Arsenal vs Ammers 22.02.2025 - KO 15:00 GMT

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

We have the players who can up the tempo and play a more direct game, we've seen it, it works. We can't break teams down because we almost hand craft invitations for the opposition defence to meander back to their defensive positions. We are always facing masses ranks because it takes us 30+ passes to move the ball all around our own half before getting it into the opposition third. We have players like Saka, Nwaneri, Trossaard, Martinelli, tierney, these guys whould be playing at 100mph every match with their eyes fixed on the opposition goal. Instead they are expending 100% effort shuffling around the place trying to fill two, even three roles.

Just hump the fucking ball up the pitch and if you are going to use Merindo then he's good in the air, so use him as a target man. Then get that fucker down to either Partey or Odeagrd and hoof that fucker at the goal so the forwards can heap maximum pressure on the defence.

I thought we were supposed to be optimally fit, that the modern PL was agame for athletes? So why are we plodding around at 1mph? The fucking grass has grown by the time we transition up the pitch.

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When have we seen it? I know you keep insisting on the fact that Rice is this Roy of the Rovers footballer who can play box to box. But he doesn’t, he doesn’t have the passing range, the acceleration or the skill with the ball to his feet. It’s not his fault, it’s not how he plays…he’s a defensive midfielder his job is to neutralise danger and he’s exceptional at that. I told you very clearly that we beat Man City because they are a side of suicidal stubbornness when it comes to playing out from the back. They overcommitted and left acres of space for us to run into.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

And we’ve all been deluding ourselves into a fairy tale belief that somehow players who don’t look like scoring were somehow going to score

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Guilty as charged, but despite our injuries there are players out there who should be able to chip in and score goals. I thought you were being hysterical when you questioned whether we can stay in the top 4 but right now you do have to wonder where the goals are going to come from to keep us up there. It’s galling to see Liverpool cruise to the title so easily. They’re the best in the league but that’s a low bar this season.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

When have we seen it? I know you keep insisting on the fact that Rice is this Roy of the Rovers footballer who can play box to box. But he doesn’t, he doesn’t have the passing range, the acceleration or the skill with the ball to his feet. It’s not his fault, it’s not how he plays…he’s a defensive midfielder his job is to neutralise danger and he’s exceptional at that. I told you very clearly that we beat Man City because they are a side of suicidal stubbornness when it comes to playing out from the back. They overcommitted and left acres of space for us to run into.

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I know you are suffering with some sort of mental illness when it comes to Rice, possibly because you are sexually attracted to Partey and will get a better view of his buttocks if he plays further up the pitch.

But I was talking about the tempo of the game and the comfort we afford the opposition defence. It's all obvious stuff really. Give the defenders less time and they'll make more mistakes. Not sure you need any of the imaginary tactics pundits come up with to justify their salaries.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I know you are suffering with some sort of mental illness when it comes to Rice, possibly because you are sexually attracted to Partey and will get a better view of his buttocks if he plays further up the pitch.

But I was talking about the tempo of the game and the comfort we afford the opposition defence. It's all obvious stuff really. Give the defenders less time and they'll make more mistakes. Not sure you need any of the imaginary tactics pundits come up with to justify their salaries.

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So sidestepping the two paragraphs of poo you’ve written. When was this time we were able to play direct and cut through an opposition that didn’t play totally into our hands?

I’m not talking about tactics. I don’t think we’ve got the players to do what you’re saying we should do

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Originally Posted by Letters

Guilty as charged, but despite our injuries there are players out there who should be able to chip in and score goals. I thought you were being hysterical when you questioned whether we can stay in the top 4 but right now you do have to wonder where the goals are going to come from to keep us up there. It’s galling to see Liverpool cruise to the title so easily. They’re the best in the league but that’s a low bar this season.

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Liverpool aren't a great team, not even a notable one. They have a great player carrying them, and a decent enough defender just about holding things together. And a couple of world class cheats to consistently tilt the playing field.

Gypos are a bunch of mercenaries who are tired of it now, too rich, can't be arsed.

We always had top 4 as the goal. For financial reasons. There was never any intention to win anything, that's not the focus of the club.

Probably the worst PL in quite some time. None of these 3 would have got within a mile of recent gypo title winners or even recent Liverpool winners. And, sadly, even out team from last year would be an impossible hurdle for anything in this league right now (especially our current bunch of shitkickers)

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

So sidestepping the two paragraphs of poo you’ve written. When was this time we were able to play direct and cut through an opposition that didn’t play totally into our hands?

I’m not talking about tactics. I don’t think we’ve got the players to do what you’re saying we should do

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Oh - the extra condition tagged to the end so you can skip over your bizarre, unbalanced initial response and also leapfrog my reminder of what the conversation is actually about.

The last game was Leicester, the second goal. And then back through this season with several examples, last season likewise and all the way back through Wenger's reign, we've ALWAYS been better playing at a high tempo. We've NEVER been Barcelona. We're more than capable. Yes, granted we can't go too gung-ho given the current injury crisis. But how hard would it be for a wide man to play on the move facing the opposition goal rather than stood still with back to goal?

Pepe ruined football. He's cursed it. It's why most games are unwatchable now.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Oh - the extra condition tagged to the end so you can skip over your bizarre, unbalanced initial response and also leapfrog my reminder of what the conversation is actually about.

The last game was Leicester, the second goal. And then back through this season with several examples, last season likewise and all the way back through Wenger's reign, we've ALWAYS been better playing at a high tempo. We've NEVER been Barcelona. We're more than capable. Yes, granted we can't go too gung-ho given the current injury crisis. But how hard would it be for a wide man to play on the move facing the opposition goal rather than stood still with back to goal?

Pepe ruined football. He's cursed it. It's why most games are unwatchable now.

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Leicester the second goal? You mean the second goal where play was stretched because we’d already taken the lead, meaning Leicester had to come out and overcommit.

Plus what I said about Rice was relevant to the discussion. This direct, high tempo football you crave is not possible when you’re playing a defensive midfielder at 8. I don’t know where your weird projected homoerotic remark about Partey came from as I don’t think he’s especially a great 8 either. But he’s better at it than Rice and Rice is far, far better at 6 than Partey.


And maybe if nothing else if Rice wasn’t pushed so far forward we’d have had better protection for our back line. And we’d be bemoaning a 0-0 rather than a 1-0 defeat

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Leicester the second goal? You mean the second goal where play was stretched because we’d already taken the lead, meaning Leicester had to come out and overcommit.

Plus what I said about Rice was relevant to the discussion. This direct, high tempo football you crave is not possible when you’re playing a defensive midfielder at 8. I don’t know where your weird projected homoerotic remark about Partey came from as I don’t think he’s especially a great 8 either. But he’s better at it than Rice and Rice is far, far better at 6 than Partey.


And maybe if nothing else if Rice wasn’t pushed so far forward we’d have had better protection for our back line. And we’d be bemoaning a 0-0 rather than a 1-0 defeat

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So Trossard outpaced and beat his man because Leicester lacked players in and around the box? Didn't look that way. Looked more like Trossard skinning the defender. Why aren't we playing it in front of him so he can do that some more? It's what he does. Instead we see him engaged in pretty triangles before one of the midfielders feels the slightest pressure and plays it all the way back. Happens what, 20 times a match? Same with Nwaneri, he's keen to take on his man, not afraid at all. But instead we have him tip tapping it between himself and 5 yard Odegard?

We had a break in Dubai? We should have run the legs off WH. We didn't get out of first gear. It's not about the intricacies of football that may or may not be real, it's about getting to the bal quicker, playing more positive passes, accepting you might lose the ball, using the supposedly best defence in the league to cover those occasions.

Even simpler, play at 2mph instead of 1mph. Even that would be better.

Trossard did well to take on his man and put in a good cross, but watch the goal again….Calafiori acres of space finds Trossard, his man gets tight to him but only because Trossard has no pace, but when Trossard puts the ball in, Leicester defenders are still running back and therefore Merino is able to ghost in unmarked.

It’s a counter attacking goal. It’s the kind of goal you can only score when the opposition has pushed up which they had

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

A red card is only a 3 match ban for dangerous play. It’s a one match ban

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Ah didn't know this....that makes things a little bit more palatable.

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

Ah didn't know this....that makes things a little bit more palatable.

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It’s why we lost Saliba for only the one game back in October

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Trossard did well to take on his man and put in a good cross, but watch the goal again….Calafiori acres of space finds Trossard, his man gets tight to him but only because Trossard has no pace, but when Trossard puts the ball in, Leicester defenders are still running back and therefore Merino is able to ghost in unmarked.

It’s a counter attacking goal. It’s the kind of goal you can only score when the opposition has pushed up which they had

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No wait, I'm not saying we have to score a goal every time we go forward. I'm saying we should play at a higher tempo, we should be more direct and play with a lot more pace (which we usually have, albeit not right now). Even Sterling would find it easier despite his shot legs. You are making my point for me. When the defenders are put under more pressure there is more chance of them making a mistake. They could be under pressure because their mates are up the field chasing the game, or they could be under pressure because relentless bastards keep coming at them with no let-up.

We, instead, tip it around in front of the opposition defence. And when the opposition gets stretched by a pass or when recovering from a transition, by the time we've completed out 30+ 5 yard passes, everyone has had a breather and is comfortably back in control.

The very fact almost every manager is now a Pep knock-off is why we get two teams playing chess instead of football. We need to be knights against these pawn armies. Go over, past and around them but always forwards and always with urgency. How could that NOT be more effective than trying to walk the ball in 80+ times in a season?

Right just one more time. We weren’t playing at a higher tempo, we were playing with more space. Not because we created the space with our high tempo, but because Leicester had no choice but to push forward after going behind.

We don’t have the players with the ball skills of Thierry Henry to make defenders part like the Red Sea. Savvy?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

We always had top 4 as the goal. For financial reasons. There was never any intention to win anything, that's not the focus of the club.

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I don’t think that’s as true as it used to be.
For financial reasons Top 4 has been a minimum requirement but the level of investment over the last few years suggests they have tried to push on and win something. Had it not been for us being up against a team who have been cheating for years we’d have won the title last year and maybe the year before. It’s frustrating when City finally do drop off that it’s not us who benefits. Maybe without the injuries we’d have run Liverpool close, and without the refs putting their thumb on the scales which has clearly cost us points. But we left ourselves vulnerable with a lack of squad depth and failing to sign a striker last summer when it was clearly a problem area was just negligent

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Right just one more time. We weren’t playing at a higher tempo, we were playing with more space. Not because we created the space with our high tempo, but because Leicester had no choice but to push forward after going behind.

We don’t have the players with the ball skills of Thierry Henry to make defenders part like the Red Sea. Savvy?

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Obviously it's going to take more than one time. What do you think would be more effective? Trossard taking on his man and getting the cross in? Or Trossard recieving the ball with his back to goal, slowing it down, taking a few taps and then playing it back into the midfield to the closest team mate?

I don't think the answer to this is difficult. But we'll see.

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Originally Posted by Letters

I don’t think that’s as true as it used to be.
For financial reasons Top 4 has been a minimum requirement but the level of investment over the last few years suggests they have tried to push on and win something. Had it not been for us being up against a team who have been cheating for years we’d have won the title last year and maybe the year before. It’s frustrating when City finally do drop off that it’s not us who benefits. Maybe without the injuries we’d have run Liverpool close, and without the refs putting their thumb on the scales which has clearly cost us points. But we left ourselves vulnerable with a lack of squad depth and failing to sign a striker last summer when it was clearly a problem area was just negligent

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I wonder about that. WOULD we have won the title last year if gypsies weren't allowed in the league? Maybe. Or maybe we'd have invested less because there'd be fewer direct rivals for the top 4 trophy. We saw in the summer we're prepared to ignore doing what it takes to win. Then we saw it even more starkly in January. I don't think there's any way to get around January. We KNEW we were desperately short, due to those injuries you mention AND because our shitty summer resulted in Sterling being evacuated onto our bench. Still did nothing. Still placed other priorities above winning. Player age, sell-on fee. It's become a very far-fetched argument that concluded this club is out to win trophies rather than maximise return on investment financially. Soon enough we'll be in the next summer window, then we will see. They'll need to spend 150-200 million (minus any sales) in that window to win, or when they spend considerably less, release 5 new kits and have us playing some whack tournament in some desert or the far side of the world, we'll know.

How do you think the summer will turn out? Isak, Sesko, somebody to replace Saliba, somebody to fill the gap left by Partey and Jorghino? The quality we need to win the title, as opposed to securing another top 4 trophy? I have a feeling we'll still be asking the question next deadline day and the headlines will read, "Sterling's Mum Signed in Loan Deal."

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I wonder about that. WOULD we have won the title last year if gypsies weren't allowed in the league? Maybe. Or maybe we'd have invested less because there'd be fewer direct rivals for the top 4 trophy. We saw in the summer we're prepared to ignore doing what it takes to win. Then we saw it even more starkly in January. I don't think there's any way to get around January. We KNEW we were desperately short, due to those injuries you mention AND because our shitty summer resulted in Sterling being evacuated onto our bench. Still did nothing. Still placed other priorities above winning. Player age, sell-on fee. It's become a very far-fetched argument that concluded this club is out to win trophies rather than maximise return on investment financially. Soon enough we'll be in the next summer window, then we will see. They'll need to spend 150-200 million (minus any sales) in that window to win, or when they spend considerably less, release 5 new kits and have us playing some whack tournament in some desert or the far side of the world, we'll know.

How do you think the summer will turn out? Isak, Sesko, somebody to replace Saliba, somebody to fill the gap left by Partey and Jorghino? The quality we need to win the title, as opposed to securing another top 4 trophy? I have a feeling we'll still be asking the question next deadline day and the headlines will read, "Sterling's Mum Signed in Loan Deal."

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I don't think we would have invested anywhere near as much as we have had we been content to bumble around in the top 4.
The investment we've made has seen us properly challenging for the first time in a couple of decades. We were miles above everyone last year, if you don't count the oil cheats.
January...it's hard to do serious business then although I as I just said in the match thread I still think Rashford might have been worth a punt.
This summer...God knows, although it will be interesting as it will show how serious we are about taking the final step up to land a big prize. If we do nothing of note again then I guess we'll have our answer.

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Originally Posted by Letters

I don't think we would have invested anywhere near as much as we have had we been content to bumble around in the top 4.
The investment we've made has seen us properly challenging for the first time in a couple of decades. We were miles above everyone last year, if you don't count the oil cheats.
January...it's hard to do serious business then although I as I just said in the match thread I still think Rashford might have been worth a punt.
This summer...God knows, although it will be interesting as it will show how serious we are about taking the final step up to land a big prize. If we do nothing of note again then I guess we'll have our answer.

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It's the opposite of hard to do business in January, it's easy, as demonstrated by the hundreds of deals that were made. Villa made the window look like a Black Friday Amazon click and collect. We spent the month either repeatedly failing to do what other clubs managed to do without fuss, or not even trying (which I'm betting is the case).