Arshavin

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Originally Posted by Syn

Why would Arsene want to change him? Arshavin is half his comedy act. He can't WUM nearly as effectively without having the 'Arshavin sub' card.

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That's what I meant. A WUM who was really on the ball would have appointed Arshavin as fitness coach and motivational trainer by now. Wenger isn't getting as much out of Arshavin as he could, Wenger out!

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Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm

qft

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Quit fucking typing?

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

He should play where he is fecking told ffs, if he can't show motivation for that then why should be paly in the centre because he wants too.

He is a footballer not a school boy ffs

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He looks a bit like a school boy.

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Originally Posted by Ach

Wengeritis has hit him the hardest.

We all saw how good he was previous to joining us and even when he joined us back in January 09.

He then had a full pre season under Wenger and he was coached out of all his talents and tried to get him to play the pass, pass, pass, lets not go anywhere but lose the ball and probably concede, pass, pass pass Wengerball way that has become so common in the past few years. So Wenger has totally mismanged him. Out of position, expecting him to defend which tbf he does try but hes not very good at it, case in point, the last game v Mancs. He tracked back but he didnt do much. So yes i blame Wenger mostly.

Saying that though, Arshavin is an international and a captain at that as Wenger made sure we knew and he probably could have done better to fight the effects of Wengeritis. He seems disinterested now.

Move him on. Hopefully will still get £10m for him from Anzhi Makelele whatever and that £10m will go down well in the pockets of Wenger and the board

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Rubbish, He had been playing well till about Russia not going to the world cup then he sulked for a year because of it. now he can't be bothered and is only worried about his bank balance.

He saw the way we play before he joined, could have gone else where if he hated it, only thing AW is reposnisble foris still playing him.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Quit fucking typing?

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Please.

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Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm

Please.

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Didn't say Simon says!

You had your chance and you blew it.

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Rubbish, He had been playing well till about Russia not going to the world cup then he sulked for a year because of it. now he can't be bothered and is only worried about his bank balance.

He saw the way we play before he joined, could have gone else where if he hated it, only thing AW is reposnisble foris still playing him.

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I blame the board :NQ:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLos2HMjs28

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Originally Posted by Ach

I blame the board :NQ:

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"Wenger should be playing just behind Arshavin to cover him defensively. But the lazy fucker stays on the sidelines. Therefore Wenger responsible for this as well as the Italian cruise ship thing. Wenger Out and never allowed to drive boats again!" - ACH

i see alot of contradiction on this board...wont call out names, however the same people saying Asharvin is shiit fullstop also in other threads seem to questions why Wenger does not play players in their best position.

when Asharvin arrived, he thrived on the left...this was in a 442, so he midfield could offer better cover to him, and he was a revelation when the two upfront strikers created the space for him to exploit.

in this complete nonsense, psuysdo 433 that we play, the guy is massively exposed, he cannot do what he does best and that is cause devastation in the final third...his confidence is completely shot and he must hate going onto the pitch.

Wenger should have got the guy in tip top condition, played him in the centre or off RVP for at least 5-10 games and then seen what he could do.

I agree his form dipped after Russia did not qualify for the world cup however it was up to his coach to get the best back out of him, not keep on sticking him in a postion where he clearly suffers.

I made this comparison before, how effective would Dennis Bergkamp have been on the left in this useless psuedo 433, thats a valid question.

Wenger is blatantly to blame...who recall's playing Diaby on the wing, Song as CB etc....even Nasri was wasted on the right, when Cesc was injured and Narsi came into the middle last season he was magical, but as soon as Cesc is fit Nasri is pushed out wide and his form dropped in line with ours.

These are not co-incidences but they are down to Wenger forgetting that football comes first not all this science data bullshit, everyone does that crap now, why not go back to judging a footballer on what he does best.

Stuff him into a brown envelope and 'Arry will take him off our hands.

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Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm

Stuff him into a brown envelope and 'Arry will take him off our hands.

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That'll move the brown envelope business out of recession

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

Wenger is blatantly to blame...who recall's playing Diaby on the wing, Song as CB etc....even Nasri was wasted on the right, when Cesc was injured and Narsi came into the middle last season he was magical, but as soon as Cesc is fit Nasri is pushed out wide and his form dropped in line with ours.

These are not co-incidences but they are down to Wenger forgetting that football comes first not all this science data bullshit, everyone does that crap now, why not go back to judging a footballer on what he does best.

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Rubbish, where did you expect daiby and song to play while fab and nas were in the middle for us. Nasri could play on the left so don't see the problem with it tbh. But while cesc was around it did not make sense to play in the middle.

as for song at CB most of here thought he was a CB at some point its only recently he has improved alot as a dm tbh don't see what choice aw had with him.

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

i see alot of contradiction on this board...wont call out names, however the same people saying Asharvin is shiit fullstop also in other threads seem to questions why Wenger does not play players in their best position.

when Asharvin arrived, he thrived on the left...this was in a 442, so he midfield could offer better cover to him, and he was a revelation when the two upfront strikers created the space for him to exploit.

in this complete nonsense, psuysdo 433 that we play, the guy is massively exposed, he cannot do what he does best and that is cause devastation in the final third...his confidence is completely shot and he must hate going onto the pitch.

Wenger should have got the guy in tip top condition, played him in the centre or off RVP for at least 5-10 games and then seen what he could do.

I agree his form dipped after Russia did not qualify for the world cup however it was up to his coach to get the best back out of him, not keep on sticking him in a postion where he clearly suffers.

I made this comparison before, how effective would Dennis Bergkamp have been on the left in this useless psuedo 433, thats a valid question.

Wenger is blatantly to blame...who recall's playing Diaby on the wing, Song as CB etc....even Nasri was wasted on the right, when Cesc was injured and Narsi came into the middle last season he was magical, but as soon as Cesc is fit Nasri is pushed out wide and his form dropped in line with ours.

These are not co-incidences but they are down to Wenger forgetting that football comes first not all this science data bullshit, everyone does that crap now, why not go back to judging a footballer on what he does best.

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:gp:

Arshavin is having a mid-life crisis tbh.

I bet he has a terrible relationship with his father.

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Originally Posted by Syn

I don't get the 'out of position' thing. Maybe he's not playing in his ideal position, but that doesn't give you licence to play like a retard. If I'm remembering right, he was playing on the left when he was destroying teams to get us in the top 4. But in either case, no matter where you are on the pitch, I think if you fancy yourself as a showboating poncy twat, you can skip past players whether you're in defence or midfield or attack, on the left, centre or right. He used to be able to beat a couple of players with ease and find a great ball. Now nevermind about beating players, he can't even make simple 10 yard passes without it being intercepted half the time.

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When a players confidence is rock bottom you start seeing odd things. Remember how Sol Cambell would go to pieces when his confidence took a knock? Or Eduardo's last season for us. Torres...it can happen.

The funny thing is, Wenger knows Arshavin goes for high risk passes that's why his assist ratio is so good. He was saying the other day that Theo's end product was suffering because he's doing so much defensive work and getting to the final third and he's knackered. That could be true, could be a factor but Theo can't cross anyway, but if he says that about Theo then how true is that for Arshavin? Also, he may have good technical skills and can dribble but je's not the sort of guy that should be on the wing running at defenders. Take Nasri as an example. The ball would stick to his feet but he's not the sort of winger that scares defenders. Same can be said for Arsh.

Also, when playing the 4-4-2, he was lazy and would never drop back. He's making an effort to do that now, but as seen against Man U, that isn't what he's good at and asking him to curb his attacking play just isn't helping us. If we're not going to use him properly then it's best we keep him out of th team. Playing him on the flank is as bad as playing Djourou as right back.

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Rubbish, where did you expect daiby and song to play while fab and nas were in the middle for us. Nasri could play on the left so don't see the problem with it tbh. But while cesc was around it did not make sense to play in the middle.

as for song at CB most of here thought he was a CB at some point its only recently he has improved alot as a dm tbh don't see what choice aw had with him.

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ffs open your eyes mate.

What you do with Diaby and Song at that time is sell/loan the fcukers and bring in players who can do a world class job where it was needed. Why the fcuk are we playing Song at CB or Diaby on the wing just so Fab and Nas were there...how about having Fab and Nas there and having a proper winger? Not rocket science.

Who can forget the Asharvin up front disaster a few seasons back...what did he score one goal? Or the Djourou at right back this season....get a loan signing from the championship if you have to!!!

People really need to open their eyes...unbelivable

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

When a players confidence is rock bottom you start seeing odd things. Remember how Sol Cambell would go to pieces when his confidence took a knock? Or Eduardo's last season for us. Torres...it can happen.

The funny thing is, Wenger knows Arshavin goes for high risk passes that's why his assist ratio is so good. He was saying the other day that Theo's end product was suffering because he's doing so much defensive work and getting to the final third and he's knackered. That could be true, could be a factor but Theo can't cross anyway, but if he says that about Theo then how true is that for Arshavin? Also, he may have good technical skills and can dribble but je's not the sort of guy that should be on the wing running at defenders. Take Nasri as an example. The ball would stick to his feet but he's not the sort of winger that scares defenders. Same can be said for Arsh.

Also, when playing the 4-4-2, he was lazy and would never drop back. He's making an effort to do that now, but as seen against Man U, that isn't what he's good at and asking him to curb his attacking play just isn't helping us. If we're not going to use him properly then it's best we keep him out of th team. Playing him on the flank is as bad as playing Djourou as right back.

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You're right. It's probably not as clear cut as I'm trying to make out. But I just don't believe it's about confidence with Arshavin. I reckon he knows he's good. I reckon he knows he's one of the best around. He has been quiet recently but back when he was a hero, he used to get interviewed a lot and he used to say things that Joe Pubteamer doesn't. He is very intelligent. IMO he's far too intelligent to lose perspective and continue playing shit because he's 'low on confidence'. His mentality isn't a problem. But I think the thrill of 'being a hero' is gone for him now and it's not worth his effort to focus on getting back to his best. I don't think he's unhappy with his role right now.

Torres? Yeah, he's probably a fanny.

I know there are plenty of examples of very talented players starting to play bad due to an injury or lack of confidence - maybe even, as you say, mismanagement. Maybe Wenger hasn't dealt with Arshavin as well as he should have. I don't doubt that. But I just can't believe that a player of Arshavin's ability can consistently misplace simple 10 yard passes without a serious lack of self-focus. At a certain stage, as a grown man of 30 years old, you have to enough pride to decide that your performances are embarrassing and it's time to improve. If Arshavin decided to improve and focus, I reckon he could turn it around. But football, now, is just a job for him and he's getting paid the same regardless.

I think Wenger hasn't managed some players well. Despite most Arsenal fans disagreeing with it, I think Walcott has good technical ability. Not on Oxlade's level but Theo can take a 50 yard pass under pressure better than most. And from the way he strikes the ball, you can tell he has good technique. But he has been held back a bit. He has been allowed to keep passing in-field instead of being told to take people on. When he came here at 17, he could take players on. I don't think I was imagining that. He could beat players. But after a few years without practice, now he can't. Anyway, forget Theo - about Andrey Depreshavin™ (Depression? Could it catch on?) he has to take the blame IMO - not Arsene.

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

ffs open your eyes mate.

What you do with Diaby and Song at that time is sell/loan the fcukers and bring in players who can do a world class job where it was needed. Why the fcuk are we playing Song at CB or Diaby on the wing just so Fab and Nas were there...how about having Fab and Nas there and having a proper winger? Not rocket science.

Who can forget the Asharvin up front disaster a few seasons back...what did he score one goal? Or the Djourou at right back this season....get a loan signing from the championship if you have to!!!

People really need to open their eyes...unbelivable

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Did i say AW never made mistakes so stop puting words in my mouth please. So because AA was played out of place that gives him an excuse to behave like an ass.

yes wenger plays people in the wrong posistion but it up to them to make sure they get played in the right posistion.

Our play was never about width so why would we go and buy a winger in a 433. it was pass pas did not need a winger for that did we, nas and cesc in the middle were fine. Song was poor in those days and diaby was always injured so how could he play in the middle.

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Originally Posted by Syn

You're right. It's probably not as clear cut as I'm trying to make out. But I just don't believe it's about confidence with Arshavin. I reckon he knows he's good. I reckon he knows he's one of the best around. He has been quiet recently but back when he was a hero, he used to get interviewed a lot and he used to say things that Joe Pubteamer doesn't. He is very intelligent. IMO he's far too intelligent to lose perspective and continue playing shit because he's 'low on confidence'. His mentality isn't a problem. But I think the thrill of 'being a hero' is gone for him now and it's not worth his effort to focus on getting back to his best. I don't think he's unhappy with his role right now.

Torres? Yeah, he's probably a fanny.

I know there are plenty of examples of very talented players starting to play bad due to an injury or lack of confidence - maybe even, as you say, mismanagement. Maybe Wenger hasn't dealt with Arshavin as well as he should have. I don't doubt that. But I just can't believe that a player of Arshavin's ability can consistently misplace simple 10 yard passes without a serious lack of self-focus. At a certain stage, as a grown man of 30 years old, you have to enough pride to decide that your performances are embarrassing and it's time to improve. If Arshavin decided to improve and focus, I reckon he could turn it around. But football, now, is just a job for him and he's getting paid the same regardless.

I think Wenger hasn't managed some players well. Despite most Arsenal fans disagreeing with it, I think Walcott has good technical ability. Not on Oxlade's level but Theo can take a 50 yard pass under pressure better than most. And from the way he strikes the ball, you can tell he has good technique. But he has been held back a bit. He has been allowed to keep passing in-field instead of being told to take people on. When he came here at 17, he could take players on. I don't think I was imagining that. He could beat players. But after a few years without practice, now he can't. Anyway, forget Theo - about Andrey Depreshavin™ (Depression? Could it catch on?) he has to take the blame IMO - not Arsene.

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Could be that he doesn't give a damn now. His contract is running low, the fans hate him and Wenger won't listen to him. But, you get glimpses of the guy trying to make a real go of it and remember the guy putting in some hard tackles last season to try and please the crowd.

I blame Wenger because it seems like he's blatantly ignoring the obvious with this guy. He's not protecting him, that's for sure a knows the fans are on his back. But sentiment aside, Wenger's little sport science stat machine must show that this guy isn't suited on the flanks. If he's able to get info about peak condition and when a player is likely to tire, he must know that around the 60 minute mark this guy is dead on his feet. He must know that the clock his against him and at 30 his legs and stamina won't improve, it's all downhill from here. He must see on the stats sheet that this guy rarely makes an interception or successful tackle and as he tires the chances of him even tracking his runner diminishes. Those are the negatives.

On the more positive, his assist ratio is great and he goes for the risky pass. When we have playere that are too slow to spot the pass/afraid or just lack the skill to pull it off, why not play Arshavin where any natural playmaker would be dangerous? Especially when we're struggling to create chances and our defensive midfielder has more assists than Ramsey and Arteta. Wouldn't that make sense? He's poor at tackling and has stamina issues. Henry was allowed to be a lazy bastard at times and was able to catch his breath with his hands on hips while taking a stroll when the ball was at the other end. If Arshavin has a stamina problem and can't tackle, he shouldn't be on the wing. Fergie took off his full back and put Valencia to right back and Park ahead when he came on. He knew he could exploit the weakness. Wenger knew that Man U were dangerous down the flanks put took the risk anyway even though he knew that we'd be exposed. I really can't understand why Wenger plays him there, especially when the stats that he likes to depend on probably suggests that he has no business playing there either.

I mentioned Ramsey and we have all seen how useless he is. Why play a 4-3-3 when the middle three unit don't play together and are so disjointed? Just play a 4-4-1-1. It's not as if Man U were packing the midfield as they used to do back in the day. We have an inefficient player in our 4-3-3 every time and Wenger doesn't get it. Someone on another board even said he has to business playing a 4-3-3 without natural full backs. He's damn right but Wenger won't budge.

a player on 80k a week or more can relaise that in fact he is playing on the wing and put the extra hours in on the training ground to learn, can put 100% effort in every game and sprint his fucking bollocks to get back or forward whatever

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

ffs open your eyes mate.

What you do with Diaby and Song at that time is sell/loan the fcukers and bring in players who can do a world class job where it was needed. Why the fcuk are we playing Song at CB or Diaby on the wing just so Fab and Nas were there...how about having Fab and Nas there and having a proper winger? Not rocket science.

Who can forget the Asharvin up front disaster a few seasons back...what did he score one goal? Or the Djourou at right back this season....get a loan signing from the championship if you have to!!!

People really need to open their eyes...unbelivable

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Ignore that guy.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

a player on 80k a week or more can relaise that in fact he is playing on the wing and put the extra hours in on the training ground to learn, can put 100% effort in every game and sprint his fucking bollocks to get back or forward whatever

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Wenger doesn't allow extra training sessions I heard.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

a player on 80k a week or more can relaise that in fact he is playing on the wing and put the extra hours in on the training ground to learn, can put 100% effort in every game and sprint his fucking bollocks to get back or forward whatever

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:gp:

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Wenger doesn't allow extra training sessions I heard.

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i think i remember last season walcott saying sagna, mannone, chamakh and himself were doing extra sessions.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

a player on 80k a week or more can relaise that in fact he is playing on the wing and put the extra hours in on the training ground to learn, can put 100% effort in every game and sprint his fucking bollocks to get back or forward whatever

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just at Henry should have done so when he was a winger in Italy...put in extra effort and all would have been well on the wing?

Nope how about come to a club where his strenghts were played too, in front of our greatest number 10 who made full use of Henrys main ability....finishing and pace.

Apply the above to Asharvin and away we go.

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Originally Posted by Terry Tuffnutz

i think i remember last season walcott saying sagna, mannone, chamakh and himself were doing extra sessions.

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Sounds like a dodgy source.

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

just at Henry should have done so when he was a winger in Italy...put in extra effort and all would have been well on the wing?

Nope how about come to a club where his strenghts were played too, in front of our greatest number 10 who made full use of Henrys main ability....finishing and pace.

Apply the above to Asharvin and away we go.

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Speaking of Henry, when he went to Barcs and played on the flanks, he struggled a bit and never really won over the fans with his performances. Playing in 4-5-1 for us also meant he had to adjust his game as well. He wasn't used to playing with his back to goal and often got caught in possession.

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

just at Henry should have done so when he was a winger in Italy...put in extra effort and all would have been well on the wing?

Nope how about come to a club where his strenghts were played too, in front of our greatest number 10 who made full use of Henrys main ability....finishing and pace.

Apply the above to Asharvin and away we go.

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henry was going to be played as a striker, he was moved pretty quickly. fat fuck been playing there for three years. he can do extra sessions to improve. he can run and track back. not wengers fault that fat fuck falls over and then takes ages to get up and laughs. thats fat fucks fault. wenger migth be playing in wrong posistion but player can put a fucking shift esp when we pay him 80k a week. turning up to preseason overweight is not wenger its fat fuck. he is unprofessional and can fuck off

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

henry was going to be played as a striker, he was moved pretty quickly. fat fuck been playing there for three years. he can do extra sessions to improve. he can run and track back. not wengers fault that fat fuck falls over and then takes ages to get up and laughs. thats fat fucks fault. wenger migth be playing in wrong posistion but player can put a fucking shift esp when we pay him 80k a week. turning up to preseason overweight is not wenger its fat fuck. he is unprofessional and can fuck off

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Too fecking right, people just letting their hatred of Wenger cloud their Judgement. This just shows how spoilt the morden day footballer is.Even if AA was played in the right posistion he still not put in a shift then what will be the excuse.

Can't blame Wenger for eveything single thing ffs

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Too fecking right, people just letting their hatred of Wenger cloud their Judgement. This just shows how spoilt the morden day footballer is.Even if AA was played in the right posistion he still not put in a shift then what will be the excuse.

Can't blame Wenger for eveything single thing ffs

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Lol I guess Eduardo was just lazy on the wing when also played there.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

henry was going to be played as a striker, he was moved pretty quickly. fat fuck been playing there for three years. he can do extra sessions to improve. he can run and track back. not wengers fault that fat fuck falls over and then takes ages to get up and laughs. thats fat fucks fault. wenger migth be playing in wrong posistion but player can put a fucking shift esp when we pay him 80k a week. turning up to preseason overweight is not wenger its fat fuck. he is unprofessional and can fuck off

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Whose to say he is not trying...Henry always looked like he was playing casually then bamm!! The point is why waste his ability on the wing...we don't defend collectively like Barcelona, so our wingers in the 3 get knAckered hence why Wallcot is always tired....Barca maintain possession, compress the half and collectively win back the ball so a player like Iniesta on the wing can still be dangerous.

Imagine Iniesta in our team, being told to track back like Asharvin And work his bollox off cos we are shit at defending as a team, even be would be fucking knAckered mate and be is the best midfielder in the world.

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Rubbish, where did you expect daiby and song to play while fab and nas were in the middle for us. Nasri could play on the left so don't see the problem with it tbh. But while cesc was around it did not make sense to play in the middle.

as for song at CB most of here thought he was a CB at some point its only recently he has improved alot as a dm tbh don't see what choice aw had with him.

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May be Wenger shouldve bought horses for courses.. he bought a ton of CAM- Arshavin, Nasri, Rosicky, Diaby, Cesc (played that role too), Hleb. Diaby and Song shouldnt be playing on the right and left just because Cesc is playing there.. we shouldve had players who can play on the left and/or right!

Also how many players can you think of that Arsene has fucked up with playing this 4-3-3? Eduardo, Vela, Bendy, Arshavin, Chakma! Eduardo was a world class striker who he pushed on the left, Vela was promising but again brought from the bench to play on the left or right, Bendy on the right, Arshavin on the left/rigth, Chakma- he didnt know where to play him with RVP on the pitch! Why on earth we are stuck with this Barca lite 4-3-3 is beyond me? What have we won with this formation under AW? Nothing! FFS start from scratch, try something that has worked before!!

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Originally Posted by gunnerrrrr

Lol I guess Eduardo was just lazy on the wing when also played there.

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LOL

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Originally Posted by fakeyank

May be Wenger shouldve bought horses for courses.. he bought a ton of CAM- Arshavin, Nasri, Rosicky, Diaby, Cesc (played that role too), Hleb. Diaby and Song shouldnt be playing on the right and left just because Cesc is playing there.. we shouldve had players who can play on the left and/or right!

Also how many players can you think of that Arsene has fucked up with playing this 4-3-3? Eduardo, Vela, Bendy, Arshavin, Chakma! Eduardo was a world class striker who he pushed on the left, Vela was promising but again brought from the bench to play on the left or right, Bendy on the right, Arshavin on the left/rigth, Chakma- he didnt know where to play him with RVP on the pitch! Why on earth we are stuck with this Barca lite 4-3-3 is beyond me? What have we won with this formation under AW? Nothing! FFS start from scratch, try something that has worked before!!

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:gp:

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Andrei Kanchelskis has launched an amazing attack on *fellow Russian Arshavin, who looks set to leave Arsenal in the summer after failing to live up to the *reputation he forged at Euro 2008.Ex-Manchester United winger Kanchelskis said: “I kept saying Andrey was an average player.
“At first they admired him in England, but now they have simply woken up to reality and see him for what he really is.
“Arshavin is not a player of Arsenal’s level and now suddenly a lot of people *recognise it.”

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http://www.dailystar.co.uk/football/...n-for-England/

Arshavin has to take most of the blame for his sad decline, but as a club we are shocking at trying to help players recapture form. Wenger is the world's worse at the 'arm round the shoulder thing' (just stubbornly continuing to play players regardless is not the same thing), and we as fans are just as bad. Result - many players who start off great and never again recapture their form.

far from a turn around in his form of course but two assists this season have got us 6 vital points, a couple more of those before the end will justify him sticking around.

Fat Fuck playing himself into the shop window. :bow: