Arsenal 1-1 Brentford Player rating and match reaction

[HCZ_Reborn]

Raya 7 - Not much to do, but commanded his penalty area well on set pieces


Partey 7 - Good finish to a lovely move from Rice, I think there are increasing arguments to give him contract extension


Saliba 7 - Good interceptions


Kiwior 7 - Another confident performance


Tierney 7 - Decision to disallow his goal was probably correct


Jorginho 6 - Any hope of getting a win went off the pitch with him


Rice 8 - Carried on from his excellent performance midweek


Zinchenko 7 - Had a good run out in a free role


Martinelli 6 - Good first half but faded


Trossard 6 - Some lazy passing and showboating second half


Nwaneri 6.5 - Seemed to be happier coming inside, not convinced his future is on the wing


Subs:


Timber 6.5 - Relieved to see him come on after he hobbled off Wednesday


Saka 6.5 - Managed to close down Flekken but seemed to lack the confidence to pull the trigger


Odegaard 6 - Too many safe passes, Zinchenko was at least adventurous


Merino 6 - Seems to have far more impact up front these days


Lewis-Skelly 6 - Looked tired and was a bit clumsy at times



The more we drop points the more secure we seem to be in second place, this is the kind of game had it been earlier on in the season I’d have been spitting blood about. Though dropped points is a) reflective of the fact that we are rightly prioritising the champions league and b) today more about players fluffing their lines than anything tactical. The overall play was good.

[Mac76]

We did a decent job, got a decent result, the only issue is playing Martinelli the whole game, an act of pure insanity

[Marc Overmars]

I just want 2nd secured because if we do go on in Europe then it’s likely that the league will continue to drift and then we’re just hoping the chasing pack don’t string 2-3 wins together. Incredibly frustrating how many times we’ve taken the lead in games this season and failed to convert that into 3 points.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I just want 2nd secured because if we do go on in Europe then it’s likely that the league will continue to drift and then we’re just hoping the chasing pack don’t string 2-3 wins together. Incredibly frustrating how many times we’ve taken the lead in games this season and failed to convert that into 3 points.

Lack of goals. Story of our season. I disagree with the media reports and commentators I think we carved out quite a few chances yesterday, enough to win the game. It’s a mixture of lacking goalscorers and the players lacking confidence. Saka before his injury I think would have scored when closing down Flekken yesterday

But from 16 games this season, we’ve scored only 1 goal or no goal. Compared to 12 in the whole of last season

We’ve only scored more than once two times in the last 8 games (8 goals in 8 games)

I agree about 2nd

[Mac76]

I just want 2nd secured because if we do go on in Europe then it’s likely that the league will continue to drift and then we’re just hoping the chasing pack don’t string 2-3 wins together. Incredibly frustrating how many times we’ve taken the lead in games this season and failed to convert that into 3 points.

We can keep top 5 with mostly draws if needs be, the priority has to be the CL, this is a huge oppprtunity and he needs to pick every PL lineup with that in mind

The Liverpool game is the only one where we really need to try to win, to set us up for competing with them again next srason

There's some value in 2nd but it's way way way below winning the CL

[Marc Overmars]

We can keep top 5 with mostly draws if needs be, the priority has to be the CL, this is a huge oppprtunity and he needs to pick every PL lineup with that in mind

The Liverpool game is the only one where we really need to try to win, to set us up for competing with them again next srason

There's some value in 2nd but it's way way way below winning the CL

Of course, that’s obvious, I don’t care where we finish if there’s an opportunity to win the CL. But I do believe in momentum and the league grinding to a premature halt is no good for anything. What if we get through next week but lose in the semis while the league continues to stall? It’s all going to look rather shit.

[Mac76]

Of course, that’s obvious, I don’t care where we finish if there’s an opportunity to win the CL. But I do believe in momentum and the league grinding to a premature halt is no good for anything. What if we get through next week but lose in the semis while the league continues to stall? It’s all going to look rather shit.

Only if you think that way, but it's the risk we need to take, I won't blame Arteta if he rests players to try to win the CL, tbh I think even if we make the semis of the CL that's progress.

With the cards, injuries etc it's a miracle we're still second tbh, we left ourselves short in attach this season, as you're saying, so rectify that in the summer and we can build on it further.

Btw there's talk of Havertz being back before the end of the season which would be a welcome boost in both league and CL

[KSE Comedy Club]

Of course, that’s obvious, I don’t care where we finish if there’s an opportunity to win the CL. But I do believe in momentum and the league grinding to a premature halt is no good for anything. What if we get through next week but lose in the semis while the league continues to stall? It’s all going to look rather shit.

Yeh, I'm sorry but for me it seems like we are happy to plod along in the league now to focus solely on the CL. That's inexcusable IMO based on where we should be at at this stage of the process.
It's also not something I personally find acceptable, we should be able to manage some kind of show of strength in more than one competition.

I thought this was a shit game, we played averagely and got an average result.
Back to looking like we had no clue what to do next after getting in to the final third. 'Oh just pass the ball sideways and backwards another 100 times, that should eat up another 10 mins and make it look like we are in doing something constructive'

Trossard made me want to put my fist through the TV - he HAS to be sold in the summer, since his strop he has been total dogshit.

Also Saka !!?? - open goal after successfully tackling the keeper and he's trying to tap it forward another few yards and get a couple more touches on the ball - What the actual fuck!!?? just fucking shoot and it's a goal, 2-1, 3 points, thank you very much.
Coming back from injury is no justification for that shocker.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I thought we created far more than we usually do in these kind of games, and once again the main issue was a lack of a natural finisher

I think Trossard you have a point, a lot of lazy passes and unnecessary flicks and tricks that didn’t come off

But I think we shot from outside the box (not as much as people in the crowd seemed to want) and actually broke on them more than once (including for the goal).

I think largely the front three disappointed - Martinelli everything he tried just didn’t come off second half, Trossard already spoken about and Nwaneri did ok on the wing but seems to prefer to be playing centrally.

Especially given we rested a few players I don’t think there was much wrong with the build up play.

Yes Saka could have shot first time, but I was right behind the goal in that incident, and the angle wasn’t an easy one…he tried to tap it in it would have been cleared away (he had a defender on him) and if he’d used too much power probably would have been off target…I think he took too long to set himself but that’s confidence that you lose when you’ve been away for months.

I get the frustration, but I’ve seen some real dog shit performances in the league this season and I don’t think this was necessarily one of them

[HCZ_Reborn]

https://www.le-grove.co.uk/p/same-problems-who-cares?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

I think the only thing I disagree with in this match summary is that I think a Red card for Norgaard would have been harsh, it’s a yellow for me….its a cynical foul but there’s no intent to cause harm…I think a yellow was fair

[Chippy]

We can keep top 5 with mostly draws if needs be, the priority has to be the CL, this is a huge oppprtunity and he needs to pick every PL lineup with that in mind

The Liverpool game is the only one where we really need to try to win, to set us up for competing with them again next srason

There's some value in 2nd but it's way way way below winning the CL

I am thankful that CL qualification has been extended to five clubs. We have gone from title contenders to sweating on the other teams chasing us down to get top four. Not good.

[Mac76]

Yeh, I'm sorry but for me it seems like we are happy to plod along in the league now to focus solely on the CL. That's inexcusable IMO based on where we should be at at this stage of the process.


You're all being ridiculous IMO, we have quite a few players either injured or just coming back from injury, we've a chance to win the biggest trophy in international club football which we've never won before and you're arguing over the lineup for a home game v a mid-table side which we just have to draw to stay in a decent top five position.

I should be the one who's annoyed as i pay to go to the games, but I'm completely phlisophical about it and with one or two exceptions, mostly the inexplicable decision to start Martinelli when we could have played Sterling, I'm just relieved Arteta has learnt enough not to thrash all our key players into the ground, especially after his 'over my dead body' nonsense

I think he realises patience wil run thin soon and so he really needs to get the CL over the line if he can

If we can stay in the CL to the point where we can't fall out of the top five I hope and expect we're literally fielding the under-18s in every league game if that's what it takes - apart from anything else I would like to see academy players given more minutes here and there in case we've more MLSs or Sakas to unearth

[HCZ_Reborn]

I disagree with aspects of both points of view, I think Arteta is actually for once rotating probably the right amount. I think it’s clear Rice would have been rested if not for the injury sustained by White in training.

I think sacking off the league and playing under 18s would be just as much of a poor idea as playing a completely full strength team. I think Martinelli probably needs game time, and given he didn’t start against Everton I really don’t think it was that harmful to start him for both Real Madrid and Brentford. I’m simply not convinced the champions league can be treated as a seperate entity to the league. Plus I think Saka showed that there’s a balance that needs to be had, between making sure he’s not run into the ground again and giving him enough game time to build up his confidence and match fitness.

I think for what it’s worth, as I said on the match thread that having gone to the game myself that many fans were as you say philosophical….disappointed with the result but enjoyed the performance. I’m not sure that they’d have felt that way if we had played the kids and lost by several goals….plus that’s the kind of thing that can get you heavily fined by the FA or the premier league.

I’m certainly not saying this as an Arteta stan but in terms of who he’s putting out there, I think he’s probably got the balance right

[IBK]

I take all the points about rotation and our priorities lying elsewhere, but I felt disappointed by yet another draw on Saturday - having been deservedly in front - to an opposition that had only 2 shots on target and an Xg of....0.19. And we created less after MLS; Timber; Odegard and Saka came on than before.

For me Arteta was all over the place with his subs. There was no pressing reason to bring MLS, Odegard or Saka on, and I do not really understand why they weren't fully rested. Starting Partey in a physically demanding LB role when he has racked up more minutes recently than almost any other Arsenal player and he was so key against RM was a risk IMO, and I hope that his injury wasn't serious. While I understand more taking Rice off, he still played 75 mins, and Merino was expected to pick up playing in his place when he has been playing up front. It was as though Areta did not know whether to twist or stick, and his subs disrupted what had been a decent performance from most of the understudies - with the exception maybe of Nwaneri. For me there was no reason to leave us with 10 players by the end when Jorghino - one of our best players on the day - got injured.

Getting a bit sick of all these draws...but onto Wednesday we go.

I praised Arteta for his player management against Everton. Not so much on Saturday.

[Mac76]

For me Arteta was all over the place with his subs. There was no pressing reason to bring MLS, Odegard or Saka on, and I do not really understand why they weren't fully rested. Starting Partey in a physically demanding LB role when he has racked up more minutes recently than almost any other Arsenal player and he was so key against RM was a risk IMO, and I hope that his injury wasn't serious. While I understand more taking Rice off, he still played 75 mins, and Merino was expected to pick up playing in his place when he has been playing up front.

Part of the problem lies with Arteta's historial reluctance to widen the overall experience of the squad, hence in this type of scenario he can't turn to, for example, Kabia or Butler-Oyedeji instead of Saka et al because he wouldn't even give them minutes when we were 7 goals to the good against PSV, so if he wants to change a game he's stuck with the usual suspects.

But I'm surprised you complain at his bringing them on given you also express disappointment at not winning the game.

I didn't like Partey at RB (for it was there that he was played, not LB...) but we're slightly stuck for alternatives given the above plus injuries.

That's why for me it's playing Martinelli that stands out - we have an obvious alternative in Sterling yet he wasn't used to rest Martinelli, who instead nearly had his leg broken in what should have been a red-card tackle (and would no doubt have been if it had been the other way round).

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I disagree with aspects of both points of view, I think Arteta is actually for once rotating probably the right amount. I think it’s clear Rice would have been rested if not for the injury sustained by White in training.

I think sacking off the league and playing under 18s would be just as much of a poor idea as playing a completely full strength team. I think Martinelli probably needs game time, and given he didn’t start against Everton I really don’t think it was that harmful to start him for both Real Madrid and Brentford. I’m simply not convinced the champions league can be treated as a seperate entity to the league. Plus I think Saka showed that there’s a balance that needs to be had, between making sure he’s not run into the ground again and giving him enough game time to build up his confidence and match fitness.

I think for what it’s worth, as I said on the match thread that having gone to the game myself that many fans were as you say philosophical….disappointed with the result but enjoyed the performance. I’m not sure that they’d have felt that way if we had played the kids and lost by several goals….plus that’s the kind of thing that can get you heavily fined by the FA or the premier league.

I’m certainly not saying this as an Arteta stan but in terms of who he’s putting out there, I think he’s probably got the balance right

:gp:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I take all the points about rotation and our priorities lying elsewhere, but I felt disappointed by yet another draw on Saturday - having been deservedly in front - to an opposition that had only 2 shots on target and an Xg of....0.19. And we created less after MLS; Timber; Odegard and Saka came on than before.

For me Arteta was all over the place with his subs. There was no pressing reason to bring MLS, Odegard or Saka on, and I do not really understand why they weren't fully rested. Starting Partey in a physically demanding LB role when he has racked up more minutes recently than almost any other Arsenal player and he was so key against RM was a risk IMO, and I hope that his injury wasn't serious. While I understand more taking Rice off, he still played 75 mins, and Merino was expected to pick up playing in his place when he has been playing up front. It was as though Areta did not know whether to twist or stick, and his subs disrupted what had been a decent performance from most of the understudies - with the exception maybe of Nwaneri. For me there was no reason to leave us with 10 players by the end when Jorghino - one of our best players on the day - got injured.

Getting a bit sick of all these draws...but onto Wednesday we go.

I praised Arteta for his player management against Everton. Not so much on Saturday.

:gp:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Part of the problem lies with Arteta's historial reluctance to widen the overall experience of the squad, hence in this type of scenario he can't turn to, for example, Kabia or Butler-Oyedeji instead of Saka et al because he wouldn't even give them minutes when we were 7 goals to the good against PSV, so if he wants to change a game he's stuck with the usual suspects.

But I'm surprised you complain at his bringing them on given you also express disappointment at not winning the game.

I didn't like Partey at RB (for it was there that he was played, not LB...) but we're slightly stuck for alternatives given the above plus injuries.

That's why for me it's playing Martinelli that stands out - we have an obvious alternative in Sterling yet he wasn't used to rest Martinelli, who instead nearly had his leg broken in what should have been a red-card tackle (and would no doubt have been if it had been the other way round).

Martinelli needed the game time (though in hindsight it didn't improve him at all).

He is and has always been a confidence player. If you noticed against Real, he was hardly successful beating his man. However when he noticed this early on, he chose wisely to concentrate more on ball retention and trying to get into spaces when his marker was off. It was one of the most matured performances from him I'd ever seen.

I am guessing the plan was give him simpler opposition that he'd be able to beat and maybe even get a confidence goal, but playing him next to Trossard neutered that.

As for not taking the league seriously, most teams that win the CL still do well in their leagues. We can count on one hand in the last 3 decades teams that won the CL and decided to treat most of their league games with levity.

Its not an all or nothing as there is no guarantee that a fresh team, without a winning streak in their league will be confident enough to overcome adversity and win the top trophy. History shows us its usually the other way round.

[Letters]

I am thankful that CL qualification has been extended to five clubs. We have gone from title contenders to sweating on the other teams chasing us down to get top four. Not good.

Not really. We're 9 points ahead of 5th place. We've lost 3 games all season, it seems highly improbable we'll lose 3 more now.
The title has been gone since late Feb. The CL is still improbable but after the first leg feels slightly more plausible.
I don't think we will win the CL and this season will therefore be a disappointment, but given we are still in it it is absolutely right that we prioritise it.
I'm a bit frustrated we didn't win on Saturday but it honestly doesn't matter.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Not really. We're 9 points ahead of 5th place. We've lost 3 games all season, it seems highly improbable we'll lose 3 more now.
The title has been gone since late Feb. The CL is still improbable but after the first leg feels slightly more plausible.
I don't think we will win the CL and this season will therefore be a disappointment, but given we are still in it it is absolutely right that we prioritise it.
I'm a bit frustrated we didn't win on Saturday but it honestly doesn't matter.

I read today there was a 0.1% of you winning the league. Still too high for my liking :ninja:

[Letters]

Yeh, I'm sorry but for me it seems like we are happy to plod along in the league now to focus solely on the CL. That's inexcusable IMO based on where we should be at at this stage of the process. It's also not something I personally find acceptable, we should be able to manage some kind of show of strength in more than one competition.
Which would all be a fairly reasonable view if we were still in with a shout of the title.
But we aren't.
Maybe you think we should be which is an opinion I can get on board with, given the last couple of seasons. But the injuries this season have really (and literally) hobbled us.
And while I don't think there's any great anti-Arsenal conspiracy we have been completely fucked over by referees this season while Liverpool have been getting the rub of the green.
How many penalties is it for them now? 9?
Given the title was all but over before Feb was out and given we were still in the CL it was absolutely the right thing to prioritise the latter.
If we'd completely fallen apart and fallen out of the top 4 (as some feared we might) then I'd find that acceptable, but we haven't.
Let's just get this season over with now, it's been a slog. We have a big summer coming up, I think next season is Arteta's last chance to deliver a big trophy, unless we do somehow with the CL which seems unlikely but we should get to the semi-final and at that stage you have to believe we have some chance.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Which would all be a fairly reasonable view if we were still in with a shout of the title.
And while I don't think there's any great anti-Arsenal conspiracy we have been completely fucked over by referees this season while Liverpool have been getting the rub of the green.
How many penalties is it for them now? 9?


Last season you had 10. :shrug:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Letters post has me thinking.......

If we are able to pull off winning the CL this season (50-50 for me) and next season we ended up with another sub standard performance in the league and probably not advancing past the initial knockout stages in the CL (QF at best), with no other domestic trophies either... would we all be happy to take our unlikely CL win and insist Arteta stays?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Letters post has me thinking.......

If we are able to pull off winning the CL this season (50-50 for me) and next season we ended up with another sub standard performance in the league and probably not advancing past the initial knockout stages in the CL (QF at best), with no other domestic trophies either... would we all be happy to take our unlikely CL win and insist Arteta stays?

If we buy the attacking players we should get I don’t see any reason why we would have a poor season in the league, this season has clearly been defined by a lack of goals and I don’t see us as being deficient defensively.

But would winning the champions league give him the good will, yes quite probably. I don’t expect major trophies every season. But at the same time I’d have cause to wonder what the fuck went wrong

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

If we buy the attacking players we should get I don’t see any reason why we would have a poor season in the league, this season has clearly been defined by a lack of goals and I don’t see us as being deficient defensively.

But would winning the champions league give him the good will, yes quite probably. I don’t expect major trophies every season. But at the same time I’d have cause to wonder what the fuck went wrong

Probably agree....one shouldn't expect to win trophies every season.

Though if it ended up being a Newcastle or Villa that wins the league next season my opinion would be drastically different on cutting him some slack.

[Letters]

Last season you had 10. :shrug:

So?
Ok, so maybe things went for us last season.
They haven’t this year.
What’s your point, caller? Even you have admitted you’ve had some things go for you this year.

[Marc Overmars]

Letters post has me thinking.......

If we are able to pull off winning the CL this season (50-50 for me) and next season we ended up with another sub standard performance in the league and probably not advancing past the initial knockout stages in the CL (QF at best), with no other domestic trophies either... would we all be happy to take our unlikely CL win and insist Arteta stays?

Of course the coach who delivers our first ever CL win would deserve every opportunity to get it right in the league. It wouldn’t just be a Di Matteo fluked win either, it would be a lot more meaningful given the work done to take us out of the gutter to this point now where we can talk about possibly achieving meaningful things.

[Letters]

Of course the coach who delivers our first ever CL win would deserve every opportunity to get it right in the league. It wouldn’t just be a Di Matteo fluked win either, it would be a lot more meaningful given the work done to take us out of the gutter to this point now where we can talk about possibly achieving meaningful things.

Well also, this wouldn't be a Ten Hag situation for 2 reasons. Firstly the CL is a much, much bigger prize than the FA Cup. Secondly as disappointing as our league season has been by the standards we have set for ourselves, we're still pretty likely to finish 2nd. Certainly Top 4. It's not the utter mess Ten Hag oversaw last season before they stumbled to the FA Cup. And even then remember they let a 3-0 lead vs Coventry slip and were a VAR call away from exit and humiliation.


All this said, this is all supposing we win the CL which I am still finding it hard to believe we will. Which will render this a disappointing and frustrating season. Next season feels like last chance saloon for Arteta.

[Mac76]

I’m not sure that they’d have felt that way if we had played the kids and lost by several goals….plus that’s the kind of thing that can get you heavily fined by the FA or the premier league.


Oh cut the faux sensibility will you, we all know what someone means when they say play the kids, I don't literally mean play the under-18s (or not all of them anyway :lol:) and I've already said my main issue is his playing Martinelli

[Mac76]

Which would all be a fairly reasonable view if we were still in with a shout of the title.
But we aren't.
Maybe you think we should be which is an opinion I can get on board with, given the last couple of seasons. But the injuries this season have really (and literally) hobbled us.
And while I don't think there's any great anti-Arsenal conspiracy we have been completely fucked over by referees this season while Liverpool have been getting the rub of the green.
How many penalties is it for them now? 9?
Given the title was all but over before Feb was out and given we were still in the CL it was absolutely the right thing to prioritise the latter.
If we'd completely fallen apart and fallen out of the top 4 (as some feared we might) then I'd find that acceptable, but we haven't.
Let's just get this season over with now, it's been a slog. We have a big summer coming up, I think next season is Arteta's last chance to deliver a big trophy, unless we do somehow with the CL which seems unlikely but we should get to the semi-final and at that stage you have to believe we have some chance.

:gp:

[IBK]

Part of the problem lies with Arteta's historial reluctance to widen the overall experience of the squad, hence in this type of scenario he can't turn to, for example, Kabia or Butler-Oyedeji instead of Saka et al because he wouldn't even give them minutes when we were 7 goals to the good against PSV, so if he wants to change a game he's stuck with the usual suspects.

But I'm surprised you complain at his bringing them on given you also express disappointment at not winning the game.

I didn't like Partey at RB (for it was there that he was played, not LB...) but we're slightly stuck for alternatives given the above plus injuries.

That's why for me it's playing Martinelli that stands out - we have an obvious alternative in Sterling yet he wasn't used to rest Martinelli, who instead nearly had his leg broken in what should have been a red-card tackle (and would no doubt have been if it had been the other way round).

My point about Partey (yes - at RB sorry) was that it was a risk rather than anything else. Not going to be over critical of Arteta's decision to start him given our lack of options here, and the fact that he scored our only goal.

My disappointment at the result derives from the fact that we were playing fine with our starters, and the multiple subs disrupted the team's rhythm. Also for me it seemed as though even with the subs we were playing (understandably perhaps) more with a mind on tomorrow's game and not fully committed to getting the win, so better to have rested MLS, Odegard and Saka. Plus the fact that we didn't defend particularly well for Brentford's goal.

Agreed re Martinelli though. We are fortunate that he wasn't injured badly.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Oh cut the faux sensibility will you, we all know what someone means when they say play the kids, I don't literally mean play the under-18s (or not all of them anyway :lol:) and I've already said my main issue is his playing Martinelli

Except you actually said “literally play the under 18s”

There wasn’t anything that said afterwards I’m using the word literally as hyperbole. Let’s be fair none of us on here are completely avoidant of staking out extreme positions, so it’s not always easy to know when to take people at their word or not.


Either way it’s fair to say you would be willing to go further than myself and probably others on here in terms of rotation for league matches. Fine that’s your opinion, just not one I agree with

[HCZ_Reborn]

My point about Partey (yes - at RB sorry) was that it was a risk rather than anything else. Not going to be over critical of Arteta's decision to start him given our lack of options here, and the fact that he scored our only goal.

My disappointment at the result derives from the fact that we were playing fine with our starters, and the multiple subs disrupted the team's rhythm. Also for me it seemed as though even with the subs we were playing (understandably perhaps) more with a mind on tomorrow's game and not fully committed to getting the win, so better to have rested MLS, Odegard and Saka. Plus the fact that we didn't defend particularly well for Brentford's goal.

Agreed re Martinelli though. We are fortunate that he wasn't injured badly.

I agree with you about the timing of the substitutions, I foolishly thought bringing on the first team players would sure things up but it did just disrupt things when to that point our play had been decent.


As for Partey at right back, well I don’t think anyone is in any doubt about how I feel about him playing there. But I think him playing there as well as Rice playing full stop was due to White picking up a knock in training, and given Timber also needed resting after midweek it seemed to me anyway as being a result of restricted choice

[Mac76]

My point about Partey (yes - at RB sorry) was that it was a risk rather than anything else. Not going to be over critical of Arteta's decision to start him given our lack of options here, and the fact that he scored our only goal.

My disappointment at the result derives from the fact that we were playing fine with our starters, and the multiple subs disrupted the team's rhythm. Also for me it seemed as though even with the subs we were playing (understandably perhaps) more with a mind on tomorrow's game and not fully committed to getting the win, so better to have rested MLS, Odegard and Saka. Plus the fact that we didn't defend particularly well for Brentford's goal.

Agreed re Martinelli though. We are fortunate that he wasn't injured badly.

TBH there's an argument that says, particularly in Saka's case, that he needs some minutes to get back to his best and I've some sympathy for that, despite being at the front of the queue of those saying that in general Arteta overplays him

Clearly the subs were lined up when we were 0-0 and he was bringing them on to get the breakthrough, but not for the first time this season (Brighton) he just carried on with planned subs even though the game state had changed.

As for Partey, I agree and thinking about it there was a lad called Josh Nicholls who played at RB pre-season and was, I thought, very good, maybe not quite as much as MLS but then that's an unfair comparison given how he's taken to first-team football like a duck to water

However Arteta's duly left him out all season, hence no minutes, hence him not being an option when he'd have been useful - so frustrating, I really get annoyed that Arteta doesn't bring younger players on more - if I was a manager I'd be rotating and using different combinations all the time and giving younger players minutes whenever I could, it's the only way to know what they can do

[IBK]

TBH there's an argument that says, particularly in Saka's case, that he needs some minutes to get back to his best and I've some sympathy for that, despite being at the front of the queue of those saying that in general Arteta overplays him

Clearly the subs were lined up when we were 0-0 and he was bringing them on to get the breakthrough, but not for the first time this season (Brighton) he just carried on with planned subs even though the game state had changed.

As for Partey, I agree and thinking about it there was a lad called Josh Nicholls who played at RB pre-season and was, I thought, very good, maybe not quite as much as MLS but then that's an unfair comparison given how he's taken to first-team football like a duck to water

However Arteta's duly left him out all season, hence no minutes, hence him not being an option when he'd have been useful - so frustrating, I really get annoyed that Arteta doesn't bring younger players on more - if I was a manager I'd be rotating and using different combinations all the time and giving younger players minutes whenever I could, it's the only way to know what they can do

Nailed that reply Mate.

Good point re Saka, and yes I understand Arteta wanting him to try to regain a little match sharpness (that is clearly a bit lacking - hence his missed big goal opportunity). your highlighted line encapsulates Arteta's error nicely.

..And I agree with your point re Josh Nicholls too - albeit that Arteta will point to Partey's goal.

[IBK]

I agree with you about the timing of the substitutions, I foolishly thought bringing on the first team players would sure things up but it did just disrupt things when to that point our play had been decent.


As for Partey at right back, well I don’t think anyone is in any doubt about how I feel about him playing there. But I think him playing there as well as Rice playing full stop was due to White picking up a knock in training, and given Timber also needed resting after midweek it seemed to me anyway as being a result of restricted choice

Yep - Hobson's choice re Partey, I guess. Praying that he is OK for tomorrow.

[Mac76]

Nailed that reply Mate.

Good point re Saka, and yes I understand Arteta wanting him to try to regain a little match sharpness (that is clearly a bit lacking - hence his missed big goal opportunity). your highlighted line encapsulates Arteta's error nicely.

..And I agree with your point re Josh Nicholls too - albeit that Arteta will point to Partey's goal.

:good:

[Chippy]

Not really. We're 9 points ahead of 5th place. We've lost 3 games all season, it seems highly improbable we'll lose 3 more now.
The title has been gone since late Feb. The CL is still improbable but after the first leg feels slightly more plausible.
I don't think we will win the CL and this season will therefore be a disappointment, but given we are still in it it is absolutely right that we prioritise it.
I'm a bit frustrated we didn't win on Saturday but it honestly doesn't matter.

Maybe, but as I am the worlds biggest pessimist, I just want to secure CL football for next season :unsure:

[Chippy]

Well also, this wouldn't be a Ten Hag situation for 2 reasons. Firstly the CL is a much, much bigger prize than the FA Cup. Secondly as disappointing as our league season has been by the standards we have set for ourselves, we're still pretty likely to finish 2nd. Certainly Top 4. It's not the utter mess Ten Hag oversaw last season before they stumbled to the FA Cup. And even then remember they let a 3-0 lead vs Coventry slip and were a VAR call away from exit and humiliation.


All this said, this is all supposing we win the CL which I am still finding it hard to believe we will. Which will render this a disappointing and frustrating season. Next season feels like last chance saloon for Arteta.

I also find it hard to believe that we will win the CL because we all dream about it, especially after the disappointment of 2005. Imagine, Champions of Europe!

[Mac76]

I also find it hard to believe that we will win the CL because we all dream about it, especially after the disappointment of 2005. Imagine, Champions of Europe!

That's no reason not to believe mate, keep the faith :cool:

[Chippy]

That's no reason not to believe mate, keep the faith :cool:

:pray::pray: