Ozil OUT. Yes or yes?

[Master Splinter]

Probably the worst purchase in Arsenal history. A flaky, no-impact, stattard's dream. Solely repsonsible for multiple defeats through his cowardice, lack of discipline or basic technical errors. No other team in Europe wants him. The embodiment of Wenger's Arsenal in his downfall years.

Only one lone fangirl on here seems to tolerate his pointlessness, likely too dazzled by his continuous disappearing act to see what is beyond obvious to any other sane human.

At least we can be solaced by the fact he'll be the first one hauled out by a new manager when Wenger retires in the space year 2145.

[Niall_Quinn]

He'll be off in January or the summer latest and Alexis with him. Then Wenger won't have anyone to hide behind nor anyone to pull his useless arse out of the fires he starts himself.

[Cripps]

I'm praying he doesn't sign a new contract.

A soft, weak minded pussy. I think Spain suited him perfectly; 2-3 big games a season and the rest against shite teams that are so tactically inferior to the top 2 its like having a kick about in the park every week.

The premier league requires drive, determination and energy, something he does not have. He's been allowed to regress under a mediocre, past-it manager, who himself has regressed so much and can't see left from right. Wenger is the perfect manager for him; allows him to get away with murder and constantly backs him.

[Marc Overmars]

Probably the worst purchase in Arsenal history. A flaky, no-impact, stattard's dream. Solely repsonsible for multiple defeats through his cowardice, lack of discipline or basic technical errors. No other team in Europe wants him. The embodiment of Wenger's Arsenal in his downfall years.

Only one lone fangirl on here seems to tolerate his pointlessness, likely too dazzled by his continuous disappearing act to see what is beyond obvious to any other sane human.

At least we can be solaced by the fact he'll be the first one hauled out by a new manager when Wenger retires in the space year 2145.

Well said.

I look at the other top attacking midfielders in the league with envy because they bring so much more to the table for their teams than Ozil does for us. I’m tired of hearing about this guy now, he’s undoubtedly the most disappointing signing in our history.

Get rid and bring some hungry and most importantly effective players in. Though I would say Ozil won’t be the last decent player to regress under Wenger. He’s a shit coach and anyone we bring in will have to be truly special to avoid having the life sucked out of them.

[Power n Glory]

One of the most overrated players I've seen at Arsenal and has escaped criticism for so long because people are trying to kid themselves into believing we haven't wasted our money. Even the one thing that's supposed to make him exceptional is bang average.

[Bumble]

If Ozil can play that many times for Germany then he cant be a bad player. Maybe he just needs better players in the team to make him excel. He isn't a guy who can take a game by the scruff of the neck and win it on his own.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Iwobi should've scored from his pass tbf.

[Niall_Quinn]

If Ozil can play that many times for Germany then he cant be a bad player. Maybe he just needs better players in the team to make him excel. He isn't a guy who can take a game by the scruff of the neck and win it on his own.

Lots of thrashing around by the fans trying to find somebody to blame for this absurd mess the club is in. We've heard that Ozil missed a sitter, when it wasn't a sitter at all, just a bad miss, and we've heard the Watford bloke 100% dived, when it wasn't at all clearcut unless viewed at super slow motion. Extreme reactions in response to an extreme situation. Plus there's the anti-Ozil agenda that has been rolling since the day he arrived, spawned by jealous media hacks and then picked up by fans who were expecting Messi.

Truth is even Alexis doesn't play well any more in this Wengerised shit show. Difference with him is he can still find a moment of brilliance and turn a game. And because Ozil hasn't been doing this of late he's taking all the flak. But it's gone to ludicrous extremes now with people claiming the guy can't play at all. Nobody is playing well because there's no stage upon which to play. Wenger's foul tactics and his total dismissal of each and every opponent sends the team onto the pitch as a disorganised jumble, constantly fighting with a randomly shifting starting lineup, bizarre positional rotations and lacking in the basic drills that even the relegation battlers seem able to manage. It is from this ocean floor that Ozil is being pilloried for not being able to re-float the ship and bring it up to top speed. Of course nobody could name a single player who would be capable. Yank De Bruyne out of a purring team of gypos and dump him in our landfill and he'll be scrabbling about aimlessly like the rest of them.

It will be interesting to see who the hounds attach themselves to once Ozil is gone. Not Wenger or Kroenke I'm betting. And the perpetual Theo will still be here, delivering nothing at all and attracting no concern whatsoever. Because people know he's a nothing player, so they don't make the fuss. But they know well Ozil is no Theo Walcott.

[Letters]

Probably the worst purchase in Arsenal history.
*sigh*

[Xhaka Can’t]

If Ozil can play that many times for Germany then he cant be a bad player.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171017/a17d41c5e0ebe6a5dcb86f55d7c305ea.png

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

One of the most overrated players I've seen at Arsenal and has escaped criticism for so long because people are trying to kid themselves into believing we haven't wasted our money. Even the one thing that's supposed to make him exceptional is bang average.

Escaped criticism???

Ozil is a lazy cunt but he’s evidence that if you give a calculator to a retard he will try to use it to change tv channels with

For the first season he was played on the wing for a considerable length of time

His attitude exemplifies the mindset prevalent throughout the entire squad.

We all know though the high probability that once he leaves and starts working with a manager who knows what he’s doing that one of the most technically accomplished players we have will be shitting gold nuggets

[Power n Glory]

What does it mean when a supposed world class player looks just about as average as the rest of the average players around him?

In most cases, I've seen fans overestimate the performance of an above average player who plays with average or below average players. Big fish in a small pond syndrome. They usually get found out when moving to a bigger team. Hleb, Flamini, Ade and Nasri are examples of that. We usually have no problem calling such players out.

I've never seen a case where such a big name flops and he still holds his status as a world class player despite the lacklustre performances. Wenger is a shocking manager but that's not a blanket excuse for every performance. You can still see how a player like Sanchez and Cazorla are way ahead of their teammates and how vital they are to helping us tick.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

We will have to disagree about him looking average, he looks like what he has always looked like someone who doesn’t want to roll his sleeves up.
And wherever he goes that won’t be any different, they will just create the conditions in which a player like that is able to ply his trade more consistently.

Put it simply he will have better players around him. We already have clearly established he’s not your type of player. Me personally I’ve never come across anotherbplayer who has the same vision to make a pass like Ozil does, that’s clearly what Wenger sees in him but he’s a luxury player that I can agree to. He’s one that can make a good or great team look even better but in an average team like ours he is a filling in a mouth full of rotten teeth.

[Niall_Quinn]

It's not just his role on the pitch. The fact Ozil arrived at the supposed start of the new Arsenal era and will be leaving at the earliest opportunity following the almost instant termination of Arsenal's new era will be an enduring symbol of the lies and deceit dished out by the likes of Wenger and Lizard and the rats who scarpered and left us to die at the hands of Kroenke. When Ozil and Alexis go they'll be the last of the big players we'll see at this club for some time. Wenger and his fellow travellers will have cemented second tier status and the coveted 4th place spot really will be our title, if we can ever land it again.

Wenger got a 2 mill pay rise though, for bringing us to this point. So that's a silver lining.

[Power n Glory]

We will have to disagree about him looking average, he looks like what he has always looked like someone who doesn’t want to roll his sleeves up.
And wherever he goes that won’t be any different, they will just create the conditions in which a player like that is able to ply his trade more consistently.

Put it simply he will have better players around him. We already have clearly established he’s not your type of player. Me personally I’ve never come across anotherbplayer who has the same vision to make a pass like Ozil does, that’s clearly what Wenger sees in him but he’s a luxury player that I can agree to. He’s one that can make a good or great team look even better but in an average team like ours he is a filling in a mouth full of rotten teeth.

Of course you'd disagree. As expected.

[Letters]

Of course you'd disagree. As expected.

Him disagreeing with you doesn't make him wrong, you know.

[Power n Glory]

Him disagreeing with you doesn't make him wrong, you know.

Of course not.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Of course you'd disagree. As expected.

Whenever have I shared your view of Ozil?

I do think he merits a lot of the criticism he deserves but you do have form for your view of him. You’re not a fan, that’s long established.

As much as I find him frustrating, I am a fan of the type of player he can be albeit hugely inconsistently.

Go back a couple of years, we’ve had this same debate before. Maybe you want to concede that it’s what I genuinely think rather than thinking that I am doing it to contradict you, you aren’t that interesting to argue with that I’d need to make up or exaggerate my disagreement.

[Marc Overmars]

He's a silky player for sure but I'm sorry, he can't keep hiding behind the playing with rubbish players and Wenger being shit excuse. Even luxury players turn up with a degree of consistency, but this guy is a complete passenger half of the time and rarely seems to elevate us in the big games and moments.

Maybe he does need a better coach but I'm only interested in what I see him doing for Arsenal and for the last couple of years I've not seen a whole lot.

[Niall_Quinn]

He's a silky player for sure but I'm sorry, he can't keep hiding behind the playing with rubbish players and Wenger being shit excuse. Even luxury players turn up with a degree of consistency, but this guy is a complete passenger half of the time and rarely seems to elevate us in the big games and moments.

Maybe he does need a better coach but I'm only interested in what I see him doing for Arsenal and for the last couple of years I've not seen a whole lot.

Sounds like you'll be responsible for finding his replacement if the stories today are true.

Don't fuck it up!

[Power n Glory]

Whenever have I shared your view of Ozil?

I do think he merits a lot of the criticism he deserves but you do have form for your view of him. You’re not a fan, that’s long established.

As much as I find him frustrating, I am a fan of the type of player he can be albeit hugely inconsistently.

Go back a couple of years, we’ve had this same debate before. Maybe you want to concede that it’s what I genuinely think rather than thinking that I am doing it to contradict you, you aren’t that interesting to argue with that I’d need to make up or exaggerate my disagreement.

:lol: Can't let it go, can you? If I'm not interesting to argue you with, respond to someone else other than me. Master Splinter started this thread. Try arguing with him for a change. Or maybe Marc Overmars. I'm trying to keep the back and forth with you to the minimum because it does get boring. Take the hint and move on.

[selassie]

He's a silky player for sure but I'm sorry, he can't keep hiding behind the playing with rubbish players and Wenger being shit excuse. Even luxury players turn up with a degree of consistency, but this guy is a complete passenger half of the time and rarely seems to elevate us in the big games and moments.

Maybe he does need a better coach but I'm only interested in what I see him doing for Arsenal and for the last couple of years I've not seen a whole lot.

Aye, I don't rate him either, I don't really care what he does now because I've given up on him. I also think that if he is as great as some make him out to be then he would shining in this team and he isn't. He did have a very good half season spell a couple of seasons ago but that's all he has to show for it, he's a flop.

[Master Splinter]

Ozil with his shop-window performance.

Shame no-one's outside.

Or that no-one goes to shops anymore.

Ozil :haha:.

Can only perform against a ten-man sub-Derby County Merseyside Villagers XI.

[Master Splinter]

Probably the worst purchase in Arsenal history.

:gp:

[Niall_Quinn]

Get ALL our good players out. Buy shit. Let's go for mediocrity like we mean it. No more fucking around. I want to see a bid for Lee Cattermole in this January window OR ELSE!

[Marc Overmars]

But did you see how well he played against a dog shit Everton? He proved his worth then.

[Power n Glory]

I'm guessing Ozil went missing again?

[Niall_Quinn]

The whole thing is a shambles. There's nothing good, anywhere you look. When people refer to a total disaster, this is the textbook definition.

[Cripps]

Get ALL our good players out. Buy shit. Let's go for mediocrity like we mean it. No more fucking around. I want to see a bid for Lee Cattermole in this January window OR ELSE!

Let's bring Arteta out of retirement! :haha:

[Niall_Quinn]

Suppose it doesn't matter. The cunt could replace Ozil with Messi. Then he'd bench him.

[Özim]

Doesn't really matter, Sanchez and Ozill will be gone next summer, don't think either wants to stay on this sinking ship.

[Niall_Quinn]

True, but if Wenger and his gang can distract us all by focusing on Alexis and Ozil then it removes scrutiny from the dregs who will be staying. Because it will be dregs. Anyone who thinks Lacazette won't soon be scanning for an exit is not paying attention. Any player at this club who has a care for their career must surely be weighing up their options (while they still have options). In a few years the squad could be Theo Walcott and all his relatives.

[Marc Overmars]

He doesn’t even feature in the top assist chart anymore, so that string to his bow has gone.

[Master Splinter]

Remember that one good game he had against Everton away?

Fraudzil :bow:.

[Gubby Allen]

Remember that one good game he had against Everton away?

Fraudzil :bow:.

So is he earning about three times what Wilshere is? It should be the other way around.

[Niall_Quinn]

Remember that one good game he had against Everton away?

Fraudzil :bow:.

The one Pires dived in?

[Niall_Quinn]

All the things we feared Wenger would do to this club.

Have happened.

So there it is.

Well done all those who thinks he wears some kind of special hat. Good job. Way to go.

[Power n Glory]

Had a shocker of a first half. Despite playing with Lacazette and Aubameyang, he still can't carve out clean chances for these guys. They're making the runs. Further proof that the chance creation stat people pipe on about was complete bullshit.

[selassie]

Had a shocker of a first half. Despite playing with Lacazette and Aubameyang, he still can't carve out clean chances for these guys. They're making the runs. Further proof that the chance creation stat people pipe on about was complete bullshit.

Im not making excuses for Ozil’s poor performance today but it’s gotten to the stage now where it’s become impossible to objectively assess the performance of any of our players. I honestly think pretty much the entire first XI are capable of playing at a much higher level with a competent manager in charge. Wenger has shot the confidence of pretty much the entire team, look at Cech now, he is a complete mess with the ball at his feet.

[Niall_Quinn]

Im not making excuses for Ozil’s poor performance today but it’s gotten to the stage now where it’s become impossible to objectively assess the performance of any of our players. I honestly think pretty much the entire first XI are capable of playing at a much higher level with a competent manager in charge. Wenger has shot the confidence of pretty much the entire team, look at Cech now, he is a complete mess with the ball at his feet.

Good point. Cech WAS the consummate professional, a guy who had achieved at every level, Mr Football. The ultimate Pro.

But he didn't stand a chance against Wenger.

[Power n Glory]

Im not making excuses for Ozil’s poor performance today but it’s gotten to the stage now where it’s become impossible to objectively assess the performance of any of our players. I honestly think pretty much the entire first XI are capable of playing at a much higher level with a competent manager in charge. Wenger has shot the confidence of pretty much the entire team, look at Cech now, he is a complete mess with the ball at his feet.

Cech is getting old and i doubt he's ever been good with the ball at his feet. He shouldn't be put in such shit positions.

It all comes back to Wenger but I could tell within the first 5 minutes Ozil wasn't up for this game. He didn't look right from kick off. Had a better second half but there was a chance where he could have put Mkhitaryan or Aubameyang through on a counter attack but he fucked up the pass. Since passing is his speciality, he should have delivered. He's not low on confidence so I have no idea why he consistently fails to turn up for these massive games. It's a pattern with him.

I can't take the players completely out of the firing line. Shitbags like Xhaka need shooting in the kneecaps when you see his piss poor attempts to defend. It's not acceptable at any level. He's taking the piss and our weak and blind manager does nothing. When I see shit like that, it's hard for me to dismiss the piss poor effort and say it's down to Wenger being a shit tactician.

Same with Kos and that goal we conceded. There was no confusion on who should be marking Kane in that situation, the cowardly cunt just did a poor job of marking his man and knowing where he is.

It's a combination of the players and manager. But I'm sure under a better manager, these sort of performances wouldn't be tolerated. That's the thing with Wenger. Besides be an absolute retard when it comes to tactics, he also tolerates the worst sort of performances week in week out without reprisals. A complete cunt of a manager. Someone put him out of his misery.

[Niall_Quinn]

I can't even blame Xhaka. What should he do? Drop himself? We're just not a serious football club. At real clubs when a player is consistently shit he is dropped or sold. Here he gets nailed onto the team sheet. It's all Wenger. 100% e are so far beyond the players being on form, off form, giving 100%, giving 20% - none of it matters because the larger things are so badly fucked up.

It's 100% Wenger. He's to blame for everything. Even the money. He's had money and he spent 70 mill on Xhaka and Mustafi. He's a fuck up. He's given Jack a pay cut while our captain doesn't even make the bench any more. This is a fucking joke of a club - mismanaged from top to bottom by the fuck who is to blame for it all - Wenger.

[Power n Glory]

I can't even blame Xhaka. What should he do? Drop himself? We're just not a serious football club. At real clubs when a player is consistently shit he is dropped or sold. Here he gets nailed onto the team sheet. It's all Wenger. 100% e are so far beyond the players being on form, off form, giving 100%, giving 20% - none of it matters because the larger things are so badly fucked up.

It's 100% Wenger. He's to blame for everything. Even the money. He's had money and he spent 70 mill on Xhaka and Mustafi. He's a fuck up. He's given Jack a pay cut while our captain doesn't even make the bench any more. This is a fucking joke of a club - mismanaged from top to bottom by the fuck who is to blame for it all - Wenger.

I'm gonna agree with you. All focus should go on Wenger.

[Özim]

Wenger accepts sup par performances and poor work rate, he even rewards it by not dropping players.

The team selection isn't so much a team selected for the opposition, more a team selected based on who Wenger likes, we didn't close Spurs down and chase the ball enough, we didn't look in the mood and weren't up for the match, any manager would have lost his rag at the players and would have certainly have them more motivated than they were, Wenger just wants to pick his favourite team and then just let them play if they fancy it.

Xhaka is a prime example, rubbish in every single game and yet still one of the first players on the teamsheet, anyone with any logic would try someone else, personally feel sorry for players like Lacazette, when you're not flavour of the day with Wenger you don't get a fair crack. There's no fairness in team selection at Arsenal, if the manager likes you, you play, even if you've been making errors left, right and centre.

[Master Splinter]

Remember when he went on a run of two and a half games of acceptable form to earn a new contract?

Hopefully the first one out when Rodgers takes over.

He is the embodiment of latter years Wenger on the pitch.

[Power n Glory]

Predictable. Checked out after the score of his life.

[Mac76]

Remember when he went on a run of two and a half games of acceptable form to earn a new contract?

Hopefully the first one out when Rodgers takes over.

He is the embodiment of latter years Wenger on the pitch.

If Rodgers takes over i'll be the first one out - talk about frying pans and fires...

It will be the end of the club

[Power n Glory]

http://www.espn.co.uk/football/arsenal/story/3486444/arsenals-mesut-ozil-may-miss-final-games-of-season-with-back-injury

:lol: Ozil may not play for the rest of the season. Keown called it. We should play Iwobi or Mhiki as the 10.

As for Ozil, new manager has to put this guy in check. Ozil may find himself on the chopping block if he doesn't sort himself out just like what happened at Madrid. Pathetic.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Poor guy, can't get over the flu now his back has given out on him.

:(

[Xhaka Can’t]

I don’t care if I never see him stinking up an Arsenal shirt again.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Now that we've got him signed up so we'll get a decent fee we could reinvest I wouldn't be too opposed to it provide there's a genuine footballing reason for it, not the BS reason they gave for RVP leaving.

It would depend on the new manager and the style of football we want to play.

The biggest problem is that it would diminish our commercial power at a time we can ill afford to lose it (deals coming up). The guy has more twitter followers than the club. It's probably for the best if we could establish ourselves in the top four and then flog him tbh.

[Marc Overmars]

A very appropriate injury. Spineless.

[Power n Glory]

Just replace him ffs. We sold Sanchez but still managed to get Mkhitaryan and Aubameyang.

We're in advanced negotiations for our new kit deal and that should be signed soon and announced by the end of next season. Once that's done, he can't dimminsh our commercial power. The real danger is that if he continues to stink out the joint we'll have a player on £350k that we can't shift. That's probably the case already because he failed to attract much interest the last time round. On that contract and looking at his recent performances, we're going to have a serious problem moving him on.

If he can't make an impact during the World Cup or under our new manager, we're going to be stuck with him. How long is his contract?

[Marc Overmars]

The days of Ozil making an impact are over. He is the ultimate luxury player now, picks and chooses when he turns up. I hope the new manager doesn’t give him an easy ride like Wenger did.

[Letters]

You guys are nuts :lol:

He needs better management but he's one of our few properly world class players.

[Power n Glory]

You guys are nuts :lol:

He needs better management but he's one of our few properly world class players.

Key questions.

Can he be replaced?

Are the amount of games he misses through 'sickness' acceptable?

I'm not debating this whole 'world class' tag that's open to interpretation or him needing better management. We'll soon see if it's down to better management because I also remember it being said that he needed faster strikers in front of him. We've ditched Giroud and still no change with Lacazette and Aubameyang in front of him.

[Niall_Quinn]

Replace him BEFORE the new manager comes in?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw9oX-kZ_9k

[Power n Glory]

Replace him BEFORE the new manager comes in?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw9oX-kZ_9k

It's obvious that won't happen. But if he can't up his game with a new manager, we have to try and get rid of him. I'm disagree with what TEG said about waiting until we're back in the Top 4.

[Goonermerree]

I don't see the point of him and it galls me that he has so much time off when he gets so much money.

[Letters]

Can he be replaced?

I would never say anyone is irreplaceable, a better question is can we replace him with anyone who is as effective.
I know there's a perception that he isn't effective but statistically, he is:
https://talksport.com/football/arsenal-fc-news-amazing-mesut-ozil-assists-and-chances-created-stats-180131270735


Are the amount of games he misses through 'sickness' acceptable?

Not this season. But it would be crazy to get rid of a player of that quality when a new manager is just coming in.
I don't believe any new manager would come in and think that Ozil is one of our big problems and we need to sell him.

[Power n Glory]

I would never say anyone is irreplaceable, a better question is can we replace him with anyone who is as effective.
I know there's a perception that he isn't effective but statistically, he is:
https://talksport.com/football/arsenal-fc-news-amazing-mesut-ozil-assists-and-chances-created-stats-180131270735



Not this season. But it would be crazy to get rid of a player of that quality when a new manager is just coming in.
I don't believe any new manager would come in and think that Ozil is one of our big problems and we need to sell him.

Mkhitaryan looked fine yesterday from what I heard.

Also, you forget about how we got Ozil in the first place. It's happened to him before. I'm not sure what's going to happen this summer but Ozil will have to work harder and impress if he wants to keep his place.

[Letters]

Mkhitaryan is looking very good but wouldn't having him AND Ozil be the ideal?
If we're going to seriously compete we need some real depth in our squad.

[Power n Glory]

Mkhitaryan is looking very good but wouldn't having him AND Ozil be the ideal?
If we're going to seriously compete we need some real depth in our squad.

No. The ideal would be to have a good squad all willing to put in the performances and not check out for the big games or call in sick when they feel like a break.

If we're serious about competing, we can't accommodate that sort of attitude from anyone.

[Letters]

Agreed, and I've already agreed Ozil has missed too many games this year.
But selling a player of his quality before a new manager has had a chance to work with him is crazy.

[Power n Glory]

Agreed, and I've already agreed Ozil has missed too many games this year.
But selling a player of his quality before a new manager has had a chance to work with him is crazy.

I haven't said that he should be sold before a new manager arrives. The point I'm making is that he may find himself in the same situation that happened at Madrid when Ancelotti arrived where he finds himself out of favour rather quickly. A new manager may look at him as a type of player they can't use and won't want to indulge especially if they don't have to.

[selassie]

I haven't said that he should be sold before a new manager arrives. The point I'm making is that he may find himself in the same situation that happened at Madrid when Ancelotti arrived where he finds himself out of favour rather quickly. A new manager may look at him as a type of player they can't use and won't want to indulge especially if they don't have to.

I do agree with your stance on him. I think Ozil should be treated and judged as a first team player like everybody else and not as some kind of "teacher's pet" which was clearly the treatment he was getting from Wenger.


I would go as far as to say if he keeps on pulling these phantom sickies then he should be dropped from the team. He is one of our best players...but he certainly isn't irreplaceable.

I like him as a player...but I truly hope the new boss pushes him like every other first team player should be pushed.

[Gooner23]

I always wondered if Ozil had some specific clauses inserted into his contract when he first signed for us.

At the time it was a major coup so perhaps they insisted on some things before he signed such as his unofficial winter break and also these 'sick' leaves.

He pretty much always gets 90 minutes as well (injury aside), even if he was completely stinking out the place Wenger would still keep him on for the duration.

[Bumble]

how can we get rid of him though. £300k a week is a lot of money and any sensible club wouldn't pay that. So only really leaves China

[Niall_Quinn]

Why on earth would we want to get rid of him? As fans, I mean. He's been our best player by a mile. That's maybe not saying much considering none of the players have shown any sort of consistency at the top level. But all this media nonsense that many fans have bought into is just that, bullshit. We are a much better team when Ozil plays. We've seen in the past the beginnings of a partnership with Alexis, but the idiot Wenger ruined that. Now we have seen glimpses of the beginnings of a partnership with Mkhitaryan, though the idiot Wenger churned that around too.

The idiot Wenger may be the cause of these Ozil "sickies". It's not an admirable quality either way in terms of the player's attitude, but if Wenger had reached the low point where he was such an undesirable factor for any prospective top tier player and the club had to bribe Ozil to stay then Wenger's idiocy has to be taken into account too. I suppose Ozil stayed on the basis his participation in the World Cup would be protected at all costs. A despicable clause in any contract if true, but it's the most likely explanation given the idiot Wenger's apparent willingness to go along with the sickness/ slight injury/ tired bullshit that has been used to explain the player's absence.

The next manager won't be an idiot like the idiot Wenger. And it will be down to the new guy to decide what he can get from the player. As fans we should be excited to see what can be achieved, not just with Ozil but with the whole squad once they are managed by somebody who isn't an idiot. And I assume the new guy will act if players can't pull their weight. I assume his goals will be focused on winning rather than ensuring maximum transfer sell on value or the other types of nonsense the idiot Wenger agonised over.

Ozil won't spend the last 3 years of his career stuck on a bench. So if nobody wants him at 300k per week his only option will be to muck in and give it 100%. He'll still want that last big pay day in China or the States I'm guessing. And he'll still want to play at International level. So he'll need to satisfy the new Arsenal manager to achieve any of that. Of course, under the idiot Wenger he could take the piss. Does anyone think that's likely to continue under a manager who isn't a complete idiot?

[Power n Glory]

Of course, under the idiot Wenger he could take the piss. Does anyone think that's likely to continue under a manager who isn't a complete idiot?

I can't respect a professional footballer that would rather sit games out and take the piss because he has a weak manager. It's no excuse.

Also, I don't think the next manager will tolerate it. Or I hope not. This is where we have a problem. If Ozil doesn't stop his game up under new management, we're going to be stuck with him.

This is why people say he's not fit to where the shirt. If you're saying he's taking the piss because he can, he's not fit to wear the shirt. I don't care how shit Wenger has been. It's the same sort of shit I won't accept from players like Xhaka and Mustafi. Certain things there is just no excuse for.

[Niall_Quinn]

I can't respect a professional footballer that would rather sit games out and take the piss because he has a weak manager. It's no excuse.

Also, I don't think the next manager will tolerate it. Or I hope not. This is where we have a problem. If Ozil doesn't stop his game up under new management, we're going to be stuck with him.

This is why people say he's not fit to where the shirt. If you're saying he's taking the piss because he can, he's not fit to wear the shirt. I don't care how shit Wenger has been. It's the same sort of shit I won't accept from players like Xhaka and Mustafi. Certain things there is just no excuse for.

None of them are fit to wear the shirt, are they? Except, perhaps, the very newest players who haven't had a chance to acclimatise to Wenger's world of piss taking - we will see. Fighting Burnley for 6th place? Not even bothering to turn up to a Euro semi? This is Wenger's world and these are the players who live there. A bizarre place that is unlikely to be replicated ever again.

But pushing to get rid of Ozil at the very moment of change is nonsensical. One of the key jobs for the new man will be to ensure all the players are not only fit to wear the shirt but also good enough. Which means we keep Ozil and get rid of Welbeck. Anything else is cutting our nose off to spite our face. We don't have the gypo's cash mountain so repairing the quality members of the squad we already have and deprogramming the players is a sensible route.

[Niall_Quinn]

BTW, we now also have a chief scout who is not a complete idiot. When you add up all of Wenger's idiocy and how it all combined to create such a shit show, we should have great expectations for a profound transformation in so many areas once the idiot has gone.

[Power n Glory]

None of them are fit to wear the shirt, are they? Except, perhaps, the very newest players who haven't had a chance to acclimatise to Wenger's world of piss taking - we will see. Fighting Burnley for 6th place? Not even bothering to turn up to a Euro semi? This is Wenger's world and these are the players who live there. A bizarre place that is unlikely to be replicated ever again.

But pushing to get rid of Ozil at the very moment of change is nonsensical. One of the key jobs for the new man will be to ensure all the players are not only fit to wear the shirt but also good enough. Which means we keep Ozil and get rid of Welbeck. Anything else is cutting our nose off to spite our face. We don't have the gypo's cash mountain so repairing the quality members of the squad we already have and deprogramming the players is a sensible route.

The lengths you will go to justify a player taking time off and choosing when to play. What’s worse is the fact that you’ll talk about how influential he is and being our best player but at the same time justify him taking days off. Shouldn’t a player with that sort of talent be under more scrutiny if he has the ability to change a game for us? He should be doing everything he can to have an impact on the game. You should be embarrassed to defend this sort of diva like behaviour. It shouldn’t be acceptable. From anyone!

How can you even criticise Wenger if you’re willing to back a player that’s not giving his all and taking the absolute piss because of weak leadership but also milking the club for every penny he can? It’s different to other players because we can at least assume they run out of answers on the pitch and lose faith. But when you have a player as skilled as Ozil taking days off and not wanting to play…that’s not a team player or someone that cares about the club or fans. Fuck no is he worthy of this sort of praise from you.

[Marc Overmars]

Never has a player been afforded more excuses than Ozil, it’s always someone else’s doing that he can’t consistently perform for us. He’s no longer the assist king either, infact he barely features anymore in the charts for that.

[Letters]

Never has a player been afforded more excuses than Ozil, it’s always someone else’s doing that he can’t consistently perform for us. He’s no longer the assist king either, infact he barely features anymore in the charts for that.

He's created more chances than anyone this season but De Bruyne

https://talksport.com/football/premier-league-201718-players-most-chances-created-season-revealed-and-ranked-180321276292?p=4

So one could argue that the lack of assists is more our strikers' incompetence than his.
I remember that Southampton game last season when he created about 8 good chances and it finished 0-0.
I like a good stat, me, but assists aren't the only relevant metric. If he's putting them on a plate and they're not being finished then that's not his fault.

[Power n Glory]

He's created more chances than anyone this season but De Bruyne

https://talksport.com/football/premier-league-201718-players-most-chances-created-season-revealed-and-ranked-180321276292?p=4

So one could argue that the lack of assists is more our strikers' incompetence than his.
I remember that Southampton game last season when he created about 8 good chances and it finished 0-0.
I like a good stat, me, but assists aren't the only relevant metric. If he's putting them on a plate and they're not being finished then that's not his fault.

:lol: When was the last time he put it on a plate for Aubameyang and Lacazette and they fucked it up? How often does he find either player?

[Letters]

Maybe...not every chance Ozil has created has fallen to them? They've scored 8 and 17 goals respectively.
We haven't had Aubameyang all season, Lacazette hasn't played as much as he should have.
I think both are good strikers and I'm quite excited about our front line for next season.
The general point is Ozil has been creating plenty of chance this season, if those haven't turned into assists then it's bizarre to completely blame Ozil for that, the other player has to do their bit too.

[Power n Glory]

Maybe...not every chance Ozil has created has fallen to them? They've scored 8 and 17 goals respectively.
We haven't had Aubameyang all season, Lacazette hasn't played as much as he should have.
I think both are good strikers and I'm quite excited about our front line for next season.
The general point is Ozil has been creating plenty of chance this season, if those haven't turned into assists then it's bizarre to completely blame Ozil for that, the other player has to do their bit too.

I've already gone over this and posted a video of what counts as a chance created. Any chance created that results in a shot in target counts as a created chance. So if Ozil pulls a Hleb and cuts the ball back to a player that's getting charged down and the shot gets blocked, that still counts as a chance created.

It speaks nothing of the quality. Also, it's a worry if he can't find quality strikers like Aube and Laca to finish chances. For example, if he's creating chances for overlapping wingbacks to blast into the side netting that's not something to rave about. We often get so congested down the middle there is no where else to go but wide and it ends up at the feet of the least threatening player. Unless you're Monreal. :lol:

Same goes if he's taking corners that result in a tame header or something that goes well wide. Those aren't chances to write or home about. Most of what he creates doesn't put the key players into great positions.

[Marc Overmars]

I'll wait and see what a new coach can get out of him but I expect more of the same if I'm honest. The same flaky performances with the odd freak game where he'll get a few assists and "remind" everyone of his ability.

[Mac76]

I've already gone over this and posted a video of what counts as a chance created. Any chance created that results in a shot in target counts as a created chance. So if Ozil pulls a Hleb and cuts the ball back to a player that's getting charged down and the shot gets blocked, that still counts as a chance created.

It speaks nothing of the quality. Also, it's a worry if he can't find quality strikers like Aube and Laca to finish chances. For example, if he's creating chances for overlapping wingbacks to blast into the side netting that's not something to rave about. We often get so congested down the middle there is no where else to go but wide and it ends up at the feet of the least threatening player. Unless you're Monreal. :lol:

Same goes if he's taking corners that result in a tame header or something that goes well wide. Those aren't chances to write or home about. Most of what he creates doesn't put the key players into great positions.

i agree but you can't overestimate the extent to which Wenger nerfed our team through making them pass pass pass instead of being more direct, plus playing the wrong lineup half the time - noone would find it easy trying to get Walcott and Welbeck to score.

but that can't explain the time off and it seems odd tbh but maybe there's something we don't know about, all the same it does leave a bad taste in the mouth considering what he's paid

i do think another manager might be able to get better - and more - performances out of him, so we may as well wait and see.

to me he's clearly more of a confidence player than most and Wenger as we know isn't a good man manager

[Niall_Quinn]

The lengths you will go to justify a player taking time off and choosing when to play. What’s worse is the fact that you’ll talk about how influential he is and being our best player but at the same time justify him taking days off. Shouldn’t a player with that sort of talent be under more scrutiny if he has the ability to change a game for us? He should be doing everything he can to have an impact on the game. You should be embarrassed to defend this sort of diva like behaviour. It shouldn’t be acceptable. From anyone!

How can you even criticise Wenger if you’re willing to back a player that’s not giving his all and taking the absolute piss because of weak leadership but also milking the club for every penny he can? It’s different to other players because we can at least assume they run out of answers on the pitch and lose faith. But when you have a player as skilled as Ozil taking days off and not wanting to play…that’s not a team player or someone that cares about the club or fans. Fuck no is he worthy of this sort of praise from you.

Sorry, but our fucking club captain was clapped off the pitch over the weekend for taking the last 2 years off. Under Wenger this has been a very fucked up club. All change now and it seems reasonable to suggest that anyone who doesn't want to change is out. But letting the new guy get his feet under the desk is long way from making excuses for Ozil - which I didn't do btw, in fact I have been singling out his random holidays for weeks now.

[Power n Glory]

Sorry, but our fucking club captain was clapped off the pitch over the weekend for taking the last 2 years off. Under Wenger this has been a very fucked up club. All change now and it seems reasonable to suggest that anyone who doesn't want to change is out. But letting the new guy get his feet under the desk is long way from making excuses for Ozil - which I didn't do btw, in fact I have been singling out his random holidays for weeks now.

Merts is at retirement age where he's more of liability on the pitch and has more use to us coaching behind the scenes. Ozil is in peak condition and these should be his best years. Are you really comparing the two situations?

Also, how many times do I have to repeat myself on this? I'm not saying we should sell Ozil before the new guy arrives, I'm saying Ozil needs to sort himself out when the new guy arrives. The amount of sick days he takes won't have gone unnoticed and the amount of no shows on the pitch will also be issue. Whoever takes over will either want to push him beyond the shite we've seen so far or show him the exit. Especially if it looks like he's not training hard and coasting during a game.

[Niall_Quinn]

Merts is at retirement age where he's more of liability on the pitch and has more use to us coaching behind the scenes. Ozil is in peak condition and these should be his best years. Are you really comparing the two situations?

Also, how many times do I have to repeat myself on this? I'm not saying we should sell Ozil before the new guy arrives, I'm saying Ozil needs to sort himself out when the new guy arrives. The amount of sick days he takes won't have gone unnoticed and the amount of no shows on the pitch will also be issue. Whoever takes over will either want to push him beyond the shite we've seen so far or show him the exit. Especially if it looks like he's not training hard and coasting during a game.

Of course it's the same thing. At what other club would you see any of this? The captain benched for 2 years writing about how he doesn't fancy playing any more and the star player on holiday all the time? It could only be Wenger's Arsenal.

Accountability. Wenger never had any and he never demanded any from his players either. A disaster that now has to be undone.

[Power n Glory]

Of course it's the same thing. At what other club would you see any of this? The captain benched for 2 years writing about how he doesn't fancy playing any more and the star player on holiday all the time? It could only be Wenger's Arsenal.

Accountability. Wenger never had any and he never demanded any from his players either. A disaster that now has to be undone.

As said, the lengths you go to justify Ozil's disappearing act. If you can't tell the difference between a player that's in peak physical condition choosing not to play because he doesn't fancy it over a player about to retire and taking on a player/coach role, I can't help you. It boils down to professional pride. You mention accountability but always fail to hold the players accountable.

[Niall_Quinn]

As said, the lengths you go to justify Ozil's disappearing act. If you can't tell the difference between a player that's in peak physical condition choosing not to play because he doesn't fancy it over a player about to retire and taking on a player/coach role, I can't help you. It boils down to professional pride. You mention accountability but always fail to hold the players accountable.

And what utility did they club get from either of the players when they were missing? And if Merts wasn't fit to play then why has he been on the payroll for the last 2 years? Professional pride? A far worse case of absence, but he's clapped off as a hero?

No, sorry. You need to defend your constant sniping at Ozil by insisting I have been excusing his absences when, in every recent match thread, you'll find posts by me to the contrary. This thread, even by your own admission, remains as irrelevant as ever because there's no way anything is happening with Ozil until the new guy gets in.

[Goonermerree]

Charity FC, that's Arsenal. So many players have been on our books for sentiment only. Per should have been gone a couple of years ago. The money we've paid him we could have got better defender in.Ozil shouldn't have been given such a pay rise and then be allowed to not play. It's not as if he plays half the time when he's on the pitch. He is a good player, but we can't afford passengers.

[Ralpheroo72]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44122247

He should not be posing with that despot. Arsenal shirt in tow as well.

[Özim]

Charity FC, that's Arsenal. So many players have been on our books for sentiment only. Per should have been gone a couple of years ago. The money we've paid him we could have got better defender in.Ozil shouldn't have been given such a pay rise and then be allowed to not play. It's not as if he plays half the time when he's on the pitch. He is a good player, but we can't afford passengers.

Totally agree, Mertersacker shouldn't even have been kept at the club, was never much of a leader or a player who led by example, was never anything special for us either, like you said we should have moved him on years ago and brought a quality CB in.

[Mac76]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44122247

He should not be posing with that despot. Arsenal shirt in tow as well.

i agree - very disappointing

[Niall_Quinn]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44122247

He should not be posing with that despot. Arsenal shirt in tow as well.

He shouldn't have an Arsenal shirt. But no International can be criticised for engaging in promotion. That's what the World Cup is mostly about these days.

Maybe the puffed up Jihadi has a couple of gunmen just out of shot to make sure the players smile broadly enough.

[Goonermerree]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44122247

He should not be posing with that despot. Arsenal shirt in tow as well.

Ozil makes me so mad, he can' t play for Arsenal, no respect for the club, and gives an Arsenal shirt to a despot. I think Arsenal should fine him 6 months wages.

[Xhaka Can’t]

That is grounds for terminating his contract.