Match reaction - Man City

[Cripps]

Wenger :haha:

[Marc Overmars]

We’re not very good but we knew that already.

Spurs next. :yawn:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Stupid fucking game anyway.

[Letters]

Check score after
Think "oh"
Get on with my day.

You should try it.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Makes debating anything a bit harder if you never watch it anymore.

[Marc Overmars]

So...why was our 50m striker benched? (Again for another big away game)

[selassie]

I’m just glad the score was respectable. This one was a write off for me, next week kind of is as well though I think we’ll get a point next week.

[Marc Overmars]

I’m just glad the score was respectable. This one was a write off for me, next week kind of is as well though I think we’ll get a point next week.

Great result tbh. Honestly thought we’d be hit for 5.

[Cripps]

I see cech kept up the trend of diving the wrong way as usual for the penalty

The useless fool

[The Emirates Gallactico]

FFS. We weren't great but we could have gotten a draw out of that with some better refereeing.

Though it terms of quality of play and intent to win you can't begrudge City winning.

The Lacazette decision still astounds me.


Check score after
Think "oh"
Get on with my day.

You should try it.

Why do you still support the club if you're not at least prepared to follow/watch/listen to the big games at the very least when you have the opportunity to?

[Niall_Quinn]

Real result was 1-1.

Not bad.

We were supposed to get blown away. Didn't happen. The gypos were shown up to be the shite they are, having to pay the officials to get the result. And anyone who even makes a case for those official - SHAME ON YOU!

[Globalgunner]

FFS. We weren't great but we could have gotten a draw out of that with some better refereeing.

Though it terms of quality of play and intent to win you can't begrudge City winning.

The Lacazette decision still astounds me.



Why do you still support the club if you're not at least prepared to follow/watch/listen to the big games at the very least when you have the opportunity to?

Ill let you in on a secret. Letters IS Wenger. He just got back from the game and giving a few interviews.

[Cripps]

Why do you still support the club if you're not at least prepared to follow/watch/listen to the big games at the very least when you have the opportunity to?

The funny thing is for years he was warning us all be careful what you wish for and now he's the one not watching the games :lol:

[Letters]

Why do you still support the club if you're not at least prepared to follow/watch/listen to the big games at the very least when you have the opportunity to?

I don't have to justify my level of following the club. Used to have a season ticket, now can't be arsed watching at all.
Still keep an eye on the scores but quite honestly sick of the state of the club and football in general.
It's so rarely enjoyable watching Arsenal these days I have better ways of spending my time.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I think we'll get a fine for our six yellows. :bow:

[Özim]

With a lineup like that (Coquelin and Xhaka in the team :lol: and no Lacazette :lol:) you're looking at a defeat, the way I see it Wenger got what he deserved today, you'd have to live in cloud cuckoo land not to start Lacazette today, nevermind not starting him and taking him off as much as Wenger does, it's beyond a joke.

Expected a defeat so it's not surprised, no excuses there's a reason we're so far behind, we're not good enough, City played in midweek let's not forget and our lot were rested.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

The funny thing is for years he was warning us all be careful what you wish for and now he's the one not watching the games :lol:

True. I like Letters, but if he's not going to suffer along with the rest of us in watching the games then he loses a lot of moral authority to lambast us for "overreacting" and being feverently "anti-Wenger".

[selassie]

Real result was 1-1.

Not bad.

We were supposed to get blown away. Didn't happen. The gypos were shown up to be the shite they are, having to pay the officials to get the result. And anyone who even makes a case for those official - SHAME ON YOU!

Come on NQ, we could and should have been 4 down at Half Time. They weren’t great and the penalty and third goal were very debatable but they were the better side for long periods of the game. We only threatened for a 10/15 minute period after we went 2 down. We are a level below teams like City and it showed, we are not even a top 4 team anymore.

[Cripps]

True. I like Letters, but if he's not going to suffer along with the rest of us in watching the games then he loses a lot of moral authority to lambast us for "overreacting" and being feverently "anti-Wenger".

:gp:

[Letters]

Just to add, don't massively care we lost. No disgrace losing up there. The issue is we all pretty much KNEW we'd lose. Long gone are the days when we used to believe we could get results in these sorts of games

[Niall_Quinn]

I think we'll get a fine for our six yellows. :bow:

tbf, there was a very blatant brush against a shoulder for one of those yellows. Poor gypo trailer trash could have been killed.

Unfortunately he wasn't.

[Niall_Quinn]

Just to add, don't massively care we lost. No disgrace losing up there. The issue is we all pretty much KNEW we'd lose. Long gone are the days when we used to believe we could get results in these sorts of games

Honestly though - fuck off Letters.

[Niall_Quinn]

Come on NQ, we could and should have been 4 down at Half Time. They weren’t great and the penalty and third goal were very debatable but they were the better side for long periods of the game. We only threatened for a 10/15 minute period after we went 2 down. We are a level below teams like City and it showed, we are not even a top 4 team anymore.

I already said, the gypos are super hyped turds. Not our fault if they have Sterling in their team, is it?

I only care about what happened. And what happened was blatant corruption. Two shit teams who had as much chance to pub a result as each other, and the ref comes in and decides it. End of.

[Letters]

True. I like Letters, but if he's not going to suffer along with the rest of us in watching the games then he loses a lot of moral authority to lambast us for "overreacting" and being feverently "anti-Wenger".
When's the last time I did that?
I'll still respond to some of the nonsense like the thing about our squad being "average". I don't think that is so. But the sort of thing you're talking about I haven't done for ages.

[Cripps]

Just to add, don't massively care we lost. No disgrace losing up there. The issue is we all pretty much KNEW we'd lose. Long gone are the days when we used to believe we could get results in these sorts of games

Well we tried to warn you :coffee:

[The Emirates Gallactico]

I don't have to justify my level of following the club. Used to have a season ticket, now can't be arsed watching at all.
Still keep an eye on the scores but quite honestly sick of the state of the club and football in general.
It's so rarely enjoyable watching Arsenal these days I have better ways of spending my time.

You're entitled to support the club however you want Letters but if you're not prepared to stick it out with the rest of us then I don't see how you can have a go at NQ or the others for theirs views, when they tough it out and suffer having to watch the shit we sometimes churn out.

It's easy to support the club when the things are going well but much more difficult when times are hard - but that's what separates fans from fairweathers.

I'd say the same thing to Zim who often seems to pop in to check the score and then bitch and moan without knowing how we've actually played.

[Letters]

Honestly though - fuck off Letters.

:gp:

[Niall_Quinn]

When's the last time I did that?
I'll still respond to some of the nonsense like the thing about our squad being "average". I don't think that is so. But the sort of thing you're talking about I haven't done for ages.

Did you watch the game today?

And if you did, if you can't see this squad is average you are literally blind. Why persist with this? Xhaka has been turned into shit by Wenger. The poor bastard can't kick a ball. He's literally worse than me. And be very sure of one thing, I'm shit. But I'm better than Xhaka.

[Niall_Quinn]

:gp:

Your dulcet, oh so reasonable routine is the VERY LAST THING we need right now.

[Letters]

It's easy to support the club when the things are going well but much more difficult when times are hard - but that's what separates fans from fairweathers.
It's not about how good or bad things are, for me it's about how predictable it all is.
I'm not going to watch Murder on the Orient Express, I've read the book and I know who dunnit.
What's the point in watching a murder mystery without the mystery?
This is increasingly feeling the same. And it's rarely enjoyable watching us play.
And that's without the way football as a sport has gone.

Others have expressed similar levels of ennui, why have a go at me?

[Cripps]

Did you watch the game today?

And if you did, if you can't see this squad is average you are literally blind. Why persist with this? Xhaka has been turned into shit by Wenger. The poor bastard can't kick a ball. He's literally worse than me. And be very sure of one thing, I'm shit. But I'm better than Xhaka.

That's true. A family member in Germany told me Xhaka was very good when we signed him. He's literally turned to sh*t. If he was at Chelsea or Utd he'd be a completely different player.

[Letters]

Your dulcet, oh so reasonable routine is the VERY LAST THING we need right now.

How old are you?
Serious question.
I think you're older than me and you still get this wound up about football?
Especially in a game when we all knew the result ahead of time.
You need to have a word with yourself fella.

[Cripps]

It's not about how good or bad things are, for me it's about how predictable it all is.
I'm not going to watch Murder on the Orient Express, I've read the book and I know who dunnit.
What's the point in watching a murder mystery without the mystery?
This is increasingly feeling the same. And it's rarely enjoyable watching us play.
And that's without the way football as a sport has gone.

Others have expressed similar levels of ennui, why have a go at me?

Because you're the one that constantly pops up backing Wenger, providing a positive spin or providing devils advocate scenarios. Or maybe the fact you antagonise and WUM :shrug:

[Niall_Quinn]

It's not about how good or bad things are, for me it's about how predictable it all is.
I'm not going to watch Murder on the Orient Express, I've read the book and I know who dunnit.
What's the point in watching a murder mystery without the mystery?
This is increasingly feeling the same. And it's rarely enjoyable watching us play.
And that's without the way football as a sport has gone.

Others have expressed similar levels of ennui, why have a go at me?

Letters. PLEASE.

We are still fans, regardless of it all.

We can say we don't care until we are blue in the face. But we do, for better, for worse or even with Wenger as a manager.

I can just about live with us being shit, which we are.

But I can assure you, we aren't the only shit in this league, as we just saw. And when corrupt cunts intervene to sort the shit from the shit, well that's treads on areas way beyond football. And if we won't fight or even get energised in those areas then we are dead.

I'm not dead, I'm alive.

How about you?

[hobson's choice]

I'm not Dissappointed at all today. Wenger not starting Lacazette was a big mistake, opportunities were there for the taking in the 1st half.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm not Dissappointed at all today. Wenger not starting Lacazette was a big mistake, opportunities were there in the taking in the 1st half.

It's Wenger. What do you expect?

[Cripps]

I'm not Dissappointed at all today. Wenger not starting Lacazette was a big mistake, opportunities were there in the taking in the 1st half.

He's failed to start Lacazette in our 2 biggest away games. Anfield and City. He bought a £50m striker and benched him for the 2 biggest games. Madness.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

It's not about how good or bad things are, for me it's about how predictable it all is.
I'm not going to watch Murder on the Orient Express, I've read the book and I know who dunnit.
What's the point in watching a murder mystery without the mystery?
This is increasingly feeling the same. And it's rarely enjoyable watching us play.
And that's without the way football as a sport has gone.

Others have expressed similar levels of ennui, why have a go at me?

Because you're the one bragging about not watching the game on here.


That's true. A family member in Germany told me Xhaka was very good when we signed him. He's literally turned to sh*t. If he was at Chelsea or Utd he'd be a completely different player.

He was one of the most sought after young midfielders in the Bundesliga when we signed him - Man Utd were linked the season before. And now look at him.


How old are you?
Serious question.
I think you're older than me and you still get this wound up about football?
Especially in a game when we all knew the result ahead of time.
You need to have a word with yourself fella.

I know it seems that you've given up Letters old but what's wrong with NQ displaying some passion and emotion about how bad things are? :lol::lol:

Football is a passionate sport!

[Niall_Quinn]

I just want to drift back in time and go on up to Highbury and watch Liam Brady. That would suit me just fine.

[Power n Glory]

I didn't watch the game. Chose to watch Star Wars Episode III Revenge of the Sith instead. Good movie. A tale of the downfall of good man because of arrogance and selfishness. How a democracy turned to a dictatorship. Quite fitting to our circumstances when thinking about it.

[Niall_Quinn]

I didn't watch the game. Chose to watch Star Wars Episode III Revenge of the Sith instead. Good movie. A tale of the downfall of good man because of arrogance and selfishness. How a democracy turned to a dictatorship. Quite fitting to our circumstances when thinking about it.

Now you are just showing off.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Even he (Brady) eventually fecked off though when it ended in failure.

Us against Valencia. :doh:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I didn't watch the game. Chose to watch Star Wars Episode III Revenge of the Sith instead. Good movie. A tale of the downfall of good man because of arrogance and selfishness. How a democracy turned to a dictatorship. Quite fitting to our circumstances when thinking about it.

He was redeemed in the end though.

[Niall_Quinn]

Even he (Brady) eventually fecked off though when it ended in failure.

Us against Valencia. :doh:

Yeah, but at least we still had Ford Cortinas.

[Niall_Quinn]

Anything decent on TV tonight to take our minds off footie?

