Newcastle v Arsenal. League Cup Semi Final Second Leg. 5th Feb. 20:00

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Originally Posted by IBK

More worrying is the fact that by all accounts we looked utterly spent...and that our vulnerability to quick transitions when playing far too high up the pitch has been a distinct feature of this season.

As much as I thought winning the LC would be good for the players (and I stand by that) maybe it's not such a bad thing to be beaten by Liverpool in the final or even worse Spuds. In retrospect we should really have played kids/reserves in that competition from start to finish, where it's good experience and losing would not be something to criticise anyone for

I'm sure Dubai will help, and it's as silly to look at last night's game and conclude that we are a shit team as it is for us to look at Sunday and believe we are world beaters. But our frailties and squad deficiencies are there for all to see, and looking across the current season, this is not a team that is going to win anything, alas.

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yes we are spent but I do think Dubai will help.

I also think Arteta is going to have to think ever more laterally - e.g. from what it says about Butler-Oyedeji on the website, he's played a bit in League One, where teams mix it a bit, can he really not be given 15-20 minutes at at the end of a game to give Havertz a breather?

As for not winning anything, the league is gone and yes the CL looks like a very remote possibility, especially with Martinelli now out

I think Arteta will hopefully get funds this summer to either get Isak or Sesko or the like, plus one or two more, but then he's got one more season AFAIC before serious questions have to be asked

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Originally Posted by Letters

Just watched that second goal again :haha:

FFS, what is this obsession with playing out from the back? I'm not saying you never do it but when you're being closed down by that and all the players near you are marked, just get rid of it ffs!

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we've actually been kicking it long a lot more recently tbf, although with mixed results, but yes not good on that goal

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Originally Posted by Mac76

As for not winning anything, the league is gone

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I have no idea why people are conceding that this early.

<KeggyKeegle>We're still fighting for this title, and he's got to go to Everton and get something, and... and... I'll tell you, honestly, I will love it if we beat them, love it!</KeggyKeegle>

If they beat Everton next week then yeah, I think it's over. But even if Everton draw...if gives us a bit of a chance. They didn't win their other game in hand.
As Oscar Wilde once said, "it ain't over till it's over".

For the record, if I was a betting man I'd definitely be putting my money on Liverpool. I just don't accept it's a done deal.

Between the last international break and now we’ve had to play 21 games in 74 days. That is an average of a game every 3.5 days basically. With the injuries and what have you….its actually kind of impressive that we only lost twice (and in the least important of all the competitions, yeah we are out of the fa cup but technically that was a draw).

There’s been very little rotation to speak of, mainly because we haven’t been able to

It’s shit losing to Newcastle three times in one season for sure, but to be honest especially given my attitude towards the league cup I don’t feel any grounds to feel particularly resentful towards the players or the coach about this defeat

Don’t think this will have any knock on effects simply because I don’t think the desire for cup success is there within this squad or coach. Limp cup exits have been a recurring theme every season.

Just need to take our medicine and move on. If Dubai can recharge the batteries like it did last year then cool.

We’re probably going to win fuck all again for the 5th season running though which isn’t a good look for a club that’s spent it’s way into a position to win things.

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Originally Posted by Mac76

we've actually been kicking it long a lot more recently tbf, although with mixed results, but yes not good on that goal

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I guess the reasoning is if you boot it long there's a 50/50 chance you'll win the ball - so half the time you're immediately conceding possession. Obviously that percentage depends how good your midfielders are at winning the ball vs theirs. So I get the reasoning of playing it out - you're in control of the ball from the start. But you need the players to do it and you need to know when to do it. When you're under pressure and all the players nearby are being marked - just boot it. Worst that can happen is you'll lose possession, you won't immediately concede a goal like we did last night. Just poor decision making.

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Originally Posted by IBK

Not going to weep into my cornflakes over this result.

The tie was effectively won in the first leg, given that (yes HCZ ;) ) Newcastle are a team that have our number - particularly at their place.

I'll admit to having only seen the 'highlights' and read the reports (was in late and frantically trying to get my Now TV day pass when I heard in radio commentary that Isak had scored - didn't realise that it was disallowed :pal: - and saved myself £15).

While Sunday's result built a bit of confidence going into this game, it now seems clear that Citeh played into our hands a bit - but with game state pressure and against a team that (1) has a midfield; (2) is excellent in transition and (3) knows how to defend - we were humbled. It's almost embarrassing the ease with which Newcastle dealt with us in this tie.

More worrying is the fact that by all accounts we looked utterly spent...and that our vulnerability to quick transitions when playing far too high up the pitch has been a distinct feature of this season.

I'm sure Dubai will help, and it's as silly to look at last night's game and conclude that we are a shit team as it is for us to look at Sunday and believe we are world beaters. But our frailties and squad deficiencies are there for all to see, and looking across the current season, this is not a team that is going to win anything, alas.

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I don't think we were spent, not all the players anyway. I think the players were too inflexible in dealing with a brighter than expected Newcastle. Against city we saw Partey snapping into challenges and distributing the ball upfield. Against Newcastle he was marking empty space in the middle and had reverted to ball retention instead of distribution. Havertz played with his back to goal. Martinelli was receiving the ball in coverage rather than having it played into space in front of him. Yes you could say that's because Newcastle had a more energetic midfield than city, but I don't think it was that, I think we were less aggressive than in the city match, which may have come across as looking tired.

It was bad tactics. We knew Newcastle could play on the break and we didn't really have anything in the locker to counter that. We should have been taking advantage of them playing on the break, encouraging them to do it so we could get the ball back when they were at thir most vulnerable. Trouble is our defence didn't have the best of nights because I don't think they ere supported as energetically by the midfield.

It was interesting, all I could find last night was a stream with no sound so I watched the game in silence. No opinions from the commentators, just what I saw happening on the pitch. Rice, our MOTM on Sunday, and particularly Partey looked like they were refs rather than players, almost as if they were delibertly trying not to get in the way. Partey was often 30 yards off the play. As if we were fearful of what Newcastle could do. Bad tactics.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I don't think we were spent, not all the players anyway. I think the players were too inflexible in dealing with a brighter than expected Newcastle. Against city we saw Partey snapping into challenges and distributing the ball upfield. Against Newcastle he was marking empty space in the middle and had reverted to ball retention instead of distribution. Havertz played with his back to goal. Martinelli was receiving the ball in coverage rather than having it played into space in front of him. Yes you could say that's because Newcastle had a more energetic midfield than city, but I don't think it was that, I think we were less aggressive than in the city match, which may have come across as looking tired.

It was bad tactics. We knew Newcastle could play on the break and we didn't really have anything in the locker to counter that. We should have been taking advantage of them playing on the break, encouraging them to do it so we could get the ball back when they were at thir most vulnerable. Trouble is our defence didn't have the best of nights because I don't think they ere supported as energetically by the midfield.

It was interesting, all I could find last night was a stream with no sound so I watched the game in silence. No opinions from the commentators, just what I saw happening on the pitch. Rice, our MOTM on Sunday, and particularly Partey looked like they were refs rather than players, almost as if they were delibertly trying not to get in the way. Partey was often 30 yards off the play. As if we were fearful of what Newcastle could do. Bad tactics.

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Sometimes the other team just wants it more. This was everything to Newcastle. A club that hasn’t won anything for 70 years. They’d take finishing 17th and winning this if offered.

I don’t buy the fatigue side of things, we simply did not want this enough.

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

Sometimes the other team just wants it more. This was everything to Newcastle. A club that hasn’t won anything for 70 years. They’d take finishing 17th and winning this if offered.

I don’t buy the fatigue side of things, we simply did not want this enough.

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:gp:

Honestly, we don't care about the League Cup. We the fans or we the players. Sure, they want to win games, they're obviously very competitive guys. But they're not going to go out there giving it everything like they did on Sunday. Sometimes you have to pick your battles.

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Originally Posted by Letters

I have no idea why people are conceding that this early.

<KeggyKeegle>We're still fighting for this title, and he's got to go to Everton and get something, and... and... I'll tell you, honestly, I will love it if we beat them, love it!</KeggyKeegle>

If they beat Everton next week then yeah, I think it's over. But even if Everton draw...if gives us a bit of a chance. They didn't win their other game in hand.
As Oscar Wilde once said, "it ain't over till it's over".

For the record, if I was a betting man I'd definitely be putting my money on Liverpool. I just don't accept it's a done deal.

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I thought it was Lenny Kravitz

Anyway, no it’s not technically over. But there for me had to be a sign that we would be able to step in and take advantage of any Liverpool slip up. There have been some slip ups, we’ve taken advantage only then to give up that advantage in the next game.

Whilst I still believe that our strongest XI is better than theirs and that having Salah doesn’t make up the difference, they have seemingly more squad depth to call on up front. As much as I don’t rate Gakpo, in terms of goals at least there is more threat from him than Sterling or Trossard frankly. They’ve had their easy fixtures away from home sure but they seem able to navigate the harder fixtures too. It’s all about momentum, something we’ve simply not had at any time this season….i can’t remember winning more than three games in a row in all competitions (Liverpool have I think won four in a row on two occasions in the league and it’s been enough for them to notionally retain the advantage they’ve had over us since early November).
That’s the problem, we can say oh they are only x amount of points in front of us, and they are due for a downturn in results…but I’ve no faith we can take advantage of that. The sixteen wins in eighteen we got last season is beyond us, not because we aren’t as good but because we look too jaded.


You know how I feel, it’s for me a disgrace that we aren’t winning this title…and Arteta’s job should be forfeit. But whilst I’m still cross about it, you can only sustain anger so long until it becomes ambivalence and then indifference