Mikel Arteta Thread

[GP]

Arteta has been outstanding. Fantastic signing.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Arteta has been outstanding. Fantastic signing.


But he didnt score 40 goals and assist 20 others in the few minutes he was on so must be shit

[GP]

But he didnt score 40 goals and assist 20 others in the few minutes he was on so must be shit

Ah, of course :doh:

[Olivier's xmas twist]

But he didnt score 40 goals and assist 20 others in the few minutes he was on so must be shit

:haha:

[Cripps_orig]

But he didnt score 40 goals and assist 20 others in the few minutes he was on so must be shit

Few minutes he was on?

He played the whole game

Ollie :haha:

[Cripps_orig]

Ollie never said that.

Never said he said that

[Xhaka Can’t]

Arteta has been outstanding. Fantastic signing.

Right from day one and all the way through including yesterday. He has one of the best attitudes and work ethics in the game today.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Never said he said that

Never said you said he said that.

[Cripps_orig]

:gp: Arteta, is a beast in that Dm role. As long as he keeps doing what he is doing we will be ok. Leave the Creatvity to the likes or Santi and Jack etc.

Jack is dead

Santi cant do it on his own

Arteta needs to do his bit

[Power n Glory]

He doesnt have to do what Song did ie run upfront at every opportunity

Just play the ball forward more often, speed up our attack

:doh:

That's what annoys me about him sometimes. When playing that deep, I don't think he realises that he sometimes has time to turn to play the ball forward. The short passing backwards and sideways can put others under pressure. But saying that, he's no slouch and when on his game he goes in for the mean tackle.

[fakeyank]

Arteta is god :bow:

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Jack is dead

Santi cant do it on his own

Arteta needs to do his bit

Jack will be back, we also have AOC who gives us creativity and diaby.

[Dennis Bendtner]

Wenger did very well with Arteta given the haste and lateness of the deal. Clearly, he was nothing like top of the list last year. But he's done very well on a few occasions altering the player's role and getting the best from them. Arteta doesn't have the passing range or dexterity in tight areas. What he does do is what the few Denilson apologists claimed he did. Good on the ball and disciplined. Basically, he knows how to play football. I could see in some games with Wilshere available, Arteta sitting out. That wouldn't be many though. Of course he does have his limitations. In the circumstances, very good signing.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Jack will be back, we also have AOC who gives us creativity and diaby.

jack has never played with arteta, chamberlain or cazorla.

thats frightening. imagine our midfield when he's back.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

jack has never played with arteta, chamberlain or cazorla.

thats frightening. imagine our midfield when he's back.

Yes we will have a wonderful midfield when he is back.

[milla]

Yes we will have a wonderful midfield when he is back.

And Diaby can play in midfield too. :coffee:

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Mikel Arteta should be captain, not Vermaelen who I think is getting away with alot of poor decisions and performances because he is captain and when you put him together with Kos it's even worse.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

i like tommy as captain. i like his aggression and presence. he's one of a few who actually shows a bit of passion when we concede a goal unlike that oaf koscielny who puts his head down and trudges back to the halfway line.

[Cripps_orig]

Mikel Arteta will consider a move into management when his playing days are over - even though he believes the job is more stressful than ever.

The midfielder has been a revelation since joining Arsenal last year and was recently appointed vice-captain by Arsène Wenger. At 30, Arteta has a number of years left on the pitch but his cerebral approach to his sport augurs well should he eventually swap the midfield for the technical area.

The Spaniard admits he has thought about his long-term future but he is wary of the pressure on modern-day managers.

"I don’t know [if I will be a manager], it’s a big thing nowadays because it’s really demanding," Arteta told Arsenal.com.

"I think the job has changed a lot in the last few years - you can see the stress and the responsibility managers have. Sometimes people don’t recognise that. To manage a group of players nowadays with 10 or 15 different countries involved with different personalities is a difficult thing to do.

"I have thought about it a lot and we will see what happens one day. It’s still early for that [decision]. Obviously you’re starting to get a few things from different managers and players and a key thing is they can help.

"Sometimes on the pitch as well you think about things that can be done better or in a different way, or how you play depending on if you’re winning and drawing and what the team needs to do."

Arteta worked under David Moyes at Everton and has also thrived with Wenger. The Spaniard's tactical awareness is one of his strengths but he believes that man-management is just as important in the top job.

"If you have 24 players, every one is different," he said. "One of the biggest mistakes I’ve seen is when you treat everyone the same. People say ‘everyone has to be the same’ - they have to be the same in certain roles, but everyone is different.

"The way you approach someone is very important. If you shout at someone, it depends on their character - you may kill him for the next 45 minutes.

"Sometimes you need to pinch someone because you know he has the character. He can involve the rest if he pushes and raises his level in the game. You have to recognise those characters and I think that’s a very difficult part of football management."

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/arteta-i-will-consider-management-one-day

Might as well give him a go. Cant be any worse

[Japan Shaking All Over]

Jack will be back, we also have AOC who gives us creativity and diaby.

Love the the after thought way Diaby is mentioned there. . . .shamful the way illegitimate sprogs are treated on here :sulk:

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Love the the after thought way Diaby is mentioned there. . . .shamful the way illegitimate sprogs are treated on here :sulk:
:lol:

[Kyle?]

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/arteta-i-will-consider-management-one-day

Might as well give him a go. Cant be any worse

I reckon he'd be pretty good at it actually.

[Joker]

http://arseblog.com/2012/12/arsenal-need-to-rediscover-their-sense-of-fun/

Apparently only 21.5% of Arteta's passes have been forward this season. This is one of the reasons we should bring Rosicky back in, to give us more drive and urgency in midfield.

[Kano]

they play different positions. the only way that stat makes any sense is in direct comparison to others that sit in front of their defence. he has not been good enough this season but it takes more than that stat to figure out the problem.

[Marc Overmars]

My problem is not his passing in particular but how he's easily marked out games now, he's not a natural in this position and it's starting to show. He needs time and space to pass but he's not nimble enough to think on his feet.

This is why it was suicide to let Song go and not buy a replacement, he was a key part of making the midfield work but also managed to do the dirty work as well.

[GP]

My problem is not his passing in particular but how he's easily marked out games now, he's not a natural in this position and it's starting to show. He needs time and space to pass but he's not nimble enough to think on his feet.

This is why it was suicide to let Song go and not buy a replacement, he was a key part of making the midfield work but also managed to do the dirty work as well.

At our best (especially with Fabregas and Nasri) he would have flourished because there were always intelligent players on the same wavelength making themselves available for passes. He's not getting that right now, which is why we struggle to get any kind of possesion for long periods.

the midfield is broke, but not because of individual players. the ones we have are excellent, just not compatible.

[LDG]

At our best (especially with Fabregas and Nasri) he would have flourished because there were always intelligent players on the same wavelength making themselves available for passes. He's not getting that right now, which is why we struggle to get any kind of possesion for long periods.

the midfield is broke, but not because of individual players. the ones we have are excellent, just not compatible.

Yup.

The way we set up is to accomodate Diaby or Rosicky, both of whom are little bit broken.

Jack is not the ball carrier we need, though he'll try his best. He'll be the one who does Arteta's job eventually, dictating the play and doing the dirty work.

[Power n Glory]

My problem is not his passing in particular but how he's easily marked out games now, he's not a natural in this position and it's starting to show. He needs time and space to pass but he's not nimble enough to think on his feet.

This is why it was suicide to let Song go and not buy a replacement, he was a key part of making the midfield work but also managed to do the dirty work as well.

Agree with that. Because he's easy to mark he's being forced to play the ball backwards. The stats and what we're seeing on the pitch relate. Unlike Song, Diaby,Cesc, Rosicky.. he's the type of player that needs a lot of space to play beause he can't play on the half turn when under pressure. If he's tightly marked he'll point away so someone doesn't pass to him or recieve the ball and then pass it back to the orginal passer, a backwards or sideways pass. He's part of the problem and Wenger needs to addres that. Teams are pressing the middle and wide players like Podoslki tend to drift in and not carry the ball down the wide channels even if free and that's where most of the space should be if we're being pressed down the centre. It's a real mess and we have no cohesion.

[LDG]

Agree with that. Because he's easy to mark he's being forced to play the ball backwards. The stats and what we're seeing on the pitch relate. Unlike Song, Diaby,Cesc, Rosicky.. he's the type of player that needs a lot of space to play beause he can't play on the half turn when under pressure. If he's tightly marked he'll point away so someone doesn't pass to him or recieve the ball and then pass it back to the orginal passer, a backwards or sideways pass. He's part of the problem and Wenger needs to addres that. Teams are pressing the middle and wide players like Podoslki tend to drift in and not carry the ball down the wide channels even if free and that's where most of the space should be if we're being pressed down the centre. It's a real mess and we have no cohesion.

I get what you're saying, but Diaby, Cesc and Rosicky never played the role that Arteta is currently playing for us. Diaby was abismal as the player to sit back.

Song looked better, but why? For me it was because last year, Arteta and Song were interchangeable. When Song went forward, Arteta stayed back.

He may not be producing in an attacking sense, but he's the most diciplined we have there, and has saved our arses a few times this year, even if he has let some past him. Now that Song has pissed off, there is nobody who is interchangeable. He's all we have. And as Rosicky and Diaby have been out, Jack has had to slot in as the ball carrier.

The problem we have is the link player who carries the ball forward. Hopefully Rosicky can do it for a few games before falling over again, but that's where we need to invest money. Not replacing Arteta.

[Power n Glory]

I get what you're saying, but Diaby, Cesc and Rosicky never played the role that Arteta is currently playing for us. Diaby was abismal as the player to sit back.

Song looked better, but why? For me it was because last year, Arteta and Song were interchangeable. When Song went forward, Arteta stayed back.

He may not be producing in an attacking sense, but he's the most diciplined we have there, and has saved our arses a few times this year, even if he has let some past him. Now that Song has pissed off, there is nobody who is interchangeable. He's all we have. And as Rosicky and Diaby have been out, Jack has had to slot in as the ball carrier.

The problem we have is the link player who carries the ball forward. Hopefully Rosicky can do it for a few games before falling over again, but that's where we need to invest money. Not replacing Arteta.

It's not so much the defence part and sitting back I'm referring to, just taking on the responsibility to take the ball from defence and play it forward like how Vieria used to do. Cesc was great at doing it when playing a 4-4-2 with Gilberto, Diaby and Rosicky play box to box and are more mobile but Diaby player a disciplined game against Liverpool and I've also seen him do that when paired with Song or Denilson in the past.

I don't think it's so much about the role but more about the player and Arteta just can't play on the half turn. Wilshere played the deep role once and he was great at taking on the responsibility and keeping the ball moving even when under pressure as seen when playing against Barca. Arteta just can't play that way.

[LDG]

It's not so much the defence part and sitting back I'm referring to, just taking on the responsibility to take the ball from defence and play it forward like how Vieria used to do. Cesc was great at doing it when playing a 4-4-2 with Gilberto, Diaby and Rosicky play box to box and are more mobile but Diaby player a disciplined game against Liverpool and I've also seen him do that when paired with Song or Denilson in the past.

I don't think it's so much about the role but more about the player and Arteta just can't play on the half turn. Wilshere played the deep role once and he was great at taking on the responsibility and keeping the ball moving even when under pressure as seen when playing against Barca. Arteta just can't play that way.

I just don't know anymore. You're right about playing on the half turn. Deffo.

On the one hand I want to stick up for him, as I think he's done a sterling job for us over the last year or so. Certainly last season, and early doors this.

But when all is said and done. Is he good enough? I think he's an intellegent player. But is he quick enough, especially when the "out ball" is being cut off.

From what I've seen just recently, nobody has been showing for the ball. There is no movement in the team. Nothing. And it's very hard for a player to play out from the back, when the rest of the team don't work hard enough for you, or (as is the case with "some" players) are just plain shit.

We relied on RVP last year as the "get out of jail free card". The magic player who could change a game himself. Unfortunately, we now have to rely on the team, playing as a team. And when components of that team don't work, the team breaks down. And much as I give props to Arteta, he's no RVP / Cesc / World Class Player.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Arteta awful sideways passer. :lol:

[Kano]

I get what you're saying, but Diaby, Cesc and Rosicky never played the role that Arteta is currently playing for us. Diaby was abismal as the player to sit back.

Song looked better, but why? For me it was because last year, Arteta and Song were interchangeable. When Song went forward, Arteta stayed back.

He may not be producing in an attacking sense, but he's the most diciplined we have there, and has saved our arses a few times this year, even if he has let some past him. Now that Song has pissed off, there is nobody who is interchangeable. He's all we have. And as Rosicky and Diaby have been out, Jack has had to slot in as the ball carrier.

The problem we have is the link player who carries the ball forward. Hopefully Rosicky can do it for a few games before falling over again, but that's where we need to invest money. Not replacing Arteta.
moutinho. shame he costs so f much

[Özim]

Arteta is waste as a DM, he's a creative player and was a decent one at Everton, I don't understand using him in that role it totally nullifies his strengths.

[Gervinho's Forehead]

Arteta is waste as a DM, he's a creative player and was a decent one at Everton, I don't understand using him in that role it totally nullifies his strengths.

You know who our manager is right?

[Olivier's xmas twist]

moutinho. shame AVB is buying him in jan

:gp:

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Arteta is waste as a DM, he's a creative player and was a decent one at Everton, I don't understand using him in that role it totally nullifies his strengths.

Time for M'Vila tbh.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

You know who our manager is right?

Well i did, not sure who this guy Claming to be Wenger is tbh.

[Power n Glory]

I just don't know anymore. You're right about playing on the half turn. Deffo.

On the one hand I want to stick up for him, as I think he's done a sterling job for us over the last year or so. Certainly last season, and early doors this.

But when all is said and done. Is he good enough? I think he's an intellegent player. But is he quick enough, especially when the "out ball" is being cut off.

From what I've seen just recently, nobody has been showing for the ball. There is no movement in the team. Nothing. And it's very hard for a player to play out from the back, when the rest of the team don't work hard enough for you, or (as is the case with "some" players) are just plain shit.

We relied on RVP last year as the "get out of jail free card". The magic player who could change a game himself. Unfortunately, we now have to rely on the team, playing as a team. And when components of that team don't work, the team breaks down. And much as I give props to Arteta, he's no RVP / Cesc / World Class Player.

Agree, I don't think it's just one individual player that's the problem. All three midfield players are struggling and we only get width from Walcott because Pod does nothing but it won't take long for teams to figure out they need to double up on Walcott to stop him and then out wing play suffers.

It's a huge mess. If Rosicky plays again, maybe we'll see a difference.

[Japan Shaking All Over]

Well i did, not sure who this guy Claming to be Wenger is tbh.

:lol:

[Master Splinter]

Mikel Arteta bagged himself two penalties today and the Arsenal midfielder is now the second-highest Spanish goalscorer in Premier League history.

Arteta has now hit 36 goals in the division, one ahead of former Gunners skipper Cesc Fabregas. The top scorer is of course Fernando Torres, who moved on to 78 with a brace today.

Arteta :bow:.

Lampregas :haha:.

[Syn]

Fran Merida :haha:

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Mata :haha:

[milla]

Almunia :coffee:

[GP]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sF-rv6Hoc4&feature=player_embedded

Love him. He's been a revelation in the deeper role. One of our best, most consistent performers.

[LDG]

Tets :bow:

People who don't rate him :doh:

[GP]

Tets :bow:

People who don't rate him :doh:

Pretty much. It shows a basic lack of understanding.

Artekkers :bow:

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Seems they don't rate him in Spain either.

Was quite surprised not to see him in Spain's B team against Tahiti yesterday (or was I?).

[Cripps_orig]

Seems they don't rate him in Spain either.

Was quite surprised not to see him in Spain's B team against Tahiti yesterday (or was I?).
He's not very good

[Joker]

He's a decent player but when he's in the team the onus on creating chances is very much on the other 2 central midfielders, which isn't necessarily a problem as long as they're in form. However, when for example Cazorla and/or Wilshere are not doing it, he struggles to provide the impetus we need. Also I think he's too conservative with his passing sometimes, and slows the game down by perhaps missing openings that other more creative deep midfielders like Pirlo would take advantage of. I'm not saying he's a bad player, but IMO we can do better in that position.

[Niall_Quinn]

He

is

being

played

out

of

position...

That means...

The position

where

he

normally

plays

is

not

where

Wenger

is

playing

him...

Or put another way...

The board are a bunch of ****s.

[GP]

He's a decent player but when he's in the team the onus on creating chances is very much on the other 2 central midfielders,

Isn't that always the way?

No one expected Gilberto to be creative. Arteta is doing a similar job.

He's been pretty great tbh.

[Niall_Quinn]

Isn't that always the way?

No one expected Gilberto to be creative. Arteta is doing a similar job.

He's been pretty great tbh.

Chesney has no goals all season, so what's your point?

[GP]

Chesney has no goals all season, so what's your point?

Not true, he's been responsible for loads.

[Niall_Quinn]

Not true, he's been responsible for loads.

Those aren't goals, they are assists.

[GP]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BNrWaSMCcAAiG4m.jpg

Terrific player :bow:

[LDG]

:gp:

[V-Pig]

Love how he beats Carrick in literally every category they list.

[Kano]

he's doing ok in his role, which is not his natural position but it is an area we could definitely improve on.

[Power n Glory]

Don't take it to heart. Ramsey is on that list too.

[GP]

Love how he beats Carrick in literally every category they list.

Yeah he's really been fantastic.

[LDG]

he's doing ok in his role, which is not his natural position but it is an area we could definitely improve on.

Not trying to nit-pick at all here....but who do you think would be better at the role?

Quite clearly there are more talented players out there, but in that role, and with the game we play? There can only be a handful of players able to sustain that level of consistency accross a whole season.....

We're talking about a position where the player has to be pretty exceptional. It demands touch, eye for a pass (long, short, sideways, forwards), ability to read the game, tackle, set the tempo, workrate.....it is the hardest position on the pitch to play.

[GP]

Not trying to nit-pick at all here....but who do you think would be better at the role?

Quite clearly there are more talented players out there, but in that role, and with the game we play? There can only be a handful of players able to sustain that level of consistency accross a whole season.....

We're talking about a position where the player has to be pretty exceptional. It demands touch, eye for a pass (long, short, sideways, forwards), ability to read the game, tackle, set the tempo, workrate.....it is the hardest position on the pitch to play.

Yeah but he's not racking up 200 assists so he must be shit.

[Kano]

Not trying to nit-pick at all here....but who do you think would be better at the role?

Quite clearly there are more talented players out there, but in that role, and with the game we play? There can only be a handful of players able to sustain that level of consistency accross a whole season.....

We're talking about a position where the player has to be pretty exceptional. It demands touch, eye for a pass (long, short, sideways, forwards), ability to read the game, tackle, set the tempo, workrate.....it is the hardest position on the pitch to play.
i'm not so sure because on that basis, we would struggle to ever replace him. for me he does a 'job' in that role and in most cases does it pretty well but we definitely lack a bit more muscle there. now that doesn't mean some sort of 10ft mythical beast that a lot of people seem to think is the atypical deep lying player but someone with a better engine and who doesn't always go for the safe option (which i think is because mikel is not completely comfortable playing there, so we lose some of that dynamic drive from the back at times).

there have been times when the balance with jack/ramz/carz has been completely off and our midfield has looked at a complete loss as to what to do next. arteta is a good player, even at AM he is good. but is good, 'good' enough if we want this team/squad to evolve. i wouldn't say he is right at the top of the list right now in terms of people to remove but if we were serious (which i'm not convinced of) about doing more than fourth, then we should be looking to upgrade on a more specialised, box-to-box player from deep.

[Marc Overmars]

El Statinho.

[Özim]

Prefer him in an attacking role which is what he's best at, the position he's played in should be reserved for someone who's natural position it is, IMO someone more physical and powerful.

He's totally wasted in that role.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

:lol: arteta.

people who believe he's good are clearly thickos that read The Sun.

[GP]

yoghurt/10

[Joker]

I don't think he's a bad player but Tuffnutz is right in saying that ideally, we'd get a more mobile player in there who is better at closing down the opposition, making interceptions and in general dictating the tempo of our game more. Arteta doesn't really do that, he's a neat and tidy passer but he fails to really set the tone for us. Maybe you can counter that by saying that should be Wilshere's responsibility, but when he's not available we need others to step up to the plate.

[LDG]

I don't think he's a bad player but Tuffnutz is right in saying that ideally, we'd get a more mobile player in there who is better at closing down the opposition, making interceptions and in general dictating the tempo of our game more. Arteta doesn't really do that, he's a neat and tidy passer but he fails to really set the tone for us. Maybe you can counter that by saying that should be Wilshere's responsibility, but when he's not available we need others to step up to the plate.

I think if you bring in the type of player both you and Terry say, then we change our style of play completely.

Incidentally, I happen to prefer that style too, but I'm assuming we're going to be set up to play the style Wenget seems to prefer nowadays....

[GP]

I can't really think of any DMs who do that.

Where he used to play, or how some think he should play isn't relevant. The only thing that's relevant is the position he's playing for us now, and he's been outstanding in the role.

[Syn]

In a more grown up gooner forum I read, you won't believe the praise that Arteta and Ramsey get. I don't think anyone is under any illusions on that side; Arteta is not a world class player, he's too slow to cover enough ground and although he's excellent at reading the game and making interceptions, he's not quite Gilberto level either. He has however been the main reason for our improved defensive record because he's the most selfless player on our side; his job has been to clean up everyone else's mess, take a booking, cover their positions while Cazorla, Wilshere, Ramsey, Gibbs have little idea how to limit opposition attacks.

We have been relying on him too much and I'd love to see a more athletic player with arteta's attitude and discipline to shut down opponents. Ramsey has done very well in the last 10-15 games too but again even with him we're lacking some physical presence in the centre. I'm not sure Fellaini's the answer. Seems to be another jack of all trades type. Rather spend the big money on a specialist DM that ticks all the boxes required. Need a Flamini type of player as the holding mid. Wouldn't mind cayabe.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Arteta. :haha:

We've really lost hope; consigned to mediocrity and averageness.

[GP]

Arteta. :haha:

We've really lost hope; consigned to mediocrity and averageness.

Yeah but enough about your posts and face haha lol

[Özil's Panoramic View]

In a more grown up gooner forum I read, you won't believe the praise that Arteta and Ramsey get. I don't think anyone is under any illusions on that side; Arteta is not a world class player, he's too slow to cover enough ground and although he's excellent at reading the game and making interceptions, he's not quite Gilberto level either. He has however been the main reason for our improved defensive record because he's the most selfless player on our side; his job has been to clean up everyone else's mess, take a booking, cover their positions while Cazorla, Wilshere, Ramsey, Gibbs have little idea how to limit opposition attacks.

We have been relying on him too much and I'd love to see a more athletic player with arteta's attitude and discipline to shut down opponents. Ramsey has done very well in the last 10-15 games too but again even with him we're lacking some physical presence in the centre. I'm not sure Fellaini's the answer. Seems to be another jack of all trades type. Rather spend the big money on a specialist DM that ticks all the boxes required. Need a Flamini type of player as the holding mid. Wouldn't mind cayabe.

Most Definitely....

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Yeah but enough about your posts and face haha lol

Arteta/10.

[GP]

Thanks.

[Fist of Lehmann]

In a more grown up gooner forum I read, you won't believe the praise that Arteta and Ramsey get.

I've never heard anything but praise for Arteta from media pundits and analysts too.

But irregardless of which side of the fence you fall, the side that rates him or the side where all the mongs live, the fact is that his old knee injury and age are catching up with him. Succession planning needs to begin this summer if possible.

Gonalons and Illarramendi I reckon are unlikely and I would not be surprised if another leftfield solution happened here.

[Özil's Panoramic View]

I've never heard anything but praise for Arteta from media pundits and analysts too.

But irregardless of which side of the fence you fall, the side that rates him or the side where all the mongs live, the fact is that his old knee injury and age are catching up with him. Succession planning needs to begin this summer if possible.

Gonalons and Illarramendi I reckon are unlikely and I would not be surprised if another leftfield solution happened here.

:haha:

Oh sweet irony.

[Niall_Quinn]

:haha:

Oh sweet irony.

mong face

[Letters]

There's no-one better
Than Mikel Arteta

</thread>

[Niall_Quinn]

There's no-one better
Than Mikel Arteta

</thread>

mong face

[GP]

There's no-one better
Than Mikel Arteta

</thread>

:gp:

Artekkers :bow:

[Cripps_orig]

El Statinho.

Exactly

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Arteta. :haha:

We've really lost hope; consigned to mediocrity and averageness.

best post in here tbh

[McNamara That Ghost...]

:haha:

Oh sweet irony.

Irregardless is a word, just not commonly used. :doh:

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Irregardless is a word, just not commonly used. :doh:

:lol:

Ok.

[V-Pig]

Irregardless is a word, just not commonly used. :doh:

In fairness, it's not commonly used because it's commonly assumed to be wrong, seeing as it's a mispronunciation/bastardisation of "irrespective" or "regardless". However, I agree with that original poster's point so I'm gonna say he can use which ever words he likes.

[Power n Glory]

Not trying to nit-pick at all here....but who do you think would be better at the role?

Quite clearly there are more talented players out there, but in that role, and with the game we play? There can only be a handful of players able to sustain that level of consistency accross a whole season.....

We're talking about a position where the player has to be pretty exceptional. It demands touch, eye for a pass (long, short, sideways, forwards), ability to read the game, tackle, set the tempo, workrate.....it is the hardest position on the pitch to play.

I thought Song was exceptional when he sat back and kept it simple. Diaby has had some decent games playing deep as well. I remember a few where he and Song were just dominant in the middle but obviously that combo would never last. It’s not an expensive problem especially if we’ve been able to play Arteta back there. It’s not his natural role. At the moment, we’re really light in the middle and rarely boss the park like we used to with our passing. Nobody in the middle is setting the tempo. Rosicky is the only player that seems to be able to do it and when he’s on his game, will work his socks off to close down an opponent. It’s not all down to Arteta but something has to change in the middle next season. Either a dramatic personal improvement or we look to the transfer window to solve the problem. For me, Arteta, Ramsey and Wilshere will have to push on next season.

[Cripps_orig]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5015443/Mikel-Arteta-Arsenal-must-spend-big-its-such-an-exciting-time.html

[Ollie the Optimist]

spoken like a true captain

Arteta :bow:
Arteta's hair :bow:

[GP]

Great player.

[Cripps_orig]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/5018824/Mikel-Arteta-has-given-up-hope-of-playing-for-Spain.html

Surprised he didn't get a call up back when he was decent at Everton.

No chance now though as he himself admits

[Özim]

Yes me too, best chance he had when he was at Everton, was a pretty decent creative player. Not so suited to his current role and will never get a call up as he doesn't stand out in that role.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Even as a creative player he wouldn't have had a hope in hell of getting picked.

[Özim]

When at Everton he did, Spain weren't as good back then and he was very good, never happened though. Won't happen now, particularly not in the position he plays now where let's face it he's understandably not been that great.

[Cripps_orig]

When at Everton he did, Spain weren't as good back then and he was very good, never happened though. Won't happen now, particularly not in the position he plays now where let's face it he's understandably not been that great.
He's a great player tbh....:haha:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

No, he wouldn't. Spain have always had mass amounts of talent in midfield, even when they haven't been winning tournaments - when he moved to Everton, Xavi and Iniesta were heavily involved (Iniesta's first big season in his case) for Barcelona then.

Personally, I really don't understand the enmity Arteta seems to get, for where he plays now.

[Ollie the Optimist]

No, he wouldn't. Spain have always had mass amounts of talent in midfield, even when they haven't been winning tournaments - when he moved to Everton, Xavi and Iniesta were heavily involved (Iniesta's first big season in his case) for Barcelona then.

Personally, I really don't understand the enmity Arteta seems to get, for where he plays now.

its called wumming :good:

[GP]

its called wumming :good:

Pretty much.

He's put in two consistently good seasons for us. One of the first names on the teamsheet.

[Özim]

its called wumming :good:
Not really, it's called not being that good when played out of position :good:

[Cripps_orig]

Not really, it's called not being that good when played out of position :good:

He's WUMming.

[Özim]

He's WUMming.
Pretty much.

He's been very average for two seasons and if not for the fact we have noone else to play there because Wenger doesn't want to sign a DM he wouldn't be playing there.

[Niall_Quinn]

Pretty much.

