Match Reaction: Arsenal 0 Middlesbrough 0

[Kano]

Poor performance but we were always going to drop points sometime soon after winning so many in a row.

Shit happens, onto Reading and Sunderland next weekend.

[Niall_Quinn]

YAWN!!!!!!!!!!

Wenger out.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Top of the league. :scarf:

[Goonermerree]

Let's face it, the media was calling us the form team, but we struggled against Burnley and Southampton, we could have conceded two or three against ludo and we struggled again today, but we didn't get away with it. It's like when they say we play attractive football, it's just not true.

[Goonermerree]

Top of the league. :scarf:

It's just not the same when you don't win and play so badly.

[Niall_Quinn]

This is a very simple concept Wenger. So fucking listen!

When we are playing a team that has set out to defend deep, DO NOT play a slow, sideways game in front of them.

Got that?

Good.

It has only taken a decade you fucking moron.

[Niall_Quinn]

Top of the league. :scarf:

True I suppose. Maybe the gypos will fuck up. We floated to second last season, maybe we can float to a title this season.

[dostoy]

Its so predictable.

We had the chance to go top with a win and 3 points clear of Spuds etc.

We also played less than 3 days ago so the excuse was there already.

[Niall_Quinn]

Let's face it, the media was calling us the form team, but we struggled against Burnley and Southampton, we could have conceded two or three against ludo and we struggled again today, but we didn't get away with it. It's like when they say we play attractive football, it's just not true.

The performances don't matter. Only the 3 points matter. Except when you finally can't pub 3 points. With such a talented team we couldn't find a way to overcome a very ordinary Boro team. At home! This is why performances and momentum absolutely matter. Good teams find a way. Pub teams on a random run eventually come up short.

[Globalgunner]

We must be the easiest team in the world to defend against. The blueprint was written circa 2006 and though players have changed, the formula remains constant. The only teams we play well against are teams that want to play against us. If you decide to pack defence & wait for a break, then a point, maybe 3 is yours for the taking. Sure as the sunrise we never change our system. Pass, pass, pass,pass, pass, pass, then pass some more.

[Niall_Quinn]

Anyway, not letting it get me down. I'm off to watch the unpredictable F1 qualifying.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Well we clearly aren't the easiest team in the world to defend against but sometimes it works for the oppositon. I think mostly we've put away the pub teams away in the league.

A bit galling a Mourinho crony gets a Mourinho at the Emirates point though.

[topgun]

We must be the easiest team in the world to defend against. The blueprint was written circa 2006 and though players have changed, the formula remains constant. The only teams we play well against are teams that want to play against us. If you decide to pack defence & wait for a break, then a point, maybe 3 is yours for the taking. Sure as the sunrise we never change our system. Pass, pass, pass,pass, pass, pass, then pass some more.

:gp:

[Marc Overmars]

We're not going to win every game of course, but it's very disappointing to drop points in a fixture like this. Should be bread and butter.

Ah well, on we go.

[Niall_Quinn]

13 fouls by Boro (227 in reality) - 6 fouls by us.

0 yellows for boro
1 yellow for us.

Meanwhile we had 75% possession :bow:

Boro had 25% possession and 11 attempts, including all the best attempts.

[Power n Glory]

Ozil created 0 chance and completed 47/60 of his passes.

Just saying....

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Anyway, not letting it get me down.

Well why would you, have barely registered any anger at poor Arsenal results this year.

The only sensible thing to do is enjoy it when we win and play well and shrug your shoulders when you don't.

Doing anything else will just drive you mad

[Niall_Quinn]

Ozil created 0 chance and completed 47/60 of his passes.

Just saying....

Are you seriously trying to blame Ozil for Wenger's latest fuck-up? Ozil wasn't great today but his role was to try and create something out if a huge bag of shit evacuated directly from Wenger's rancid bowels.

[Globalgunner]

Well we clearly aren't the easiest team in the world to defend against but sometimes it works for the oppositon. I think mostly we've put away the pub teams away in the league.

A bit galling a Mourinho crony gets a Mourinho at the Emirates point though.

The Training manuals in most European academies have a chapter called the Wenger frustration model. (No. dont Google it. Its supposed to be top secret)

[Niall_Quinn]

Well why would you, have barely registered any anger at poor Arsenal results this year.

The only sensible thing to do is enjoy it when we win and play well and shrug your shoulders when you don't.

Doing anything else will just drive you mad

I did. I have actually enjoyed 3 games this season. Perhaps 4 is getting greedy.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Ozil created 0 chance and completed 47/60 of his passes.

Just saying....

If this was the Sopranos I'd say something like "you've got a real hard on for this Ozil"

Fuck it, you don't rate him we get it. You need to accept that other people aren't going to agree with you.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I did. I have actually enjoyed 3 games this season. Perhaps 4 is getting greedy.

