European Super League

[Marc Overmars]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/european-super-league-announced


Deserves its own thread now it’s been confirmed and we’re one of the greedy cunts involved.

What is this shite?

This is going to be a complete mess, no sanctioning body in the game will authorise it but it’s just going to happen regardless it seems. Hopefully the PL threaten to boot us out of the league or deduct points or something.

[Niall_Quinn]

Quite handy really. I was moving from being a fan to being indifferent and, slowly, onto loathing the club. This speeds things up nicely. Totally predictable, as greed generally is. You'd think they'd be focusing all energies on improving the current boring, mid-table, shit-kicker football played domestically. But no, they're going to double down.

[Bumble]

Ridiculous. Sport is about being where you are on merit. Where will all this extra money go into players and agents how does that help anyone.

[Letters]

Just another part of the dismantling of the game I grew up with.

The foreign players have undoubtedly enriched the game but there needs to be some balance between them and the “local boy made good”. There’s almost none of the latter now.
No heroes. No players who give everything for the shirt. Who get what playing for The Arsenal is about and won’t leave when someone waves the next big cheque at them.

We have owners who couldn’t give a shit about the club so long as it’s doing their bank balance good.

So we have players who don’t care about the club or fans, owners who don’t care about the club or fans. You have journeyman players who aren’t fit to lace Adams’ boots earning more in a year than he did in his career. The fans being fleeced from every angle - someone’s got to pay these obscene amounts of money and one way or another it’s always us.

You have the saturation coverage, bollox like VAR coming in to make things worse, the social media stuff - honestly, who runs Arsenal’s FB? The detachment from the fans is embarrassing. And that’s the key thing, there has to be some connection between a club and fans. A sense that it’s us against the rest “fuck all the rest”. It’s gone. They don’t care about us. They care about our money but that’s not really the same thing.

It’s not a sport any more. This is just another nail in the coffin of the sport I grew up with.

[Xhaka Can’t]

https://media2.giphy.com/media/3XiQswSmbjBiU/giphy.gif

[Letters]

Have to say this has united the fans in an almost unprecedented way.
I haven’t heard anyone say a good thing about it.

[Gooner23]

The whole thing is rotten

[Letters]

Wenger :bow:

https://www.football.london/arsenal-fc/news/arsenal-european-super-league-wenger-20413860

Spot on again :cool:

:d


:ninja:

[WGC Goon]

Arsenal announcing on Twitter that they are one of the founder members of the ESL made my blood boil like never before, thanks Stan Kroenke for stripping away any resemblance of the football club I once loved :angry:

[Letters]

The new annual tournament will provide significantly greater economic growth and support for European football via a long-term commitment to uncapped solidarity payments which will grow in line with league revenues.

https://www.arsenal.com/news/european-super-league-announced

:lol: They're not even pretending any more.


Football :rose:

[I am invisible]

Tbh, this is the format the modern game probably deserves - there hasn’t been any real competition in most leagues for years so why not do away with the pretence completely?

Gutted for the fans and all the small businesses out there that rely on that income trickling down from the top, but I have absolutely zero sympathy for the Premier League, UEFA, any of the other clubs or the government. They made this monster when they allowed spending and wages get out of control, and now self-preservation is kicking in after the pandemic...

[KSE Comedy Club]

How the fuck were we even considered to part of this?!?

We've been dogshit for the last 4-5 years and not anywhere near CL level.

I can see it now - get in the ESL, not invest any money in the squad, sit in the lower part of the table and achieve nothing.

woohoo.

[Letters]

How the fuck were we even considered to part of this?!?
You could ask the same about Spurs. Yes, they're better than us right now but only marginally. They haven't won a big trophy since 1991 (no, Spurs, you don't get to count the league cup), they haven't won a title since Noah was in short trousers.
BUT, what do Arsenal and Spurs have in common? Shiny new big stadiums and a large, global fan base. Think of all that lovely money!
It's so transparent, it's embarrassing.

I can't see this happening. It's united football fans in their distain for it so who is going to watch? Who is going to pay to watch, more to the point.
If the answer is "that large global fan base" then maybe that's true, but it'll basically sever the last dangling thread of connection between the traditional fan and the club. But I guess if you're a business that doesn't matter. So long as the money is coming in from somewhere, right?

[Chippy]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/european-super-league-announced


Deserves its own thread now it’s been confirmed and we’re one of the greedy cunts involved.

What is this shite?

This is going to be a complete mess, no sanctioning body in the game will authorise it but it’s just going to happen regardless it seems. Hopefully the PL threaten to boot us out of the league or deduct points or something.

I originally thought that this is something to rival the Premier League. For example, the big six would leave to join the Super League.

However, it seems to be an "Add On". So what about the current European competitions? Will we be able to play in the FA Cup? Will teams prioritise the Super League because of money an simply rest players in the Premier League?

This has got disaster written all over it :(

[Gooner23]

How the fuck were we even considered to part of this?!?

We've been dogshit for the last 4-5 years and not anywhere near CL level.

I can see it now - get in the ESL, not invest any money in the squad, sit in the lower part of the table and achieve nothing.

woohoo.

Sounds like Kroenke is heavily involved, along with the other American owners

[Letters]

Sounds like Kroenke is heavily involved, along with the other American owners

One has to wonder what they were thinking.
Did they really think the fans would be excited by this?
Or did they know there would be a backlash but figured that with global fan bases large enough they only need, say, 1% of them to pay a lot to see this and screw the rest?

[Marc Overmars]

I originally thought that this is something to rival the Premier League. For example, the big six would leave to join the Super League.

However, it seems to be an "Add On". So what about the current European competitions? Will we be able to play in the FA Cup? Will teams prioritise the Super League because of money an simply rest players in the Premier League?

This has got disaster written all over it :(

It would kill the CL for sure but that seems to be one of the aims of it. Cut out UEFA the middleman and spread the cash amongst themselves.

[Ollie the Optimist]

I suspect most of this could have been avoided if UEFA & the premier league etc had actually tried to enforce Financial Fair Play rather then just letting the billionaire owners do what they want with no repercussions as uefa & the league were happy with the money rolling in.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Have to say this has united the fans in an almost unprecedented way.
I haven’t heard anyone say a good thing about it.

Unfortunately it does have plenty of defenders on twitter :sulk:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Further, for a number of years, the Founding Clubs have had the objective of improving the quality and intensity of existing European competitions throughout each season, and of creating a format for top clubs and players to compete on a regular basis.

I must have missed where that applies to us for the last 10 years :blink::shrug:

[Globalgunner]

The UEFA and European Brussels admin are trying to push across the whole leagues a 51% fan ownership model similar to what obtains in Germany. This ownership thing is what prevents German clubs with being on board with this. I imagine now they will try to fast track this new law now. It will force Kroenke and co to become minority owners (UK maybe exempt bc of Brexit). If passed it will kill this Super league dead in its tracks as no fan dominated board will go along with it. Its probably why these billionaire owners are fast tracking this. they want it to be a fait accompli before the European legislation is passed.

Battle lines have certainly been drawn

[KSE Comedy Club]

You could ask the same about Spurs. Yes, they're better than us right now but only marginally. They haven't won a big trophy since 1991 (no, Spurs, you don't get to count the league cup), they haven't won a title since Noah was in short trousers.
BUT, what do Arsenal and Spurs have in common? Shiny new big stadiums and a large, global fan base. Think of all that lovely money!
It's so transparent, it's embarrassing.

I can't see this happening. It's united football fans in their distain for it so who is going to watch? Who is going to pay to watch, more to the point.
If the answer is "that large global fan base" then maybe that's true, but it'll basically sever the last dangling thread of connection between the traditional fan and the club. But I guess if you're a business that doesn't matter. So long as the money is coming in from somewhere, right?

Spurs?

Who the fuck are they ??


lol, I know they are no different, but I just meant from an Arsenal perspective - no one cares about Spurs :lol:

[Globalgunner]

You could ask the same about Spurs. Yes, they're better than us right now but only marginally. They haven't won a big trophy since 1991 (no, Spurs, you don't get to count the league cup), they haven't won a title since Noah was in short trousers.
BUT, what do Arsenal and Spurs have in common? Shiny new big stadiums and a large, global fan base. Think of all that lovely money!
It's so transparent, it's embarrassing.

I can't see this happening. It's united football fans in their distain for it so who is going to watch? Who is going to pay to watch, more to the point.
If the answer is "that large global fan base" then maybe that's true, but it'll basically sever the last dangling thread of connection between the traditional fan and the club. But I guess if you're a business that doesn't matter. So long as the money is coming in from somewhere, right?

Spurs global fan base is a mythical thing. Nobody in the outside white Europe or Americas cares a hoot about Spurs. No one here buys their tat. Maybe the Koreans are Son fans but I have never come across a Spurs fan outside my being in the UK

[KSE Comedy Club]

Sounds like Kroenke is heavily involved, along with the other American owners
I would say that is pretty much a given, this is a heavily 'American influenced' idea of sporting competition.

"This corner kick is brought to you by ENOC - keeping the world moving!"

:sick:

[hobson's choice]

So it's obvious the American owners bought these teams with a hindsight this was gonna happen

[hobson's choice]

Spurs global fan base is a mythical thing. Nobody in the outside white Europe or Americas cares a hoot about Spurs. No one here buys their tat. Maybe the Koreans are Son fans but I have never come across a Spurs fan outside my being in the UK

City doesn't have one either, and Chelsea barring a few places, don't really have much either.

[Letters]

Spurs global fan base is a mythical thing. Nobody in the outside white Europe or Americas cares a hoot about Spurs. No one here buys their tat. Maybe the Koreans are Son fans but I have never come across a Spurs fan outside my being in the UK

A mate went to South Africa and told me the PL is big over there and he met lots of Spurs fans.
And yes, there's the Son thing.
They have around 37-38 million followers on social media.

https://www.goal.com/en/news/which-football-teams-have-most-fans/1qmg4j3457wvh1kxkb7qbdo7qn

[Mac76]

tbh if we were going to do it then it should replace the PL - then we'd never have to play the likes of Burnley again - I can see the advantage in that but this is a pointless halfway house that upsets everything and gains nothing

[Mac76]

we're really not messing about are we...


https://arseblog.news/2021/04/arsenal-quit-european-club-association

[Ollie the Optimist]

Reports today that Bayern, PSG & Dortmund will also be signing up.


Obviously PSG will follow the money but yesterday when no Germans were involved, the media were banging on about how their fan ownership models were the way to go and praising them. That aged well :lol:

[IBK]

I really don't understand why anyone is surprised about this move. This didn't happen overnight, or recently. As far as the EPL is concerned, it started when foreign commercial investors - particularly the Americans - were invited to run our clubs. That was when the genie was released, not now. If you look at it from the perspective of owners who only care for their financial investment a Super league basically run on the American model - makes total sense.

I hate the idea like most fans - but for me its ironic to see EPL clubs who have wallowed in the obscene TV money available - are now up in arms when the big bucks approach is taken to another level. You jump on the express train, and then wail when it fails to stop at your station.

The talk of clubs being banned from the top flight or players being banned from playing for their countries is about as real a threat as the sanctions being taken against racism. It won't happen because revenue trumps everything. It seems ridiculous that our club (and Spurs) should be considered as part of the elite given current form, but look at the rich list and it seems less absurd.

It's depressing, but clearly this is the future, and ther is little point in wailing about it now.

[KSE Comedy Club]

The UEFA and European Brussels admin are trying to push across the whole leagues a 51% fan ownership model similar to what obtains in Germany. This ownership thing is what prevents German clubs with being on board with this. I imagine now they will try to fast track this new law now. It will force Kroenke and co to become minority owners (UK maybe exempt bc of Brexit). If passed it will kill this Super league dead in its tracks as no fan dominated board will go along with it. Its probably why these billionaire owners are fast tracking this. they want it to be a fait accompli before the European legislation is passed.

Battle lines have certainly been drawn

It's a great idea but you can bet your bottom dollar that it wont be able to be retrospectively enforced.

[KSE Comedy Club]

EUFA Statement:

https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/mediaservices/mediareleases/news/0268-12121411400e-7897186e699a-1000--statement-by-uefa-the-english-football-association-the-premier-/

most notably:

As previously announced by FIFA and the six Confederations, the clubs concerned will be banned from playing in any other competition at domestic, European or world level, and their players could be denied the opportunity to represent their national teams.

so then what?

What exactly would be the point of any of these clubs existing if they are only in one league, excluded from everything else?

But hey, money, right.... :shrug:

[KSE Comedy Club]

In addition, the competition will be built on a sustainable financial foundation with all Founding Clubs signing up to a spending framework. In exchange for their commitment, Founding Clubs will receive an amount of €3.5 billion solely to support their infrastructure investment plans and to offset the impact of the COVID pandemic.

This is absolutely insane :blink:

[Letters]

But hey, money, right.... :shrug:
Right. But where's that money going to come from? Obviously clubs have been picked for their global fan base.
But from the reaction I've seen that global fan base thinks this is bullshit.
Are the clubs banking on the fact that while many people are pissed off, enough will still want to see their team to pay to watch this?
They might be right. It's completely alienate the traditional support but I guess if enough other people around the world will keep paying then who cares, right?

[Marc Overmars]

I have no doubt global fans would lap it up, they provide more commercially for these clubs than any domestic fans do. Certain foreign TV stations can also comfortably outbid BT & Sky in securing deals too.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Right. But where's that money going to come from? Obviously clubs have been picked for their global fan base.
But from the reaction I've seen that global fan base thinks this is bullshit.
Are the clubs banking on the fact that while many people are pissed off, enough will still want to see their team to pay to watch this?
They might be right. It's completely alienate the traditional support but I guess if enough other people around the world will keep paying then who cares, right?

I'm not entirely sure, but we can guess that some streaming services will bid for the rights to show the games.