Is it Walking Dead?

Did I say decent :doh:

[Niall_Quinn]

But back to Alan Smith.

What the fuck is that guy's problem?

[Power n Glory]

Because you're the one bragging about not watching the game on here.



He was one of the most sought after young midfielders in the Bundesliga when we signed him - Man Utd were linked the season before. And now look at him.



I know it seems that you've given up Letters old but what's wrong with NQ displaying some passion and emotion about how bad things are? :lol::lol:

Football is a passionate sport!

Letters has always been the one to say to be careful what you wish for when it comes to changing managers and this club doing a Man Utd with Moyes. But he's not even watching the games anymore. I'm starting to do the same. How much worse can it be when fans can't even be bothered to switch on? That's the death of a football club if everyone adopts the same sort of thinking. Wenger has totally fucked us.

[Niall_Quinn]

Letters has always been the one to say to be careful what you wish for when it comes to changing managers and this club doing a Man Utd with Moyes. But he's not even watching the games anymore. I'm starting to do the same. How much worse can it be when fans can't even be bothered to switch on? That's the death of a football club if everyone adopts the same sort of thinking. Wenger has totally fucked us.

Alan Smith for manager?

[Niall_Quinn]

Oh, by the way, we ALMOST signed David Silva but, apparently, he wasn't physical enough for Wenger.

There are many, many ironic jokes to be had from that one. Please queue in an orderly fashion.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Anything decent on TV tonight to take our minds off footie?

Is it Walking Dead?

Did I say decent :doh:

Blue Planet II not that I've seen the first episode yet.

It's a good thing the next game is so nearby for us so I don't have to stew. For two weeks. Three, probably.

[Cripps]

Anything decent on TV tonight to take our minds off footie?

Is it Walking Dead?

Did I say decent :doh:

Watch Luther :good:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

But back to Alan Smith.

What the fuck is that guy's problem?

Dunno. At least Merse has a somewhat legitimate gripe being turfed out after one season by Wenger.

[Power n Glory]

He was redeemed in the end though.

By his son! :lol:Do we have to wait for Wenger's offspring to save the day for us?

Also, Darth Vader will remain a cunt. Regardless of what he did at the end, it won't blot out the fuckery. He built the Death Star (Emirates) for fucks sakes.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I don’t believe anyone who says they aren’t disappointed today

And just because we expect it doesn’t change that. No I’m not going to go round in a foul mood for the rest of the day, ten years ago I would have done. Today I just think “what a fucking surprise”

It is predictable. But there are a lot of things that are galling that are predictable

[Niall_Quinn]

Blue Planet II not that I've seen the first episode yet.

It's a good thing the next game is so nearby for us so I don't have to stew. For two weeks. Three, probably.

Even you have to admit, there aren't many machine guns in Blue Planet II. That's not really the release I'm looking for.

Oh well, back to snuff granny movies.

[Niall_Quinn]

By his son! :lol:Do we have to wait for Wenger's offspring to save the day for us?

Also, Darth Vader will remain a cunt. Regardless of what he did at the end, it won't blot out the fuckery. He built the Death Star (Emirates) for fucks sakes.

OMG!

He doesn't have a son does he? Not even a secret unknown son called Ramsey.

[Power n Glory]

Anything decent on TV tonight to take our minds off footie?

Is it Walking Dead?

Did I say decent :doh:

Get yourself a Netflix account and watch Narcos. I've heard Ozark is worth watching too.

[Niall_Quinn]

Watch Luther :good:

Nope.

[Niall_Quinn]

By his son! :lol:Do we have to wait for Wenger's offspring to save the day for us?

Also, Darth Vader will remain a cunt. Regardless of what he did at the end, it won't blot out the fuckery. He built the Death Star (Emirates) for fucks sakes.

Star Wars IS Darth Vadar. How do you square that circle?

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Even you have to admit, there aren't many machine guns in Blue Planet II. That's not really the release I'm looking for.

Oh well, back to snuff granny movies.

You'll love the first episode, of which I have seen a clip on (I think). A fish goes in but the same fish does not come back out.

Also had to edit the above post.

[Cripps]

Nope.

Why?

[Niall_Quinn]

Why?

My post may have been edited.

[Cripps]

The only positive is 3 more points for City which hopefully means less of a chance of that abhorrent prick Mourinho winning the title. We're never going to win it so I hope it goes to City.

[Master Splinter]

I watched Citizen Kane.

Then Downfall.

Then I, Wenger.

Then Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot.

[AFC Leveller]

Frustrating to lose because of two bad ref calls but City are a better team and had many other chances.

This game didn't really tell us anything we didn't already know, we are still 5th (I think) so nothing chances in that respect.

[Niall_Quinn]

The only positive is 3 more points for City which hopefully means less of a chance of that abhorrent prick Mourinho winning the title. We're never going to win it so I hope it goes to City.

Gypos are far, far worse than Maureen. At least Maureen is not a sand scavenging savage dressed up in a Saville Row suit and pretending to be human.

[Cripps]

Gypos are far, far worse than Maureen. At least Maureen is not a sand scavenging savage dressed up in a Saville Row suit and pretending to be human.

No chance.

Mourinho is the biggest prick in the league. Can't stand the narcicistic, repulsive twat. Would love for it to go tits up at Utd and he finally f*cks off out this country, but unfortunately I predict he'll win a couple of big trophies before he leaves for PSG.

[Niall_Quinn]

Okay.

Let's assume the following:

Wenger is of fit mind;
Wenger is a competent professional football manager...

No, no, just go with me on this one. Try to pretend.

So.

He spends 50 mill on Lacazette in the summer to finally give us the striker (second tier option if you ask me) we've needed.

GREAT!

But he hasn't played him for 90 mins so far.

And he benched him for our big game against the gypos.

And after he scored, he shoved him onto the wing so he had no chance of scoring again.

Could some Wengerite (Letters) please come on here and explain why they think this manager is still fit to run the club?

Okay, that's an impossible ask, so...

Please explain why you think he's mentally capable of holding down a football manager's job at ANY club anywhere in the world.

[Cripps]

Okay.

Let's assume the following:

Wenger is of fit mind;
Wenger is a competent professional football manager...

No, no, just go with me on this one. Try to pretend.

So.

He spends 50 mill on Lacazette in the summer to finally give us the striker (second tier option if you ask me) we've needed.

GREAT!

But he hasn't played him for 90 mins so far.

And he benched him for our big game against the gypos.

And after he scored, he shoved him onto the wing so he had no chance of scoring again.

Could some Wengerite (Letters) please come on here and explain why they think this manager is still fit to run the club?


Because he cares.

[Niall_Quinn]

Because he cares.

That must be it then. He'd never do anything to rip the arsehole out of this club with a drill hammer.

[Master Splinter]

I mean playing Kolasinac at CB for the opening two games, then benching him in favour of Bellerin at LB to accommodate the exiting Oxlade is still haunting me tbf.

It's best to embrace the batshit decisions now while there's still some humour to wring from them.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Makes debating anything a bit harder if you never watch it anymore.

True.

Which is why I watched Trainspotting 2 instead.

I’ve seen it before, so knew exactly what would happen.

[Xhaka Can’t]

But back to Alan Smith.

What the fuck is that guy's problem?

Arsene Wenger and Pat Rice tag teamed his wife,

[Xhaka Can’t]

Get yourself a Netflix account and watch Narcos. I've heard Ozark is worth watching too.

Ozark is pretty good

[selassie]

Another defeat due to the ref's decisions according to Arsene.


https://youtu.be/a859xTNXgQE

[rodders]

Outplayed. out thought miles behind Man City by any possible comparison. Wenger out Kroenke out.

[Niall_Quinn]

Another defeat due to the ref's decisions according to Arsene.


https://youtu.be/a859xTNXgQE

Even the media is taking the piss out of him now.

[Cripps]

Even the media is taking the piss out of him now.

Luckily most see through the BS apart from MS and Letters :console:

[Niall_Quinn]

Luckily most see through the BS apart from MS and Letters :console:

Media used to be his bestest ever fweind. That's part of whats kept him in the job . Now even they can't hold the line against this insanity.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I don’t know who is interviewing Wenger but did well to press him on the point of refereeing decisions

Offside calls get missed

I think their penalty was a penalty

From what I saw we weren’t especially that bad today, they were just better than us. Now money is a factor in that but the bigger factor is keeping a load of unmotivated and average players that have it too easy.

I’m not sure if Wenger believes what he’s saying about referring decisions costing us the game, he’s either deluded or refuses to acknowledge out of pure stubbornness the drag factor he is for us.

Ths is the kind of disjointed performances we got in George Graham’s last season.

It is just totally and utterly depressing

[Niall_Quinn]

I don’t know who is interviewing Wenger but did well to press him on the point of refereeing decisions

Offside calls get missed

I think their penalty was a penalty

From what I saw we weren’t especially that bad today, they were just better than us. Now money is a factor in that but the bigger factor is keeping a load of unmotivated and average players that have it too easy.

I’m not sure if Wenger believes what he’s saying about referring decisions costing us the game, he’s either deluded or refuses to acknowledge out of pure stubbornness the drag factor he is for us.

Ths is the kind of disjointed performances we got in George Graham’s last season.

It is just totally and utterly depressing

But AT LEAST you pick your best 11. Right?

At least that.

Bog basic standard bare minimum.

Something that Wenger can't achieve any more.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Just bizarre

Coquelin starting I just get, but Iwobi over Lacazette ?

[Niall_Quinn]

Just bizarre

Coquelin starting I just get, but Iwobi over Lacazette ?

Don't forget, Mr Red Zone started Coquelin mid week. So even his bullshit red zone bullshit cocksucking cunt bullshit fuckwit bullshit cunt thing doesn't add up.

[Chippy]

Because you're the one that constantly pops up backing Wenger, providing a positive spin or providing devils advocate scenarios. Or maybe the fact you antagonise and WUM :shrug:

Wenger out! Letters out! Bring back Ashburton 2006 for Moderator!!

[Letters]

Wenger out! Letters out! Bring back Ashburton 2006 for Moderator!!

And bring back Cripps!



Oh, that's already happened... :coffee:

[Chippy]

And bring back Cripps!



Oh, that's already happened... :coffee:

:o

[The Emirates Gallactico]

And bring back Cripps!



Oh, that's already happened... :coffee:

Can we take from this that Vieira = Cripps/Ach then? :tiphat:



Maybe it's finally time to reveal who I really am now as well. :ninja:

[Cripps]

Maybe it's finally time to reveal who I really am now as well. :ninja:

Flavs:bow:

He's back :bow:

[Letters]

Could some Wengerite (Letters)
Come on. You're better than that. Just.

[Cripps]

Is that NQ or shearer on MOTD? :lol:

£50m signing on the bench. He's getting ripped.

[Niall_Quinn]

Come on. You're better than that. Just.

No. Come on. This is our better than average manager in charge of our above average squad. Tell me why Le Genius is sticking his 50 mill striker on the bench for the biggest games. Must be a reason that's not directly related to sheer incompetence or impaired mental faculties.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Flavs:bow:

He's back :bow:

Cripps please. I'm not some bald headed Northern thug.


I was the guy who used to constantly own you in debates. :cold:


Adebayor :haha::haha:

[Cripps]

First Herbert now you

Why do I always seem to attract the muppets:rolleyes:

[Marc Overmars]

The thing that really bugged me from today’s game was the simplicity of City’s play. They’d win the ball back and only need a simple one-two and they’d have us on the ropes. I just cannot believe how laboured we were in comparison, why weren’t we trying to stretch their defence in the same way with some quick passing and runners? We’re pure pub these days. It’s really hard to watch us construct passages of play knowing full well it’s not going anywhere.

I don’t see any chemistry in this squad at all. Which probably shouldn’t come as a surprise given our 2 best players are unmotivated.

[Marc Overmars]

Also, Mourinho gets stick for parking the bus (rightly so) but Wenger is just as bad, if not worse. The only reason it doesn’t get picked up on is because we’re not good enough to get results that way like Mourinho’s teams often are.

Every game against top opposition the set up is to somehow nullify the other team, without much thought given as to how we’re actually going to attack effectively.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

First Herbert now you

Why do I always seem to attract the muppets:rolleyes:

Maybe it’s your natural charm

I actually had no idea who you were, no wonder you keep whinging like a little girl about being banned :haha:

[Globalgunner]

Also, Mourinho gets stick for parking the bus (rightly so) but Wenger is just as bad, if not worse. The only reason it doesn’t get picked up on is because we’re not good enough to get results that way like Mourinho’s teams often are.

Every game against top opposition the set up is to somehow nullify the other team, without much thought given as to how we’re actually going to attack effectively.

MO, so you have seen it too. Fast breaks?. Nobody knows how to flunk fast breaks like we do. If we ever manage to break out ahead of the oppo defence. Our players will get to the byline. wait for the defence to get back and start the tippy tappy infont of 8 defenders again, until one pass goes wayward and the other team breaks. We will get overrrun and the other team scores with 5 of our players still in the other half of the pitch. Madness I know, but its our particular madness.

City are so good because it only takes maybe 4 passes to see the ball hit at the keeper. With us more like 20.

Yes Wenger is as bad as Mourinho, because his confidence is shot to pieces. He prefers to play defensive against the top teams because he wants to avoid humiliations. A draw is ticked off as a win for his ego as he was not beaten. Where once he had a formula that delivered the beatings now he now plans squarely on accumulating enough points in the league to remain respectable. He can now confidently predict that next season we will challenge for the title....with him still in charge of course.

[Niall_Quinn]

Saw this comment:


It's a contractual thing, if he plays 90 mins x times Arsenal has to pay add-ons to Lyon and increase his salary. Same happened with Podolski who was always subbed right before the 70th minute. No surprises here, Wenger wants to make profit which is in this case incompatible with the sporting goals of a proper club.

Don't know if it's true. But it adds a third possibility to the sabotage/ mental breakdown list of reasons. I've seen Lacazette's fee expressed as anything from £44mill through £52mill. So I guess there could be £8mill potential profit to add to the last transfer window up for grabs if Wenger can do what he does best, fuck the players and the fans over for personal gain for himself and his leech of a boss.

[Niall_Quinn]

Two top PL strikers weigh in with their views, Shearer and Wrighty:


'He's scored six league goals, double anyone else in that Arsenal team. Not only that, he's actually played Sanchez, a guy who doesn't want to commit himself to the football club, whereas he's signed for £50m.

'What does that say not only to him, but to the rest of his team-mates? He's got every right to go and knock on the manager's door in the morning and say: "Do you not fancy me or something? Do you not want to play me?".'

Adding to Shearer's point, Ian Wright believes Lacazette will be frustrated with the way he is being treated in the early days of his Arsenal and will wonder exactly how he can earn Wenger's trust.

Wright said: 'He must be thinking what he has to do to get in this team, especially when he's watching how poorly Sanchez is playing. It must be so frustrating for him.'

Nobody in football has a clue what Wengersaurus is doing. That would be fine if we were making progress. We aren't, we're going backwards. So it should be a massive alarm bell for the club and the owners, under normal circumstances. But not at this club. It will all just roll on without a mention.

It's November and we are out of the title race already. We weren't really in it, but we've gone from pretence and a lukewarm challenge that collapses at the final stretch, to never looking like we are getting within a mile. It's a steady backwards march, led by the guy who keeps getting rewarded for failure.

[Niall_Quinn]

Tyranowenger's post farce comments:


'I believe it was no penalty. We know that Raheem Sterling dives well, he does that very well.'

'Can anyone stop them? It will be difficult this season, the way they have started the quality they have, but you never know. If, on top of that, they have decisions at home like that, they will be unstoppable.

'Overall, once again, the referee made the decision with a penalty and an offside goal. We are used to it when we come here. I feel they don't work enough, because it happens every season. It is unacceptable.

'You have seen what I have seen. The fact you tell me it is an offside goal says enough. I don't want to take anything away from the quality, but it happened at a moment when we were really in the game at 2-1 and it killed the game.

'It is the second year. We got two offside goals here last year and one this year. We put a lot of effort in and at 2-1 I thought we could come back. The 3-1 was an immense relief for them, an unexpected present. Of course, they are a top team, but that makes it even more difficult for you.'

'Just wrong.'

Quite right. This shit happens every year and it's entirely unacceptable.

And the gypo diving happens too, but Sterling didn't dive to get our 50 mill top scorer benched. Nor did he dive to select our holding midfielder as a CB when we had our club captain and at least one other legitimate defender who didn't even make the squad.

So Wenger got his bullshit in long before Sterling or the ref. And it was the combination of all these things, as well as many other unique Wenger contributions over the years, that culminated in yet another loss against a so-called rival.

What's Wenger's record against the top teams now?

What's his record in Europe?

Fraud.

[Letters]

Because you're the one bragging about not watching the game on here.
Not bragging, but this is all so laughably predictable now really, what's the point?
If you're going to keep hitting yourself over the head then there's no point complaining you have a headache :shrug:

[Özim]

Saw this comment:



Don't know if it's true. But it adds a third possibility to the sabotage/ mental breakdown list of reasons. I've seen Lacazette's fee expressed as anything from £44mill through £52mill. So I guess there could be £8mill potential profit to add to the last transfer window up for grabs if Wenger can do what he does best, fuck the players and the fans over for personal gain for himself and his leech of a boss.

Now it makes sense, profit over football as ever by Wenger, that's all he cares about, wouldn't surprise me if this story is spot on.

[Özim]

Two top PL strikers weigh in with their views, Shearer and Wrighty:



Nobody in football has a clue what Wengersaurus is doing. That would be fine if we were making progress. We aren't, we're going backwards. So it should be a massive alarm bell for the club and the owners, under normal circumstances. But not at this club. It will all just roll on without a mention.

It's November and we are out of the title race already. We weren't really in it, but we've gone from pretence and a lukewarm challenge that collapses at the final stretch, to never looking like we are getting within a mile. It's a steady backwards march, led by the guy who keeps getting rewarded for failure.

To think that people were scared to get rid of this guy in case things got worse, can't really get much worse overall, there's no enjoyment to be had anymore.

[Özim]

Like I said before, I saw thr lineup and if I wasn't sure we'd lose before that, I certainly was after seeing it. It was an absurd team selection, IMO that selection deserved one thing, a beating (which they got), it was never ever going to get a result.

Wenger got exactly what he deserved IMO, at the end of the day City are miles ahead of us quality wise, 12 points behind already, 4 defeats already, it gets worse every season, as I said we're a pretty dire team at the moment.

Decision or no decisions, we lost basically because we're rubbish, when we were good we had decisions going against us as well, difference is most of the time we overcame them and won, you can take matters into your own hands or just let things happen, we just let things happen and don't have the fight or desire to overcome them, bunch of losers to be honest.

Xhaka is absolutely hopeless he really is, what a waste of 35 million, yet Wenger keeps playing the guy, he could at least try something different, tough times ahead.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

To think that people were scared to get rid of this guy in case things got worse, can't really get much worse overall, there's no enjoyment to be had anymore.

In fairness, I don’t think that was in anyway what fans were thinking when he bypassed the board to get himself a new contract.

This is an opinion you can maybe attribute to a sizeable portion of the fan base five or six years ago. It was largely the media who came out with the be careful what you wish for bullshit more recently

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Like I said before, I saw thr lineup and if I wasn't sure we'd lose before that, I certainly was after seeing it. It was an absurd team selection, IMO that selection deserved one thing, a beating (which they got), it was never ever going to get a result.

Wenger got exactly what he deserved IMO, at the end of the day City are miles ahead of us quality wise, 12 points behind already, 4 defeats already, it gets worse every season, as I said we're a pretty dire team at the moment.

Xhaka is absolutely hopeless he really is, what a waste of 35 million, yet Wenger keeps playing the guy, he could at least try something different, tough times ahead.

The problem is we didn’t have a lineup we could have put out that we couldn’t expect to get beaten with

You have to go back over a decade to encounter a midfield as poor as this one. Even then we were over relying on one player....now we don’t even have that

[Niall_Quinn]

Like I said before, I saw thr lineup and if I wasn't sure we'd lose before that, I certainly was after seeing it. It was an absurd team selection, IMO that selection deserved one thing, a beating (which they got), it was never ever going to get a result.

Wenger got exactly what he deserved IMO, at the end of the day City are miles ahead of us quality wise, 12 points behind already, 4 defeats already, it gets worse every season, as I said we're a pretty dire team at the moment.

Decision or no decisions, we lost basically because we're rubbish, when we were good we had decisions going against us as well, difference is most of the time we overcame them and won, you can take matters into your own hands or just let things happen, we just let things happen and don't have the fight or desire to overcome them, bunch of losers to be honest.

Xhaka is absolutely hopeless he really is, what a waste of 35 million, yet Wenger keeps playing the guy, he could at least try something different, tough times ahead.

Xhaka was almost comically bad yesterday. He's a shadow of the player he was when he signed. Totally unsuited to this league. Somehow he's getting slower each week. What the hell goes on in training I can't guess at. But Xhaka's another player who needs to get away from Wenger fast if he wants to save his career. Sooner the better because his market value will be going down the shitter, fast.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Xhaka was almost comically bad yesterday. He's a shadow of the player he was when he signed. Totally unsuited to this league. Somehow he's getting slower each week. What the hell goes on in training I can't guess at. But Xhaka's another player who needs to get away from Wenger fast if he wants to save his career. Sooner the better because his market value will be going down the shitter, fast.

Clearly thought he was signing an Arteta without paying attention to the kind of player he is

He will never make it in the premier league he’s far too slow

[Özim]

The problem is we didn’t have a lineup we could have put out that we couldn’t expect to get beaten with

You have to go back over a decade to encounter a midfield as poor as this one. Even then we were over relying on one player....now we don’t even have that

I agree to some extent, but football is a funny sport, the superior team doesn't always win and you have to give yourself the best chance of winning, selecting Coquelin, Xhaka, playing Monreal as a CB and not selecting Lacazette was a shockingly bad decision IMO.

I agree that City are far better though, but I would always have picked Lacazette as he can always pop up with a goal, he's a goalscorer, just a really odd decision (unless the contract thing NQ mentioned is indeed true).

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41878157

He should apologise, Sterling doesn’t dive “well”

He just does it frequently

[Marc Overmars]

Not bragging, but this is all so laughably predictable now really, what's the point?
If you're going to keep hitting yourself over the head then there's no point complaining you have a headache :shrug:

The trouble is Letters, you come across as a bit disingenuous. You’re never as dismissive after a decent result. Worse still, you often use decent results as a way of picking a fight or poking fun at the negative comments that will still be there because if anything, GW is generally consistent with it’s opinion but you don’t seem to be.

[Özim]

Xhaka was almost comically bad yesterday. He's a shadow of the player he was when he signed. Totally unsuited to this league. Somehow he's getting slower each week. What the hell goes on in training I can't guess at. But Xhaka's another player who needs to get away from Wenger fast if he wants to save his career. Sooner the better because his market value will be going down the shitter, fast.

He barely ever has a good game, totally agree he'll never make it in the league, he just doesn't have the attributes, just don't understand what would possess Wenger to buy him in the 1st place, for 35 million on top of that. Seems to be another one of his golden boys that can't be dropped as well, however poor he is.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I agree to some extent, but football is a funny sport, the superior team doesn't always win and you have to give yourself the best chance of winning, selecting Coquelin, Xhaka, playing Monreal as a CB and not selecting Lacazette was a shockingly bad decision IMO.

Playing Monreal as a centre back is suicidal thinking

If he was going to play someone in the position he played Coquelin it should have been Elneny

There’s absolutely no explanation rationally for not starting Lacazette

[Letters]

Quite like the bit about questioning a footballer's integrity :lol:
Yes, footballers these days are all famously upstanding pillars of society. :rolleyes:

[Cripps]

Saw this comment:



Don't know if it's true. But it adds a third possibility to the sabotage/ mental breakdown list of reasons. I've seen Lacazette's fee expressed as anything from £44mill through £52mill. So I guess there could be £8mill potential profit to add to the last transfer window up for grabs if Wenger can do what he does best, fuck the players and the fans over for personal gain for himself and his leech of a boss.

That would make complete sense from the loony wannabe CEO :haha:

[Cripps]

Now it makes sense, profit over football as ever by Wenger, that's all he cares about, wouldn't surprise me if this story is spot on.

Wouldn't also surprise me if he was somehow a shareholder, as rumours suggest. Would all tie in together. This man has become completely embroiled in money making, it's crazy.