Hmm

Watford, Chelsea and Ludogorets?

Hull maybe being the 4th?

[Niall_Quinn]

Hmm

Watford, Chelsea and Ludogorets?

Hull maybe being the 4th?

It was the 3 games where we passed the ball forwards.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

13 fouls by Boro (227 in reality) - 6 fouls by us.

0 yellows for boro
1 yellow for us.

Meanwhile we had 75% possession :bow:

Boro had 25% possession and 11 attempts, including all the best attempts.

Frankly we should be seeing it as a point gained and Boro two dropped

[Goonermerree]

Well quel surprise, we were a leetle bit jaded. According to Wenger, before the match Arsenal 'is all about goals'.

Boro played well. I'm ging to look at the table, might be the first and last time I see us top this season.

Just looked at the table and Pool have to beat the baggies 3 nil to go above us.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

2-0. They'd be above us on Goals Scored.

[RomfordPele]

Good grief. Only wenger would start with two defensive midfielders at home against a team like Middlesbrough.

What was he thinking?

:rolleyes:

[Goonermerree]

2-0. They'd be above us on Goals Scored.

Ok smart butt:d

[Niall_Quinn]

Good grief. Only wenger would start with two defensive midfielders at home against a team like Middlesbrough.

What was he thinking?

:rolleyes:

That made up rule by the cheating John Moss led to that selection really.

[Power n Glory]

If this was the Sopranos I'd say something like "you've got a real hard on for this Ozil"

Fuck it, you don't rate him we get it. You need to accept that other people aren't going to agree with you.

Just pointing at the stats. :lol: anything wrong with that? Plenty here do it.

Oh 1 shot attempt. Not on target. 2 take on attempts. 0 successful. :good:

[Niall_Quinn]

Just pointing at the stats. :lol: anything wrong with that? Plenty here do it.

Oh 1 shot attempt. Not on target. 2 take on attempts. 0 successful. :good:

3 goals in his last 2 games. Means he's consistent. So what are you complaining about?

[Power n Glory]

3 goals in his last 2 games. Means he's consistent. So what are you complaining about?

Oh, so now you're applying that sort of argument. Hmm. I said something similar before but it flew over your head. :lol:

[mastermind84]

If this was the Sopranos I'd say something like "you've got a real hard on for this Ozil"

Fuck it, you don't rate him we get it. You need to accept that other people aren't going to agree with you.
Why even argue with him on this? Mans an idiot.

Seriously, if you don't rate Özil you shouldn't be taken serious in football conversations.

[mastermind84]

You cannot play Elneny and Coquelin together. No progressive passing, which lead to a blunted attack.

Xhaka or Santi must always play.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

You cannot play Elneny and Coquelin together. No progressive passing, which lead to a blunted attack.

Xhaka or Santi must always play.

yes although academic

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I do think that in games like this, Elneny's cautious passing is going to hinder us but who else was he going to play and at least the aforementioned is unlikely to lose us the game.

Also in games like this the chance that Alexis got several yards from goal we simply cannot afford to miss.

[RomfordPele]

He could have tried ox in the middle from the start. Coquelin and elneny reminds me of a dark period c.2008 when we had Flamini and denilson in central midfield because Fabregas was out. Didn't work then, ain't gonna work now. Wenger is pathologically incapable of learning any lessons.

Perez looks like a bit of a dud too. I don't see what he's going to add to this team.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Chamberlain is not trustworthy enough in a game like this in central midfield where the margins are fine.......as it was Kos showed complete class and maturity to bail us out near the end.

Momma said there'd be days like this! The question is, what are we going to do the next time.....

[Kano]

You cannot play Elneny and Coquelin together. No progressive passing, which lead to a blunted attack.

Xhaka or Santi must always play.

If one is suspended and the other one not recovered from a knock, it might prove a bit difficult.

[mastermind84]

He could have tried ox in the middle from the start. Coquelin and elneny reminds me of a dark period c.2008 when we had Flamini and denilson in central midfield because Fabregas was out. Didn't work then, ain't gonna work now. Wenger is pathologically incapable of learning any lessons.

Perez looks like a bit of a dud too. I don't see what he's going to add to this team.
Ox is also a mistake

The reason Xhaka has made the attack great is because he moves it forward quickly from deep positions/

Santi works because he can get the ball forward.

Oxlade doesn't play like those two. He'd actually be better playing where Coquelin does.

[Chippy]

Poor performance but we were always going to drop points sometime soon after winning so many in a row.

Shit happens, onto Reading and Sunderland next weekend.

I was kinda hoping these kind of shit performances were behind us? I was hoping Wenger had learned his lesson by not playing negative midfielders? FUCK.

[Kano]

I was kinda hoping these kind of shit performances were behind us? I was hoping Wenger had learned his lesson by not playing negative midfielders? FUCK.

Who else could've played today that the fans can hand on heart say they believe in to deliver beyond the starting eleven? Plenty of shit performances to come from every team near the top of the league. There easily should've been enough in that team to win the game but we didn't. And the 'negative midfielders' should've given us better protection against the counter attacks, so what happened there?

[Chippy]

Who else could've played today that the fans can hand on heart say they believe in to deliver beyond the starting eleven? Plenty of shit performances to come from every team near the top of the league. There easily should've been enough in that team to win the game but we didn't. And the 'negative midfielders' should've given us better protection against the counter attacks, so what happened there?
I know what you mean but Elneny is no better than Flamini!! Another mediocre Wumger signing. Might have been better off keeping Wilshire?

[Kano]

Elneny is a solid squad player and has contributed more to the club here than Jack has in the past two years. Wilshere completed 90 minutes for the first time in 24 months today. He chose to leave. He's still to prove whether he's worth the time and energy anymore.

[Chippy]

Elneny is a solid squad player and has contributed more to the club here than Jack has in the past two years. Wilshere completed 90 minutes for the first time in 24 months today. He chose to leave. He's still to prove whether he's worth the time and energy anymore.
Solid yes, but negative. At least Jack would go forward Mr Kano. Oh well, let's hope for better next week! It's beer time for me! Cheers brother!

[Kano]

That's all we've got when it comes to footie my friend, the next game, a bit of hope and getting off our tits in the meantime.

[Chippy]

That's all we've got when it comes to footie my friend, the next game, a bit of hope and getting off our tits in the meantime.
Exactly! :)

[Niall_Quinn]

I know what you mean but Elneny is no better than Flamini!! Another mediocre Wumger signing. Might have been better off keeping Wilshire?

Elneny was fine until the stupid old goat taught him the Wenger Way. Sideways, sideways, sideways, back. Sideways, sideways, sideways, back.

[Power n Glory]

Yet to see the game but why is Elneny taking so much of the blame? He's not our creative player but he had a 95% completion rate, played the ball forward more times than he played it square or backwards and supplied our most creative players more than any other midfielder. Ozil received the ball from MO more than an other player but Ozil didn't create a single chance and actually played the ball backwards more than he did forward.

Mo, in fact, supplied Iwobi and Theo more than any other midfield player. Considering his pass completion rate is so high and he's getting tha ball to our most creative players, shouldn't the burden fall on these guys to create something more? He's no Santi but the bias on here is crazy. The burden has to fall on our most creative players. Ozil, Sanchez, Iwobi and Theo. They have to pick up the slack. Should be no excuses for these guys creating zero or just 1 chance from 90 minutes. No successful takes on and hardly any shots on goal. What the heck are they doing? When we're up against a stubborn defence we need players to take some risks. The problem isn't Elneny because this sounds like the sort of problem we had against Burnley.

[fakeyank]

Boro deserved the win today. We fluked a point today.. another point towards our 4th place trophy! :trophy:

[RomfordPele]

Yet to see the game but why is Elneny taking so much of the blame? He's not our creative player but he had a 95% completion rate, played the ball forward more times than he played it square or backwards and supplied our most creative players more than any other midfielder. Ozil received the ball from MO more than an other player but Ozil didn't create a single chance and actually played the ball backwards more than he did forward.

Mo, in fact, supplied Iwobi and Theo more than any other midfield player. Considering his pass completion rate is so high and he's getting tha ball to our most creative players, shouldn't the burden fall on these guys to create something more? He's no Santi but the bias on here is crazy. The burden has to fall on our most creative players. Ozil, Sanchez, Iwobi and Theo. They have to pick up the slack. Should be no excuses for these guys creating zero or just 1 chance from 90 minutes. No successful takes on and hardly any shots on goal. What the heck are they doing? When we're up against a stubborn defence we need players to take some risks. The problem isn't Elneny because this sounds like the sort of problem we had against Burnley.

I don't think elneny played badly at all yesterday. The problem was that him and coquelin together don't work, and are never going to work, against a team that sits back. We needed someone to carry the ball, break through the first line, disrupt their order and create space for Ozil, Sanchez and Walcott. Neither coquelin or elneny can do that, which is why it was a pretty poor team selection by Le Genius.

That said, I accept the point that the ox wasn't much better when he came on (Perez was anonymous too), which is why it was strange keeping him around this season and loaning out Jack. We could have done with Jack yesterday, I reckon...

[Niall_Quinn]

Elneny was a disaster zone and those stats of 95% pass completion are the main problem. He got a lot of the ball and everything he did was ultra, ultra conservative. He played the same role as Coquelin so you can understand why we had literally nothing creative coming from the middle. You expect this of Coquelin, it is his job. But when Elneny (I bet through no fault of his own) is doing the exact same job then the team is fucked. Every time the ball went into that centre the game was slowed to a crawl and the men ahead of the ball had to either come back or stand around waiting for the pass - the short pass every time and only if the infuriating tip back to Coquelin wasn't on. And that was that, dead attack, nothing created. Either this showed severe limitations in the ability of Elneny where he completely failed to emulate or even approximate the Cazorla or Xhaka role, or Wenger panicked at the loss of those two and shut up shop at home to dog shit Middlesboro. I think it was the latter because I've seen Elneny play far better against better teams.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Elneny is in danger of making a rep as Mr circumspect but saying a disaster zone is too far. He won't lose you the game and he'd never have made the mistake Xhaka did for Swansea's goal the other day.

Ironically it was a good day for Wilshere to come in.

I want the club to come out and just admit they've sold Giroud.

[Niall_Quinn]

Elneny is in danger of making a rep as Mr circumspect but saying a disaster zone is too far. He won't lose you the game and he'd never have made the mistake Xhaka did for Swansea's goal the other day.

Ironically it was a good day for Wilshere to come in.

I want the club to come out and just admit they've sold Giroud.

Meant his role was a disaster zone. He was very solid in what he was asked to do. The problem was what he was asked to do was a joke considering we were playing Middlesboro at home.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

As I said after the Burnley game, we need to stop trying to play the ball into congested middle where invariably we end up passing sideways and backwards

I think our best option is to play the ball in behind the full backs and across the face of goal.

[Power n Glory]

Elneny is an easy target. NQ is ignoring a few facts. Yes, Mo passed the ball to Coquelin 17 times but also played the ball Ozil 15 times and Iwobi 14. That'd his top 3 passing combos. It's not as if he couldn't get the ball to our most creative players. Mo created a good chance for Sanchez but Ozil and Iwobi created zero chances. How? Why? Ozil's assist and chance creation rate has dried up a little and that's being overlooked.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Meant his role was a disaster zone. He was very solid in what he was asked to do. The problem was what he was asked to do was a joke considering we were playing Middlesboro at home.

The negative passing thing was actually levelled at him immediately in his Arsenal career. By neutrals if not always by Arsenal fans, but he came at a time we were just relieved for a competent, reliable hard working player. Not to do him down, it's merely an observation but he has to now realise to be considered more seriously he's going to need to do more. Whether it is his game or not, there's a lot of competition.

[Power n Glory]

As I said after the Burnley game, we need to stop trying to play the ball into congested middle where invariably we end up passing sideways and backwards

I think our best option is to play the ball in behind the full backs and across the face of goal.

Exactly. It's the same issue we had against Burnley. Batter a team in the Champs League followed up by a lacklustre performances. We had Xhaka and Cazorla play that game and we got lucky with our goal.

I think it's a problem with our opposition and our style of play when we're not moving the ball quick enough and the we haven't got the movement in the final third. It's nothing like having Ramsey and Flamini in the middle because in those games we'd struggle to string together an attack and pin our opponents back. Moves would break down after two or three passes and it's like we had no midfield presence at all to mount an attack. Flam or Ramsey would keep giving the ball away and we've have a real problem getting the ball to our creative players.

[Niall_Quinn]

Elneny is an easy target. NQ is ignoring a few facts. Yes, Mo passed the ball to Coquelin 17 times but also played the ball Ozil 15 times and Iwobi 14. That'd his top 3 passing combos. It's not as if he couldn't get the ball to our most creative players. Mo created a good chance for Sanchez but Ozil and Iwobi created zero chances. How? Why? Ozil's assist and chance creation rate has dried up a little and that's being overlooked.

Except if you read what I'm saying you'll see Elneny isn't my target. Wenger's excessive caution and negativity and his seemingly endless desire to do the absolute minimum is my target.

[Power n Glory]

Except if you read what I'm saying you'll see Elneny isn't my target. Wenger's excessive caution and negativity and his seemingly endless desire to do the absolute minimum is my target.

That's another easy target. Do you think Wenger has told them to be more cautious? That makes no sense and we've had this debate before. We have key players out injured and Ozil isn't making assists. He has 1 all season.

[Letters]

I do think Wenger has changed tack slightly, we had a tenancy to concede late in games so as a reaction to that we do sometimes shut up shop late in a game.
I'm OK with that. He saw a problem (which we all saw) and reacted to it. Wenger gets enough stick on here (with some justification) for problems persisting and him doing nothing about them.

[Niall_Quinn]

That's another easy target. Do you think Wenger has told them to be more cautious? That makes no sense and we've had this debate before. We have key players out injured and Ozil isn't making assists. He has 1 all season.

Okay, this Ozil thing is weird. Don't know where you are going with it or why.

[Niall_Quinn]

I do think Wenger has changed tack slightly, we had a tenancy to concede late in games so as a reaction to that we do sometimes shut up shop late in a game.
I'm OK with that. He saw a problem (which we all saw) and reacted to it. Wenger gets enough stick on here (with some justification) for problems persisting and him doing nothing about them.

Yes, this is true. We were susceptible to getting a good hiding off some of the better teams on far too regular a basis and it was right he reacted to that and tightened things up in those games. But home against Middlesboro? He's taken things to the other extreme.

[Letters]

I didn't see the game on Saturday but wasn't it just a case of 'Boro coming, keeping things tight and trying to nick a point, which they did?
Breaking teams down who do that is difficult, we manage it more often than not but it's not going to happen every time.
It's only the 2nd time all season we've failed to score (although we rode our luck against Burnley).
Bit early to tell if it's "same old Arsenal" or just "one of those days".

[Kano]

I do think Wenger has changed tack slightly, we had a tenancy to concede late in games so as a reaction to that we do sometimes shut up shop late in a game.
I'm OK with that. He saw a problem (which we all saw) and reacted to it. Wenger gets enough stick on here (with some justification) for problems persisting and him doing nothing about them.

We were open from the first twenty minutes to the counters in this game, which was worrying given we had two traditional DM's on the pitch, which didn't have much of an effect. I get the closing down of games when we're in control, that makes sense but here we were wide open at the back a number of times. We keep getting away with it so far but someone is going to punish us for it. I guess it's part and parcel of playing with a high back line and having 2/3 mobile defenders in Kostafi and Hector helps with that but it means our tackling has to be spot on almost every time.

[Power n Glory]

Okay, this Ozil thing is weird. Don't know where you are going with it or why.

I think it's hilarious how you'll skate around criticizing certain players. Against Burnley, there were no obvious weak players and hard to pinpoint why were playing so slowly and couldn't create chances, so Wenger is the obvious target. For some reason he's told the players to play slower. ;)

This weekend we hardly create many chances, but it's Elneny taking all the blame despite that not being what he's good at. You skate around the fact that Ozil created zero chances. Why? He has 1 assist all season. Is that usual? Last year people kept pointing out the amount of chances he'd create and blame the strikers for not putting them away, so why aren't you looking at the chance creation stats this season and this sort of game where we're blunt in the final third?

[Niall_Quinn]

I think it's hilarious how you'll skate around criticizing certain players. Against Burnley, there were no obvious weak players and hard to pinpoint why were playing so slowly and couldn't create chances, so Wenger is the obvious target. For some reason he's told the players to play slower. ;)

This weekend we hardly create many chances, but it's Elneny taking all the blame despite that not being what he's good at. You skate around the fact that Ozil created zero chances. Why? He has 1 assist all season. Is that usual? Last year people kept pointing out the amount of chances he'd create and blame the strikers for not putting them away, so why aren't you looking at the chance creation stats this season and this sort of game where we're blunt in the final third?

But surely not as hilarious as this hard on you have for Ozil? Ozil was as effective as anyone else on the pitch, which was not at all. That's because we played a slow, static and stupid game that was overly cautious. We had two central midfielders playing negative roles, one understandable to a degree but the other not at all. We used short, possession obsessed passing (7% of our passes were classed as long in the post game stats). We had a stupid amount of possession (75%) and did fuck all with it BECAUSE of the way the midfield two were deployed. As a result the front men, particularly Alexis, had to keep coming deep just to get involved. The whole thing was ludicrous. Now perhaps you are right. Perhaps Wenger said go out there, play at a decent tempo, penetrate. Perhaps he told Elneny to be progressive, ambitious, while Coquelin was instructed to sit. In which case Elneny ignored him entirely and did the opposite. I wonder if that's likely given the control freakery of this manager? And if that was the case, why did we carry on doing it after the break? Why wasn't Elneny pulled to one side at half time and read the riot act by Mr Ambition?

But of course you're saying none of that was the issue. The real issue was Ozil not creating chances. Not Theo or Alexis or Monreal and Bellerin with their woeful crossing, but Ozil. Well it's quite hard to create chances when the striker is on the halfway line trying to get the ball because the central two are playing tippety tap. Or when you are receiving the ball in a packed centre with 4 defenders around you. If you can't see the difference between how we set up and played this game compared to the games where we've had a lot less possession but have had far more penetration and played at a much higher pace then you are probably focusing on Ozil exclusively and ignoring everything else.

[Letters]

Do you think Wenger micro-manages how each player plays? I thought the criticism of him was that he doesn't give them enough direction and just lets them get on with it.

[Niall_Quinn]

Do you think Wenger micro-manages how each player plays? I thought the criticism of him was that he doesn't give them enough direction and just lets them get on with it.

It appears he has an obsessive focus on certain aspects of the play, such as possession. He seems to value that above all else. Then there's fitness and energy and his red lines and incomprehensible rotation policy. But you'll hardly ever see him get off the bench and issue tactical instructions to individuals players.

[Power n Glory]

But surely not as hilarious as this hard on you have for Ozil? Ozil was as effective as anyone else on the pitch, which was not at all. That's because we played a slow, static and stupid game that was overly cautious. We had two central midfielders playing negative roles, one understandable to a degree but the other not at all. We used short, possession obsessed passing (7% of our passes were classed as long in the post game stats). We had a stupid amount of possession (75%) and did fuck all with it BECAUSE of the way the midfield two were deployed. As a result the front men, particularly Alexis, had to keep coming deep just to get involved. The whole thing was ludicrous. Now perhaps you are right. Perhaps Wenger said go out there, play at a decent tempo, penetrate. Perhaps he told Elneny to be progressive, ambitious, while Coquelin was instructed to sit. In which case Elneny ignored him entirely and did the opposite. I wonder if that's likely given the control freakery of this manager? And if that was the case, why did we carry on doing it after the break? Why wasn't Elneny pulled to one side at half time and read the riot act by Mr Ambition?

But of course you're saying none of that was the issue. The real issue was Ozil not creating chances. Not Theo or Alexis or Monreal and Bellerin with their woeful crossing, but Ozil. Well it's quite hard to create chances when the striker is on the halfway line trying to get the ball because the central two are playing tippety tap. Or when you are receiving the ball in a packed centre with 4 defenders around you. If you can't see the difference between how we set up and played this game compared to the games where we've had a lot less possession but have had far more penetration and played at a much higher pace then you are probably focusing on Ozil exclusively and ignoring everything else.

But even outside of this game, Ozil has only 1 assist. Is that not setting off alarm bells? As I said before, were our most creative players starved of possession? Was that the issue? If so, I'd agree with you here but I don't think that was the case at all. We're always going to run into this problem regardless of who we play. This isn't anything new.

We've had plenty of games where we've done nothing with our possession and it's not just down to who is playing in the midfield. A huge part of it comes from the way Wenger wants to the team to play. The unselfish way. Doing what the game calls you to do. That spiritual mumbo jumbo, where I've heard Henry and Bergkamp talk of the game as if it were religion; playing the pass instead of going for glory. I feel you're on track for blaming Wenger on the overall philosophy of the game. But we're not a team full of robots. Wenger has preached the same sermon for years and it never stopped Henry from running through Liverpool's defence or going for an outrageous shot against Utd. Same goes for Bergkamp and his ridiculous goals when the team need that bit extra. We had players that could carry the team when we had difficult times. So although Wenger has way he likes us to play, it's not so rigid that it doesn't allow for creative freedom to beat these sort of teams.

When the midfield is packed and we have no way through the middle, as Herbert says, why aren't we working the wide areas? We why aren't more of our players trying to break the lines with their dribbling skills and get beyond defenders that way? Our system isn't that rigid to the point where players can't try to flex some creative muscle. I get on to Ozil about this more than most because he has the ability to dribble and buy himself more space but hardly ever takes on his man even when he has a lower than usual pass completion rate. Try something different for petes sakes! He's one of the few players with that ability. Heck, it's why I like Sanchez. Far from perfect but he goes for the risky pass or attempt the dribble. It's not always the right decision but he's proof that our current system isn't so dogmatic. Just look at the goal he scored midweek in the CL.

It's not just Ozil. Iwobi attempted 0 takes on. That's nuts for a player of his ability. Didn't we see him carve a chance out by dribbling through 3 or 4 players? He's young so it's forgivable. But a player that just turned 28 and one of our top players...we need more. He's not a limited player like so many of the others. He's just missing that attitude. Of course, it doesn't all fall on him but each week I see you go out of your way to avoid mentioning Ozil.

[Penguin]

Ozil hasn't really got going yet this season but it's a bit early to get the pitchforks out. He only has one assist but he's already got 6 goals... he could have even won it against Middlesborough if he held his run. He's showing a real hunger to get beyond the striker and get in the goals. Last season he wouldn't have made those kinds of runs so surely that is trying something different?

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I think it was Stillman (who I know you rate P'n'G) that said on a recent podcast when asked about Ozil's goals and lack of assists.....'it's not like he isn't still creating chances'....

I haven't bothered to check but I'm not sure there is a strong correlation between the chances he has created and his number of assists.

Though I have said a bit on Elneny I do think that the main issue is that in tight games like this we just need to take at least one of the few chances we get. We can analyse the crap out of it but there will always be days you don't create as much and on those days, if you don't take your chance(s) you've had it.

[Kano]

I think it was Stillman (who I know you rate P'n'G) that said on a recent podcast when asked about Ozil's goals and lack of assists.....'it's not like he isn't still creating chances'....