JP Morgan (the great reset) is financing it's creation, although I'm not sure what they are getting out of it in return.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/sports/football/jp-morgan-to-finance-breakaway-super-league-101618818691307.html

[KSE Comedy Club]

I have no doubt global fans would lap it up, they provide more commercially for these clubs than any domestic fans do. Certain foreign TV stations can also comfortably outbid BT & Sky in securing deals too.

This is true.

I saw a post on twitter last night that DANZ (some tv station abroad) was willing to pay €3-4 billion for the tv rights in it's respective country :shrug:

[WGC Goon]

I can see it now - get in the ESL, not invest any money in the squad, sit in the lower part of the table and achieve nothing.

woohoo.

Stan will be happy though :cheer::yippee:

[Marc Overmars]

Stan will be happy though :cheer::yippee:

No relegation either.

20th place trophy. :bow:

Sporting merit. :bow:

[WGC Goon]

So it's obvious the American owners bought these teams with a hindsight this was gonna happen

Stan Kroenke knew this was on the horizon and this must have influenced his decision not to sell the club to Usmanov.

[GP]

Look at the La Liga table on the Rel Betis website :lol:

https://en.realbetisbalompie.es/

Never mind, looks like they removed it.

[IBK]

Stan Kroenke knew this was on the horizon and this must of influenced his decision not to sell the club to Usmanov.

Of course he did!

[Niall_Quinn]

Wenger :bow:

https://www.football.london/arsenal-fc/news/arsenal-european-super-league-wenger-20413860

Spot on again :cool:

:d


:ninja:

There's a very important lesson to learn here, as Mr Wenger himself would say.

These "surprises" do not happen by surprise. They are planned long in advance, in the shadows, while denial is issued left, right and centre in public. That's how Wenger knows - because conspiracies (which is precisely what this is and has always been) leak out, little by little. You don't always know precisely what's going on, you don't always know the details, but you can see the direction all the birds are flying.

Thinking back two Wenger's great teams striding around a sun soaked Highbury, going toe to toe with what was essentially a gang of hoodlums from Manchester, the anticipation, the build-up, the rage, the joy, the packed pub afterwards. Or the disbelief if we somehow lost, the genuine hatred for Mike Riley (who now seems like a half decent ref by today's standard).

It's not so long ago. When rotten individuals get control of something they can destroy it very quickly.

That should be remembered in all aspects of life, not just football.

[Niall_Quinn]

You could ask the same about Spurs. Yes, they're better than us right now but only marginally. They haven't won a big trophy since 1991 (no, Spurs, you don't get to count the league cup), they haven't won a title since Noah was in short trousers.
BUT, what do Arsenal and Spurs have in common? Shiny new big stadiums and a large, global fan base. Think of all that lovely money!
It's so transparent, it's embarrassing.

I can't see this happening. It's united football fans in their distain for it so who is going to watch? Who is going to pay to watch, more to the point.
If the answer is "that large global fan base" then maybe that's true, but it'll basically sever the last dangling thread of connection between the traditional fan and the club. But I guess if you're a business that doesn't matter. So long as the money is coming in from somewhere, right?

I think you are overestimating their reliance on what you call "fans"

You probably mean fans who live in this country and want to actually attend games in, relatively speaking, tiny stadiums that are potentially dwarfed in audience size by the great god pay per view TV.

When they say "European" league - have a bet right now that it will become a global league with mega-bankrolled teams from China and the USA.

The "fans" they are salivating over are not the same as the lower income, local lads who used to turn up in person. Unless we're going to go all Red Star Belgrade, the traditional fans will simply be sidestepped as irrelevant. The greedy pigs have said as much - Covid, the gift that keeps on giving, saw the stadiums shut down. You can say that was an unfortunate consequence of an unforeseen pandemic - fine. However, purely coincidentally of course, it has also been a fantastic trail run for future sport in general, where evrything will be consumed from a distance provided you have the credit card in hand.

[Niall_Quinn]

I would say that is pretty much a given, this is a heavily 'American influenced' idea of sporting competition.

"This corner kick is brought to you by ENOC - keeping the world moving!"

:sick:

Modern players can't take corners properly, so that'll be one of the cheap slots. I suspect diving and rolling around screaming will be prime time.

[Niall_Quinn]

I really don't understand why anyone is surprised about this move. This didn't happen overnight, or recently. As far as the EPL is concerned, it started when foreign commercial investors - particularly the Americans - were invited to run our clubs. That was when the genie was released, not now. If you look at it from the perspective of owners who only care for their financial investment a Super league basically run on the American model - makes total sense.

I hate the idea like most fans - but for me its ironic to see EPL clubs who have wallowed in the obscene TV money available - are now up in arms when the big bucks approach is taken to another level. You jump on the express train, and then wail when it fails to stop at your station.

The talk of clubs being banned from the top flight or players being banned from playing for their countries is about as real a threat as the sanctions being taken against racism. It won't happen because revenue trumps everything. It seems ridiculous that our club (and Spurs) should be considered as part of the elite given current form, but look at the rich list and it seems less absurd.

It's depressing, but clearly this is the future, and ther is little point in wailing about it now.

They're after the revenue, not the football. So an ex-giant that happens to be shite carries as much weight as a present day giant with an ever expanding revenue base. And this is just the start. Endorsements, advertising, sponsorship, football players plastered over every screen selling every product imaginable.

I hope they can still find the time to turn up for the match, prior engagements permitting.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Modern players can't take corners properly, so that'll be one of the cheap slots. I suspect diving and rolling around screaming will be prime time.

Absolutely.

Imagine a penalty kick...........

'a penalty advertising slot is £30m sir'

[Niall_Quinn]

I have no doubt global fans would lap it up, they provide more commercially for these clubs than any domestic fans do. Certain foreign TV stations can also comfortably outbid BT & Sky in securing deals too.

I always wondered why Amazon was suddenly interested in streaming sporting events. And now they have all that extra loot they picked up from a million competitors shut down during year of nonsense I guess they be one of the mega-corporations that can buy in at ground level and own sport thereafter. Really opens up a lot of opportunity when you don't have to pay tax.

[Niall_Quinn]

Absolutely.

Imagine a penalty kick...........

'a penalty advertising slot is £30m sir'

There will probably be a 10 minute interlude so they can run 9 minutes of ads and a 1 minute pre-penalty kick show. Hosted by Gary Lineker.

[Niall_Quinn]

No relegation either.

20th place trophy. :bow:

Sporting merit. :bow:

And first in alphabetical order, so we'll always top the league at least once per season, confirming our status as the best club in Europe while it lasts.

Starting to warm to the idea. Greatness beckons.

[KSE Comedy Club]

There will probably be a 10 minute interlude so they can run 9 minutes of ads and a 1 minute pre-penalty kick show. Hosted by Gary Lineker.

A silent night mattress ad for 9 minutes, hosted by Michael Ow........zzzzzzzzzz

[Letters]

https://newsthump.com/2021/04/19/football-fans-outraged-at-plans-for-european-super-league-of-europes-top-clubs-and-spurs/

:lol:

(Obviously we're on thin ice, but still...)

[WMUG]

Genuinely meant what I said in the other thread about setting up a phoenix club.

I've been following AFC Wimbledon for a few years now, they represent everything I love about football whilst Arsenal have been slowly morphing into everything I despise about it.

If this goes ahead, I think we'd be seeing a lot of similar clubs starting at the lowest level and working their way up, and if I can, I like the idea of being involved in some way.

[Letters]

Last year I was going to Enfield Town a bit. Might do that more regularly. The quality isn't high but it's good fun and it's more like the football I remember.

Goonersweb FC :bow:

[KSE Comedy Club]

This is all so depressing.

I've just recently managed to get back some interest after another turgid season of banging my head against the wall.

Partly why I haven't posted here in such a long time, feeling detached from the game and the results being predictable and meaningless.

Looks like I'll be heading that way again soon.

I actually feel quite devastated right now :upset:

[Marc Overmars]

It’s enough to just switch off from football altogether. I’ve zoned out this season more than I ever thought possible, to the point where I genuinely don’t know when games are on or what the league table looks like. Without Maccy’s threads I wouldn’t know shit unless I saw it in passing.

[KSE Comedy Club]

It’s enough to just switch off from football altogether. I’ve zoned out this season more than I ever thought possible, to the point where I genuinely don’t know when games are on or what the league table looks like. Without Maccy’s threads I wouldn’t know shit unless I saw it in passing.

Same.

What a terrible day.

Even Jose getting sacked hasn't managed to make me smile :shrug:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Apparently the super league clubs wont be licensed to appear on FIFA 22 game this year :lol:

I doubt the clubs earn very much money from those games so I’m sure they will be shaking in their boots at that threat.


Plus i think several the super league clubs, arsenal included already license themselves to Pro Evolution anyway. I suspect if fans really want to play as Arsenal or Real Madrid etc, they’ll buy Pro Evo rather than FIFA.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Apparently the super league clubs wont be licensed to appear on FIFA 22 game this year :lol:

I doubt the clubs earn very much money from those games so I’m sure they will be shaking in their boots at that threat.


Plus i think several the super league clubs, arsenal included already license themselves to Pro Evolution anyway. I suspect if fans really want to play as Arsenal or Real Madrid etc, they’ll buy Pro Evo rather than FIFA.

Ah well, I hate football games anyway - much prefer shooting things :good:

[Letters]

Apparently the super league clubs wont be licensed to appear on FIFA 22 game this year :lol:

I doubt the clubs earn very much money from those games so I’m sure they will be shaking in their boots at that threat.


Plus i think several the super league clubs, arsenal included already license themselves to Pro Evolution anyway. I suspect if fans really want to play as Arsenal or Real Madrid etc, they’ll buy Pro Evo rather than FIFA.

It's an interesting power play.

"If you join that super league then you can't play in the PL". OK. Good luck selling Sky subscriptions without the big clubs...
Same with the World Cup. Without many of the top players it would be like the Olympic Football, and who cares about that?
Who is going to blink first? It's an interesting test case of where the power really lies.

[Ollie the Optimist]

It's an interesting power play.

"If you join that super league then you can't play in the PL". OK. Good luck selling Sky subscriptions without the big clubs...
Same with the World Cup. Without many of the top players it would be like the Olympic Football, and who cares about that?
Who is going to blink first? It's an interesting test case of where the power really lies.

The league & UEFA will blink first because money talks. The super league now has the money in place so they dont give a shit.

The last tv rights in the premier league went for billions. Do you think sky will pay teh same amount if the biggest game of the season is Burnley v West Ham? Not a chance. Same with the champions league games.

[Marc Overmars]

I’d be interested to see what the players think because being told you can no longer compete for the CL or even play at a World Cup, and instead have to play for some made up trophy, can’t really sit will with them on a sporting level.

Then again their wages would probably be doubled as a sweetener anyway.

It’s all fucked, greed has always existed but you could argue it was proportionate but now this is a total disregard for everything football has ever been.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Modern players can't take corners properly, so that'll be one of the cheap slots. I suspect diving and rolling around screaming will be prime time.

These handbags are brought to you by Louis Vuitton.

Press RED to buy now!

[WGC Goon]

Apparently the super league clubs wont be licensed to appear on FIFA 22 game this year :lol:

I doubt the clubs earn very much money from those games so I’m sure they will be shaking in their boots at that threat.


Plus i think several the super league clubs, arsenal included already license themselves to Pro Evolution anyway. I suspect if fans really want to play as Arsenal or Real Madrid etc, they’ll buy Pro Evo rather than FIFA.

No disrespect Ollie but are you 12?

FIFA 22, Pro Evo...I DON'T GIVE A F*CK!!!

I need a dark corner :ilt:

[Letters]

I’d be interested to see what the players think because being told you can no longer compete for the CL or even play at a World Cup, and instead have to play for some made up trophy, can’t really sit will with them on a sporting level.
Right, but as Ollie has suggested, it could be an idle threat. Because if you don't have the prestige teams in the CL or the prestige players in the World Cup then does it harm those things to the point where the powers that be are going to have to buckle and stand down. It would be nice if they finally showed some backbone and stood up to them, but it's plausible that when push comes to shove they won't be able to.

[Ollie the Optimist]

As has been pointed out on twitter earlier today, the premier league talking about respecting the fans etc is a bit rich when they tried to flog Brighton v Fulham for £15 earlier this year.

It also shows where the power lies. They had to reverse that decision as no one was paying £15 to watch the shit games so why would people pay for sky etc if those were only ones on offer? They wont, they’ll pay to watch arsenal v spurs or Liverpool v united etc and the league knows that. Money will talk but right now, the super league has all the cards imo.

We also know the day after the Qatar World Cup, PSG sign up to this league

[Ollie the Optimist]

No disrespect Ollie but are you 12?

FIFA 22, Pro Evo...I DON'T GIVE A F*CK!!!

I need a dark corner :ilt:


:lol:

I haven’t brought FIFA in years, it was just one of the stories i saw going around and it made me laugh

[Niall_Quinn]

It’s enough to just switch off from football altogether. I’ve zoned out this season more than I ever thought possible, to the point where I genuinely don’t know when games are on or what the league table looks like. Without Maccy’s threads I wouldn’t know shit unless I saw it in passing.

Same.

[Niall_Quinn]

These handbags are brought to you by Louis Vuitton.

Press RED to buy now!

That link doesn't work. I clicked and nothing happened.

[Niall_Quinn]

It really doesn't matter if this is just a threat designed to force UEFA and the PL into throwing even more cash at the "big" clubs, or if it's a determined proposal that will see the dark of day. These (even greedier than UEFA and the PL, if you can even envisage such greed) "big" clubs win no matter. And the "small" clubs (like Leicester) get fucked.

It would be better to throw these clubs out, take the pain, see the money drain out of the domestic game and then build from scratch. Local players, local fans, cheap tickets, sane wages, part-time players even, and maybe football could be reborn. The prawn sandwich day-trippers were never fans anyway. They'll always chase the loudest, brightest hype. So you'll get genuine fans back into stadiums (if Doris allows it) and kids who actually want to play football rather than model women's clothes and knock about with slags. And then we can do it all again but at least we'd get a few decades of decent sport.

[GP]

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/ian-holloway-european-super-league-23940779

Says it all, I'm afraid.

[Coney]

Last year I was going to Enfield Town a bit. Might do that more regularly. The quality isn't high but it's good fun and it's more like the football I remember.

Goonersweb FC :bow:

I'm thinking on those lines. Having moved from London to the Cotswolds, my local team here is a certain Forest Green Rovers, so I should start watching them. The Arsenal I started supporting almost 50 years ago has gone. The idea that we would have a permanent right to be in the pretend European top flight even if we were even more crap than we have been is just plain wrong and there is no way I can stand up and try and justify anything like that.

So I am going to cancel my red membership and I think that is finally it for me. Some great memories over the years (along with pain for long periods!) but it is now just history. I'll keep my important mementos - the Arsenal shirt with Radford 9 on the back that John Radford signed for me being the most important.

I guess this kind of thing was coming with all the money flying around. While we can blame the Yank for his part in this, I think it all stems from the greed of football for the Sky money, creating the PL and changing the balance of football money to the top 'haves'.

Ah well. Arsenal FC. RIP.

[Letters]

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/ian-holloway-european-super-league-23940779

Says it all, I'm afraid.

:haha:

[Mac76]

Ah well, I hate football games anyway - much prefer shooting things :good:

:gp:

[Mac76]

I’d be interested to see what the players think because being told you can no longer compete for the CL or even play at a World Cup, and instead have to play for some made up trophy, can’t really sit will with them on a sporting level.

Then again their wages would probably be doubled as a sweetener anyway.

It’s all fucked, greed has always existed but you could argue it was proportionate but now this is a total disregard for everything football has ever been.

yeah whatever the madcap schemes of the past and the exploitation of fans they've never shown such blatant greed and disregard before to the point where a few clubs are kicking against all the other football setup like this

this really does feel like the end

[Letters]

The lack of relegation is a real giveaway.
Run off to where the money is and pull up the drawbridge.
I see they’re offering a few crumbs to “the rest” with some qualifying places each year.
How magnanimous.

[Gooner23]

Genuinely meant what I said in the other thread about setting up a phoenix club.

I've been following AFC Wimbledon for a few years now, they represent everything I love about football whilst Arsenal have been slowly morphing into everything I despise about it.

If this goes ahead, I think we'd be seeing a lot of similar clubs starting at the lowest level and working their way up, and if I can, I like the idea of being involved in some way.

Its been done already. Dial Square FC, they play in my local league in... Surrey :doh:

[Letters]

Saw something good on FB on one of the Arsenal groups.
Someone asked if people would stop supporting Arsenal if this thing goes ahead.
Someone replied that they wouldn’t stop supporting Arsenal, but the Arsenal they support would no longer exist. Pretty much how I feel about Arsenal and top level football in general.

[Letters]

https://i.ibb.co/hmRQ306/45-D19-A88-ED9-C-4110-AD16-FB90-FA23-D75-C.jpg

:lol:

[KSE Comedy Club]

It's an interesting power play.

"If you join that super league then you can't play in the PL". OK. Good luck selling Sky subscriptions without the big clubs...
Same with the World Cup. Without many of the top players it would be like the Olympic Football, and who cares about that?
Who is going to blink first? It's an interesting test case of where the power really lies.

I think the World Cup might be better without the superstars personally.

The players might try harder and raise their games.

[hobson's choice]

And of course I see some type off salary cap situation. These players better look at what these NFL owners do when it comes to contracts and salary, and see what might be in store for them

[KSE Comedy Club]

Perez said it all last night and confirmed my fears with all of this.

'What is the world asking for? Singapore, China and so many other places. What gives money are the big games, and that game goes everywhere'

This idea that the fans in this country and the fans of the clubs in Europe can do something to stop this, I am afraid, is just wishful thinking.

why would they care about 150 million fans as we are now, when they can have access to 500 million + in China, or the sea of money in Dubai.


The football fans in the UK are small fry compared to the open world market :shrug:

[Letters]

That's what NQ was getting at above. And he's right of course.
But the point of football - of sport in general - is aspiration. You want to see the minnow take on the giant and hope for a surprise.
You want to play the bigger games but you want to earn the right to do that. The European games when I first used to go to games were fun because they were rare.
You didn't qualify every year and suddenly you were playing Benfica. Got a hiding, but at least we'd got there, we'd earned the right to play them.
When the CL got expanded it suddenly created a top 4 which had access to a big pot of money which the rest didn't. So that immediately created a situation which meant a group of clubs were often there year on year with everyone else desperately trying to break in. Movement was possible, but you had to spend big and gamble (or not gamble if you're a billionaire who could buy your way in).

But this is another step - a group of clubs who are there permanently, no-one else need apply. Yeah, they're throwing a few crumbs by making a few places available for "the rest" but basically the "them and us" between that group of clubs and everyone else is permeant. And that means the excitement of playing a Barca or a Real is gone. You're going to play them next year anyway so it's not an "occasion".
How long is that going to be exciting and draw a crowd?

[WMUG]

Its been done already. Dial Square FC, they play in my local league in... Surrey :doh:

Yeah that's just a vanity project for the owner.

This would need to be fan owned.

[Letters]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56812151

:lol:

Oh fuck off!

Edit: Hadn't read past the headline when I posted the above


Perez said the move had been made because young people are "no longer interested in football" because of "a lot of poor quality games".

So they invited Arsenal? :haha:
And Spurs? :haha: :haha:

Yes, this is definitely about quality...

[Mac76]

Spurs?

Who the fuck are they ??



well they're a club who are called by their nickname (whcih generally is a sign of affection) by fans who are supposed to hate them - i never ever use 'sp*rs' - for me it's always spuds

how many spuds fans call us 'gunners'?

i'm willing to bet it's absolutely zero

and yet many of our fans use their nickname - why?

because it's fewer syllables??

'tottnam' is only two syllables - not a big deal - 'spuds' is only one

so no excuse to use their nickname :sulk:

[IBK]

I sympathise with everyone on here lamenting this move as some kind of final nail in the coffin (and hate it equally), but let's face it the football we knew died a long time ago.

The Super Leage = WWF...or as people have said a video game with real players. It's football as entertainment, not sport in the way that we understand it. And like WWF there will be plenty of people willing to watch it.

But look how we got here...

Our clubs owned by Oligarchs/sovereign states - to compete, others sell out to American investment funds or individual billionare sports franchise investors - the very people who have planned for this for years, and none of whom give a shit about the game; our traditions; sporting competition or any of the things that most fans care about.

The EPL - awash with TV money. Why - because the EPL is the most popular league in the world (ironically because of tradition; relative competetiveness; the way the English game is played and the self-fulfilling effect of the money pumped in...) - and watched by precisely the huge emerging markets that care little for the things that are precious to the avarage home grown fan.

Fifa/UEFA - de-valuing international club and national comps by bloating competitions with meaningless games that turn so many fans off ('Champions' League, anyone?); and making the big live events 50% corporate and staged with little or no thought for proper fans (Baku, anyone?) - all to line their own pockets and in thrall to big business.

Players - mostly chasing the money, with those with real affinity with Clubs either the exception or at the very junior end of the game. An industry in their own right. I'd be willing to bet that most would jump at the chance of playing in the Super League.

We fans are anachronisms. We are in large part on the 'wrong' side of a generational divide that sees younger potential fans living their lives through the lens of social media where everything becomes a story and the value of the concrete truth seems diminished. A generation for whom scripted 'reality' TV is a norm; who are used to 'instant' gratification and who are not turned off by the idea of buying 'success'. Future global football fans will know that what they are watching is entertainment rather than sport, but this entertainment is skillfully crafted.

The people driving this thing know all of this, and can see the future. They know also that we, the traditional fans are not needed, and this is why they now feel emboldened to show their contempt of us, having worked in more subtle, yet equally devastating ways for years.

Bad times...

[Ollie the Optimist]

There are a few things that make me uncomfortable in the reaction to this new super league.

The first is the fact the Government are trying to interfere, not just here but in Spain & France etc. As far as i can see, these private companies (which is what they are) have set up a new competition. There is nothing illegal in that and i don’t see how the Government can change it. In my mind it also sets a worrying precedent where if clubs want to do something but the premier league oppose it for whatever reason, they just go running to the government to change it.

While fully accepting cricket is nowhere near as popular as football but recently they have changed the county cricket structure to create a brand new “100” game with new teams rather then existing counties and effectively paid off the opposition. Now as a cricket fan, i dont like this new league i much prefer watching my county but i don’t remember the governemnt getting involved here at all. Probably because it was the league who wanted it rather then the clubs unlike in this situation. The overall theme is that money talks, fans dont and that still applies here.

The second thing is the way uefa & sky etc are banging on about greed. Yesterday Sky made Monday night football free to air so everyone could see Neville & Carragher accuse the clubs of being greedy and ignoring the fans. As soon as the game kicked off though, they stopped the free to air so that fans could pay to watch the game. Not exactly the best message there!
Uefa yesterday accused the clubs of ignoring the fans and being greedy yet this is the same UEFA that put the Europa League Final in Baku, a place where many fans have to fly via Dubai to get to a European game. Was thinking of the fans? Was it bollocks, it was greed but it was ok greed as it was UEFA. Let’s look at the EUROs, their plan (Covid aside) is to play them all over Europe which only adds to the costs for fans as instead of booking a trip to say France to watch all the games, they have to book several trips.

[Mac76]

the thing is, the lower leagues are still like that - most of their games are 3pm on a saturday, they go to the matches and talk about it in the pub afterwards - it's only 'big' clubs like ours that have a mix of those fans plus the armchair ones and tourists - i don't mind the latter as long as they know their place but it's meant the clubs now feel they can cut off the 'legacy' fans i i've heard they're now calling them...

maybe this will actually help the grass roots if soem 'legacy fans' switch to Enfield or whoever else

[IBK]

There are a few things that make me uncomfortable in the reaction to this new super league.

The first is the fact the Government are trying to interfere, not just here but in Spain & France etc. As far as i can see, these private companies (which is what they are) have set up a new competition. There is nothing illegal in that and i don’t see how the Government can change it. In my mind it also sets a worrying precedent where if clubs want to do something but the premier league oppose it for whatever reason, they just go running to the government to change it.

While fully accepting cricket is nowhere near as popular as football but recently they have changed the county cricket structure to create a brand new “100” game with new teams rather then existing counties and effectively paid off the opposition. Now as a cricket fan, i dont like this new league i much prefer watching my county but i don’t remember the governemnt getting involved here at all. Probably because it was the league who wanted it rather then the clubs unlike in this situation. The overall theme is that money talks, fans dont and that still applies here.

The second thing is the way uefa & sky etc are banging on about greed. Yesterday Sky made Monday night football free to air so everyone could see Neville & Carragher accuse the clubs of being greedy and ignoring the fans. As soon as the game kicked off though, they stopped the free to air so that fans could pay to watch the game. Not exactly the best message there!
Uefa yesterday accused the clubs of ignoring the fans and being greedy yet this is the same UEFA that put the Europa League Final in Baku, a place where many fans have to fly via Dubai to get to a European game. Was thinking of the fans? Was it bollocks, it was greed but it was ok greed as it was UEFA. Let’s look at the EUROs, their plan (Covid aside) is to play them all over Europe which only adds to the costs for fans as instead of booking a trip to say France to watch all the games, they have to book several trips.

Good and interesting observations, Ollie. particularly re the government intervention. Having spent the last few weeks seeing the cronyism and vested interests operating at the top level in our government, the idea that state intervention would represent an alternative to people acting in self-interest seems laugable.

And we have both observed the hypocisy that many of those bodies (EPL; UEFA; Sky etc) wringing their hands over this are showing here...

[IBK]

the thing is, the lower leagues are still like that - most of their games are 3pm on a saturday, they go to the matches and talk about it in the pub afterwards - it's only 'big' clubs like ours that have a mix of those fans plus the armchair ones and tourists - i don't mind the latter as long as they know their place but it's meant the clubs now feel they can cut off the 'legacy' fans i i've heard they're now calling them...

maybe this will actually help the grass roots if soem 'legacy fans' switch to Enfield or whoever else

...and why are the lower leagues different? Less money at this level. The problem is that along with the more 'traditional' values that you refer to, what makes football most attractive is seeing football skills along with this. So personally, I don't see an exodus to grass roots football happening. The product isn't as good. And those driving this initiative know it.

[Ollie the Optimist]

the thing is, the lower leagues are still like that - most of their games are 3pm on a saturday, they go to the matches and talk about it in the pub afterwards - it's only 'big' clubs like ours that have a mix of those fans plus the armchair ones and tourists - i don't mind the latter as long as they know their place but it's meant the clubs now feel they can cut off the 'legacy' fans i i've heard they're now calling them...

maybe this will actually help the grass roots if soem 'legacy fans' switch to Enfield or whoever else

I think that is quite a dangerous statement. What do you mean “know their place”

Ive seen this attitude towards foreign fans quite a bit on social media but what makes us better fans then them? You only have to see how popular the clubs are when they go on pre season tours and sell out games for meaningless games. These fans also get up at stupid hours to watch every game, probably more so then people do here tbh.

Of course, fans in this country are always likely to have a stronger attachment given the club is located here but i dont think that fans in other countries are not as valuable. We have all seen the pictures of “tourists” at the emirates with large bags of shopping from teh club shop but that could be their only trip to game in their life time so they make the most of it.

Again, on social media someone made an interesting point when people say the fans are against the super league. I suspect if you ask the majority of fans in Asia or America, they would rather watch arsenal v united more then arsenal v Burnley. Do their views not count ?

[Letters]

And we have both observed the hypocisy that many of those bodies (EPL; UEFA; Sky etc) wringing their hands over this are showing here...
Your post above is depressing and spot on.
And yes, you and Ollie have both highlighted the utter hypocrisy.

"Isn't it terrible, it's all about money!"

What they really mean of course is

"Isn't it terrible, it's all bout money which we're not going to get!"

[IBK]

I think that is quite a dangerous statement. What do you mean “know their place”

Ive seen this attitude towards foreign fans quite a bit on social media but what makes us better fans then them? You only have to see how popular the clubs are when they go on pre season tours and sell out games for meaningless games. These fans also get up at stupid hours to watch every game, probably more so then people do here tbh.

Of course, fans in this country are always likely to have a stronger attachment given the club is located here but i dont think that fans in other countries are not as valuable. We have all seen the pictures of “tourists” at the emirates with large bags of shopping from teh club shop but that could be their only trip to game in their life time so they make the most of it.

Again, on social media someone made an interesting point when people say the fans are against the super league. I suspect if you ask the majority of fans in Asia or America, they would rather watch arsenal v united more then arsenal v Burnley. Do their views not count ?

Our league sold its soul to a foreign fanbase years ago. We 'benefitted' from the money and the draw to England of the world's best players, and now we are crying about the consequences...

[IBK]

Your post above is depressing and spot on.
And yes, you and Ollie have both highlighted the utter hypocrisy.

"Isn't it terrible, it's all about money!"

What they really mean of course is

"Isn't it terrible, it's all bout money which we're not going to get!"

Aye, and let's not forget that our shareholders sold out to Kroenke did so for personal gain/greed. We can't in good conscience pick and choose what greed we criticise...

We fans are pawns, yes, but we are also part of what generates the greed by chosing to spend our cash supporting the system.

[KSE Comedy Club]

well they're a club who are called by their nickname (whcih generally is a sign of affection) by fans who are supposed to hate them - i never ever use 'sp*rs' - for me it's always spuds

how many spuds fans call us 'gunners'?

i'm willing to bet it's absolutely zero

and yet many of our fans use their nickname - why?

because it's fewer syllables??

'tottnam' is only two syllables - not a big deal - 'spuds' is only one

so no excuse to use their nickname :sulk:

Woah there!

I know you're upset, but this is the least of our worries right now.... :console:

[KSE Comedy Club]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56812151

:lol:

Oh fuck off!

Edit: Hadn't read past the headline when I posted the above



So they invited Arsenal? :haha:
And Spurs? :haha: :haha:

Yes, this is definitely about quality...

The guy is off his head, been snorting all that lovely money for too long.

Most of what he has said is bollocks and delusional.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I think that is quite a dangerous statement. What do you mean “know their place”

Ive seen this attitude towards foreign fans quite a bit on social media but what makes us better fans then them? You only have to see how popular the clubs are when they go on pre season tours and sell out games for meaningless games. These fans also get up at stupid hours to watch every game, probably more so then people do here tbh.

Of course, fans in this country are always likely to have a stronger attachment given the club is located here but i dont think that fans in other countries are not as valuable. We have all seen the pictures of “tourists” at the emirates with large bags of shopping from teh club shop but that could be their only trip to game in their life time so they make the most of it.

Again, on social media someone made an interesting point when people say the fans are against the super league. I suspect if you ask the majority of fans in Asia or America, they would rather watch arsenal v united more then arsenal v Burnley. Do their views not count ?

I agree with you to some extent, but this is where the paradox lies.

This is exactly the reason where are where we are now and this super league has been created :shrug:

[Mac76]

Woah there!

I know you're upset, but this is the least of our worries right now.... :console:

:lol:

[Letters]

Aye, and let's not forget that our shareholders sold out to Kroenke did so for personal gain/greed. We can't in good conscience pick and choose what greed we criticise...

We fans are pawns, yes, but we are also part of what generates the greed by chosing to spend our cash supporting the system.

Agreed. When I used to go to games I'd marvel at the queues of people at the Armoury with arm-fulls of Arsenal merch, just lining up to part with their cash.
When I first started going there was a little shop by the Clock End and that was it.

I've been fairly consistent in criticising greed, IMO it really stepped up a gear with Sky and the PL. They promised a "whole new ball game" and boy did they deliver. It's pretty much directly led us to where we are today, via a lot of the steps you identified.

In brief: :ilt:

[Niall_Quinn]

There are a few things that make me uncomfortable in the reaction to this new super league.

The first is the fact the Government are trying to interfere, not just here but in Spain & France etc. As far as i can see, these private companies (which is what they are) have set up a new competition. There is nothing illegal in that and i don’t see how the Government can change it. In my mind it also sets a worrying precedent where if clubs want to do something but the premier league oppose it for whatever reason, they just go running to the government to change it.

While fully accepting cricket is nowhere near as popular as football but recently they have changed the county cricket structure to create a brand new “100” game with new teams rather then existing counties and effectively paid off the opposition. Now as a cricket fan, i dont like this new league i much prefer watching my county but i don’t remember the governemnt getting involved here at all. Probably because it was the league who wanted it rather then the clubs unlike in this situation. The overall theme is that money talks, fans dont and that still applies here.

The second thing is the way uefa & sky etc are banging on about greed. Yesterday Sky made Monday night football free to air so everyone could see Neville & Carragher accuse the clubs of being greedy and ignoring the fans. As soon as the game kicked off though, they stopped the free to air so that fans could pay to watch the game. Not exactly the best message there!
Uefa yesterday accused the clubs of ignoring the fans and being greedy yet this is the same UEFA that put the Europa League Final in Baku, a place where many fans have to fly via Dubai to get to a European game. Was thinking of the fans? Was it bollocks, it was greed but it was ok greed as it was UEFA. Let’s look at the EUROs, their plan (Covid aside) is to play them all over Europe which only adds to the costs for fans as instead of booking a trip to say France to watch all the games, they have to book several trips.

No Ollie. This "private company" bullshit has to stop being the global excuse for shit heap abusers like Amazon, Apple, Facebook, UEFA and Arsenal Football Club.

A genuinely private company is one that is built from the endeavour of a few, with the risks taken by those few and the products and services they produce being of benefit to the many - all played out on a level playing field where innovation, integrity, quality and a fair exchange of value drive the demand.

This is why monopolies are regulated against. Monopolies do not fulfil the definition of private companies. They are instead socialised organisations in all aspects except for control and revenue share. Added to that, the very second any of these "private" companies help themselves to taxpayer money, in the form of subsidies or a blind eye turned to their shady tax practises, you can strip away that notion of private operation again.

What these companies are doing is leveraging societies rather than customers and then using legal constructs to protect the profits. Who told the BBC to start putting Twitter ads on every news report? That's what it is when a public service favours one service over another, a state sponsored advert. So if Twitter is genuinely private they can pay for the advert right? Like any genuinely private company would have to. And not just the BBC, but every other public facing organisation that suddenly decided Twitter was a thing.

Facebook pages. Same deal, right? Why is Microsoft getting 20+ billion dollars from the U.S. government for kit that could have been produced anywhere? What makes Microsoft, a notorious producer of bug-ridden bloatware, so special?

Why doesn't Alphabet pay its taxes? Who has to pay them instead? Why did hundreds of corporations get favoured status and tax rebates last year while small companies and sole traders were locked down?

How much has Arsenal paid to society for the 100+ years of history it has just used to board the ESL gravy train? Or has it been a simple matter of the Kroenkes leeching up that generational capital and converting it from a social endeavour into a privately owned profit stream? Where's the "private" part of that beyond the profits? Where's the consideration of the fans' equity on this balance sheet, because that's the major part of what actually built the business from the ground up, match by match, over decades. The original proposition was not the same as a setting up a shop to sell widgets. Football clubs are part of the society, made by the society, originally funded by the society through participation and that strange word that will never be understood by vulture capitalists - loyalty.

These days there's a big industry in intellectual property and ownership of innovation. Patents and trademarks are often valued above the entire worth of the bricks, mortar and stock. Why can a "private" company place value on these intangible assets when football fans can't? Why can these assets be passed to the likes of Kroenke, free of charge? Do you see what he gets for free, beyond the bricks and mortar and grass he bought?

These are private companies on paper, but they milk every benefit society and the state have to offer. That makes society and the state shareholders in these companies.

Don't confuse vulture capitalism with the ideal of a free market.

[Niall_Quinn]

I sympathise with everyone on here lamenting this move as some kind of final nail in the coffin (and hate it equally), but let's face it the football we knew died a long time ago.

The Super Leage = WWF...or as people have said a video game with real players. It's football as entertainment, not sport in the way that we understand it. And like WWF there will be plenty of people willing to watch it.

But look how we got here...

Our clubs owned by Oligarchs/sovereign states - to compete, others sell out to American investment funds or individual billionare sports franchise investors - the very people who have planned for this for years, and none of whom give a shit about the game; our traditions; sporting competition or any of the things that most fans care about.

The EPL - awash with TV money. Why - because the EPL is the most popular league in the world (ironically because of tradition; relative competetiveness; the way the English game is played and the self-fulfilling effect of the money pumped in...) - and watched by precisely the huge emerging markets that care little for the things that are precious to the avarage home grown fan.

Fifa/UEFA - de-valuing international club and national comps by bloating competitions with meaningless games that turn so many fans off ('Champions' League, anyone?); and making the big live events 50% corporate and staged with little or no thought for proper fans (Baku, anyone?) - all to line their own pockets and in thrall to big business.

Players - mostly chasing the money, with those with real affinity with Clubs either the exception or at the very junior end of the game. An industry in their own right. I'd be willing to bet that most would jump at the chance of playing in the Super League.

We fans are anachronisms. We are in large part on the 'wrong' side of a generational divide that sees younger potential fans living their lives through the lens of social media where everything becomes a story and the value of the concrete truth seems diminished. A generation for whom scripted 'reality' TV is a norm; who are used to 'instant' gratification and who are not turned off by the idea of buying 'success'. Future global football fans will know that what they are watching is entertainment rather than sport, but this entertainment is skillfully crafted.

The people driving this thing know all of this, and can see the future. They know also that we, the traditional fans are not needed, and this is why they now feel emboldened to show their contempt of us, having worked in more subtle, yet equally devastating ways for years.

Bad times...

Yeah. The writing has been on the wall for decades. It can all be traced back to Sky Sports. I'm not saying Sky set out to achieve this end, but everything they have done has continued to remove the fan from the stadium and plonk them in front of a telly. Sky built the audience and the swarm of sponsors that prey on that audience. Their model had the destruction of traditional football baked in from the outset.

And Boris and the government can fuck off, as always. Successive governments sat on their hands and watched as literal criminals slithered into the game and took ownership. Now, with the horse bolted and dead after a long a fruitful life, and the gate rotted through by worms and collapsed in the dirt - in rides Boris on a white steed. Who's going to buy that?

[Niall_Quinn]

I think that is quite a dangerous statement. What do you mean “know their place”

Ive seen this attitude towards foreign fans quite a bit on social media but what makes us better fans then them? You only have to see how popular the clubs are when they go on pre season tours and sell out games for meaningless games. These fans also get up at stupid hours to watch every game, probably more so then people do here tbh.

Of course, fans in this country are always likely to have a stronger attachment given the club is located here but i dont think that fans in other countries are not as valuable. We have all seen the pictures of “tourists” at the emirates with large bags of shopping from teh club shop but that could be their only trip to game in their life time so they make the most of it.

Again, on social media someone made an interesting point when people say the fans are against the super league. I suspect if you ask the majority of fans in Asia or America, they would rather watch arsenal v united more then arsenal v Burnley. Do their views not count ?

Erm... if they love the game so much, why don't they set up leagues worth a shit? I'm entitled to watch the NFL if I want to. But I'm not entitled to avoid criticism if my money and the money of millions of other fundamentally disconnected viewers results in the NFL being modified to suit me rather than the fans who created it.

If we're the "legacy fans" then all the rest, bar an incredibly small minority who used to jump a jet and come to the games (big respect), are the johnny-come-latelies who have wallets and popcorn but no real connection. I definitely see a distinction between them and the real fans who are heading off on the Eurostar for an expensive and exhausting roundtrip to watch Xhaka play FC Shitkickers - and probably lose.

And what about clubs like Crewe and Rotherham? How many of these foreign football fanatics who love the game on merit alone will be digging in their wallets to fund the smaller teams that "legacy fans" have supported through thin and thinner?

The only dangerous thing here is the greedy bastards at the top signing up millions of pseudo-fans and kicking the real fans out of the game.

[IBK]

Yeah. The writing has been on the wall for decades. It can all be traced back to Sky Sports. I'm not saying Sky set out to achieve this end, but everything they have done has continued to remove the fan from the stadium and plonk them in front of a telly. Sky built the audience and the swarm of sponsors that prey on that audience. Their model had the destruction of traditional football baked in from the outset.

And Boris and the government can fuck off, as always. Successive governments sat on their hands and watched as literal criminals slithered into the game and took ownership. Now, with the horse bolted and dead after a long a fruitful life, and the gate rotted through by worms and collapsed in the dirt - in rides Boris on a white steed. Who's going to buy that?

Agreed re Boris. All he is doing is looking for a popular cause to further bolster his position. He doesn;t even follow football...any more than Cameron who hilariously forgot which football team he supported!

[Niall_Quinn]

The guy is off his head, been snorting all that lovely money for too long.

Most of what he has said is bollocks and delusional.

He's the shithead that was supposed to be representing the interests of 200 European clubs. And all the while he was smiling out one side of his skull but working in the background to throw 188 of those clubs under the bus. You have to be an epic scumbag to operate like that.

[Ollie the Optimist]

No Ollie. This "private company" bullshit has to stop being the global excuse for shit heap abusers like Amazon, Apple, Facebook, UEFA and Arsenal Football Club.

