Where has Wenger gone wrong?

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Originally Posted by HCZ

I guess it depends how long we are talking

In the immediate future, I think it will be difficult for many of us to think of him too fondly

And at best even in the fullness of time it will be once great manager stayed with us far too long

If the writing is on the wall for him, and he jumps before he’s pushed he will probably get his soapy tit wank farewell.

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He's completely destroyed his legacy.

If he left after the first or second FA cup he would have been viewed as an untouchable legend. If he left after the third he would still have been respected and viewed as an icon in years to come.

Now? He's the biggest laughing stock in the world. There's people taking Wenger out signs to protests in Africa FFS.

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

Unfortuantley now there have been arguably more years of disharmony and frustration as there have been success. His legacy now includes a deeply mind fucked and divided fanbase. What you alluded to about the divided fanbase will rumble on after he’s gone. If the next manager were to get off to a poor start or struggle at any point, you just know those fans who still hold a candle for Wenger will cause a problem and the cycle will repeat itself, only this time with the in and out roles will be reversed.

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A good angle. It's become fashionable to regard Arsenal fans as spoilt and thinking that they are entitled to success, but this isn't true at all. For years we were promised that the club was preparing to compete at the highest level, and up until about 5 years ago I think that we were patient in a way that, say, Manure fans would not have put up with. Since then, with the deliberate orchestration of AW we have been invited to inhabit a parallel universe where any excuse under the sun has been offered to explain under performance and lack of ambition on and off the pitch. If it were simply that we were cash-strapped, or that the players seemed to be giving their all but were losing to better sides, it would be one thing, but the unberable frustration has been caused by the manager's utter refusal to see, or admit where he is going wrong - or to do anything about it. Wenger has effectively traded on his legacy to garner support - and this is what has set fans so implacably against each other and eroded any vestige of patience.

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Originally Posted by IBK

A good angle. It's become fashionable to regard Arsenal fans as spoilt and thinking that they are entitled to success, but this isn't true at all. For years we were promised that the club was preparing to compete at the highest level, and up until about 5 years ago I think that we were patient in a way that, say, Manure fans would not have put up with. Since then, with the deliberate orchestration of AW we have been invited to inhabit a parallel universe where any excuse under the sun has been offered to explain under performance and lack of ambition on and off the pitch. If it were simply that we were cash-strapped, or that the players seemed to be giving their all but were losing to better sides, it would be one thing, but the unberable frustration has been caused by the manager's utter refusal to see, or admit where he is going wrong - or to do anything about it. Wenger has effectively traded on his legacy to garner support - and this is what has set fans so implacably against each other and eroded any vestige of patience.

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Agreed, when you think that we had a stadium move to compete with the best in Europe when we can't now beat mediocre teams in our own league, added to that the the fans pay the highest ticket prices for dross, I think the fans have a right to complain. Nobody thinks we have a god-given right to win everything, we just want to be a bit more competitive.

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Originally Posted by Goonermerree

Agreed, when you think that we had a stadium move to compete with the best in Europe when we can't now beat mediocre teams in our own league, added to that the the fans pay the highest ticket prices for dross, I think the fans have a right to complain. Nobody thinks we have a god-given right to win everything, we just want to be a bit more competitive.

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...and not to be regarded as a laughing stock....

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Originally Posted by IBK

A good angle. It's become fashionable to regard Arsenal fans as spoilt and thinking that they are entitled to success, but this isn't true at all. For years we were promised that the club was preparing to compete at the highest level, and up until about 5 years ago I think that we were patient in a way that, say, Manure fans would not have put up with. Since then, with the deliberate orchestration of AW we have been invited to inhabit a parallel universe where any excuse under the sun has been offered to explain under performance and lack of ambition on and off the pitch. If it were simply that we were cash-strapped, or that the players seemed to be giving their all but were losing to better sides, it would be one thing, but the unberable frustration has been caused by the manager's utter refusal to see, or admit where he is going wrong - or to do anything about it. Wenger has effectively traded on his legacy to garner support - and this is what has set fans so implacably against each other and eroded any vestige of patience.

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I agree. I take huge exception to the notion of others thinking Arsenal fans are entitled. We've been the most patient, sentimental and understanding fans going. We watched on for years as our best players were stripped away and replaced with cheap imitations, all while thinking this was the price to pay for a smart, long term strategy that would see us pay off the stadium and enable us to challenge somewhere down the line. Most even believed the board were responsible for withholding money and throwing Wenger under a bus. He got away with it for years but it's only within the last 2-3 seasons he's really been exposed and he knows it.

We've had to endure more humiliating results than I care to remember, a decline in quality of football, sliding out of the CL (Wenger's last redeeming feature) and all while hearing excuse after excuse from a manager who won't accept he might be the problem because he's selfishly using Arsenal to prolong his involvement in football as he's not ready to retire, he even had the cheek to blame the fans for his and his teams humiliations and underachievement. Every single club in the world hires and fires managers on performance based merits, why do we have to be any different? Because Wenger achieved greatness 15 years ago? How is that still relevant today?

Make no mistake about it, Wenger is definitely the reason why there's so much apathy not only for the club but football in general. The obscene amounts of money in the game now is tiresome but lets not pretend we wouldn't be enjoying ourselves if we had a quality, competitive team. Which with our resources, is what we should have.

Anyone who thinks we should be sweeping all before us, they are worthy of ridicule but I have honestly never spoken to an Arsenal fan who wants anything more than just to be hopeful of competing. I don't care about Wenger, I care about Arsenal but that line is now blurred within the fanbase as some have taken it upon themselves to be offended on his behalf.

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

I agree. I take huge exception to the notion of others thinking Arsenal fans are entitled. We've been the most patient, sentimental and understanding fans going. We watched on for years as our best players were stripped away and replaced with cheap imitations, all while thinking this was the price to pay for a smart, long term strategy that would see us pay off the stadium and enable us to challenge somewhere down the line. Most even believed the board were responsible for withholding money and throwing Wenger under a bus. He got away with it for years but it's only within the last 2-3 seasons he's really been exposed and he knows it.

We've had to endure more humiliating results than I care to remember, a decline in quality of football, sliding out of the CL (Wenger's last redeeming feature) and all while hearing excuse after excuse from a manager who won't accept he might be the problem because he's selfishly using Arsenal to prolong his involvement in football as he's not ready to retire, he even had the cheek to blame the fans for his and his teams humiliations and underachievement. Every single club in the world hires and fires managers on performance based merits, why do we have to be any different? Because Wenger achieved greatness 15 years ago? How is that still relevant today?

Make no mistake about it, Wenger is definitely the reason why there's so much apathy not only for the club but football in general. The obscene amounts of money in the game now is tiresome but lets not pretend we wouldn't be enjoying ourselves if we had a quality, competitive team. Which with our resources, is what we should have.

Anyone who thinks we should be sweeping all before us, they are worthy of ridicule but I have honestly never spoken to an Arsenal fan who wants anything more than just to be hopeful of competing. I don't care about Wenger, I care about Arsenal but that line is now blurred within the fanbase as some have taken it upon themselves to be offended on his behalf.

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:gp:

Until a few years ago, I was one of the people who still thought that AW might be able to compete if he was able to spend money on players. It's noticable and somewhat ironic that the manager has been exposed now, just at the time that he has done. One can't escape the feeling that the manager only resigned himself to paying top money for players in a desperate attempt to prove otherwise, rather than this demonstrating a real change in his mentality. And i may be stubborn here, but the players that he has spent big on - including those who are now being written off - were not valued highly for nothing. Like I said originally, Wenger is yesterday's man in terms of coaching and management. I don't blame him for this. I do blame him for being the only person at our football club with the power to do something about it and bow out gracefully - like SAF did - but refusing to do so.

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

I agree. I take huge exception to the notion of others thinking Arsenal fans are entitled. We've been the most patient, sentimental and understanding fans going. We watched on for years as our best players were stripped away and replaced with cheap imitations, all while thinking this was the price to pay for a smart, long term strategy that would see us pay off the stadium and enable us to challenge somewhere down the line. Most even believed the board were responsible for withholding money and throwing Wenger under a bus. He got away with it for years but it's only within the last 2-3 seasons he's really been exposed and he knows it.

We've had to endure more humiliating results than I care to remember, a decline in quality of football, sliding out of the CL (Wenger's last redeeming feature) and all while hearing excuse after excuse from a manager who won't accept he might be the problem because he's selfishly using Arsenal to prolong his involvement in football as he's not ready to retire, he even had the cheek to blame the fans for his and his teams humiliations and underachievement. Every single club in the world hires and fires managers on performance based merits, why do we have to be any different? Because Wenger achieved greatness 15 years ago? How is that still relevant today?

Make no mistake about it, Wenger is definitely the reason why there's so much apathy not only for the club but football in general. The obscene amounts of money in the game now is tiresome but lets not pretend we wouldn't be enjoying ourselves if we had a quality, competitive team. Which with our resources, is what we should have.

Anyone who thinks we should be sweeping all before us, they are worthy of ridicule but I have honestly never spoken to an Arsenal fan who wants anything more than just to be hopeful of competing. I don't care about Wenger, I care about Arsenal but that line is now blurred within the fanbase as some have taken it upon themselves to be offended on his behalf.

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Completely agree with this, some people will say we have Wenger to thank for this and that, personally I don't think we've got anything to thank him for, this club is in a worse state than when he arrived, what's worse is the ticket prices are sky high and he supports this, on top of that the football is rubbish, we can't keep hold of players and our transfers have generally been rubbish.

I agree, it's Wenger that has ruined football for the fans, not the money in football, like you say we wouldn't care if we had a quality team competing, the guy thinks he's Arsenals messiah and the reason we exist, to be honest he's had it easy, easy from the club and easy from the fans, he had blind support from many for years, many more years than he would have had at any other club.

If anything Arsenal fans are the opposite of spoilt, they've been loyal beyond belief to a man who doesn't give them anything back and blames them a lot of the time.

I'm not being funny but how much do people now remember of the the great teams, Ill be honest and say those times are a distant memory, it's becoming hard to remember the champagne football and successes as they're so long ago now,for me I'll remember him as the guy who turned this club into this thing that I no longer really like and a manager who was in reality overrated by many.

Arsenal fans may not be entitled, but they are definitely mugs. All of us. This guy should have walked 10 years ago and even now he's still given a very easy ride with fans too afraid to pull out a protest banner because they get attacked by Wenger cultists. Can you imagine Hammers or Geordies or Mancs putting up with this for so long? They'd have long hounded the guy out.

No other club would put up with what we've had to. Fuck me, some managers only have to lose 10 games to be sacked these days.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mir...p-12107420.amp

If this is true IF

Than the players are as much cunts as Wenger is.

They are professional athletes being paid obscene money, they shouldn’t be complaining about feeling shattered. We know that Spurs players are drilled rigorously. If you’re exhausted because you are pushed too hard in training the fault lies as much with them as their idiotic manager