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We should have won the final against Barca. Henry should have made it 2-0. Anything is possible but it feels like we're a million miles away from a team that can beat the likes of Real Madrid over two legs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice
Although they were terrible that year Chelsea had a long history of reaching the latter stages and still had the core of old boys to pull them through. Porto and Liverpool were just on point tactically.
You need luck on your side win anything, however with us it just feels like we're as far away as we've ever been. Even back in the day we grossly underachieved in Europe with some of the best players to ever play for our club. In 20 years we've only gone beyond the 2nd round a handful of times, it's too late for Wenger to crack Europe now. It's just something that will unfortunately need to be held against him when he is compared to the greats.
Nothing would give me more joy than seeing him lift the CL though.
I consider this match to be a dead rubber. I know PSG might slip up, but I doubt it. This is the one time when I don't care if we rest some first teamers, what with the Christmas period coming on. Finishing first does not guarantee avoiding a big club this year, so why risk injuries?
Yes you do need luck, you also need guile and determination. Arsenal too often wilt when things don't go in our favour......because Wenger doesn't buy players with character and he isn't a strong enough personality himself to give it to them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
True today but not sure what happened during his best years. Plenty of character but we always failed. Maybe going into games without Bergkamp or playing at Wembley instead of Highbury had a psychological effect on the squad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
But we won league titles and there was always a demonstrable difference between European and league form. I think in past times it was more a case of running out of steam and ideas rather than just capitulation which is the way it is now (we would never have gone out against Monaco with that invincibles team).Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
2003/2004 as good as that season was there is no question it was a missed opportunity to win this club a treble, but ultimately it was an opportunity that was beyond the ability of Wenger as a man motivator and a tactician to take.
We were confident in the league but Europe was a step into the unknown. It wasn't just a case of running out of steam and ideas. We weren't an unfit team.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
I don't mean so much physically but we played a certain way and sometimes even with strong characters there is only so much you can do without inspiration from the benchQuote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Couldn't the same be said about the team today and others that have gone?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
What i am saying is there is a difference, the old Wenger teams with the exception of the 6-1 game at Old Trafford tended to capitulate less because they had more character and a lot of the reason for this is because Wenger inherited as many of the players he had as much as he bought himself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
But ultimately didn't have have it in them to singularly get past European obstacles, where as the players today seem to be unable to get past obstacles whatever competition it is.
What i am saying is that even with the character Wenger had in his team back then it wasn't enough without a stronger motivator (Wenger isn't the big personality for big motivational speeches or bawling people out in the dressing room), and now we have neither the characters or the motivator.