A genuinely private company is one that is built from the endeavour of a few, with the risks taken by those few and the products and services they produce being of benefit to the many - all played out on a level playing field where innovation, integrity, quality and a fair exchange of value drive the demand.

This is why monopolies are regulated against. Monopolies do not fulfil the definition of private companies. They are instead socialised organisations in all aspects except for control and revenue share. Added to that, the very second any of these "private" companies help themselves to taxpayer money, in the form of subsidies or a blind eye turned to their shady tax practises, you can strip away that notion of private operation again.

What these companies are doing is leveraging societies rather than customers and then using legal constructs to protect the profits. Who told the BBC to start putting Twitter ads on every news report? That's what it is when a public service favours one service over another, a state sponsored advert. So if Twitter is genuinely private they can pay for the advert right? Like any genuinely private company would have to. And not just the BBC, but every other public facing organisation that suddenly decided Twitter was a thing.

Facebook pages. Same deal, right? Why is Microsoft getting 20+ billion dollars from the U.S. government for kit that could have been produced anywhere? What makes Microsoft, a notorious producer of bug-ridden bloatware, so special?

Why doesn't Alphabet pay its taxes? Who has to pay them instead? Why did hundreds of corporations get favoured status and tax rebates last year while small companies and sole traders were locked down?

How much has Arsenal paid to society for the 100+ years of history it has just used to board the ESL gravy train? Or has it been a simple matter of the Kroenkes leeching up that generational capital and converting it from a social endeavour into a privately owned profit stream? Where's the "private" part of that beyond the profits? Where's the consideration of the fans' equity on this balance sheet, because that's the major part of what actually built the business from the ground up, match by match, over decades. The original proposition was not the same as a setting up a shop to sell widgets. Football clubs are part of the society, made by the society, originally funded by the society through participation and that strange word that will never be understood by vulture capitalists - loyalty.

These days there's a big industry in intellectual property and ownership of innovation. Patents and trademarks are often valued above the entire worth of the bricks, mortar and stock. Why can a "private" company place value on these intangible assets when football fans can't? Why can these assets be passed to the likes of Kroenke, free of charge? Do you see what he gets for free, beyond the bricks and mortar and grass he bought?

These are private companies on paper, but they milk every benefit society and the state have to offer. That makes society and the state shareholders in these companies.

Don't confuse vulture capitalism with the ideal of a free market.

I’m sorry but i dont agree.

I dont think the premier league will kick out the big 6 because they are worth too much money. No way sky pay a billion pounds for tv rights if the big six are kicked out. Money will ultimately talk.

However, as far as i can tell, this is basically a breakup between UEFA & the breakaway clubs. I’m certain they will continue playing in their respective leagues but just replace the champions league with the Super League so where is the political right to get involved?

Why is the champions league perfectly acceptable yet this one isn’t? Both earn huge sums of money for the organisers and both don’t give a shit about the fans.

[Niall_Quinn]

Aye, and let's not forget that our shareholders sold out to Kroenke did so for personal gain/greed. We can't in good conscience pick and choose what greed we criticise...

We fans are pawns, yes, but we are also part of what generates the greed by chosing to spend our cash supporting the system.

And let's not forget either, if you put (rough guess) 99% of people in Kroenke's place they'd probably do exactly the same. Loyalty to Arsenal would last all of 1 second with 300 million quid a year sitting on the table.

It's up for grabs now!

And I wouldn't place much stock in the "football men" pundits are lamenting. Ken Bates, "football man" extraordinaire, introduced us to that footballing legend Mr Abramovich.

So many people banging on about racism and sexism and all that virtually non-existent shit, relatively speaking. Nobody talking about how money has corrupted virtually every last soul on the planet, to one degree or another. Whether you chase money for greed or chase money to eat, it's a very few individuals across history who have consistently maintained money as the measure of a man and that man's place in life. This is just one in a million manifestations of that fundamental corruption.

We all love to believe we wouldn't or couldn't be the next Kroenke and we couldn't, because we aren't ruthless enough. That's the only reason we never have to face such decisions. A good reason which means we shouldn't judge Kroenke on what he does, but on what he is. He's THAT kind of man.

[GP]

https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1384454232867233792

lol

[Ollie the Optimist]

Erm... if they love the game so much, why don't they set up leagues worth a shit? I'm entitled to watch the NFL if I want to. But I'm not entitled to avoid criticism if my money and the money of millions of other fundamentally disconnected viewers results in the NFL being modified to suit me rather than the fans who created it.

If we're the "legacy fans" then all the rest, bar an incredibly small minority who used to jump a jet and come to the games (big respect), are the johnny-come-latelies who have wallets and popcorn but no real connection. I definitely see a distinction between them and the real fans who are heading off on the Eurostar for an expensive and exhausting roundtrip to watch Xhaka play FC Shitkickers - and probably lose.

And what about clubs like Crewe and Rotherham? How many of these foreign football fanatics who love the game on merit alone will be digging in their wallets to fund the smaller teams that "legacy fans" have supported through thin and thinner?

The only dangerous thing here is the greedy bastards at the top signing up millions of pseudo-fans and kicking the real fans out of the game.

That has been happening for years and the Super League won’t change it. Kick off times have been modified to suit overseas markets rather then away fans travelling to the game.

The premier league didn’t give two shits when they signed up with sky in 1992 and the fans have lost out since then. It was a slow process but sped up over the last few years. These clubs, all of them in the premier league, took the sky money etc and didnt voice any opposition.

It is no good them trying to claim they looking after the real fans now.

[Niall_Quinn]

I’m sorry but i dont agree.

I dont think the premier league will kick out the big 6 because they are worth too much money. No way sky pay a billion pounds for tv rights if the big six are kicked out. Money will ultimately talk.

However, as far as i can tell, this is basically a breakup between UEFA & the breakaway clubs. I’m certain they will continue playing in their respective leagues but just replace the champions league with the Super League so where is the political right to get involved?

Why is the champions league perfectly acceptable yet this one isn’t? Both earn huge sums of money for the organisers and both don’t give a shit about the fans.

Not really what I was talking about.

But anyway, on this new topic, I agree. We'll hear a lot of huffing and puffing and then the "Big 6" will cut a few influencers into the deal and suddenly the laughable notion this is to "save football" will become another new normal.

I was watching Gary Neville claim he can say what he wants about this, while Klopp is prevented form doing the same. Fair point. But let's see what Gary has to say (or not) when Sky secures a piece of the pie. Gary won't be putting his 11 year career at Sky on the line.

It's a sad situation, but it will also be quite funny to watch so many tunes being changed.

[Letters]

It can all be traced back to Sky Sports.

This.

The money had been creeping up in football for a while but Sky was a watershed moment. Suddenly you had to pay for a channel if you wanted to watch the game. And if you're going to pay then you'd better get value for money so suddenly it was saturation coverage, endless analysis and "build up". Who wants "build up" for West Ham vs Burnley ffs?
The expansion of the CL was another nail in the coffin, that created the little group of big clubs at the top of each league.
This is the next step in the evolution, and this time it'll be a pretty much closed shop.

[Niall_Quinn]

That has been happening for years and the Super League won’t change it. Kick off times have been modified to suit overseas markets rather then away fans travelling to the game.

The premier league didn’t give two shits when they signed up with sky in 1992 and the fans have lost out since then. It was a slow process but sped up over the last few years. These clubs, all of them in the premier league, took the sky money etc and didnt voice any opposition.

It is no good them trying to claim they looking after the real fans now.

Ollie, do you read the posts before you respond to them?

Again, on you new and unrelated point, I agree. Of course the clubs gave up on the fans years ago. And fans have been complaining for years and not much has been done about it. Even the "victories" have been defeats with some fanbases forcing owners out only to have even worse jackals arrive.

[Letters]

Manchester City's Official Supporters Club said the move showed "those involved have zero regard for the game's traditions", adding it was "determined to fight against this proposed Super League".

:haha:

[Letters]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56813819

FIFA strongly disapproves. STRONGLY!


...ladies and gentlemen, the organisation that gave us the World Cup in Russia and then Qatar :haha:

[Ollie the Optimist]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56813819

FIFA strongly disapproves. STRONGLY!


...ladies and gentlemen, the organisation that gave us the World Cup in Russia and then Qatar :haha:

The response from Uefa, Fifa sky etc has been a complete PR disaster imo.

They are accusing someone else of greed and ignoring the fans which is something they have all done for years. How many of those involved in awarding the World Cup to Russia were then expelled from FIFA for taking bribes?

I actually think the more uefa etc bang on about greed etc, the more they will actually drive up support for this new league. Not many will be happy taking lectures on morality from that lot

[Marc Overmars]

You can accept greed and money in the game because that’s par for the course now, however the main thing for me is the elitist, closed shop nature of it. Of the teams involved, only a handful of them would even be deemed good enough to win it. The rest of us would be there for a jolly up with essentially nothing to play for. It would be like a glorified friendly tournament for the majority with no incentive. Nothing to aim for, can’t be relegated, so what’s the point? It would be dull as dishwater but as long as they’re getting their billions fuck everyone else - that’s why it stinks of shit.

It’s not a league and it certainly isn’t a competition. Just an exhibition to showcase the biggest clubs to plastic fans across the world who lap this kind of stuff up.

[Mac76]

You can accept greed and money in the game because that’s par for the course now, however the main thing for me is the elitist, closed shop nature of it. Of the teams involved, only a handful of them would even be deemed good enough to win it. The rest of us would be there for a jolly up with essentially nothing to play for. It would be like a glorified friendly tournament for the majority with no incentive. Nothing to aim for, can’t be relegated, so what’s the point? It would be dull as dishwater but as long as they’re getting their billions fuck everyone else - that’s why it stinks of shit.

It’s not a league and it certainly isn’t a competition. Just an exhibition to showcase the biggest clubs to plastic fans across the world who lap this kind of stuff up.

exactly - it's just something to be on in pubs and bars around the world but not something we will care about much

[KSE Comedy Club]

He's the shithead that was supposed to be representing the interests of 200 European clubs. And all the while he was smiling out one side of his skull but working in the background to throw 188 of those clubs under the bus. You have to be an epic scumbag to operate like that.

Absolutely, he should be the first person assassinated IMO.

[KSE Comedy Club]

https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1384454232867233792

lol

So in the spirit of these current proceedings, what's everyone's money on as to which club this is?

For some unknown reason, everyone seems to think Citeh have the biggest morals and it's them.

Anyone agree?

[IBK]

You can accept greed and money in the game because that’s par for the course now, however the main thing for me is the elitist, closed shop nature of it. Of the teams involved, only a handful of them would even be deemed good enough to win it. The rest of us would be there for a jolly up with essentially nothing to play for. It would be like a glorified friendly tournament for the majority with no incentive. Nothing to aim for, can’t be relegated, so what’s the point? It would be dull as dishwater but as long as they’re getting their billions fuck everyone else - that’s why it stinks of shit.

It’s not a league and it certainly isn’t a competition. Just an exhibition to showcase the biggest clubs to plastic fans across the world who lap this kind of stuff up.

Yes and I agree but like I said before, it's the future. Sport purely as entertainment, with the element of real competition largely absent.

Ollie asked a few posts above why this proposed league is different from the Champions League it seeks to replace. Well its precisely because of it being a closed shop. Closed in terms of the teams who are guaranteed to be in it no matter how they perform, and closed by being self-fulfilling - namely the founding clubs will get ever richer at the expense of those left out in the cold.

But its only the natural progresssion of the direction the game, and all sports, have been travelling in for a while. You don't invest - as a disinterested financial institution like JP Morgan - in a league subject to the vagaries of promotion and relegation - ie competition. You invest in a product - like Netflix or Konami - that has inherent stability and can be directed by your algorithms. You then manipulate your market - ie fan base - until you are, literally, the only game in town. These people do not want large numbers of teams, and owners with access to their market, they want wealth to be concentrated in the hands of the privileged few.

Sport in the sense that we still see it, it ain't.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Manchester City's Official Supporters Club said the move showed "those involved have zero regard for the game's traditions", adding it was "determined to fight against this proposed Super League".

:haha:

A telegraph journalist, Matt Law, said yesterday on twitter he was most disappointed with City & Chelsea for joining as they were the ones who “broke” the cartel of arsenal & united back in early 2000s.

Probably the stupidest opinion written on the entire ESL

Edit: he has just written this article

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2021/04/20/roman-abramovich-should-embarrassed-chelseas-european-super/

Jesus Christ its beyond thick. If it was for abramovich & city, we wouldn’t be in this mess

[IBK]

I'm loving everyone's astute observations on the sheer hypocrisy of so many in response to this thing...

[Ollie the Optimist]

I'm loving everyone's astute observations on the sheer hypocrisy of so many in response to this thing...


Personally, while I dont like the idea, I’m not actually that bothered and I think the hypocrisy is a major part of it. I’m not going to get angry because Sky or Uefa no longer get the money but instead someone else gets it. In fact, thats the only reason they are angry themselves because they longer get the pay day. Nothing to do with fans etc.

Fans have been shafted for a while and when you look at the thread the other day asking How bothered people are about arsenal these days, it probably explains why many are shrugging their shoulders knowing the fans will always be shafted whether its Uefa sky or this new ESL.

Ultimately this new ESL is all about who gets the money, the clubs or UEFA etc and quite frankly, not many will pick a side on that as most dont care

[Mac76]

it would be nice if it was us wouldn't it but i don't think that's likely...

[Letters]

The response from Uefa, Fifa sky etc has been a complete PR disaster imo.

They are accusing someone else of greed and ignoring the fans which is something they have all done for years. How many of those involved in awarding the World Cup to Russia were then expelled from FIFA for taking bribes?

I actually think the more uefa etc bang on about greed etc, the more they will actually drive up support for this new league. Not many will be happy taking lectures on morality from that lot

There is no response they can sensibly give to be fair.
They can't approve the plans because they've been completely shafted.
But any hand-wringing about money is hypocrisy of the highest order and no-one is going to buy any concern from them about grass roots football.

[Marc Overmars]

it would be nice if it was us wouldn't it but i don't think that's likely...

Definitely won’t be us. We probably need this more than any of the others involved. Spurs too.

We’re already irrelevant in the PL so this helps us a lot. Sadly.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Pep Guardiola about the #SuperLeague: “Sport is not a sport when the success is guaranteed, and when the relation between the effort and reward don’t exist. It’s not a sport when it doesn’t matter if you lose. It's not fair if teams fight at the top and cannot qualify”. �� #MCFC


Guardiola can get fucked. He joined City who have spent billions buying the best players in order to guarantee success. He spent vast sums of money at Barcelona to do the same.

[Mac76]

Guardiola can get fucked. He joined City who have spent billions buying the best players in order to guarantee success. He spent vast sums of money at Barcelona to do the same.

i don't really buy into the Pep hate - sure it's easier when you have nothing but great players, but Artetas' multiple mistakes show that whatever squad you have, you still need to organise them well, pick the right teams and be consistent

is he the world's greatest coach? we don't know until he wins the PL with, say, Southampton - although did winning with Leicester make Ranieri the world's greatest coach either?

i admit he's failed in the Champions League with Citeh - they ought to have won it by now - the best chance they had was when Liverpool won it after Pep chased everything sight instead of focussing on the CL, so yes that was a mistake - i can't believe any Citeh fan gave a shite about winning the quadruple compared to ensuring the best chance of winning the CL

so he's not perfect but he's not a 'fake' either IMO

[Ollie the Optimist]

i don't really buy into the Pep hate - sure it's easier when you have nothing but great players, but Artetas' multiple mistakes show that whatever squad you have, you still need to organise them well, pick the right teams and be consistent

is he the world's greatest coach? we don't know until he wins the PL with, say, Southampton - although did winning with Leicester make Ranieri the world's greatest coach either?

i admit he's failed in the Champions League with Citeh - they ought to have won it by now - the best chance they had was when Liverpool won it after Pep chased everything sight instead of focussing on the CL, so yes that was a mistake - i can't believe any Citeh fan gave a shite about winning the quadruple compared to ensuring the best chance of winning the CL

so he's not perfect but he's not a 'fake' either IMO

I agree you still need to coach them and in that sense, he is a good coach.

But its hard to take lectures from someone who when he decides a player isn’t good enough can just go out and spend tens of millions on a replacement without thinking because a billionaire gives him the money.

Not all clubs have that which is hwy we are in this mess

[Mac76]

I agree you still need to coach them and in that sense, he is a good coach.

But its hard to take lectures from someone who when he decides a player isn’t good enough can just go out and spend tens of millions on a replacement without thinking because a billionaire gives him the money.

Not all clubs have that which is hwy we are in this mess

it doesn't matter how much money we spent on a new player, Arteta would probably play them out of position or shun them altogether because they didn't run around enough traffic cones...

[Letters]

Yes yes, OK. Pep > Arteta. No argument there.
But it's kinda amusing for organisations or individuals who have had their snouts firmly in the trough for years, decades even, now whining because the big clubs are threatening to make their own trough.

[Letters]

https://newsthump.com/2021/04/20/arsenal-already-relegated-from-new-european-super-league/

:lol:

FFS <_<

[Mac76]

:)

[Ollie the Optimist]

Reuters reporting that a court in Spain has blocked UEFA from banning the super league/blocking players from playing in the EUROs etc.

Assuming that court order stays in place, its game over for uefa. There is no punishment they can bring and the super league is going ahead

[Letters]

:lol: The PL have rejected the plans.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0An80JX94o

What does that mean?! :lol:. That's like me rejecting the plans for a wedding I'm not invited to. What am I going to do? Not go?

[I am invisible]

If I were those 14 PL clubs (and the lower leagues) I’d be milking this for everything I could get! The ‘big 6’ are going to need to recruit players from somewhere, and Brexit certainly won’t make that any easier...

[Globalgunner]

Reuters reporting that a court in Spain has blocked UEFA from banning the super league/blocking players from playing in the EUROs etc.

Assuming that court order stays in place, its game over for uefa. There is no punishment they can bring and the super league is going ahead

Always knew this wouldnt fly. Its plainly illegal and would breach the fundamental rights of each player in every club. Im sure the Eurpoean court will strike Uefa down too.

[Ollie the Optimist]

BBC reporting Chelsea are drawing up paperwork to quit the ESL :lol:


The worst thing about that is that they will be treated as hero’s for doing “the right thing” despite them being the cause of this entire mess in first place

Edit: now City are being reported as pulling out as well.

ESL. It had a good run :rose:

[Letters]

What a shambles.

The whole thing will collapse, the 6 clubs will come crawling back but what they’ve done won’t be forgotten by their own fans or anyone else.

[Marc Overmars]

What a flop. :lol:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Journalists on twitter reporting that both Athletico & Barcelona are also pulling out :lol:


At this rate, we might actually win it

[Ollie the Optimist]

�� BREAKING: All 12 breakaway clubs are meeting tonight to discuss disbanding the Super League.

Via @TalkSport

:haha:

Can we do this every year? It’s a lot of fun and makes a couple of days go by quicker when not much else in the news

[Marc Overmars]

How embarrassing, absolute bottle job.

[dazthegooner]

Typical Chelski. From skysports... Chelsea were not one of the ringleaders. The breakaway was driven by Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11668/12281501/chelsea-and-manchester-city-to-leave-european-super-league

[Coney]

Typical Chelski. From skysports... Chelsea were not one of the ringleaders. The breakaway was driven by Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11668/12281501/chelsea-and-manchester-city-to-leave-european-super-league

"Please sir - it was him" :shrug:

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Spurs will still put it on their honours board.

Super League participant 2021 (Shared)

[Mac76]

At this rate, we might actually win it

:lol:

[Ollie the Optimist]

Ed Woodward apparently resigning as chairman of United :lol:


If this means these pricks of owners are getting driven out then the last two days would have been a good thing though nothing will change ultimately.

Bit like sky banging on about how greed is killin the game and driving fans away. Will they reduce their extoritinate subscription fees? Will they bollocks. That greed is good greed as it goes to them

[Mac76]

This is a farce

And to think Vinai resigned from being Chair of that European football thing (whatever it's called) :pal:

[Mac76]

I wouldn't be surprised if the Kroenkes sold now...

But to whom...? :wacko:

[Ollie the Optimist]

I wouldn't be surprised if the Kroenkes sold now...

But to whom...? :wacko:

Wenger might have saved a bit of spare cash with his 7 million a year salary.

Time for the big man to save football again

[dazthegooner]

I wouldn't be surprised if the Kroenkes sold now...

But to whom...? :wacko:

Goonersweb whip round? :blink:

[Marc Overmars]

This is funny as fuck. They went all in with total conviction and now it’s seemingly dead in the water. It shows how out of touch these parasites are, how could they not have foreseen the widespread disdain?

Hopefully these fuckers are driven out and if they’re not, these clubs should never be allowed to forget. Scum.

[Mac76]

Goonersweb whip round? :blink:

I'm in - i'll pledge a tenner

[Mac76]

We absolutely need to pull out ahead of spuds, that's the main thing now ...

[dazthegooner]

Levy's probably shitting himself was hoping this would pay for Morons pay off :)

[Ollie the Optimist]

We absolutely need to pull out ahead of spuds, that's the main thing now ...

Nah no need to worry.

Spurs will be the last to leave so they can claim they won the inaugural super league and add it as honour on their website

[Mac76]

Nah no need to worry.

Spurs will be the last to leave so they can claim they won the inaugural super league and add it as honour on their website

Don't forget the DVD

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Well that went well...

FSG next pls. Cos the next multi-billionaires who buy us will be all about the fans...

[Letters]

Spurs will still put it on their honours board.

Super League participant 2021 (Shared)

:lol:

Norwich Hospital Cup (Shared)

[Mac76]

From BBC site:

"the news is coming thick and fast but we are now hearing Manchester United's executive vice chairman Ed Woodward has resigned.

This we are told is not related to the European Super League."

Yeah, right ##

[Letters]

This is funny as fuck. They went all in with total conviction and now it’s seemingly dead in the water. It shows how out of touch these parasites are, how could they not have foreseen the widespread disdain?

Hopefully these fuckers are driven out and if they’re not, these clubs should never be allowed to forget. Scum.

The detachment from the average fan is incredible.
I bet they genuinely thought that fans would be excited about this.
Utter twunts

[Ollie the Optimist]

Tbh the last two days of outrage and now the collapse of the ESL have been more enjoyable then watching arsenal this season :coffee:

[Mac76]

Tbh the last two days of outrage and now the collapse of the ESL have been more enjoyable then watching arsenal this season :coffee:

Well tbh pretty much anything has been more enjoyable than watching Arsenal this season...

[GP]

That's it then.

Game over man, game over!

[Mac76]

That's it then.

Game over man, game over!

Don't count your chickens, maybe as long as there's one other team left the Kroenkes will go for it - after all, Scotland shows two-team leagues can survive...

[Niall_Quinn]

Time to make Kroenke's life a living hell. He's thousands of miles away and hiding in one of his 300 ranches, but I'm sure inventive ways can be found.

[I am invisible]

Wow! Just... wow! A new low, even by the Kroenkes’ incredibly low standards.

This is gonna take some topping.

[Mac76]

This sums it up, read that last line about shares falling before they knew teams were pulling out, if the other ESL clubs have seen this, they'll know it's hitting their bottom line, at that point it really is curtains

"Bad for business?

Bill Rice

BBC Radio Manchester

Manchester United shares are down more than 6.5% on the New York Stock Exchange, in a sign that investors are concerned about the prospects for the proposed European Super League and the extra profits that might bring for the football club.

Shares are currently trading at just over $16, having started the day at $17.16.

The price had already fallen about 3% today before reports emerged of Chelsea and Manchester City withdrawing from the competition."

[Letters]

As all this falls apart, let's not forget that they did this...or tried to.
Wankers.

[Mac76]

As all this falls apart, let's not forget that they did this...or tried to.
Wankers.

Nobody will - and the fans will be back next season... :threaten:

[Mac76]

KDB :bow:

https://mobile.twitter.com/DeBruyneKev/status/1384572733653229572?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1384572733653229572%7Ctwgr% 5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.co.uk%2Fsport%2Flive %2Ffootball%2F56812305

[Marc Overmars]

Chelsea fans with a banner tonight that said “dreams can’t be bought”.

They sure about that? :lol:

Well done for the demo but the irony of it.

[WMUG]

Time to make Kroenke's life a living hell. He's thousands of miles away and hiding in one of his 300 ranches, but I'm sure inventive ways can be found.

:gp:

How you go about getting them to sell is an open question, given there's no legal framework or voting or whatnot. United have been struggling with this.

Maybe pressure the government to pursue the 50+1 route?

[Niall_Quinn]

Now that a unified lash-back has frightened these vampires back into the darkness - how about we all do the same to put the health service back in public hands, or make shitty corporations pay their taxes, or put an end to this lunatic covid hysteria?

It's good the fans all stood up as one. It's a shame it takes football to do it though. Why can't it happen in all aspects of life? These arrogant masters of the universe can be put back in their coffins, given the unity and resolve of the many who have to suffer these few.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Wow! Just... wow! A new low, even by the Kroenkes’ incredibly low standards.

This is gonna take some topping.

I guess this is what happens when you sell your soul to a well!! (yeah, yeah.....just reminded me of something biblical).

Note how the clubs with billionaire "football fans" as owners (those who actually spent their own money) were the first to listen to their fans and pull out. (PSG owners didn't even need their fans to tell them this was crap- " no relegation" - anyone who grew up with football as their first sport would spit at this)

I will repeat this over and over again, Kronke is easily the worst thing to happen to Arsenal in a generation...honestly the harm he has done to us will only properly be measured by Historians when they look back. Never has the feelings of hollowness and emptiness pervaded this club the way it does now.....and this emanates directly from this zombie of an owner.

It would be great if this whole shameful debacle led to he and his journeymen yank owners ( those who can't be bothered to understand the culture of the game) selling off or being forced to sell off by the government or someone else.

It really stinks to be an Arsenal fan with this kind of leadership. To think chavs and citeh fans will firmly get more respect than us now. Wow, the lows keep coming.

[Niall_Quinn]

:gp:

How you go about getting them to sell is an open question, given there's no legal framework or voting or whatnot. United have been struggling with this.

Maybe pressure the government to pursue the 50+1 route?

Why not just pass a rule that owners have to be resident in the same country as the club they own? That means they couldn't buy clubs across Europe, it would also bring them closer to the consequences of their actions. And if you aren't resident then you have to pay a 100% tax on earnings. Actually, make it 110%.

What is really required is a way to make these absentee landlords accessible to the fans. I don't mean being invited around for tea. I mean hearing the chants outside their windows rather than watching it all on TV.

[Niall_Quinn]

I guess this is what happens when you sell your soul to a well!! (yeah, yeah.....just reminded me of something biblical).

Note how the clubs with billionaire "football fans" as owners (those who actually spent their own money) were the first to listen to their fans and pull out. (PSG owners didn't even need their fans to tell them this was crap- " no relegation" - anyone who grew up with football as their first sport would spit at this)

I will repeat this over and over again, Kronke is easily the worst thing to happen to Arsenal in a generation...honestly the harm he has done to us will only properly be measured by Historians when they look back. Never has the feelings of hollowness and emptiness pervaded this club the way it does now.....and this emanates directly from this zombie of an owner.

It would be great if this whole shameful debacle led to he and his journeymen yank owners ( those who can't be bothered to understand the culture of the game) selling off or being forced to sell off by the government or someone else.

It really stinks to be an Arsenal fan with this kind of leadership. To think chavs and citeh fans will firmly get more respect than us now. Wow, the lows keep coming.

