Wenger to sign a new deal

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Originally Posted by Syn

I can't and won't speak for 'most people on here' because I think most people on here are stupid. But I would try to use my head. We knew Tottenham had a tougher run in and we still had over a quarter of a season to go. I didn't think we would make it because it was hard to imagine us going on such a brilliant run over 10 games. I don't think some people understand what choking or bottling means. Its such a stupid thing to do to pick out, say, our qpr game and say we bottled it had we missed out. Tottenham were consistent in their performances throughout the season. Not brilliant but not bad either. Nobody saw us putting on that sort of run together - better than title winning form - given how disjointed we looked earlier, and luckily there were lots of games left to just about sneak it. If Tottenham's results fallen off a cliff over a run of games they were expected to win, and we stayed on our usual mediocre form, then you can call it choking.

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Looking at the points tally on paper is different to the actual season and build up during the weekend. On matchday, regardless of the opponent, if one match determined whether or not we stayed ahead of Spurs in the league and we lost or drew, I can't imagine anyone on here, including you, keeping calm about the result. If it was one of those games where we didn't kick into gear quick enough, switched off or failed to convert our chances, it would held up as the point where we chocked because the pressure was on and the players lost their nerve. Even if it's only by a small margin and we play well for the rest of the season, it's still a choke.

I hear what you're saying though, but I wouldn't be so forgiving if it were my team. Only in retrospect can we be so calm and because the results went our way. In most other sports, regardless of how well you play, you miss that last clutch shot and it's a choke. Screw up on the last lap and you lost your nerve, regardless of whose behind you. But it all depends on perspective when it comes to these things. Come out the winner and you think it was an excellent performance, come out with the lose and your critical of your performance.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

from tonights q&a with him. check twitter all hte main blogs are living blogging it.


he isnt talking about now, he says we do have money, however he said last 8 years arsene has been operating on a limited budget and only able to get players within that budget

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It doesn't really change things though does it? It's simple maths. If you can afford two pairs of £60 Addidas, you can afford a pair of Nike's top of the range £110 trainers.

We operate within a budget but it's how you chop it up.

Personally i don't care if Wenger stays as long as
a) we actually prove we are not all talk and sign the players we clearly need
b) steve bould stays on as assistant manager, my belief is that in the last ten games (11 if you count Bayern Munich) conceeding five goals in that run in was not just laurent koscielny individually but bould drilling that team defensively and you look at the goals we conceeded most of which were individual errors rather than poor tactical set up.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

It doesn't really change things though does it? It's simple maths. If you can afford two pairs of £60 Addidas, you can afford a pair of Nike's top of the range £110 trainers.

We operate within a budget but it's how you chop it up.

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however just because you can spend the whole budget on one top player doesnt mean you should. one striker was never going to help us, so wenger had to buy several players at cheap prices.

You see, while some will resort to use the ad hominem in a bid to aggrandise themselves and to look smart, I just stick to pointers that are relevant to what is being debated.

Now, it appears some might have mirepresented what I said - inadvertently or otherwise - making it seem I'm arguing that the scum had choked in a calamitous manner. They were 7 points clear after defeating us and with only 10 games to go, it is my view that it did take a bit of choking at some point on their part, for us to catch up, keep pace and nick them in the end.

And, both fixtures with 10 games to go were tricky. We had the league leaders, a team that were also then in CL spot contention and relegation threatened teams fighting for their prem lives to face.

They had the defending champs who had already surrendered their crown, an inconsistent chav team and maybe a few half decent teams to face. All this with an inform chimp banging in flukes left, right and centre ftw.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Looking at the points tally on paper is different to the actual season and build up during the weekend. On matchday, regardless of the opponent, if one match determined whether or not we stayed ahead of Spurs in the league and we lost or drew, I can't imagine anyone on here, including you, keeping calm about the result.

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Yes, if one match determined that and it was a match we should win, then yes. Quite clearly, there was no such one match. Although if we did have to pick such a match, I'm guessing it would be our game with Tottenham - that they won. In no way can they be accused of choking.

And also, if your team loses (which doesn't mean they choked) of course you're not going to be 'calm'. We're going to highlight our crappy defence and our rubbish attack and our weak midfield and whatever else has been awful - just like it might've been all season. Not necessarily the bottle (or lack of) of our players.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

however just because you can spend the whole budget on one top player doesnt mean you should. one striker was never going to help us, so wenger had to buy several players at cheap prices.

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But it makes sense to pay smaller fees on players that can't even get first team action and push up the wage bill?

Park cost us £3m and Santos £6m. Throw in the money we paid for Eisfield and Joe Campbell, we could have just bought a decent £10m plus player like a Merts, Podolski or Arteta. Someone that would do a job there and then, ready for the first team.

Or look at our bigger signings from that 11/12 window. £10m for Gervinho and £12 for Ox. Ox hardly played and Gervinho wasn't good enough plus was going to the AFCON. Why not just find a £20m winger that's ready there and then and we don't have to worry about developing Ox and waiting 3 years for him to become the £20m superstar we hope he'll be whilst putting up Gervinho's Bambi like antics?

That's an example of one season of spending. 9 players and all of them were above average to below but not one exceptional talent with the money spent! £50m!

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

however just because you can spend the whole budget on one top player doesnt mean you should. one striker was never going to help us, so wenger had to buy several players at cheap prices.

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:gp:

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Originally Posted by Syn

Yes, if one match determined that and it was a match we should win, then yes. Quite clearly, there was no such one match. Although if we did have to pick such a match, I'm guessing it would be our game with Tottenham - that they won. In no way can they be accused of choking.

And also, if your team loses (which doesn't mean they choked) of course you're not going to be 'calm'. We're going to highlight our crappy defence and our rubbish attack and our weak midfield and whatever else has been awful - just like it might've been all season. Not necessarily the bottle (or lack of) of our players.

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I'd actually say the Everton and Man Utd game. I remember a few comments about us choking in the big games, games that matter, players failing to turn up and the usual talk. But it's the same for the Spurs game. I remember some of the comments in the match reaction thread and failing to turn up when we need the results. I don't know if we'd be talking like this if we didn't qualify for the CL.

Spurs run in


Liverpool (a) Lost 3-2

- Never an easy team to play especially at Anfield, we won there earlier in the season but i still think they gave us a game until we scored the second goal, dodgy goalkeeping from Hugo Lloris and dodgy defending from both sides.


Fulham (h) Lost 1-0
- Three days after losing 4-1 at the San Siro, dominated the game but were sucker punched by their old friend Berbatov


Swansea (a) Won 2-1
- Never an easy place to go and win but they took a two goal lead and held on despite a late fightback


Everton (h) Drew 2-2
- Dominated possession and chances and again quite unlucky to come away with only a point, poor defending from Caulker and Vertonghen for the Jagielka header.


Man City (h) Won 3-1
- City wanted to win this game and keep the title race going for as long as possible, Spurs actually created very little for 70 minutes but controlled possession and invariably wore City down capatalising on poor marking for the equaliser and taking city apart on the counter attack for second and third goal.


Wigan (a) Drew 2-2
- Poor defending by Spurs but catastrophic defending from Wigan, Spurs controlled the game without ever really creating that much....both goals arguably gifted to them. Poor marking for Emerson Boyce's goal only a minute after them taking the lead.


Southampton (h) won 1-0
- Poor first half, took control of the game in the last twenty minutes and got the goal their dominance just about merited


Chelsea (a) drew 2-2
- Were outplayed by Chelsea for long periods of this game but took their chances and got back level twice and despite Gareth Bale having a poor game by his standards actually performed quite decently.


Stoke (a) won 2-1
Delicately poised at half-time, Spurs dominated possession as they would against most teams they would play but Stoke creating the better chances. After Charlie Adam got himself sent off was only a matter of time before Spurs broke through and got a winner with Adebayor duly obliging.


Sunderland (h) won 1-0
A very tense game with Spurs being kept at bay by Simon Mignolet, the tension was displayed by both players and the crowd........a rather dull affair settled by a wonder goal. Proved to be irrelevant as 4th place had been decided on Tyneside.



Arsenal run in


Swansea (a) 2-0
Didn't create much in the first half but apart from Michu Swansea created very little as well. The welsh side tired as the game went on, played much deeper and deeper and the pressure told. We soaked up whatever pressure they put on us in the last twenty minutes and put them to the sword on the counter.


Reading (h) 4-1
Stroll in the park with Gervinho and Cazorla having one of those fancy free games where they just ran at the defence for fun.


West Brom (a) 2-1
Not the best defensive performance in the world, Fabianski looking all at sea from set pieces....man of the match Tomas Rosicky providing brilliance in clearing off the line as well as taking his two goals superbly. Another shout out for Gervinho who proved that he could add a finishing touch to his technical talent.


Norwich (h) 3-1
Tense, Labored performance....the start of the dire midfield performances that would sum up the rest of our season. Conceding a cheap goal with lapse marking, looked like we would lose until we brought on podolski and walcott who opened up the canaries with their pace.


Everton (h) 0-0
Truly awful game which no side looked like they wanted to win, Everton shot their bolt within the first twenty minutes. And it wasn't until Wenger's clockwork efficiency with bringing on substitutes on 67 minutes that we actually looked dangerous and looked like we could win the game....too litttle...too late....Giroud's left foot.


Fulham (a) 1-0
Could have been punished, should have been punished....weren't punished. We were fortunate to play a Fulham side that couldn't buy a win....and had been completely savaged at home to Chelsea mid-week. Even despite the man advantage, couldn't keep possession....played deeper and deeper.....had to rely on Szczesny to bail us out with some decent saves. When Giroud was sent off it was frankly a relief......one of those games that illustrated why Aaron Ramsey should be no-where near the first 11.


Man United (h) 1-1
I thoroughly disagree with people that felt we played well in this game, we stunk up the place and deserved to be beaten against a side that were already champions and for the first half an hour clearly didn't even give a fuck. Half-hearted challenges, no pressure on us on the ball and we were only 1-0 up, Ramsey was giving away the ball at every single opportunity and Rosicky was forever trying to shoot when there wasn't a shot on. When United woke from their slumber it was only a matter of time before they equalized, so Sagna really didn't need to do them a favour. Second half even worse....constantly torn to shreds on the counter attack and wasn't for the fact that both Valencia and Rooney had poor games would have lost and resoundingly.


QPR (a) 1-0
One of the games that sums up why i hate watching Arsenal this season, reasonably nice passing football in the first twenty minutes but as soon as QPR realised they were playing a competitive match the team retreated into their shells. Arteta was ok, but Rosicky and Ramsey were an utter disgrace again....although neither of them managed to perform quite as badly as Monreal in that game.....you could tell we were playing a team that was already relegated any other side would have had us on toast.


Wigan (h) 4-1
Good opening fifteeen minutes, but after that retreated back further and further and invariably made to pay for our reticence to go for the jugular albeit with a little assistance from Mike Dean. Second half, we weathered a right old battering.....and took the game and premiership survival away from Wigan. Probably one of most accomplished second half performances of the season despite playing with a shackle round our leg in the form of Aaron Ramsey.


Newcastle (a) 1-0
Awful, Awful, Awful......whimpered our way to Champions League football....Walcott and Koscielny seemed to be the only players that had bothered to turn up at St James Park. Ramsey was a good pick for the neutral whose inept passing and inability to keep the ball kept the game in the balance despite Newcastle preferring not to have anyone go into the box (taking a leaf out of our own book no doubt)....Walcott was slightly unlucky not to put the game to bed. Was just glad when it was over and not just because we secured 4th, no more awful football to watch for another two and a half months....phew.

So to summarise we got 4th playing ugly little bit, drab little bit, lucky little bit, plucky little bit, clucky little bit, =Spurs :pal: however our chances of the title next year if groundhog day happens again :ilt:

You can tell it's summer :doh:

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Originally Posted by LDG

You can tell it's summer :doh:

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Uhuh must've run out of belly button fluff to argue with :blink:

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

If we were 7 points ahead of Spurs and then fell behind them to finish 5th, wouldn't most people on here put that down to us chocking?

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People don't understand what choking means if they think Spurs choked. Even allowing for every game played since the match against us, they lost 1 game that they shouldn't have. One game from that point until the end of the season.

That is not choking.

why dont we stop arguing about wether spurs choked or not, and just laugh at them for finishing below us. again


spurs :haha:

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

why dont we stop arguing about wether spurs choked or not, and just laugh at them for finishing below us. again


spurs :haha:

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:goodpost:

The scum. :haha:

Their best season ever as it relates to points haul, and still they dwell in our shadow.

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

why dont we stop arguing about wether spurs choked or not, and just laugh at them for finishing below us. again


spurs :haha:

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Why don't you just shut up.

To prevent groundhog day we need to stop the February/March collapse that causes us to go out of every competition each season in a matter of a few weeks.

2007 - LC Cup 25th Feb, FA Cup 28th Feb, Champions League 7th March.....out of three competitions within 10 days
2008 - FA Cup 16th Feb plus 1 win from next six league games (CL exit happened in April)
2011 - LC Cup 27th Feb, Champions League 8th March, FA Cup 12th March
2012 - FA Cup 18th Feb (following on from 4-0 drubbing by AC Milan) Champions League 6th March
2013 - FA Cup 16th Feb, Champions League 13th March (although tie effectively ended on 19th Feb)

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Originally Posted by GB.

Why don't you just shut up.

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why don't you just fuck off :good:

It was a joke.

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Originally Posted by GB.

It was a joke.

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didnt come acrros that way. apologies

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Originally Posted by ollie the optimist

didnt come acrros that way. apologies

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I thought of writing, "why don't you just fuck off" but figured I'd tame it down a bit in case you didn't get it and flew off on one.

This how the fights started in the crowd :rose:

calm it ladies.... this is exactly the reason why atmosphere at home matches is so dire!

I'm just happy that everyone is in agreement that Wenger is a great man and deserves our respect.

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Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm

I'm just happy that everyone is in agreement that Wenger is a great man and deserves our respect.

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Why don't you just shut up.

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Originally Posted by Suarez Is Boss

Why don't you just shut up.

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Why don't you just fuck off. :good:

Yes, eat ALL of our shirts.

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Originally Posted by GB.

People don't understand what choking means if they think Spurs choked. Even allowing for every game played since the match against us, they lost 1 game that they shouldn't have. One game from that point until the end of the season.

That is not choking.

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Again, if you look at Spurs and their run, you'd say they didn't choke. But if it were us...:lol:

Not all teams are equal.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Again, if you look at Spurs and their run, you'd say they didn't choke. But if it were us...:lol:

Not all teams are equal.

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I know what you are getting at, but no, I wouldn't.

But I'd be pissed off.

Even if it's must win 3 pointer game, media hyping and Wenger saying he's confident the team will deliver and the usual media narrative building up the importance of a particular game? A game where we just fail to turn up and totally bottle the occasion. You wouldn't call it choking?

expectation levels of the two clubs count for a lot. 8 years without a trophy but 17 in the cl keeps those levels far higher than spurs, added to the weight of history between the two clubs and respective managers. we are 'expected' in a sense to remain among the elite whilst if spurs achieve it, they are breaking not only the establishment but their own threshold. and that goes back far longer than wenger's reign.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Even if it's must win 3 pointer game, media hyping and Wenger saying he's confident the team will deliver and the usual media narrative building up the importance of a particular game? A game where we just fail to turn up and totally bottle the occasion. You wouldn't call it choking?

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Sorry - I don't follow.

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Originally Posted by LDG

You can tell it's summer :doh:

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Not by going outside you can't :cold:

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Originally Posted by Josh_Gooner

Now, it appears some might have mirepresented what I said - inadvertently or otherwise - making it seem I'm arguing that the scum had choked in a calamitous manner. They were 7 points clear after defeating us and with only 10 games to go, it is my view that it did take a bit of choking at some point on their part, for us to catch up, keep pace and nick them in the end.

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After they played us they only lost one game you'd expect them to win though, and they won games which I thought they'd drop points in. Overall I don't see how that's choking. It was the 2 games after we played them that let us back in but even then despite the run we were on and their tougher run-in they pushed us hard and we had to scrape a win on the last day of the season to stay ahead of them.

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Originally Posted by Josh_Gooner

And, both fixtures with 10 games to go were tricky. We had the league leaders, a team that were also then in CL spot contention and relegation threatened teams fighting for their prem lives to face.

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We did, and we dropped points in both. As for the relegation-threatened teams, we put Wigan down although it was a few days after the Cup Final when we'd had a break. QPR were already down, Newcastle were safe, Fulham weren't in serious danger. West Brom and Swansea weren't in any danger. Norwich were in trouble but we were at home and they'd only won one of their previous 15 games! Even then we wobbled. Reading were rock bottom and we were at home, they lost 15 out of 19 away games and had lost their previous 5 games when we played them.

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Originally Posted by Josh_Gooner

They had the defending champs who had already surrendered their crown, an inconsistent chav team and maybe a few half decent teams to face. All this with an inform chimp banging in flukes left, right and centre ftw.

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City had already surrendered? They'd won the 3 previous games before they played Spurs, including away at Utd. It was all over bar the shouting by then anyway but the results hardly suggest they weren't bothering any more at that stage. As for Chelsea, they certainly had a poor league season but they did win 6 of their last 8 league games, the only 2 they dropped points in were Liverpool away and Spurs at home - it was the first time they'd dropped at home since the Reading game at the end of January

After the Spurs game I didn't think we had a chance of catching them. I fully expected them to drop points - 6 of their last 10 games were potentially tricky - but I had no confidence in Arsenal's ability to put the kind of run together we needed to in order to put serious pressure on. We rather stumbled through a lot of games but by hook or by crook we did it.

End of the day I'd expect Spurs fans to be more emotional about this than us, they'd surely be more likely to feel the team choked or let them down. None of the Spurs fans I know do feel that.

Top analysis.

spurs did not choke this season.

they choked last season. even their own fans admit it.

but this season they got their highest ever points tally and had a great run towards the end. that is not choking.

Spot on.

Points taken. Nothing wrong with us agreeing to disagree on matters providing we keep it civil.

Think we can all agree, though, that spuds have well and truly developed and embraced an inferiority complex to us. Trying to usurp us is pretty much the highlight of their seasons. Keeping them in their place over many seasons has one common denominator, that is Arsene Wenger, to whom due credit should be given and respect must be shown for this litlle bit remarkable fete.

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Originally Posted by Josh_Gooner

Trying to usurp us is pretty much the highlight of their seasons.

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This is fasting becoming the highlight of ours too.