He's been very average for two seasons and if not for the fact we have noone else to play there because Wenger doesn't want to sign a DM he wouldn't be playing there.

Depends how you measure it. Statistically he's been way above average, one of the very best in Europe. Creatively he's been below average. But he plays in a pretty dire team of course.

[Ollie the Optimist]

while arteta was playing as dm, our defence improved to become the second best defence in the league. thats not average

[Özim]

We were awful defensively the season before last, he played then. Guess it wasn't his fault.

[Ollie the Optimist]

We were awful defensively the season before last, he played then. Guess it wasn't his fault.

you mean the one with alex song playing as dm? yeah thanks for proving my point

[Özim]

you mean the one with alex song playing as dm? yeah thanks for proving my point
He still played and from memory he didn't offer anything coming forward so he must have been helping his fellow defenders.

Stupid decision the play him as DM, what next play Walcott in goal?

[GP]

you mean the one with alex song playing as dm? yeah thanks for proving my point

:lol:

Boom.

[Niall_Quinn]

2-0 Giroud. But he seriously lucked out there. He should have been in the box for the first cross. Rebounds out and he whacks it. Good finish but awful positional play again.

EDIT; And before anyone says I have posted this in the wrong thread, not so, I meant to post it here for reasons I'll keep to myself.

[Özim]

Also we were shocking defensively at the start of last season, we only improved towards the end of the season (probably won't last and I would expect us to go back to what we're good at next season if we don't sign anyone decent defensively in midfield).

:lol:

Boom.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Also we were shocking defensively at the start of last season, we only improved towards the end of the season (probably won't last and I would expect us to go back to what we're good at next season if we don't sign anyone decent defensively in midfield).

:lol:

Boom.

first four games, 1 goal conceded. shocking start defensively that. then the goals in the next few games came from individual errors with no blame attached to arteta. keep trying though

[Ollie the Optimist]

He still played and from memory he didn't offer anything coming forward so he must have been helping his fellow defenders.

Stupid decision the play him as DM, what next play Walcott in goal?

in a season where he didnt play as DM, someone else did, we were poor defensively. in the next season, we play arteta as DM and improve to second best defence in the league. and you are calling that a stupid decision? if thats what you think is a stupid decision, then you need help

[Niall_Quinn]

This Arteta thing is just another route to getting at Wenger I suppose. If not Arteta then who plays DM? Who could do the job there? With some evidence please, not just kicking out names.

[Cripps_orig]

This Arteta thing is just another route to getting at Wenger I suppose. If not Arteta then who plays DM? Who could do the job there? With some evidence please, not just kicking out names.

This may sound a crazy idea but how about sign someone who is actually a DM and can play there instead of playing pubbers out of position?

[Niall_Quinn]

This may sound a crazy idea but how about sign someone who is actually a DM and can play there instead of playing pubbers out of position?

No, your argument is Arteta is pointless. It's not his fault if we don't sign players, in fact he was in the papers this week urging Wenger to get the chequebook out. Fact is we didn't sign players. So who plays in that role then? Apart from this pointless player Arteta?

[Marc Overmars]

in a season where he didnt play as DM, someone else did, we were poor defensively. in the next season, we play arteta as DM and improve to second best defence in the league. and you are calling that a stupid decision? if thats what you think is a stupid decision, then you need help

Of course Arteta played that role in his first season, it was why Song was relieved from that duty and became quite effective creatively.

[Cripps_orig]

No, your argument is Arteta is pointless. It's not his fault if we don't sign players, in fact he was in the papers this week urging Wenger to get the chequebook out. Fact is we didn't sign players. So who plays in that role then? Apart from this pointless player Arteta?
That role just doesn't consist of doing whatever it is Arteta is doing.

He can do more. He can be more creative. Pirlo plays in a similar position but you don't see him being pointless.

I'm not Wenger. I don't know who else can play there. I do know that Arteta can do much more

[Ollie the Optimist]

Of course Arteta played that role in his first season, it was why Song was relieved from that duty and became quite effective creatively.

fair enough he played there first season, song goes, arteta becomes sole DM at club, we improve to second best defence in the league. its just backing up my point that he isnt average, and that it wasnt a stupid decision to play him there

[Niall_Quinn]

That role just doesn't consist of doing whatever it is Arteta is doing.

He can do more. He can be more creative. Pirlo plays in a similar position but you don't see him being pointless.

I'm not Wenger. I don't know who else can play there. I do know that Arteta can do much more

Is he pointless or not? No, he's not Pirlo but neither are thousands of other players. He's not Messi either. But he does a job for us that, seemingly by your own admission, nobody else can do better. That's not the definition of pointless.

[LDG]

He's not a defensive midfielder anyway :shrug:

We haven't played with a defensive midfielder for years. And most teams with five midfielders don't either. The midfield all work to defend, be it zonally or not.

He's the pivot at the base of the trio, who lays the ball off and keeps the game moving. The role Denilson should have played, but was too lazy. You have to work fucking hard in that role, because you have to be available all of the time, and you also have to cover off gaps left by other midfielders (which is as defensive as it gets).

He's done superbly well at it.

[Cripps_orig]

Is he pointless or not? No, he's not Pirlo but neither are thousands of other players. He's not Messi either. But he does a job for us that, seemingly by your own admission, nobody else can do better. That's not the definition of pointless.

I don't work for arsenal. I'm not their coach or manager. I don't know who else can play there. You seem to have mistaken me for someone who does work there.

Do you think when Arteta gets the ball and him passing back to a CB countless times instead of looking for a forward pass isn't pointless?

I'm pretty sure any of our DMs in the youth set up can do the same.

More is expect from Arteta however and he has failed.

Denilson did the same as Arteta and was widely criticised by the same people praising the spaniard. That's how I know they are WUMming.

[Ollie the Optimist]

arteta was asked to be the base of the midfield and be more defensive then others, the team then improve defensively to become leagues second best. in what way has he failed there?

and with denilson, as LDG, teh problem was him being lazy, not tracking back or jogging back. clear difference there

[Dennis Bendtner]

Why don't you remind us all how of how great Gilberto was

[Özim]

No, your argument is Arteta is pointless. It's not his fault if we don't sign players, in fact he was in the papers this week urging Wenger to get the chequebook out. Fact is we didn't sign players. So who plays in that role then? Apart from this pointless player Arteta?
Noone is saying it's his fault, they're saying he's not very good at playing out of position. Hardly a criticism, it makes sense after all, he's an attackingly minded player not a defensive one and he's wasted where he plays.

You play to a player's strength you don't try and fit a square peg in a round hole, but that's Wenger allover, stubborn as a mule always thinks he knows best and because he doesn't want to spend money the team and to an extent player has to suffer for it

[Ollie the Optimist]

please explain to me, how playing a player "out of position" which ends up improving the team from being awful defensively the season before to the second best defence in the league is making the team suffer?

[Cripps_orig]

please explain to me, how playing a player "out of position" which ends up improving the team from being awful defensively the season before to the second best defence in the league is making the team suffer?

Stops us creatively.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Stops us creatively.

how? its his job to be more defensive minded, while cazorla, jack etc do the creative work.

[Özim]

He's hardly the reason for the sudden improvement in defence (we'll see how that goes next season I reckon this is a blip anyway), his performances have been average.

You pull out all these stats and yet despite being so great we achieve nothing all season, crash out of everything early and limp to 4th, our worst performance for a long time.

[Özim]

Stops us creatively.
Yup, Arteta would be much better if he was used to do what he's good at (like he was at Everton).

[Fist of Lehmann]

He still played and from memory he didn't offer anything coming forward so he must have been helping his fellow defenders.

This was he season he notched more key passes than anyone in Europe except Pirlo and Xavi yeah?

[Cripps_orig]

This was he season he notched more key passes than anyone in Europe except Pirlo and Xavi yeah?

Define a key pass

[Özim]

This was he season he notched more key passes than anyone in Europe except Pirlo and Xavi yeah?
So what constitutes a key pass then. Is it an assist or not?

[Power n Glory]

please explain to me, how playing a player "out of position" which ends up improving the team from being awful defensively the season before to the second best defence in the league is making the team suffer?

I don't think anyone has to explain shit to you when you can argue against the signing of a top class striker to replace RVP last season. Makes no sense that you can acknowledge Arteta's contribution to the team but at the same time brush aside RVP's by simply looking at our league position.

[Fist of Lehmann]

So what constitutes a key pass then. Is it an assist or not?

It's:

Key Pass
The final pass or pass-cum-shot leading to the recipient of the ball having an attempt at goal without scoring.

In other words, chances created excluding assists.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Yup, Arteta would be much better if he was used to do what he's good at (like he was at Everton).

is he better at creating attacks and scoring then someone like jack or cazorla? no. are jack and cazorla better at being defensive then arteta? no. therefore you play them so the two players better at attack, attack. the player better at defending, defends. its not rocket science.

and he clearly is good at it. season before we were poor defensively with him and song there. you play just arteta there and we improve. its not just down to arteta, the defence got devolped too but you cant over look it

[Ollie the Optimist]

I don't think anyone has to explain shit to you when you can argue against the signing of a top class striker to replace RVP last season. Makes no sense that you can acknowledge Arteta's contribution to the team but at the same time brush aside RVP's by simply looking at our league position.


yeah you clearly missed all my points earlier. well done

[Power n Glory]

yeah you clearly missed all my points earlier. well done

Maybe I did. But I'll assume you were talking shit until you clarify.

[LDG]

It's:

Key Pass
The final pass or pass-cum-shot leading to the recipient of the ball having an attempt at goal without scoring.

In other words, chances created excluding assists.

And you're saying Arteta had the most in Europe bar Xavi and Pirlo?

Wow.

And all from DM.

[GP]

And you're saying Arteta had the most in Europe bar Xavi and Pirlo?

Wow.

And all from DM.

That's quite impressive.

Just really underlines how great he's been for us.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Can you check the stats of how many shots our defenders have had?

Must be pretty high as all Arteta does is pass to them


so you argue that arteta isnt creative enough, someone shows you that he third highest player with key passes, you then try and dismiss that.

top wumming

[Cripps_orig]

so you argue that arteta isnt creative enough, someone shows you that he third highest player with key passes, you then try and dismiss that.

top wumming
Shows me?

Where?

All he did was tell me. Am I supposed to accept that?

I've seen Arteta more than enough times to make my own judgement and I'm not far off being spot on about him.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

What I like about players like Arteta playing in that position is they tend to win it back by interceptions (not that he can't tackle) and can use their ball skill to bring it out of deep in our half and then lay it off or whatever it might be.

It's incredibly important to have a player that is always there to control the ball and pass it. It's not to say Arteta is the best at this because he isn't but the need for conventional DMs (as destroyers) I think is a bit antiquated.

[Dennis Bendtner]

Shows me?

Where?

All he did was tell me. Am I supposed to accept that?

I've seen Arteta more than enough times to make my own judgement and I'm not far off being spot on about him.

What was your opinion on Gilberto Silva?

[LDG]

What I like about players like Arteta playing in that position is they tend to win it back by interceptions (not that he can't tackle) and can use their ball skill to bring it out of deep in our half and then lay it off or whatever it might be.

It's incredibly important to have a player that is always there to control the ball and pass it. It's not to say Arteta is the best at this because he isn't but the need for conventional DMs (as destroyers) I think is a bit antiquated.

Couldn't have put it better myself. Although I did try :(

[Letters]

Shows me?

Where?

All he did was tell me. Am I supposed to accept that?

I've seen Arteta more than enough times to make my own judgement and I'm not far off being spot on about him.
Not sure where the stat mentioned above comes from. I found these though:

http://www.talksport.co.uk/magazine/features/130420/arsenals-5-best-players-season-according-premier-league-stats-195988

http://sport.uk.msn.com/football/premier-league-pass-masters#image=12
(Arteta is 5th in the PL)

[Cripps_orig]

So being behind only Pirlo and Xavi was bs?

Thought as much

[Letters]

So being behind only Pirlo and Xavi was bs?

Thought as much
I don't know about that but it's not really relevant, the stats show he's a very effective player for Arsenal.
Most people's perception of him tallies with that.

[Cripps_orig]

I don't know about that but it's not really relevant, the stats show he's a very effective player for Arsenal.
Most people's perception of him tallies with that.

I just can't see it. At games or watching on tv, he just really frustrates me. If he did more, maybe the team would do more.

You don't see it much on tv as that just follows the ball but at games, you can see Podolski or Theo making a run but Arteta ignoring them to pass sideways or back, keeps possession but ultimately doesn't do anything.

As I've said, he's not a bad player but he needs to do much more. He clearly isn't great as the WUMs on here suggest

[Letters]

Fine. I don't think he's outstanding tbh. But he's not as bad as some of the other WUMs on here suggest either.

[Cripps_orig]

Fine. I don't think he's outstanding tbh. But he's not as bad as some of the other WUMs on here suggest either.

They should take my stance. Right down the middle.

[Letters]

:lol:

Nice :tiphat:

[Power n Glory]

I just can't see it. At games or watching on tv, he just really frustrates me. If he did more, maybe the team would do more.

You don't see it much on tv as that just follows the ball but at games, you can see Podolski or Theo making a run but Arteta ignoring them to pass sideways or back, keeps possession but ultimately doesn't do anything.

As I've said, he's not a bad player but he needs to do much more. He clearly isn't great as the WUMs on here suggest

I admire the sacrifice he makes for the team and understand he's a leader in the dressing room, but he's not comfortable in that position. Sometimes when he has plenty of time and space to turn and make a pass to a player in a better space, he'll rush his decision and pass straight back into a crowed area. He's not comfortable receiving the ball when under pressure and we'll be in serious problems if managers decide to man mark him all game. Besides Arteta, the whole midfield trio needs adjusting. Things just weren't flowing well last season.

[Fist of Lehmann]

And you're saying Arteta had the most in Europe bar Xavi and Pirlo?

Wow.

And all from DM.

Not this season, the season before.

http://www.eplindex.com/12157/mikel-arteta-arsenals-pivotal-playmaker.html

[Özim]

I just can't see it. At games or watching on tv, he just really frustrates me. If he did more, maybe the team would do more.

You don't see it much on tv as that just follows the ball but at games, you can see Podolski or Theo making a run but Arteta ignoring them to pass sideways or back, keeps possession but ultimately doesn't do anything.

As I've said, he's not a bad player but he needs to do much more. He clearly isn't great as the WUMs on here suggest
Basically we should buy a DM and play him in his natural position, he'd be a decent option to have.

He's made the best of the raw deal he's getting, but he'd be a lot better playing in a position that exploits his talents.

[Özim]

Fine. I don't think he's outstanding tbh. But he's not as bad as some of the other WUMs on here suggest either.
What about the WUMs who say he's great, you don't mention them?

[LDG]

Not this season, the season before.

http://www.eplindex.com/12157/mikel-arteta-arsenals-pivotal-playmaker.html

:good:

[LDG]

What about the WUMs who say he's great, you don't mention them?

Not too sure anyone is WUMming saying he's great :unsure:

I stated my case earlier. Maccy said much the same as me, and I'm sure he's not Wumming.

[Letters]

What about the WUMs who say he's great, you don't mention them?
Cripps already did. LDG and Maccy haven't been WUMming, the usual suspects have been WUMming and point scoring though.
Tiresome, as always.

[Özim]

Cripps already did. LDG and Maccy haven't been WUMming, the usual suspects have been WUMming and point scoring though.
Tiresome, as always.
I never suggested the names you mentioned were Wumming at all, I don't think they were.

[Letters]

I never suggested the names you mentioned were Wumming at all, I don't think they were.
So what's your point?

People WUMming and point scoring about players by saying they're the bestest-westest player ever is almost as bad as other people WUMming and point scoring about players by saying they're useless/pointless.

[Cripps_orig]

So what's your point?

People WUMming and point scoring about players by saying they're the bestest-westest player ever is almost as bad as other people WUMming and point scoring about players by saying they're useless/pointless.

It's worse IMO. The people calling Arteta pointless can back it up. People calling Arteta great cant.

[LDG]

It's worse IMO. The people calling Arteta pointless can back it up. People calling Arteta great cant.

How have you backed it up?

[Letters]

Well no, because the stats show him to have been a useful player. All the 'backing up' of him being pointless is subjective opinion which is being deliberately exaggerated to wind others up.

[Özim]

So what's your point?

People WUMming and point scoring about players by saying they're the bestest-westest player ever is almost as bad as other people WUMming and point scoring about players by saying they're useless/pointless.
My point was merely that you choose to point out those that say he's rubbish but ignore those who say he's great as if that's OK.

Incidentally noone said he was rubbish did they, most said he's played out of position and is pretty average playing out of position understandably. He's not a stand out player where he's played, we could find better (which a player who talents suit that role) and then use him where his strengths lie and where he was very good for Everton, offensively.

[Letters]

I've just pointed out both.
Although as (supposed) Arsenal fans we're more likely to be wound up by overly negative opinions about our players than overly positive ones, so they're not quite the same.
And as others have pointed out, the positive opinions in this case are backed up with facts as well as popular opinion, the negative ones aren't which, along with the people posting them, make them seem more WUMmish.

[LDG]

There's no-one better
Than Mikel Arteta

</thread>


Fine. I don't think he's outstanding tbh. But he's not as bad as some of the other WUMs on here suggest either.


Moving the goal posts :sulk:

[Letters]

:lol:

<_<

[Özim]

I've just pointed out both.
Although as (supposed) Arsenal fans we're more likely to be wound up by overly negative opinions about our players than overly positive ones, so they're not quite the same.
And as others have pointed out, the positive opinions in this case are backed up with facts as well as popular opinion, the negative ones aren't which, along with the people posting them, make them seem more WUMmish.
That's your opinion though, I think most Arsenal fans have woken up to the fact that we're not that great and that the players and manager are the reason and thus negative opinions of them are fine, so I disagree there. If anything positive opinions like some that we see are worse as they completely ignore what's happened in the last 8 years as if it's been a fairytale and support things that clearly shouldn't be.

The facts come from the season before last where we struggled again, noone stood out other than RVP who carried us. Last season his stats weren't as favourable however, again though we weren't very good and who really stood out.

If he's as good as the stats suggest why aren't people standing up and taking notice of his contribution (none Arsenal fans)?

[Özil's Panoramic View]

How is people saying Ramsey :haha:, and to a lesser extent, Arteta are/were SUPERB not an absolute wind up?

[Letters]

While we're not that great we are still one of the best teams in the country, we're not that bad either.
Overly negative opinions of first team regulars are just obviously WUMmish. I think we can all agree that Gerhinho shouldn't be paid to play football but clearly most of our first choice players are pretty decent or we wouldn't be finishing in the top 4. Overly positive opinions can be annoying when people rave about a player no matter how they play

As for non-Arsenal fans' opinion of Arteta this seems like a fairly balanced, thought out piece, I don't think the bloke is an Arsenal fan (I may be wrong, if he is he's tried to be objective about things)

http://www.eplindex.com/32048/mikel-arteta-unsung-hero.html

[Özim]

While we're not that great we are still one of the best teams in the country, we're not that bad either.
Overly negative opinions of first team regulars are just obviously WUMmish. I think we can all agree that Gerhinho shouldn't be paid to play football but clearly most of our first choice players are pretty decent or we wouldn't be finishing in the top 4. Overly positive opinions can be annoying when people rave about a player no matter how they play

As for non-Arsenal fans' opinion of Arteta this seems like a fairly balanced, thought out piece, I don't think the bloke is an Arsenal fan (I may be wrong, if he is he's tried to be objective about things)

http://www.eplindex.com/32048/mikel-arteta-unsung-hero.html
One of the best teams in the country? I find using best strange, the reason being we're really were very average for large parts of last season and the season before, we did get results towards the end but the performances were dire to be honest.

We're an OK team in a rather average league these days, we're not really competing for trophies just for a top 4 place against teams who have been shown to lack something.

I think this is our worst team for many years, it lacks creativity, lacks real quality and doesn't have the fighting spirit or hunger for success either.

I saw that piece, I was really referring to the general view, barely anyone really ever mentions his contribution on TV or in the press, this usually points to a player with little influence.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

It's incredibly important to have a player that is always there to control the ball and pass it. It's not to say Arteta is the best at this because he isn't but the need for conventional DMs (as destroyers) I think is a bit antiquated.

spot on.

he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent i.e. the season before last. when he's the DM and expected to throw his body about, make tackles etc, he's useless. you might not need a destroyer but you need a level of aggression to ensure the midfield isn't overpowered. with arteta you dont get that feeling.

buy a DM, stick arteta next to him and watch him flourish again. but as the kingpin of our midfield? do me a favour.

[Cripps_orig]

Just want him to be more creative.

It's that simple.

[Letters]

One of the best teams in the country?
Yeah.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/tables/9484362/Premier-League-table-2012-13.html

:shrug:

By definition we're one of the best teams in the country. It doesn't matter what the other teams are like, whether it's an average league or not, we finished 4th and haven't finished lower than that for yonks.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

we need denilson back tbf

we havent been competing for the title since he's been gone

[Power n Glory]

spot on.

he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent i.e. the season before last. when he's the DM and expected to throw his body about, make tackles etc, he's useless. you might not need a destroyer but you need a level of aggression to ensure the midfield isn't overpowered. with arteta you dont get that feeling.

buy a DM, stick arteta next to him and watch him flourish again. but as the kingpin of our midfield? do me a favour.

I disagree about him controlling the midfield. We've looked disjointed for the past two seasons and we're struggling to hold on to possession. It's not like before when we had long bouts of pointless possession, now it seems like we generally struggle to keep the ball moving.

[Cripps_orig]

we need denilson back tbf

we havent been competing for the title since he's been gone

The original Arteta :bow:

[Cripps_orig]

Midfield has been our weakest position for the last 2 seasons.

Arteta has been the major part of that.

[Özim]

Yeah.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/tables/9484362/Premier-League-table-2012-13.html

:shrug:

By definition we're one of the best teams in the country. It doesn't matter what the other teams are like, whether it's an average league or not, we finished 4th and haven't finished lower than that for yonks.
Yes but 4th is hardly a great achievement, the way we are so proud to finish 4th is pretty sad to be honest.

Are the top 6 not all one of the best teams in the country as well? It's pretty meaningless, what would give this meaning is if we were competing with the top clubs or picking up trophies, without this being "one of the best teams in the country" is largely meaningless, who really cares about this?

[Letters]

Yes but 4th is hardly a great achievement
I didn't say it was.

Are the top 6 not all one of the best teams in the country as well?
Yes.

And it's not meaningless, it just means that we're not that bad a side. We're not that good either of course.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

I disagree about him controlling the midfield. We've looked disjointed for the past two seasons and we're struggling to hold on to possession. It's not like before when we had long bouts of pointless possession, now it seems like we generally struggle to keep the ball moving.

i never said he controlled the midfield, i said he was a controller. the focus is on him, not the whole midfield.

and the struggling to hold onto possession comes from a myriad of problems; shape, lack of balance, tempo etc. cant expect one player to control a midfield.

[Power n Glory]

i never said he controlled the midfield, i said he was a controller. the focus is on him, not the whole midfield.

and the struggling to hold onto possession comes from a myriad of problems; shape, lack of balance, tempo etc. cant expect one player to control a midfield.

Well, he's part of the problem. It's not just him but if we're saying we're playing him out of position to have more possession but we sacrifice a combative midfield for him....I say it's not working out. None of the current starters are controlling the middle at all.

As for one player controlling the tempo, I think Rosicky does a good job at being the glue when he plays and we look more fluid when he plays. Cesc is another obvious one and hope we make a move for him.

[Master Splinter]

While we're not that great we are still one of the best teams in the country, we're not that bad either.
Overly negative opinions of first team regulars are just obviously WUMmish. I think we can all agree that Gerhinho shouldn't be paid to play football but clearly most of our first choice players are pretty decent or we wouldn't be finishing in the top 4. Overly positive opinions can be annoying when people rave about a player no matter how they play



Gerhinho :bow:.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Well, he's part of the problem. It's not just him but if we're saying we're playing him out of position to have more possession but we sacrifice a combative midfield for him....I say it's not working out. None of the current starters are controlling the middle at all.

As for one player controlling the tempo, I think Rosicky does a good job at being the glue when he plays and we look more fluid when he plays. Cesc is another obvious one and hope we make a move for him.

i think you'll find i was the one who just said he was better next to a DM instead of as the DM. in other words, he shouldnt be played out of position.

read posts properly before you comment and try to debate with someone who is actually agreeing with you :haha:

[Power n Glory]

i think you'll find i was the one who just said he was better next to a DM instead of as the DM. in other words, he shouldnt be played out of position.

read posts properly before you comment and try to debate with someone who is actually agreeing with you :haha:

Jeez, someones butt hurt over some past shit!

It's not even a debate, I'm just throwing in my opinion of his role in the team and how the midfield needs tweaking. Don't be so sensitive. I'm not trying to point score with you.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Jeez, someones butt hurt over some past shit!

It's not even a debate, I'm just throwing in my opinion of his role in the team and how the midfield needs tweaking. Don't be so sensitive. I'm not trying to point score with you.

:blink:

you made something up. i proved you wrong. how is that being butt hurt?

you said that i said he controlled the midfield. i never. i said he was a controller instead of a tackler. here:


he's a controller, not a tackler.

then you said "it's not just him but if we're saying we're playing him out of position to have more possession but we sacrifice a combative midfield for him....I say it's not working out". i never said that. i was the one who said we shouldnt play him out of position i.e. in DM. here:


which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent i.e. the season before last. when he's the DM and expected to throw his body about, make tackles etc, he's useless. you might not need a destroyer but you need a level of aggression to ensure the midfield isn't overpowered. with arteta you dont get that feeling.

buy a DM, stick arteta next to him and watch him flourish again. but as the kingpin of our midfield? do me a favour.

you really need to learn to read posts properly and also admit something when you're wrong.

you keep bringing up the past shit, says more about you than me :shrug:

[Power n Glory]

:blink:

you made something up. i proved you wrong. how is that being butt hurt?

you said that i said he controlled the midfield. i never. i said he was a controller instead of a tackler. here:



then you said "it's not just him but if we're saying we're playing him out of position to have more possession but we sacrifice a combative midfield for him....I say it's not working out". i never said that. i was the one who said we shouldnt play him out of position i.e. in DM. here:



you really need to learn to read posts properly and also admit something when you're wrong.

you keep bringing up the past shit, says more about you than me :shrug:

You said, I said.....whatever.

What's the difference between a controller or controlling the midfield? It just reverts back to the sole point about us not doing well at holding possession and controlling the tempo of the game. There isn't really much to prove here. Even next Song, where Song had the more box to box role, we struggled to control possession.

Stop being so sensitive.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

ok go off on one and imply what you want to satisfy whatever agenda you want to set. and im the one who should stop being sensitive yet you're the one who keeps bringing up the past :shrug:

[fakeyank]

You said, I said.....whatever.

What's the difference between a controller or controlling the midfield? It just reverts back to the sole point about us not doing well at holding possession and controlling the tempo of the game. There isn't really much to prove here. Even next Song, where Song had the more box to box role, we struggled to control possession.

Stop being so sensitive.

https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/4744284160/h43B54155/

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

:gp:

[Power n Glory]

ok go off on one and imply what you want to satisfy whatever agenda you want to set. and im the one who should stop being sensitive yet you're the one who keeps bringing up the past :shrug:

Don't take my initial post as an attack. Chill.

Was just saying I disagree with Arteta being a controller or the type of player we could build a midfield around like with what we did with Cesc. For example, even if we played Cesc further back, what we'd lose in physical presence, we'd still make up for in passing and possession. As Cripps was saying earlier, Pirlo is played deep and that doesn't hamper is passing/playmaking abilities.

[Power n Glory]

https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/4744284160/h43B54155/

You know! :lol:

Ain't nobody got time for dat!

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Don't take my initial post as an attack. Chill.

Was just saying I disagree with Arteta being a controller or the type of player we could build a midfield around like with what we did with Cesc. For example, even if we played Cesc further back, what we'd lose in physical presence, we'd still make up for in passing and possession. As Cripps was saying earlier, Pirlo is played deep and that doesn't hamper is passing/playmaking abilities.

once again, ive never disagreed with that :blink: you know full well my feelings on arteta so im not sure why are you trying to paint a picture that i want us to 'build a team around him' or that i rate him. those words are fabricated by you, can you link me to where i said that please or suggested it in any way whatsoever?

i said he's better next to a DM instead of being the DM. simple. why? because he's a controller instead of a destroyer. thats hardly anything to disagree with, he's hardly a destroyer is he.

as usual, you're going at 100mph into posts.

