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i want us to win the EL. I am still naïvely clinging to the hope that Wenger will leave after the EL win and on a high.
Also I do disagree with Zim about Wenger being an average manager. He has won 3 league titles and has won the FA Cup more times than any other manager. I know he has been here a long time but lets not totally rewrite history and forget the job he did at the start.
A "poor" season? Just one of those things?Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Or a season that yet again confirms every point Wenger's critics have been making for years? And what are those critics saying now? Even one more year will make things worse. So why are you going on about eternal life? He will definitely leave "at some point"? Well it should be right now, today, based on his record. But there's not enough pressure to force it. Your indifference to the departure date is the very type of complacency and lack of ambition and drive that has put the club in the shit, is it not?
This is like a war of attrition. If Wenger can just endure long enough then his critics will give up. This season is a reflection of that. So many fans thought the old fraud would do the decent thing and fuck off last season. But he didn't, to his legacy killing shame. And even some of his most strident opponents said, fuck it, I'm done. The surest way of Wenger being here for the foreseeable future is if the pressure drops and everyone instead focuses on "triumph" in a competition that clubs like Madrid and Barca and now even the gypos would see as a huge backward slide.
Complacency at its finest. Mediocrity manifest.
Nobody is rewriting history. It doesn't need to be rewritten to state, based on the evidence, Wenger is a shit manager today. And has been for years. That's what the record states. That's what the results tell us. And it's also history that shouldn't be and can't be rewritten.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumble
Clough was a great manager. Then he was the biggest liability in the game. That's history too.
I disagree with Zim about Wenger being an average manager too. He's not that good. Look at the league table. Look at our European record in the competition that counts. Look at the woeful string of PL collapses year after year. He's not even been close to doing anything significant for well over a decade.
He's an absolute fraud. He's convinced so many fans that winning the little stuff makes him a big guy. The truth is he's a second rate has-been, a sad and pathetic old fool who doesn't know when to call it a day and doesn't care if he's dragging this club down to his level provided he keeps his job as emperor of his little fantasy kingdom.
And his legacy is shot to hell with many fans now, and rightly so. His selfishness far outweighs his achievements at this stage.
Who cares if he leaves on a high, we've had years of frustration thanks to him and he's turned this club into some business that's only interested in money and puts results a firm 2nd.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumble
As for him being average, based on his entire career with us it is average, 20+ years and look at his major achievements 3 league titles over 14 years ago, the FA Cups in his early spell fair enough, those were big prizes too, but later on not so much as the FA Cup is very much a 2nd tier trophy. His record in Europe makes for sorry reading as well, he's harped on about how he's qualified for x amount of years and yet not once managed to win it, despite at some stage having the best team in the competition, very poor show really.
You can't look at those early successes in isolation, you have to look at his whole tenure with us, on that basis he's average.
Leave on a high :lol:
I hope we lose every game until he leaves :lol:
Thought about this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
He was above average when he arrived and overcame a number of challenges to make us into a team that was quite simply breathtaking. For a good reason.
Now the team just makes you want to breath your last breath rather than watch another 90 minutes of....well....I can’t describe it. I just know I want no part of it.
The game has passed him by and this coupled with him ditching just about all the qualities that mad him good have turned him into a manager that is waaaaaay below average.
I'd have forgiven him everything had he not made that incredibly selfish end-run around the board last season. That was unforgivable. And look at us now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall Quinn
I'd easily, without a moment's thought, swap an EL win this year for him having left at the end of last season. Now the thought he might use such a win to stay even longer, it's the deal breaker - I'll probably be done with football if that happens. I'm almost done with it now, and Wenger is at least 75% responsible for that with the general shit state of the super hyped carnival being guilty for the remainder.
Wenger was there when football was the best I ever remembered, not because we were winning, but because we were winning with such spectacular style. The football was enthralling, invigorating, everything that used to make it worth watching this sport, and more. Unforgettable. He played his part.
All those years ago.
And I'm not going to forget what he's done since, to tarnish everything that went before.
Damn. This guy has made a hundred million quid at Arsenal. Why couldn't he just fuck off when the time was right? He'd be the legend of legends now. I thought he was supposed to be an intelligent guy.
The question is, does Wenger already think he's done enough by getting to the EL semi-final?
everyone agrees Atletico is a CL-standard team so even if we lose, but only narrowly, then I'm betting he'll use that as an excuse
And if we get to the final, then definitely i think he will say that's good enough, having beaten a CL-standard team to get there.
i've said it before but i really remember his reaction when we beat Man City in the FAC SF last season - he jumped up thinking 'that's it I've done enough now, it won't matter if we lose to Chelsea in the final, i'll get a new contract'
I think he does.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac76
I also think he willl use the Atletico have been a consistent CL semi-finalist / finalist over the past few years as justification for us going out.
Then we will get the "I have been here 20 years, I have built the club up, I have built the new stadium, everybody should show me some respect" blah blah blah
He really is tiring, I really wish he would just go. :rolleyes:
I'd swap that first FA cup for him leaving that summer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn