Arsenal v Newcastle. League Cup Semi Final 1st Leg. 20:00

[Marc Overmars]

I think given the kind of team Newcastle are and the form they’re in this is going to be a very difficult tie to get through. Feel like we need to win this tonight because I doubt we will be winning at St James’ Park.

Nwaneri is out.

Stodgeball incoming. :bow:

1-0

[HCZ_Reborn]

I’ve come back yesterday to a mountain of work due to lazy coworkers which means I’ll be working into this evening to try and catch up, plus honestly? I don’t give a shit about this game so probably will make no effort to watch. I hope we win because it’s Arsenal but I see tonight’s match and the game on Sunday as unnecessary distractions and an opportunity to exacerbate our injury list further

[Mac76]

0-3 Isak hatter

Am not at this game and not that sorry, as I think the combination of Newcastle on their current form, plus the leniency they get from refs, is not a promising formula when put together with our injury list.

In a way, while not a good thing on one level, a resounding defeat should cause Arteta not to bother too much in the return leg (why TF is this still a two-leg semi anyway - effing ridiculous)

[IBK]

I think given the kind of team Newcastle are and the form they’re in this is going to be a very difficult tie to get through. Feel like we need to win this tonight because I doubt we will be winning at St James’ Park.

Nwaneri is out.

Stodgeball incoming. :bow:

1-0

Been thinking about 'stodgeball'. We can be as frustrated as we like both watching it, and with the reasons why we have to rely on it. But given where we are now, the unfortunate reality is that we have no other realistic option. FWIW in the circumstances of Saturday's game Arteta was probably right to lean into our control/defence based game an try to nick a 0-1 win. The huge frustration of the penalty is that this nullified our team's greatest strength - defensive solidity and squeezing the life out of the opposition. I have resigned myself to the fact that we are not winning the league. The harsh reality of where we are is that we will have to rely on stodgeball if we are going to finish second or third in the league. The other point is that ironically, stodgeball is more likely to see us through cup games than it is to win us the league (it won't).

[Mac76]

On the pelanty, I get people say it's not normally given but when I watch it again I don't see it as a 50-50

I've got to say I still think the power Saliba puts into that defensive.header, which is clearly going to result in him striking Pedro if he misses the ball, and where he's further from the ball from Pedro, means I can't get so worked up about that pel tbh - if a defender goes for the ball with his feet and gets the player instead, however accidental, it's a pel

But I guess I must be wrong because no-one else thinks it should be given :)

[HCZ_Reborn]

It comes back to the inconsistency, if another incident like that had been given as a penalty….ok harsh but maybe fair. But given that a) the “they got the ball” defence was used to justify the non award of a penalty to us in the game at Villa Park last season and the Liverpool game this season b) no such penalty has been given against a side before, not one of the Brighton players expected it to be given and almost certainly it will never be given again. It’s another example of where we are officiated differently from every other team.

I can accept the odd bad decision going against us even with VAR, it should all even up. But the sheer volume of questionable decisions that have gone against us, us penalised harshly…opposition not penalised at all. This adds to the resentment. Because I’m not someone who thinks in a binary way, I think two things can both be true.

I think the very best thing you can say about the penalty award is that it’s generous, and I think it shouldn’t have mattered as Brighton hadn’t won in the league since late November and were there for the taking. All we had to do was get an unassailable lead and then rest the attacking players and stodge up the game

But equally I don’t think Brighton would have got back into the game without that penalty award

[IBK]

On the pelanty, I get people say it's not normally given but when I watch it again I don't see it as a 50-50

I've got to say I still think the power Saliba puts into that defensive.header, which is clearly going to result in him striking Pedro if he misses the ball, and where he's further from the ball from Pedro, means I can't get so worked up about that pel tbh - if a defender goes for the ball with his feet and gets the player instead, however accidental, it's a pel

But I guess I must be wrong because no-one else thinks it should be given :)

For me - yes there are arguments both ways - but the general consensus amongst non PGMOL apologists is that it was very harsh - and I am yet to see someone point to any similar circumstances in which a pel has been given. Its more the cursory and IMO incorrect VAR check that I take issue with. An extremely harsh decision is bad luck...and we are getting more than our fair share of this this season.

[Mac76]

@HCZ and @IBK - yes agree with all that

I do also still think that if Saliba had thought to go down clutching his head, we wouldn't be having this discussion - so much for us being good at the 'dark arts' ... :lol:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Arsenal: Raya, Lewis-Skelly, Gabriel, Saliba, Timber, Partey, Rice, Trossard, Odegaard, Martinelli, Havertz.
Subs: Porter, Tierney, Kiwior, Zinchenko, Calafiori, Jorginho, Merino, Sterling, Jesus.

Newcastle: Dubravka, Hall, Burn, Botman, Livramento, Joelinton, Tonali, Willock, Gordon, Murphy, Isak.
Subs: Vlachodimos, Trippier, Kelly, Almiron, Targett, Longstaff, Miley, Barnes, Osula.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Sky build-up is mainly that Arsenal are relegation fodder and Newcastle are way above our level.

Please blam them like in the league game last season.

[Mac76]

That's actually a decent lineup with Timber and MLS and Havertz better

[HCZ_Reborn]

Two out of three ain’t bad :haha:

[Mac76]

Two out of three ain’t bad :haha:

? Look again all three of those players are playing

[McNamara That Ghost...]

What is wrong with Gordon's face?

Aside from the obvious.

[Mac76]

Gordon seems to have been punched in the face recently :good:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Hell of a strike from Saliba.

[Mac76]

Dreadful from Raya

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Timber heads over.

[Mac76]

Jeez neither team can hit a barn door right now

[Mac76]

Silly shot from Gabriel

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Martinelli smacks the post!

[Mac76]

Great ball from Trossard but Martinelli wastes the opportunity

[Letters]

Martinelli smacks the post!

What a break!
We are much more direct today, maybe because of the way Newcastle play. Much better than other games (from what I've seen/read about them)

[McNamara That Ghost...]

0-1 Isak. Bollocks.

[Letters]

0-1 Isak. Bollocks.

:gp:

[Mac76]

0-1 Isak

[Mac76]

A pity, we're playing quite brightly but no composure near or in their box

[Letters]

Odegaard takes about 4 hours to take a free kick and hits it straight into the wall :doh:

[Letters]

A pity, we're playing quite brightly but no composure near or in their box

I think we've been pretty good so far, a bit unlucky to be behind. Martinelli should have scored and we've had some other half chances.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

0-1 HT.

[Mac76]

Looks like Trossard's crocked, shame he was having a good game

[Marc Overmars]

They have a good striker, we don’t. That’s about it really.

[Mac76]

MLS has been great, Trossard really lively, too many of the others still nees too many touches though and we can't make the most of our chances

[Mac76]

The space we gave Isak for the goal is unbelievable

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Come on Arsenal FFS.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

They have a good striker, we don’t. That’s about it really.

And that's going to be the story of our season.

[Marc Overmars]

0-2 Gordon :haha:

Dear oh dear.

[Mac76]

0-2 game and tie over

[McNamara That Ghost...]

0-2 Gordon. :doh:

[Letters]

They have a good striker, we don’t. That’s about it really.

Pretty much. Which is why it's now 2-0. Izak involved again.

[HCZ_Reborn]

:whistle:

I did say we should have just played the kids tonight

[Marc Overmars]

All from Isak just getting a shot away from a nothing position. No doubt one of our players would have looked for a pass there.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Pretty much. Which is why it's now 2-0. Izak involved again.

Its really ridiculous that anyone can argue that we don't even need someone even half on his level....really really ridiculous and just pissing me off.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

All from Isak just getting a shot away from a nothing position. No doubt one of our players would have looked for a pass there.

We've had 3 or 4 of those half chances and each time no one made the keeper work properly.

[HCZ_Reborn]

From what I’ve seen we’ve had three shots on target, the rest have all been blocked because Newcastle have sat back and hit us on the counter.

So yeah we need a striker but we also need to be getting up the pitch quicker.

[Mac76]

We've had 3 or 4 of those half chances and each time no one made the keeper work properly.

Absolutely, we're just not direct enough

[Marc Overmars]

How the fuck has Havertz put that wide?

[Mac76]

How many touches does Partey need ffs??

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Oh Havertz.

[Letters]

Wanker, Wanker, more like :doh:

[Mac76]

Havertz :rolleyes:

[Mac76]

Partey off, he's been trash tonight

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

From what I’ve seen we’ve had three shots on target, the rest have all been blocked because Newcastle have sat back and hit us on the counter.

So yeah we need a striker but we also need to be getting up the pitch quicker.
Did you see what Havertz just did in a semifinal?

Its silly anyone arguing this point of us getting a proper striker

[Marc Overmars]

Jorginho is at least getting his passes off quickly

[Marc Overmars]

Saliba heads over from close range

[Letters]

Now Saliba missing :lol:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

At least our Tormentor-in-chief is off.

[Mac76]

Weak shot from Jorg

[Marc Overmars]

We’ve not really played that badly to be honest but we’re so short of quality and confidence up front it’s fucked us.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Did you see what Havertz just did in a semifinal?

Its silly anyone arguing this point of us getting a proper striker

Erm I didn’t, I think you’re reading what you want to read and you don’t need me for that.

[Mac76]

Rice :lol:

[Mac76]

Barnes :haha:

[Letters]

We’ve not really played that badly to be honest but we’re so short of quality and confidence up front it’s fucked us.

I was thinking that. We've actually been quite good but we are whatever the opposite of "clinical" is.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Erm I didn’t, I think you’re reading what you want to read and you don’t need me for that.

I think you should take a bit of your advice because no one except you cares about silly shots on target (which were actually like passes to their keeper and shots hitting the bar)....we are talking about meaningful contributions and deadly strikes that if their keeper saves, we can confidently say "darn, he tried his best"...which was exactly what happened with the goals Raya conceded today.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I was thinking that. We've actually been quite good but we are whatever the opposite of "clinical" is.

Everyone accepts this except Arteta and the guy who likes wumming on here.

[Mac76]

Zin coming on, we're well and truly waving the white flag now

[Marc Overmars]

This is horribly stale. Arteta has fumbled this team hard.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Another pass to the keeper from Havertz which will surely go down as a shot on target :)

[Mac76]

Zin immediately yellowed :haha:

[Letters]

Zin coming on, we're well and truly waving the white flag now

Be fair, he only took 5 minutes to get booked.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I think you should take a bit of your advice because no one except you cares about silly shots on target (which were actually like passes to their keeper and shots hitting the bar)....we are talking about meaningful contributions and deadly strikes that if their keeper saves, we can confidently say "darn, he tried his best"...which was exactly what happened with the goals Raya conceded today.

You’re a very silly person aren’t you

Yes you’re right, the three shots on target (and only three shots on target) is as much about shots that are getting blocked because by the time we get into their box they have everyone back


So yes we need a striker given we’ve missed decent half chances, but the point is the whole creativity is slow that we are only creating half chances

As I keep saying if you want to argue against an argument you’ve imagined be my guest but you don’t need me for that

[Mac76]

Be fair, he only took 5 minutes to get booked.

It was about 90 seconds :lol:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

You’re a very silly person aren’t you

Yes you’re right, the three shots on target (and only three shots on target) is as much about shots that are getting blocked because by the time we get into their box they have everyone back


So yes we need a striker given we’ve missed decent half chances, but the point is the whole creativity is slow that we are only creating half chances

As I keep saying if you want to argue against an argument you’ve imagined be my guest but you don’t need me for that

Are you watching the game this time....or should I wait for your in depth match analysis after another 5 min highlight reel?

[Mac76]

Rice's cornere go too near the goal, it gets so clogged in there we can't find a way through

[Marc Overmars]

I imagine it’s going to be very ugly for Arteta should United somehow spawn a win on the weekend.

[Mac76]

I imagine it’s going to be very ugly for Arteta should United somehow spawn a win on the weekend.

It's not at all unlikely, they were actually quite decent against Liverpool at the weekend, Maguire howler notwithstanding

[HCZ_Reborn]

Are you watching the game this time....or should I wait for your in depth match analysis after another 5 min highlight reel?

Against my better judgement I’ve watched the game. Your pathetic petulance about highlight reels relate to a match four months ago where I did a player rating only after watching the full highlights of the game.

As I say because you’re either semi literate or too flustered to read properly. You’re starting a row with me for no reason


You’re imagining I’m saying we don’t need a striker when I’ve not said any such thing.

[Mac76]

Better from Jorg

[Mac76]

Are you watching the game this time....or should I wait for your in depth match analysis after another 5 min highlight reel?

:lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

I imagine it’s going to be very ugly for Arteta should United somehow spawn a win on the weekend.

I can’t stand Arteta as is well known but my only gripe tonight is playing the first team. I think playing Calafiori rather than Maitland Niles on the left might have possibly given us more width on the left, but ultimately it comes back to being one trick ponies with set pieces

[HCZ_Reborn]

:lol:


https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/6/66/CrumbLaugh.jpg

[Mac76]

Maitland Niles

:haha:

[Marc Overmars]

Could be here for another 90 mins and not be anywhere near scoring

[HCZ_Reborn]

On the plus side no new injuries…so no real harm done apart from to egos

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Against my better judgement I’ve watched the game. Your pathetic petulance about highlight reels relate to a match four months ago where I did a player rating only after watching the full highlights of the game.

As I say because you’re either semi literate or too flustered to read properly. You’re starting a row with me for no reason


You’re imagining I’m saying we don’t need a striker when I’ve not said any such thing.

I am not imagining anything.

Your first reply to my comment stated that besides having a striker, if we had moved the ball more quickly it would do.

My initial comment was a reply to MO which was in full agreement with what he said, that only Isak was the difference between the teams.

I repeat, the difference in this game has been a striker doing his job, simple. This is all we have been asking Arteta to do for almost 2 years.

Playing faster might have helped but that was not the difference, which you would have witnessed when Martinelli fast break occured and he hit the bar, as most expected he would do.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

0-2 FT. Jesus wept.

[Marc Overmars]

0-2 FT

Horribly predictable in the end. That’s almost certainly us dumped out, would take one hell of a turn around up there that I don’t think anyone believes were capable of.

Arteta. :haha:

[HCZ_Reborn]

I am not imagining anything.

Your first reply to my comment stated that besides having a striker, if we had moved the ball more quickly it would do.

My initial comment was a reply to MO which was in full agreement with what he said, that only Isak was the difference between the teams.

I repeat, the difference in this game has been a striker doing his job, simple. This is all we have been asking Arteta to do for almost 2 years.

Playing faster might have helped but that was not the difference, which you would have witnessed when Martinelli fast break occured and he hit the bar, as most expected he would do.

How many opportunities have we had like that in the entire game, as opposed to what most of the game has been threatening from set pieces and blocked shots

Your dislike of Martinelli aside, the difference is Newcastle are the away side and will play on the break and defend deep. We are the home side so you would expect us to create more clear chances than we are doing….and it’s not just a problem against Newcastle, it’s against Ipswich and against Everton as well…where for the most part we could have had Thierry Henry and the opposition box is so congested we wouldn’t have scored. Because we aren’t moving the ball quick enough to stretch the play.

So you tell me, did we open this Newcastle side up loads tonight…or were they defending deep and able to throw bodies at the ball for most of it when we got round to getting shots away?

Yes we fluffed chances, but again two things can be true…we are also not creating enough chances.

Can I suggest you take up smoking? Give you time to reflect and not to act like a hammer seeing everything as a nail

This wasn’t the Liverpool fa cup tie last season where we opened them up time after time. We just didn’t

[Mac76]

0-2 is almost the worst possible scoreline - there's just enough hope there for Arteta to give it a go - 0-3 and surely even he would have played the kids at St Jimmy's Park

tbf the team gave it their best shot but they need help from a couple more lively attackers who know where the goal is

Merino - who didn't even get on the pitch tonight - was such a waste of money it's unbelievable, considering we needed to stengthen the attack rather than spend £40m on a midfield workhorse

[HCZ_Reborn]

0-2 FT

Horribly predictable in the end. That’s almost certainly us dumped out, would take one hell of a turn around up there that I don’t think anyone believes were capable of.

Arteta. :haha:

Play the kids at St James Park, like we should have done tonight

My main gripe is that we tried to rest players against Brighton for this.

[Marc Overmars]

Play the kids at St James Park, like we should have done tonight

I’d rather the morons out there tonight suffer instead.

[Mac76]

I’d rather the morons out there tonight suffer instead.

unfair, they need some scoring power, they're good at setting up chances but somebody needs to be there to put them away

[HCZ_Reborn]

I’d rather the morons out there tonight suffer instead.

The only Moron is the Lego haired one who has had nine transfer windows to buy a striker and has this need to control games, rather than actually attack teams with pace and stretch the play

Especially at home we get caught out by the counter or by one long ball where because the build up play is so slow we have to overcommit bodies. End of the day Havertz, Trossard etc are never going to be world class goal scorers…they are squad players at best…but we frankly need to have a bit of colonic irrigation in our game to open up a backed up opposition

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

How many opportunities have we had like that in the entire game, as opposed to what most of the game has been threatening from set pieces and blocked shots

Your dislike of Martinelli aside, the difference is Newcastle are the away side and will play on the break and defend deep. We are the home side so you would expect us to create more clear chances than we are doing….and it’s not just a problem against Newcastle, it’s against Ipswich and against Everton as well…where for the most part we could have had Thierry Henry and the opposition box is so congested we wouldn’t have scored. Because we aren’t moving the ball quick enough to stretch the play.

So you tell me, did we open this Newcastle side up loads tonight…or were they defending deep and able to throw bodies at the ball for most of it when we got round to getting shots away?

Yes we fluffed chances, but again two things can be true…we are also not creating enough chances.

Can I suggest you take up smoking? Give you time to reflect and not to act like a hammer seeing everything as a nail

This wasn’t the Liverpool fa cup tie last season where we opened them up time after time. We just didn’t

Don't you give health advice or something like that for a living?

Anyway, I think my argument is simple enough for anyone. If we had reliable personnel that their main job is to be clinical, we could have escaped with something today.

Now we are just going to have to listen to you and Arteta making excuses about teams playing deep, till the next team beats us by having forwards who are clinical.

On the brightside, this is now another trophy Arteta doesn't have to worry about so we can get a rest.

Imagine being beat by the same team/trick twice in less than 4 months....lets wait for you guys to roll out the stats again of how we are not doing that badly compared to last season.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Don't you give health advice or something like that for a living?

Anyway, I think my argument is simple enough for anyone. If we had reliable personnel that their main job is to be clinical, we could have escaped with something today.

Now we are just going to have to listen to you and Arteta making excuses about teams playing deep, till the next team beats us by having forwards who are clinical.

On the brightside, this is now another trophy Arteta doesn't have to worry about so we can get a rest.

Imagine being beat by the same team/trick twice in less than 4 months....lets wait for you guys to roll out the stats again of how we are not doing that badly compared to last season.

Are you old enough to remember Worzel Gummidge?

He was a scarecrow. A man made out of cloth and straw….thats what you’re attacking right now

Almost nothing you’re saying bares any resemblance to any argument I’ve made

How honestly can I believe you when you’re telling me you read what I’m saying when you’ve concluded I’m defending Arteta


I wouldn’t mind but you have spectacularly good form for doing this. At the moment you are in exactly the same frame of mind as you were when you had a meltdown over us not signing Mudryk.

[The Wengerbabies]

This is starting to feel like just before I completely lost interest in football.

Not sure I'll make it to the end of the season tbh.

[HCZ_Reborn]

This is starting to feel like just before I completely lost interest in football.

Not sure I'll make it to the end of the season tbh.

Oh no please don’t go. Where will we be without you

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

How honestly can I believe you when you’re telling me you read what I’m saying when you’ve concluded I’m defending Arteta



IMO HCZ, you subconsciously defend him all the time.

Or rather, let me put it like this, Mac once said you are unhappy if anyone critiques Arteta except you, and I happen to believe it as you've shown so much evidence of double-speak, that it's a bit mind blowing.

Anyway, keeping it simple, we did enough today not to end up being embarrassingly beaten 0-2 in front of our fans, 1-2, 2-3 or even 3-2 but definitely not 0-2...we just needed someone who could finish.

Lets just get someone, anyone ( at least a half decent one) this January, so we can hopefully have something to play for this season.

Like IBK said, we can make a go of it in the CL, but we will still need a finisher as we can't draw our way to the final...at least I can't remember that ever being done (this game should also help prove that).

[The Wengerbabies]

Oh no please don’t go. Where will we be without you

I'll just post exclusively in General Chat, don't worry.

[HCZ_Reborn]

IMO HCZ, you subconsciously defend him all the time.

Or rather, let me put it like this, Mac once said you are unhappy if anyone critiques Arteta except you, and I happen to believe it as you've shown so much evidence of double-speak, that it's a bit mind blowing.

Anyway, keeping it simple, we did enough today not to end up being embarrassingly beaten 0-2 in front of our fans, 1-2, 2-3 or even 3-2 but definitely not 0-2...we just needed someone who could finish.

Lets just get someone, anyone ( at least a half decent one) this January, so we can hopefully have something to play for this season.

Like IBK said, we can make a go of it in the CL, but we will still need a finisher as we can't draw our way to the final...at least I can't remember that ever being done (this game should also help prove that).

I know you’re not exactly an intellectual heavyweight but is that the best you can do

When I accuse people of saying one thing and believing another, I’m usually trying to bait them so I can only assume that’s what you’re doing.

If I criticise an argument Mac makes about Arteta it’s not in defence of Arteta it’s because it’s a stupid argument. Like the whole Xhaka teacher’s pet thing. People said the same thing to me about reading Arteta’s body language in that awful documentary series…I don’t think they were doing so to defend Arteta.


But you must realise how deranged you sound when you make that accusation. If you don’t think our club should be run like Chelsea in the way it treats coaches, If you don’t agree with me that it’s a striker and only a striker that was the issue tonight then you must secretly be defending Arteta. Apart from being petulantly childish, it’s a big old reach.

It’s reminds me of the tribal attitude I hate in politics. You’re either in this camp or you’re in that camp. I get accused by leftists of being right wing and by frothing right wingers of being a libtard. Because it’s about purity circles and allegiance signalling rather than actually looking at each individual issue and coming to conclusions

I want Arteta gone because even without a striker I think this team is good enough to be leading the title race. I honestly don’t give a fuck about tonight, we missed chances but we really don’t create enough chances to begin with. I think what Arteta has done well is given us a good team for controlling the game against the big teams…our record against the likes of Chelsea, Man City, Liverpool, Spurs etc has drastically improved. Where we failed last season was against sides competing for top ten spots who are hard to break down…I think you need both a Rice and Partey away at City and Liverpool. You don’t need both in most home games nor do you need an inverted full back giving you an extra man in the middle of the park for breaking up play.

What I’d like to see is a coach that largely keeps what Arteta has done but is more flexible…so that we aren’t playing two holding players against spastic teams like Everton and Ipswich. I’m not into throwing out the baby with the bath water. You presumably want rid of Martinelli and Havertz, I don’t…Havertz should be a squad player and Martinelli either needs to up his game or become a squad player.

[Letters]

This is starting to feel like just before I completely lost interest in football.

Not sure I'll make it to the end of the season tbh.
So you’re a glory hunter?

[The Wengerbabies]

So you’re a glory hunter?

I have more important things to do in my life.

For the nostalgia if we're doing well it's nice, otherwise what's the point in caring.

[Letters]

I have more important things to do in my life.
Like hating black people?
I guess it's all about priorities.

[KSE Comedy Club]

So you’re a glory hunter?

I think the issue is more that, the last two seasons have been exciting to watch, exciting to believe, exciting to be an Arsenal fan.

This season, we have gone back to his first season in charge, and it seems like we are a new project again - that is too much to take after where we have been the last 20 years.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Don't you give health advice or something like that for a living?

Anyway, I think my argument is simple enough for anyone. If we had reliable personnel that their main job is to be clinical, we could have escaped with something today.

Now we are just going to have to listen to Arteta making excuses about teams playing deep, till the next team beats us by having forwards who are clinical.

On the brightside, this is now another trophy Arteta doesn't have to worry about so we can get a rest.

Imagine being beat by the same team/trick twice in less than 4 months....lets wait for the stats again of how we are not doing that badly compared to last season.

:gp:

Tbf, HCZ cannot stand Arteta and wants him gone. I have edited the quote to reflect what I do agree with however.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I think the issue is more that, the last two seasons have been exciting to watch, exciting to believe, exciting to be an Arsenal fan.

This season, we have gone back to his first season in charge, and it seems like we are a new project again - that is too much to take after where we have been the last 20 years.

I do sometimes wonder if Arsenal fans watch the same game as me.


For the first half of last season especially we absolutely were not exciting to watch at all.


Idiots like 21 Brain cells seem to think by comparing this season with last season I’m defending Arteta when in fact what I’m doing is saying that we remember the 16 wins out of 18, but we don’t remember what absolute dirge we were serving up until the new year.

I don’t think we were that great in the second half of the season truth be told, we just managed to exploit set pieces more and we scored more goals against spastic teams. The only games I remember seeing any free flowing football was the home games against Liverpool and the away game vs Spurs.

So that to that end I don’t think we really have regressed.

[Letters]

I think the issue is more that, the last two seasons have been exciting to watch, exciting to believe, exciting to be an Arsenal fan.

This season, we have gone back to his first season in charge, and it seems like we are a new project again - that is too much to take after where we have been the last 20 years.
I think that's a bit of an overstatement - the bit in bold. But it certainly feels like we haven't pushed on since last season. Although as I've noted before, we're actually in a very similar position to the one we were in this time last year.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I do sometimes wonder if Arsenal fans watch the same game as me.


For the first half of last season especially we absolutely were not exciting to watch at all.


Idiots like 21 Brain cells seem to think by comparing this season with last season I’m defending Arteta when in fact what I’m doing is saying that we remember the 16 wins out of 18, but we don’t remember what absolute dirge we were serving up until the new year.

I don’t think we were that great in the second half of the season truth be told, we just managed to exploit set pieces more and we scored more goals against spastic teams. The only games I remember seeing any free flowing football was the home games against Liverpool and the away game vs Spurs.

So that to that end I don’t think we really have regressed.

Our football in the second half of last season absolutely was free flowing and more attack focused, certainly not set piece focused.

The point is that it has felt like we were building towards being bigger & better and getting back to trophy winning ways - it was exciting.

But this season has been turgid, slow, boring and infuriating. Watching us makes my eyes bleed.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I think that's a bit of an overstatement - the bit in bold. But it certainly feels like we haven't pushed on since last season. Although as I've noted before, we're actually in a very similar position to the one we were in this time last year.

It's really not.

We have gone completely back to sideways and backwards passing with slow paced, predictable and easy to defend against forward attack (I use attack lightly)

That is 100% the football we were playing in Arteta's first season.

[Letters]

It's really not.

We have gone completely back to sideways and backwards passing with slow paced, predictable and easy to defend against forward attack (I use attack lightly)

That is 100% the football we were playing in Arteta's first season.

Oh, I thought you meant in terms of results.
To be fair, I think injuries to some key creative players like Odegaard and Saka have been a factor there. I actually thought we looked better last night, Martinelli was inches away from putting us in front, had he done so it would have been a different game. Fine lines in football. But we do lack a clinical striker, I don't think anyone disputes that. Well...maybe Arteta does! But players like that don't grow on trees at this level, I'm not sure we had the money to get someone last summer.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Our football in the second half of last season absolutely was free flowing and more attack focused, certainly not set piece focused.

The point is that it has felt like we were building towards being bigger & better and getting back to trophy winning ways - it was exciting.

But this season has been turgid, slow, boring and infuriating. Watching us makes my eyes bleed.

Well that’s a difference of opinion. I think certainly if you look at games like Palace and West Ham at the beginning of that run, even big wins like that it was about opening the scoring from set pieces and trying to exploit teams pushing up to try and get back into the game.

I think ultimately the difference is most teams have started to wise up to it and we don’t have another trick up our sleeves

[Marc Overmars]

Second half of last season was also about riding the crest of a wave. Odegaard was in the form of his life, Havertz made it look like he was the number 9 we needed, Trossard stepped up and so did many others. The defence was also imperious and not making the mistakes we’ve seen this season.

But football isn’t linear and just because something happened before doesn’t mean it’s going to happen again. It’s all gone very stale and you can’t help but feel the window of opportunity we had is about to close if it hasn’t already.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Second half of last season was also about riding the crest of a wave. Odegaard was in the form of his life, Havertz made it look like he was the number 9 we needed, Trossard stepped up and so did many others. The defence was also imperious and not making the mistakes we’ve seen this season.

But football isn’t linear and just because something happened before doesn’t mean it’s going to happen again. It’s all gone very stale and you can’t help but feel the window of opportunity we had is about to close if it hasn’t already.

Oh i have no expectation of that happening again, that’s why I’ve conceded the title.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Oh, I thought you meant in terms of results.
To be fair, I think injuries to some key creative players like Odegaard and Saka have been a factor there. I actually thought we looked better last night, Martinelli was inches away from putting us in front, had he done so it would have been a different game. Fine lines in football. But we do lack a clinical striker, I don't think anyone disputes that. Well...maybe Arteta does! But players like that don't grow on trees at this level, I'm not sure we had the money to get someone last summer.

No, sorry, I was referring to our style and general play - it is nauseating this season and inexplicably so.

Well, there are two strikers with release clauses that could be had - Gyokores & Osimhen
Then there is Nico Williams - 48m release clause.

If we have any aspirations of being a big club then these are the types of signing that we need to make to push on and win the top prizes.

We have money, the Kroenke's spent more money on a new stadium for the Rams than they have in the last 5 years with us.

We always though, seem to be looking for loans or bargain basement, average journeymen to fill in the gaps - and wonder why we are always 'nearly men'

If we want to be big, we have to move big. Simple as that.
We need a star, we need that match winner when the chips are down - we don't have that and it's been missing for years.

[Letters]

We have money, the Kroenke's spent more money on a new stadium for the Rams than they have in the last 5 years with us.
Doesn't FFP limit what we can do?

[IBK]

So last night...

The saddest thing for me is that I'm not sure anyone was really surprised either by the result or by the way the game played out. If we look at our recent games, even the likes of Brentford and Brighton have better strikers than us. Newcastle have 2!

They pretty much swatted us aside, and its almost embarrassing how straightforward it was for them to do so.

As HZC points out in this thread, however, while our Xg might suggest that pretty much any of the top strikers for the other teams in the top half of the league would have scored in yesterday's game, much of the time even Henry in his prime would struggle given our ponderous build up play. I have mentioned our deficiency in transitions, and this is killing us. Going forwards we invite the opposition to get set in defence and constantly then have to try to thread the ball through the eye of a needle. Most of the time, there is no point whatsoever shooting from outside their box because it it too congested with players to have a chance of scoring. The inevitabe result is that we give up possession.

Having done so, we then invite the opposition to transition to spring a counter attack - with all of our players up the pitch and acres of space for them to run into. So all the possesison and delay is for what? Controlling the game is pointless when we not only cede control but leave ourselves vulnerable when we have to try do the improtant thing - score goals.

Does Arteta even study games where the opposition has been made vulnerable? Brentford and Villa in the league had no problem scoring against Newcastle recently, and I guarantee that this was not down to patient, slow build up play.

The irony is that Raya was bought because of his ability with the ball at his feet. He passes long very well - but what's the point when we then pass sideways if we win the ball up the pitch. When there are no runners into the space that has become available. When we do not have players who can convert clear chances.

Depressing.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Doesn't FFP limit what we can do?

FSR ? Yes to a degree

The reason we are trying to bring players in from abroad on loan. Isn’t that we can’t afford the transfer fee…it’s because we are concerned about adding to the wage bill without reducing it elsewhere. We really for instance cannot afford to be indulging a player like Gabriel Jesus any longer, he is on ridiculous wages….and would need to get him off the wage bill before signing a player at the level of Isaak. Not because we’d be in immediate trouble with FSR, but two three years down the line if you haven’t brought in the money to offset the money you’re losing every month it can cause problems.

This is why Liverpool are in the same boat and why they did almost nothing in the transfer market last summer, the difference is they had an attacking player already who was already better than anyone we had and has reached levels he hasn’t in the past five years.


But in truth, although I like Calafiori the money we spent on him and Merino would have been much better spent on bringing in a forward. I don’t think the money is there like it has been in previous seasons, but the money then as I’ve said wasn’t spent wisely


I’m sure the giant man baby will find a way of twisting this into saying im subconsciously defending Arteta :lol:

[Letters]

FSR ?
Tbh I'd missed the memo about that replacing FFP. But yes, that.
But the point is Kroenke's wealth isn't that relevant, is it? We can't "do a Man City". Not sure I'd want us to tbh.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Tbh I'd missed the memo about that replacing FFP. But yes, that.
But the point is Kroenke's wealth isn't that relevant, is it? We can't "do a Man City". Not sure I'd want us to tbh.

I don’t think Man City can do a Man City anymore

My understanding is FFP is the pan European rules, and FSR is how it’s governed in English football

[The Wengerbabies]

Like hating black people?
I guess it's all about priorities.

What an outrageous thing to say.

[The Wengerbabies]

I think the issue is more that, the last two seasons have been exciting to watch, exciting to believe, exciting to be an Arsenal fan.

This season, we have gone back to his first season in charge, and it seems like we are a new project again - that is too much to take after where we have been the last 20 years.

:gp:

I wasn't around for Arteta's first season but after 10 years of Wengerball I began to switch off around 2013/2014, I was only mildly aware of Leicester's season and was fully out of it by probably 2017. Came back to it at the start of 2023 and there was hope and excitement, now it feels like the shit Wenger years again. Same old story, so pointless.

[KSE Comedy Club]

:gp:

I wasn't around for Arteta's first season but after 10 years of Wengerball I began to switch off around 2013/2014, I was only mildly aware of Leicester's season and was fully out of it by probably 2017. Came back to it at the start of 2023 and there was hope and excitement, now it feels like the shit Wenger years again. Same old story, so pointless.

What's even more concerning is that Arteta is now making comments that could echo Wenger himself!

Are we going to add in the transfer market? - "we will look for internal solutions"

[KSE Comedy Club]

Tbh I'd missed the memo about that replacing FFP. But yes, that.
But the point is Kroenke's wealth isn't that relevant, is it? We can't "do a Man City". Not sure I'd want us to tbh.

There are players that would improve us available that we could get for £50m (Williams, Mansour (sp)) Douglas Luiz on loan

Are we saying we don't even have that to spend now?

Bearing in mind we started the season without a full 25 man squad.

[HCZ_Reborn]

There are players that would improve us available that we could get for £50m (Williams, Mansour (sp)) Douglas Luiz on loan

Are we saying we don't even have that to spend now?

Bearing in mind we started the season without a full 25 man squad.

As I said I suspect it’s not the transfer fee it’s the wages

The transfer fee can be amortised and usually is


My feeling would be to sound out Saudi Arabia to take Jesus off our hands and bring in a Striker. His wages are obscene for what he’s given us