All the shit that's fit to print!Quote:
Originally Posted by Grebbo
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All the shit that's fit to print!Quote:
Originally Posted by Grebbo
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2681/...058cf70069.jpg
Well, you can see on here how this issue splits opinion and if Stan and co sack Wenger, the knives would be out, especially if we have a rocky start. A new manager won't be welcomed with open arms either and it will just be a sour environment around the ground. Wenger has a long standing lagacy here and as seen here people can't accept that he's at fault for certain things. Stan will get all the blame of it goes tits up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fist of Lehmann
Think of it like The Dark Knight.:Lol: Wenger stands for something with the fans. It's a legacy and that has to be broken for people to accept change. If he goes before his time, people will still believe he could have led us to glory. Well some.
That's the theory anyway. Probably bollocks. :lol:
Because its irrelevant thats why.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
How so? His philolsophy has always been about nurturing talent and youth. He's a pig in muck at Arsenal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
Nonsense about his past being irrelevant because as soon as he's ready to step down and a new manager is announced people will be quick to bring up his past and accolades. Maybe in your world it's irrelevant. If Pep and Jose were being lined up to be the next Arsenal manager, how would you asses them and figure out which one suits our club? Far fetched I know, but it's a simple example.
So quick to look past the obvious and blame the board but unwilling to look at the man and his past actions which line up with his word and current actions.
And then again there are those who contrive to blame every problem at the club on Wenger. I think the cries of what a shit substitution, why can't we play Ox, what the fuck are we doing playing Chamakh again at least hints that some of the fanatics who suggest the board should also be examined (bless them) also consider Wenger's actions to be troublesome. Figuring out what environment he's operating in and why he does what he does in terms of the transfer window is hard to do once you've looked past the obvious and unjustifiably exonerated the guys who actually control the money. And if Wenger's record at Monaco is ignored then it's a small oversight compared to the elephant sitting in the middle of the room.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
This is why the board will pick the next manager to be wenger esq so their not seen as mugs with no backbone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
What the fuck is he working with that Swansea, Fulham, Stoke, Newcastle, Spurs and every other team haven't got to deal with?Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
Sick of hearing the excuses. If lower league coaches can drill championship level players into a sold squad that know how to defend on a small budget then why can't Wenger? Of course, the board have their blame in all this but there isn't much they can now. When the shit hit the fan in the summer, we finally spent some money while Wenger was away in Switzerland.
Can't help but agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
I don't get it - every club has shit to deal with, on and off the pitch, but whatever the problems are, it shouldn't affect the manager being able to instill some basic team fundamentals, which is what we seem to lack and have lacked for many years now.
There seems to be this perception that Wenger is operating in a unique bubble. Of course the board should share the blame for certain issues, but I don't buy the idea Wenger is operating with one arm tied behind his back. In my view, Wenger and the board are one.
No other club would stand for the decline we have seen over the past 6 years. The board should do one for accepting an underperforming manager because he makes them bucks, and Wenger should do one for putting together a team that has a horrible habit of wilting under pressure and causing extreme embarrassment to it's fans, there are no outside influences involved there, none at all.
Arsenal will make an offer for Lille winger Eden Hazard. Extremely reliable source. (via @tomvermeersch ) - twitter.
i will be gutted be hazard went to chelsea. wouldnt mind if it was madrid. apparently there was talk that AW enquired about him this week.
i was talking about the board numbnutsQuote:
Originally Posted by Letters
:gp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Bottom line.. if the board is not giving him money and not co-operating with him, he quits. Why ruin your legacy and records for some old farts interested in money? Its not like Arsene cannot make 6 million quid elsewhere. Its a simple explanation really! AW is just a thick old guy who just hasnt come to terms that his flawed tactics are not going to get him anywhere in this day and age..
:doh:Quote:
Originally Posted by fakeyank
So one minute he is thick the next minute he can make six million somewhere else, how can a thick man do that. He is a stubborn man at most.
wenger is a mediocre manager these days. not to say that hes an awful manager, but a manager who has lost his touch.he does just enough to get the job done but cant get us to that next level. he is unable or unwilling to change even simple things. tactically speaking we can come up with a laundry list of questionable things hes tried on the pitch. he cares about winning and losing but he will always justify things in the end with some more bullshit. then predictably not a change much the next season. thats one definition of a loser in my opinion and thats why he needs to go.
Agree with thisQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Lahey
We got no chance over chelea or Madrid tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnerFan4Life
Another lowball offer coming up. Probably a fair price but nobody deals in fair prices anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnerFan4Life
Keeping Arshavin :bow:Quote:
Arsene Wenger says Russian forward Andrei Arshavin, 30, will not be sold in the January transfer window.
Full story: Metro
Arsenal goalkeeper Wojciech Szczesny insists "there are no scars from the Manchester United mauling" as the sides prepare to meet for the first time since the Gunners' 8-2 drubbing at Old Trafford.
Full story: London Evening Standard
We'll see Sunday
So nothing againQuote:
Originally Posted by Ach
He is above all but one of those teams, none of which have ever finished above him in the League. Ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
So what is your point?
Pretty much
I fear for this club
I'm not talking about league position and the point is there in the second paragraph. If it goes over your head, I can't help you.Quote:
Originally Posted by GB.
Oh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
I wonder when they had better defences?
Or is your point about him being in Switzerland?
When we've played those teams, they've defended better than ours. They have half the budget that we have but can at least make themselves hard to beat. We used to struggle every season at Bolton and I swear this is the third season running where Fulham have outplayed us and stolen more points off us when they shoudln't. I keep hearing people taking about our budget as an excuse but we often get beaten by teams way down the table and struggle to break them down. It happens far too often. If those clubs can find and train decent defenders on a cheap then why can't we?Quote:
Originally Posted by GB.
Talking of teams above us...Man Utd have a very young team and that was Fergie's worst teams to have won the title and it's not as if he hasn't had injury problems. It's the same for this season, but they're not struggling to qualify for the Champs League either. It's a very average looking Man U side and they should be there for the taking.
Tactically, Wenger is poor and that is what's letting us down. A good defensive coach could drill an average group of players to be very hard to break down and beat.
I'm not denying things are shit and I don't want change, but people need perspective. Everybody gets beaten by teams worse than them and/or with less resources. But every year over the course of a season, the better team finishes higher. And we have done so against all the teams you have listed by a considerable margin.
But that is all likely to change to some degree given the chronic lack of investment in the team and inability/unwillingness to make the best use of the playing resources we are seemingly stuck with. In fact, we are stuck with more than many appreciate because we aren't getting rid of the likes of Denilson and Bendtner until their contracts run out.
He is thick because he wont change his methods even though they have failed for 6 seasons running.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
This is a difficult one to call but as time goes on, I do not doubt Wenger's intelligence but I also don't think his salary either proves he is above average in the IQ department.
But call them whar yiu will, question marks or cracks, there are signs that the make up of the guy's character are ihas serious flaws.
Wenger has done wonders for the club and could count himself lucky when ge walked through the door and already had the rock foundations of a defence he didnt need to touch. Some extremely, legend making pick ups, TH14, PV4 allowed the sky to become the limit.
I believe the first crack was the inability to achieve back to back leagues titles but that was easy to ignore because of other cup success however retirements, players moving on proved to be tge back breaker, the inability to replace those players and the insistence that youth was the answer, and that financial constraints were holding us back has created a manager who lacks the ability to motivate his team beyond dreams of mediocrity.
Factor in a board that lacks ambition, fails to give both public or private support, seems more ontrested in cashong in than bowing to the demands of an ambitious manager (which Wenger both isnt doing or show traits of being anymore) and you have a sorry affair.
Now as fans we now seem to find ourselves in the same posotion as in the summer, agast at Wengers lack of teaction to obvious problems, is a nrw manager the answer? Maybe. . .but will the board change? maybe not. . .I for one will not be overly sad to see Wenger stay but his staying and refusal to see things the way they are, his hiding behind excuses that frankly make little to no fucking sense. . .you know when he mentioned the now infamous 'waiting period' I actually waited ! ! ! and by all counts still am.
He can stay for me. . .but the feeling of deja vu has to go. . .but I feel holding my breath would futile
Getting beat by teams with less resources happens and I'm not trying to make out as if they have no right to beat us. That would be going off topic. It's a response to NQ's and Charlie's posts and how they keep raising the Board and transfer dealings as the main source of problem for everything football related.Quote:
Originally Posted by GB.
Wenger goes out and buys playere in the summer that aren't Prem ready - but it's the Board's fault.
We can't defend and the team are mentally weak - it's the Board's fault.
This notion that the problems Wenger faces and the environment he works in is exclusive to Arsenal only is nonsense. Every club has restrictions to work with. It's not just us. A good coach should be able to get the best out of limited players and it doesn't cost a fortune to fix a defence. it takes good coaching and teaching discipline. We could spend millions on the worlds best defenders but if they don't get the correct coaching they will look below average. The arguments about the Board gets pulled out too muh by certain posters and they can't aknowledge the fact that we have a bad coach on our hands. Or his methods are outdated...however you want to spin it, Wenger isn't doing his part well.
He should have the skill to get the best out of his resources. Swansea spent less on transfers then all the teams in the Prem, but they play at a very high level and are tough to beat. That's a coach making the best of what he's got and pushing his coaching skills to the max. We're not doing that or making good use of the £30m - £60m we have to spend in transfer windows. If we were an old clapped out motor, Wenger would have just spent a huge chunk of our budget on spinning rims and windscreen wipers.
He's supposed to be a world class coach and he shouldn't be getting out thought by certain coaches. It can happen now and again, but he gets done over plenty of times. He should know tricks and tactics that these guys haven't even dreamed of. His experience in management should trump theres. We've all seen Top Gear with the reasonably priced car test right? If we had the equivalent in football, where would Wenger rank? We've seen it Top Gear where an F1 driver like Lewis Hamilton pulls in one of the fastest lap times but some other celebrity with the same car and conditions can't come anywhere near that time. If your top class you should be able to get the best out of whatever vehicle your pushing. Wenger seems to drive with the handbrake on - as he puts it. Our team looks average but the manner of our defeats and the mistakes are embarrassing.
Our Board sucks for not slapping Wenger over the head and telling him to sort his shit out, I can't blame them for the nonsense I see on the pitch. Bendtner playing as a right winger? Come on! Every coach has limits to deal with but certain things he should have dealt with by now. That's my view.
He is right though. Everything is the Board's fault.
He is either not adequately supported by them and/or he is no longer up to the job as fans see the job - you know - tactics and winning things whereas the Board seem to have different criteria. I think it is a combination of support and capability. In which case, Wenger needs to go.
edit: Oh, and I think he did fix the defence - anyone would struggle with that injury list.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
I cant help myself nodding in agreement to a lot of that and at the same time repeating the same things I was saying in the summer.
Wenger has a lot to be held accountable for what goes on on the pitch. After a very rocky start we started to show signs of recovery, we went on a very decent run but even then after every win, the consensus was (and rightly so) that we by no means the finished article. . .and that Wenger shared the same sentiment and that he would use the run we were on plus January 's transfer window to catapult us further.
However injuries and signs that the sticker tape used to keep the wheels on were losing its grip, thus giving Wenger another excuse to bemoan and hide behind.
People are right when they question his inability to get the best out of our current squad especially when we get beaten by times whose superiority has been their heart and the way they apply it.
The business dealings of the club are down to the board as they control the purses, however a lot of their opinion of the state of the team has to come from the reasoning of the man managing the club.
But at the end of the day both parties are as blind, ignorant, head up their pompous arses as it each. . .how can Wenger not be banging the door down demanding money for better players when he sees the performances and how can the board be not contemplating the departure of this once great man when tbey see the performances.
Bring in another, maybe. . .but you would be wise to remember that the fix would not be immediate, . .Jose has had success and Sporting was a great achievement but Chelsea and Real throw money around like candy. . .bring in someone like Matinez and I am sure a lot on here will be looking to burn the place down too. . .nothing is a cert, remember that the few who will be putting their toys back in the the pram they threw them out of after Wenger is shown the door
:gp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Japan Shaking All Over
Thats not thick thats stubborn.Quote:
Originally Posted by fakeyank
Too right im behind you on this. Wenger is at fault for how we play on the pitch no deny that, however imo when in comes to transfer dealings both board and manager have to step up and share the blame. However the board need to be blamed for alot of off the field stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
There is such a mess at this clubthat even if wenger was to go it would be a while before a new manager would win things with us anyways.
Very true, but it's Wenger who lumbered us with losers like Denilson, Chamakh, Bendtner, Squillaci, Djourou on high wages due to his blind faith and cheapness in the transfer market.Quote:
Originally Posted by GB.
We could have spent the money we've wasted on these chumps on getting some very good players, sadly Wenger really has made some bad decisions in particular regarding the pay policy he believes in (similar pay level for most in the squad).
He decided to go down the kids route which initially I guess you could accept (though not to the extreme he took it perhaps), problem is the kind of money he decided to stick them on. If they're good they disappear off as they want to win stuff, if they're rubbish we're lumbered with them and their sky high wages.
I remember a time when seeing a youngster make it into the team was exciting, now it's just frustrating and boring as we've done it way too much.
I'd suggest he lacks common sense as well, some of his decisions are just plain bizarre, decisions noone in their right minds would make. The average fan probably wouldn't make some of the errors he has, simply because it's so glaringly obvious what should be done at times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
Im sure he knows that it goes way beyond that.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
It is the wages that are killing us they significantly impact upon the funds available for transfers and impair our ability to get rid of the deadwood.
exactly. too many players happy to collect a wage they don't give a shite about the game. IMO wengers fault is that his ambition for far too long has been top 4 and he has bought players who he thought could get us there.Quote:
Originally Posted by GB.
lets be real the last 4 of the last 6 season the aim was top 4 and we achieved that, hence whywe never spent over the odds and maybe wenger thinks by prolonging that it will help us in the future.
i agree with zimm no point buying kids if you don't play them or loan them out. Theo could have gone back on loan when he 1st arrived would have helped him and us same with AOC
That's true, but if you look at some of the players we still have who earn pretty decent money these are players AW signed as kids or on the cheap and then stuck on high salaries, he seems to look at economics when buying a player but not when salary comes into it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
None of the players mentioned were particularly special and none of them deserved the salaries on offer, the way I see it with such ordinary players it's like it or lump it, if they don't like the wages they are offered (reasonable ones) let them go elsewhere, they need to prove themselves before the money comes rolling in. If you give player big money before they've achieved anything is it any surprise when they have no motivation on the pitch?
The lack of hunger IMO is partly down to the fact we never give players an incentive to produce on the pitch, they're already multi-millionaires off the pitch before they've even done anything.....what happened to proving yourself.
Tevez to PSG off apparently.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...report?cc=4716
Sign him up, Arsene :popcorn:
:lol: We might sign Tevez, it's not beyond the realms of possibility...not sure how good Diego Tevez is though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss