Match Reaction v Aston Villa

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Originally Posted by ItsMe

It wasn't great for them, but i'll tell you what if our manager had delivered success as much and regularly as Ferguson has....you'd accept it as a blip. Our manager seems to be stuck in a permanent blip.

Like I said they respect Ferguson because he's earnt it and proved himself, Wenger BS all the time, comes out with lets face it nonsense and doesn't acknolwedge any of the flaws of his team...in addition he's delivered nothing in 7 years and still acts as if he knows it all....if that's the case why did Birmingham beat us in the CC final, why can't he win anything anymore, why do all his best players want out?

Let's stop comparing Ferguson with Wenger, one is a proven manager who's done it all, the other one is a clown who masquerades as a manager these days, it's like comparing a Ferrari to a Morris Minor.

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there we have it.

another win for the mighty TPS.

what's that, 7 years without a trophy for BWK? :lol:

and they charge the highest membership fees in the country :haha:

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Originally Posted by milla

Why would Klopp come to Arsenal? Dortmund is winning trophies left and right, playing in CL, has a 80000 seat stadium full to brim week in and week out, making profits every year and actually has a strong dynamic young team who loves to play or him. Why on earth would he leave Dortmund? lol. :coffee:

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Because despite Wumgers best efforts- Arsenal is still the bigger team. It's like asking an animator why he would want to join Disney??

And honestly why do people keep asking this silly question- despite how bad things are for us now, the only logically valid question still remains- "why wouldn't a manager want to come to Arsenal??" Here's the checklist:

1. History- check
2. Fan Base- check
3. Rich- check
4.Financial Stability- check
5. Supportive Board- check
6.Top Billing- check
7. Good players to work with- check
8. Job security/enabling enviornment- check
9. Best League in the world - check
and more important to a really ambitious manager is that we've now had a long period of failure/underachievement- and thus he now has a chance to right his name in the stars if he starts of kicking (just like AW did whjen he first came). Let's not forget that all Rafa had to do was win a CL and scousers worshiped him. Why didn't Di Matteo triumph have the same effect??

Also it doesn't hurt that AW probably earns trebble what Klopp earns ATM. In fact there is no manager in World football that we can't pay his wages comfortably.

Self defeatist gooners need to realise there is a big difference between sucking and actually being certifed shit.

The only thing thats certain is that we are not making any progress with wenger still in charge. I really didnt know that there were any dedicated AKB`s still out there, but they along with others like them will in time come around to seeing their way clear. Wenger wont leave Arsenal of his own volition because there is nothing out there for him. He cannot leave the comfort zone of a club tailor made to his eccenticities, where coming 3rd is treated like a major coup, becuase 4th was the actual target.
Why should wenger be immune from abuse because he won doubles 8 years or more ago. Sometimes i wonder if Bendtner or Henry had scored those crucial goals and we won the CL if we would EVER be able to see the back of him. Going by the words of some here, IF that had happened he would have been interred on the cente circle of the Emirates. Clubs like Pool, ManU erect statues to managers who have won truly great things but here we worship Wenger simply because we havent seen anyone better come through our doors.
He deserves whatever abuse he gets because he is doing a bad job and paid extraordinarily for our pain. The PMs and presidents get roundly crucified in every means possible and gets paid less for doing mauch more difficult jobs.

Everything boils down to the current mentality at this club. we have no great desire for success on the pitch and that comes from the board and wenger has taken this as his totem, nothing will change while either or both remain in place

Personally i dont give a monkeys about our performances. Only relegation would make me sad, only Wenger Leaving would make me feel like a fan again.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

Because despite Wumgers best efforts- Arsenal is still the bigger team. It's like asking an animator why he would want to join Disney??

And honestly why do people keep asking this silly question- despite how bad things are for us now, the only logically valid question still remains- "why wouldn't a manager want to come to Arsenal??" Here's the checklist:

1. History- check
2. Fan Base- check
3. Rich- check
4.Financial Stability- check
5. Supportive Board- check
6.Top Billing- check
7. Good players to work with- check
8. Job security/enabling enviornment- check
9. Best League in the world - check
and more important to a really ambitious manager is that we've now had a long period of failure/underachievement- and thus he now has a chance to right his name in the stars if he starts of kicking (just like AW did whjen he first came). Let's not forget that all Rafa had to do was win a CL and scousers worshiped him. Why didn't Di Matteo triumph have the same effect??

Also it doesn't hurt that AW probably earns trebble what Klopp earns ATM. In fact there is no manager in World football that we can't pay his wages comfortably.

Self defeatist gooners need to realise there is a big difference between sucking and actually being certifed shit.

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LOL Dortmund has a long history if not longer than Arsenal. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borussia_Dortmund

A brand spanking new stadium and very large fan base in Germany (and Europe), they are are not tier 2 Europen clubs like Montpelier or Lille. You could say PL is bigger league but at current debt rate, this could easily go upside down (like the way Italian and Spanish did). :coffee:

Sad sequence of postings from the usual suspects.

Wah, wah, wah. Why won't Wenger leave? GTFO Wenger. Wenger this, Wenger that, Wenger controls the club, all the usual bullshit but now with the added twist of seeing the blow it up gang lining up behind the press to persecute the manager - the British media FFS! And going as far as to apologise for PHW, a guy who inherited his position and sold it the moment key individuals were ejected. "We don't want his sort here", right up until the cash was flashed and Pete realised he'd get a chunk. Yeah, there's a huge similarity between Wenger and PHW, LOL. An Arsenal man through an through is our Pete.

The whole time the most obvious fact is overlooked. If the board wanted Wenger out then Wenger would be out. So the fans can scream all they want about Wenger but until they start directing that fire at the individuals who can actually get them what they want then they are wasting their time and boring the rest of us to death in the process. It all seems far too contrived. Ignore the elephant in the room and press every ounce of blame onto one guy. That's realistic, isn't it? And get Klopp in while you are at it because that'll change the board's agenda overnight, won't it? Stands to reason, provided you don't think anything through realistically. Of course Klopp could always join and then quit in protest, that would be useful and necessary in fact or else he'd be in the same position of having to go along with the agenda. Whether he's take the opportunity to criticise his bosses at every turn, who knows? My money is on no, he wouldn't.

And a special mention again to the "told you so" self-congratulation crew. Well done boys. There's no way to test if your half solutions would be successful because guess what, the board is still here and the board still wants Wenger to be here. It must be murder having to dodge around that all the time to get at Wenger.

It's amazing how some fans just don't get that Arsenal is now an investment vehicle. Fine, go ahead and change the manager, the players, the stadium, the pitch, the menu, whatever you want. I accept the fact the current manager is fucking up in a lot of respects. But I also accept the very obvious fact he's doing pretty well in other areas that would probably crush other managers, such as having to sell his key players every year. Now to the people suggesting he wants to do that so he can make money for his bosses - grow the fuck up really. Stop making shit up and adding two and two to get nine hundred. Player sales is the area where Wenger has diverged the most from the board, even to the point of making himself look ridiculous. He even said we couldn't be a big club if we sold our top players. Do you think that went down well in the boardroom? Now he wants for money for Walcott to stay, I can't wait to see how this is spun into an attempt to force Walcott out. I want him to stay, I think he will stay, give him more money - Wenger forces Walcott out! LOL guys, just LOL.

Quick note to those who assume otherwise, if I saw Kroenke I CERTAINLY would call him a **** right to his face. I've never had any problems telling the truth. I wouldn't do it in public where he'd get the benefit of trying to assume the moral high ground. But in private, no problems. Anyone who came into our club knowing nothing about it beyond the investment potential who then set out to pillage it would get the same response from me. I'm just surprised every fan doesn't see it the same way.

As for Wenger, I wouldn't have any problems telling him about himself either and commenting in detail about how his stubborness is costing us on the pitch - IN MY OPINION - because we're outside after all looking in, so maybe, just maybe we wouldn't be as effective as Wenger in the management role. It has to be entertained as a possibility at least. But I'd keep at the back of my mind the deep admiration I felt for the guy when he was guiding the best footballing team I've ever seen to so much (earned not bought) glory. And that would help me achieve a balance to any frustration I am feeling at the current state of affairs.