I haven't bothered to check but I'm not sure there is a strong correlation between the chances he has created and his number of assists.

Though I have said a bit on Elneny I do think that the main issue is that in tight games like this we just need to take at least one of the few chances we get. We can analyse the crap out of it but there will always be days you don't create as much and on those days, if you don't take your chance(s) you've had it.

It's part of the intangible elements that make up so much of sport. No matter how many data sets, form guides or tactics are drilled into a set of players, off days are going to occur. I'm sure Pep was desperate to get a win under his belt again after stumbling recently and the players would've been too - yet they barely got going on the weekend. Ronaldo has stood over that ball infront of a wall of men hundreds of times in match situations, thousands of times on the training pitch, yet the fucker still hardly puts one in the net.

The opposition approach can have just as much say in how effective or not you are going to be on any one day. The problem is that again, that is immeasurable to a certain degree, played out in the smallest of humanistic details on the pitch. So much goes on in the players heads, all of which decides the outcomes of the games. All of which we're not privy to of course. All of which is affected beyond what our eyes and sometimes what their emotions can control. I guess the trick across a campaign is management of those temperaments by the manager and combined with the level of talent at their disposal, that will decide the champions. Football is a simple game but the forces that define it, really aren't.

[Power n Glory]

Yes, I rate Tim Stillman but in games where we're struggling to break a team down but have loads of possession, I think Ozil should be creating more chances. Against Boro and Burnley where we really struggled, he only created 1 chance in each game. Stats certainly don’t tell the whole story but when it comes to chance creation, is he creating the sort of a chances our strikers should be burying or is it just a cut back into a tight area that’s easily charged down and blocked but it still counts as a chance? I’d probably rate Ozil more in the deep laying playmaker role to be honest. His passing is accurate and great for keeping possession but I don’t think he takes enough chances. We aren’t seeing defence splitting passes that make the goal, the type I’ve seen Sanchez and Iwobi craft. It’s probably why I’m harsh on him but as said, if he were playing the Santi role, I’d probably appreciate him a lot more.

It’s worth reading the latest from Stillman. Penguin could be right in regards to Ozil taking on a more goal scoring role. He’s making the runs and has 6 goals but it’s worth remembering 3 of those came in a dead and buried game in the CL against Ludogorets. If Alexis is dropping back and taking on the more playmaker role as a sort of false 9, it probably explains why Ozil isn’t making as many assists. But I feel we have other players that can be that goal threat from that sort of position. We’ll see how the season plays out.




Ozil has taste for goals

It’s amazing that Mesut Ozil has yet to register an assist in the league this season. His role hasn’t refined much, but for those players around him it has. That’s enough to force him to adjust his game a little bit, mainly because his areas of occupation are being occupied. Ozil is known for drifting to the flanks to find space but now those wingers are playing in the “half spaces” he thrives on. Not to mention also, his partner in crime, Alexis, has moved away from the left and that, as we anticipated has altered his game.

The relationship is still there, but now they’re attracted going vertically up the pitch, rather than combining in the left-channel. Alexis has become the creator and Ozil, not so much the finisher in the partnership, but finally beginning to use his ghosting runs to greater effect for Arsenal. That’s also where the space is if Arsenal continue to try and get as many players between-the-lines as possible because somebody has to make those runs, and Ozil is taking responsibility. Wenger, though, explains it best, speaking of the psychological shift involved in Ozil scoring more goals than simply player higher.

“He works quite well on finishing in training,” Wenger said. I believe that every player gets in a habit of having a vision of his game, and sometimes he doesn’t get out of the boundaries he has fixed for himself. He experienced his game as a provider and slowly I think he’s getting the taste to think, ‘oh, maybe I can finish as well.’ That’s what you want him to do, to add that to his game. There’s no reason that he should not finish and score. Hopefully the fact that he scored again on Wednesday night (against Ludogorets) will give him that taste and desire.”

As it happened, Ozil couldn’t quite find the finishing touch against Middlesbrough, though at times, he was the most advanced player. He thought he had found the winner when he deflected Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain’s shot in, and though it was disallowed, the jubilation initially on his face, showed he has a taste for goals now.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

The question is how many opportunities is he giving to team mates to create chances, going back to last season one game i would use as an example is the champions league match against Olympiakos in Athens where Ozil created space for other people to assist Giroud.

There is no doubt Ozil has had a couple of off games this season (most notable for me were against Southampton and PSG) but games i've seen him either taking shots on himself (something you've criticised him for not doing enough of) or releasing other players to make assists.

Like other midfielders he has an infuriating tendency to make sideways and backwards passing in the middle of the park when really he and other should be driving forward and bringing runners with him, but from watching the Middlesborough game we suffered in many aspects.

1) Not recycling the ball quick enough when winning the ball back in our own third.

2) Neither Walcott or Sanchez willing to take on a more conventional forwards role and not being in a position to receive the ball when it was played through the centre.

3) The tendency to over play the ball through the centre and try and thread a eye of needle pass, and even when this came off the player was too far away from goal and not enough players in the box to mop up any goalkeeper spillage.

4) Both full backs being guilty of letting their man past them, and Monreal especially guilty of ball watching in the box and allowing Middlesborough players to escape their marker.

5) Koscielny being left too exposed by poor positional play by Elneny and Coquelin allowing players like Traore too much space to bomb forward at our defence, Mustafi had to put in a cynical challenge of the kind that Xhaka was sent off for last week.

6) Ozil did seem to me like he was getting forward but wasn't trying to orchestrate the game from the middle of the park like he usually does and better passing to players in the final third went begging.

[Niall_Quinn]

But even outside of this game, Ozil has only 1 assist. Is that not setting off alarm bells? As I said before, were our most creative players starved of possession? Was that the issue? If so, I'd agree with you here but I don't think that was the case at all. We're always going to run into this problem regardless of who we play. This isn't anything new.

We've had plenty of games where we've done nothing with our possession and it's not just down to who is playing in the midfield. A huge part of it comes from the way Wenger wants to the team to play. The unselfish way. Doing what the game calls you to do. That spiritual mumbo jumbo, where I've heard Henry and Bergkamp talk of the game as if it were religion; playing the pass instead of going for glory. I feel you're on track for blaming Wenger on the overall philosophy of the game. But we're not a team full of robots. Wenger has preached the same sermon for years and it never stopped Henry from running through Liverpool's defence or going for an outrageous shot against Utd. Same goes for Bergkamp and his ridiculous goals when the team need that bit extra. We had players that could carry the team when we had difficult times. So although Wenger has way he likes us to play, it's not so rigid that it doesn't allow for creative freedom to beat these sort of teams.

When the midfield is packed and we have no way through the middle, as Herbert says, why aren't we working the wide areas? We why aren't more of our players trying to break the lines with their dribbling skills and get beyond defenders that way? Our system isn't that rigid to the point where players can't try to flex some creative muscle. I get on to Ozil about this more than most because he has the ability to dribble and buy himself more space but hardly ever takes on his man even when he has a lower than usual pass completion rate. Try something different for petes sakes! He's one of the few players with that ability. Heck, it's why I like Sanchez. Far from perfect but he goes for the risky pass or attempt the dribble. It's not always the right decision but he's proof that our current system isn't so dogmatic. Just look at the goal he scored midweek in the CL.

It's not just Ozil. Iwobi attempted 0 takes on. That's nuts for a player of his ability. Didn't we see him carve a chance out by dribbling through 3 or 4 players? He's young so it's forgivable. But a player that just turned 28 and one of our top players...we need more. He's not a limited player like so many of the others. He's just missing that attitude. Of course, it doesn't all fall on him but each week I see you go out of your way to avoid mentioning Ozil.

I don't think we're actually disagreeing here, are we? I have said most of these things myself. But I have called it an obsession with possession. Something I thought Wenger might be recovering from following a couple of games where we ceded the possession in favour of direct play and more ambition. I don't believe the players make these decisions themselves though. Revealing comments slip out from time to time, Ozil joking he should have passed to Ramsey when he scored that goal, Santi tongue-in-cheek chiding Alexis, "On the ground, keep it on the ground!"

My feeling is if Wenger could unclench his butt cheeks we'd not only see good football on a more regular basis but we'd have a serious chance of winning this league. His way is the average it out, safe route to that top 4 spot. I'd rather lose a few trying to win a few more.

[Power n Glory]

I don't think we're actually disagreeing here, are we? I have said most of these things myself. But I have called it an obsession with possession. Something I thought Wenger might be recovering from following a couple of games where we ceded the possession in favour of direct play and more ambition. I don't believe the players make these decisions themselves though. Revealing comments slip out from time to time, Ozil joking he should have passed to Ramsey when he scored that goal, Santi tongue-in-cheek chiding Alexis, "On the ground, keep it on the ground!"

My feeling is if Wenger could unclench his butt cheeks we'd not only see good football on a more regular basis but we'd have a serious chance of winning this league. His way is the average it out, safe route to that top 4 spot. I'd rather lose a few trying to win a few more.

We agree on the general approach to our game and the pass pass philosophy, but don't you see that same pass pass philosophy in the way Ozil plays? That's where we bump heads.

Also, Wenger can't micro manage the players every move. It's not that dogmatic. As said, Bergkamp and Henry wouldn't just look to always pass against a stubborn defence. They'd take a risk. The same can be said for Sanchez or even Ramsey and Wenger won't bench those guys for going off script. Heck, Walcott is the opposite of a pass pass player and his numbers are much lower the rest of the squads. Players still have license to how play how they play.