In a flash.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
But he won't. He'll only get worse.
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In a flash.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
But he won't. He'll only get worse.
Surprised Chelsea haven't gone in for him to be honest, he could room with John Terry and they could have fun on evenings in watching old episodes of the black and white minstrel show.Quote:
Originally Posted by Edinburgh Gooner
I personally just don't think he fits in with the style adopted by Chelsea even when his old boss Benitez was thereQuote:
Originally Posted by Suarez Is Boss
He's lost most of his main attributes from when he first moved to England, not least his pace.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
He's just a glorified work horse now, an admirable hard worker lacking in any confidence who still manages to scrabble +3s against FC Nordsjaelland Reserves but ultimately he's withered away into nothing. It's quite sad really, because he was a frightening player at times for us, now he's just a shell of a man.
Leave Wenfer alone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Suarez Is Boss
Who was the better player for your lot out of Suarez and Torres?Quote:
Originally Posted by Suarez Is Boss
Or this:Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_gN7zlpnz8
Suarez wouldn't like that at all...he'd think the black man should know his place and be thankful and flattered that the white man is ogling his wife.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Splinter
I'll fudge the answer. Best all round player is Suarez, no question. Simply as a goalscorer and striker, Torres.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grebbo
But if I could only choose one, Suarez. Ignoring all the crap that comes with him.
The fact Torres played in a much more settled, balanced and quite simply higher-quality team in every area of the pitch also bolsters the case for Suarez.Quote:
Originally Posted by Suarez Is Boss
#TeamSuarez.
Sorry.
I thought his position - particularly the point in relation to understanding why people don't want to play to the corporate agenda was crystal clear. In fact NQ's entire posting history pretty much supports not parting with money to support a corporate agenda that is almost completely unaligned to the interests of supporters of a football club.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
To reach the conclusion you arrived at is baffling.
Jens' Face woz rite.
Good for you!Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve French
But the better commercial deals are on the table now and they haven't been linked to success on the field at all, unless the constant 4th place finishes are viewed as success in the business world. Undoubtedly they are and this is where the huge disconnect with the fans exists. And the share price has the potential to rocket to looney levels with Usmanov already overbidding for every share he can get. The fact is, if you look at it from a business angle Arsenal is a tremendous success, the model example. They've managed to do all this without paying a blind bit of attention to the fans asking where the quality has gone or criticising the lack of ambition. I'm saying as long as we continue to look at this as fans (which is of course understandable) we probably don't get close to what the agenda of the club actually is because we're not looking in the same places.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Seriously though, I have made the case so many times it even bores the shit out of me. You want me to clarify and strength something you refuse to acknowledge exists. What's the point of that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
He said that in an interview recently. Everyone who doesn't see it (precisely) his way is a "hater". The guy should be in care.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
I actually think the amount we make in commerical revenue is quite paltry compared to what we could get, unless your saying the Board is greedy but they are not that greedy.
I think you'd also have to use a magic wand to explain away the wage bill before what your suggesting makes sense.
i think we have made two major deals commerically in the last 6-12 months....one is the re-negotiation for the Emirates stadium naming rights, the other is the spoken about in hushed tones kit deal we might have with Puma from 2014 onwards....other than that our marketing strategy has been extremely limited....it wasn't until two years ago that the board put it's foot down with Wenger and told him he had to start taking the squad to Asia on pre-season tours because we were missing out on the potential cash cow over there.
And you think about the profit we have generated it's largely been through player sales....i discussed this with a friend the other day.....i can't think of a season in the last ten years where our outlays were in excess of the money we generated on selling our players. I don't really see that as a genius business model it's like a billionaire industrialist in china only turning a profit by selling twenty percent of his factories every year....which would be fine if you were a asset stripping venture capitalist....but these people seem to be here for the long haul.
And for Arsenal this form of profit generation is rather short-termist because you would agree i think that we don't exactly have that much on offer left to keep the money coming in.
All in all i think your giving the board and people like Gazidis a credit for something they don't deserve, the board in itself are very conservative and are adverse to any risk taking of any kind and i think this has hamstrung them because if they were in it to make money (which is not in itself a bad thing) they would be doing much more than they are currently to make us a global brand which we are not.
Our commercial deals were so poor to the point where if we didn't sell our best players we wouldn't actually make much of a profit at all.
And that was the hidden asset value in the club that attracted the likes of Kroenke. He's not here for the long term. Get in, get out. That's what this guy is all about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
Yes, I agree with you. This is definitely short termism, absolutely no doubt about that. The possibility of short term takings is a huge bonus for investors. I mean Kroenke has gone way beyond having to plan for his retirement, right? It was the fucked up state of the commercials that had been put in place by people absolutely desperate to drive the share price and then cash out that likely attracted the Kroenke shark in the first place. Somewhere along the line our previous shareholders had a dramatic change in philosophy, I'm betting after DHW died and that utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, utter, **** PHW took over. I think that's when they realised they could cash in on the new money laden, mega TV deal version of football (the version we don't really recognise) and turn their £7.52 investment into a £500mill cash out. And I think everything that has been done at this club since then was in line with that agenda and I also think a repeat performance is playing out as we speak.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
To see it I think you have to set aside being a fan for a moment and look at it from a business point of view. The fucked up commercials were gold dust in reality. What;s the whole point of corporate investment? Buy low sell high. That's Arsenal in a nutshell. And you've spotted the short term nature of the deal. Yes, of course, the club has to die once all the profit taking has concluded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
Peter Hill-Wood became chairman in 1982, if he was asset stripping the club (which really wouldn't do him much good as his stake-holding in the club is pretty small...less than 1% i think) he's taking an awful long time about doing it. Hill-Wood is no different to his father they are all from a long line of semi-aristocratic Tories from the city....that's why we were known for years as the Bank of England Club. Stuff shirted immovable old buffers who don't like change remember the "we don't need his sort here" quote from everyone's favourite octagenerian in 2007 regarding Stan Kroenke. Kroenke was welcomed to the club as the lesser of two evils to Alisher Usmanov who really is a vile human being with links to human trafficking amongst other things.
Kroenke is hardly a philanthropist by any stretch of the imagination, but his history in sports investment hardly indicates a cut and run approach....his Colorado based franchises he has owned for 10-15 years now with no indication that he is looking to sell at all.
He likes our self-sustaining model because it means he can be as hands off as he likes, i think if he had his way he'd never come over to England.....and he is tolerated because he doesn't interfere in the day to day running of the club.
brilliant. :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
One of the Colorado based franchises he owns is the Colorado Avalanche. They were a premier club in the NHL. When Kroenke bought them they were top class and laden with stars. Shortly after his purchase they won their 2nd President's Trophy and went on to win the Stanley Cup. The team also held the league record for consecutive games sold out. Since then, they have regularly traded away their top players and at points have just about paid above the salary cap payroll floor (the minimum spend on wages an NHL team can make) http://www.capgeek.com/payrolls/Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
The team as a result, suck - big time. Have a look at the league table for last year http://www.nhl.com/ice/standings.htm...nav-stn-league
But its OK because the Avs are a profitable team.
suarez clause is nothing but an inform him of the bid. they want 50, we wont pay it.
we're signing gareth barry and thats it.
fuck this
please, god, no. :ilt:Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
LOL, even ollie's cracked.
Worst summer ever.
I wouldn't worry about it too much, surely there;ll be worse to come.Quote:
Originally Posted by AKBapologist
Spurs buying Suarez?
thats done it for me. i was completely wrong, and we got fucked over by an agent too. pissed liverpool off, after believing an agent when its now clear there is nothing there. ive got this wrong and ill hold my hands up to it. the lot of them can fuck off. bidding that extra quid has now cost us any chance of getting him at all. no excuses.Quote:
Suárez has made no representation to the Premier League to seek adjudication on whether Arsenal’s provocative bid of one pound over £40 million obliged Liverpool to sell.
Arsenal believed their offer, submitted last week, would trigger an exit clause in the Uruguayan’s contract, a suggestion the Anfield board rejected instantly.
Liverpool are unmoved by any suggestion there is any ambiguity and are adamant if the Premier League was to adjudicate on any dispute the club’s position would be validated further.
The lack of any approach does not suggest confidence on the part of the striker’s advisers. Club lawyers and those of Fenway Sports Group are definite about the details of Suárez’s contract and believe the 26-year-old’s agent, Pere Guardiola, is well aware Arsenal’s £40 million bid was far too low.
“We’ve all examined the clause in detail,” a senior Liverpool figure said. “All it obliges is for us to enter good faith negotiations about Luis’s future. There is absolutely no obligation to sell and that is very clear.”
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Liverpool themselves could request the Premier League to ask Arsenal on what basis they bid £40,000,001. It is contrary to League regulations for a rival club to be given access to confidential contract details of an opposing player. There are no Liverpool plans at this stage to pursue a complaint against the Londoners, although at the highest level of the Merseyside club there is a feeling bidding an additional pound was "rubbing Liverpool’s noses in it".
It has ensured no further approaches by Arsenal are welcome at Anfield.
Liverpool, meanwhile, have agreed a loan deal for Benfica left back Lorenzo Melgarejo but will require a work permit if they are to proceed with signing of the Paraguay international.
http://metro.co.uk/2013/07/30/gareth...uarez-3905440/Quote:
Originally Posted by AKBapologist
:lol:
Dear Lord, Ollie is also depressed... we might as well shoot ourselves now :ilt:
I acknowledge it, I just don't agree with it. As said, if we're talking in the realms of business and greed, it makes no sense for the club to play such games with their number 1 asset and not in his final year of contract. I've never understood why the Board let the wage bill increase but act so cheap when it comes to transfer fees. It doesn't make sense at all for them to be okay with the wages but not with the fees. Surely they'd look to keep both at a low cost?Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
I think Wenger's latest interview gives a lot away. He prefers to work with young players and to nurture talent. He values hard work and as a result we lost key players because they were unwilling to wait. The numbers and sales match the theory. I find it hard to believe that we'd penny pinch on transfers but nobody blinks when it comes to signing contract extensions.
Quote:
"The egos are big, but you must know that a person, no matter how big a star he is, is ready to listen to you if it meets his needs," he explained.
"Unfortunately in management, you cannot cheat for a long time. When you are in a squad of 30 people, the players detect at a huge speed the weakness in your personality. If they think you are the man who can help them, they will respect you.
"The next step for them is deciding whether they are in a squad who can help them to be successful. We had that problem when we were under financially-restricted conditions.
"At Arsenal we have fought against the policy of only buying stars. For some players, we didn't have enough stars to be successful as quickly as they wanted to be."
Quote:
"One of our strengths is young people know we will give them a chance. We try to look all over the world to find players who have the talent and desire," he explained.
"But what we look for is their motivation to be successful. You also need consistency in your motivation and that is what we try to test in players as well.
"For me that is a very underrated quality. It means they are determined and they are ready to hurt themselves to be successful, and that's the type we are looking for - the people that are very demanding with themselves, and each other for a long time."
It's a bloody shambles. Deadline day it is then.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
I'm done trying to make sense of what is non-sensical.
The Owners, Board, CEO and Manager are all money grubbing ****s.
deadline day? there wont be that this year. fucking patheticQuote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Was that down to Stan or due to the salary cap ruling? I really don't know much about NHL but it seems unfair to lay the blame on Stan if a salary cap gets imposed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve French
I think there will be. We'll sign players but there won't be any high profile stars moving here. But it really is pathetic. We're going to gamble again.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
whats the point of signing players who wont improve us? the club knew we needed big players, and have completely failed to act on that. its august this week and nothing. i was optimistic and hopeful we would go big, but the board and wenger havnt. they've fucked around, no one has stood up to wenger and done what they should have done and hes dithered. its unbelievable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
The salary cap has a ceiling (max you can spend) and a floor (minimum you can spend).Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Guess where Stan took the Avs to?
no champs league football there. any signings we make will be after the cl play off imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by AKBapologist