Wenger Out?...Seriously.

[Marc Overmars]

Is he on borrowed time?

Can anyone seriously justify keep him on? Nothing has changed and it appears that we're actually getting worse. I'm basing this on the assumption that we won't finish 4th because it's very clear to me that we're not good enough.

It's always been his saving grace, "...but he always finishes 4th at least". That's why we fear it might be a gamble to get rid of him.

Well, I'm starting to think it's a gamble to actually keep him on. He would have been out of a job a long time ago at any other club, but because we have a bunch fucking cunts on the board who have allowed him to create this incredibly poor Arsenal side, just because he's made a huge profit along the way.

What an earth happened today? Forget about the top 3 for one second, would any half decent side in this league collapse like that under no pressure at all? Against a poor side like Blackburn of all teams.

It's gone on long enough. I no longer support Wenger and I would not give a shit if he was sacked tomorrow and Pat Rice was caretaker for x amount of time until we find a replacement.

[Joker]

IMO there's no question he has leave NOW. I don't care the season has started, he looks absolutely clueless on the sidelines, and it's obvious he doesn't know how to rectify our defensive problems. He must go.

[Cripps_orig]

Should have gone at the end of the 09/10 season and certainly at the end of last.

We are gradually getting worse and he hasnt got any idea on how to fix it. Its time for a change

[Ernesto]

Does anyone remember how Brian Clough left Forest?

Was he sacked or did he walk? I recall he took Forest full circle- from back-to-back European champions to relegation fom the top flight in his final season.

The reason I ask is this whole "borrowed time" argument. Does he still have a licence from the board (he's definitely lost the fans now, has Wenger) to do whatever he wants, whenever he wants? It appeared Clough had exactly that luxury at the City Ground and there was an interesting article in the Indy the other week comparing and contrasting the two situations.

[Özim]

No way back for him, should have gone a long time ago IMO, should go now for sure.

His bum chum PHW won't have it though.

[Niall_Quinn]

What do we do about the board though? Wenger is not and has never been the whole problem. You get rid of Wenger and the what changes? This club needs major amputations, not a haircut.

[gunnerrrrr]

Can't go soon enough, it's comidical management, clueless, dim-witted

[Joker]

We need sustained protests against the board and manager. Moreover, we need to stop turning up to home games, and hit the greedy cunts where it really hurts, in the pockets.

[gunnerrrrr]

What do we do about the board though? Wenger is not and has never been the whole problem. You get rid of Wenger and the what changes? This club needs major amputations, not a haircut.

Hopefuuly a morhinio type of manager would de,and change

[Ernesto]

We need sustained protests against the board and manager. Moreover, we need to stop turning up to home games, and hit the greedy cunts where it really hurts, in the pockets.

Liverpool did it with Hodgson, it's bound to work.

[Cripps_orig]

Does anyone remember how Brian Clough left Forest?

Was he sacked or did he walk? I recall he took Forest full circle- from back-to-back European champions to relegation fom the top flight in his final season.

The reason I ask is this whole "borrowed time" argument. Does he still have a licence from the board (he's definitely lost the fans now, has Wenger) to do whatever he wants, whenever he wants? It appeared Clough had exactly that luxury at the City Ground and there was an interesting article in the Indy the other week comparing and contrasting the two situations.

I mentioned the Clough comparison around a month ago and was laughed out of town.

Well whos laughing now?

Well it would be me if i wasnt so pissed off

[Özim]

Who can replace him.

Honestly if Donald Duck and Pluto walked through they door I'd give them the job over this chump, they might not know much about football tactics and setting a team up but neither does he.

and at least Donald Duck would quack in anger at the players rather than getting behind them all the time.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

What do we do about the board though? Wenger is not and has never been the whole problem. You get rid of Wenger and the what changes? This club needs major amputations, not a haircut.

Well we can't buy anyone until January now anyway. What would be needed now is stability and a defence that resembles something like a defence.

[selassie]

Yes Wenger needs to go, there is no question about that.

It's getting pretty desperate now and IMHO you could compare Wenger's current situation to that of Benetiz or Houllier in there final days at Liverpool.

I don't think Wenger has it in him to turn things around, the calibre of player we now have in our squad isn't at the play his perfect type of football.

What we now need is someone like a Hiddink to organise this bunch until we're in a position to attract a higher calibre player.

I honestly think that if Wenger stays in charge we'll have several seasons of 6-8 finishes, i'm being totally serious.

[Fats]

Does anyone remember how Brian Clough left Forest?

Was he sacked or did he walk? I recall he took Forest full circle- from back-to-back European champions to relegation fom the top flight in his final season.

The reason I ask is this whole "borrowed time" argument. Does he still have a licence from the board (he's definitely lost the fans now, has Wenger) to do whatever he wants, whenever he wants? It appeared Clough had exactly that luxury at the City Ground and there was an interesting article in the Indy the other week comparing and contrasting the two situations.

Been saying this for a while. Wow past glories hold a lot of faith at our club

[Ernesto]

Hopefuuly a morhinio type of manager would de,and change

We've gotta be realistic about the calibre of manager who comes in. Mourinho wouldn't leave his job at Real. Arsenal wouldn't pay him as well as the Spaniards do and nor would they offer him vast amounts of money to make lavish investment in the squad (you really think Mourinho would join Arsenal if he had to stick/persist with the crap we've got out there at the moment?!)

We are looking at a mid-table manager. A Martin o'Neill (you may well laugh, but that's going to be the only sloppy seconds going) or a Carlo Ancelotti type-manager. No Mourinho, no Hiddink, no Guardiola. A feel-good factor manager may be enough to see out our season (Georgie Graham, anyone? It worked at Liverpool with Dalglish)

'Arsenal quality' has not only dissipated from the kind of player we can attract, but also the type of manager to replace Wenger.

[Ollie the Optimist]

i think he will resign now, and its time to. really sad to see him go but its right for him and us BUT he is the greatest manager this club has ever had, he took us to the top, the very top, he successfully took us to the emirates, kept us going on nothing, he transformed english football. yes he has fucked up now and needs to go but i will remember him as the greatest manager we have ever had. you should too

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Should have gone at the end of the 09/10 season and certainly at the end of last.

We are gradually getting worse and he hasnt got any idea on how to fix it. Its time for a change

This

[Marc Overmars]

Get Rafa Benitez in tbh.

Might be able to get us 5th and win the CL in his first year. :coffee:

[RomfordPele]

Well we can't buy anyone until January now anyway. What would be needed now is stability and a defence that resembles something like a defence.

You won't get that with Wenger at the helm.

Most realistic scenario is Wenger moves upstairs (perhaps after a 'health scare' to save face and win him back some sympathy), and then we get someone like Steve Bould in as a caretaker boss for rest of season.

Then it's Ancelotti or Van Gaal for me. Assuming the board can attract them with a big enough transfer kitty.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

i think he will resign now, and its time to. really sad to see him go but its right for him and us BUT he is the greatest manager this club has ever had, he took us to the top, the very top, he successfully took us to the emirates, kept us going on nothing, he transformed english football. yes he has fucked up now and needs to go but i will remember him as the greatest manager we have ever had. you should too

You know its bad when posters like Ollie and Maccy call for Wengers head tbh.

But i agree he has to go wheather its not or the end of the season. He should walk with some dignity left in him.

[Cripps_orig]

His legacy will be forever known for this imo. Hes totally ruined it and through no one elses fault but his own.

The Invincibles, the 2 double winning teams will be remembered if you think hard enough but the first thought people will have when thinking of Wenger 50 years from now will be this

[Ollie the Optimist]

You know its bad when posters like Ollie and Maccy call for Wengers head tbh.

But i agree he has to go wheather its not or the end of the season. He should walk with some dignity left in him.

im not calling for his head as such ie i want him out at all times, i just feel he will go and i think its time. though if he stays, i will always support him

[topgun]

This season has been an accident waiting to happen,a blind man could see the direction things were going in,as long as Wenger remains in charge nothing will change,he is a one trick pony and has been found out,football has moved on and the mans failings have been there for all to see,this is not knee jerk but its time for supporters to make themselves heard.

[gunner6smith]

The thing that shocked me today was the fact that he hardly moved. Pat Rice came out into the technical area a few times but Wenger sat still, seemingly unpeturbed at the alarming collapse that was unfurling before his eyes. Can you see Fergie, Moyes, Dalglish and to a lesser extent Villas-Boas doing likewise? Not a chance.

The problem it appears to me is that he's lost his mojo. He's become so bitter and stubborn in his own ways that he can't see any way out of it, rather than to just continue in the vain hope the results will sort themselves out. That's not good enough. Hope. We need action and quickly, otherwise, we're not going to be worried about being x points behind Manchester, we're gonna worry about how many points we're off the bottom half of the league. That's not tongue in cheek, not pessimism. It's realistic. The squad is starting to improve, Song and Ramsey and Gervinho were the bright points today, but the leadership and direction afforded to them by the manager is disgraceful. No other club would stand for this - we shouldn't either.

So, who to bring in? True.... a manager of extreme quality would a) be difficult to attract and b) be unavailable. There's not many around. I'd back a tactician such as O'Neill. He'd do an excellent job. Somebody like a Klinsmann who manages with a lot of verve and desire could work. (Not necessarily Jurgen, simply an example of the type of coach we need)

Whatever the case, we need a change. A Blackburn supporting mate of mine asked me to describe Arsenal's predicament in one sentence. I gave him one word. 'Stale' They look bored and play with little urgency. And it needs sorting before it's too late.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

oh shut up, yes he has fucked up recently but if you remember him for this and then you are retarded. he took us to the very top, made this club great. yes he made us crap recently but come end of season we will still be up there maybe not top four but top 6 at least. he made this club great, and in years to come you will understand that and appreciate what he did for us

we get relegated under him only one way he will be remembered especially by young gooners.

[Marc Overmars]

For years many fans have seen the direction the club was heading in, but they've been told to keep it shut by the likes of PHW and Wenger.

No hiding place now.

[RomfordPele]

oh shut up, yes he has fucked up recently but if you remember him for this and then you are retarded. he took us to the very top, made this club great. yes he made us crap recently but come end of season we will still be up there maybe not top four but top 6 at least. he made this club great, and in years to come you will understand that and appreciate what he did for us

He'll forever be seen as a bit of a flawed genius in my view. He did exactly the same trick at Monaco: scaled the heights, then nearly took the club down. It's an unforgiveable failure of governance that the board is allowing him to do the same at our club.

Basically, Wenger's not the messiah, he's just a very stubborn boy.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

The thing that shocked me today was the fact that he hardly moved. Pat Rice came out into the technical area a few times but Wenger sat still, seemingly unpeturbed at the alarming collapse that was unfurling before his eyes. Can you see Fergie, Moyes, Dalglish and to a lesser extent Villas-Boas doing likewise? Not a chance.

The problem it appears to me is that he's lost his mojo. He's become so bitter and stubborn in his own ways that he can't see any way out of it, rather than to just continue in the vain hope the results will sort themselves out. That's not good enough. Hope. We need action and quickly, otherwise, we're not going to be worried about being x points behind Manchester, we're gonna worry about how many points we're off the bottom half of the league. That's not tongue in cheek, not pessimism. It's realistic. The squad is starting to improve, Song and Ramsey and Gervinho were the bright points today, but the leadership and direction afforded to them by the manager is disgraceful. No other club would stand for this - we shouldn't either. So, who to bring in? True.... a manager of extreme quality would a) be difficult to attract and b) be unavailable. There's not many around. I'd back a tactician such as O'Neill. He'd do an excellent job. Somebody like a Klinsmann who manages with a lot of verve and desire could work. (Not necessarily Jurgen, simply an example of the type of coach we need)

Whatever the case, we need a change. A Blackburn supporting mate of mine asked me to describe Arsenal's predicament in one sentence. I gave him one word. 'Stale' They look bored and play with little urgency. And it needs sorting before it's too late.

Maybe he wants to leave but for these lot to pay him off or he is doing this to spite the board

[gunner6smith]

I couldn't care less about the reason for him losing his mojo. I want him either gone or to rediscover it pronto before the embarrassment that is our club becomes even worse.

[Özim]

He'll forever be seen as a bit of a flawed genius in my view. He did exactly the same trick at Monaco: scaled the heights, then nearly took the club down. It's an unforgiveable failure of governance that the board is allowing him to do the same at our club.

Basically, Wenger's not the messiah, he's just a very stubborn boy.
Got to agree, the glory days seem a long long time ago now, the last 6 years have really ruined what he built..it's a shame but that's life, his stubborness and ignorance of problems has led to this at the end of the day.

[WengerISaLizard]

I feel sorry for Arsenal fans, they have had the 8-2 jokes 4-3 weeks now

[gunner6smith]

I feel sorry for Arsenal fans, they have had the 8-2 jokes 4-3 weeks now

:goodpost:

[Japan Shaking All Over]

I think I kind of fall in to the Ollie Maccy crew.......cant recall calling for Wenger to do one........except (and I must sound like a broken record player) to change the fucking formation, that to realise that we dont have the players to play that kind of football any more.

Today when we were flying you could see glimpses of the old ways, we looked to be having funny but we were playing Balckburn and we should have fun......but we havent been able to finish games off or hold on to leads now for years and until we can do that we are going down or treading water at best.

We can blame indviduals, Gerbs should have passed, yes he should and he made a mistake but his wasnt the only one and TBH for the first hour he was our most lively player.

Wenger is making mistakes......and the formation for me is the most glaring.......Arshavin, Walcott are being played out of position and RvP can not play his position with out the lvele of skill Cesc or Nas brought to the team.
Wenger, his scouts, the people who control the are at fault here.....if the formation was to remain then the players to play it needed to be brought in.
We need to use the pace we have........two wingers......we have Gerbs who likes to play that role and shit give Miya a chance........why does he still insist on this way......we arent top quality anymore we need to be more direct.

I will never forget what kind of success Wenger brought to the club.....never and I will not say directly that he must leave but if he did walk or get the sack I would see it as a chance to redirect the club.......my only worry is who to bring in........Rafa? no fucking way MO - O'Neill, there are worst out there but guys remember we dont make marquee signings because we cant attract them, and likewise for a manager unless they are interested in the challenge......I would have like Rijkaard.

a though just occurred to me...........seriously do you think that Wenger was given only a certain amount of money to spend......I mean we all agree there must be more money but they nature, timing and urgency we rushed through things......I mean the cheap Cahill bid, Yossi o a loan could that have been because he was forced to balance things out.

That he is on borrowed time and that if things are not better by January a new manager will be given the funds.........if that be the case the board can all fucking do one.....because for his faults Wenger should not be treated that way.

At the moment I am with Ollie.......am frustrated as hell and to answer the thread 'when saturday comes......" I do care and am extremely pissed off atm.......will not tell Wenger to fuck off but his stubborn ways are not winning my heart.......at all


the wife is really fucked off too and that is serious..........she cant understand why Kos is playing....she just wanted to add hersel

[fakeyank]

I think I kind of fall in to the Ollie Maccy crew.......cant recall calling for Wenger to do one........except (and I must sound like a broken record player) to change the fucking formation, that to realise that we dont have the players to play that kind of football any more.

Today when we were flying you could see glimpses of the old ways, we looked to be having funny but we were playing Balckburn and we should have fun......but we havent been able to finish games off or hold on to leads now for years and until we can do that we are going down or treading water at best.

We can blame indviduals, Gerbs should have passed, yes he should and he made a mistake but his wasnt the only one and TBH for the first hour he was our most lively player.

Wenger is making mistakes......and the formation for me is the most glaring.......Arshavin, Walcott are being played out of position and RvP can not play his position with out the lvele of skill Cesc or Nas brought to the team.
Wenger, his scouts, the people who control the are at fault here.....if the formation was to remain then the players to play it needed to be brought in.
We need to use the pace we have........two wingers......we have Gerbs who likes to play that role and shit give Miya a chance........why does he still insist on this way......we arent top quality anymore we need to be more direct.

I will never forget what kind of success Wenger brought to the club.....never and I will not say directly that he must leave but if he did walk or get the sack I would see it as a chance to redirect the club.......my only worry is who to bring in........Rafa? no fucking way MO - O'Neill, there are worst out there but guys remember we dont make marquee signings because we cant attract them, and likewise for a manager unless they are interested in the challenge......I would have like Rijkaard.

a though just occurred to me...........seriously do you think that Wenger was given only a certain amount of money to spend......I mean we all agree there must be more money but they nature, timing and urgency we rushed through things......I mean the cheap Cahill bid, Yossi o a loan could that have been because he was forced to balance things out.

That he is on borrowed time and that if things are not better by January a new manager will be given the funds.........if that be the case the board can all fucking do one.....because for his faults Wenger should not be treated that way.

At the moment I am with Ollie.......am frustrated as hell and to answer the thread 'when saturday comes......" I do care and am extremely pissed off atm.......will not tell Wenger to fuck off but his stubborn ways are not winning my heart.......at all


the wife is really fucked off too and that is serious..........she cant understand why Kos is playing....she just wanted to add hersel

I just dont buy the whole argument that AW is not given funds by the board. Why would any man taint his legacy if the board was not backing him. Ach and a few others on here got out quotes that had AW saying that he wouldnt stay in a club if he didnt have control over it. You think a manager that can get the old geezers to move to a 300mill quid stadium cannot squeeze out 15 million odd quid a season from them.. just doesnt add up! Wenger MUST leave.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I just dont buy the whole argument that AW is not given funds by the board. Why would any man taint his legacy if the board was not backing him. Ach and a few others on here got out quotes that had AW saying that he wouldnt stay in a club if he didnt have control over it. You think a manager that can get the old geezers to move to a 300mill quid stadium cannot squeeze out 15 million odd quid a season from them.. just doesnt add up! Wenger MUST leave.

No point him leaving till xmas new manger coming in now will change nothing. we need someone to come in spend big in jan and go from there.

[RomfordPele]

No point him leaving till xmas new manger coming in now will change nothing. we need someone to come in spend big in jan and go from there.

Nah, forget January. Sack Wenger now, get a competennt caretaker in for the rest of season so that we at least avoid the drop. Then give a new manager the whole summer to prepare a team. This whole season is already a write-off - we need action now.

[Japan Shaking All Over]

I'm hearing you there FakeYank and I am not trying to sell it to anyone......its just I cant see work things out.......has January been given as a finish line to get to by the board to Wenger
and they didnt want to hand the whole lot to him in case he like he is doing now fucks things up and leave the coffers bare for the new guy

Why didnt we just spend the required money for either Jags or Cahill, they were both players wenger rated unless by doing so he couldnt spend on other areas that also needed attention

the Oxo bid took a fair lump but listening to everyone this guy is a very good prospect

[fakeyank]

No point him leaving till xmas new manger coming in now will change nothing. we need someone to come in spend big in jan and go from there.

I think a new manager will lead to some sort of positive environment around the club. We need something, anything to hold on to right now. As you mentioned, it wouldnt change a thing.. it probably wont but it gives the new manager time to look at this bunch of players and then figure out who and what we need in the Jan transfer window.

[Ollie the Optimist]

No point him leaving till xmas new manger coming in now will change nothing. we need someone to come in spend big in jan and go from there.

why spend big? there are other problems that need to be sorted, spending money will not sort it. learn how to defend, someone like moyes could come in, not spend much but he will get those players defending as a unit. throwing money wont solve problem, but a different manager might, change formation, use players in better posistions

[Japan Shaking All Over]

Moyes would be a decent shout.......I think he has a strong work ethic and it may be the direction we need to go in.........not convinced even though I mentioned Rijkaard earlier that we need to go for a flashy name.........didnt really think about poaching a manager from another team (BTW I know Rijkaard is now employed)

[Olivier's xmas twist]

why spend big? there are other problems that need to be sorted, spending money will not sort it. learn how to defend, someone like moyes could come in, not spend much but he will get those players defending as a unit. throwing money wont solve problem, but a different manager might, change formation, use players in better posistions

This squad has a big problem, any manger coming in will have a big problem, We need quality and you have to spend big in this day and age to get it. im not saying splash 200 or 300 mill. but just enough to fix the squad.

Because Wenger is failing badly, he can't motivate this lot or even motivate himself, its as if he don't give too fecks anymore. we need a manager that will get players on their toes and reming them what club this is.

[Sirjackofwilshere]

Moyes would be a decent shout.......I think he has a strong work ethic and it may be the direction we need to go in.........not convinced even though I mentioned Rijkaard earlier that we need to go for a flashy name.........didnt really think about poaching a manager from another team (BTW I know Rijkaard is now employed)

:gp:

Moyes is the one I'd go for

[Ollie the Optimist]

This squad has a big problem, any manger coming in will have a big problem, We need quality and you have to spend big in this day and age to get it. im not saying splash 200 or 300 mill. but just enough to fix the squad.

Because Wenger is failing badly, he can't motivate this lot or even motivate himself, its as if he don't give too fecks anymore. we need a manager that will get players on their toes and reming them what club this is.

your second point shows imo that we do not need to spend big if we get a new manager. a new manager, like moyes who knows how to get the best out of his players would be fine. yes maybe one or two signings would help but dont go out and splash 20 mil on somoene just cos we need a big signing. this team has quality, ches, sagna, verm, arteta, jw, arshavin, rvp and more, we just need someone to get the best out of them

[Xhaka Can’t]

His legacy will be forever known for this imo. Hes totally ruined it and through no one elses fault but his own.

The Invincibles, the 2 double winning teams will be remembered if you think hard enough but the first thought people will have when thinking of Wenger 50 years from now will be this

No. You have got it completely arse over tits, but I understand your frustration.

[Master Splinter]

No. You have got it completely arse over tits, but I understand your frustration.

I thought you'd be aware of how Ach operates by now.

In essence, I am asking: Are You New Here?

[GP]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Cripps_orig]

No. You have got it completely arse over tits, but I understand your frustration. Wouldn't be surprised tbh. If Wenger sees his job through and takes us down then most def it will be

[Özim]

Wenger mentioned huge potential in the post match interview again.......really? ¯\_(ツ)_/

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Wenger mentioned huge potential in the post match interview again.......really? ¯\_(ツ)_/

least he never blamed everyone but the team, but yeah he still sucks wenger out

[Bergkampwonderland10]

Thought his post-match interview was very telling today. He is a broken man. He didn't even look to blame the offside Yak goal or the fact Robinson pretty much took out Walcott at the end. I actually feel a little sorry for him. He is probably only now seeing the error of his stubborn ways and now he is stuck with players like Koscielny who just seems to make error after error. Thankfully Squillacci is no where near the first team but what a waste of money those two were. The team looks totally disjointed and with Wilshere and Vermaelen out for the long term - we are pretty much without the 2 most natural leaders at the club. Gervinho and Arteta look like the only 2 quality additions - but Arteta looked forlorn at the 2nd own goal and Gervinho already feels duped with the loss of Cesc and Nasri. I think this might well be Arsene's final season if we fail to finish 4th or win anything - but there is no way we should get rid of him mid season. What would be useful is bringing in a.....wait for it....defensive coach.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Thought his post-match interview was very telling today. He is a broken man. He didn't even look to blame the offside Yak goal or the fact Robinson pretty much took out Walcott at the end. I actually feel a little sorry for him. He is probably only now seeing the error of his stubborn ways and now he is stuck with players like Koscielny who just seems to make error after error. Thankfully Squillacci is no where near the first team but what a waste of money those two were. The team looks totally disjointed and with Wilshere and Vermaelen out for the long term - we are pretty much without the 2 most natural leaders at the club. Gervinho and Arteta look like the only 2 quality additions - but Arteta looked forlorn at the 2nd own goal and Gervinho already feels duped with the loss of Cesc and Nasri. I think this might well be Arsene's final season if we fail to finish 4th or win anything - but there is no way we should get rid of him mid season. What would be useful is bringing in a.....wait for it....defensive coach.

:gp:

Spot on girl

[Xhaka Can’t]

I'd like him to go now. It would provide time for a new Manager to turn things around, see if he can get more out of the existing squad and where he can't, make the required changes in the January transfer window.

[Power n Glory]

Wenger only has himself to blame. We all knew we needed a confident defender with Prem experience but he refused to bring one in. It's early days for Merts but he's confidence will be shot to pieces if he keeps playing under Wenger. He keeps making the same stupid mistakes. You just don't know how a foreign player will adapt to the Prem and especially when he's expecte to organise the team and be the leader.

The board have backed him and we can't say they re refusing to release the funds because we spent a lot in the transfer window on deadline day and I fully believe that Wenger was prepared to go into the season without Santos, Arteta and co had it not been for the massacre and injuries to TV and JW. That just shows how naive he is. The guy was quick to praise Kosienly after the Dortmund game but developed convenient amnesia over his first half performance. Maybe Pat Rice gave him a bollocking and he pulled his socks up. Wenger was also quick to praise the defence after the Newcastle clean sheet and was acting as if we didn't need new CB's. Even after the massacre he was asked if he was going to buy players and his first reaction was telling. 'you people always think buying is the answer'. He's probably right, they need to start asking him maybe a new coach would help!

He has dug himself into this massive hole and he hasn't got the strength to dig deep and sort it out. He's weak. He's looking like a victim and people are feeling sorry for him. That's when it's time to throw in the towel. Someone has to end this for him because his pride won't allow him to walk. He has 10 more games and if he can't turn it around he needs to be shown the door. The board should be on the phone right now drawing up a list of potential managers. Wenger is done.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I'm not saying the Board arent backing him, but the selling of our two best players and using a little over half the proceeds of them does not provide evidence of Wenger being backed financially by the Board.

[selassie]

Wenger only has himself to blame. We all knew we needed a confident defender with Prem experience but he refused to bring one in. It's early days for Merts but he's confidence will be shot to pieces if he keeps playing under Wenger. He keeps making the same stupid mistakes. You just don't know how a foreign player will adapt to the Prem and especially when he's expecte to organise the team and be the leader.

The board have backed him and we can't say they re refusing to release the funds because we spent a lot in the transfer window on deadline day and I fully believe that Wenger was prepared to go into the season without Santos, Arteta and co had it not been for the massacre and injuries to TV and JW. That just shows how naive he is. The guy was quick to praise Kosienly after the Dortmund game but developed convenient amnesia over his first half performance. Maybe Pat Rice gave him a bollocking and he pulled his socks up. Wenger was also quick to praise the defence after the Newcastle clean sheet and was acting as if we didn't need new CB's. Even after the massacre he was asked if he was going to buy players and his first reaction was telling. 'you people always think buying is the answer'. He's probably right, they need to start asking him maybe a new coach would help!

He has dug himself into this massive hole and he hasn't got the strength to dig deep and sort it out. He's weak. He's looking like a victim and people are feeling sorry for him. That's when it's time to throw in the towel. Someone has to end this for him because his pride won't allow him to walk. He has 10 more games and if he can't turn it around he needs to be shown the door. The board should be on the phone right now drawing up a list of potential managers. Wenger is done.

Yep, I agree with a lot of this
.
I think what we're seeing now is years of under investment from Arsene/Board. We have had pretty major defensive issues for around 3 or 4 seasons but the issues to some degree have been masked by having a small core of outstanding attacking players who have pulled us through.

What we're seeing now is a drop in quality of the first team which means we no longer control games in the way we use to. This is putting more pressure on our defenders who are being exposed for what they are as a unit. As individuals they are all good players, as a unit they suck, I think they suck because Arsene doesn't coach Defence.

I'm being serious here, I cannot for the life of me understand why they do what they are doing in games if they are being coached. There is no rhythm, no understanding & no organisation.

I think this is pretty much it for Arsene, he won't change, he won't spend that extra bit on the quality we need, he won't hire a defensive coach, he won't listen to anybody and accept that this team has major flaws...he just needs to run down his contract and then we start a fresh with somebody new.

[Power n Glory]

I'm not saying the Board arent backing him, but the selling of our two best players and using a little over half the proceeds of them does not provide evidence of Wenger being backed financially by the Board.

The board should take credit some credit for getting such a huge fee for the Nasri deal. Wenger was prepared to let him walk on a free. Plus he's the one that convinced the Board to sell Cesc for cheap.

Wenger doesn't like to spend big on players and it was the same at Monaco. We spent a lot on deadline day but it was probably impossible to spend it all on deadline day because we left ourselves with little time. Plus, you have to question for the sort of players Wenger wants. Gervinho is decent buy he's not the best winger we could have bought. He's bought 3 CB's over the past 2 seasons and look how it's turned out. He goes for value all the time. He's a bargain bin shopper. The type of guy that would walk into Primark over some luxury designer clothes store to spend £200. That' always been his mentality.

[Xhaka Can’t]

PnG, I don't disagree with your assessment of the type of players Wenger is ultimately wasting money on - poor players are not bargains, but the Board is complicit in this. All the evidence of the past few years points to financial rewards as being the measure of success at this Club. If that were not the case, Wenger would have been gone some time ago.

[Power n Glory]

PnG, I don't disagree with your assessment of the type of players Wenger is ultimately wasting money on - poor players are not bargains, but the Board is complicit in this. All the evidence of the past few years points to financial rewards as being the measure of success at this Club. If that were not the case, Wenger would have been gone some time ago.

But that was always the case since moving to the Emirates and I'm not going to put them at fault for that. This has always been a long term plan and makes sense that they'd take financial stability over trophies. That makes sense for them. It wouldn't be wise for them to start this project and demand silverware while we're in transition and put pressure on the very man that has made this move possible. Wenger is their golden goose and without him, they wouldn't have been able to consider a move to the Emirates. I understand their caution because they are always looking at the long term.

But Wenger is a football coach up there with the elites and competing for top honours year in year out. Just like the players, he should have a burning desire to win trophies and have some sense of pride when it comes to this. Seeing your defence fall apart year after year has to sting and even if he's not even thinking about trophies at the start of the season, just having the pride and drive to make sure your team doesn't look foolish when out there for 90 minutes is enough. Don't let those boys walk out on the pitch and put you to shame, man. Where's his pride? He's a football manager and the ultimate goal should be to win games and improve as a squad. The trophies come as result of constant drilling, chipping away and refining certain parts of our game. How can he look at the tapes of us playing and be satisfied as a coach? How? That's what's killing me. When you put the board and money issues to one side, it boils down to those 90 minutes on the pitch and what you see going wrong after each game. It's like he can't see the problems or has no idea how to fix them. He hasn't even tried to adjust the way we play or tactics, he's just doing the same thing over and over again. As a coach, he should feel ashamed but he doesn't.

[Maestro]

Nail on the head P n' G. It astounds me how the man has no shame, or any sort of professional pride left. As this is the case, why not do the honourable thing and resign as he clearly does not have the answers.

If he really loves this club, or even cares to a degree then he should step down.

It's game over for le' Prof!

[Power n Glory]

Yep, I agree with a lot of this
.
I think what we're seeing now is years of under investment from Arsene/Board. We have had pretty major defensive issues for around 3 or 4 seasons but the issues to some degree have been masked by having a small core of outstanding attacking players who have pulled us through.

What we're seeing now is a drop in quality of the first team which means we no longer control games in the way we use to. This is putting more pressure on our defenders who are being exposed for what they are as a unit. As individuals they are all good players, as a unit they suck, I think they suck because Arsene doesn't coach Defence.

I'm being serious here, I cannot for the life of me understand why they do what they are doing in games if they are being coached. There is no rhythm, no understanding & no organisation.

I think this is pretty much it for Arsene, he won't change, he won't spend that extra bit on the quality we need, he won't hire a defensive coach, he won't listen to anybody and accept that this team has major flaws...he just needs to run down his contract and then we start a fresh with somebody new.

You know what's funny, the one game where we showed true defensive grit and really clung on when under pressure was the Dortmund game and that display came after Pat Rice had his half time team talk and shouted at them. Schzney did say he shouts a lot after the game. lol.

Wenger's tactic for that game was to attack them to keep that Mario Gotze guy from touching the ball. When it was made perfectly clear that it wasn't working, the team looked in trouble but got a lucky break with Dortmund being wasteful and RVP getting that 1 nil lead. Now, if I was Pat Rice, I'd have told them to hold on tooth and nail to that one nil victory. It didn't quite work but we saw a different approach at least. We looked more organised and players like Song and Kosienly looked better after half time. The focus was on defence and getting the result even if it was ugly. Not really what I like to see but at least it's something different and adapting to the situation. And remember...this is Pat Rice!

When it comes to Wenger's half time team talks....we ship in a further 5 goals like we did against Manure or 3 like we did yesterday. I've lost count of the amount of times this team has conceded a goal 5 minutes after Wenger's half time team talk. It happened again yesterday. How the mighty has fallen. It's a sad day. Was listening to Sunday Supplement and they told a story of when Pat Rice first started working with Wenger. Pat Rice was shouting at the players and Wenger sat him down and said that's not the Arsenal way, even though Pat has been at the club for years before Wenger. Pat looks pathetic on the touchline and a yes man because that's down to Wenger's influence and how he wants things to be run. Wenger's influence stretches too far and we need a change because the players just aren't responding to his ways.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I can't agree with not putting pressure on Wenger to deliver. And when I say that, I don't talk in terms of demanding silverware, but demands that he does the things that increase the likelihood of silverware. They don't and have not done this, because their demands are purely financial.

[Özim]

I can't agree with not putting pressure on Wenger to deliver. And when I say that, I don't talk in terms of demanding silverware, but demands that he does the things that increase the likelihood of silverware. They don't and have not done this, because their demands are purely financial.
That maybe true but Wenger is also totally focussed on finances, how many managers do you hear talking about making profits for the club?

He's forgotten his job is to manage the team and make them as successful as they can be, basically IMO he has not pride in what should actually be his job.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Like I said, that is where the emphasis has been. If Wenger's objectives and focus differed from that of the Board, I'd have expected him to have been gone some time ago. No Board focussing on the performance of the team and reputatation of the Club would have put up with what for a supposed top Club, has been ritual and pretty full on humiliation.

[Power n Glory]

I can't agree with not putting pressure on Wenger to deliver. And when I say that, I don't talk in terms of demanding silverware, but demands that he does the things that increase the likelihood of silverware. They don't and have not done this, because their demands are purely financial.

But who are they to tell Wenger how to get results? Wenger is a very stubborn guy and likes his own way just as a pointed out in my last post regarding his relationship with Pat Rice. When hearing that, I'm not surprised that he hasn't kept guys like Keown or Adams on for coaching roles because he doesn't want people undermining his authority. The Board cocked up with the David Dein move and they handed Wenger the keys to the kingdom when we went that long period without a Dein type figure next to Wenger, they can be blamed for that.

But what can they possible suggest to him that would increase our likely hood of winning silverware without dictating to him like an Abramovich, Real Madrid sort of regime? Wenger wouldn't have that and for years for Board have kept telling fans that they will give Wenger the funds if he wants them, they are supportive but if he wants to spend £13m on Oxlade Chamerlain and not £15m on Samba or Cahill, what are they going to tell him? "You're wrong Wenger, buy a CB and we'll have a better chance of winning a title"....who on the board can tell him that? Why should it take board member to tell him what it takes to win silverware? They're money men and don't have a clue about football, nowhere near as much as Wenger, anyway. I don't think they should have to tell him to buy but I think that's what actually happened on transfer deadline day. I think Gazdis has put pressure on him on to do something because he's very aware of how upset the fans are and he's probably warning Wenger that things can get ugly. But Wenger seems to think it's a media witch hunt that has whipped the fans into a frenzy. He's losing it.

When the board starts dipping their toes in this sort of thing, it gets messy. Being there to back him him and support him is good, but if they have to start suggesting things he hasn't already seen, then he's in trouble. Imagine a mechanic taking advice from an accountant on how to fix an engine oil leak. Has it really come to this?

[alexander]

We are in a similar position to spurs and liverpool a few years back, before they got Redknapp in, and `pool got rid of Woy.

We need a big change, changing players has not worked, so the manager has to go.

How long do people think wenger will be given, really, no jokes. Surely the board will only let this go on for so long.

[notwist]

But who are they to tell Wenger how to get results? Wenger is a very stubborn guy and likes his own way just as a pointed out in my last post regarding his relationship with Pat Rice. When hearing that, I'm not surprised that he hasn't kept guys like Keown or Adams on for coaching roles because he doesn't want people undermining his authority. The Board cocked up with the David Dein move and they handed Wenger the keys to the kingdom when we went that long period without a Dein type figure next to Wenger, they can be blamed for that.

But what can they possible suggest to him that would increase our likely hood of winning silverware without dictating to him like an Abramovich, Real Madrid sort of regime? Wenger wouldn't have that and for years for Board have kept telling fans that they will give Wenger the funds if he wants them, they are supportive but if he wants to spend £13m on Oxlade Chamerlain and not £15m on Samba or Cahill, what are they going to tell him? "You're wrong Wenger, buy a CB and we'll have a better chance of winning a title"....who on the board can tell him that? Why should it take board member to tell him what it takes to win silverware? They're money men and don't have a clue about football, nowhere near as much as Wenger, anyway. I don't think they should have to tell him to buy but I think that's what actually happened on transfer deadline day. I think Gazdis has put pressure on him on to do something because he's very aware of how upset the fans are and he's probably warning Wenger that things can get ugly. But Wenger seems to think it's a media witch hunt that has whipped the fans into a frenzy. He's losing it.

When the board starts dipping their toes in this sort of thing, it gets messy. Being there to back him him and support him is good, but if they have to start suggesting things he hasn't already seen, then he's in trouble. Imagine a mechanic taking advice from an accountant on how to fix an engine oil leak. Has it really come to this?

Totally agree with that. The thing is everything has got so muddled and fucked over the summer. Wenger actually admitted he doesn't know how this team will turn out. He just paniced at the end of the transfer window and bought what was left on the shelves. It may work but probably won't. But it is no way to run a football club and that is the reason he must go. His youth experiment didn't work because he invested too many years in the likes of Vela and Bendtner and never had any interest in the defence. He now has this weird zonal marking shit which Liverpool abandoned because it was a disaster. It is one panic on top of another. At least with project youth we had kind of an excuse that it was all about the future. Now it is just silly and someone needs to come in and make a fresh start. This situation is NOT recoverable.

[Xhaka Can’t]

But who are they to tell Wenger how to get results? Wenger is a very stubborn guy and likes his own way just as a pointed out in my last post regarding his relationship with Pat Rice. When hearing that, I'm not surprised that he hasn't kept guys like Keown or Adams on for coaching roles because he doesn't want people undermining his authority. The Board cocked up with the David Dein move and they handed Wenger the keys to the kingdom when we went that long period without a Dein type figure next to Wenger, they can be blamed for that.

But what can they possible suggest to him that would increase our likely hood of winning silverware without dictating to him like an Abramovich, Real Madrid sort of regime? Wenger wouldn't have that and for years for Board have kept telling fans that they will give Wenger the funds if he wants them, they are supportive but if he wants to spend £13m on Oxlade Chamerlain and not £15m on Samba or Cahill, what are they going to tell him? "You're wrong Wenger, buy a CB and we'll have a better chance of winning a title"....who on the board can tell him that? Why should it take board member to tell him what it takes to win silverware? They're money men and don't have a clue about football, nowhere near as much as Wenger, anyway. I don't think they should have to tell him to buy but I think that's what actually happened on transfer deadline day. I think Gazdis has put pressure on him on to do something because he's very aware of how upset the fans are and he's probably warning Wenger that things can get ugly. But Wenger seems to think it's a media witch hunt that has whipped the fans into a frenzy. He's losing it.

When the board starts dipping their toes in this sort of thing, it gets messy. Being there to back him him and support him is good, but if they have to start suggesting things he hasn't already seen, then he's in trouble. Imagine a mechanic taking advice from an accountant on how to fix an engine oil leak. Has it really come to this?

I can't disagree with your points about interference. But if the criteria Wenger is to be judged by is footballing success, then when he does not meet that, he should be sacked. That point has long since passed. But hey, we are still (for the time being) printing money.

So they're happy, and we the fans who are printing the money for them are 'ungrateful' and 'impatient'

I can't think of a group of fans, and I count myself among them, who have been more patient.

[Niall_Quinn]

The board should take credit some credit for getting such a huge fee for the Nasri deal. Wenger was prepared to let him walk on a free. Plus he's the one that convinced the Board to sell Cesc for cheap.

Wenger doesn't like to spend big on players and it was the same at Monaco. We spent a lot on deadline day but it was probably impossible to spend it all on deadline day because we left ourselves with little time. Plus, you have to question for the sort of players Wenger wants. Gervinho is decent buy he's not the best winger we could have bought. He's bought 3 CB's over the past 2 seasons and look how it's turned out. He goes for value all the time. He's a bargain bin shopper. The type of guy that would walk into Primark over some luxury designer clothes store to spend £200. That' always been his mentality.

Agreed, agreed, agreed. Everything you're saying makes sense. But you are also effectively saying the board is one giant Wenger whipped lapdog. This alone is enough to warrant them walking. We need tough winners in every position, on the pitch, in the dugout, in the board room. Of course if they aren't Wenger whipped lapdogs that throws up another batch of compelling reasons for them to walk. They've failed, Wenger has failed. Let them make all their excuses but the game now becomes how to get them out and a proper team in who can restore the club to it's rightful place. Somebody on here was complaining about our arrogance, the belief we are entitled to be top dog. I'm guilty of that no doubt, and I wouldn't change it. I won't hand these guys the ridiculous amounts of money they demand for their sub-standard product, not any more. But it would scare the shit out of me to sit down and calculate the amount of money I've forked over to Arsenal Football Club over decades. If they wanted £3 to stand in a field then my feeling of entitlement suddenly vanishes. This is not disrespect to the other teams in the league, it is a demand for respect from the people taking my money. That's how it should work surely? I think the bargain shopping is probably Wenger's pet but who's going to say the board hasn't done rather well out of it themselves?

[Coney]

I can't agree with not putting pressure on Wenger to deliver. And when I say that, I don't talk in terms of demanding silverware, but demands that he does the things that increase the likelihood of silverware. They don't and have not done this, because their demands are purely financial.

If their demands are purely financial, do you not think that they are aware that not making 4th loses a lot of dosh, being low in the PL and starting to have trouble filling the stadium loses even more. They need success, even if it for a different reason than us.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Agreed, agreed, agreed. Everything you're saying makes sense. But you are also effectively saying the board is one giant Wenger whipped lapdog. This alone is enough to warrant them walking. We need tough winners in every position, on the pitch, in the dugout, in the board room. Of course if they aren't Wenger whipped lapdogs that throws up another batch of compelling reasons for them to walk. They've failed, Wenger has failed. Let them make all their excuses but the game now becomes how to get them out and a proper team in who can restore the club to it's rightful place. Somebody on here was complaining about our arrogance, the belief we are entitled to be top dog. I'm guilty of that no doubt, and I wouldn't change it. I won't hand these guys the ridiculous amounts of money they demand for their sub-standard product, not any more. But it would scare the shit out of me to sit down and calculate the amount of money I've forked over to Arsenal Football Club over decades. If they wanted £3 to stand in a field then my feeling of entitlement suddenly vanishes. This is not disrespect to the other teams in the league, it is a demand for respect from the people taking my money. That's how it should work surely? I think the bargain shopping is probably Wenger's pet but who's going to say the board hasn't done rather well out of it themselves?

Agreee totally NQ Untill the old farts like PHW leave nothing will change well at least in the board room. A new manager would still face the same problems only diffrence is hin influnce on the team will be diffrent.

[Xhaka Can’t]

If their demands are purely financial, do you not think that they are aware that not making 4th loses a lot of dosh, being low in the PL and starting to have trouble filling the stadium loses even more. They need success, even if it for a different reason than us.

Finishing 4th is not success and it became so common place they figured we could keep stripping the assets without paying a price.

Then we got buttfucked 8-2.

Then we went on a panic buying spree.

But hey, it's too late.

The one saving grace, so I thought was that Liverpool would take our top 4 place. Now it looks like it'll be Spurs.

Fuckin magic eh?

[Olivier's xmas twist]

You know what's funny, the one game where we showed true defensive grit and really clung on when under pressure was the Dortmund game and that display came after Pat Rice had his half time team talk and shouted at them. Schzney did say he shouts a lot after the game. lol.

Wenger's tactic for that game was to attack them to keep that Mario Gotze guy from touching the ball. When it was made perfectly clear that it wasn't working, the team looked in trouble but got a lucky break with Dortmund being wasteful and RVP getting that 1 nil lead. Now, if I was Pat Rice, I'd have told them to hold on tooth and nail to that one nil victory. It didn't quite work but we saw a different approach at least. We looked more organised and players like Song and Kosienly looked better after half time. The focus was on defence and getting the result even if it was ugly. Not really what I like to see but at least it's something different and adapting to the situation. And remember...this is Pat Rice!

When it comes to Wenger's half time team talks....we ship in a further 5 goals like we did against Manure or 3 like we did yesterday. I've lost count of the amount of times this team has conceded a goal 5 minutes after Wenger's half time team talk. It happened again yesterday. How the mighty has fallen. It's a sad day. Was listening to Sunday Supplement and they told a story of when Pat Rice first started working with Wenger. Pat Rice was shouting at the players and Wenger sat him down and said that's not the Arsenal way, even though Pat has been at the club for years before Wenger. Pat looks pathetic on the touchline and a yes man because that's down to Wenger's influence and how he wants things to be run. Wenger's influence stretches too far and we need a change because the players just aren't responding to his ways.

This, But if Wengers influnce is big makes no diffrence talking about really does it, if like you say he has a hold over the board then he is never going to get sacked so its a waste even posting the board should sack wenger.

What we need is for someone on the board to Stand up and say arsenal are being made mugs off and things need to change. Nina has tried but no one listens to her.

People keep saying we need Dein back, is he the right way to go. tbh i just don't know what the answer is anymore.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Finishing 4th is not success and it became so common place they figured we could keep stripping the assets without paying a price.

Then we got buttfucked 8-2.

Then we went on a panic buying spree.

But hey, it's too late.

The one saving grace, so I thought was that Liverpool would take our top 4 place. Now it looks like it'll be Spurs.Fuckin magic eh?

Nah it will be pool spurs will loose a lot of games The Europa league will get in their way pool have no distractions tbh they are favs for 4th and with kenny they should get it.

we won't be have a st totterings day this season though put it that way

[Power n Glory]

[/B]

This, But if Wengers influnce is big makes no diffrence talking about really does it, if like you say he has a hold over the board then he is never going to get sacked so its a waste even posting the board should sack wenger.

What we need is for someone on the board to Stand up and say arsenal are being made mugs off and things need to change. Nina has tried but no one listens to her.

People keep saying we need Dein back, is he the right way to go. tbh i just don't know what the answer is anymore.

When we fail to qualify for the Champions League and attendance figures start dropping, they'll give him the boot. Money talks. Gazidis and Stan know this club has worldwide appeal and potential and you can only grow that appeal if you're winning titles and in the Champions League. They'll sack Wenger if he keeps going at this pace.

[Coney]

When we fail to qualify for the Champions League and attendance figures start dropping, they'll give him the boot. Money talks. Gazidis and Stan know this club has worldwide appeal and potential and you can only grow that appeal if you're winning titles and in the Champions League. They'll sack Wenger if he keeps going at this pace.

I'd hate to see Wenger leaving in that way, but unless he sorts things out PDQ, then that is going to be the inevitable consequence. He is now in the position of the team having lost confidence and that is probably the hardest test of a manager. Having a team that does not have the full skillset required is one thing, having a team with no confidence - and possibly no confidence that the manager can turn it round - is a different matter.