Bear in mind, the staff and the players found out just a couple of hours before we did. These owners don't respect anyone. Not their staff, not the fans and certainly not the traditions and history of the club. All the vitriol should be reserved for the Kroenkes. I think it would be unfair to level it at the team or the club in general. There are different reasons to be angry at the players of course. But I don't think they were involved in this particular shambles in any way.

[WMUG]

Why not just pass a rule that owners have to be resident in the same country as the club they own? That means they couldn't buy clubs across Europe, it would also bring them closer to the consequences of their actions. And if you aren't resident then you have to pay a 100% tax on earnings. Actually, make it 110%.

What is really required is a way to make these absentee landlords accessible to the fans. I don't mean being invited around for tea. I mean hearing the chants outside their windows rather than watching it all on TV.

That could work, yeah.

But then you still have your Steve Dales who that didn't work for.

I'd still like to see fan ownership more broadly implemented, but your suggestion would be easier to implement.

[Niall_Quinn]

That could work, yeah.

But then you still have your Steve Dales who that didn't work for.

I'd still like to see fan ownership more broadly implemented, but your suggestion would be easier to implement.

Yeah, that too. The vultures have shown their hand. Now let the champion of the people, Boris, put his money where his mouth is. Or will he just slink away and forget all about his rehearsed outrage?

I don't expect anything from government. All talk when the people are talking, and then drop it when the interest wanes. But FIFA and UEFA (who have somehow come out of this as victims) could pass that rule regarding residency.

[I am invisible]

I guess this is what happens when you sell your soul to a well!! (yeah, yeah.....just reminded me of something biblical).

Note how the clubs with billionaire "football fans" as owners (those who actually spent their own money) were the first to listen to their fans and pull out. (PSG owners didn't even need their fans to tell them this was crap- " no relegation" - anyone who grew up with football as their first sport would spit at this)

I will repeat this over and over again, Kronke is easily the worst thing to happen to Arsenal in a generation...honestly the harm he has done to us will only properly be measured by Historians when they look back. Never has the feelings of hollowness and emptiness pervaded this club the way it does now.....and this emanates directly from this zombie of an owner.

It would be great if this whole shameful debacle led to he and his journeymen yank owners ( those who can't be bothered to understand the culture of the game) selling off or being forced to sell off by the government or someone else.

It really stinks to be an Arsenal fan with this kind of leadership. To think chavs and citeh fans will firmly get more respect than us now. Wow, the lows keep coming.
They’ve absolutely torn our club’s soul apart. Passion and pride? Gone. Decency and class? Gone. Entertainment? There’s still some comedy value, I guess. Victory through harmony? Need to take that down! We’ve literally been eaten alive from the inside by a parasite and there’s nothing left but a shell.

Chelsea can fuck right off with their attempt to play the good guys too! The only reason they’ve pulled out is because Roman needs Chelsea to legitimise his money and he needs to keep the UK sweet. He’s already hanging by a thread as it is after Russia’s antics in recent years.

And of course PSG’s owners hold rights to broadcast Champions League football through BeINSports, and they’re pretty much guaranteed qualification every year, so they win either way.

Can’t believe UEFA, FIFA, the PL, the oligarchs and Gulf-state-owned clubs and Boris Johnson are scoring points as the saviours of football! Be afraid of what’s just happened here.

[I am invisible]

Bear in mind, the staff and the players found out just a couple of hours before we did. These owners don't respect anyone. Not their staff, not the fans and certainly not the traditions and history of the club. All the vitriol should be reserved for the Kroenkes. I think it would be unfair to level it at the team or the club in general. There are different reasons to be angry at the players of course. But I don't think they were involved in this particular shambles in any way.
Wouldn’t be at all surprised if they’ve all been muzzled by NDAs. Americans love an NDA!

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Looks like all the English clubs have withdrawn from the Super League :lol:

Well that was an interesting few days. Back to the football now I gue....nah.

[Marc Overmars]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/open-letter-our-fans?fbclid=IwAR3QjkET8ygiLCO0pXaiLYDCnPvx2IvlyYay EBDKbpxi4heNQv6cecCBoGg

An open letter of apology. :haha:

[Letters]

Apology not accepted.

Off you fuck :tiphat:

[Niall_Quinn]

Wouldn’t be at all surprised if they’ve all been muzzled by NDAs. Americans love an NDA!

Listening to Pep and Klopp, it sounds like they genuinely weren't told anything. Usually when people are muzzled they openly say they can't comment. But both of them were clearly battling surprise as they tried to find the right words (in a foreign language) to walk right up to the line but not cross it.

[Niall_Quinn]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/open-letter-our-fans?fbclid=IwAR3QjkET8ygiLCO0pXaiLYDCnPvx2IvlyYay EBDKbpxi4heNQv6cecCBoGg

An open letter of apology. :haha:

Was that released simultaneously by all six clubs again? Was probably written in advance anyway, in case their wet dream turned into a nightmare.

[Niall_Quinn]

Apology not accepted.

Off you fuck :tiphat:


The system needs to be fixed.

The one moment of sincerity in the whole heap.

How did that go for them?

[Marc Overmars]

The system they think that needs to be fixed is the one that prevents them squeezing every last penny for themselves. Pure unadulterated greed and they as good as admitted it there.

[GP]

Shame, I was looking forward to it.

[Letters]

The system they think that needs to be fixed is the one that prevents them squeezing every last penny for themselves. Pure unadulterated greed and they as good as admitted it there.
Exactly.

They’re right, but for exactly the opposite way of the way they mean.

[Marc Overmars]

Shame, I was looking forward to it.

I reckon Maccy would have been the only viewer.

[I am invisible]

Man, Perez is FUMING! :lol:

[Gooner23]

Fuck him and Real, hope they go bust!

[I am invisible]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/open-letter-our-fans?fbclid=IwAR3QjkET8ygiLCO0pXaiLYDCnPvx2IvlyYay EBDKbpxi4heNQv6cecCBoGg

An open letter of apology. :haha:
With all due respect to the board, a good first step here would be for Arsenal to appoint a new board (and give it more than ceremonial powers).

[Letters]

Danny Baker’s Twitter has been entertaining

https://mobile.twitter.com/prodnose?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7C twgr%5Eauthor

[I am invisible]

Fuck him and Real, hope they go bust!
:gp:

[WGC Goon]

Well that didn't last long did it!!! :titsup::haha:

Now it's time for the Get Kreonke Out thread :satan:

[Letters]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkJehlr1tEw

[I am invisible]

We need to harness this current spirit of unity and get the backing of fans of all clubs for #KroenkeOut. They’ve already wrecked our club and they very nearly destroyed the league - it’s in everyone’s best interest that they’re removed ASAP.

[Gooner23]

I'd love to see that snake gone, but difficult to know what can realistically be done to get him out?

And what happens next. As Arseblog says this morning, the chances of finding a 'good guy' billionaire owner are pretty slim.

Does it need Government intervention to stop these power grabs? Is that even remotely feasible? I love the 51% rule but how realistic is it to implement here.

[WGC Goon]

We need to harness this current spirit of unity and get the backing of fans of all clubs for #KroenkeOut. They’ve already wrecked our club and they very nearly destroyed the league - it’s in everyone’s best interest that they’re removed ASAP.

I'm in :threaten:

[Mac76]

so, it looks to me like Woodward and Perez called everyone up at the weekend and told them that the ESL was happening, Man U were in and if they didn't follow they'd be out in the cold

so they had to issue statements in a hurry saying they were part of it

that's why they hadn't time to talk to managers and players etc

it was blackmail and the clubs all went for it (as would everton, burnley and any other po-faced bunch of hypocrits who've been publicly criticising it)

that's why the Arsenal statement on Sunday was so perfunctory

I'm not trying to give the Kroenkes an easy ride and tbh if their plan was always to get an ESL so they could not have to compete and just watch the money come in, they might now sell (although again we need to be careful what we wish for because we could have worse)

but while it's easy to laugh at last night's statement from Arsenal, it reads better than a lot of those from other clubs (especially Levy's I'm pleased to say)

after all, if they didn't apologise and say they made a mistake we'd be demanding they did just that wouldn't we?

but it's a shame Arteta and the players weren't as vocal as Klopp, Henderson, Pep, KDB and others

but Neville can truly eff off, he was part of a club that bullied and cheated its way to titles year after year

so we've all had a really worrying 2-3 days while this played out, but at least we can know it won't be tried again for a long long time

[Letters]

It was a pretty good statement, to be fair.

It's just...I don't believe a word of it. Sure, they're sorry that so many fans basically told them to fuck off and that they would be withdrawing their custom, they care about the money potentially drying up. But that's all.

And sure, you could say "well, it's not the players' fault, it's not Arteta's fault". And you'd be right. But it's not like the players care about us or the club either. It's all screwed.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Charles Egan from talksport tweeted last night that KSE had alerted JP Morgan Chase, that they are ready to sell Arsenal after the collapse of the super league :shrug:

https://twitter.com/CharIesEgan/status/1384582677190397953?s=20

[dazthegooner]

Well last year Nigerian billionaire Aliko Dangote expressed an interest in purchasing Arsenal but had other commitments to finish first.

[Mac76]

It was a pretty good statement, to be fair.

It's just...I don't believe a word of it. Sure, they're sorry that so many fans basically told them to fuck off and that they would be withdrawing their custom, they care about the money potentially drying up. But that's all.

And sure, you could say "well, it's not the players' fault, it's not Arteta's fault". And you'd be right. But it's not like the players care about us or the club either. It's all screwed.

well you have to think about who 'they' are - i'm willing to bet there's some staff at the club who do care about its history and fans.

as for Arteta and the players i don't think you can tar them all with the same brush - i suspect they all had their own thoughts, varying from "great i'll rake it in and don't have to play well" to "this is totally against what i think football's about"

[Mac76]

Charles Egan from talksport tweeted last night that KSE had alerted JP Morgan Chase, that they are ready to sell Arsenal after the collapse of the super league :shrug:

https://twitter.com/CharIesEgan/status/1384582677190397953?s=20

wouldn't it be great if Wenger led a consortium of people who weren't guilty of fraud, genocide or human rights abuses - i'm not holding out much hope though...

[GP]

Well last year Nigerian billionaire Aliko Dangote expressed an interest in purchasing Arsenal but had other commitments to finish first.

He's had "other commitments" for about a decade.

[GP]

wouldn; it be great if Wenger led a consortium of people who weren't guilty of fraud, genocide or human rights abuses - i'm not holding out much hope though...

Remember when Arsenal fans were comparing Wenger to Mugabe?

Good times.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Well last year Nigerian billionaire Aliko Dangote expressed an interest in purchasing Arsenal but had other commitments to finish first.

That's right.

He was waiting for his Oil company to start production early this year.

His name also came up on twitter a few times and supposedly, he is an option.

https://www.football.london/arsenal-fc/news/aliko-dangote-arsenal-takoever-kroenke-20430504

The Dangote refinery

https://www.theafricareport.com/29913/nigerias-dangote-still-expects-refinery-to-be-running-early-2021/

[Munchies]

https://youtu.be/4svKS43oPkY?t=9

[I am invisible]

I'd love to see that snake gone, but difficult to know what can realistically be done to get him out?

And what happens next. As Arseblog says this morning, the chances of finding a 'good guy' billionaire owner are pretty slim.

Does it need Government intervention to stop these power grabs? Is that even remotely feasible? I love the 51% rule but how realistic is it to implement here.

Honestly, I have no idea who or what comes next for us, but I don't see how KSE can possibly continue after this? Beyond the clandestine talks of a Super League, that they've obviously been having since day one, they clearly had / have no other vision or plan for this club - if this was meant to be their end game, then they've seriously miscalculated.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Stan Collymore was actually the first to announce that Arsenal had left the ESL on Twitter last night.

He also said that he had heard that one owner will sell, although no clues as to who

https://twitter.com/StanCollymore/status/1384586718611918852?s=20

[Mac76]

That's right.

He was waiting for his Oil company to start production early this year.

His name also came up on twitter a few times and supposedly, he is an option.

https://www.football.london/arsenal-fc/news/aliko-dangote-arsenal-takoever-kroenke-20430504

The Dangote refinery

https://www.theafricareport.com/29913/nigerias-dangote-still-expects-refinery-to-be-running-early-2021/

Dangote will be no angel, that second article makes clear there are environmental concerns and you can guarantee he got where he did by greasing a lot of palms

[WMUG]

Kroenke Out protest at the Emirates Friday at 6, btw.

[Mac76]

Kroenke Out protest at the Emirates Friday at 6, btw.

shall we all turn up with a GW banner? :lol:

[I am invisible]

wouldn't it be great if Wenger led a consortium of people who weren't guilty of fraud, genocide or human rights abuses - i'm not holding out much hope though...

Honestly, I have never wanted Wenger back more than I do right now - the club has completely lost its identity and its soul, and he's about the only person I can think of who could instantly restore some values and credibility.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Honestly, I have no idea who or what comes next for us, but I don't see how KSE can possibly continue after this? Beyond the clandestine talks of a Super League, that they've obviously been having since day one, they clearly had / have no other vision or plan for this club - if this was meant to be their end game, then they've seriously miscalculated.

I think our billionaire arsehole is the most likely candidate to sell.

Kroen**** is the only one of them who seems to have no interest in football at all.

He always wanted the 'brand' to make money off of.

Now it's been heavily tarnished, and the userbase hates him - it could be enough for him to jump ship.

Whilst collecting a few billion for the privilege, of course :coffee:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Dangote will be no angel, that second article makes clear there are environmental concerns and you can guarantee he got where he did by greasing a lot of palms

Very true.

But let's be honest - which billionaire in the world, got their riches legitimately and by being straight up and honest :shrug:

We always knew, once we got into bed with the billionaires, a dodgy owner would always be the outcome.

Honestly we could do with an oil Sheik on Citeh's level

[IBK]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkJehlr1tEw

Thanks for making me laugh today, Letters :lol:

[Letters]

shall we all turn up with a GW banner? :lol:

I've still got a few hundred GW fliers somewhere*, maybe I should take them along
(*I think, possible I chucked them!)

[I am invisible]

Dangote will be no angel, that second article makes clear there are environmental concerns and you can guarantee he got where he did by greasing a lot of palms

Is he a fan looking to buy a club, or another investor who was eyeing the future potential of a Super League?

[Mac76]

they've missed out "5) built a giant toilet bowl for spuds to play in"

:haha:

https://twitter.com/g7jhp/status/1384604315399118848

[I am invisible]

they've missed out "5) built a giant toilet bowl for spuds to play in"

:haha:

https://twitter.com/g7jhp/status/1384604315399118848

*Furloughed staff and then tried to get them to work at his mansion as servants

[dazthegooner]

Is he a fan looking to buy a club, or another investor who was eyeing the future potential of a Super League?

It's been quoted that he is actually an Arsenal fan so who knows? :shrug:

[Letters]

Tbh we should just tell ALL the billionaires to fuck off out of the game.

[KSE Comedy Club]

https://youtu.be/4svKS43oPkY?t=9

"Ok Stan, if you would just give me your bank account details, then I can transfer de monies, to your bhaaaaank"

[KSE Comedy Club]

Tbh we should just tell ALL the billionaires to fuck off out of the game.

It would be nice, but it's a pipedream now :(

[WMUG]

Yeah, that too. The vultures have shown their hand. Now let the champion of the people, Boris, put his money where his mouth is. Or will he just slink away and forget all about his rehearsed outrage?

I don't expect anything from government. All talk when the people are talking, and then drop it when the interest wanes. But FIFA and UEFA (who have somehow come out of this as victims) could pass that rule regarding residency.

No reason you couldn't put pressure on both ways. Lobby the govt and FIFA/UEFA simultaneously and see who caves first.

[GP]

Tbh we should just tell ALL the billionaires to fuck off out of the game.

You can't tell me what to do.

[WMUG]

It would be nice, but it's a pipedream now :(

This is the moment to make it happen though.

As NQ said, the parasites have shown their hand. Nobody's under any illusion about the damage these pricks would do to the game given the chance.

We won't get an opportunity like this for decades.

Strike while the iron's hot, get 50+1 implemented and reclaim our sport.

[Ollie the Optimist]

So there are reports today taht UEFA offered huge sums of money to the English clubs to withdraw from the Super League which sounds suspiciously like a bribe but never mind.

The new champions league format agreed by UEFA also means that clubs who fail to qualify but have high enough coefficient points will automatically qualify for the Champios League. We are 11th in the points apparently and given the teams ahead of us would qualify automatically via the league for the Champions League, would see us qualify next season if the rule was in place.

How is that new rule any different to the super league? It’s the big clubs looking after their own interests to ensure they all play in the big competition. The only difference is that UEFA get the money rather then super league which therefore seems to make it acceptable

[Mac76]

So there are reports today taht UEFA offered huge sums of money to the English clubs to withdraw from the Super League which sounds suspiciously like a bribe but never mind.

The new champions league format agreed by UEFA also means that clubs who fail to qualify but have high enough coefficient points will automatically qualify for the Champios League. We are 11th in the points apparently and given the teams ahead of us would qualify automatically via the league for the Champions League, would see us qualify next season if the rule was in place.

How is that new rule any different to the super league? It’s the big clubs looking after their own interests to ensure they all play in the big competition. The only difference is that UEFA get the money rather then super league which therefore seems to make it acceptable

that's all as disappointing as it is believable

if it's true about the bribery then absolutely UEFA have killed off the insurgents to keep control of the cash - not that any of us wanted that type of insurgency as it was the opposite of the fans getting their game back

[I am invisible]

The Kroenkes must be confused AF this morning! This is probably the closest thing to a slam dunk that you'll ever get by American sporting standards - drastic increase in income, instant security after the pandemic, cemented status as one to the world's top sides, forever, nothing but big matches against the best teams every other week... they were probably sitting there by their iPads, waiting for the kudos to start rolling in!

[Ollie the Optimist]

that's all as disappointing as it is believable

if it's true about the bribery then absolutely UEFA have killed off the insurgents to keep control of the cash - not that any of us wanted that type of insurgency as it was the opposite of the fans getting their game back

That’s all UEFA gave a shit about along with the premier league & sky etc. They claimed they were trying to protect the fans but as long as they got their money, they couldn’t give a shit about the fans

[KSE Comedy Club]

So there are reports today taht UEFA offered huge sums of money to the English clubs to withdraw from the Super League which sounds suspiciously like a bribe but never mind.

The new champions league format agreed by UEFA also means that clubs who fail to qualify but have high enough coefficient points will automatically qualify for the Champios League. We are 11th in the points apparently and given the teams ahead of us would qualify automatically via the league for the Champions League, would see us qualify next season if the rule was in place.

How is that new rule any different to the super league? It’s the big clubs looking after their own interests to ensure they all play in the big competition. The only difference is that UEFA get the money rather then super league which therefore seems to make it acceptable

UEFA are geniuses! They have countered this move by creating a 'European Super League'

It's a brilliant idea!

:lol:

[I am invisible]

So there are reports today taht UEFA offered huge sums of money to the English clubs to withdraw from the Super League which sounds suspiciously like a bribe but never mind.

The new champions league format agreed by UEFA also means that clubs who fail to qualify but have high enough coefficient points will automatically qualify for the Champios League. We are 11th in the points apparently and given the teams ahead of us would qualify automatically via the league for the Champions League, would see us qualify next season if the rule was in place.

How is that new rule any different to the super league? It’s the big clubs looking after their own interests to ensure they all play in the big competition. The only difference is that UEFA get the money rather then super league which therefore seems to make it acceptable

Does make you wonder if this was actually the real play from the 'founding 12'?

[Mac76]

Does make you wonder if this was actually the real play from the 'founding 12'?

could be, if so they really pressed the nuclear button though

[I am invisible]

could be, if so they really pressed the nuclear button though

Perfect opportunity though - football reeling after the pandemic, no fans, big Uefa meeting about the future of the CL...

[Letters]

The Kroenkes must be confused AF this morning! This is probably the closest thing to a slam dunk that you'll ever get by American sporting standards - drastic increase in income, instant security after the pandemic, cemented status as one to the world's top sides (and Spurs), forever, nothing but big matches against the best teams every other week... they were probably sitting there by their iPads, waiting for the kudos to start rolling in!
fyp :sulk:

[Niall_Quinn]

so, it looks to me like Woodward and Perez called everyone up at the weekend and told them that the ESL was happening, Man U were in and if they didn't follow they'd be out in the cold

so they had to issue statements in a hurry saying they were part of it

that's why they hadn't time to talk to managers and players etc

it was blackmail and the clubs all went for it (as would everton, burnley and any other po-faced bunch of hypocrits who've been publicly criticising it)

that's why the Arsenal statement on Sunday was so perfunctory

I'm not trying to give the Kroenkes an easy ride and tbh if their plan was always to get an ESL so they could not have to compete and just watch the money come in, they might now sell (although again we need to be careful what we wish for because we could have worse)

but while it's easy to laugh at last night's statement from Arsenal, it reads better than a lot of those from other clubs (especially Levy's I'm pleased to say)

after all, if they didn't apologise and say they made a mistake we'd be demanding they did just that wouldn't we?

but it's a shame Arteta and the players weren't as vocal as Klopp, Henderson, Pep, KDB and others

but Neville can truly eff off, he was part of a club that bullied and cheated its way to titles year after year

so we've all had a really worrying 2-3 days while this played out, but at least we can know it won't be tried again for a long long time

No, no, no, no, no. That's definitely not what happened. That's called a limited hangout and it is designed to save the arses of the plotters who haven't already resigned from various roles. Heap all the blame on the targets that have already been killed. The others walk away as abused victims who finally saw the light?

Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit! Bullshit detectors going off everywhere. A cacophony. You'd have to be a total mug to believe any of that, and they'd have to think we are all total mugs to believe we'd believe such bullshit.

No. These things are planned way in advance. Contracts, lawyers, accountants, organising the money, plus a thousand other moving parts. Nobody did anything at the last minute and none of them are innocent. Certainly none of them were coerced into sitting down months or years ago when this shit all started.

No, we're not having their bullshit excuses. They tried to steal the game and keep it for themselves. Now they (and all like them) must be ejected from the game. People like Perez must be rooted out.

Wenger drove me to tears of desperation with his unwillingness to leave the club and the structural damage he was doing daily, towards the end.

But now he needs to be in charge of all of it because everyone trusts him to do the right thing. You just can't see Wenger at the heart of a (yes they do exist) conspiracy like this. He's the Elliott Ness of football, sometimes with a dodgy aim and a tendency to outstay his welcome, but whatever.

He's the bloke for it and, having a think about it, I can't even come up with a name for his deputy. Who's another bloke in football that could be trusted? There must be somebody?

[IBK]

So there are reports today taht UEFA offered huge sums of money to the English clubs to withdraw from the Super League which sounds suspiciously like a bribe but never mind.

The new champions league format agreed by UEFA also means that clubs who fail to qualify but have high enough coefficient points will automatically qualify for the Champios League. We are 11th in the points apparently and given the teams ahead of us would qualify automatically via the league for the Champions League, would see us qualify next season if the rule was in place.

How is that new rule any different to the super league? It’s the big clubs looking after their own interests to ensure they all play in the big competition. The only difference is that UEFA get the money rather then super league which therefore seems to make it acceptable

Was this the clubs' intention all along? Either the ESL took off or there would be a pay day? Or is this just conspiracy theorising?

[IBK]

No, no, no, no, no. That's definitely not what happened. That's called a limited hangout and it is designed to save the arses of the plotters who haven't already resigned from various roles. Heap all the blame on the targets that have already been killed. The others walk away as abused victims who finally saw the light?

Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit! Bullshit detectors going off everywhere. A cacophony. You'd have to be a total mug to believe any of that, and they'd have to think we are all total mugs to believe we'd believe such bullshit.

No. These things are planned way in advance. Contracts, lawyers, accountants, organising the money, plus a thousand other moving parts. Nobody did anything at the last minute and none of them are innocent. Certainly none of them were coerced into sitting down months or years ago when this shit all started.

No, we're not having their bullshit excuses. They tried to steal the game and keep it for themselves. Now they (and all like them) must be ejected from the game. People like Perez must be rooted out.

Wenger drove me to tears of desperation with his unwillingness to leave the club and the structural damage he was doing daily, towards the end.

But now he needs to be in charge of all of it because everyone trusts him to do the right thing. You just can't see Wenger at the heart of a (yes they do exist) conspiracy like this. He's the Elliott Ness of football, sometimes with a dodgy aim and a tendency to outstay his welcome, but whatever.

He's the bloke for it and, having a think about it, I can't even come up with a name for his deputy. Who's another bloke in football that could be trusted? There must be somebody?

https://www.therightaddress.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/Ian-Wright-website.jpg

[Ollie the Optimist]

Was this the clubs' intention all along? Either the ESL took off or there would be a pay day? Or is this just conspiracy theorising?

I think the super league was genuine in one sense that if UEFA didnt give them what they wanted, it was ready to go (for 48 hours :lol:) but i do believe an element of it was to force UEFA etc into doing what they want which was give them more money

[Mac76]

No. These things are planned way in advance. Contracts, lawyers, accountants, organising the money, plus a thousand other moving parts. Nobody did anything at the last minute and none of them are innocent. Certainly none of them were coerced into sitting down months or years ago when this shit all started.


i get what you're saying but if there's all these contracts etc where are they now?

how are the clubs all able to just walk away all of a sudden if they've all signed up after your months of clandestine planning?

[Niall_Quinn]

It was a pretty good statement, to be fair.

It's just...I don't believe a word of it. Sure, they're sorry that so many fans basically told them to fuck off and that they would be withdrawing their custom, they care about the money potentially drying up. But that's all.

And sure, you could say "well, it's not the players' fault, it's not Arteta's fault". And you'd be right. But it's not like the players care about us or the club either. It's all screwed.

Why don't you believe them? They are the official source.

This is a rare moment in public life. It is very, very rare to see the sausage being made. Even rarer to walk in on the blood soaked butchers at work, stripped of their fancy suits and public relations entourage. This is what they look like in real life, not the fantasy life they set up for themselves and pay others to endorse.

This reality is not confined to football. These people run the world (and ruin it), almost always using money stolen from the masses, a pound per consumer at a time.

The ONLY thing they are scared of is when the masses wake up and unify in their condemnation. That's even rarer. But it should happen all the time.

[Niall_Quinn]

i get what you're saying but if there's all these contracts etc where are they now?

how are the clubs all able to just walk away all of a sudden if they've all signed up after your months of clandestine planning?

That's going to be the final joke. If I know my American lawyers - and I do - there will be clause after clause tying these clubs into the deal and stipulating hefty penalties on forfeiture. I'm thinking they'll end up losing millions to the likes of JP Morgan, rather than cashing all that lovely money they thought was in the bank.

It's not my clandestine planning btw, it was theirs.

[Niall_Quinn]

I think our billionaire arsehole is the most likely candidate to sell.

Kroen**** is the only one of them who seems to have no interest in football at all.

He always wanted the 'brand' to make money off of.

Now it's been heavily tarnished, and the userbase hates him - it could be enough for him to jump ship.

Whilst collecting a few billion for the privilege, of course :coffee:

The fans need to heavily boycott the club for the time being. Dive the share price down. Send those revenues to zero so every day the deal gets worse for Kroenke. Don't just let him walk away without a reminder of the pain he's brought to every Arsenal fan since his sorry arse parachuted in.

That's the thing with these bastards. Even when they lose huge, they win.