Now you can officially start to panic...

[AKBapologist]

Wenger on Cesc:

"We have the clause in the contract so we would be on alert but at the moment that's not something we're after"

Wenger on Signings:

"A lot of money around, not many players"
"We are not close to signing anyone"


Higuain now appears more likely to go to Napoli or Chelsea than Arsenal, we will never out bid RM for Suarez and Rooney probably isn't going anywhere, not for stupid money anyway, and Chav's would have got them if that wasn't the case.

Meanwhile Man City have already signed 2 player's we've been linked with....

Some things never change.

[Letters]

:ilt:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Wenger on Cesc:


Wenger on Signings:



Higuain now appears more likely to go to Napoli or Chelsea than Arsenal, we will never out bid RM for Suarez and Rooney probably isn't going anywhere, not for stupid money anyway, and Chav's would have got them if that wasn't the case.

Meanwhile Man City have already signed 2 player's we've been linked with....

Some things never change.



on cesc - it shows the two of them have clearly been talking, and that wenger will most likely activate the release clause if he can. given there is more to the quote then you posted.

on the others, thats not an encouraging quote, but who listens to wenger anyway, those that claim he is full of bullshit will take this quote as gospel. its just him being wumger, remember he denied knowing who cazorla was about two days before signing him. its worrying but ill judge in september.

on the city signing players we are linked with, only one is jovetic and i dont think he is offically signed yet, the others are hardly world class signings either.

higuain wont go to chelsea, tahts for sure, you dont want to leave madrid because the manager doesnt play you enough, to then go and play for that same manager

[Özim]

on cesc - it shows the two of them have clearly been talking, and that wenger will most likely activate the release clause if he can. given there is more to the quote then you posted.

I'm not sure how you worked that out from what he said. There's no clause he can activate, Cesc doesn't want to leave, Barca don't want to sell.


on the others, thats not an encouraging quote, but who listens to wenger anyway, those that claim he is full of bullshit will take this quote as gospel. its just him being wumger, remember he denied knowing who cazorla was about two days before signing him. its worrying but ill judge in september.

You do, I agree he's a BS merchant but you seem to be quite happy with what he says. As for Cazorla I don't remember that.


on the city signing players we are linked with, only one is jovetic and i dont think he is offically signed yet, the others are hardly world class signings either.

Jovetic looks like he's going to sign, they don't mess about. Negredo scored 29 in 32 games not a bad return and that Brazilian dude is suppose to be pretty decent


higuain wont go to chelsea, tahts for sure, you dont want to leave madrid because the manager doesnt play you enough, to then go and play for that same manager

Maybe not but Napoli is a likely destination then, if he leaves Madrid

[Power n Glory]

We'll have to wait until September. It's a worry but I had a feeling once we'd go out on tour he'd get cold feet on signings. Not sure if he'll sign a striker at all. He'll give Giroud another season.

[AKBapologist]

Re Carzola.
http://www.london24.com/sport/arsenal/arsenal_boss_arsene_wenger_on_spurs_target_i_don_t _know_this_guy_1_1455519


But still, I don't see wenger signing anyone. Not through lack of trying, the rot in our reputation has well and truly set in.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I agree with that - our reputation is shot.

[Özim]

I don't get that article, under the picture it says:


Arsenal's new recruit Santi Cazorla in action for Spain. Picture: Tony Marshall/EMPICS Sport

In addition, I wonder whether he was smiling at the time, are we seriously suppose to believe he hadn't heard of a Spain international, seems tongue in cheek to me.

[Ollie the Optimist]

I'm not sure how you worked that out from what he said. There's no clause he can activate, Cesc doesn't want to leave, Barca don't want to sell.

there is a release clause, everyone has reported it. as i said, barca could be open to offers, if they didnt want to sell, they would say, "hes not for sale" by saying "cesc wants to stay" they have left the door open. two very similar sentances, two very very different meanings.




You do, I agree he's a BS merchant but you seem to be quite happy with what he says. As for Cazorla I don't remember that.

i dont which part of me saying, these quotes worry me is me being happy with what he says but oh well. cazorla comments here http://www.london24.com/sport/arsenal/arsenal_boss_arsene_wenger_on_spurs_target_i_don_t _know_this_guy_1_1455519






Jovetic looks like he's going to sign, they don't mess about. Negredo scored 29 in 32 games not a bad return and that Brazilian dude is suppose to be pretty decent

they look decent, are clearly so well known you know him as that brazilian dude. they are good squad players, who could turn out to be very good, but right now we need world class. you'd be moaning if we signed them and no one else. if at the end of the window, we sign no one, of course ill be jealous of city getting good players but right now we can do much better so I'm not too worried right now



Maybe not but Napoli is a likely destination then, if he leaves Madrid

i think he will end up at napoli now. ive seen a report tonight saying madrid want 37 million for him now. pay the 3million extra for suarez in that case

[Injury Time]

:patrice: need an unhappy version....even the smilies are against us
:ilt:
:ilt: :ilt: :ilt: :ilt:
:ilt: :ilt: :ilt: :ilt:
curses only allowed 10 images ilt ilt

[Özim]

there is a release clause, everyone has reported it. as i said, barca could be open to offers, if they didnt want to sell, they would say, "hes not for sale" by saying "cesc wants to stay" they have left the door open. two very similar sentances, two very very different meanings.

Barca have also said he's untransferable and Cesc has pretty much confirmed it, in addition even if we do have an option it takes two to tango Cesc would need to want to come. Can't see it, he'd want to go to a club who have a realistic chance of winning stuff.



i dont which part of me saying, these quotes worry me is me being happy with what he says but oh well. cazorla comments here http://www.london24.com/sport/arsenal/arsenal_boss_arsene_wenger_on_spurs_target_i_don_t _know_this_guy_1_1455519


See above seems tongue in cheek, plus pic says he's our signing which hardly gives this article credibility


they look decent, are clearly so well known you know him as that brazilian dude. they are good squad players, who could turn out to be very good, but right now we need world class. you'd be moaning if we signed them and no one else. if at the end of the window, we sign no one, of course ill be jealous of city getting good players but right now we can do much better so I'm not too worried right now

I'm not fussed but Jovetic is highly rated apparently and Negredo scored 29 goals in Spain not a bad feat


i think he will end up at napoli now. ive seen a report tonight saying madrid want 37 million for him now. pay the 3million extra for suarez in that case

He probably will as they're loaded, waste of time regarding Suarez we won't bid enough and he won't come anyway.

[Kano]

can someone start another thread about someone we're not going to sign please.

[Ollie the Optimist]

that article, its written on 23rd july. we signed cazorla in august so hey must have updated it. i thought quote was two days before looks like two weeks.

wenger has also said on deadline day or day before that there are no truth in arteta links hours later we sign him.


the fabregas thing, the trophies arguement is slightly redundent in this case, purely because barca are guanreteed trophies, united are not. they are unknown right now, they dont have a great squad, fergie was just an incrediable manager who would win ten points a season on his own. moyes having never won a trophy is a gamble for players. its not as clear cut as who is more likely to win trophies in this case, if it was, hed stay at barca. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23330921 this from the bbc has quotes from barca, not a single one says he isnt for sale, it just says he wants to stay. there is a difference

[Özim]

that article, its written on 23rd july. we signed cazorla in august so hey must have updated it. i thought quote was two days before looks like two weeks.

wenger has also said on deadline day or day before that there are no truth in arteta links hours later we sign him.


the fabregas thing, the trophies arguement is slightly redundent in this case, purely because barca are guanreteed trophies, united are not. they are unknown right now, they dont have a great squad, fergie was just an incrediable manager who would win ten points a season on his own. moyes having never won a trophy is a gamble for players. its not as clear cut as who is more likely to win trophies in this case, if it was, hed stay at barca. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23330921 this from the bbc has quotes from barca, not a single one says he isnt for sale, it just says he wants to stay. there is a difference
Updated an old article to say that he's signed under the picture? Odd

Wenger is a liar, we know that he's lied many times, however with regards signings we know the kind of players he likes, cheap relatively low profile players.

The trophies argument is relevant, if you had a choice you'd want to go to a club who clearly are geared towards winning and Man U fit the bill much, there would probably be others interested. He'd never come back to us, not unless he was content with no silverware, which given the choice you wouldn't be.

Says he's untransferable here:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/10181738/Manchester-United-told-Barcelona-midfielder-Cesc-Fabregas-is-not-available-to-buy.html

[Ollie the Optimist]

Updated an old article to say that he's signed under the picture? Odd

Wenger is a liar, we know that he's lied many times, however with regards signings we know the kind of players he likes, cheap relatively low profile players.

The trophies argument is relevant, if you had a choice you'd want to go to a club who clearly are geared towards winning and Man U fit the bill much, there would probably be others interested. He'd never come back to us, not unless he was content with no silverware, which given the choice you wouldn't be.

Says he's untransferable here:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/10181738/Manchester-United-told-Barcelona-midfielder-Cesc-Fabregas-is-not-available-to-buy.html

that telegraph article, it says a barcalone source. not exactly a huge assurance. the manger himself saying he isnt for sale is a huge statement, he hasnt said that. an anonymous said that, not exactly what fabregas wants to hear.


the cazorla article, updating a photo to say he is signed is odd, but wahts more odd is writing an article with that quote, backdating it two weeks nad publishing it.

the way you are talking is that we will never win a trophy ever again. but i dont think you trophies etc is an arugement with fabregas, i think his relationship with wenger is the key to this. if we did sign a world class striker and cesc, we will trophies ( dont start the whole we wont sign wc players, that shit is boring) if wenger said to cesc, ive got higuain/suarez and if you come, you can win trophies with us, h'll do it. he wont go to united, the emotional bond with us is key here, i just cant see him leaving for united over us, not with wenger in charge

[Niall_Quinn]

I thought Higuain was a real possibility but that looks stone cold now. Rooney, Suarez, never real. Cesc, I haven't seen it confirmed anywhere we get part of the transfer if he moves, but if true we'll take the money rather than spend it every time. They may rush one name in at the very end but I hope that doesn't fool the fans.

We needed to spend that £70mill just to stop the drain and steady things. And we needed to make a strong statement at the start of the window to encourage other players to at least consider us. Now all we see is same old Arsenal. Two billionaires and no signings. They'll be quick enough to take the proceeds though when it comes time to sell up.

[Özim]

that telegraph article, it says a barcalone source. not exactly a huge assurance. the manger himself saying he isnt for sale is a huge statement, he hasnt said that. an anonymous said that, not exactly what fabregas wants to hear.


the cazorla article, updating a photo to say he is signed is odd, but wahts more odd is writing an article with that quote, backdating it two weeks nad publishing it.

the way you are talking is that we will never win a trophy ever again. but i dont think you trophies etc is an arugement with fabregas, i think his relationship with wenger is the key to this. if we did sign a world class striker and cesc, we will trophies ( dont start the whole we wont sign wc players, that shit is boring) if wenger said to cesc, ive got higuain/suarez and if you come, you can win trophies with us, h'll do it. he wont go to united, the emotional bond with us is key here, i just cant see him leaving for united over us, not with wenger in charge
:lol: So your articles are fine but that one isn't, have you listened to yourself?

The relationship with Wenger is iirelevant, Wenger has great relationships with loads of players but they still leave without a 2nd thought. I can't see us winning another trophy under Wenger, I said that quite a while ago and he's yet to show me any different.

We won't sign these big name players you mention, never have, never will, it's not Wenger's style either. You think it's as easy as saying "if you come you'll win trophies with us"....let me put it out there but perhaps he might say, "Arsene you say this but Arsenal haven't won a trophy for a long time and when I was with Arsenal it never happened", actions speak louder than words, you'd have to be a fool to believe him after so long without success and years of promises tbh.

The emotional bond thing is b*llocks sorry, they only have one career and they're not going to choose a club with no chance of winning and no ambition, silverware is a greater pull than any supposed emotional bond in the end.

[Ollie the Optimist]

:lol: So your articles are fine but that one isn't, have you listened to yourself?

no its the people in the articles. one is the barcalona manager, the other is an annoymous source. which one do you listen to if you are a player?


The relationship with Wenger is iirelevant, Wenger has great relationships with loads of players but they still leave without a 2nd thought. I can't see us winning another trophy under Wenger, I said that quite a while ago and he's yet to show me any different.

We won't sign these big name players you mention, never have, never will, it's not Wenger's style either. You think it's as easy as saying "if you come you'll win trophies with us"....let me put it out there but perhaps he might say, "Arsene you say this but Arsenal haven't won a trophy for a long time and when I was with Arsenal it never happened", actions speak louder than words, you'd have to be a fool to believe him after so long without success and years of promises tbh.

The emotional bond thing is b*llocks sorry, they only have one career and they're not going to choose a club with no chance of winning and no ambition, silverware is a greater pull than any supposed emotional bond in the end.

fair enough, but as you say actions speak louder tehn words, so if wenger said, ive actually signed suarez/higuain tahts an action that could convince him.

some players have walked out while having a great relationship thats true. but like fans, there are actually some players out there who might be all about the glory. fans arent glory hunters, some players might not be either, there is that possibilty too.

he has one career true, hes won a few trophies now, so he might want to come back and do something else, and that something else is win a trophy and be a hero not just win a trophy.

[Cripps_orig]

Don't care about the Cesc part.

But the latter part confirms what we all knew.

[fakeyank]

on cesc - it shows the two of them have clearly been talking, and that wenger will most likely activate the release clause if he can. given there is more to the quote then you posted.

on the others, thats not an encouraging quote, but who listens to wenger anyway, those that claim he is full of bullshit will take this quote as gospel. its just him being wumger, remember he denied knowing who cazorla was about two days before signing him. its worrying but ill judge in september.

on the city signing players we are linked with, only one is jovetic and i dont think he is offically signed yet, the others are hardly world class signings either.

higuain wont go to chelsea, tahts for sure, you dont want to leave madrid because the manager doesnt play you enough, to then go and play for that same manager

You are either Arsene Wenger himself or his son/daughter! There is no way in hell a man can be so naive... I havent met Americans who are half as naive as you. You need to be an advocate of positive thinking at terminally ill patients ward!

You will judge Wenger in September? 8 years of BS was not enough?? May be he will sign some douche bag on Aug 31... you know whats going to happen next? There is the settling period because whoever we sign will need a whole fucking season to be what he is supposed to be. Where will we be at? Square fucking one! :ilt:

[Globalgunner]

There is also the possibility he is a paid agent of the club. An agent provocateur to plant b.s.. it's the kind of worthwhile investment that Arsenal fc would deem good business. How many £s per week are you on Ollie. I could deputise for you if you made me an offer.

[Harland]

hey Ollie, can I please ask you a question...

If (hypothetical situation) we don't sign anyone of note this summer, but the club releases a statement implying that we will be active in the market during the January window, will you defend the board / Wenger until January?

Genuine question....

[Xhaka Can’t]

You are either Arsene Wenger himself or his son/daughter!

That is unfair mate.

If he was Wenger's son or daughter, he would have fucked off to supporting a Manchester club - or possibly Barcelona by now.

[Ralpheroo72]

Maybe we will sign that Dung bloke from Vietnam

[Lord Nelson]

Wenger on Cesc:


Wenger on Signings:



Higuain now appears more likely to go to Napoli or Chelsea than Arsenal, we will never out bid RM for Suarez and Rooney probably isn't going anywhere, not for stupid money anyway, and Chav's would have got them if that wasn't the case.

Meanwhile Man City have already signed 2 player's we've been linked with....

Some things never change.
The thing is, we all moan, but there will still be 60,000 Mugs paying an average of £50 to get in!? I stopped my Red Membership three years ago because of this nonsense. I refuse to line the boards pockets!!
The only way to make a point is to stay away fom the Emirates.

[Letters]

The thing is, we all moan, but there will still be 60,000 Mugs paying an average of £50 to get in!? I stopped my Red Membership three years ago because of this nonsense. I refuse to line the boards pockets!!
The only way to make a point is to stay away fom the Emirates.
I gave up my season ticket this year, not just because of the way the club is run although the level of football we're seeing is a factor. We're paying double what we were 10 years ago for a far inferior product. Thing is though, I'm sure someone will snap up my seats, the ground wasn't choc full last season but it was never half empty either. Until people leave en masse there's no reason the board will change policy.

[LDG]

http://soccer.cellc.mobi/wp-content/blogs.dir/2/files/2013/01/Wenger-smiling.jpg

[Gooner23]

My red membership renewed automatically, bit annoyed about it as I would have thought they needed my consent for this. But I'm too lazy to do anything about it, and will probably end up going to 1 or 2 games anyway. But I would'nt even consider paying for a season ticket, crazy money.

As for AW's comments, it does appear to be just same old same old. We may well bring in a half decent player, but it will be right at the end of the window.. and it probably won't be enough. Damn this club is infuriating. They must realise this summer is a real watershed moment, as even the real die-hards will start turning if we don't significantly strengthen.

[Letters]

In 5 years time it'll just be NBN going to games.

[LDG]

Slightly weird take on this I know, but I think there's something in what he's saying "not enough players about".

I don't believe a word that comes out of that man's mouth for one second, and if you haven't learned to just ignore all of this by now then more fool you. That goes for all of them. Ivan, Wenget, Fox.....they're all serial bullshitters. They have a duty to the media and to the shareholders to be open. But you're mugs if you think they're gonna tell you what's "really" going on.

That said. From what I can see, the market is hyper-inflated, and there really aren't that many players about. I'm talking players of the calibre we sold (RVP, Cesc etc). There aren't, because they're already on more money than we can pay them at other super-rich clubs.

The concern for me, is that we are still basing our value of a player, on our own valuation. Moreover, Arsene Wenger's valuation. Which I'm afraid to say is out of sync with the rest of football. Whilst he's out of sync, I still believe he doesn't like spending money. I think it's a moral which id ingrained in him. Couple that with all of his infatuation with polishing turds, it's a cycle he's just never going to come out of.

It was always said that Wenger needed Dien to nudge him (more manhandle I'm sure) into buying the player he wanted. But with the ****s that run this club, happy to hold onto the cash, and with no desire to see the club do anything other than what it is currently doing (making money), there is nobody to kick the manager up the arse.

There was a lot of discussion yesterday about the top four trophy. I'll say it before, and I'll say it again. He's one of only a few managers who could have managed that feat year on year, not spending money. He's a fucking genius. And if he's only spend some money, he would push us into title winning form again I'm sure. He's a briliant football manager.

We have been handicapped, no doubt, but I'm now firmly of the belief that there has always been more money there, and that it is AW's choice not to use it.

He needs to go if he doesn't spend this summer. I feel sorry for him though. I understand his principles. I adore hime for all he has given, and I don't doubt for one second his loyalty, affection and desire to win.

But then again, these ****s that own the club can choose the next laccy.

What a fucking mess.

:(

[Kano]

and it's a model of sustainability for the next set of billionaire owner that take over the club. a template of how to run it at a minimum but still rake it in.

football. yay.

[Ollie the Optimist]

hey Ollie, can I please ask you a question...

If (hypothetical situation) we don't sign anyone of note this summer, but the club releases a statement implying that we will be active in the market during the January window, will you defend the board / Wenger until January?

Genuine question....


No. This is the first time I've felt we genuinely have had money to spend. The other years. I don't think we did, gazidas confirmed it so was happy to defend wenger. If he doesn't spend this summer, there are no excuses.

[Kano]

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/gazidis-we-have-sufficient-funds-to-invest

[Ollie the Optimist]

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/gazidis-we-have-sufficient-funds-to-invest

He also said wenger has performed miracles on a limited budget last Month. What's your point?

[Kano]

they have been spouting the same shit for years. nothing has changed. same old song. i wish i lived in your bubble.

[Niall_Quinn]

and it's a model of sustainability for the next set of billionaire owner that take over the club. a template of how to run it at a minimum but still rake it in.

football. yay.

I think that's all of it, neatly wrapped up in one sentence. The last lot got out with what must rank as the one of the pay-offs of all time. Kroenke will want no less. He says he loves Wenger. I can see why. If I had half a billion quid to invest I'd want Wenger looking after it rather than some bankster prick. AND he's kept us fourth while the club has been transformed into a savings account. We have Kroenke, we have Usmanov - who if he was as desperate to invest as he tries to make out could just write a cheque to show his love, but that's not how rape works. If either of these mega powerful, mega rich men wanted to do an Abramovich they could. Just pick up the phone and order Wenger to spend some fucking money. But no, they are powerless to prevent Wenger building their investments.

[Özim]

they have been spouting the same shit for years. nothing has changed. same old song. i wish i lived in your bubble.
Exactly right, why are his words now any different to what he said before? Seems to me it's just another way of excusing the manager for his inadequacies in the transfer market.

[Niall_Quinn]

Exactly right, why are his words now any different to what he said before? Seems to me it's just another way of excusing the manager for his inadequacies in the transfer market.

Seriously though. How to you jump straight from the finances thing to the Wenger bashing without any kind of analysis in-between?

