leads-chorus-celebration-left.html


Still, it's quite amusing to see the Daily Mail jump in to defend her honour.




Can't help thinking that the Daily Mail pouring outrage to the campaign from some quarters to get "Ding Dong The Witch is Dead" to number one in the charts is going to backfire - it's only going to increase it's publicity.

Now I'm not sitting here celebrating her death, but that would make me :lol: for days...



Also, it seems there won't be any minute's silences at any football games.... probably the correct decision.

[Niall_Quinn]

She was old, senile and harmless when she died so no point bearing malice towards her. I hope there's a God and a heaven and therefore a hell because there will be eternal justice if so.

I just wish she had died three decades ago. That would have been something to celebrate.

[Niall_Quinn]

Some boyband douche tweeted RIP Margaret Thatcher...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BHVM-cACYAAAIQF.jpg

:lol:

Maggie's education policies certainly paved the way.

The next generation :rose:

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Now I'm not sitting here celebrating her death, but that would make me :lol: for days...



Also, it seems there won't be any minute's silences at any football games.... probably the correct decision.

With so few people legally downloading singles these days I'm pretty confident even a small campaign will ensure that it gets into the top ten at least.


I don't usually listen to the tripe that is the Sunday evening top 40 chart show but I would for next week, if this gathers momentum. It's going to be quite amusing to see the DJ's handle the sudden rise of this track. :lol:



Good decision not to have a minute's silence. That would have been a week's worth headlines right there and a prime opportunity for the Mail to attack the North.


EDIT - https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BHVEyBzCEAAEfRU.jpg :rolleyes:

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

I think the most shocking thing is that someone actually bought our purple kit...

[GP]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BHVjZALCMAEljxY.jpg:large

There's blood on your hands, Mrs. Thatcher!

[Letters]

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/people-with-no-idea-who-thatcher-was-ecstatic-that-shes-dead-2013040865066

[LDG]

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/people-with-no-idea-who-thatcher-was-ecstatic-that-shes-dead-2013040865066

:haha:

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Are they going to have a minute's silence for her tonight before the manchester derby?...We all know what high esteem she held football and football fans in (snigger)

[Cripps_orig]

Before my time, don't give a shit about politics so no idea how she was as PM.

rip

[Xhaka Can’t]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xmmomV-ax-s

[Letters]

http://isthatcherdeadyet.co.uk/

[Marc Overmars]

So why does she divide opinion then?

Before my time and I never paid much attention in history at school.

[PGFC]

So why does she divide opinion then?

Before my time and I never paid much attention in history at school.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11518331


:good:

[Injury Time]

State funeral in time of recession...it's what she would've wanted <_<

[Letters]

We're not in recession, she's not getting a state funeral.
Apart from that, very accurate post.

[PGFC]

How divisive :sulk:

[Letters]

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/the-mash-guide-to-not-talking-about-thatcher-2013040965132

:lol:

[Letters]

And

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/thatchers-grave-not-a-nightclub-2013040965124

:lol:

[Injury Time]

We're not in recession, she's not getting a state funeral.
Apart from that, very accurate post.

Damn the BBC and all media have washed my brain of double/ triple dip recession letters says its over :trophy:, send off by all the armed forces & gun carriage on BBC news last night, I'm sure that's run by volunteers and no expense occurred at tax payer expense :good:.

[Letters]

Damn the BBC and all media have washed my brain of double/ triple dip recession letters says its over :trophy:,

It's not me that says it's over

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/9970918/Services-PMI-survey-signals-UK-will-avoid-triple-dip.html


send off by all the armed forces & gun carriage on BBC news last night, I'm sure that's run by volunteers and no expense occurred at tax payer expense :good:.

All I said was it's not a state funeral. It isn't. :shrug:

[Niall_Quinn]

It's not me that says it's over

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/e...riple-dip.html

Where to begin...

No, instead I give up.

[LDG]

Where to begin...

No, instead I give up.

:woohoo:

[The Emirates Gallactico]

It's not me that says it's over

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/9970918/Services-PMI-survey-signals-UK-will-avoid-triple-dip.html



All I said was it's not a state funeral. It isn't. :shrug:

A) They aren't official figures yet just speculation.

B) Growth at 0.1% is nothing to be celebrated about. It's pretty much a triple dip recession.

C) Until the current clowns get removed out of office things aren't going to change.


P.S. - Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead has jumped up into the charts over night.

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/news/ding-dong-the-witch-is-dead-set-to-enter-uk-official-top-40-following-margaret-thatchers-death-8566042.html

Number two on Amazon already. :lol:



Also more butthurt from the Daily Mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2306165/Margaret-Thatcher-death-parties-The-Lefts-sick-celebration-Brixtons-streets.html

[Letters]

A) We are not currently in recession. That isn't speculation, it's based on the last two quarters which is the definition of recession
B) Not to be celebrated but the current forecasts indicate we'll avoid going back into recession. But yes, those forecasts could change. That doesn't change point A
C) We'll just end up with another lot of clowns anyway :shrug:

[GP]

C) Until the current clowns get removed out of office things aren't going to change.

:lol:

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

The only difference between the clowns is the colour of the rosettes.

They're all the same bunch of bastards.

[Letters]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC3W1BiUjp0

[Niall_Quinn]

A) We are not currently in recession. That isn't speculation, it's based on the last two quarters which is the definition of recession
B) Not to be celebrated but the current forecasts indicate we'll avoid going back into recession. But yes, those forecasts could change. That doesn't change point A
C) We'll just end up with another lot of clowns anyway :shrug:

Honestly Letters. Bullshit!

All of these figures are produced for political purposes. Look out your window if you want to see the recession. We have been in recession for decades. The ****s will say a recession or growth is based on how the overall economy is performing, broadly speaking in terms of spending. Which is of course insane considering money is debt. Growth, by their ridiculous standard, is growth in debt in real terms. Which is precisely what the "boom" was before the bust. Back when everyone was racking up debt on credit cards the economy was classed as being healthy. That's like a gambler chucking money at a table, the more money he chucks the better off he is according to these fucked up economists.

Bankruptcies up, unemployment (real as opposed to government massaged) up, repossessions up, savers robbed, corporate welfare up, social welfare down, manufacturing outsourced, debt at record levels, inflation rampant (again, go and spend some money rather than listening to thick economists), the money supply starting to crush a temporary dam (and when that one breaks it'll all get twice as bad)...

But there's no recession because a bunch of fuckers who have a key interest in maintaining the faith based economy and our faith based money say so. Who are you going to believe? Them or your lying eyes?

It's not just here either, it's global. This is what happens when Ponzi schemes collapse and that's what the global economy has been for decades, a giant Ponzi scheme. Scare resources being underwritten by unlimited promises. There can be only one outcome when an economy is run like that.

[WMUG]

NQ is like Alex Jones but with more logic.

[Syn]

I don't take growth figures seriously. Not for the reason NQ says though - there might be a little spin but I don't think the guys at BoE, ECB or IMF give a shit about that. And they're not unreliable, they can estimate what they want to estimate quite accurately. But mainly because it doesn't really mean much. Similar with a lot of macro variables. Some direct measures like unemployment tell you a bit more about what's going on (though obviously not without little bit error). Trying to aggregate 'growth' or 'inflation'...bit naff imo.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Only difference is party colours....just swapping one set of clowns for another....clueless politicians....economic stagnation.... Fuck! For a second I thought you guys were talking about my home country here.

[Letters]

NQ is like Alex Jones but with more logic.
What logic? You can't just spout things with no backup and then when someone produces evidence to the contrary dismiss it as massaged or wrong.

He asks me to 'look out of my window'. The trouble with that is
a) My window is in London which has possibly been less affected by the recession than some regions and
b) I only get a limited view - it's like watching one game where Theo gets a hat-trick and proclaiming him the new Messi.

c) All I can see is flags at half mast and that makes me sad :(

Looking at some of the things he says:


Bankruptcies up, unemployment (real as opposed to government massaged) up, repossessions up, savers robbed, corporate welfare up, social welfare down, manufacturing outsourced, debt at record levels, inflation rampant (again, go and spend some money rather than listening to thick economists), the money supply starting to crush a temporary dam (and when that one breaks it'll all get twice as bad)...

I've looked for some stats on some of those things

Unemployment spiked during the worst of the recession but has fallen a bit since. It's not as high as it has been in the past though:

http://www.google.co.uk/publicdata/explore?ds=z8o7pt6rd5uqa6_&met_y=unemployment_rate&idim=country:uk&fdim_y=seasonality:sa&dl=en&hl=en&q=uk%20unemployment%20rate

Home repossessions probably went up in the worst of the recession but are now at a 5 year low:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20249822

National Debt which as a %age of GDP is way lower than it has been in the past:

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_debt_chart.html

Inflation is up over the last few years but hardly 'rampant' and not as high as has been:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2009/mar/09/inflation-economics

Insolvencies have risen though:

http://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/otherinformation/statistics/201202/


The term recession has a specific definition.
A bit like marriage.
;)

[WMUG]

Well. More logic than Alex Jones, anyway.

I have no clue about anything to do with economics and am not going to pretend otherwise, though I get the feeling you're arguing more with NQ than me :lol:

[Letters]

Tbh I don't know much about economics either but shouting a load of 'facts' and then dismissing any stats to the contrary is hardly arguing with logic.

[Xhaka Can’t]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC3W1BiUjp0

I was going to post this. :lol:

[Nayan]

Interestingly, she wasn't actually made of iron, it was just a nickname.

she was a West ham fan

anyway RIP. I think she was brilliant.

[Niall_Quinn]

Tbh I don't know much about economics either but shouting a load of 'facts' and then dismissing any stats to the contrary is hardly arguing with logic.

"Facts" - as the government reports? Or the newspapers tell you?

Unemployment is "down" because successive governments have found creative ways to remove those out of work from the unemployment registers. Home repossessions are "down" because the banks have been instructed to eat the mounting arrears until they get the go ahead to drop the other shoe. And many home owners have benefited from the theft of savings achieved through record low interest rates. Again, this is a holding exercise that can't last and must have dire consequences. National debt can't ever go down due to the nature of money and the banking system (but that's an argument three miles down the road)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdejphZrRP8&feature=share&list=UUVnplTAv0NJA09oDEThXVWw

Same argument with inflation. It is impossible for inflation to fall in real terms (again due to the nature of money) but the "rate" of inflation can be manipulated easily enough.

Anyway it doesn't matter is some people want to keep repeating from government and approved (self interested) sources. One of the most positive aspects of the recent global crime spree is more and more people have come to realise what money actually is, how it is produced and why it is the very worst measure of economic performance. We are pathetic in the UK in terms of standing up to establishment abuse and criminality but the Americans and Spanish and Portuguese and so on are not so faint hearted.

[Niall_Quinn]

BTW, Youtube video embeds don't seem to work on this site any more. Don't know if it's just me, videos work fine in other sites.

[Letters]

BTW, Youtube video embeds don't seem to work on this site any more. Don't know if it's just me, videos work fine in other sites.
The one above is embedded OK :unsure:
What browser are you using?

[Niall_Quinn]

The one above is embedded OK :unsure:
What browser are you using?

Chrome - probably something to do with flash player as usual. Irritating, it just displays the whole video frame as an image.

[Cripps_orig]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11518331


:good:
Skimmed through that. No idea what a free market is but the most important part was


She was dubbed "Thatcher the milk snatcher" after her decision to end free school milk for older primary school pupils

What a bitch

[IBK]

Like her or hate her, noone can deny that she was an immensely important part of the political make up of this country in the 20th century. I have no problem with her death being marked in the way it will be. Its a sad day when a nation cannot mark the passing of such a prominent public figure.

[GP]

she was a West ham fan

Well I'm glad the fucking bitch is dead.

[Thierrymon]

Margaret Thatchers greatest achievement was undoubtedly helping create Mr Whippy.

[Power n Glory]

"Facts" - as the government reports? Or the newspapers tell you?

Unemployment is "down" because successive governments have found creative ways to remove those out of work from the unemployment registers. Home repossessions are "down" because the banks have been instructed to eat the mounting arrears until they get the go ahead to drop the other shoe. And many home owners have benefited from the theft of savings achieved through record low interest rates. Again, this is a holding exercise that can't last and must have dire consequences. National debt can't ever go down due to the nature of money and the banking system (but that's an argument three miles down the road)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdejphZrRP8&feature=share&list=UUVnplTAv0NJA09oDEThXVWw

Same argument with inflation. It is impossible for inflation to fall in real terms (again due to the nature of money) but the "rate" of inflation can be manipulated easily enough.

Anyway it doesn't matter is some people want to keep repeating from government and approved (self interested) sources. One of the most positive aspects of the recent global crime spree is more and more people have come to realise what money actually is, how it is produced and why it is the very worst measure of economic performance. We are pathetic in the UK in terms of standing up to establishment abuse and criminality but the Americans and Spanish and Portuguese and so on are not so faint hearted.

Useful. Thanks for that one. Checking out the main site.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Read that she was a supporter of apartheid and strongly opposed any sanctions against South Africa - even went as far as labelling the ANC rebels.

What a bitch.

[Power n Glory]

She said they were terrorists.

[Letters]

She said they were terrorists.
Weren't they? :unsure:

[Power n Glory]

Weren't they? :unsure:

Nelson Mandela was a terrorist?

A very thin line between a rebel/freedom fighter and terrorist.

[GP]

Weren't they? :unsure:

Certainly were.

[PGFC]

Nelson Mandela was a terrorist?

A very thin line between a rebel/freedom fighter and terrorist.

It only depends on who wins.

[Power n Glory]

It only depends on who wins.

Yep. They're not a terrorist group anymore. :lol:

Terrorist group or not, people are still saying she supported the apartheid government and prevented international sanctions. That's what she's being criticised for.

[Xhaka Can’t]

They were disenfranchised in their own country with no democratic means of achieving even basic rights.

Everyone knew that, they fought against that. In no way could an armed struggle against their subjugation be labelled terrorism. The government oppressing the majority were the terrorists.

[Power n Glory]

They were disenfranchised in their own country with no democratic means of achieving even basic rights.

Everyone knew that, they fought against that. In no way could an armed struggle against their subjugation be labelled terrorism. The government oppressing the majority were the terrorists.

Wisely put, GB.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Wow, a few of shocking comments coming through here. Oppressed, disenfranchised and heavily marginalised folks fighting against a racist and brutal regime in a bid to be recognised at least as human beings in their own country, so they can have basic human living conditions and rights, are rightly labelled as terrorists and rebels, eh?

[Power n Glory]

It’s bad but I’m hardly shocked. We support the same team on here but politics is an entirely different matter.

[Özim]

She was very important, but her standout moment was without doubt this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqZTP8-8wIs

This could have never happened without her.

[Özim]

Read that she was a supporter of apartheid and strongly opposed any sanctions against South Africa - even went as far as labelling the ANC rebels.

What a bitch.
You need to read this as it gives a more accurate picture:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/10/margaret-thatcher-apartheid-mandela

Love her or hate her she is a historical figure, first woman Prime Minister and a very unique woman who will be remembered in the history books.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

You need to read this as it gives a more accurate picture:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/10/margaret-thatcher-apartheid-mandela


More accurate according to who?

[Özim]

More accurate according to who?
There's different views, but she was a very intelligent woman who understood the complexities of different situations, many subscribe to the view that she helped end Apartheid and free Mandela more speedily. ANC members disagree of course, but then she did refer to them as a terrorist group.

I'm not a Thatcher supporter btw, but it's more complicated that just simply saying she supported Apartheid.

[Letters]

Nelson Mandela was a terrorist?

A very thin line between a rebel/freedom fighter and terrorist.
Yes, there is a fine line. By the definition of terrorism I guess they were. From what I've read their tactics were similar to the IRA's.

Whether their acts were justified though...you can make a pretty good case.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Yes, there is a fine line. By the definition of terrorism I guess they were. From what I've read their tactics were similar to the IRA's.

Whether their acts were justified though...you can make a pretty good case.

So because they have not got the resources of the State to propogate a war doing things like air raids and military incursions, they're terrorists?

In SA, it was the terrorists that were in control of the state.

The resultant tactics of the ANC were borne as a result of the situation.

[Power n Glory]

There's different views, but she was a very intelligent woman who understood the complexities of different situations, many subscribe to the view that she helped end Apartheid and free Mandela more speedily. ANC members disagree of course, but then she did refer to them as a terrorist group.

I'm not a Thatcher supporter btw, but it's more complicated that just simply saying she supported Apartheid.

I wouldn't go that far. She was quite happy to make money out of the Iraq/Iran conflict and buddy up with Saddam.

[Özim]

I wouldn't go that far. She was quite happy to make money out of the Iraq/Iran conflict and buddy up with Saddam.
All countries look after their own interests at the end of the day, politicians have a duty to their own people and not those abroad, as harsh as that sounds it's the way of the world as it's them that elect them.

I don't necessarily think that should be the way, but it is and will probably remain so. Maggie Thatcher wasn't the first and certainly won't be the last to make questionnable decisions.

[Letters]

So because they have not got the resources of the State to propogate a war doing things like air raids and military incursions, they're terrorists?
They're terrorists because they tried to bring about their aims through the use of terror as opposed to peaceful means.
That's pretty much what the term means.

Whether they had other options, whether the means were justified are separate debates as is whether the state should be considered terrorists too.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

All countries look after their own interests at the end of the day, politicians have a duty to their own people and not those abroad, as harsh as that sounds it's the way of the world as it's them that elect them.

I don't necessarily think that should be the way, but it is and will probably remain so. Maggie Thatcher wasn't the first and certainly won't be the last to make questionnable decisions.

I'm sure she also excelled there as well, so much so that there is no vastly split opinion about her. Loved and revered by the British people en masse.

Let's have a gut busting laugh at anti-apartheid twats that tried to revile and malign her.

[Power n Glory]

All countries look after their own interests at the end of the day, politicians have a duty to their own people and not those abroad, as harsh as that sounds it's the way of the world as it's them that elect them.

I don't necessarily think that should be the way, but it is and will probably remain so. Maggie Thatcher wasn't the first and certainly won't be the last to make questionnable decisions.

There is no denying that most governments are involved in arms trading but let’s cut the crap about the woman understanding the complexities of the conflict in South Africa when it all probably boils down to money and being able to exploit a conflict.

