Match reaction vs Everton

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Originally Posted by Mac76

Trossard came on with half an hour and to be fair did his bit to try to make something happen.

I'd give him, Gabriel and Saliba each a 7 but otherwise agree with your scores

Just hoping this game will bust the Zinchenko myth a bit, all the hero-worship's been getting on my nerves

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It’s fine to be wise after the event but i think with the power of hindsight we should have started him

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

A truly humbling day..... but always best to get these days come early so we learn from them.

Its now 180 mins in 2 games where we have not scored.

In both games our wide men were marked out of the game and we seemed to have no plan B.

The sad thing is that before these two games happened, Newcastle had showed the blueprint on how to play us so we should have been forewarned.

We need to make our possession in the middle count and be able to pose goal threats from playing straight through the middle

So many times in this game you could see Xhaka, Zinchenko and Odegaard be in loads of space in the middle and still pass the ball out wide to heavily marked men. It makes no f**king sense if they expect Saka, Martinelli and Eddie to bail us out with goals every single time....you win games by scoring goals and not the amount of passes you make.

One more important thing: Arteta seems to be the only "top" manager I know who consistently makes the game worse with his subs i.e. his substitutions come to late or never improve the game.

He needs to work on his shit, because you can't always pick the right team on the get go and your team must be able to adapt when it clear the opposition has figured you out.

We met a team today that wanted it more than us and deserved to win....a top manager would have been adequately prepared for the "new coach bounce".

A sad day but we have to get over it fast!!!


Lastly, Eddie needs to learn how to get more involved in games. People criticised Jesus for not always being in the box but the last 2 games should show that coming out and forcing defenders out of position has it's upsides.

Oh and why don't our wingers exchange positions temporarily during the game like we use to do under AW and Emery...it can be effective in confusing defenders in games like this. I think Martinelli tried to force it but Saka was having none of it. Arteta should really consider it as I am sure he is the cause of this not happening.

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Agree with most of that and on that last point, I noticed Martinelli move over later on but as you say Saka didn't reciprocate.

Also I think we now need to ask the question about Vieira, against a determined PL side like Neverton were today he seems to have little to offer, he's basically a cup-game filler, not a game-changer

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Dunno about that, Wenger managed quite a few of those in the last few years of his reign away from home

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I mean percentage wise...tried asking the all knowing Chat GPT, but it couldn't be bothered either, with the usual excuse of "my knowledge cuts off after 2021".....well I asked it about AW too and it still came up with the same silly answer :lol:

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Originally Posted by Mac76

Agree with most of that and on that last point, I noticed Martinelli move over later on but as you say Saka didn't reciprocate.

Also I think we now need to ask the question about Vieira, against a determined PL side like Neverton were today he seems to have little to offer, he's basically a cup-game filler, not a game-changer

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I don't want to be premature, but Fabio Vieira does not seem like the kind of player Arteta can get the best out of, thats if you ask me anyway.

I mean, clearly he's a talented player but he doesn't seem like a player who can play in a rigid system like Arteta insists on. He's more like the kind of player who AW would have loved....but lets see.

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

I mean percentage wise...tried asking the all knowing Chat GPT, but it couldn't be bothered either, with the usual excuse of "my knowledge cuts off after 2021".....well I asked it about AW too and it still came up with the same silly answer :lol:

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The worst thing with Arteta is that if we concede the first goal away from home, there is something like an 87% chance of dropping points.

At home not so much of an issue (we’ve conceded first three times at home this season and gone on to win each time)

For me this is largely a midfield issue. Teams can play with men behind the ball and do us on the break because we don't like the physicality

As far as I’m aware we haven’t won an away game after conceding first since 2021 (Leicester)

That’s got to be addressed. We knew as soon as we went 1-0 down today that it was game over

People are talking about the subs

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...-Jorginho.html

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

I don't want to be premature, but Fabio Vieira does not seem like the kind of player Arteta can get the best out of, thats if you ask me anyway.

I mean, clearly he's a talented player but he doesn't seem like a player who can play in a rigid system like Arteta insists on. He's more like the kind of player who AW would have loved....but lets see.

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I think he will improve once he has adapted to PL and bulked up a bit. I think he has high potential but he is just not ready right now. Not ready in the sense that he can't influence games even though he does do some great stuff in games from time to time.

I think he will improve next season and become more of an option for the team as a rotation player.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

The worst thing with Arteta is that if we concede the first goal away from home, there is something like an 87% chance of dropping points.

At home not so much of an issue (we’ve conceded first three times at home this season and gone on to win each time)

For me this is largely a midfield issue. Teams can play with men behind the ball and do us on the break because we don't like the physicality

As far as I’m aware we haven’t won an away game after conceding first since 2021 (Leicester)

That’s got to be addressed. We knew as soon as we went 1-0 down today that it was game over

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I said it on the match thread at half time that we could lose the game, but once they scored that early in the half I actually felt we had enough time to draw.

Yes, we don't have another striker but it was rather lame to throw on all the attacking players you have hoping for a goal...IIRC he panicked and did the same thing against Man U.

He should look at tweaking or developing another system of attack when it comes to us going forward. His methods of altering a game really needs to be worked on

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

A truly humbling day..... but always best to get these days come early so we learn from them.

Its now 180 mins in 2 games where we have not scored.

In both games our wide men were marked out of the game and we seemed to have no plan B.

The sad thing is that before these two games happened, Newcastle had showed the blueprint on how to play us so we should have been forewarned.

We need to make our possession in the middle count and be able to pose goal threats from playing straight through the middle

So many times in this game you could see Xhaka, Zinchenko and Odegaard be in loads of space in the middle and still pass the ball out wide to heavily marked men. It makes no f**king sense if they expect Saka, Martinelli and Eddie to bail us out with goals every single time....you win games by scoring goals and not the amount of passes you make.

One more important thing: Arteta seems to be the only "top" manager I know who consistently makes the game worse with his subs i.e. his substitutions come to late or never improve the game.

He needs to work on his shit, because you can't always pick the right team on the get go and your team must be able to adapt when it clear the opposition has figured you out.

We met a team today that wanted it more than us and deserved to win....a top manager would have been adequately prepared for the "new coach bounce".

A sad day but we have to get over it fast!!!


Lastly, Eddie needs to learn how to get more involved in games. People criticised Jesus for not always being in the box but the last 2 games should show that coming out and forcing defenders out of position has it's upsides.

Oh and why don't our wingers exchange positions temporarily during the game like we use to do under AW and Emery...it can be effective in confusing defenders in games like this. I think Martinelli tried to force it but Saka was having none of it. Arteta should really consider it as I am sure he is the cause of this not happening.

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Pretty good post.

Arteta is just too rigid in both tactics and team selection.

For example, Ben White put in a horrific performance against Man U. Tommy comes on and does well. He does better than most against City then he's dropped, because...

Same with his system which often neuters the attack. With Zinchenko instructed to tuck in side and White being an offensive liability it leaves Saka and Martinelli almost always double teams. That only leaves Eddie ahead of Odegaard when he gets on the ball and looks forward. Xhaka is utterly woeful at playing fitba so not even worth mentioning other than being an offensive black hole.

Today was a great chance to rotate a little with Tommy, Viera and Trossard coming in for White, Xhaka and Martinelli.

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Originally Posted by Chippy

Always said it. We are in a race for fourth place. Nothing else.

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And you were always wrong and continue to be.
Top 4 was certainly my target pre-season but this isn't a side who are going to be scrapping for 4th place like we were last year.
We're 8 points clear of 3rd place with a game in hand, we're 14 points of 5th place with a game in hand.