PHW though. Seriously? Fuck him. He has his money, he's shovelled the club into the hands of theives and gangsters, he's not even connected to Arsenal any more after his sell out. Fuck him. He's just a lingering stink. Respect? For what?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by milla

LOL Dortmund has a long history if not longer than Arsenal. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borussia_Dortmund

A brand spanking new stadium and very large fan base in Germany (and Europe), they are are not tier 2 Europen clubs like Montpelier or Lille. You could say PL is bigger league but at current debt rate, this could easily go upside down (like the way Italian and Spanish did). :coffee:

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Mate, I've been watching Dortmund since Chapuisat- they are not a bigger club than Arsenal, end of. Newcastle's stadium was once bigger than ours, that still didn't make them a bigger club than us.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wiltord's Winner

i get that but at what point do we say enough is enough? we're being milked for all our money and the team has degenerated into a pile of crap. we used to be in and around the title hunt until the later stages of the season but since the carling cup defeat we've been way off. that loss broke the camels back and wenger should have left. but he didnt and we're paying for it now. when is the last straw? does it really have to get to liverpool's situation before people open their eyes? because by then it will be too late.

for how long do we keep hoping an old dog learns new tricks? wenger got us into this position and we all thank him for that. we wouldnt be where we are without him, we get that, but for how long do we keep trudging along accepting everything the way it is? its not acceptable. we're living in a world where you need to stay competitive, my old man bleats on about it all the time. if you fall behind you wont be able to catch up anytime quick. just ask liverpool fans. there's no love for the modest and no sympathy for the losers. it's all about success and we should be moving forward but we're not. we're being constantly lied to by the board and the manager, and in the same process, are being told we cant even question the manager. how is that fair? who exactly is wenger accountable to? because gazidis stood up at last year's AGM and said it was the fans but when the fans speak up we're told to quieten down. where's the consistency?

instead of providing answers we're being insulted. wenger says he has been in the game for 30 years and that he doesnt have to justify his decisions. id counter that and say over the past 30 years ive never seen a manager earn so much money when he has so many flaws.

we all want the best for the club and i think we're all starting to realise its without wenger. i said it earlier and ill say it again, deep down in your heart of hearts, you me and everybody knows we aren't winning anything with wenger in charge. not one more trophy. now you can point to chelsea winning the champions league last year but they had someone who employed a bit of common sense. we dont even have that.

whilst ach exaggerates when he says the genuine gooners will celebrate when wenger leaves, i think it shows how far wenger has fallen. ill shed a tear when he leaves but its not because im sorry he left, its because im sorry it ended up like this. i know one thing and thats when wenger finally leaves it will be relief. it may not be rosy for a while but how can it be worse? we aren't even playing players in the natural positions. in fact we aren't even playing attractive football anymore which was our king pin for so many years. a new manager gives us hope, a new vision and will get more support. the only downfall is that i dont trust those tossers on the board to get in the right man. but thats for another debate.

i used to defend wenger but with every week that passes it becomes less of a problem with board and finances and more of a problem with tactics and squad. that is down to wenger. he gets paid £7m a year and instills the wrong tactics. that isnt acceptable. its basic.

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I don't disagree with any of that but I'm not going to call the man a ****.
You can accuse Wenger of many things but not caring isn't one of them IMO. I genuinely think he's doing what he thinks is best for the club and I think he has had one eye on the longer term. Even now he'd leave us in a better state than he found us. I'll be sad when he goes and I agree it'll partly be sadness that his legacy has been somewhat tainted by the last few years. But I'll still be grateful for where he took us.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Sad sequence of postings from the usual suspects.

Wah, wah, wah. Why won't Wenger leave? GTFO Wenger. Wenger this, Wenger that, Wenger controls the club, all the usual bullshit but now with the added twist of seeing the blow it up gang lining up behind the press to persecute the manager - the British media FFS! And going as far as to apologise for PHW, a guy who inherited his position and sold it the moment key individuals were ejected. "We don't want his sort here", right up until the cash was flashed and Pete realised he'd get a chunk. Yeah, there's a huge similarity between Wenger and PHW, LOL. An Arsenal man through an through is our Pete.

The whole time the most obvious fact is overlooked. If the board wanted Wenger out then Wenger would be out. So the fans can scream all they want about Wenger but until they start directing that fire at the individuals who can actually get them what they want then they are wasting their time and boring the rest of us to death in the process. It all seems far too contrived. Ignore the elephant in the room and press every ounce of blame onto one guy. That's realistic, isn't it? And get Klopp in while you are at it because that'll change the board's agenda overnight, won't it? Stands to reason, provided you don't think anything through realistically. Of course Klopp could always join and then quit in protest, that would be useful and necessary in fact or else he'd be in the same position of having to go along with the agenda. Whether he's take the opportunity to criticise his bosses at every turn, who knows? My money is on no, he wouldn't.

And a special mention again to the "told you so" self-congratulation crew. Well done boys. There's no way to test if your half solutions would be successful because guess what, the board is still here and the board still wants Wenger to be here. It must be murder having to dodge around that all the time to get at Wenger.

It's amazing how some fans just don't get that Arsenal is now an investment vehicle. Fine, go ahead and change the manager, the players, the stadium, the pitch, the menu, whatever you want. I accept the fact the current manager is fucking up in a lot of respects. But I also accept the very obvious fact he's doing pretty well in other areas that would probably crush other managers, such as having to sell his key players every year. Now to the people suggesting he wants to do that so he can make money for his bosses - grow the fuck up really. Stop making shit up and adding two and two to get nine hundred. Player sales is the area where Wenger has diverged the most from the board, even to the point of making himself look ridiculous. He even said we couldn't be a big club if we sold our top players. Do you think that went down well in the boardroom? Now he wants for money for Walcott to stay, I can't wait to see how this is spun into an attempt to force Walcott out. I want him to stay, I think he will stay, give him more money - Wenger forces Walcott out! LOL guys, just LOL.

Quick note to those who assume otherwise, if I saw Kroenke I CERTAINLY would call him a **** right to his face. I've never had any problems telling the truth. I wouldn't do it in public where he'd get the benefit of trying to assume the moral high ground. But in private, no problems. Anyone who came into our club knowing nothing about it beyond the investment potential who then set out to pillage it would get the same response from me. I'm just surprised every fan doesn't see it the same way.

As for Wenger, I wouldn't have any problems telling him about himself either and commenting in detail about how his stubborness is costing us on the pitch - IN MY OPINION - because we're outside after all looking in, so maybe, just maybe we wouldn't be as effective as Wenger in the management role. It has to be entertained as a possibility at least. But I'd keep at the back of my mind the deep admiration I felt for the guy when he was guiding the best footballing team I've ever seen to so much (earned not bought) glory. And that would help me achieve a balance to any frustration I am feeling at the current state of affairs.

PHW though. Seriously? Fuck him. He has his money, he's shovelled the club into the hands of theives and gangsters, he's not even connected to Arsenal any more after his sell out. Fuck him. He's just a lingering stink. Respect? For what?

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This is getting silly.

Fergie called Wenger to get the RVP deal sorted and Fabregas said Wenger got the Board to lower the asking price so he could move to Barca.

Seeing Wenger's reaction to the press conference, do you really think Wenger would stand for some upstairs to interfere with his affairs on the field?

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

Mate, I've been watching Dortmund since Chapuisat- they are not a bigger club than Arsenal, end of. Newcastle's stadium was once bigger than ours, that still didn't make them a bigger club than us.

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lol whatever, I can say I watched Dortmund since before you were suckling your mom tits, end of.. !? They got European medals which we don't have and they currently doing a lot better than us. At least they don't have our small club mentality. :coffee:

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

This is getting silly.

Fergie called Wenger to get the RVP deal sorted and Fabregas said Wenger got the Board to lower the asking price so he could move to Barca.

Seeing Wenger's reaction to the press conference, do you really think Wenger would stand for some upstairs to interfere with his affairs on the field?

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Why bother?? I remember wasting my time posting links to seperate interviews where PHW and our former Big Boss Fiszman said clearly they had never and couldn't ever imagine saying NO to Wenger. These interviews were years apart. It is on public record that only Wenger has never been overruled in this club- Dein was, PHW was, the guy intially in charge of our stadium was- but hey......... It's mostly the boards fault because they keep supporting their manager :doh: I give up.