[Power n Glory]

Even Arseblog is worried.

http://arseblog.com/

[Özim]

There was a lot of discussion yesterday about the top four trophy. I'll say it before, and I'll say it again. He's one of only a few managers who could have managed that feat year on year, not spending money. He's a fucking genius. And if he's only spend some money, he would push us into title winning form again I'm sure. He's a briliant football manager.
Proofs in the pudding as they say and in the last 8 years there's been nothing brilliant about him, elementary errors all over the place and a level of stubborness never seen before in the world of football.

He has spent some money, unfortunately it's also been badly spent on a failed youth scheme (which has cost us money as although we've received some money for some players, we've paid out huge amounts in wages over the years and have had to get rid of others for nothing), unknowns who just have been up to scratch and journeyman available on the cheap.

That money could have been spent much more wisely on quality signings. It's all very good saying he's a brilliant football manager, but a manager is judged on results and the results haven't been good in a number of years, it's also been clear the team has been going backwards in terms of quality and style.

I think he's done at top level management and not capable of out-thinking the managers out there right now.

[LDG]

I think the worry, is that we all KNOW we have money to spend.

Before, nobody was ever dead certain.

We are now. And that means there is only one man in the way of it being spent.

And that is Wenger.

And that means that even the most loyal defender of the realm must be starting to cry.

Except Ollie.

Ollie :bow:

[Kano]

2012

‘What we can do is develop a really solid financial platform for the club that gives us the ability to compete for top players – both top players that we bring in and top players that we want to keep.


2011

We’re certainly not sitting there saying, ‘let’s hold back on our resources’. We’ve got a substantial amount of money that we can invest.”

2010

We have got more money than we've had for a long, long time and we would like to spend it.

[Özim]

Seriously though. How to you jump straight from the finances thing to the Wenger bashing without any kind of analysis in-between?
He's spent money and badly on sh*t players most of the time, that's how. I don't believe this money thing and never have, it's a choice from someone who doesn't like to spend and has indicated as much many times.

[LDG]

Is that Ivan? :lol:

What a ****.

[Marc Overmars]

Not quite ready to panic yet, although at the moment it does understandably feel ominous. After the shameful boast about being in a position to spend you'd think we would have done something by now. We've spent so many years rummaging around the bargain bins, now we have serious money I genuinely think Wenget doesn't know how to use it.

[Ralpheroo72]

There has been a transfer at the Emirates today, £10M has been transferred to wengers Cayman Islands account

[Niall_Quinn]

Less than one month to the kick off and Arsenal FC has scarpered to the other end of the planet leaving the tea lady in charge to handle the bargain hunting. Actually I bet she looks longingly at the Tetley range when she's out and about doing the club's business, before heading off to the special offers shelf.

[Niall_Quinn]

He's spent money and badly on sh*t players most of the time, that's how. I don't believe this money thing and never have, it's a choice from someone who doesn't like to spend and has indicated as much many times.

If Abramovich owned the club would Wenger slap him around and make him his bitch?

[Niall_Quinn]

Not quite ready to panic yet, although at the moment it does understandably feel ominous. After the shameful boast about being in a position to spend you'd think we would have done something by now. We've spent so many years rummaging around the bargain bins, now we have serious money I genuinely think Wenget doesn't know how to use it.

Season after season and you keep forgetting about the waiting period. Just because other clubs don't have the class to observe it doesn't mean we should abandon our principles.

[Özim]

If Abramovich owned the club would Wenger slap him around and make him his bitch?
If Abramovich owned the club Wenger would have been sacked a long long time ago tbh.

[Niall_Quinn]

If Abramovich owned the club Wenger would have been sacked a long long time ago tbh.

So Kroenke must be some sort of weakling idiot then?

[Özim]

So Kroenke must be some sort of weakling idiot then?
He only cares about profits as long as those roll in, who cares about the football side....he's a businessman at the end of the day what happens on the pitch is inconsequential to him.

Wenger has money to spend if he wants to, but if he chooses not to spend it that's fine too as long as the money keeps rolling in.

[Niall_Quinn]

He only cares about profits as long as those roll in, who cares about the football side....he's a businessman at the end of the day what happens on the pitch is inconsequential to him.

Wenger has money to spend if he wants to, but if he chooses not to spend it that's fine too as long as the money keeps rolling in.

Okay, so Kroenke leaves it all up to Wenger? He manages his investment on the basis of so far so good but Wenger could spend a fortune any moment? And then trusts he doesn't? In other words Kroenke has invested on the understanding Wenger is some sort of hoarder and skinflint and he's so confident of that assessment he has no safeguards in place and applies no direction or control? A fool and his money.

[Özim]

Okay, so Kroenke leaves it all up to Wenger? He manages his investment on the basis of so far so good but Wenger could spend a fortune any moment? And then trusts he doesn't? In other words Kroenke has invested on the understanding Wenger is some sort of hoarder and skinflint and he's so confident of that assessment he has no safeguards in place and applies no direction or control? A fool and his money.
Pretty much yes, he's said he trusts Wenger and likes they way he works.

He manages his investment based on the profits returned, he's seen Wenger's record regarding profit so trusts him on that score. If Wenger wanted to spend he could, there would be more pressure on him to get us higher up the table and competing for trophies of course (thus increasing revenue and achieving the right profit level), but Wenger is content making the profits and staying 4th without going for the risky spending tactic.

It would be a risk for Wenger to spend and clearly he's not willing to take that risk, he's risk averse.

[Kano]

you have it the wrong way round. the owners don't want to spend the money. they control it. the ceo is the budget holder. that is the case in every business - even if a director is given permission to make decisions.

they have just got very lucky in that wenger is shares their principles and will go along with the set up as they see it. sure, that makes him all kinds of not very nice things but ultimately, if the men upstairs wanted to spend, they'd find a man that did so. clearly they don't.

[Özim]

Whilst the owners are happy not spending, should he want it Wenger could have money, however expectations would change and top 4 would no longer be adequate, we'd have to move up a level and compete to maintain a similar level of profits.

Too risky for Wenger IMO.

I agree they're quite happy with the situation though, as is Wenger and like you said if they were interested in the football side and wanted someone to spend, Wenger wouldn't be there.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Whilst the owners are happy not spending, should he want it Wenger could have money, however expectations would change and top 4 would no longer be adequate, we'd have to move up a level and compete to maintain a similar level of profits.

Too risky for Wenger IMO.

You say it's only wenger who doesn't spend etc, why hasn't gazidas or Kronos etc told him to go away, leave the money to them. Wenger says he wants Suarez, they turn round amd say we don't care how much he's worth, don't worry we will go get him. You blame wenger entirely for not spending but nothing on gazidas. What is stopping him doing that? Like dein did

[Cripps_orig]

I blame Wenger entirely cos hes our manager

[Özim]

You say it's only wenger who doesn't spend etc, why hasn't gazidas or Kronos etc told him to go away, leave the money to them. Wenger says he wants Suarez, they turn round amd say we don't care how much he's worth, don't worry we will go get him. You blame wenger entirely for not spending but nothing on gazidas. What is stopping him doing that? Like dein did
Because they are quite happy with him not spending as long as the profits remain the same. As I said if Wenger chose to spend he'd have to up his game and top 4 would no longer be enough.

[LDG]

Fuck it.

It doesn't matter.

What does matter, is that if we don't spend, and spend of quality very soon, we can kiss fourth place goodbye anyway. Last chance to stop the rot.

Will they spend? That is the question.

[Cripps_orig]

We need any new signings before the emirates cup so they have at least a couple of games.

Can't see it happening

[Özim]

We need any new signings before the emirates cup so they have at least a couple of games.

Can't see it happening
Emirates cup, first trophy of the season :bow:

[Özim]

Fuck it.

It doesn't matter.

What does matter, is that if we don't spend, and spend of quality very soon, we can kiss fourth place goodbye anyway. Last chance to stop the rot.

Will they spend? That is the question.
Not too worried about 4th, always seem to somehow get the rub of the green and end up there.

What's more worrying is seeing yet another carbon copy of previous season, sh*t football, crashing out of all competitions early then putting a mini run of results at the end of the season (albeit labouring to many of them).

[LDG]

Not too worried about 4th, always seem to somehow get the rub of the green and end up there.

What's more worrying is seeing yet another carbon copy of previous season, sh*t football, crashing out of all competitions early then putting a mini run of results at the end of the season (albeit labouring to many of them).

Makes me wonder why you bother.

[Özim]

Makes me wonder why you bother.
Makes me wonder too, I can't say I enjoy it anymore.

Wenger Entertainment :bow:

[Niall_Quinn]

I blame Wenger entirely cos hes our manager

Yes, he's the manager. That's the point. Arsenal is not a hobby, it's a business. Businesses have structure and hierarchy, owners and employees. Why does the buck stop halfway up the chain of command for you? You blame and employee, okay fair enough Wenger plays his role too, but you stop at that and ignore the guys who are responsible (by law) for the money.

[Niall_Quinn]

Fuck it.

It doesn't matter.

What does matter, is that if we don't spend, and spend of quality very soon, we can kiss fourth place goodbye anyway. Last chance to stop the rot.

Will they spend? That is the question.

We say that every year and every year Wenger scrapes 4th place. I don't see the coming season as being any different. Only thing that will change is the profitability of the club, which will go up.

[Injury Time]

We need any new signings before the emirates cup so they have at least a couple of games.

Can't see it happening


Emirates cup, first trophy of the season :bow:

Guaranteed 4th :trophy:

[Power n Glory]

Yes, he's the manager. That's the point. Arsenal is not a hobby, it's a business. Businesses have structure and hierarchy, owners and employees. Why does the buck stop halfway up the chain of command for you? You blame and employee, okay fair enough Wenger plays his role too, but you stop at that and ignore the guys who are responsible (by law) for the money.

Unless you want a Abramovich situation, the Board can’t tell Wenger how to run his team. They’ve provided the funds and taken care of the business side of things so we’re now generating more money but they can’t tell Wenger who to sign and how he manages the finances. It’s his choice and the best thing they can do is set the challenge and see if he can deliver. Now that they’re saying the period of transition is over, we’ll see if they grow a pair. They have no excuse now and I can understand why they’d be cautious whilst building a new stadium. But I hold Wenger accountable for the garbage players we’ve signed. We’ve wasted good money on players like Gervinho, Santos, Chamakh, Squallci, players that he’s tossed on to the useless pile after one season. You buy cheap you buy twice. But the Board have to really take a hold of this situation now. No more excuses. Just like when you have to stop blasting a useless player, you soon have to start looking at the manager for picking him. The Boards time is coming and I’d be seriously pissed off if he fails again yet they offer him a new deal.

[Kano]

the board have been telling us for years there is money to spend and have done zilch about it in regards to pushing wenger, so don't expect a change anytime soon.

[Özim]

the board have been telling us for years there is money to spend and have done zilch about it in regards to pushing wenger, so don't expect a change anytime soon.
They work on the "It's a lovely day, just got paid, stack it up be on my way" principal and so does Wenger.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Unless you want a Abramovich situation, the Board can’t tell Wenger how to run his team. They’ve provided the funds and taken care of the business side of things so we’re now generating more money but they can’t tell Wenger who to sign and how he manages the finances. It’s his choice and the best thing they can do is set the challenge and see if he can deliver. Now that they’re saying the period of transition is over, we’ll see if they grow a pair. They have no excuse now and I can understand why they’d be cautious whilst building a new stadium. But I hold Wenger accountable for the garbage players we’ve signed. We’ve wasted good money on players like Gervinho, Santos, Chamakh, Squallci, players that he’s tossed on to the useless pile after one season. You buy cheap you buy twice. But the Board have to really take a hold of this situation now. No more excuses. Just like when you have to stop blasting a useless player, you soon have to start looking at the manager for picking him. The Boards time is coming and I’d be seriously pissed off if he fails again yet they offer him a new deal.

As you say, they can't tell him how to run his team, but asking who he wants to sign, then telling him not to worry about the money side, they will sort that, is not an abrovmich situation it is what should happen. Wenger didn't mind it when dein did it. The board need to tell him to worry about football side, identiy targets amd them leave the signing of them up to them while we focuses on training players.

[Power n Glory]

the board have been telling us for years there is money to spend and have done zilch about it in regards to pushing wenger, so don't expect a change anytime soon.

That’s true but they’re not going to take high risks when in the middle of the transition. It wouldn’t make sense to rock the boat then so I can understand the caution, especially when none of them at that level have a deep understanding of the game. This season, there has been a clear message sent out by them and it’s not the same as saying he has money to spend. There has been more clarity about our ambition and intention for this season.

[Kano]

That’s true but they’re not going to take high risks when in the middle of the transition. It wouldn’t make sense to rock the boat then so I can understand the caution, especially when none of them at that level have a deep understanding of the game. This season, there has been a clear message sent out by them and it’s not the same as saying he has money to spend. There has been more clarity about our ambition and intention for this season.
three years ago we were told we had more money than ever before and intended to spend it - last season we had the money to spend on big players apparently. the clarity has always been there and the message, along with the type of activity, remains the same unfortunately.

[Power n Glory]

three years ago we were told we had more money than ever before and intended to spend it - last season we had the money to spend on big players apparently. the clarity has always been there and the message, along with the type of activity, remains the same unfortunately.

When have they ever been as clear to say that we can afford a player like Wayne Rooney plus wages? This time last year, PHW was saying we couldn’t afford RVP’s wages and this year we’re firmly saying we can. If the club said he had money, we’d always wonder how much he’d have to spend. If a figure was batted around, we’d all wonder if that included wages.

The buzz is all around the dressing room and the expectation for a big signing is there like never before. Besides the finances, the talk around town is that we’re going for the title this year. There is way more transparency.

[Kano]

they could tell us anything, why does it matter? the media position themselves as portrayers of the truth, yet we know how honest that is. so releasing a statement, answering a question or telling the world you have money to burn is as tangible as saying nothing at all. given the size of the deals that have rolled in, they have to give out some pr nonsense about it, to drag the fans along through the summer. the players have been talking about the same nonsense rumours we have on here and the players always talk up our chances of the title, before it disappears off the radar come november.

there is no transparency when you cannot actually see anything bar a smokescreen full of words, rumours and actual, real time, inactivity.

[AKBapologist]

Meanwhile, Higuain confirms chav's are interested....
http://gossip.ladyarse.com/arsenal/2013/07/18/chelsea-make-higuain-offer-higuain-speaks-allegedly/

[Power n Glory]

As you say, they can't tell him how to run his team, but asking who he wants to sign, then telling him not to worry about the money side, they will sort that, is not an abrovmich situation it is what should happen. Wenger didn't mind it when dein did it. The board need to tell him to worry about football side, identiy targets amd them leave the signing of them up to them while we focuses on training players.

As Ivan said at a AGM meeting, it makes sense for the manager to involved with the process. But you have to wonder how bad Wenger wants a striker this season. Will he blow the budget on one massive signing or have a gamble with Giroud?

[LDG]

Meanwhile, Higuain confirms chav's are interested....
http://gossip.ladyarse.com/arsenal/2013/07/18/chelsea-make-higuain-offer-higuain-speaks-allegedly/

Allegedly.

[Power n Glory]

they could tell us anything, why does it matter? the media position themselves as portrayers of the truth, yet we know how honest that is. so releasing a statement, answering a question or telling the world you have money to burn is as tangible as saying nothing at all. given the size of the deals that have rolled in, they have to give out some pr nonsense about it, to drag the fans along through the summer. the players have been talking about the same nonsense rumours we have on here and the players always talk up our chances of the title, before it disappears off the radar come november.

there is no transparency when you cannot actually see anything bar a smokescreen full of words, rumours and actual, real time, inactivity.

Have you read what Gazdis said recently regarding this season and the funds?

[Ollie the Optimist]

As Ivan said at a AGM meeting, it makes sense for the manager to involved with the process. But you have to wonder how bad Wenger wants a striker this season. Will he blow the budget on one massive signing or have a gamble with Giroud?

Wells he bid for 30 million for Suarez so to me it looks like he does want a striker. You don't bid double your transfer record if you want to gamble with Giroud. So I think he does want one, wether he gets one is a different matter.

It does make sense for a manager to be involved but only to a point. If the board are saying we have the money don't worry, and he's worrying, that is not sensible. The board then need to tell him to leave it to them. He's identified a target, they will get him the target.

[LDG]

As Ivan said at a AGM meeting, it makes sense for the manager to involved with the process. But you have to wonder how bad Wenger wants a striker this season. Will he blow the budget on one massive signing or have a gamble with Giroud?

It's like with all things on Wenger's wishlist; The best at the cheapest price possible.

Until he realises that you can't always have a bargain, he will continue to keep ducking deals when the price goes too high, and the formular on his spreasheet says #value!

[Letters]

Not too worried about 4th, always seem to somehow get the rub of the green and end up there.
Nah. You don't finish 4th every year by luck.

[Power n Glory]

Wells he bid for 30 million for Suarez so to me it looks like he does want a striker. You don't bid double your transfer record if you want to gamble with Giroud. So I think he does want one, wether he gets one is a different matter.

It does make sense for a manager to be involved but only to a point. If the board are saying we have the money don't worry, and he's worrying, that is not sensible. The board then need to tell him to leave it to them. He's identified a target, they will get him the target.

Why not bid £30 for Higuain or just meet Real's asking price and be done with it?

[GP]

Nah. You don't finish 4th every year by luck.

4th is easy.

Apparently.

[Kano]

Have you read what Gazdis said recently regarding this season and the funds?
good for him. i read the same last year too.

[LDG]

4th is easy.

Apparently.

Sperz :pal:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Why not bid £30 for Higuain or just meet Real's asking price and be done with it?

Why not indeed? It doesn't help when you agree a 25 million deal then at the last second Madrid turn around amd go yeah actually we want 37 million. Adding 13 million on is huge and bound to make anyone take a second look amd see If there are others.

But you still haven't answered my question, what is stopping the board in turning around to wenger amd telling him to not worry about the price, we will sort it like dein did

[Kano]

when have madrid asked for 37m? in fact, when was the bar set at any price?

[Power n Glory]

good for him. i read the same last year too.

Really? He was that specific last year about the sort of player we could afford?

[Power n Glory]

Why not indeed? It doesn't help when you agree a 25 million deal then at the last second Madrid turn around amd go yeah actually we want 37 million. Adding 13 million on is huge and bound to make anyone take a second look amd see If there are others.

But you still haven't answered my question, what is stopping the board in turning around to wenger amd telling him to not worry about the price, we will sort it like dein did

Did we table a bid?

No idea to be honest. Maybe because it wouldn't be wise to blow the budget on a player Wenger isn't dead set on buying. We also have other poistions to think about too.

[Kano]

Really? He was that specific last year about the sort of player we could afford?
yes. you do realise that just because they say they can afford rooney, doesn't make it true they would ever seriously ever entertain the idea, right?

[Ollie the Optimist]

when have madrid asked for 37m? in fact, when was the bar set at any price?

It's in today's papers, namely the times. Pretty much all media outlets reported we had 25 million pound deal agreed, they wouldn't have let him discuss personal terms if no offer was made. Upping a deal by a couple of million and you think, just pay it. 13 million? Makes you think twice

[GP]

It's in today's papers, namely the times. Pretty much all media outlets reported we had 25 million pound deal agreed, they wouldn't have let him discuss personal terms if no offer was made. Upping a deal by a couple of million and you think, just pay it. 13 million? Makes you think twice

Don't you realise how media reports work?

Suits an agenda = gospel truth

Doesn't suit an agenda = bullshit

[Kano]

so basically, nothing official from anywhere? let's not forget. higuains dad was supposed to hold the irrefutable truth by being, well just by being his dad. look how that turned out. just think for a minute how on earth would anyone in the media be privy to what would have been a one off conversation like that.

[Özim]

when have madrid asked for 37m? in fact, when was the bar set at any price?
When we made our imaginary 23 million pound bid. Perez turned it down then woke up and told everyone he wants to keep him.

[Özim]

Nah. You don't finish 4th every year by luck.
I said we get the rub of the green, I didn't say it was purely down to luck. Let's face it things do seem to fall into place for us in a strange way.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Did we table a bid?

No idea to be honest. Maybe because it wouldn't be wise to blow the budget on a player Wenger isn't dead set on buying. We also have other poistions to think about too.

I think if wenger has said I want Suarez but won't pay over 35 million or along those lines, the board can assume he wants him and would play him if he was signed regardless of cost.
Very true we do have other positions to think about, but this is where the board have to take control. Wenger gives them names, he lists targets in order of importance and while having an understanding of our budget, the board get to work . They then negotiate, keep in contact with wenger but don't let him tell them what a player is worth. They are in control of that not him. They worry about the money, he worries about the team

[Ollie the Optimist]

When we made our imaginary 23 million pound bid. Perez turned it down then woke up and told everyone he wants to keep him.


Funny how you believed reports that Napoli made a bid though.

[Ollie the Optimist]

so basically, nothing official from anywhere? let's not forget. higuains dad was supposed to hold the irrefutable truth by being, well just by being his dad. look how that turned out. just think for a minute how on earth would anyone in the media be privy to what would have been a one off conversation like that.

Higuains dad/agent gave a direct quote to the media saying Madrid had given them permission to discuss personal terms with us. That's pretty official

[Özim]

so basically, nothing official from anywhere? let's not forget. higuains dad was supposed to hold the irrefutable truth by being, well just by being his dad. look how that turned out. just think for a minute how on earth would anyone in the media be privy to what would have been a one off conversation like that.
Nothing has been confirmed by anyone we can trust basically, until something is confirmed by both parties and a player is as good as signed I won't believe any of this BS about pipedream signings.

[Özim]

Higuains dad/agent gave a direct quote to the media saying Madrid had given them permission to discuss personal terms with us. That's pretty official
and how do you know that exactly?

If you believe this sh*t he also said "in the same way as Juventus" regarding an offer and yet Juve had signed Tevez and Llorente so I doubt they'd have signed another striker.

[Letters]

I said we get the rub of the green, I didn't say it was purely down to luck. Let's face it things do seem to fall into place for us in a strange way.
Things didn't just fall into place for us. Our run in results were: P16 W12 D3 L1.

[Ollie the Optimist]

and how do you know that exactly?

Because funnily enough the media aren't allowed to just make up quotes. If they do that they say an anonymous source said...

[Ollie the Optimist]

Nothing has been confirmed by anyone we can trust basically, until something is confirmed by both parties and a player is as good as signed I won't believe any of this BS about pipedream signings.


But will believe any bid made by another club for a player we have been linked too.

[Power n Glory]

yes. you do realise that just because they say they can afford rooney, doesn't make it true they would ever seriously ever entertain the idea, right?

Last year PHW said we couldn’t afford RVP’s wages and the party line was that we couldn’t compete with financially doped up clubs. We develop players and we identify value in the market. It’s ambitious talk this year. If they fail to live up to the hype this year, it won’t be forgiven. The hype hasnm#t been the same this year.

[AKBapologist]

Things didn't just fall into place for us. Our run in results were: P16 W12 D3 L1.

How would he know? Zimm never watches the games anyway.

[Kano]

Higuains dad/agent gave a direct quote to the media saying Madrid had given them permission to discuss personal terms with us. That's pretty official
which was two weeks ago and contradicted by their president and since then, nothing. i'm not inclined to believe either of them - although perez even less so - because they are dodgy spaniards working a deal.

i've got no reason not to believe ian ayre of liverpool, despite him being a scouser, nor the president of napoli, who also is a dodgy italian but as far as i know no history of bs like perez.

it's like us saying we can afford rooney's wages. great. brilliant. i'm sure that we can. but at the moment the words mean nothing until someone backs them up, from somewhere.

[Özim]

Things didn't just fall into place for us. Our run in results were: P16 W12 D3 L1.
We were largely sh*t in that run (performance wise) tbf, we got the results but rode our luck. In addition Spurs totally blew it from being 7 points ahead, it was a collapse of proportions we're familiar with.

So we did get the our fair share of luck along the way, if the rest of the league hadn't been so sh*t we'd have been nowhere near 4th place, we're just lucky it was last season.

[Özim]

But will believe any bid made by another club for a player we have been linked too.
I don't believe anything, but it's more feasible that a club who spend money and have a record of signing top players might make a bid. It's not feasible with us, both the manager and club are stingy f*cks.

[Letters]

We were largely sh*t in that run (performance wise) tbf, we got the results but rode our luck. In addition Spurs totally blew it from being 7 points ahead, it was a collapse of proportions we're familiar with.

So we did get the our fair share of luck along the way.
Again: P16 W12 D3 L1. It's pretty exceptional.
We were poor in some of those games but our defence was generally solid and saw us through. You don't go on a run like that by luck.
And if you look at Spurs' results in the run in they certainly didn't collapse, I posted some analysis of their run-in a while back. I can't be arsed repeating it but if you look at some of the fixtures they had and the results they got they hardly collapsed. Our run was just too good.

[Ollie the Optimist]

I don't believe anything, but it's more feasible that a club who spend money and have a record of signing top players might make a bid. It's not feasible with us, both the manager and club are stingy f*cks.

With regards to Higuain amd the Napoli bid. Tell me their record of signing top players. You say you don't believe anything, as soon as we are mentioned with x player you refuse to acknowledge we would even bid for them, yet as soon as the papers who reported us and player x say club y want player x you go along with that.

[Letters]

With regards to Higuain amd the Napoli bid. Tell me their record of signing top players. You say you don't believe anything, as soon as we are mentioned with x player you refuse to acknowledge we would even bid for them, yet as soon as the papers who reported us and player x say club y want player x you go along with that.
You're not accusing Zimm of shifting goalposts are you? :sulk:

[Özim]

Again: P16 W12 D3 L1. It's pretty exceptional.
We were poor in some of those games but our defence was generally solid and saw us through. You don't go on a run like that by luck.
And if you look at Spurs' results in the run in they certainly didn't collapse, I posted some analysis of their run-in a while back. I can't be arsed repeating it but if you look at some of the fixtures they had and the results they got they hardly collapsed. Our run was just too good.
No it isn't if, you look at how we performed on paper it looks great but the reality is we weren't great and yet that run makes it look like we were in top form and brushing sides aside.

The league wasn't great quality wise last season, that much was clear so that helped us somewhat. At one stage we were miles behind and needed some sort of miracle and them miracle did somehow occur. Did anyone think we'd catch them from 7 point behind after losing to them? I doubt it and to do so we needed more than a little helping hand from them.

We know the team lacks quality, we also so how our standard of play has fallen, it was commented on many times last season and yet we ended up top 4. For a side of our quality to stay in the top 4 is impressive, but perhaps it paints a damming picture of the quality of the opposition as well that a side like us waltzed our way to 4th place.

[Özim]

With regards to Higuain amd the Napoli bid. Tell me their record of signing top players. You say you don't believe anything, as soon as we are mentioned with x player you refuse to acknowledge we would even bid for them, yet as soon as the papers who reported us and player x say club y want player x you go along with that.
They've just collected 55 million, they need a replacement striker. Enough said really.

I don't believe our bids because quite frankly we are a joke in the transfer market and have been for years.

[Ollie the Optimist]

They've just collected 55 million, they need a replacement striker. Enough said really.

I don't believe our bids because quite frankly we are a joke in the transfer market and have been for years.


:banghead: how can you not believe our bid when you believe someone else has bid instead when IT'S THE SAME BLOODY PAPER REPORTING IT

You either believe both their stories, or none.

[Ollie the Optimist]

You're not accusing Zimm of shifting goalposts are you? :sulk:

Shifting them? He's converted them into bloody rugby goalposts

[Harland]

You say it's only wenger who doesn't spend etc, why hasn't gazidas or Kronos etc told him to go away, leave the money to them. Wenger says he wants Suarez, they turn round amd say we don't care how much he's worth, don't worry we will go get him. You blame wenger entirely for not spending but nothing on gazidas. What is stopping him doing that? Like dein did

I honestly blame the board. But I blame Wenger for not standing up to them. Which is why I want the next manager to be Mourinho, someone who is able to shift the pressures from himself onto the board.

Of course I might be entirely wrong and that they are in it together....

[Ollie the Optimist]

I honestly blame the board. But I blame Wenger for not standing up to them. Which is why I want the next manager to be Mourinho, someone who is able to shift the pressures from himself onto the board.

Of course I might be entirely wrong and that they are in it together....

Mourinho would take all of wengers good work of getting the club through the transition stage and becoming financially better, piss it up the wall, sulk of in two years time and leave the club in a much worse state

[GP]

Anyone who wants Mourinho honestly has no idea what it means to be an Arsenal fan.

[Letters]

No it isn't if, you look at how we performed on paper it looks great but the reality is we weren't great and yet that run makes it look like we were in top form and brushing sides aside.
That run looks like we were winning a lot of games. We were. It was the reason we finished in the top 4, you don't do it by luck.
I agree to an extent about the quality of the league and our quality but I don't see how that's relevant.
No, I didn't think we'd finish above Spurs after being 7 points behind them but then I didn't expect us to go on that sort of run. If you look at Spurs' run in game by game they only dropped points in one game you'd really expect them to win - Fulham at home. But that is somewhat mitigated by them beating City at home (who were on an excellent run) and drawing away at Chelsea (who dropped very few points at home last year). Their run-in results were excellent, ours were just better.

We hardly waltzed into the top 4, we snuck in there on the last day and only did so by going on the sort of run which if you extrapolate over a season is championship form. I agree we didn't look convincing but as you'd be the first to say it's all about results and we got them.

[Harland]

Anyone who wants Mourinho honestly has no idea what it means to be an Arsenal fan.

FOH with your holier than thou attitude.

so Mr True Arsenal fan, let me get your sacred opinion then.

Is Wenger or the board responsible for the refusal to spend any sort of money?

Is being a true Arsenal fan contented with prioritising a financial model that requires us to consistently sell our best players and to never be competitive?

I guess yes, I'm not a true Arsenal fan if so. You can have that you miserable twat.

[GP]

Is Wenger or the board responsible for the refusal to spend any sort of money?


Yes

[Harland]

Mourinho would take all of wengers good work of getting the club through the transition stage and becoming financially better, piss it up the wall, sulk of in two years time and leave the club in a much worse state

Let me rephrase, someone 'like' Mourinho who is not afraid to make statements and therefore give us as fans a better idea of what is actually going on. Right now, our state of being financially better is translating to the board level, and not club level on the pitch so as of now there is no evidence to suggest that our financial model is actually doing AFC, a football club any service. Evidence is pointing that it is doing well for AFC if viewed as a pure business entity.

[Harland]

Yes

I guess you don't know the meaning of 'or' then. I hope true Arsenal fans don't have to be of minimum literacy as well.

[GP]

Yes, Wenger or the board are responsible for the lack of signings (so far)

[LDG]

Everyone's on wierd pills this week.

Including me :wacko:

[Özim]

:banghead: how can you not believe our bid when you believe someone else has bid instead when IT'S THE SAME BLOODY PAPER REPORTING IT

You either believe both their stories, or none.
Read my post again and then come back.

[Kano]

Mourinho would take all of wengers good work of getting the club through the transition stage and becoming financially better, piss it up the wall, sulk of in two years time and leave the club in a much worse state
mourinho is worse than a war criminal but whoever comes in next won't be around for a long time. wenger is the last dinosaur left roaming an extended tenure. 3 year managerial deals all round for minimal risk for the club and keeping a managers 'options' open. they are all as devious as players now in seeking their next 'project'.

[LDG]

mourinho is worse than a war criminal but whoever comes in next won't be around for a long time. wenger is the last dinosaur left roaming an extended tenure. 3 year managerial deals all round for minimal risk for the club and keeping a managers 'options' open. they are all as devious as players now in seeking their next 'project'.

Completely digressing, but I'm actually suprised that Klopp geezer is staying on at Dortmund. He must be the next big mover shirley?

[Ollie the Optimist]

mourinho is worse than a war criminal but whoever comes in next won't be around for a long time. wenger is the last dinosaur left roaming an extended tenure. 3 year managerial deals all round for minimal risk for the club and keeping a managers 'options' open. they are all as devious as players now in seeking their next 'project'.


If you are talking about us, then yes I can't see a new manager being here too long, or at least not being offered a long contract at first, but in football, it's not quite as you say. United offered moyes a 6 year deal for example.

Doesn't matter wether it's short term or long, there is no point getting a manager in who will just piss the last 8 years up against the wall

[Özim]

That run looks like we were winning a lot of games. We were. It was the reason we finished in the top 4, you don't do it by luck.
I agree to an extent about the quality of the league and our quality but I don't see how that's relevant.
No, I didn't think we'd finish above Spurs after being 7 points behind them but then I didn't expect us to go on that sort of run. If you look at Spurs' run in game by game they only dropped points in one game you'd really expect them to win - Fulham at home. But that is somewhat mitigated by them beating City at home (who were on an excellent run) and drawing away at Chelsea (who dropped very few points at home last year). Their run-in results were excellent, ours were just better.

We hardly waltzed into the top 4, we snuck in there on the last day and only did so by going on the sort of run which if you extrapolate over a season is championship form. I agree we didn't look convincing but as you'd be the first to say it's all about results and we got them.
The problem with this run IMO, is as you've just highlighted it can be used to make things look fantastic. Wenger could easily point to this as a good reason why we don't really need transfers but the reality is it's a bit deceiving as the stats of that run really don't show how good a side we are. Looking at the figures alone we look like a fantastic side, which clearly isn't the case (your championship form comments reaffirms that and yet we're nothing like a championship winning team).

People have been saying you don't finish top 4 through luck, obviously it's not luck alone but there are lucky breaks along the way which certainly give you a helping hand and we've had our fair share over the years.

[Kano]

Completely digressing, but I'm actually suprised that Klopp geezer is staying on at Dortmund. He must be the next big mover shirley?
i guess he has a personal point against bayern to get out of his system but with lewandowski now gone next summer, he'll be at the same airport moving on too.

[Özim]

Completely digressing, but I'm actually suprised that Klopp geezer is staying on at Dortmund. He must be the next big mover shirley?
Not that surprised, they've spent 20 odd million on that guy Liverpool wanted so they are re-investing and backing the manager. He's got a good little project going on there in a flourishing league, where's he's loved and has a talented bunch of players.

[Cripps_orig]

I guess you don't know the meaning of 'or' then. I hope true Arsenal fans don't have to be of minimum literacy as well.

:haha:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Not that surprised, they've spent 20 odd million on that guy Liverpool wanted so they are re-investing and backing the manager. He's got a good little project going on there in a flourishing league, where's he's loved and has a talented bunch of players.

When you consider who Liverpool have spent 20 million on in recent seasons, it doesn't help your point very much.

I also find it very interesting how you praise Dortmund for backing their manager with signings.

[Özim]

I guess you don't know the meaning of 'or' then. I hope true Arsenal fans don't have to be of minimum literacy as well.
:lol:

[Özim]

When you consider who Liverpool have spent 20 million on in recent seasons, it doesn't help your point very much.

I also find it very interesting how you praise Dortmund for backing their manager with signings.
Klopp seems to have an eye for talent so who Liverpool are interested in is kinda irrelevant.

I praise them because they've gone out spent the money they've got from sales and have a manager happy to spend it on the team. Plenty to praise there IMO. Not ideal to have to sell their best players but they're not in the same league (not literally) as Bayern and thus most German players will want to move to Bayern if they can, at least Dortmund are replacing them (the fact this guy costs 20 million suggests he must be pretty good).

Dortmund also have a whole team of top players so the loss of one or two isn't as damaging as it could be to smaller clubs.

[Letters]

The problem with this run IMO, is as you've just highlighted it can be used to make things look fantastic. Wenger could easily point to this as a good reason why we don't really need transfers but the reality is it's a bit deceiving as the stats of that run really don't show how good a side we are. Looking at the figures alone we look like a fantastic side, which clearly isn't the case (your championship form comments reaffirms that and yet we're nothing like a championship winning team).

People have been saying you don't finish top 4 through luck, obviously it's not luck alone but there are lucky breaks along the way which certainly give you a helping hand and we've had our fair share over the years.
I literally don't think anyone, not even Ollie, thinks we're a fantastic side. But we're not that bad either. Riding your luck at times or no, you don't go on a run like that if you're that awful.
Over time we get some good luck and some bad. Over 38 games they say it generally evens out, certainly you can't keep finishing top 4 year after year by sheer dumb luck. If Wenger or the side were as bad as you make out we'd be nowhere near the top 4.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Klopp seems to have an eye for talent so who Liverpool are interested in is kinda irrelevant.

I praise them because they've gone out spent the money they've got from sales and have a manager happy to spend it on the team. Plenty to praise there IMO. Not ideal to have to sell their best players but they're not in the same league (not literally) as Bayern and thus most German players will want to move to Bayern if they can, at least Dortmund are replacing them (the fact this guy costs 20 million suggests he must be pretty good).

Dortmund also have a whole team of top players so the loss of one or two isn't as damaging as it could be to smaller clubs.

Price tags prove nothing. We all know that so saying he cost 20 million shows he is good is bullshit.

Dortmund are in the same league as bayern, year before they were league champions, next year they reach champions league and lose by 1 goal to bayern. In terms of history, yes no where near but in footballing terms, they are so that argument doesn't work, the players must be leaving for another reason.

[Harland]

Price tags prove nothing. We all know that so saying he cost 20 million shows he is good is bullshit.

Dortmund are in the same league as bayern, year before they were league champions, next year they reach champions league and lose by 1 goal to bayern. In terms of history, yes no where near but in footballing terms, they are so that argument doesn't work, the players must be leaving for another reason.

Maybe they are leaving for money...

Let's not consider ****s like Adebayor and Ashley Cole...

Our best players are leaving us because they do not believe the club's goals align with their own. I think thats a far more disturbing trend that we are facing.

[Özim]

Price tags prove nothing. We all know that so saying he cost 20 million shows he is good is bullshit.

Dortmund are in the same league as bayern, year before they were league champions, next year they reach champions league and lose by 1 goal to bayern. In terms of history, yes no where near but in footballing terms, they are so that argument doesn't work, the players must be leaving for another reason.
I disagree, usually price tag reflects how in demand a player is and how well he performs, it's not always the case (as there's always a small percentage who don't live up to expectations) but much of the time it is.

Dortmund just don't have the pull of Bayern, neither do they have the finances (they almost went bust a while back), historically Bayern are the biggest club in Germany and you can see from their spending power they're one of the biggest clubs in the world.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Price tags reflect nothing these days. Using your logic, Stewart downing is better then Cazorla because he cost 6 million more. It used to be the case that prices were reflective but now with most clubs just throwing money it doesn't. Van Persie went at 25, some shakthar bloke signed for city this summer at 34 million.

[Özim]

Price tags reflect nothing these days. Using your logic, Stewart downing is better then Cazorla because he cost 6 million more. It used to be the case that prices were reflective but now with most clubs just throwing money it doesn't. Van Persie went at 25, some shakthar bloke signed for city this summer at 34 million.
We only got Cazorla cheaper because Malaga were hard up, so we snapped him up cheap.

Generally price tag represents the quality of a player, it's not always the case as there's some undiscovered stars out there but on the whole you get what you pay for.

Again RVP only went for 25 million as he didnt have long left on his contract.

[Ollie the Optimist]

We only got Cazorla cheaper because Malaga were hard up, so we snapped him up cheap.

Generally price tag represents the quality of a player, it's not always the case as there's some undiscovered stars out there but on the whole you get what you pay for.

Again RVP only went for 25 million as he didnt have long left on his contract.

You have just given me two reasons as to why prices are misleading and can't be used to judge a player. There are so many factors. Judge the player on his ability, not his price tag.

This is the problem, so many clubs now spend stupid money on players that we now think we have to spend 30 million on a player to compete. Wenger could turn round and say we've signed joevtic for 18 million and people would write him and complain we haven't gone and spent 30 million. People complain wenger never spends big, it's not about spending big, it's about what you spend it on. If you want wenger to spend. And you see he signs someone for 12 million, you end up going, look at wenger he's only going for the cheap option again without looking at what he has bought.

[Power n Glory]

You have just given me two reasons as to why prices are misleading and can't be used to judge a player. There are so many factors. Judge the player on his ability, not his price tag.

This is the problem, so many clubs now spend stupid money on players that we now think we have to spend 30 million on a player to compete. Wenger could turn round and say we've signed joevtic for 18 million and people would write him and complain we haven't gone and spent 30 million. People complain wenger never spends big, it's not about spending big, it's about what you spend it on. If you want wenger to spend. And you see he signs someone for 12 million, you end up going, look at wenger he's only going for the cheap option again without looking at what he has bought.

Rubbish! Nobody on here complains about the price tag of our players. If Wenger was still snapping up unknown world class players for small fees, nobody here would complain. In fact, it shows how much his rep in the transfer market has taken a hit with us Gooners because his judgement has been so off. Gervinho, Chamakj, Park, Santos, Squallaci.....he's now signing a lot of cheap duds.

[Özim]

This is the problem, so many clubs now spend stupid money on players that we now think we have to spend 30 million on a player to compete. Wenger could turn round and say we've signed joevtic for 18 million and people would write him and complain we haven't gone and spent 30 million. People complain wenger never spends big, it's not about spending big, it's about what you spend it on. If you want wenger to spend. And you see he signs someone for 12 million, you end up going, look at wenger he's only going for the cheap option again without looking at what he has bought.
If we spent 18 million noone would turn around and say we should have spent 30 million, it all depends who you sign.

On the whole Wenger has been signing sh*t players cheaply and thus wasting the clubs resources, there's a few exceptions but not many and that's the problem more than anything.

With all the money he's wasted on sh*t we could have signed several top notch players who would have improved the team dramatically, it's catch 22, I want him to spend money but at the same time I don't trust him with it.

[Özim]

Rubbish! Nobody on here complains about the price tag of our players. If Wenger was still snapping up unknown world class players for small fees, nobody here would complain. In fact, it shows how much his rep in the transfer market has taken a hit with us Gooners because his judgement has been so off. Gervinho, Chamakj, Park, Santos, Squallaci.....he's now signing a lot of cheap duds.
Precisely, players like Cazorla are totally fine (though we got him cheaper because Malaga needed the money), it's all the other cr*p he signs that's the problem.

[Niall_Quinn]

Why not bid £30 for Higuain or just meet Real's asking price and be done with it?

Because £30mill is a ridiculous over-valuation. If you look at the fees for deals being done they are all under the stupid £99mill quotes by the make it up as you go media. Suarez isn't worth anywhere near £40mill either. It's a negotiating position, the seller wants as much as he can get, the buyer wants to pay as little as possible. Somewhere a compromise is done. Ultimately it comes down to the player. Just as we couldn't hold RvP so Liverpool won't hold Suarez if he wants to go. Not that we'll get him because city or the chavs can always just keep bidding more. That's where the real problem is, not in the negotiations but the fact some clubs don't have to play the game or even be sane about these things.

[Özim]

Not that we'll get him because city or the chavs can always just keep bidding more. That's where the real problem is, not in the negotiations but the fact some clubs don't have to play the game or even be sane about these things.

It's not just about that though is it, after all Cesc wanted to go to Barca it wasn't about money or who would pay the most. The player has a big say in where they go, if you appeal to a player he'll be interested in signing and ultimately turn down other clubs willing to pay more. The problem is we offer nothing to top players, not money, not trophies, not playing alongside big players, not ambition to be the best.

[AKBapologist]

My problem is that I think marketing's valuation of Higuain is correct.

[Ollie the Optimist]

My problem is that I think marketing's valuation of Higuain is correct.


40 million? Interesting.

However, if you agreed a deal, pretty much had it done, be it for a house. Car, p,Ayer whatever, but you agreed a deal and then just before final signature, they turned around and went yeah we said 25 million but now we want 40 million. Would you do business with them?

[AKBapologist]

Ancelloti came in and deemed Higuain to be of much higher worth. If I hadn't signed a contract I can have no expectations over the structure of a deal.

Let's face it though. 23mill for Higuain seemed a bit too good to be true. Especially when that's the going rate for players with less than half the consistency and experience (see shittys latest signings)

[Power n Glory]

Because £30mill is a ridiculous over-valuation. If you look at the fees for deals being done they are all under the stupid £99mill quotes by the make it up as you go media. Suarez isn't worth anywhere near £40mill either. It's a negotiating position, the seller wants as much as he can get, the buyer wants to pay as little as possible. Somewhere a compromise is done. Ultimately it comes down to the player. Just as we couldn't hold RvP so Liverpool won't hold Suarez if he wants to go. Not that we'll get him because city or the chavs can always just keep bidding more. That's where the real problem is, not in the negotiations but the fact some clubs don't have to play the game or even be sane about these things.

There is no point in whinging about the market. Other clubs make do so why can't we? No point in complaining about the lack of quality players if we're not prepared to pay the price for them.

[GP]

I don't think you can point to Man City's dealings as the 'going rate'

[Ollie the Optimist]

Ancelloti came in and deemed Higuain to be of much higher worth. If I hadn't signed a contract I can have no expectations over the structure of a deal.

Let's face it though. 23mill for Higuain seemed a bit too good to be true. Especially when that's the going rate for players with less than half the consistency and experience (see shittys latest signings)


Out of all strikers, Higuain is the one I want. However, Madrid want Suarez and have seen he is going for 40 million. So to me Madrid are basically wanting us to buy Suarez for them, so wenger has decided fuck that, you've been dicks so ill be dick amd just get Suarez.

[AKBapologist]

I don't think you can point to Man City's dealings as the 'going rate'
Sure it is. There's at least 10 clubs that would pay those amounts for established or promising talents. And as long as there is always a man City or a Monaco or a Chelsea with more money than sense the market will always be distorted.

[AKBapologist]

Out of all strikers, Higuain is the one I want. However, Madrid want Suarez and have seen he is going for 40 million. So to me Madrid are basically wanting us to buy Suarez for them, so wenger has decided fuck that, you've been dicks so ill be dick amd just get Suarez.
Probably, but if arsenal were in marketing's position, I'd want the sale of a player to cover a potencial replacement too...

With chavs and napoli interest this deal is truly fucked. Beyond offering higs a massive signing on bonus to offer a transfer request, we may as well bid on suarez.

[Power n Glory]

Is the market to blame if we don't buy anyone? Is that where this debate is heading since we now have money and can't blame the Board? :lol:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Probably, but if arsenal were in marketing's position, I'd want the sale of a player to cover a potencial replacement too...

With chavs and napoli interest this deal is truly fucked. Beyond offering higs a massive signing on bonus to offer a transfer request, we may as well bid on suarez.


Are Napoli a bigger club? No, so we can compete with them easily. And why would you want to leave Madrid becaus of lack of playing time and then go and join the manager who didn't play you? So I don't think Chelsea are interested.

There is covering your costs of buying of a replacement, but it's also a dangerous game trying to get all the costs. If we take that 40 million and get Suarez, Madrid miss out on 40 million and/or a player they want. We get a world class striker, they are left with one who doesn't want to play for them and they seemingly don't want.

[LDG]

Jesus. You lot spent all night on this?

:haha:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Is the market to blame if we don't buy anyone? Is that where this debate is heading since we now have money and can't blame the Board? :lol:

I think you can blame the board for not spending this summer as well as wenger. Everyone's complained that wenger is in charge of the finances too much, yet let the board off for not stepping in amd dealing with finances themselves and telling wenger to just worry about the football.

[AKBapologist]

Don't know much about the Italian league tbh. Though it seems they have a better reputation and a bigger desire to spend than even we do after selling there star striker.

We're not spending 40mill on higs. Ivan said that we use algorithms and spread sheets to determine the value of players. Objective risk analysis crap neither Ivan or wenger really interferes with.... Barring some deadline day trolly dash.

[LDG]

I can just imagine Dale Winton sending Wenget dashing off down the aisle! :lol:

[Kano]

http://www.rateyourplayer.com/images/uploads/arsene-wenger-spotted-shopping-in-january.jpg

[Niall_Quinn]

There is no point in whinging about the market. Other clubs make do so why can't we? No point in complaining about the lack of quality players if we're not prepared to pay the price for them.

:shrug:

[Özim]

If we take that 40 million and get Suarez, Madrid miss out on 40 million and/or a player they want. We get a world class striker, they are left with one who doesn't want to play for them and they seemingly don't want.

I think they can sleep easy on that one :lol:

[Özim]

I think you can blame the board for not spending this summer as well as wenger. Everyone's complained that wenger is in charge of the finances too much, yet let the board off for not stepping in amd dealing with finances themselves and telling wenger to just worry about the football.

If he doesn't want to spend he doesn't want to spend, the board don't mind he's the manager and they're only interested in profits.

[Maestro]

http://www.rateyourplayer.com/images/uploads/arsene-wenger-spotted-shopping-in-january.jpg


and those two plastic bags is all we're getting this summer. Trust Wenfer to go Aldi and come out with just that amount of purchases :haha:

[Ollie the Optimist]

If he doesn't want to spend he doesn't want to spend, the board don't mind he's the manager and they're only interested in profits.

Do you blame the board at all for lack of spending or do you solely blame wenger?

[Özim]

Do you blame the board at all for lack of spending or do you solely blame wenger?
Both, the board because they don't tell the manager we need to spend to get some top quality in in order that we can challenge and the manager because he refuses to go out and sign the players we need at the price required.

Clearly the board are happy enough for him not to spend as long as we get top 4 and profits remain intact, but as a manager you should be looking to achieve success, this would require him to take a risk and spend some money and thus accepting that top 4 won't be enough for the board if he does.

Basically he's as much to blame as they are, it the board we'rent content they'd send him packing.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Both, the board because they don't tell the manager we need to spend to get some top quality in in order that we can challenge and the manager because he refuses to go out and sign the players we need at the price required.

Clearly the board are happy enough for him not to spend as long as we get top 4 and profits remain intact, but as a manager you should be looking to achieve success, this would require him to take a risk and spend some money and thus accepting that top 4 won't be enough for the board if he does.

Basically he's as much to blame as they are, it the board we'rent content they'd send him packing.


Your first is what is wrong here. It's the wrong way round. Wenge should be saying get me top quality p,ayers and board going out and signing them.

Wengers always dithered, reading about his time with dein, he dithered then, dein just signed them anyway. The board need to do that, that is why they are at fault. Wenger should be signing players amd top class ones, there is no excuse, but as selassie said, it's our negeoaitimg team who seem to be at fault too.

To me, wenger should just say I want x players and leave it up to board to talk money, if they can't get one of his targets, they go back amd he gives them another one. That's how it should be, fault is with wenger for taking too much for control but even more fault is with board for letting him.

[Power n Glory]

I think you can blame the board for not spending this summer as well as wenger. Everyone's complained that wenger is in charge of the finances too much, yet let the board off for not stepping in amd dealing with finances themselves and telling wenger to just worry about the football.

Are they supposed to force him? If he wants Suarez and Liverpool won't sell, what are we to do? He has to identify a realistic target.

[Niall_Quinn]

Do you blame the board at all for lack of spending or do you solely blame wenger?

Wenger murdered 6 million jews, I can never forgive him for that - even if he signs suarez.

[Özim]

Your first is what is wrong here. It's the wrong way round. Wenge should be saying get me top quality p,ayers and board going out and signing them.

Wengers always dithered, reading about his time with dein, he dithered then, dein just signed them anyway. The board need to do that, that is why they are at fault. Wenger should be signing players amd top class ones, there is no excuse, but as selassie said, it's our negeoaitimg team who seem to be at fault too.

To me, wenger should just say I want x players and leave it up to board to talk money, if they can't get one of his targets, they go back amd he gives them another one. That's how it should be, fault is with wenger for taking too much for control but even more fault is with board for letting him.

The problem is Wenger's valuation of players, I genuinely believe Wenger decides how much a player is worth and then tells the club won't shouldn't pay more, he's always talking about money and cost of players etc etc this is a big thing for him. Trouble is the valuation is more often than not below market value.

He makes a profit for the club and he has this in mind in everything he does, he won't go out and pay whatever is necessary for a player as he know it affect profits and put him under more pressure as he would need to deliver a lot more than he currently does.

He a bargain hunter and if someone isn't good value in his mind then he'll not pursue it.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Are they supposed to force him? If he wants Suarez and Liverpool won't sell, what are we to do? He has to identify a realistic target.

He should give the board a list in order of preference
1. Suarez
2. Rooney
3.higuain
(Amd before anyone says we won't buy, this is an example with three strikers we have been linked too)

He shouldn't worry about realistic target as such, let the board try and buy him, let the board negotiate the price. Then if they can't because they can't afford it/club won't sell or whatever, they go down to his next target in the list .

[Niall_Quinn]

He should give the board a list in order of preference
1. Suarez
2. Rooney
3.higuain
(Amd before anyone says we won't buy, this is an example with three strikers we have been linked too)

He shouldn't worry about realistic target as such, let the board try and buy him, let the board negotiate the price. Then if they can't because they can't afford it/club won't sell or whatever, they go down to his next target in the list .

The board can't sell those players, they aren't ours.

[Ollie the Optimist]

The problem is Wenger's valuation of players, I genuinely believe Wenger decides how much a player is worth and then tells the club won't shouldn't pay more, he's always talking about money and cost of players etc etc this is a big thing for him. Trouble is the valuation is more often than not below market value.

He makes a profit for the club and he has this in mind in everything he does, he won't go out and pay whatever is necessary for a player as he know it affect profits and put him under more pressure as he would need to deliver a lot more than he currently does.

He a bargain hunter and if someone isn't good value in his mind then he'll not pursue it.

His valuation is off we can all agree that. I don't think he is a bargain hunter as such, more he won't pay stupid prices. We've bid 30 million for Suarez, that's not a bargain as such, but if Liverpool say we want 60 he won't go there. If they say 35 he probably would.

But you saying board going along with his valuation is weak from them. They should tell him not to worry about price, like dein did

[Niall_Quinn]

You must remember, Kroenke has a responsibility to the shareholders.

[Niall_Quinn]

His valuation is off we can all agree that. I don't think he is a bargain hunter as such, more he won't pay stupid prices. We've bid 30 million for Suarez, that's not a bargain as such, but if Liverpool say we want 60 he won't go there. If they say 35 he probably would.

But you saying board going along with his valuation is weak from them. They should tell him not to worry about price, like dein did


ARSENE WENGER last night finally agreed to make a £40million offer for Luis Suarez — only to be told Liverpool now want £55m.

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5021882/Luis-Suarez-valued-by-Liverpool-at-55m-as-Arsenal-line-up-40m-offer.html#ixzz2ZU1owbWq

Liverpool don't even know how to haggle properly, they are obviously still sore over the whole Carroll thing.

[Power n Glory]

He should give the board a list in order of preference
1. Suarez
2. Rooney
3.higuain
(Amd before anyone says we won't buy, this is an example with three strikers we have been linked too)

He shouldn't worry about realistic target as such, let the board try and buy him, let the board negotiate the price. Then if they can't because they can't afford it/club won't sell or whatever, they go down to his next target in the list .

By the time we've been given the run around by Liverpool, Rooney would have signed for Chelsea and Higuain to Napoli.

And why aren't we looking for other posistions besides a striker? When we want a player we usually get him. He spared no time signing up that broken French striker. Maybe he was number 1 on the list. :lol:

[Ollie the Optimist]

By the time we've been given the run around by Liverpool, Rooney would have signed for Chelsea and Higuain to Napoli.

And why aren't we looking for other posistions besides a striker? When we want a player we usually get him. He spared no time signing up that broken French striker. Maybe he was number 1 on the list. :lol:


Probably because when you don't have to negotiate with a club it's a lot quicker.

Why aren't we? Good question, I hope the club are but that's not what we are talking about here. I've used strikers as examples, nothing else but point still stands. Wenger says I want these players. Club should go amd get them not wenger

[Kano]

it must be great to work in the media literally just sitting there taking the absolute piss out of people for a living. 55m :lol: now that is top of the range, elite journalism.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

it must be great to work in the media literally just sitting there taking the absolute piss out of people for a living. 55m :lol: now that is top of the range, elite journalism.

We've been in the "let's make shit up" zone for weeks now.

Someone made a bid for him that much has been confirmed, by the sounds of things it was you [it seems odd Ayre would divulge who made the bid to one media outlet and to keep quiet to everyone else, especially given how tight lipped we are with transfers after Dempsey], it was rejected. Everything else is just flat out made up.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Hasn't Suarez got a release clause of 40 million? Seem reports his agents etc say they do or at least believe they do

[Power n Glory]

Probably because when you don't have to negotiate with a club it's a lot quicker.

Why aren't we? Good question, I hope the club are but that's not what we are talking about here. I've used strikers as examples, nothing else but point still stands. Wenger says I want these players. Club should go amd get them not wenger

It’s still hours of work taken up. Why wasn’t this left on the backburner? We moved quickly to secure this guy but drag our heels on the most important signings.

[Ollie the Optimist]

It’s still hours of work taken up. Why wasn’t this left on the backburner? We moved quickly to secure this guy but drag our heels on the most important signings.


Given we could speak to him from January, it's not unreasonable to move quickly. It could have been a dome deal by February, we just didn't announce until window opened. But anyway I don't know why they are dragging their heals .

The thing with Suarez deal though is that there is no time pressure, he can't play until October so we don't need him by August 17th. But we sold van Persie only three days before new season, don't think these deals are quick unless you are city etc who just throw money, if you don't have to negotiate its a lot quicker

[Power n Glory]

Given we could speak to him from January, it's not unreasonable to move quickly. It could have been a dome deal by February, we just didn't announce until window opened. But anyway I don't know why they are dragging their heals .

The thing with Suarez deal though is that there is no time pressure, he can't play until October so we don't need him by August 17th. But we sold van Persie only three days before new season, don't think these deals are quick unless you are city etc who just throw money, if you don't have to negotiate its a lot quicker

What like Podolski or Giroud last season?

[Niall_Quinn]

ARSENE WENGER has agreed to make a £55million offer for Luis Suarez — only to be told Liverpool now want £926 billion.

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5021882/Luis-Suarez-valued-by-Liverpool-at-55m-as-Arsenal-line-up-40m-offer.html#ixzz2ZU1owbWq

I wouldn't go for him at that price.

[Cripps_orig]

I wouldn't go for him at that price.

Get this man to take over from Kroenke and it won't be a problem

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23352230

[LDG]

Get this man to take over from Kroenke and it won't be a problem

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23352230

Wenger would never spend it, so pointless :lol:

[AKBapologist]

Theres smoke over the bernard thing. ?
http://gossip.ladyarse.com/arsenal/2013/07/19/brazilian-report-bernard-is-going-to-join-arsenal/

[Özim]

Liverpool don't even know how to haggle properly, they are obviously still sore over the whole Carroll thing.
Are we seriously expected to believe we would offer £40 million.

:lol: Please

[selassie]

Your first is what is wrong here. It's the wrong way round. Wenge should be saying get me top quality p,ayers and board going out and signing them.

Wengers always dithered, reading about his time with dein, he dithered then, dein just signed them anyway. The board need to do that, that is why they are at fault. Wenger should be signing players amd top class ones, there is no excuse, but as selassie said, it's our negeoaitimg team who seem to be at fault too.

To me, wenger should just say I want x players and leave it up to board to talk money, if they can't get one of his targets, they go back amd he gives them another one. That's how it should be, fault is with wenger for taking too much for control but even more fault is with board for letting him.

We don't agree on much but I totally agree with what your saying here ;)

[GP]

Theres smoke over the bernard thing. ?
http://gossip.ladyarse.com/arsenal/2013/07/19/brazilian-report-bernard-is-going-to-join-arsenal/

Never seen him play but he looks properly skilful. Very highly rated.

Bet we don't sign him.

[selassie]

The problem is Wenger's valuation of players, I genuinely believe Wenger decides how much a player is worth and then tells the club won't shouldn't pay more, he's always talking about money and cost of players etc etc this is a big thing for him. Trouble is the valuation is more often than not below market value.

He makes a profit for the club and he has this in mind in everything he does, he won't go out and pay whatever is necessary for a player as he know it affect profits and put him under more pressure as he would need to deliver a lot more than he currently does.

He a bargain hunter and if someone isn't good value in his mind then he'll not pursue it.

Yep agreed, the fact that we have missed out on a number of players due to "our" or should I say Arsene's valuation of the player speaks volumes.

We screwed up the Mata deal by refusing to meet his "release clause" which was apparently 2 million more than what we offered. Xabi Alonso deal was messed up for the same reason, as in being a couple million short on what Liverpool wanted, as was the Schwarzer deal with Fulham.

[Power n Glory]

Yep agreed, the fact that we have missed out on a number of players due to "our" or should I say Arsene's valuation of the player speaks volumes.

We screwed up the Mata deal by refusing to meet his "release clause" which was apparently 2 million more than what we offered. Xabi Alonso deal was messed up for the same reason, as in being a couple million short on what Liverpool wanted, as was the Schwarzer deal with Fulham.

That's what makes no sense at all. On the one hand I think it has to be nonsense that we'd lose out on a few million and it has to be more. But on the other hand, I think back to how we've handled things in the past. Refusing to budge on Flamini’s wage demands made no sense at all. Allowing him to walk has been more costly to us than the measly fee he was after. It’s the same for Song as well. We’ll need a proper DM this year and he’ll most likely be on £75k a week if he’s decent and experienced. Selling RVP makes even less sense in light of what we’re seeing this season. Why sell him last season knowing we’d have more money to play with this year? If we can afford the wages and transfer fee for Rooney then we could have definitely afforded to pay RVP a bigger wage. We say we’re thinking long term but some of this stuff looks like it’s a case of ego getting in the way of solid planning.

[Özim]

That's what makes no sense at all. On the one hand I think it has to be nonsense that we'd lose out on a few million and it has to be more. But on the other hand, I think back to how we've handled things in the past. Refusing to budge on Flamini’s wage demands made no sense at all. Allowing him to walk has been more costly to us than the measly fee he was after. It’s the same for Song as well. We’ll need a proper DM this year and he’ll most likely be on £75k a week if he’s decent and experienced. Selling RVP makes even less sense in light of what we’re seeing this season. Why sell him last season knowing we’d have more money to play with this year? If we can afford the wages and transfer fee for Rooney then we could have definitely afforded to pay RVP a bigger wage. We say we’re thinking long term but some of this stuff looks like it’s a case of ego getting in the way of solid planning.
That's the thing about BS, it doesn't make sense :lol:

[AKBapologist]

What a shit summer this is turning out to be.

[Unai Tea]

What a shit summer this is turning out to be.

Ca plus ca change

[Özim]

Dogsh*t summer, but not a surprise, this club is a joke these days.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

we have signed rooney but are not announcing it so reading sell us jason roberts.