[Cripps]

The trouble is Letters, you come across as a bit disingenuous. You’re never as dismissive after a decent result. Worse still, you often use decent results as a way of picking a fight or poking fun at the negative comments that will still be there because if anything, GW is generally consistent with it’s opinion but you don’t seem to be.

http://gif-finder.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/AGT-Clapping.gif


Someone give this man a medal

[selassie]

The thing that really bugged me from today’s game was the simplicity of City’s play. They’d win the ball back and only need a simple one-two and they’d have us on the ropes. I just cannot believe how laboured we were in comparison, why weren’t we trying to stretch their defence in the same way with some quick passing and runners? We’re pure pub these days. It’s really hard to watch us construct passages of play knowing full well it’s not going anywhere.

I don’t see any chemistry in this squad at all. Which probably shouldn’t come as a surprise given our 2 best players are unmotivated.

Wenger has completely lost his way and his out of touch with modern/progressive football. Not only that but he doesn't even have the trust of his team so before a ball is kicked this team is mentality beaten in the big games.

We are clearly a level below Man City, and are inferior to teams such as Spurs, Man United and to a lesser extent Chelsea. The sad thing is we wouldn't need that much of a change to compete for top 4 again but things are not going to improve until Wenger is gone, if anything we will continue to go backwards.

[Letters]

The trouble is Letters, you come across as a bit disingenuous. You’re never as dismissive after a decent result. Worse still, you often use decent results as a way of picking a fight or poking fun at the negative comments that will still be there because if anything, GW is generally consistent with it’s opinion but you don’t seem to be.

I'm pretty consistent in picking people up on what I see as massive over-statements of things.
Long gone are the days when I would accuse people of over-reacting to bad results though.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Wouldn't also surprise me if he was somehow a shareholder, as rumours suggest. Would all tie in together. This man has become completely embroiled in money making, it's crazy.

Except very little he’s done as manager in the past few years would have much of a positive impact on share values, so if he is a Share holder he has very little interest in making a nest egg from his investment

Fan unrest will make sponsors uneasy when it comes to negotiating deals, not to mention the bungling over player contracts

Just imagine if we lose in a fortnight to Spurs, you will have pandemonium in the stadium (Emirates won’t like that)

[Cripps]

Except very little he’s done as manager in the past few years would have much of a positive impact on share values, so if he is a Share holder he has very little interest in making a nest egg from his investment

Fan unrest will make sponsors uneasy when it comes to negotiating deals, not to mention the bungling over player contracts

Just imagine if we lose in a fortnight to Spurs, you will have pandemonium in the stadium (Emirates won’t like that)

Well that's not true. The constant focus on improving us commercially, which has taken a front seat and success on the pitch a back seat, suggests so. Also we seem to be making profits in transfer windows or very small negative net spends, which also suggests that. Plus his comments about paying all 700 employees last season tells me he thinks very differently from a manager, and more like someone interested in the balance sheet.

[selassie]

Except very little he’s done as manager in the past few years would have much of a positive impact on share values, so if he is a Share holder he has very little interest in making a nest egg from his investment

Fan unrest will make sponsors uneasy when it comes to negotiating deals, not to mention the bungling over player contracts

Just imagine if we lose in a fortnight to Spurs, you will have pandemonium in the stadium (Emirates won’t like that)

Yep I agree Herb, I don't think it's got anything to do with Money Making, Wenger is actually losing the club money now and has been over the past few seasons with his wretched transfer policy. He's stacked the squad with junk. What makes it worse is the players we want to keep will be walking away for nothing and the players we don't want we can't get shot of. This has got nothing to do with money making, it's all to do with poor management from top to bottom.

[Cripps]

Yep I agree Herb, I don't think it's got anything to do with Money Making, Wenger is actually losing the club money now and has been over the past few seasons with his wretched transfer policy.


He says as the club's profit before tax was £12.6m in the latest financial results, compared to a loss of £6.2m for the same period a year earlier...

[Niall_Quinn]

Yep I agree Herb, I don't think it's got anything to do with Money Making, Wenger is actually losing the club money now and has been over the past few seasons with his wretched transfer policy. He's stacked the squad with junk. What makes it worse is the players we want to keep will be walking away for nothing and the players we don't want we can't get shot of. This has got nothing to do with money making, it's all to do with poor management from top to bottom.

Certainly agree that (despite the non-fact we are over-achieving in relation to our major rivals) we suffer bad management from top to bottom. Which is why these losers might not even be aware of some of the issues you point out. If they are sitting there thinking Xhaka is the best thing since sliced bread and the 35mill was a great investment, which considering Wenger sticks him on every team sheet might be the case, they might be equally confused when it comes to handling Lacazette. If they are completely incompetent, which may or may not be the case but which the end results certainly suggest, it's no use for the fans to try to connect things together in a logical manner because we aren't dealing in logic here, or even common sense. We're dealing in pure madness half the time and rank incompetence for the rest of it.

These idiots are sitting on a quarter of a billion quid in a hyper inflated market. So, for sure, they are losing money. On the other hand, and in other markets, and if there is no intention to spend that money in football but instead to use it to underpin some other venture, maybe the madness and incompetence on a football level then makes some sort of twisted sense. In this case we're calling the board and the manager corrupt. Another very strong possibility.

[Power n Glory]

He barely ever has a good game, totally agree he'll never make it in the league, he just doesn't have the attributes, just don't understand what would possess Wenger to buy him in the 1st place, for 35 million on top of that. Seems to be another one of his golden boys that can't be dropped as well, however poor he is.

The season we bought Xhaka he played a pre-season game against Pep’s City and we were getting bossed. We couldn’t hold possession and were easily pinned back inside of our own box. We were losing, Once Wenger subbed off Xhaka for Elneny we looked much better, the fluidity came back and we ended up winning.

Only a pre season game but that game set the alarm bells ringing when I saw how slow he looked and how he’s unable to cope with teams that press high. Wenger should have gone the usual 4 at the back formation and paired Elneny with Coquelin. Xhaka has played every possible combination and he doesn’t suit any system. Terrible signing.

[Niall_Quinn]

But do you see how mad this has become? We are now saying Elneny was a better option than Coquelin, and that might be true once you are through the looking glass. But what about the ACTUAL defenders we have available that don't even make the squad? We need to be careful not to get sucked into Wenger's la la land. Draw right back and look at his insanity in all its glory. The fixes are simple but the old fool is mired in layer upon layer of his own craziness.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Well that's not true. The constant focus on improving us commercially, which has taken a front seat and success on the pitch a back seat, suggests so. Also we seem to be making profits in transfer windows or very small negative net spends, which also suggests that. Plus his comments about paying all 700 employees last season tells me he thinks very differently from a manager, and more like someone interested in the balance sheet.

Except that in terms of commercial deals we are behind a lot of other premier league clubs. And the profit you allude to is far more a result of the tv money and our lack of transfer spending.

Now if we wanted to make more profit from transfers we’d have sold both Sanchez and Ozil

[Niall_Quinn]

Except that in terms of commercial deals we are behind a lot of other premier league clubs. And the profit you allude to is far more a result of the tv money and our lack of transfer spending.

Now if we wanted to make more profit from transfers we’d have sold both Sanchez and Ozil

Maybe they fucked that up too. Certainly that's what the gypos claim. Our incompetence and dithering was the main reason Alexis is not gone and Lemar is not here. So goes the claim.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

But do you see how mad this has become? We are now saying Elneny was a better option than Coquelin, and that might be true once you are through the looking glass. But what about the ACTUAL defenders we have available that don't even make the squad? We need to be careful not to get sucked into Wenger's la la land. Draw right back and look at his insanity in all its glory. The fixes are simple but the old fool is mired in layer upon layer of his own craziness.

Well only assuming that we keep to the same rigid formation that Wenger shoe horns his players into

I would have played Holding instead of Monreal and Elneny in front of those two

[Cripps]

Except that in terms of commercial deals we are behind a lot of other premier league clubs. And the profit you allude to is far more a result of the tv money and our lack of transfer spending.


Yeah because we signed terrible deals years ago that we're still locked into. IMO that's why we're such a tight arse in other areas, because we're trying to make up for it. I had a friend who went for an interview pretty high up at the club and they basically admitted they are doing everything in their power to match Man Utd commercially.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Maybe they fucked that up too. Certainly that's what the gypos claim. Our incompetence and dithering was the main reason Alexis is not gone and Lemar is not here. So goes the claim.

Aye but we could have just pocketed the money without replacing the player if profit making was Wengers sole motivation

I think he only cares about making the club money argument is just a way of trying to make sense of his behaviour when it fits into no logical pattern. Medically unwell? No but hamstrung by his own weird “values” and totally entrenched by stubbornness and inability to accept that football has moved on from the days when he was successful.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Yeah because we signed terrible deals years ago that we're still locked into. IMO that's why we're such a tight arse in other areas, because we're trying to make up for it. I had a friend who went for an interview pretty high up at the club and they basically admitted they are doing everything in their power to match Man Utd commercially.

A lot of the deals we were locked into expired two three years ago like the Nike Kit deal. We tried to get a similar mega bucks deal with Addidas to what United got but they told us to fuck off (an example of how you do need on the pitch success to generate top commercial revenue).
Gazidis is chiefly responsible for this as CEO, and he’s useless at it. You break down what we take in commercially and we’d be operating at a loss without the tv money in the same way we’d have been operating at a loss without player sales five-six years ago.
This club may be more interested in financial success, but it’s not particularly brilliant at that either

[Cripps]

Aye but we could have just pocketed the money without replacing the player if profit making was Wengers sole motivation


There would have been pandemonium if that had happened, especially on the back of finally dropping out of the top 4 into the Europa League. Gazidis and co knew that hence his comments about avoiding another RVP scenario and the unrest that caused.

What'll be interesting is how we replace both this summer. Will we go all out and spend the £80m-£120m needed to replace them, or will we promote from within or go for cheaper options. Wengers comments recently suggest one of the latter 2.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

There would have been pandemonium if that had happened, especially on the back of finally dropping out of the top 4 into the Europa League. Gazidis and co knew that hence his comments about avoiding another RVP scenario and the unrest that caused.

What'll be interesting is how we replace both this summer. Will we go all out and spend the £80m-£120m needed to replace them, or will we promote from within or go for cheaper options. Wengers comments recently suggest one of the latter 2.

There would have been pandemonium, but if you take the AGM as an example. It seems abundantly clear that no one gives a fuck what might upset the fans anyway.

Past the point of giving a fuck who replaces them, end of the day neither are putting in the kind of performances to make them huge losses for us on anything other than a financial basis. The chances of us making top four are nominal even with them playing.

[Marc Overmars]

I think what we’re seeing is that there probably isn’t any point in keeping players in their final year who have no intention to sign a new contract. I can only imagine what the rest of the squad who are committed feel about Ozil and Alexis. I thought Alexis would still be the same player but he looks like he’s going through the motions now.

With the power of hindsight, they probably should have been sold.

[Cripps]

A lot of the deals we were locked into expired two three years ago like the Nike Kit deal. We tried to get a similar mega bucks deal with Addidas to what United got but they told us to fuck off (an example of how you do need on the pitch success to generate top commercial revenue).
Gazidis is chiefly responsible for this as CEO, and he’s useless at it. You break down what we take in commercially and we’d be operating at a loss without the tv money in the same way we’d have been operating at a loss without player sales five-six years ago.
This club may be more interested in financial success, but it’s not particularly brilliant at that either

Agree with the bit in bold. The board and manager missed a seriously big trick in not going for the kill in terms of winning a couple of major trophies over the years. A couple of premier league titles would have taken us to another level commercially and completely neutralised all the unrest. We weren't far off on a couple of occasions either, a striker or DM or CB here or there and we could have won a league title. They decided to go with a different strategy and this is what the result is.

[selassie]

He says as the club's profit before tax was £12.6m in the latest financial results, compared to a loss of £6.2m for the same period a year earlier...

Sure, but despite this I don't believe for one minute Wenger's sole purpose is about money making. He is just getting exposed for what he really is now. It makes no difference whether he spends or not, he's not up to the job.

[selassie]

But do you see how mad this has become? We are now saying Elneny was a better option than Coquelin, and that might be true once you are through the looking glass. But what about the ACTUAL defenders we have available that don't even make the squad? We need to be careful not to get sucked into Wenger's la la land. Draw right back and look at his insanity in all its glory. The fixes are simple but the old fool is mired in layer upon layer of his own craziness.

Yep :gp:

[Power n Glory]

Certainly agree that (despite the non-fact we are over-achieving in relation to our major rivals) we suffer bad management from top to bottom. Which is why these losers might not even be aware of some of the issues you point out. If they are sitting there thinking Xhaka is the best thing since sliced bread and the 35mill was a great investment, which considering Wenger sticks him on every team sheet might be the case, they might be equally confused when it comes to handling Lacazette. If they are completely incompetent, which may or may not be the case but which the end results certainly suggest, it's no use for the fans to try to connect things together in a logical manner because we aren't dealing in logic here, or even common sense. We're dealing in pure madness half the time and rank incompetence for the rest of it.

These idiots are sitting on a quarter of a billion quid in a hyper inflated market. So, for sure, they are losing money. On the other hand, and in other markets, and if there is no intention to spend that money in football but instead to use it to underpin some other venture, maybe the madness and incompetence on a football level then makes some sort of twisted sense. In this case we're calling the board and the manager corrupt. Another very strong possibility.

Hard to make sense of what’s going on. The fact that Wenger received a new contract despite finishing outside of the Top 4 suggests something else is going on. I’m putting it down to incompetence. As suspected, it makes no sense for the Board to overlook the wage bill and not look to bring that down as first priority considering how much of a huge drain it is.

Also, allowing Ozil and Sanchez to leave on a free and passing up the chance to make £60m - £100m makes no sense at all. The whole situation is short sighted. Wenger’s comments about it potentially being more expensive to renew their contracts compared to signing a new player smacks of incompetence. I don’t know how he’s able to get away with such statements when he presents these foolish ideas as if he’s imparted some sort of wisdom to the masses. Didn’t he say this could be a trend in football? To allow your star players to run down their contract? I’m not great at maths or economics but what he has said doesn’t add up at all. When you factor in how much it will cost to sign a player and then add the wages on top, resigning Ozil and Sanchez would have been the cheaper option. Incompetence all over.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I think what we’re seeing is that there probably isn’t any point in keeping players in their final year who have no intention to sign a new contract. I can only imagine what the rest of the squad who are committed feel about Ozil and Alexis. I thought Alexis would still be the same player but he looks like he’s going through the motions now.

With the power of hindsight, they probably should have been sold.

Sanchez bless him just isn’t very bright, whilst I think the likes of Gonella went out of their way to extol his “virtues” to circle of access journalists like John Cross. I can’t imagine he’s making himself too popular, the calculation or whatever you want to call it was that he’d play himself into the shop window especially with Chile not qualifying for the World Cup.
But he is just making the assumption that City will go for him regardless (he’s right of course)

Ozil is just Ozil, he’s not behaving any differently than he has in the previous four seasons at the club. He’s a luxury player for whom rolling his sleeves up is anathema to.

[Power n Glory]

But do you see how mad this has become? We are now saying Elneny was a better option than Coquelin, and that might be true once you are through the looking glass. But what about the ACTUAL defenders we have available that don't even make the squad? We need to be careful not to get sucked into Wenger's la la land. Draw right back and look at his insanity in all its glory. The fixes are simple but the old fool is mired in layer upon layer of his own craziness.

I'm definitely not saying that. If we're to stick with playing 3 at the back, it makes no sense why we're not playing Merts or Holding considering how impressive they've been when playing that formation. But I think both were injured. In which case, it makes even less sense to play 3 at the back with so many CB's unavailable. Just play Kos and Monreal as the pair and go back to 4-3-3.

[Letters]

I think what we’re seeing is that there probably isn’t any point in keeping players in their final year who have no intention to sign a new contract. I can only imagine what the rest of the squad who are committed feel about Ozil and Alexis. I thought Alexis would still be the same player but he looks like he’s going through the motions now.

With the power of hindsight, they probably should have been sold.

I've always been somewhat undecided about sort of thing. Part of me thinks "sod 'em, they're under contract, make them play". The other part of me thinks "there's no point in making them stay, just sell them".
As discussed, I haven't seen much of us this year but I'm not sure performances so far have been that definitive one way or the other. In some games it seems like Ozil and Sanchez have been quite good.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm definitely not saying that. If we're to stick with playing 3 at the back, it makes no sense why we're not playing Merts or Holding considering how impressive they've been when playing that formation. But I think both were injured. In which case, it makes even less sense to play 3 at the back with so many CB's unavailable. Just play Kos and Monreal as the pair and go back to 4-3-3.

Wenger was emphatic in his post match press conference. There's no difference between the centre back and the holding midfielder's role. So there you have it. Now Elneny and Coquelin makes sense. But let's hope Wenger doesn't decide there's no difference between the goalkeeping a striker's role. I don't think Laca would be as good at catching crosses as he is heading them.

The man's lost the plot completely. He's off the farm, gone rogue, lost at sea, off down the river without a paddle.

These strange injuries we pick up the day before kick off, or sometimes the hour before. A kind observer might say Wenger is unlucky. A keen observer might say he's a liar looking for excuses to cover up the latest disastrous result of his incompetence.

[Cripps]

Wenger was emphatic in his post match press conference. There's no difference between the centre back and the holding midfielder's role. So there you have it. Now Elneny and Coquelin makes sense. But let's hope Wenger doesn't decide there's no difference between the goalkeeping a striker's role. I don't think Laca would be as good at catching crosses as he is heading them.

The man's lost the plot completely. He's off the farm, gone rogue, lost at sea, off down the river without a paddle.

These strange injuries we pick up the day before kick off, or sometimes the hour before. A kind observer might say Wenger is unlucky. A keen observer might say he's a liar looking for excuses to cover up the latest disastrous result of his incompetence.

Thought you were doing work? :lol:


:run:

[Power n Glory]

Wenger was emphatic in his post match press conference. There's no difference between the centre back and the holding midfielder's role. So there you have it. Now Elneny and Coquelin makes sense. But let's hope Wenger doesn't decide there's no difference between the goalkeeping a striker's role. I don't think Laca would be as good at catching crosses as he is heading them.

The man's lost the plot completely. He's off the farm, gone rogue, lost at sea, off down the river without a paddle.

These strange injuries we pick up the day before kick off, or sometimes the hour before. A kind observer might say Wenger is unlucky. A keen observer might say he's a liar looking for excuses to cover up the latest disastrous result of his incompetence.

:doh: Are you able to find the source for that comment? I think that just proves his lack of respect for certain positions.

[Niall_Quinn]

I've always been somewhat undecided about sort of thing. Part of me thinks "sod 'em, they're under contract, make them play". The other part of me thinks "there's no point in making them stay, just sell them".
As discussed, I haven't seen much of us this year but I'm not sure performances so far have been that definitive one way or the other. In some games it seems like Ozil and Sanchez have been quite good.

The opposition has a bearing. If we're allowed to play then the team can handle the lack of pressure. Otherwise it all falls into the shit. Wenger, of course, is a major factor. If he's picked a semi-sane line-up and played most of the players roughly in their correct positions it can have a positive influence on performances. But when you look at games like yesterday's, when Wenger goes full on retard mode and wrecks the team before the kick-off, everyone struggles. Hardly surprising, but then you have to look at how well they cope and how much effort they apply despite the handicaps Wenger has inflicted. Alexis put in an effort yesterday but was entirely out of sync with the non-system he was supposed to be part of. Ozil didn't stand a chance from the kick-off, but he didn't apply enough effort either so his overall performance was rank. We won't miss these two, not because they aren't good players, but because Wenger is such a fuck-up it doesn't really matter if we have 2-3 decent players on the pitch or not. What we really need is the quality all over the pitch we used to have and then Wenger can be compensated for and even overcome.

[Niall_Quinn]

Thought you were doing work? :lol:


:run:

I did.

[Niall_Quinn]

:doh: Are you able to find the source for that comment? I think that just proves his lack of respect for certain positions.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvQNd772py8

3:23

I wish the journo had pressed him and asked him to explain what the actual formation was supposed to be. Sounds like Wenger thinks we played a 2-8-1.

[Power n Glory]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvQNd772py8

3:23

I wish the journo had pressed him and asked him to explain what the actual formation was supposed to be. Sounds like Wenger thinks we played a 2-8-1.

:doh: Fucking hell. I'm done.

[Niall_Quinn]

Btw, let's roll back a few days and think about that fuck awful non-performance against Red Star.

You know - where we rested the entire first team.

For what?

That shambles of a team selection yesterday?

Lacazette wasn't "rested". He's been dropped. Our top scorer. Benched domestically and in Europe by this stupid dinosaur.

But Coquelin plays midweek and is then asked to play again in a role totally alien to him. How mad is that? It's like he wants the player to fail, he wants to make him look bad, to take flak.

[Cripps]

I did.

Dog walking:bow:

Calling that a job:bow:

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I did.

Was it quick or did you “send a message”

[Niall_Quinn]

Was it quick or did you “send a message”

Deleted an email.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11116304/ref-watch-arsene-wenger-criticism-of-referees-grossly-unfair

Dermot Gallagher seems to agree with me. It was a penalty, I’d be calling for one if a defender had barged one of our players over like Monreal did.

Embarrassing and not in the same league as the non penalty given against us at Watford

[The Emirates Gallactico]

First Herbert now you

Why do I always seem to attract the muppets:rolleyes:

It takes one to know one I suppose Cripps.



Not bragging, but this is all so laughably predictable now really, what's the point?
If you're going to keep hitting yourself over the head then there's no point complaining you have a headache :shrug:

As I said you're entitled to support the club however you want to but when your first post on here, a few minutes after a bad defeat & performance when emotions are high is "Look guys, just don't watch the matches and be smart like me!!!!" then that's obviously going to piss people off.

We follow The Arsenal not out of pleasure, but because we care and feel passionate about the club and we're desperate to see it succeed. Sure we know things are shitty at the moment but it's on us to try and force the issue to get things better. The club isn't Kroenke, Wenger, the Players etc etc ......... the club is us, it's fans. And if we all start feigning apathy and not paying attention to the state of it then that's the first step to it's doom.

As much I'd think it'd be counterproductive and stupid, I'd much rather see people go crazy, hurl abuse at Wenger & the players every game instead of outright stop at the very least paying attention to games.

[Niall_Quinn]

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11116304/ref-watch-arsene-wenger-criticism-of-referees-grossly-unfair

Dermot Gallagher seems to agree with me. It was a penalty, I’d be calling for one if a defender had barged one of our players over like Monreal did.

Embarrassing and not in the same league as the non penalty given against us at Watford

I wouldn't shout that too loudly.

It would never have been a pen at the other end. Ref would have waved on the play - just as he did with their blatant offside goal. No excuse for Wenger though. Don't give the chance for the refs to cheat, keep the ball up their end and keep the pressure on them. Solves most problems with refs. Might help if you start your club record signing, top scoring striker. But no, fuck it all up and then blame the ref. Wenger being Wenger.

[Marc Overmars]

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11116304/ref-watch-arsene-wenger-criticism-of-referees-grossly-unfair

Dermot Gallagher seems to agree with me. It was a penalty, I’d be calling for one if a defender had barged one of our players over like Monreal did.

Embarrassing and not in the same league as the non penalty given against us at Watford

It was a clear penalty. Monreal was clumsy.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I wouldn't shout that too loudly.

It would never have been a pen at the other end. Ref would have waved on the play - just as he did with their blatant offside goal. No excuse for Wenger though. Don't give the chance for the refs to cheat, keep the ball up their end and keep the pressure on them. Solves most problems with refs. Might help if you start your club record signing, top scoring striker. But no, fuck it all up and then blame the ref. Wenger being Wenger.

Probably but can’t complain about a decision that a referee is well within his rights to give

Saying that decision wouldn’t have been given against City, whilst probably true is a very different argument and not the one made by l’ouisseau.

Third goal was offside but linesmen are technically human beings, they are fallible. They are just as prone to late nights and lack of sleep intermixed with booze, gack and high price call girls as the rest of us.

Play to the whistle, if you don’t...no sympathy

[Niall_Quinn]

Probably but can’t complain about a decision that a referee is well within his rights to give

Saying that decision wouldn’t have been given against City, whilst probably true is a very different argument and not the one made by l’ouisseau.

Third goal was offside but linesmen are technically human beings, they are fallible. They are just as prone to late nights and lack of sleep intermixed with booze, gack and high price call girls as the rest of us.

Play to the whistle, if you don’t...no sympathy

You can't play to the whistle when the opponent is that far offside. They already have a decisive advantage. No excuse for the linesman. He was looking right across the line and opted to cheat.

None of which excuses Wenger in any way. And yes, I'm sick of his moaning too.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

You can't play to the whistle when the opponent is that far offside. They already have a decisive advantage. No excuse for the linesman. He was looking right across the line and opted to cheat.

None of which excuses Wenger in any way. And yes, I'm sick of his moaning too.

So Gabriel Jesus was crowded out in the box and managed to get his shot off anyway. Not really how I remember it

[Cripps]

Just checked and Huddersfield at home is nearly sold out :haha:

When will people get the message :doh: Wenger ain't going nowhere.

[Letters]

Maybe people want to see a game we've got a fighting chance of winning :unsure:

[GP]

It was a clear penalty. Monreal was clumsy.

No way. He's shoulder to shoulder. Sterling takes a dive, as he does.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Just checked and Huddersfield at home is nearly sold out :haha:

When will people get the message :doh: Wenger ain't going nowhere.


Did it go on general sale? IÂ’m assuming so.

You look at the guys on Arsenal fan TV especially Claude. Apart from the futility, itÂ’s probably neither physically or psychologically helpful for guys like him to be a season ticket holder.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/11/06/arsene-wengers-decision-bench-alexandre-lacazette-really-lack/amp/

Someone trying to provide an explanation for the intangible

[Cripps]

Did it go on general sale? I’m assuming so.


You sure you work for Essex police or are you currently sitting in the waiting area waiting to hand yourself in for being a danger to society? :haha:

[mastermind84]

City may get 100 points this season

[Letters]

City may get 100 points this season

I suspect they will have a wobble at some point.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

You sure you work for Essex police or are you currently sitting in the waiting area waiting to hand yourself in for being a danger to society? :haha:

Bit of A, bit of B

[Cripps]

City may get 100 points this season

In what? Their Tesco clubcard?

[mastermind84]

I suspect they will have a wobble at some point.

Thats always possible, but this team looks like the best team the Premiership has seen. They have already won the league as of November 5th.

[Power n Glory]

Thats always possible, but this team looks like the best team the Premiership has seen. They have already won the league as of November 5th.

There was a trophy ceremony for Man City yesterday? :unsure:

[Letters]

They have already won the league as of November 5th.
No. No they haven't.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

No they haven’t won the league. They are of course the overwhelming favourites. Uniteds away record against the top six under Mourinho is almost as shoddy as ours so the true test for City will be as much as I hate to say it Spurs

[mastermind84]

There was a trophy ceremony for Man City yesterday? :unsure:


No. No they haven't.

Lets not do this.

United, Chelsea, Liverpool, and Spurs are not catching them. Being 8 points clear on the first Sunday in November is ridiculous and unprecedented. They have already scored 50+ goals this season and have a +31 GD in the premier league. They have already dominated Chelsea, Liverpool, and Arsenal. United are managed by another dinosaur in Mourinho, Chelsea are in a civil war, Spurs are Spurs, and Klopp is looking fraudulent.

City is looking like a team that may be the best the Premier League has seen. The title race is over. Guardiola never gets caught.

They have a really good chance at getting 100 points.

[Letters]

There are 27 games to go :lol:
It is theirs to lose and right now they're clear favourites but it wouldn't be the first time a team has gone off line a train and then hit the buffers.

[Niall_Quinn]

Lets not do this.

United, Chelsea, Liverpool, and Spurs are not catching them. Being 8 points clear on the first Sunday in November is ridiculous and unprecedented. They have already scored 50+ goals this season and have a +31 GD in the premier league. They have already dominated Chelsea, Liverpool, and Arsenal. United are managed by another dinosaur in Mourinho, Chelsea are in a civil war, Spurs are Spurs, and Klopp is looking fraudulent.

City is looking like a team that may be the best the Premier League has seen. The title race is over. Guardiola never gets caught.

They have a really good chance at getting 100 points.

Real news is Pep has spent a fortune, as usual, but spent wisely (in most cases). As you say, the rest are a bunch of fuck ups, either blowing money on trash or refusing to spend at all. So it's not much of a surprise to see the team that knows what its doing getting on and doing it. As always, the pace will slow. It always does no matter how much dominance through stages of the season. It's theirs to win, for sure, but plenty of ups and downs to go yet, especially in the close season. Only thing that can be said with total certainty at this early stage is we won't be competing.

[Power n Glory]

No, Mastermind has spoken. The Premier League league title race ended on November 5th.

Edit: For us. That's for sure. Way to early to say City have won.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I think what we’re seeing is that there probably isn’t any point in keeping players in their final year who have no intention to sign a new contract. I can only imagine what the rest of the squad who are committed feel about Ozil and Alexis. I thought Alexis would still be the same player but he looks like he’s going through the motions now.

With the power of hindsight, they probably should have been sold.

I imagine there is not as much discontent as there might be....

Mustafi, Bellerin, Ospina and Debuchy all wanted out at some point too, Perez and Chamberlain both wanted out and left..... and Giroud and Theo are just as likely only still here because of the lack of attractive offers elsewhere.

[Cripps]

Lets not do this.

United, Chelsea, Liverpool, and Spurs are not catching them. Being 8 points clear on the first Sunday in November is ridiculous and unprecedented. They have already scored 50+ goals this season and have a +31 GD in the premier league. They have already dominated Chelsea, Liverpool, and Arsenal. United are managed by another dinosaur in Mourinho, Chelsea are in a civil war, Spurs are Spurs, and Klopp is looking fraudulent.

City is looking like a team that may be the best the Premier League has seen. The title race is over. Guardiola never gets caught.

They have a really good chance at getting 100 points.

They won their first 10 games last season:coffee:

We'll see how they perform during Christmas when games come thick and fast and fatigue and injuries kick in :coffee:

It's a long long season :coffee:

[Cripps]

No, Mastermind has spoken. The Premier League league title race ended on November 5th.

Edit: For us. That's for sure. Way to early to say City have won.

I wish it ended in Novermber the year we went 128 days at the top then still bottled it :haha:

How the f*ck did that happen :doh:

[Marc Overmars]

City do look head and shoulders above everyone else but it's a bit early to declare them champions and certainly too early to talk about them being one of the best ever teams.
However I would say even if they do have a wobble at some point, the lead they are building now will probably be enough of a buffer to see them over the line anyway.

Chelsea did the same last season and also in 2015, started like a runaway train then coasted towards the finish. In fact even Leicester weren't realistically going to be caught during their title win, always had that points cushion thanks to their mid season burst of form.

There hasn't been an interesting title race since 2014 so I don't believe it's really that outrageous to think their lead might already be unassailable.

[Özim]

From our point of view we were never in the title race, so it never ended because it never started, we're cannon fodder to the big teams now, a 2nd tier team who will never challenge for the big prizes.

Fans will always be optimistic (some fancied we might get something at City), but the reality is some teams are now in a different league, our fight is to get in the top 4 and were' even losing that these days. Next step down will be us challenging to qualify for the Europa League every season.

2nd rate club, with a 2nd rate manager managing a 2nd rate team. Kroenke doesn't care and Wenger can't see it, to him we're still something special, we got comprehensively outplayed yesterday, the decisions didn't dictate the result, we were never going to get anything from this, the manager however got his ready made excuse.

Somehow should ask him why we've already lost 4 times this season if we're so special and why we bore the fans to the point of putting them to sleep. All that's left for us now is the Europa League which the clown doesn't appear to be taking seriously.

[Letters]

Actually agree about that. We are in the 2nd tier of clubs now.
:ilt:

[Özim]

I wonder about Alexis as well, by all intents and purposes he was playing again his next club, he's got nothing to prove he knows he's outta here soon. So we lost, but I'm not sure he'll be that bothered, we're not his future, we'll soon be his past.

Moreover he probably fancies playing for City even more than he did before now, having seen first hand how good they are and they type of football they play.

The decision to leave Lacazette out were just dumbfounding for me, I'd have played both Sanchez and Lacazette, you want your best players on the pitch, they were all rested in midweek as well.

I really don't know where we'll be next summer now, losing our best players for nothing, with our awful transfer business it's shaping up to be another disaster, just like this season is turning out to be.

Why won't something change at this club, I just don't get it, we're a club where noone seems to care about the football side, as a footbal club we're falling apart.

[Cripps]

From our point of view we were never in the title race, so it never ended because it never started, we're cannon fodder to the big teams now, a 2nd tier team who will never challenge for the big prizes.

Fans will always be optimistic (some fancied we might get something at City), but the reality is some teams are now in a different league, our fight is to get in the top 4 and were' even losing that these days. Next step down will be us challenging to qualify for the Europa League every season.

2nd rate club, with a 2nd rate manager managing a 2nd rate team. Kroenke doesn't care and Wenger can't see it, to him we're still something special, we got comprehensively outplayed yesterday, the decisions didn't dictate the result, we were never going to get anything from this, the manager however got his ready made excuse.

Somehow should ask him why we've already lost 4 times this season if we're so special and why we bore the fans to the point of putting them to sleep. All that's left for us now is the Europa League which the clown doesn't appear to be taking seriously.

Well according to Gazidis we're the most consistent over performer out of the big clubs! :lol:

[mastermind84]

Real news is Pep has spent a fortune, as usual, but spent wisely (in most cases). As you say, the rest are a bunch of fuck ups, either blowing money on trash or refusing to spend at all. So it's not much of a surprise to see the team that knows what its doing getting on and doing it. As always, the pace will slow. It always does no matter how much dominance through stages of the season. It's theirs to win, for sure, but plenty of ups and downs to go yet, especially in the close season. Only thing that can be said with total certainty at this early stage is we won't be competing.
Mourinho has spent more than Guardiola, and look at United.

Pep is the best tactician in the game and arguably the best all time. Its not just that he spent a lot of money, its getting players to buy into his system. We complain about Ramsey abdicating his midfield responsibilities, etc. City basically play with only one midfielder in Fernandinho, yet he is never exposed. Fernandinho is a great midfielder, but he is 32 years old and just one guy in a very attacking team.

Its over.


They won their first 10 games last season:coffee:

We'll see how they perform during Christmas when games come thick and fast and fatigue and injuries kick in :coffee:

It's a long long season :coffee:
They won their first ten matches overall last season. This season they have only dropped two points in 11 Premier League matches and have set the record for the biggest lead in Premier League history after 11 matches.

Its over


No, Mastermind has spoken. The Premier League league title race ended on November 5th.
Cheers because it did.

Its over.

[mastermind84]

I wonder about Alexis as well, by all intents and purposes he was playing again his next club, he's got nothing to prove he knows he's outta here soon. So we lost, but I'm not sure he'll be that bothered, we're not his future, we'll soon be his past.

Moreover he probably fancies playing for City even more than he did before now, having seen first hand how good they are and they type of football they play.

The decision to leave Lacazette out were just dumbfounding for me, I'd have played both Sanchez and Lacazette, you want your best players on the pitch, they were all rested in midweek as well.

I really don't know where we'll be next summer now, losing our best players for nothing, with our awful transfer business it's shaping up to be another disaster, just like this season is turning out to be.

Why won't something change at this club, I just don't get it, we're a club where noone seems to care about the football side, as a footbal club we're falling apart.

Here is something else, Alexis Sanchez isnt good enough to play for Manchester City and I have no idea why they wanted him.

Wumger is finished. Midtable manager, imo.

[Niall_Quinn]

Actually agree about that. We are in the 2nd tier of clubs now.
:ilt:

Do you still agree Wenger did a great job of steering us there? Stadium move. Blah, blah. No money. Blah blah. Then spends 200 million and same old shit.b You certainly gave enough people enough grief for fucking with the legacy.

My question. Is it time for you to know admit Wenger has completely fucked this up? Not just him, granted. But his part has been a fuck-up, not some masterful steering job. He's steered us into the shitter. Expertly. I'll give him that.

[Niall_Quinn]

Well according to Gazidis we're the most consistent over performer out of the big clubs! :lol:

Rumour has it Ivan is a total dickhead.

[Niall_Quinn]

Here is something else, Alexis Sanchez isnt good enough to play for Manchester City and I have no idea why they wanted him.

Wumger is finished. Midtable manager, imo.

The Wenger is finished bit, well that's beyond dispute I would hope.

The Alexis thing, the gypos have ONE player in his class. ONE. And that's Silva. The rest range from very good but nowhere near as good as the media pundits want them to be, to Delph.