[Power n Glory]

They're terrorists because they tried to bring about their aims through the use of terror as opposed to peaceful means.
That's pretty much what the term means.

Whether they had other options, whether the means were justified are separate debates as is whether the state should be considered terrorists too.

So....what about the Syrian's that are fighting against their government?

The ANC started off as a peacful group from what I've read.

[Letters]

So....what about the Syrian's that are fighting against their government?

What about them?


The ANC started off as a peacful group from what I've read.

I'm not sure how that's relevant.

[Joker]

The ANC were totally justified in their actions IMO (I know that's not exactly what the debate is about). Any state that deprives their citizens of basic human rights based on the colour of their skin deserves to be opposed, and peaceful methods don't always work.

I wonder whether those who call the ANC terrorists would say the same about the Italian partisans fighting Mussolini and the fascist regime in Italy during WW2.

[Syn]

:lol:

This is classic Letters.

[Power n Glory]

What about them?



I'm not sure how that's relevant.

It relates back to what GB said about tactics borne out of a situation and if they were once peaceful, it says something about the regime they were up against. But regardless of all that, let's not pretend Thatcher was being guided by some moral compass on this one, as if her conscience couldn't bear the thought of aiding 'terrorists'. She had no problems helping Saddam and Pinochet.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

So....what about the Syrian's that are fighting against their government?

The ANC started off as a peacful group from what I've read.

I'm by no means clued up on Syria, but aren't lots of the "Free Syrian Army" or whatever they're called now, the very same "terrorists" we're fighting in other countries? And many of them, as Assad actually says, foreign. That's not me taking sides because the whole Middle East thing just gives me a headache but it doesn't seem to always be this one way street you'd believe if you just watched the news.

[Power n Glory]

I'm by no means clued up on Syria, but aren't lots of the "Free Syrian Army" or whatever they're called now, the very same "terrorists" we're fighting in other countries? And many of them, as Assad actually says, foreign. That's not me taking sides because the whole Middle East thing just gives me a headache but it doesn't seem to always be this one way street you'd believe if you just watched the news.

I guess I'm not clued up either. :lol:

But regardless of who they are, do they sit back and look for a peaceful resolution when under such heavy attack? As for who's who and what's accurate in that situation...who knows what's happening. I can understand the reluctance to arm rebels considering the past mess we've gotten into or maybe governments are just turning a blind eye on this one since there is no benefit and nobody wants a war during this financial crisis.

As Zimm said earlier, countries look out for their own interests first. The Al Qaeda link talk...fuck knows if that's true after the WMD and Al Qaeda links to justify the Iraq invasion. That 'terrorist' word always set the alarm bells ringing and relates back to what old Maggie was trying to do all those years ago. It can deflect sympathy for the cause and public opinion. Heck, we were in the heat of the IRA problems at the time.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Quite how the ANC were to achieve enfranchisement while brutally subjugated by a minority regime that used the weapons of state to do so is beyond me. To then label THEM the terrorists is pretty sick logic.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

I guess I'm not clued up either. :lol:

But regardless of who they are, do they sit back and look for a peaceful resolution when under such heavy attack? As for who's who and what's accurate in that situation...who knows what's happening. I can understand the reluctance to arm rebels considering the past mess we've gotten into or maybe governments are just turning a blind eye on this one since there is no benefit and nobody wants a war during this financial crisis.

As Zimm said earlier, countries look out for their own interests first. The Al Qaeda link talk...fuck knows if that's true after the WMD and Al Qaeda links to justify the Iraq invasion. That 'terrorist' word always set the alarm bells ringing and relates back to what old Maggie was trying to do all those years ago. It can deflect sympathy for the cause and public opinion. Heck, we were in the heat of the IRA problems at the time.
I did read something today that some group was worryingly close to "joining" Al Qaeda, but as I say it gives me a headache so I didn't get past the headline. Quite a few people have said that many of the people fighting there are essentially the same people we're fighting elsewhere and if they were doing it in say... Saudi Arabia, "foreign terrorists", so in many ways backing up what Assad actually says. That's not me making him out to be the good guy, I'm sure he's as vile as the next dictator, but we do seem to have a tradition of backing people, arming them, funding them and 20 years later trying to kill them.

I guess it just comes back to the point that it all depends on if you're on the winning side or not.... and for the last 60 years that would normally be on Team USA.

[Syn]

Quite how the ANC were to achieve enfranchisement while brutally subjugated by a minority regime that used the weapons of state to do so is beyond me. To then label THEM the terrorists is pretty sick logic.

Of course.

BUT

Marriage means this. Recession means that. Terrorists mean this...

It's the +1's of all +1's. Letters I recommend you have a link to an online dictionary (preferably urban) in your signature and save the energy.

[Özim]

There is no denying that most governments are involved in arms trading but let’s cut the crap about the woman understanding the complexities of the conflict in South Africa when it all probably boils down to money and being able to exploit a conflict.
I'm not disagreeing, she supported (or didn't active oppose) policies that fitted in with her ideals, her judgments were not based on morals, but then not many governments decisions are based on what's morally right.

[Letters]

Of course.

BUT

Marriage means this. Recession means that. Terrorists mean this...

It's the +1's of all +1's. Letters I recommend you have a link to an online dictionary (preferably urban) in your signature and save the energy.

Yeah, semantics is over-rated. Much easier to debate things if we all have our own private definition of what words mean, then we're all right. :good:

[Power n Glory]

You set such a bad example on here. :lol:

[Letters]

I'm not WUMming :shrug:
What do you disagree with?

If we're going to debate something we surely have to understand what certain words mean.
If we all have our own definition of them then let's just all declare ourselves right and go home.

[Power n Glory]

Did I say that? :shrug:

We're not going to have another round of semantics. :lol:

[Xhaka Can’t]

There is no universally accepted definition of 'terrorism'. It is accepted to be an emotionally charged word and State authorities almost always refer to those engaged in actions against them as 'terrorists' to delegitimise those fighting for political aims. In this case the terrorists were the minority who subjugated the majority using the forces of the state.

To label the ANC as a terrorist organisation is quite frankly, revolting.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm by no means clued up on Syria, but aren't lots of the "Free Syrian Army" or whatever they're called now, the very same "terrorists" we're fighting in other countries? And many of them, as Assad actually says, foreign. That's not me taking sides because the whole Middle East thing just gives me a headache but it doesn't seem to always be this one way street you'd believe if you just watched the news.

Yep, a motley collection of the very worst scum all on the American payroll. Standard procedure since the Iranian Coup. Probably to counterbalance the disaster in Egypt where there was a genuine uprising that deprived the yanks of their nasty little fascist buddy.

[Syn]

Yeah, semantics is over-rated. Much easier to debate things if we all have our own private definition of what words mean, then we're all right. :good:

Yes, Letters, semantics is overrated.

Person A: "That was pretty quick. Think that clocked in at 100mph. [Some interesting related shit]".
Person B: "It was 98.7 mph".

Person B is you.

It's not about having private definitions. But your entire contribution - in far too many cases - is about picking up on one little point that really doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if Thatcher is correct according to the Webster's dictionary. The bigger picture of her stance and what she was trying to do by using a word with negative connotations (which we're all surely agreed on...terrorists are bad. That's how we all think, isn't it?) is what is important.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm not disagreeing, she supported (or didn't active oppose) policies that fitted in with her ideals, her judgments were not based on morals, but then not many governments decisions are based on what's morally right.

Maggie Thatcher was vile filth. The evidence is all out there and there's plenty more buried no doubt. When segments of a nation are pitted against each other so thoroughly and with such vitriol it's self evident there's an extremely bad leader at work. She was almost the mirror image of Ghandi, she was staunch supporter of all the most divisive traditions, she sowed hatred where there was previously harmony and everything she did was regressive and designed to fracture society and redistribute wealth to the rich.

Of course there's plenty of spin out there but I suggest you ignore it and just look at what has happened in this country from 1979 onwards. She drove a lot of that. Blair was the disastrous follow on who cemented her policies. A terrible period in British history that will only be written about honestly and accurately maybe a couple of hundred years down the road. I mean even during the worst excesses back through the ages the mainstream was shouting about how great everything was. Same with Thatcher. We'll have to leave it to our great great great grandchildren to appreciate her for what she was - a monster.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm not disagreeing, she supported (or didn't active oppose) policies that fitted in with her ideals, her judgments were not based on morals, but then not many governments decisions are based on what's morally right.

An attitude of acceptance because of in idea that nothing can be done is the easiest way to ensure the thing you oppose will last forever. Eventually people have to stand up. Now, tomorrow, somewhere down the line. It's ALL about morality. If that doesn't underpin the functioning of government then there's no government at all. Government as we (erroneously) suppose is by the people for the people. That's what representation is pinned on. When that foundation is removed government ceases to exist and you have something else. When you say, "her judgements were not based on morals", that's a harsher condemnation that I could conjure (and I work pretty hard at it). But I'm thinking maybe you are missing your own point.

[Marc Overmars]

Quite interesting reading up on her.

So that's where the north/south divide eminates from. :popcorn:

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Quite interesting reading up on her.

So that's where the north/south divide eminates from. :popcorn:
To be fair that's not exactly true either, since there was essentially the same divide back in the 30s and probably even before that. It was probably increased and ingrained in peoples' minds in her time though, and frankly there's been little done since to try and rectify it.

[Nayan]

that Maggie Thatcher believed in and relished right wing politics and pushing her vision isnt in doubt. However I do think people gloss over the mess the country was in at the time - capital controls, begging for an IMF bailout, everything nationaised or on strike, rampant inflation etc. She didnt do all that, and what came afterwards (savage austerity that makes anything going at present look tame) was inevitable.

I'm not saying she did everything right, but anyone taking power afterwards wouldve had to do contend with everything grinding to a halt after the shit had hit the fan.

[Power n Glory]

I was watching a Sky Atlantic documentary and they said we were down to 3 day working weeks. We were in the shit. Was Labour that put us there?

[Niall_Quinn]

that Maggie Thatcher believed in and relished right wing politics and pushing her vision isnt in doubt. However I do think people gloss over the mess the country was in at the time - capital controls, begging for an IMF bailout, everything nationaised or on strike, rampant inflation etc. She didnt do all that, and what came afterwards (savage austerity that makes anything going at present look tame) was inevitable.

I'm not saying she did everything right, but anyone taking power afterwards wouldve had to do contend with everything grinding to a halt after the shit had hit the fan.

I suppose Cameron could argue the same thing, in fact he does. For such powerful and world changing personalities, nothing much really changes.

[Niall_Quinn]

I was watching a Sky Atlantic documentary and they said we were down to 3 day working weeks. We were in the shit. Was Labour that put us there?

No, was the bankers that put us there, as usual. That's why we have two political faces on the one system, so they can blame each other and divide and distract the people.

[PGFC]

It's a shame there wasn't an internet in 1979.

[Niall_Quinn]

It's a shame there wasn't an internet in 1979.

There was.

[Power n Glory]

No, was the bankers that put us there, as usual. That's why we have two political faces on the one system, so they can blame each other and divide and distract the people.

True. I guess it's the Government's role to split the pot. We're fucked either way.

[Niall_Quinn]

When do people think Cliff Richard will die?

[LDG]

When do people think Cliff Richard will die?

By fire, on centre court at Wimbledon....

...Oh, you said when...

[Xhaka Can’t]

:haha:

[PGFC]

There was.

That was ARPANET.

You know perfectly well what I meant angry boy.

[Letters]

There was.

Letters :bow:

[Niall_Quinn]

That was ARPANET.

You know perfectly well what I meant angry boy.

I knew what you meant. See it all the time. Hear it all the time. Familiar wisdom from those who know how ridiculous an idea it is that powerful minorities might collaborate to preserve their status. Ridiculous. Could never happen. Instead, everything's like they say on the news. Everyone knows that.

[PGFC]

Quite.

[Niall_Quinn]

Quite.

Don't forget to mix it up though. Anti-semitism, terrorist, book reader, all these work well and provide good variation.

[Cripps_orig]

When do people think Cliff Richard will die?

Hopefully never.

The likes of him, Bruce Forsyth etc are British legends

[Letters]

Apparently the Thatcher family are making a 'contribution'.
And the £10m figure seems to have been pulled out of someone's arse.
But it clearly won't be cheap.

I'm sure it's what she would have wanted.

[Grebbo]

I'm too young to have a political view on Thatcher. I know my old man hated her but liked Tony Blair which kinda makes me question his judgement. He's one of these people who votes for the party and not the candidate and that makes no sense to me.

One question I have for posters who know Thatcher's work is there seems to be a lot of hate for her closing down coal mines. Now, how come if the coal mines were so great they haven't been re-opened all these years later with us having 15yrs of a Labour government and sky high energy prices??

Some northerner on my Facebook has been constantly rejoicing at maggies death. He earns very good money working for an insurance company. I think the irony is lost on him.

[PGFC]

£10 million? a club could buy a Championship nobody for that, what a waste.

[Cripps_orig]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but surely the most important thing is do we get a holiday on the day of her funeral?

[Nayan]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but surely the most important thing is do we get a holiday on the day of her funeral?

its not a state funeral, so no. Then again - do you even have a job?

[Nayan]

When do people think Cliff Richard will die?

during the summer holiday

[Cripps_orig]

its not a state funeral, so no. Then again - do you even have a job?

Ffs. What's the point of having a funeral then?

Yes

[Nayan]

No, was the bankers that put us there, as usual. That's why we have two political faces on the one system, so they can blame each other and divide and distract the people.

bankers lent too much money too cheaply to peole who didnt pay it back (including each other). not surprisingly they are now a bit short so cant be arsed lending anyone more money to start businesses which are already doomed to failure.
However nobody put a gun agasint our heads and fored us to 'equity release' our houses and buy overpriced buy to lets in Leeds or wherever. If we are feeling the pinch after gettinggreedy and/or stupid that is entirely our fault.
likewise the politicians who borrowed to the hilt and had to reap the whirlwind when the credit dried up.

Nobody is saying that banksters are blameless. Far from it in fact. However the continual bankerbashing just diverts attention from inept politicians and ultimately a very stupid /greedy public.

[Nayan]

Ffs. What's the point of having a funeral then?

Yes

congrats.

[PGFC]

Ffs. What's the point of having a funeral then?



So lots of people with no jobs can jump around self-righteously, being angry and stealing other peoples things, possibly.

[Letters]

Yes, Letters, semantics is overrated.

Person A: "That was pretty quick. Think that clocked in at 100mph. [Some interesting related shit]".
Person B: "It was 98.7 mph".

Person B is you.

No.

Person A: "That was dangerously fast and over the speed limit. Think that clocked in at 102mph. [Some interesting related shit]".
Person B: "It was 98.7 mph".

Person B is me.

In your example the point person A is making is quite general and while "quick" is a fairly relative term whether it's 100 or 98.7 makes no difference to the point.

In my example (I'm assuming the limit is 100mph) it does make a difference. If the limit is 100mph then 102 is over it, 98.7 isn't. That makes a difference to the point because if person A is berating the driver for driving dangerously then if the driver was within the speed limit which has been deemed safe then it's less reasonable to have a go at them. You can have related debates about whether the speed limit is too high, whether the driver should have used a bit more common sense, whatever. But it's not pointless pedantry to make the point that the driver wasn't over the limit as stated.

If people are going to express outrage at Thatcher for calling the ANC terrorists it's hardly beside the point to look at what the ANC did, what terrorism generally means and whether Thatcher had a point. Were the IRA terrorists? Most people would say so. From the reading I did yesterday (on Wiki, admittedly!) some of the ANC's tactics seem quite similar to those of the IRA. A few years ago I met Patrick Magee, the Brighton Bomber. We've got a bloke at church called Harvey Thomas who was Thatcher's Communications Officer or something back in the day. Harvey organised that Brighton Tory conference and got blown up in the bomb although was uninjured. Harvey was preaching one time about forgiveness when he realised that he'd never forgiven Patrick (who by this stage was in prison) so Harvey wrote to him and, weirdly, they became friends. Patrick was released as part of the Good Friday agreement so we had this event at church in which they both were interviewed about the whole thing and their reconciliation, and the issue of forgiveness in general. It was all very interesting. Patrick is clearly a very intelligent man and very eloquently explained why they used the tactics they did, why they felt they had no other option. I didn't buy his arguements and told him so after, but I also told him I'd never heard the argument put so well before. It felt a bit weird meeting someone who'd been involved in such things but he wasn't some madman, he was an intelligent bloke who wanted change and felt that was the only way of bringing it about.

Was he a terrorist? Most people would say so.

[Niall_Quinn]

bankers lent too much money too cheaply to peole who didnt pay it back (including each other). not surprisingly they are now a bit short so cant be arsed lending anyone more money to start businesses which are already doomed to failure.
However nobody put a gun agasint our heads and fored us to 'equity release' our houses and buy overpriced buy to lets in Leeds or wherever. If we are feeling the pinch after gettinggreedy and/or stupid that is entirely our fault.
likewise the politicians who borrowed to the hilt and had to reap the whirlwind when the credit dried up.

Nobody is saying that banksters are blameless. Far from it in fact. However the continual bankerbashing just diverts attention from inept politicians and ultimately a very stupid /greedy public.

That's the consumption model. Modern economies can only function through spending. True enough, people could have refused to spend and opted to go back to a durables/ production based society. But in much the same way they choose to vote time and time again despite the consequences, they opted to get with the modern approach to economics. Not so modern really because credit expansion and contraction has been around a long time, but every old trick is re-spun as the next great thing. It's a fair point though to say people had and have choice. They are surrounded by constant messaging telling them what choice they ought to make, but the choice is still there.

What's seriously shit though is what happens to the prudent people who buck the trend and decide to save. Savings, pensions, other forms of investment are all tied to the performance of the economy, or in reality the money supply and interest rates/ inflation. So whether you chose to splurge or whether you went the other route, you still get fucked. You either get robbed via interest rates on debt or by depreciation of assets. The bankers win both ways.

[Niall_Quinn]

Terrorist is the term big terrorists apply to their smaller foe.

[PGFC]

Is that from the Penguin book of platitudes?

[Xhaka Can’t]

Letters, you have no concept of context at all. Anyone with a basic grasp of the environment and the injustice of it, would not label the ANC terrorists.

[Niall_Quinn]

Is that from the Penguin book of platitudes?

No, it's from the real rather than reported world. Who do you think the biggest terror organisation on the planet is?

Yes, Al'Qaeda - of course. How do I know? Because the BBC said so. So easy to figure these things out.

[PGFC]

Wow, you know everything.

[Niall_Quinn]

Wow, you know everything.

No, there's a difference between knowing nothing and knowing something.

[Power n Glory]

No, there's a difference between knowing nothing and knowing something.

Leave him be.

He knows nothing.

In fact, he knows less than nothing.

If he knew, he knew nothing, that would be something. But he doesn't. :lol:

[Cripps_orig]

Some piss poor people being invited

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-22109759

[Nayan]

That's the consumption model. Modern economies can only function through spending. True enough, people could have refused to spend and opted to go back to a durables/ production based society. But in much the same way they choose to vote time and time again despite the consequences, they opted to get with the modern approach to economics. Not so modern really because credit expansion and contraction has been around a long time, but every old trick is re-spun as the next great thing. It's a fair point though to say people had and have choice. They are surrounded by constant messaging telling them what choice they ought to make, but the choice is still there.


What's seriously shit though is what happens to the prudent people who buck the trend and decide to save. Savings, pensions, other forms of investment are all tied to the performance of the economy, or in reality the money supply and interest rates/ inflation. So whether you chose to splurge or whether you went the other route, you still get fucked. You either get robbed via interest rates on debt or by depreciation of assets. The bankers win both ways.

The zero interest rate policy experiencce in Japan shows you what comes next. After a crash (or indeed world war II), big government and big business rebuild their balance sheets by paying nothing for labour and capital but selling back the results at high prices to consumers (goods at inflated and taxed prices, rationed expensive mortgages etc) . ie they squeezing household wealth and the prudent savers you cite.

Add to this the more direct methods of raising taxes on folks and the sneaky ways (stoking inflation to erode the real value of your debt, after forcing your banks and pension fund to buy it) and you have the classic recipe for paying for wars, bloating welfare spending and otehr promises that were easy to make but hard to pay for.

Financial Repression is much bigger than bankers fun and games. Banker bashing is just a divversionary tactic to pull the wool over your eyes.

1) more capital provisioning / forcing bankers and your pension fund to hold that capital as government debt = create demand for government bonds, which is now being issued at puny yields
2) stoke inflation by printing money meaning that debt wil be paid back in worthless debased currency

[Letters]

Went outside to watch the hearse go by the top of Whitehall. Disappointingly little pomp. Hardly any ceremony either.

:(

[GP]

I'm only watching this in the vague hope she'll bust out of the coffin like some grotesque zombie.

[Letters]

Was going to Sky+ it but decided to watch the highlights later.
Are Hansen and Keown on the panel?

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Was going to Sky+ it but decided to watch the highlights later.
Are Hansen and Keown on the panel?
Pace, power, precision. She's quick, she's fast, she's got pace.
She was just not the kind of player.

Must be reaching the business end of the funeral now.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Strong turnout at Leeds...

https://twitter.com/IanWhiteNews/status/324469527922495489/photo/1

[Letters]

Falvs :bow:

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

bankers lent too much money too cheaply to peole who didnt pay it back (including each other). not surprisingly they are now a bit short so cant be arsed lending anyone more money to start businesses which are already doomed to failure.
However nobody put a gun agasint our heads and fored us to 'equity release' our houses and buy overpriced buy to lets in Leeds or wherever. If we are feeling the pinch after gettinggreedy and/or stupid that is entirely our fault.
likewise the politicians who borrowed to the hilt and had to reap the whirlwind when the credit dried up.

Nobody is saying that banksters are blameless. Far from it in fact. However the continual bankerbashing just diverts attention from inept politicians and ultimately a very stupid /greedy public.

damn straight.

it all confines under the category of greed. the old saying 'life isnt like the 90s, they were the golden age'. actually it was pretty similar- everyone making money and technological revolution creating a polarised society. but its greed that has taken over. we used to have the rich but they werent assholes. the communitarian bonds that were established have been destroyed, the social norms and values that britain based itself upon have been demolished, the social capital we proudly based upon has all gone. and for what? a bit more money? where has that got us? tit for tat money making benders who will walk over a dead body to get that extra pound? its a fucking disgrace.

and politicians let it get to this; they slowly devalued the working class and spat in their face, told them they were worthless, made them feel weak and vulnerable, while providing incentives for the rich to get richer. thats great if it's incorporated into a societal plan but there was no such plan. the lower class were given nominal increases in the minimum wage as a thank you, as a way of creating a carrot. but all it did was create a stick- a stick to beat them with. the real plan was to make the rich richer cause 'that will help britain' they said. that isnt a plan, its stupidity. let me tell you one thing, the working class are the life and blood of a country. they created the communitarian bonds that made britain such a 'golden age' in the 70s/80s/90s. the rich weed with themselves, pompously forbidding interaction with the rest. and now that many of the working class are feeling worthless / are kicking up a fuss, they are being told to quieten down.

i used to sit on the tube and talk to a stranger about their day. i remember an old lady told me once, 'as long as we have this, london will be a fine place'. at the time i didnt think much of it, i waved goodbye and got off the train at my stop. that was roughly 15 years ago. its only now i realise the value of what she meant.

we will never get that back.

you speak to someone on the train and they think you're either a. drunk b. a tramp c. looking for money

there used to be an incentive to look out for one another, but who on here can honestly say they care about a person they walk down the street for anymore? i see a person collapsed on a road and people dont blink an eye. im the one helping them back on their feet. why has it got to this? will it ever go back? no. you fill the balloon with air and eventually it will burst.

there's no going back so make the most of it. welcome to what friedman calls the newly 'flat' world. he was referring to in terms of globalisation but im referring to it in terms of atmosphere, social bonds and values. flat as a fiddle, and we've run out of ways to fill it back with air.

[Letters]

Headline du jour:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/george-osborne-caught-crying-camera-1837174

[Letters]

See? :d

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22290407


:ninja:

:run:

[Niall_Quinn]

See? :d

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22290407


:ninja:

:run:

:doh:

I know you are joking but it's shocking to think the majority (I would say vast majority) believe the government is running the economy. Even the concept of them being capable of running it is ridiculous.

[Letters]

The funeral cost 3.6m apparently.
A fair bit of that was on security though, that's all money going into people's pockets and back into the economy anyway.

[Syn]

Hmm...define people.

[Niall_Quinn]

The funeral cost 3.6m apparently.
A fair bit of that was on security though, that's all money going into people's pockets and back into the economy anyway.

Strange they needed security for one so loved.

[GP]

Any public event would need security.

[Letters]

Hmm...define people.
I see you ignored me when I engaged with your posts before but here you are rushing to have a little pointless dig.

Your post added far less than my ones you were so critical of.

:good:

[Syn]

I see you ignored me when I engaged with your posts before but here you are rushing to have a little pointless dig.

Your post added far less than my ones you were so critical of.

:good:

I didn't ignore it. I read it. What would you like me to say about it?

Also, define rushing. Would that be at 100mph, 98.7 mph or 102mph?

[Letters]

I didn't ignore it. I read it. What would you like me to say about it?
You don't have to say anything, but if you're going to have a pop at someone and claim their posts aren't adding anything then it's a bit rich to
a) Ignore their response which deals with that accusation.
b) Make posts which don't add anything

:tiphat:

[Niall_Quinn]

You don't have to say anything, but if you're going to have a pop at someone and claim their posts aren't adding anything then it's a bit rich to
a) Ignore their response which deals with that accusation.
b) Make posts which don't add anything

:tiphat:

And none of his posts rhyme either, not one them.

[Cripps_orig]

Hmm...define people.

Wenger and the board

[Xhaka Can’t]

The funeral cost 3.6m apparently.
A fair bit of that was on security though, that's all money going into people's pockets and back into the economy anyway.

By that reckoning, we should increase (or decrease if you read the Daily Heil) the dole rate to £500 a week. Just think of all that money going in to people's pockets and back into the economy! All those payday loan shops blighting the High Street could be replaced with Off Licenses and Tobacconists. And just imagine all those extra Sky Subscriptions!

[Letters]

Yes, that's exactly the same as paying someone for doing a job.

[Xhaka Can’t]

You were talking about the circulation of money.

And no job = pointless job.

[Niall_Quinn]

It was unlawful to charge (not bill) the taxpayer for the ****s funeral anyway. Even if backed by frivolous arguments related to consent (which in most cases is unlawfully manufactured anyway) and the national interest (which is a catch all for all manner of criminal activity) there is still no consideration in this contract and so it's unlawful, except in the cases of those sad fucks who actually attended the funeral or (possibly if you really stretch the argument) the people in teh vicinity of the funeral. But nobody will be prosecuted for this fraud of course.

[Grebbo]

The funeral cost 3.6m apparently.
A fair bit of that was on security though, that's all money going into people's pockets and back into the economy anyway.

What's 'security' anyway - is it Police and other public servants? They'd be getting paid anyway even if there was no funeral would they not?

I don't think the tax payer should have paid for it but I also don't believe it would have cost anything like £3.6m.

[Letters]

I guess it's overtime for a lot of the police as they'd need more on duty for a bit public event like that.

[LDG]

I heard her coffin was lined with gold.

[Niall_Quinn]

I heard her coffin was lined with gold.

And filled with the finest shit.

[-Xs-]

See? :d

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22290407


:ninja:

:run:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2013/may/01/double-dip-recession-doubts-ons

:ninja:

:run:

[Xhaka Can’t]

So it's been nothing but sunshine and lollipops all along.

[Letters]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NshIKMbGV6o

:patrice:

[Xhaka Can’t]

There is a Simpsons for everything!

[Niall_Quinn]

So it's been nothing but sunshine and lollipops all along.

May Day, May Day... All is Well. First Class men first and please try to make some room for the mistresses and (ahem) children.

[GP]

There is a Simpsons for everything!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDuMp2kDxos

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NshIKMbGV6o

:patrice:

Someone just caught me signing* that.

Oh the shame.

Singing it, obviously.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Closest thread to hand and I am sure Thatcher wouldn't mind.

Nigel Evans MP has been arrested on suspicion of rape and sexual assault.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Roles reversed now, with "the Left"* annoyed about the Mail's pieces on Ralph Miliband, and "the Right"* saying it's fair game.

:popcorn:

No wonder people hate politics.

*I use these terms lazily and applied mainly to people on the internet.

The original article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2435751/Red-Eds-pledge-bring-socialism-homage-Marxist-father-Ralph-Miliband-says-GEOFFREY-LEVY.html
Miliband's rebuttal: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2439593/Why-father-loved-Britain-Ed-Miliband.html
Mail's Editorial reply: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2439714/Ed-Miliband-evil-legacy-wont-apologise.html
Further article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2439565/As-Ed-Miliband-reacts-angrily-critique-Marxist-father--We-repeat-This-man-did-hate-Britain.html

[Coney]

Coney simply said "Hooray!!!" and posted a link to "Ding! Dong! The Witch is Dead"

Classy.

"Classy" - Is that why you did a 'Like' when I posted it? ;)

[Letters]

That was definitely worth waiting 18 months for.

[Niall_Quinn]

Evil cow, it was a blessing for the world when she croaked, shame it didn't happen at birth. Would have saved a lot of misery.

[Coney]

That was definitely worth waiting 18 months for.

Oh yeah - that reminds me. Weren't you going to get the date/time stamp into the quotes?

[Coney]

That was definitely worth waiting 18 months for.

Also, I've been away. ;)

[Letters]

I'm not sure I was, maybe Jof said he would. He's the vBulliten techie of this parish.

[Xhaka Can’t]

That was definitely worth waiting 18 months for.

:haha:

[mr_brighterside]

bit reach people claiming everyone hates thatcher when she won a load of elections, similar to blair who everyone now declares they hate even though he won an election after the Iraq war started.

I don't think she was perfect (stealing milk not long before I was due to get it :angry: ) but neither were the miners and unions.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Nobody is saying they were perfect. But she was one evil hag.

Blair was a very effective PM until he became a war monger.