[Power n Glory]

once again, ive never disagreed with that :blink: you know full well my feelings on arteta so im not sure why are you trying to paint a picture that i want us to 'build a team around him' or that i rate him. those words are fabricated by you, can you link me to where i said that please or suggested it in any way whatsoever?

i said he's better next to a DM instead of being the DM. simple. why? because he's a controller instead of a destroyer. thats hardly anything to disagree with, he's hardly a destroyer is he.

as usual, you're going at 100mph into posts.

This is where I said I disagree. He's not a controller and not in the sense that if you stick a DM next to him his game will improve. I'm not sold on that because even when we had Song next to him, we weren't controlling possession very well.


spot on.

he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent i.e. the season before last. when he's the DM and expected to throw his body about, make tackles etc, he's useless. you might not need a destroyer but you need a level of aggression to ensure the midfield isn't overpowered. with arteta you dont get that feeling.

buy a DM, stick arteta next to him and watch him flourish again. but as the kingpin of our midfield? do me a favour.

That's your initial post and I disagree with it. He wasn't excellent last season imo and that was with Song even though Song took up the more creative role. I'm not even sure if we bought a DM that he'd even get into the team. As said with the Pirlo example, we wouldn't look so bad with possession if he was an excellent controller. None of what I'm saying is fabricated. I just don't think he'd be excellent full stop. That's you I'm quoting right? Or do you have a cousin? :lol:

Edit: Just to add to that, I get what you mean by controller. When we first bought him we thought we had a Cesc replacement and he'd play that role. But as shown, that is just not the case. I don't have a major problem with Arteta's defensive duties, even though he gets out powered sometimes. I have more of a problem with his vision and passing options. He's never cool on the ball when under pressure.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

erm yes you did. you fabricated the "he's the type of player we could build a midfield around like with what we did with Cesc."

you said "i disagree with arteta being a controller or the type of player we could build a midfield around". for you to disagree with something i would have had to say it first. but i didnt say the cesc bit.

then you suggested i said "he controlled the midfield", which ive already proved i didnt.

and also, you said "It's not just him but if we're saying we're playing him out of position to have more possession but we sacrifice a combative midfield for him... i say it's not working out" once again, i proved i didnt say that.

so thats 3 things you made up. but you didnt fabricate anything did you :console:

and anyway, how would you describe arteta in one word then? i think its pretty obvious to every normal fan that he's a controller instead of a destroyer.

[Power n Glory]

erm yes you did. you fabricated the "he's the type of player we could build a midfield around like with what we did with Cesc."

you said "i disagree with arteta being a controller or the type of player we could build a midfield around". for you to disagree with something i would have had to say it first. but i didnt say the cesc bit.

then you suggested i said "he controlled the midfield", which ive already proved i didnt.

and also, you said "It's not just him but if we're saying we're playing him out of position to have more possession but we sacrifice a combative midfield for him... i say it's not working out" once again, i proved i didnt say that.

so thats 3 things you made up. but you didnt fabricate anything did you :console:

and anyway, how would you describe arteta in one word then? i think its pretty obvious to every normal fan that he's a controller instead of a destroyer.

Define what you mean by controller?

You do know parts of what I've said in there about Cesc are my own thoughts or how I'd define a controller or his function in our squad, right?

He's not a DM that's obvious, but some of his passing options and the way he looks under pressure....I wouldn't say he's be excellent next to a DM either. It's why he hasn't been picked for Spain.


then you suggested i said "he controlled the midfield", which ive already proved i didnt. Proved what? What the heck are you saying if he's a controller but can't control the midfield? :lol: What the hecks the function of a controller then? Be clear.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Define what you mean by controller?

You do know parts of what I've said in there about Cesc are my own thoughts or how I'd define a controller or his function in our squad, right?

He's not a DM that's obvious, but some of his passing options and the way he looks under pressure....I wouldn't say he's be excellent next to a DM either. It's why he hasn't been picked for Spain.

Proved what? What the heck are you saying if he's a controller but can't control the midfield? :lol: What the hecks the function of a controller then? Be clear.

erm dont avoid the question, describe him in one word?

being a controller and controlling the midfield are two different things. one player cannot control a whole midfield if he's playing with fools in an unbalanced team.

i never said he was excellent next to a DM either, i said he's better there. i still think he's pretty average as everyone knows.

in terms of keeping possession, accurate passing and holding the ball he's decent. in that sense he's a controller. he drops deep to the defence and collects the ball off mertesacker so controls the play. by doing that, he allows the liberation of the other midfield players by covering the gaps that appear with intelligent movement and passing. when he play next to a DM it allows him to be more expressive, hence why i think he needs to play with one instead of being one.

[Niall_Quinn]

http://youtu.be/kQFKtI6gn9Y

[Power n Glory]

http://youtu.be/kQFKtI6gn9Y

:lol:

Thank you!

[Power n Glory]

But back on topic. I'm on a roll. :lol:



erm dont avoid the question, describe him in one word?

Average!


i never said he was excellent next to a DM either, i said he's better there. i still think he's pretty average as everyone knows.


spot on.

he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent i.e. the season before last. when he's the DM and expected to throw his body about, make tackles etc, he's useless. you might not need a destroyer but you need a level of aggression to ensure the midfield isn't overpowered. with arteta you dont get that feeling.

buy a DM, stick arteta next to him and watch him flourish again. but as the kingpin of our midfield? do me a favour.

:tiphat:

[Xhaka Can’t]

:lol:

Thank you!

For what?

[Özim]

For what?
Quality Street.

[Power n Glory]

For what?

For the link. It was funny.

[Xhaka Can’t]

For the link. It was funny.

No it wasn't.

[Power n Glory]

No it wasn't.

Yes it was.

:lol:

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

But back on topic. I'm on a roll. :lol:



Average!




:tiphat:

:lol: i suppose thats one way of copping out a debate. until next time :hug:

[Power n Glory]

:lol: i suppose thats one way of copping out a debate. until next time :hug:

This isn’t a good debate, my friend.


erm dont avoid the question, describe him in one word?

What difference do you think that will make to this discussion? Me describing him in one word won’t change the outcome. In footballing terms, I rarely come across the term ‘controller’ to define a central midfield player and it’s even more barmy to say a controller doesn’t help control the midfield. :lol: What the hecks his function then? Even by your own definition, you’re describing a player in the mould of Cesc, Xabi Alonso, Xavi….etc.

The season where we had Song and RVP, we struggled to hold possession and he wasn’t excellent which is what you said in your original post.


i never said he was excellent next to a DM either, i said he's better there. i still think he's pretty average as everyone knows.
Here it is.


he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent i.e. the season before last. when he's the DM and expected to throw his body about, make tackles etc, he's useless. you might not need a destroyer but you need a level of aggression to ensure the midfield isn't overpowered. with arteta you dont get that feeling.

I read your post properly. Can you do the same? :lol:


in terms of keeping possession, accurate passing and holding the ball he's decent. in that sense he's a controller. he drops deep to the defence and collects the ball off mertesacker so controls the play. by doing that, he allows the liberation of the other midfield players by covering the gaps that appear with intelligent movement and passing.

This part of his game, I don’t think he does a good job at all. Far too many times I’ve seen him avoid collecting the ball from the back and point for the Merts to pass it wide to Sagna. He’s too slow and can’t lose or turn his marker like Cesc or Song called. They’d have no problem receiving the ball in a tight space, turning and then passing it off to an open man. Hardly any safety and sideways passing from these guys, they always kept the ball moving and this is what I also love about Rosicky. Always on the half turn and knows what he’s going to do before he’s received the pass. Arteta doesn’t look half as sharp as these guys which is why I don’t rate him. But neither of us rate him highly so feck it! :lol:

[Niall_Quinn]

I always thought Arteta was Spanish.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

This isn’t a good debate, my friend.



What difference do you think that will make to this discussion? Me describing him in one word won’t change the outcome. In footballing terms, I rarely come across the term ‘controller’ to define a central midfield player and it’s even more barmy to say a controller doesn’t help control the midfield. :lol: What the hecks his function then? Even by your own definition, you’re describing a player in the mould of Cesc, Xabi Alonso, Xavi….etc.

The season where we had Song and RVP, we struggled to hold possession and he wasn’t excellent which is what you said in your original post.


Here it is.



I read your post properly. Can you do the same? :lol:



This part of his game, I don’t think he does a good job at all. Far too many times I’ve seen him avoid collecting the ball from the back and point for the Merts to pass it wide to Sagna. He’s too slow and can’t lose or turn his marker like Cesc or Song called. They’d have no problem receiving the ball in a tight space, turning and then passing it off to an open man. Hardly any safety and sideways passing from these guys, they always kept the ball moving and this is what I also love about Rosicky. Always on the half turn and knows what he’s going to do before he’s received the pass. Arteta doesn’t look half as sharp as these guys which is why I don’t rate him. But neither of us rate him highly so feck it! :lol:

well i want you to describe him in one bloody word because if you're going to try and pick my argument apart then at least be consistent and give me yours. what word would you describe him in?

secondly, he is a controller. he may not control the ball as well as cesc or alonso but he's a different type of player to them. for you to say he doesnt keep possession or have accurate passing is wrong and you bloody well know it. he is the ball retainer in our midfield. what he lacks is the physical aspect. what is he good at then?

the last point i agree with but there aren't too many who can receive the ball under pressure in the premier league. jack is the one that is outstanding at it and never panics; he can pick the ball up in tight spaces and still manoeuvre himself out of tricky situations. but i dont think thats a problem just with arteta, its a problem across the whole of the premier league. for someone who is being completely played out of position you have to give your hat off to him, he's trying and has never been in this position before. still think he's average as a DM but next to one, great.

[LDG]

Love Arteta. Proper professional who's pretty handy.

Rather him than one of these other powderpuff wage seekers.

Legend.

[Niall_Quinn]

Love Arteta. Proper professional who's pretty handy.

Rather him than one of these other powderpuff wage seekers.

Legend.

:gp:

[GP]

Can't argue with that.

/thread

[Power n Glory]

well i want you to describe him in one bloody word because if you're going to try and pick my argument apart then at least be consistent and give me yours. what word would you describe him in?

secondly, he is a controller. he may not control the ball as well as cesc or alonso but he's a different type of player to them. for you to say he doesnt keep possession or have accurate passing is wrong and you bloody well know it. he is the ball retainer in our midfield. what he lacks is the physical aspect. what is he good at then?

the last point i agree with but there aren't too many who can receive the ball under pressure in the premier league. jack is the one that is outstanding at it and never panics; he can pick the ball up in tight spaces and still manoeuvre himself out of tricky situations. but i dont think thats a problem just with arteta, its a problem across the whole of the premier league. for someone who is being completely played out of position you have to give your hat off to him, he's trying and has never been in this position before. still think he's average as a DM but next to one, great.

In one word. Midfielder? :shrug:

You do realise football has come a long way from describing players in one word. Especially midfield players. Deep laying playmaker, defensive midfield, box to box, attacking midfielder…..a ‘controller’ is a term hardly ever used to describe a midfield player. If I’m comparing him to Cesc, Pirlo, Xavi, Carrick, Scholes, Rosicky, etc, shouldn’t that give you more accurate picture of the type of duty we expect him to perform? But feck it, let’s call him a ‘controller’ for arguments sake. You’re probably the only person on GW to use this term.

Your argument has been picked apart already. You’re contradicting yourself.


for someone who is being completely played out of position you have to give your hat off to him, he's trying and has never been in this position before. still think he's average as a DM but next to one, great.

i never said he was excellent next to a DM either, i said he's better there. i still think he's pretty average as everyone knows.

he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent



read posts properly before you comment and try to debate with someone who is actually agreeing with you

The nerve :lol:

[Power n Glory]

Love Arteta. Proper professional who's pretty handy.

Rather him than one of these other powderpuff wage seekers.

Legend.

I'll give him credit for working hard at what he does. I don't rate him highly but he's been a leader in the dressing room and that shouldn't be ignored.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'll give him credit for working hard at what he does. I don't rate him highly but he's been a leader in the dressing room and that shouldn't be ignored.

I think if you try harder you should be able to ignore it.

[Ollie the Optimist]

Given tv5 is out for three months, and was dropped last season. I'd make arteta club captain. We've seen he is a leader past season

[Niall_Quinn]

I would make Bendtner club captain, may be the only way to get rid of him.

[dazthegooner]

I would make Bendtner club captain, may be the only way to get rid of him.

Lol

[Power n Glory]

I think if you try harder you should be able to ignore it.

Is that how you manage it with Walcott? :lol:

[LDG]

Theo LoLcott :lol:

At least Arteta can control a football.

(I wonder how many pages of guff we can get out of this comparison)

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

In one word. Midfielder? :shrug:

You do realise football has come a long way from describing players in one word. Especially midfield players. Deep laying playmaker, defensive midfield, box to box, attacking midfielder…..a ‘controller’ is a term hardly ever used to describe a midfield player. If I’m comparing him to Cesc, Pirlo, Xavi, Carrick, Scholes, Rosicky, etc, shouldn’t that give you more accurate picture of the type of duty we expect him to perform? But feck it, let’s call him a ‘controller’ for arguments sake. You’re probably the only person on GW to use this term.

Your argument has been picked apart already. You’re contradicting yourself.








The nerve :lol:

:haha: :haha:

so because i said he's average in the DM position but we should applaud him for giving it a go, i'm contradicting myself?

also you do realise in those quotes you posted i said pretty much the same thing :haha: :doh:

i.e.

1. he's average in DM
2. he's great next to a DM
3. he's a controller

you're the one waffling around trying to engage in long, unmeaningful paragraphs to try and mask the lack of argument you have. thrown in with a few examples of elite footballers who are quite clearly miles better than arteta so is a ridiculous comparison to begin with.

you cant seem to describe what he does. you dismiss his attributes which is evident to every normal human being. he's apparently an inaccurate passer and someone who is bad at keeping possession but you dont know what he's good at.

i said describe him in one word if he isn't a controller. you couldnt.

you have no substance to anything you're saying. it's just general waffle without a reasoned, structured argument. and the fact you're fetching for new attempts to avoid all the questions tells me your a sinking ship in the debate, and you know it :shrug:

[Power n Glory]

Open this one for the public because this is boring.

Describe Arteta in one word.

[GP]

Captain

[Cripps_orig]

Open this one for the public because this is boring.

Describe Arteta in one word.

Pointless

[Kano]

:lol:

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Given tv5 is out for three months, and was dropped last season. I'd make arteta club captain. We've seen he is a leader past season

Knowing what happens to players made captain, I'm in full agreement with the emboldened.

[Niall_Quinn]

Spanish

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

oops there we go again, avoid avoid avoid :rolleyes:

Fraud_n_Glory

[Penguin]

He's not a defensive midfielder anyway :shrug:

We haven't played with a defensive midfielder for years. And most teams with five midfielders don't either. The midfield all work to defend, be it zonally or not.

He's the pivot at the base of the trio, who lays the ball off and keeps the game moving. The role Denilson should have played, but was too lazy. You have to work fucking hard in that role, because you have to be available all of the time, and you also have to cover off gaps left by other midfielders (which is as defensive as it gets).

He's done superbly well at it.

Yeah I agree with that, he's done a fine job. Obviously we could improve on him but some people wont be happy unless we have Sergio Busquets or Xabi Alonso :sarcy:

[Power n Glory]

oops there we go again, avoid avoid avoid :rolleyes:

Fraud_n_Glory

:lol: What the feck are you talking about, mate? Where are your comprehension skills? Can anyone else make sense of this?

This isn’t even a dispute about the type of player he is. We both pretty much agree on his type of role in the squad. You’ve pulled this ‘controller’ phrase out from your ass somewhere, nobody in football would describe a creative midfielder, deep laying playmaker, maestro…whatever as a ‘controller’ but I get what you’re saying and the role you’re trying to describe. In one word, you’d call him a ‘midfielder’ in footballing terms but as the game has become more sophisticated and complex, we need more words to fully describe a players role and attributes.. That’s not even an issue, so answering that one question you keep harping on about is bloody irrelevant in this ‘debate’. :lol: You can describe him as a controller if you want but my main point is he doesn’t make a very good one.


thrown in with a few examples of elite footballers who are quite clearly miles better than arteta so is a ridiculous comparison to begin with.
Of course it’s not when we’re talking about what we require to get better as a team. Heck, we had Cesc and I mention Rosicky. These are his peers and it’s far from ridiculous, especially when people on here are saying he had better stats than Xavi and Pirlo the season before. :doh: Should I compare him to Denilson? Would that help?

Next to a DM/destroyer, I doubt Arteta would flourish because we saw him play alongside Song and instead of hunting for the ball and conducting play, trying to make things happen in the same way a player like Cesc, Rosicky do, he took a backseat and opted for the more defensive role. If we bought a DM, played Arteta as a CM with Cazorla or JW at the top of that trio, I think we’d still struggle because we’d need someone that has better awareness, able to cope under pressure and see the pass before he’s received the ball. Arteta just doesn’t have that sort of awareness in his locker. That’s the main point you should be looking at.


he's a controller, not a tackler. which is why when he's played in the DM role he's average. when he's playing next to a DM he's excellent

i never said he was excellent next to a DM either, i said he's better there. i still think he's pretty average as everyone knows.

This is a contradiction my friend. Yes, you said he was excellent next to a DM, then denied you said it. But forget that, I disagree with him being excellent next to a DM. See point above. :lol:

:coffee:

[Özim]

Give a 4 man midfield and a tough tackler any day of the week, who the f*ck wants a 5 man midfield anyway, would rather have 2 decent strikers in the team personally. Obviously that is a problem for us, but Wenger has been obsessed with this flawed 5 man midfield for as long as I can remember.

[Cripps_orig]

4-4-2 is the way to go

[LDG]

:haha:

[Özim]

:haha:
I know right, it's funny cos we're never going to sign any strikers :lol:

[GP]

:haha:

Heatstroke is a bitch.

[LDG]

I know right, it's funny cos we're never going to sign any strikers :lol:

4-6

Or

Cook/10

[Özim]

4-6

Or

Cook/10
Wenger/10

[LDG]

Wenger/10

House!

[GP]

House!

Roadhouse!

[Master Splinter]

Roadhouse!

An absolute classic. It almost absolves Swayze of his Dirty Dancing/Ghost crimes.

[GP]

He is dead.

[Master Splinter]

He is dead.

No u

[GP]

Love Dirty Dancing. an absolute classic.

[Master Splinter]

You ruined what would have been a concise summation of the mind-numbing devolution of every thread, by way of a few parodic posts, with your input.

What a gay you are.

[GP]

GayPete

[Niall_Quinn]

A complete fucking fag

[GP]

no u

[Niall_Quinn]

no u

WTF? Dirty Dancing was a fine movie.

[Power n Glory]

Point Break! Awesome!