[Cripps]

Do you still agree Wenger did a great job of steering us there? Stadium move. Blah, blah. No money. Blah blah. Then spends 200 million and same old shit.b You certainly gave enough people enough grief for fucking with the legacy.

My question. Is it time for you to know admit Wenger has completely fucked this up? Not just him, granted. But his part has been a fuck-up, not some masterful steering job. He's steered us into the shitter. Expertly. I'll give him that.

Hear hear.

Do we get an apology for taking all the crap despite being right all along?

[Niall_Quinn]

Hear hear.

Do we get an apology for taking all the crap despite being right all along?

No.

I already know exactly what Letters is going to post. If he posts.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I’ve never once apologised and sincerely meant it

Plus I’ve wanted Wenger gone since 2011, if you arrived at your conclusion earlier....fantastic

[Niall_Quinn]

I couldn't care less about apologies either. Ongoing excuses in the face of overwhelming evidence is what perks my disgust.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Just checked and Huddersfield at home is nearly sold out :haha:

When will people get the message :doh: Wenger ain't going nowhere.

Do you realise what you’ve done?

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I couldn't care less about apologies either. Ongoing excuses in the face of overwhelming evidence is what perks my disgust.

Are there any excuses being made, there seems to be a rather pointless argument over whether Wenger is just incompetent or he’s complicit in maximising profit to the detriment of on the field performance

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Did it go on general sale? IÂ’m assuming so.

You look at the guys on Arsenal fan TV especially Claude. Apart from the futility, itÂ’s probably neither physically or psychologically helpful for guys like him to be a season ticket holder.

Whoever edited this bit about Claude Callegari. You do realise this was also public knowledge ?

The shit that went down on that Scottish message board is making you paranoid

[Letters]

Do you still agree Wenger did a great job of steering us there? Stadium move. Blah, blah. No money. Blah blah. Then spends 200 million and same old shit.b You certainly gave enough people enough grief for fucking with the legacy.

My question. Is it time for you to know admit Wenger has completely fucked this up? Not just him, granted. But his part has been a fuck-up, not some masterful steering job. He's steered us into the shitter. Expertly. I'll give him that.

I outlined at some length how I see Wenger's time with us in roughly 3 phases and you said you agreed.
I don't have much else to add to that. We all hoped when the new sponsorship deals were put in place and we started signing players like Ozil and Sanchez it would yield results. The first FA Cup gave us some hope and most felt it worth giving him a chance to see if he could push us on. If I held out hope longer than most that he would then fine, guilty as charged, but don't pat yourselves on the back too much and pretend that you knew 10 years ago we'd end up in quite such a mess.

[Cripps]

To be fair to Zimm he has been consistent on his stance regarding Wenger over the past 7-8 years and he pretty much predicted our fortunes.

[mastermind84]

The Alexis thing, the gypos have ONE player in his class. ONE. And that's Silva. The rest range from very good but nowhere near as good as the media pundits want them to be, to Delph.

Nah

[Niall_Quinn]

I outlined at some length how I see Wenger's time with us in roughly 3 phases and you said you agreed.
I don't have much else to add to that. We all hoped when the new sponsorship deals were put in place and we started signing players like Ozil and Sanchez it would yield results. The first FA Cup gave us some hope and most felt it worth giving him a chance to see if he could push us on. If I held out hope longer than most that he would then fine, guilty as charged, but don't pat yourselves on the back too much and pretend that you knew 10 years ago we'd end up in quite such a mess.

It's hard to imagine anyone could have accurately predicted just how badly this guy would fuck things up. And he just keeps on going, as his crazed team selection showed us on Sunday. What the next 10 years under this lunatic will bring, I get the feeling none of us will be able to predict how bad it will be this time either.

[Niall_Quinn]

Nah

Not based on yesterday's performance of course. And okay, I'll put Aguero on that list too. But that's all I'll concede. Most of these modern players aren't fit to lace the boots of those who went before them. Hyped beyond all reason.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

To be fair to Zimm he has been consistent on his stance regarding Wenger over the past 7-8 years and he pretty much predicted our fortunes.

:rolleyes:

You hardly have to be King Soloman for one of two outcomes to eventually become true after multiple years of whining & bitching about it.

[Cripps]

:rolleyes:

You hardly have to be King Soloman for one of two outcomes to eventually become true after multiple years of whining & bitching about it.

Just pointing out that whilst many were being positive and saw light at the end of the tunnel when certain things happened over the years, to be fair to Zimm, he was the head honcho in predicting pretty much everything that's happened, to the extent it has happened.

[Letters]

To be fair to Zimm he has been consistent on his stance regarding Wenger over the past 7-8 years and he pretty much predicted our fortunes.

Not really. He has been consistent but if you're consistent about something where fortunes often fluctuate, as they tend to in football over the long term, then at some point you will probably be "right". That doesn't mean you were right all along.
If I spent the last 10 years saying "there's no way interest rates are going to stay this low, they're definitely going to rise" then it would be a bit rich of me to pat myself on the back this month when they finally did and it would be weird of others to declare me a wise sage who tried to warn us all.

[Power n Glory]

Just pointing out that whilst many were being positive and saw light at the end of the tunnel when certain things happened over the years, to be fair to Zimm, he was the head honcho in predicting pretty much everything that's happened, to the extent it has happened.

:sulk: I want my credit, goddamnit! I've always said Wenger and the Board are one and the same. He's hid behind the no money excuse, a poor tactician and we're now seeing the results now that he's been given money.

Oh...and welcome back Cripps! :bow:

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I thought money was always overplayed as a factor. In my mind we should have won the league in 2008, it was inexcusable not to have.
Equally should have won the league in 2016 when we spent next to nothing

[Letters]

People were claiming all kinds of things about how we would decline under Wenger, plenty said we'd slip into mid-table. Last season was our worst finish under Wenger and even then we only missed out on 4th place by 2 points and we won the FA Cup.
The doom-mongers haven't exactly been vindicated, they said we'd be in mid-table years ago and that hasn't happened.
The club is, in theory, pretty well positioned for success right now. But Wenger is a spent force and we have a board who don't care so long as the money keeps rolling in.
Replacing Wenger would at least be different and right now that in itself would be a good thing, but with our board I don't see that as the silver bullet.

[Power n Glory]

I thought money was always overplayed as a factor. In my mind we should have won the league in 2008, it was inexcusable not to have.
Equally should have won the league in 2016 when we spent next to nothing

Hence why I said......
He's hid behind the no money excuse

[Niall_Quinn]

All fair points, it's not too difficult to predict one of two outcomes over an extended time.

In the normal world, as opposed to Hogwarts and the Emirates.

[Niall_Quinn]

People were claiming all kinds of things about how we would decline under Wenger, plenty said we'd slip into mid-table. Last season was our worst finish under Wenger and even then we only missed out on 4th place by 2 points and we won the FA Cup.
The doom-mongers haven't exactly been vindicated, they said we'd be in mid-table years ago and that hasn't happened.
The club is, in theory, pretty well positioned for success right now. But Wenger is a spent force and we have a board who don't care so long as the money keeps rolling in.
Replacing Wenger would at least be different and right now that in itself would be a good thing, but with our board I don't see that as the silver bullet.

A little bit of sleep and Letters is right back on it.

"Positioned for success"

Somebody tell Ivan, he'll want that one.

[Letters]

Money has been a factor. Look at where the titles have ended up. And don't pull Leicester out of your arse, what they did was remarkable but they didn't repeat it. In general the biggest prizes end up at the clubs with the biggest resources. Chelsea and City were nowhere before the billionaires took over. But that doesn't mitigate all the failures over the last 10 years and the main issue is right now we do have the resources to compete and we are still failing to.

[Niall_Quinn]

Now Leicester need to repeat it before Arsene can be held accountable.

:haha:

[Power n Glory]

People were claiming all kinds of things about how we would decline under Wenger, plenty said we'd slip into mid-table. Last season was our worst finish under Wenger and even then we only missed out on 4th place by 2 points and we won the FA Cup.
The doom-mongers haven't exactly been vindicated, they said we'd be in mid-table years ago and that hasn't happened.
The club is, in theory, pretty well positioned for success right now. But Wenger is a spent force and we have a board who don't care so long as the money keeps rolling in.
Replacing Wenger would at least be different and right now that in itself would be a good thing, but with our board I don't see that as the silver bullet.

Was it not said that Wenger was not said that Wenger had way more influence over the Board that you guys were making out?

Was it not said that he was a poor tactician?

Was it not said that he’d not be able to handle star players with egos because of his soft man management, hence why he goes for less known players?

Was it not said that he’d still fuck things up even if he had money to spend?

Was it not said that he’s he puts the interest of Board over the interest of the Arsenal fans?

A lot has been said over the years and goes way beyond the results and us dropping down the table.

[Letters]

A little bit of sleep and Letters is right back on it.

"Positioned for success"

Somebody tell Ivan, he'll want that one.

Less WUM, more debate. If you disagree then explain why. You accuse me of coming into threads and having a dig and then you do it here. If you have something to say then say it.
We have a squad which finished 5th last year and that was under Wenger who you constantly deride, you don't think they could do better under a different manager?
We have the resources to compete financially with most clubs and the stadium and global fanbase to sustain that. As a club we could succeed if we had the right manager and board.
We don't, but we could.

[Niall_Quinn]

Was it not said that Wenger was not said that Wenger had way more influence over the Board that you guys were making out?

Was it not said that he was a poor tactician?

Was it not said that he’d not be able to handle star players with egos because of his soft man management, hence why he goes for less known players?

Was it not said that he’d still fuck things up even if he had money to spend?

Was it not said that he’s he puts the interest of Board over the interest of the Arsenal fans?

A lot has been said over the years and goes way beyond the results and us dropping down the table.

Lucky guesses.

[Power n Glory]

Less WUM, more debate. If you disagree then explain why. You accuse me of coming into threads and having a dig and then you do it here. If you have something to say then say it.
We have a squad which finished 5th last year and that was under Wenger who you constantly deride, you don't think they could do better under a different manager?
We have the resources to compete financially with most clubs and the stadium and global fanbase to sustain that. As a club we could succeed if we had the right manager and board.
We don't, but we could.

Fuck off! :lol: Now you want a serious debate and less WUM!

[Letters]

Now Leicester need to repeat it before Arsene can be held accountable.

:haha:
Lazy...

https://www.veteranstoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/scarecrow-wizard-of-oz.jpg

[Niall_Quinn]

Less WUM, more debate. If you disagree then explain why. You accuse me of coming into threads and having a dig and then you do it here. If you have something to say then say it.
We have a squad which finished 5th last year and that was under Wenger who you constantly deride, you don't think they could do better under a different manager?
We have the resources to compete financially with most clubs and the stadium and global fanbase to sustain that. As a club we could succeed if we had the right manager and board.
We don't, but we could.

You want me to explain why Arsenal is not positioned for success?

[Marc Overmars]

Was it not said that Wenger was not said that Wenger had way more influence over the Board that you guys were making out?

Was it not said that he was a poor tactician?

Was it not said that he’d not be able to handle star players with egos because of his soft man management, hence why he goes for less known players?

Was it not said that he’d still fuck things up even if he had money to spend?

Was it not said that he’s he puts the interest of Board over the interest of the Arsenal fans?

A lot has been said over the years and goes way beyond the results and us dropping down the table.

Wenger was thrown under a bus, apparently.

Excuse after excuse rattled off for him back then. All to mask his flawed approach where the seeds were planted 10 years ago and now those plants are bearing fruit.

[Niall_Quinn]

Fuck off! :lol: Now you want a serious debate and less WUM!

Somebody changed the goalposts on him.

[Letters]

Fuck off! :lol: Now you want a serious debate and less WUM!

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men."

A little bit both. But I posted something sensible enough.
If people are accusing me of dropping in to sensible conversations and having a dig (which I'm not saying I ever have) then it's a bit rich for those people to then do the same thing and post lazy straw man arguments.

[Letters]

You want me to explain why Arsenal is not positioned for success?

Well, I've mentioned our board and manager which I see as "blockers" to success. And that is, admittedly, a bit problem. But we have the things I mentioned going for us, most clubs don't.
Without a billionaire taking them over very few clubs have the chance to succeed that we potentially do. If you disagree then yes, explain why.

[Niall_Quinn]

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men."

A little bit both. But I posted something sensible enough.
If people are accusing me of dropping in to sensible conversations and having a dig (which I'm not saying I ever have) then it's a bit rich for those people to then do the same thing and post lazy straw man arguments.

We had all the sensible conversations years back. Remember? And nothing has changed since. So people can maybe be excused for laughing when the same old crap comes up again. Poor old Wenger. Had 200 million to spend and all he got was Xhaka and a lousy T-shirt.

The guy has fucked-up at every turn. How long does history have to be before we can call it the official record?

[Niall_Quinn]

Well, I've mentioned our board and manager which I see as "blockers" to success. And that is, admittedly, a bit problem. But we have the things I mentioned going for us, most clubs don't.
Without a billionaire taking them over very few clubs have the chance to succeed that we potentially do. If you disagree then yes, explain why.

We have billionaires that have taken us over.

[Letters]

Was it not said that Wenger was not said that Wenger had way more influence over the Board that you guys were making out?

Was it not said that he was a poor tactician?

Was it not said that he’d not be able to handle star players with egos because of his soft man management, hence why he goes for less known players?

Was it not said that he’d still fuck things up even if he had money to spend?

Was it not said that he’s he puts the interest of Board over the interest of the Arsenal fans?

A lot has been said over the years and goes way beyond the results and us dropping down the table.

Yes, lots has been said, some right, some wrong. But don't cherry pick a few right ones and declare those who said them wise seers, ignoring all the things they said that were wrong.
Oh, and literally no-one ever thought Wenger was a good tactician :lol:

[Letters]

We have billionaires that have taken us over.

:lol: True. But you know what I meant :sulk:

[Power n Glory]

Yes, lots has been said, some right, some wrong. But don't cherry pick a few right ones and declare those who said them wise seers, ignoring all the things they said that were wrong.
Oh, and literally no-one ever thought Wenger was a good tactician :lol:

Really? I remember Flavs having a go at me for saying that some years back and few others chiming in to disagree with me.

[Cripps]

Not really. He has been consistent but if you're consistent about something where fortunes often fluctuate, as they tend to in football over the long term, then at some point you will probably be "right". That doesn't mean you were right all along.
If I spent the last 10 years saying "there's no way interest rates are going to stay this low, they're definitely going to rise" then it would be a bit rich of me to pat myself on the back this month when they finally did and it would be weird of others to declare me a wise sage who tried to warn us all.

Of course you're not going to admit he was right all along, cause that would mean you were wrong! And that can't happen can it Arsene Letters! :haha:

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I think the only sensible conclusion is that

Money prevented us from competing every season
Wenger prevented us from competing any season

Even in the 07/08 season which I maintain we should have won, didn’t compete past February due to winning 1 game in 8 between February and April.

Going that far back I supported Wenger as manager then, but still held him not money responsible for that capitulation.

[Letters]

I'd agree with that. But I don't think it was a gimme that Wenger+Money would still fail. And those pretending they knew that all along, most of us were encouraged by the first FA Cup and hoped we would push on.
I should add that a lot of Wenger's failings have always been there.
He was never a good tactician. He was never a good motivator. He never signed the right players after we'd been successful (hence never retaining the title).
When you've got better, fitter players than everyone else and a strong captain it masks a lot of that, but those things were always there, looking back.

[Cripps]

People were claiming all kinds of things about how we would decline under Wenger, plenty said we'd slip into mid-table. Last season was our worst finish under Wenger and even then we only missed out on 4th place by 2 points and we won the FA Cup.

Here we go:lol: the positive spin begins:lol:

Can't have a thread turning into pure hate towards your messiah can we now! :haha:

[Power n Glory]

Wenger was thrown under a bus, apparently.

Excuse after excuse rattled off for him back then. All to mask his flawed approach where the seeds were planted 10 years ago and now those plants are bearing fruit.

There were so many. It can be excused because we didn’t have much information back then but in light of what we see today, I look back at the situation with RVP and wonder why we sold to Utd instead of holding on to him. There is no way we needed the money that badly considering we signed new sponsorship deals the season after.

[Cripps]

Was it not said that Wenger was not said that Wenger had way more influence over the Board that you guys were making out?

Was it not said that he was a poor tactician?

Was it not said that he’d not be able to handle star players with egos because of his soft man management, hence why he goes for less known players?

Was it not said that he’d still fuck things up even if he had money to spend?

Was it not said that he’s he puts the interest of Board over the interest of the Arsenal fans?

A lot has been said over the years and goes way beyond the results and us dropping down the table.

Best post on here tbh

[Cripps]

Wenger was thrown under a bus, apparently.

Excuse after excuse rattled off for him back then. All to mask his flawed approach where the seeds were planted 10 years ago and now those plants are bearing fruit.

The latest one is he needs to stay because he's the only one that cares :lol: suppose they have to cling onto anything they can :lol:

[Power n Glory]

I'd agree with that. But I don't think it was a gimme that Wenger+Money would still fail. And those pretending they knew that all along, most of us were encouraged by the first FA Cup and hoped we would push on.
I should add that a lot of Wenger's failings have always been there.
He was never a good tactician. He was never a good motivator. He never signed the right players after we'd been successful (hence never retaining the title).
When you've got better, fitter players than everyone else and a strong captain it masks a lot of that, but those things were always there, looking back.

'Hope we push on' doesn't mean we were convinced we'd push on. You confuse the two. I hope we win every single game but that doesn't mean I'm convinced we'll do it.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I couldn’t see any reason to believe he would progress with money

I didn’t back the three years between 2014 and 2017. However I conceded that despite disappointments and frustrations he had kept us stable during the time and it was a reward for that to say here’s some money you have three years to give us some indication of progress.

Now would clubs like city, Chelsea or United been so generous?. No but there it is

Whilst I didnt support it I think there was some justification for that contract in 2014. There is absolutely none now.

[Marc Overmars]

I think the only sensible conclusion is that

Money prevented us from competing every season
Wenger prevented us from competing any season

Even in the 07/08 season which I maintain we should have won, didn’t compete past February due to winning 1 game in 8 between February and April.

Agree with that conclusion.

2008 and 2016 we definitely should have got closer. I’d also throw in 2011 and 2014. 2011 we fell apart after the League Cup final defeat only winning something like 2 out of 10 games and in 2014 we spent the most amount of days in 1st only to somehow contrive to finish 4th.

All those collapses came at different stages of Wenger’s tenure, with or without money he has struggled since the league became more competitive.

[Niall_Quinn]

If Wenger was never a good tactician, if he was never a good motivator, and if it's a gimme he'd fail in the transfer market despite having money...

Who developed the best attacking football this country has seen?
Who kept the team firing through an unbeaten season?
Who signed Henry, Vieira, Overmars, Petit, Henry, Pires?

I think you have hit on something here Letters. Which leads on to a more interesting question. Wenger's real legacy. Who was responsible for the great success we had at the turn of the century, and if it was Wenger, how can he possibly have abandoned everything and laboured so hard to produce this absolute shit show, some of the most boring football ever seen, some of the least ambitious and a team packed with expensive dross? He signed Sanogo instead of Mbappe.

My theory so far is, his early legacy remains intact but he had a mental breakdown. If he carries on, some people might not be so kind in their judgement.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

If Wenger was never a good tactician, if he was never a good motivator, and if it's a gimme he'd fail in the transfer market despite having money...

Who developed the best attacking football this country has seen?
Who kept the team firing through an unbeaten season?
Who signed Henry, Vieira, Overmars, Petit, Henry, Pires?

I think you have hit on something here Letters. Which leads on to a more interesting question. Wenger's real legacy. Who was responsible for the great success we had at the turn of the century, and if it was Wenger, how can he possibly have abandoned everything and laboured so hard to produce this absolute shit show, some of the most boring football ever seen, some of the least ambitious and a team packed with expensive dross? He signed Sanogo instead of Mbappe.

My theory so far is, his early legacy remains intact but he had a mental breakdown. If he carries on, some people might not be so kind in their judgement.

Or maybe football changes and he couldn’t adapt

When he first came here he was revolutionary, now he’s as dated as

[Niall_Quinn]

Or maybe football changes and he couldn’t adapt

When he first came here he was revolutionary, now he’s as dated as

That's like a change in the Highway Code compelling you to drive your car off a cliff.

[Letters]

'Hope we push on' doesn't mean we were convinced we'd push on. You confuse the two. I hope we win every single game but that doesn't mean I'm convinced we'll do it.

I don't confuse the two, I'm just saying that if people are claiming they "knew" we wouldn't are awarding themselves more credit than they deserve and conveniently forgetting all the things they "knew" which didn't happen.

[Cripps]

If Wenger was never a good tactician, if he was never a good motivator, and if it's a gimme he'd fail in the transfer market despite having money...

Who developed the best attacking football this country has seen?
Who kept the team firing through an unbeaten season?
Who signed Henry, Vieira, Overmars, Petit, Henry, Pires?

I think you have hit on something here Letters. Which leads on to a more interesting question. Wenger's real legacy. Who was responsible for the great success we had at the turn of the century, and if it was Wenger, how can he possibly have abandoned everything and laboured so hard to produce this absolute shit show, some of the most boring football ever seen, some of the least ambitious and a team packed with expensive dross? He signed Sanogo instead of Mbappe.

My theory so far is, his early legacy remains intact but he had a mental breakdown. If he carries on, some people might not be so kind in their judgement.

All I'll say is

Thank god George Graham was here before him

[Power n Glory]

I don't confuse the two, I'm just saying that if people are claiming they "knew" we wouldn't are awarding themselves more credit than they deserve and conveniently forgetting all the things they "knew" which didn't happen.

Like what? The season isn't over?

Letters, you don't even watch the football anymore. That is how bad things are right now. How much worse does it have to get?

[Letters]

Or maybe football changes and he couldn’t adapt

When he first came here he was revolutionary, now he’s as dated as

That is pretty much exactly how I see it.
The problem isn't that Wenger has changed, the problem is he hasn't while all around him has.

[Niall_Quinn]

I don't confuse the two, I'm just saying that if people are claiming they "knew" we wouldn't are awarding themselves more credit than they deserve and conveniently forgetting all the things they "knew" which didn't happen.

Credit? Deserve? What?

Forget that. I'm pretty sure the gist of this is people don't buy into the excuses you are making for the bloke, regardless of when they first twigged he was a loser.

You just happen to be the last person on here that supports the bloke. I know you'll say you don't and you want him gone and all that. Maybe that's even true this season. But still, so many of your postings have that "but" clause that essentially makes an excuse for every outcome. All too predictable outcomes that can be mapped back over at least a decade and can now be projected into the future with depressing accuracy.

The fanbase has been through many stages of denial, acceptance, grief, anger,.. This is the last stage of the process, where every fan finally accepts the inevitable and the fanbase becomes unified in one goal. Not winning titles, obviously, not winning cups, because it makes no difference, not even winning matches, because we can even predict those too. But getting Kroenke, Wenger and the other leeches out of this place.

That's when it's going to change. When the fanbase has a unified and unbreakable front. And for that to happen, the last lame excuses have to be purged. There's not a single legitimate excuse to be made for any of them. Every excuse has been exposed. Every lie revealed by the passage of time.

All that is left is us, and them.

No more excuses now.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

That's like a change in the Highway Code compelling you to drive your car off a cliff.

Not really. It’s the difference between a club threatening to be the dominant force in English football and being bang average which is what we are currently.

Bang Average is totally unacceptable but it’s not cliff edge.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Just pointing out that whilst many were being positive and saw light at the end of the tunnel when certain things happened over the years, to be fair to Zimm, he was the head honcho in predicting pretty much everything that's happened, to the extent it has happened.

We're in an infinitely better position financially and to compete than we would have been if we were still at Highbury. In that sense we've certainly succeeded in our aims with the stadium - you can't call yourself a big club and not have a modern up-to-date big stadium - why do you think the likes of Spurs & Chelsea are desperate to do their own moves right now? Zim was right about shit regarding that.

What's holding us back is the manager and by extension the current board's lack of ruthless ambition. I was one that was initially prepared to give Wenger a chance when the money rolled in but clearly he hasn't been cut out to handle the rigours of winning the league for a while now, especially in the ultra competitive environment we're currently in. If Zim had specifically moaned about that, then he would have been right - but then again, as alluded to above, it's hardly a bold prediction.

[Cripps]

Like what? The season isn't over?

Letters, you don't even watch the football anymore. That is how bad things are right now. How much worse does it have to get?

He can't admit we were right because that would undermine all the people that have been banned over the years and all the personal duels he got himself into, which would mean he's ultimately lost. He's trying to save face.