Random Arsenal Shit (When it's not worth starting a thread)

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

ultimately even if we beat Liverpool in the final it’s nice but it’s ultimately worthless.

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Which, again, is where you're wrong, it will be a huge boost to the club and the players, it will annoy spuds fans (always a good thing), and it might even make the Kroenkes realise they could have more fun days out if they put a bit mroe cash in

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Originally Posted by Mac76

Which, again, is where you're wrong, it will be a huge boost to the club and the players, it will annoy spuds fans (always a good thing), and it might even make the Kroenkes realise they could have more fun days out if they put a bit mroe cash in

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You really do need to learn the difference between your opinion and what is fact

It’s your contention that the league cup will be a huge boost to the club, how so I ask when the evidence of winning four fa cups in a six year period provides scant evidence of this huge boost you speak of.


If you want to win this trophy, because you think any trophy is better than none. Fine. But when you start broadcasting your opinions as gospel….tad silly

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

You really do need to learn the difference between your opinion and what is fact

It’s your contention that the league cup will be a huge boost to the club, how so I ask when the evidence of winning four fa cups in a six year period provides scant evidence of this huge boost you speak of.

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That was a different period where there wasn't the same ambition or team spirit which Arteta (despite his many faults) has created, anyone with any basic grasp of psychology woud understand it would enhance the self belief of what is stil a very young team.

Anyway, you just keep camping on here, incessantly countering everyone who happens to disagree with you, it's not like you've anything else to do...

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Originally Posted by Mac76

That was a different period where there wasn't the same ambition or team spirit which Arteta (despite his many faults) has created, anyone with any basic grasp of psychology woud understand it would enhance the self belief of what is stil a very young team.

Anyway, you just keep camping on here, incessantly countering everyone who happens to disagree with you, it's not like you've anything else to do...

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So the first bit, you haven’t defined how that’s not just your opinion. I could counter with why I disagree but if you’ve decided that your opinion is fact then there’s really not much point

Second bit I’m not sure what that’s relevant to. If it puts you at ease I could talk you through my day so you’re not left worrying that there’s not enough variance to my routine? :lol:

I read that the players are off to a warm weather training camp. This will hopefully do us good for the final part of the season.

Anthony (uglier than Dowie) Gordon saying “It is important to stay humble” things an e-Jit.

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

The smoking ban is easily one of if not the best change made in my adult lifetime. It was absolutely grim going out to enclosed spaces with so much smoke in the air. Plus it’s a habit that I’ve always hated anyway because my dad was a big smoker and he’d happily puff away at home with me around him. When I grill him about it now he blames a lack of an education on the matter but it seems like a flimsy excuse tbh.

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The smoking ban was a key step in getting rid of pubs. In a genuinely libertarian society se could easily have had pubs that allowed smoking and those that chose not to. Forcing people onto the street to smoke was for anti-social, not health purposes. As for the cost to the NHS, smokers and drinkers EASILY cover that, to such an extent the government hasn't gone the whole hog, if they are genuinely serious about health, and banned these drugs like other drugs. Look at the hypocrisy in the arguments of government and the anti-smoking lobby to see the true intentions.

Meanwhile people are poisoned by the water and food and harmed by their medicines, problems with as much if not more impact than recreational drugs. Happily people can take some steps to avoid the poisons in water and food, but don't forget a large segment of the population were on the verge of supporting mandatory "vaccination" with experimental, ineffective yet potentially very dangerous gene therapy treatment. This would have come from a notion it's even government's place to "ban" smoking - which it isn't. If we put up with such things then we aren't adults we are children.

It was only last year that smoking was (almost) fully banned in parliament, btw. It's still permitted in one of the clubs at Christmas, though I wonder why when it's against the "law"? Nevertheless, this still makes the smoking ban unlawful. When those who impose it don't adhere to it themselves, it's not a law, it's a decree. There are also clubs in London where you may still smoke a cigar (which I thoroughly approve of of course).

In France people are now starting to ignore these unconstitutional bans. Good for them. In time maybe the British will remember themselves too.

Next time the ref tries to book one of our players...

https://www.tiktok.com/@footyfrenzy2...68130984004896

:cool:

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Originally Posted by Letters

Nah.
What was actually better was...you. You were young and healthy (probably) and optimistic (possibly).
Now you're old and ill (probably) and deeply cynical about everything (definitely). So you look back on what you see as happier times and declare everything better. I see this all the time on FB. Old people going on and on about how everything used to be so much better. It wasn't.

It wasn't worse either of course, the truth is some things were better, some were worse.

With regards to football. That generation of players wouldn't cut it in the modern game. They might have been "real men" but they were slow and fat and unfit and wouldn't get near enough to the modern players to hack them down. Some of them would make it of course, they'd be brought up in the modern regime. But a lot would be off down the pub and would never get near the top level. And you are cherry picking the best players from yesteryear, ignoring how many utter cloggers there were.

Overall I think football has got worse but not because of the quality of player. The main issues are the money, the blanket coverage, the disconnect between fans and club - the relationship now being very much business and customer. As HCZ highlights, money has always been a thing but Sky and the expansion of the CL have turned it up to 11.

As for society in general. The 80s were a deeply sexist, racist, homophobic time. It might have been great if you were white, male and straight. Less great for black people or the gays. A lot of that is much better now. Other things have got worse - immigration has enriched us in some ways but the level of it is too high and that causes issues. House prices are inaccessible for most people. The internet has brought a lot of benefits and convenience but obviously there are big issues there with kids having access to stuff they shouldn't and cyber bullying. Ironically the multitude ways we have of instantly connecting with people has made people lonelier.

Overall - some things better, some things worse. Hard to quantify it into a definitive about things being better or worse these days.

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Dud you are so brainwashed. Everything is your fault, or mine in this case, never theirs. Corruption and authoritarianism accelerates to become the norm? Well, observing that fact would be the ultimate act of cynicism, so shut up! Our wonderfully democratic government is about to cancel elections. That just shows you what a tried old git I have become.

As for the players, any players, you think they couldn't have played Pepball? Tip, tap, tip, tap? I bet they'd have loved it. Instead of getting paid £50 to tear up and down the line for 90 minutes, end to end, getting elbowed and kicked the whole time, they could stand around, back to goal, passing backwards. For £100k a week. And maybe they did drink down the pub, but they only had the £50 to spend. Now they can book limos and stuff them with whores and have their rap "music" blaring out the window. It's all so civilised.

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Originally Posted by Mac76

some things are better - the smoking ban feels like one of the least heralded but most important steps forward, not least for the NHS but also (and I speak as an ex-smoker) just improving our social experiences by not treading on a carpet of fag butts, or being suffocated in small venues or ofc passively developing cancer

general air quality is better to thanks to (ahem) 'cleaner' fuel but ofc the elephant in the room is climate change which, as you at least are aware, is now getting the point where it's irreversible and makes me particularly glad I'm not any younger than I am, though even in my late 50s I'm far from convinced I'll miss witnessing some of the really bad effects of it

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Just out of interest, what terrible effects do you think are on the way after you have shuffled off this mortal coil?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Just out of interest, what terrible effects do you think are on the way after you have shuffled off this mortal coil?

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Is that a what happens to the earth after he dies or what happens to him after he dies ?

If the latter, it’s the same that will happen to the rest of us. Nothing

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

I don’t think we should be trying to get their respect and affection, like a low self esteem teenage girl does with her alcoholic piece of shit father. We aren’t going to get it, and it’s of no value anyway.

Getting to the final might add some pathos to the season, but ultimately even if we beat Liverpool in the final it’s nice but it’s ultimately worthless, plus the idea of us being some plucky underdog as we were when we beat them in 1987 nauseates me.


But that’s neither here nor there. I’m quite happy for us to have an antagonistic relationship with the authorities to some extent, they are after all the shit under our shoes.

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It's the whole point of the sport. Winning. Why do we go on about the Invincibles? Because they weren't beaten - nobody won against us. Not one single league club that season could point at us and say they beat us. So we should have gone all guns blazing against Newcastle and overwhelmed them, like we know we could, or else ended up last man down in defeat. And, if victorious, gone on and beat Liverpool and said, this is what you are facing, if you are up for it!

Instead, well, worthless, not worth it, we'll only turn up when we rate it. Well I hope so. I hope we can just turn it on and off like a light switch. But I do know Liverpool will be feeling more comfortable after that 4-0 hiding we got. That's one fine margin in their favour, as we start off on a winding road of fine margins. They already have 6 points and a game in hand, not sure we needed to hand them even more.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Is that a what happens to the earth after he dies or what happens to him after he dies ?

If the latter, it’s the same that will happen to the rest of us. Nothing

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I think a lot of climate activists would probably agree. There's this unshakable faith in the science of profiteering, yeah, earth is doomed, no doubt because. Then there's this absolute certainty that death is the end due to a complete lack of science in that field. I'm wondering what would happen if Bill Gates could somehow monetise the afterlife? Would nihilists rush to the streets selling shares in heaven?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

It's the whole point of the sport. Winning. Why do we go on about the Invincibles? Because they weren't beaten - nobody won against us. Not one single league club that season could point at us and say they beat us. So we should have gone all guns blazing against Newcastle and overwhelmed them, like we know we could, or else ended up last man down in defeat. And, if victorious, gone on and beat Liverpool and said, this is what you are facing, if you are up for it!

Instead, well, worthless, not worth it, we'll only turn up when we rate it. Well I hope so. I hope we can just turn it on and off like a light switch. But I do know Liverpool will be feeling more comfortable after that 4-0 hiding we got. That's one fine margin in their favour, as we start off on a winding road of fine margins. They already have 6 points and a game in hand, not sure we needed to hand them even more.

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In the invincibles season we lost home and away in the semi final of the league cup to Middlesborough. Who remembers that? No one (probably not even that many Boro fans)

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

In the invincibles season we lost home and away in the semi final of the league cup to Middlesborough. Who remembers that? No one (probably not even that many Boro fans)

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:lol: You can prove anything with facts :sulk:

At least in those days we’d play the second string no matter what. Wenger wouldn’t even entertain the idea of using the better players until we became a less competitive team after 2006.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I think a lot of climate activists would probably agree. There's this unshakable faith in the science of profiteering, yeah, earth is doomed, no doubt because. Then there's this absolute certainty that death is the end due to a complete lack of science in that field. I'm wondering what would happen if Bill Gates could somehow monetise the afterlife? Would nihilists rush to the streets selling shares in heaven?

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There’s nothing scientific about the afterlife, it’s wishful thinking that somehow we carry on after our bodies have atrophied

The irony to me is I see almost nothing desirable about it…everlasting life. It sounds fucking awful in fact


And to add to that, a lot of the problems we have in the world today come about because people seem to be under the impression that this existence is just a banal waiting area prior to entering celestial paradise. That and they also believe in the hot country, not enough that you should suffer and die once…you’ve got an eternity of torment to look forward to for thought crime or believing in the wrong deity.


And no before anyone starts no I don’t think we’d be living in peace and harmony without belief in sky beings. We always manage to find some way to be controlling and atavistic.

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

At least in those days we’d play the second string no matter what. Wenger wouldn’t even entertain the idea of using the better players until we became a less competitive team after 2006.

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In fairness, This time around there wasn’t much of an option to play the second string in the first leg….and in the second leg it was kind of a free hit

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

In the invincibles season we lost home and away in the semi final of the league cup to Middlesborough. Who remembers that? No one (probably not even that many Boro fans)

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I do. Pissed me right off. Which is why I specifically said "league".

Used to piss me off mightily when the reserves lost, because our reserves were better than most teams back in the day.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

There’s nothing scientific about the afterlife

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Of course there isn't :lol:
By definition it's not in this life - it's not something which can be measured or studied.
That doesn't inform whether it exists or it doesn't, it's just not a topic science has anything to say about.

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Originally Posted by Letters

Of course there isn't :lol:
By definition it's not in this life - it's not something which can be measured or studied.
That doesn't inform whether it exists or it doesn't, it's just not a topic science has anything to say about.

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Mind you, neither does the Bible until we get to the New Testament

Then it just plagiarises and adapts the idea of heaven and hell from Zoroastrianism

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

There’s nothing scientific about the afterlife, it’s wishful thinking that somehow we carry on after our bodies have atrophied

The irony to me is I see almost nothing desirable about it…everlasting life. It sounds fucking awful in fact


And to add to that, a lot of the problems we have in the world today come about because people seem to be under the impression that this existence is just a banal waiting area prior to entering celestial paradise. That and they also believe in the hot country, not enough that you should suffer and die once…you’ve got an eternity of torment to look forward to for thought crime or believing in the wrong deity.


And no before anyone starts no I don’t think we’d be living in peace and harmony without belief in sky beings. We always manage to find some way to be controlling and atavistic.

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You are blaming religion for people living banal lives just waiting to die? Nah mate, that's government and taxation that does that. Born, taxed, die - then taxed. Religion says, fuck them, you're better off dead, just try to live a good life while you are here and there's a reward. It's a comfort blanket.

Of course religion is just as man made as climate religion. Both acts of faith disconnected from science.

Death though - nobody knows anything about that, beyond the physical. You can take the attitude that therefore there is nothing to know but that's a conclusion without methodology or investigation, hardly science then. Sometimes it's better to study life. Where does that initial spark come from that populates your physical being for the time you are alive, or do you claim something can come from nothing and then return to nothing? That's anti-scientific. Our greatest thinkers have therefore populate our universe with inverse equivalents to every physical manifestation of energy discovered so far. Modern physics can't exist without this counterbalance.

Smart thinking would have to conclude, at this time, we don't know anything about death and are forced to speculate. A lack of thinking would conclude there is nothing following death.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Mind you, neither does the Bible until we get to the New Testament

Then it just plagiarises and adapts the idea of heaven and hell from Zoroastrianism

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Which in turn plagiarised it from elsewhere. The same or similar legends endure through almost every recorded civilisation through every age. Casting great suspicion on the "settled" science of anthropology and the rather cocksure field of history.

It's almost as if one mind seeded these cultural beliefs into the minds of all men.

Not to say anyone can put a finger on it and claim, there's your proof! But to refuse to think about it and call it conclusive?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

You are blaming religion for people living banal lives just waiting to die? Nah mate, that's government and taxation that does that. Born, taxed, die - then taxed. Religion says, fuck them, you're better off dead, just try to live a good life while you are here and there's a reward. It's a comfort blanket.

Of course religion is just as man made as climate religion. Both acts of faith disconnected from science.

Death though - nobody knows anything about that, beyond the physical. You can take the attitude that therefore there is nothing to know but that's a conclusion without methodology or investigation, hardly science then. Sometimes it's better to study life. Where does that initial spark come from that populates your physical being for the time you are alive, or do you claim something can come from nothing and then return to nothing? That's anti-scientific. Our greatest thinkers have therefore populate our universe with inverse equivalents to every physical manifestation of energy discovered so far. Modern physics can't exist without this counterbalance.

Smart thinking would have to conclude, at this time, we don't know anything about death and are forced to speculate. A lack of thinking would conclude there is nothing following death.

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There are a great many things we do not know. There are a great many things to be curious about. The Afterlife is simply not one of those things. Simply because even if God existed and wasn’t just a composite character of Man’s warped imagination and desire for a permanent Daddy figure…there would be no reason to conclude from that anything happens to us after we die.
And where does it end, do the livestock go to a great field in the sky, do the single celled organisms go to an afterlife?.
When something gives off every impression of being something simply that we want to be true, it’s especially important to treat it as untrue until we gain any evidence to the contrary.
You’re right about one thing though, religion like government like capital like tax like every other conceptual thing is a human invention….

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Which in turn plagiarised it from elsewhere. The same or similar legends endure through almost every recorded civilisation through every age. Casting great suspicion on the "settled" science of anthropology and the rather cocksure field of history.

It's almost as if one mind seeded these cultural beliefs into the minds of all men.

Not to say anyone can put a finger on it and claim, there's your proof! But to refuse to think about it and call it conclusive?

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Science is often wrong and subject to change, it’s a process of gaining evidence using the parameters available to us and opposed to revelation which considers itself good for all time.


I’ve answered your question already, there is no evidence of an Afterlife and every evidence that conceptually it conveniently fits into the human fear of death as well as the need to control others (it’s quite a good way to get people to do what you want, if you threaten them with an eternity of suffering for not doing so)

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

I’ve answered your question already, there is no evidence of an Afterlife

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And no evidence against it.
As I said, this is not in the scope of science. How can it be?
When I said that before you just changed the subject.

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Originally Posted by Letters

And no evidence against it.
As I said, this is not in the scope of science. How can it be?
When I said that before you just changed the subject.

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You accept I hope that at least with the idea of God it’s a possible (albeit unlikely) answer as to how we got here

With the afterlife the only possible reason for believing it to be true, is wanting it to be true.

I didn’t dodge that point, it didn’t seem to necessitate an answer. A lot of things are unfalsifiable. I dont know that Optimus Prime isn’t real, I’ve evidence of him being a fictional creation but that doesn’t prove beyond doubt that he doesn’t exist on the far away planet of Cybertron and it’s just coincidental that someone on this planet came up with the idea for children’s entertainment.

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

You accept I hope that at least with the idea of God it’s a possible (albeit unlikely) answer as to how we got here

With the afterlife the only possible reason for believing it to be true, is wanting it to be true.

I didn’t dodge that point, it didn’t seem to necessitate an answer. A lot of things are unfalsifiable. I dont know that Optimus Prime isn’t real, I’ve evidence of him being a fictional creation but that doesn’t prove beyond doubt that he doesn’t exist on the far away planet of Cybertron and it’s just coincidental that someone on this planet came up with the idea for children’s entertainment.

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I find the whole subject of an afterlife quite interesting. Maybe nothing to do with God, it may just be a natrual metamorphises :shrug:

But.....is anyone going to mention the horror show from St James's Park last night?

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

I didn’t dodge that point, it didn’t seem to necessitate an answer.

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I just don't know why you said there's "nothing scientific" about it as if it was some kind of gotcha.
It isn't.

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Originally Posted by Chippy

I find the whole subject of an afterlife quite interesting. Maybe nothing to do with God, it may just be a natrual metamorphises :shrug:

But.....is anyone going to mention the horror show from St James's Park last night?

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So I’d ask the same question, is there any reason for you to believe in this metamorphosis beyond thinking it would be nice to have a life beyond this one?

Have there been any breadcrumb trails. Does it give an alternative explanation why you keep hearing Aunty Maggie’s voice after she’s dead for twenty years….and not that you’re just having auditory hallucinations

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Originally Posted by Letters

I just don't know why you said there's "nothing scientific" about it as if it was some kind of gotcha.
It isn't.

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The point is even though belief in God is unscientific, the concept of a God follows on from the scientific question “How did we get here”

Afterlife? It follows on from allaying fear and wanting other people to do what you want

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Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

You accept I hope that at least with the idea of God it’s a possible (albeit unlikely) answer as to how we got here

With the afterlife the only possible reason for believing it to be true, is wanting it to be true.

I didn’t dodge that point, it didn’t seem to necessitate an answer. A lot of things are unfalsifiable. I dont know that Optimus Prime isn’t real, I’ve evidence of him being a fictional creation but that doesn’t prove beyond doubt that he doesn’t exist on the far away planet of Cybertron and it’s just coincidental that someone on this planet came up with the idea for children’s entertainment.

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You allow at least the possibility we got here thanks to God? But discount entirely the possibility God might take charge again when our physical bodies expire? Leaving aside religion, in terms of logic how can you allow both positions at the same time?

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Originally Posted by Chippy

I find the whole subject of an afterlife quite interesting. Maybe nothing to do with God, it may just be a natrual metamorphises :shrug:

But.....is anyone going to mention the horror show from St James's Park last night?

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Fuck - LOL, I thought we were on the Currents thread.

So then... where does our season go after it has died? Like it did last night?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

You allow at least the possibility we got here thanks to God? But discount entirely the possibility God might take charge again when our physical bodies expire? Leaving aside religion, in terms of logic how can you allow both positions at the same time?

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Because it’s ultimately solipsistic to believe that this God cares about us, and ultimately the desire to reward or punish is a very human appetite. And why should creating the universe also give someone the power to create life after death.

Actually if we want to be scientific, we do carry on after death….our atomic structure breaks down and we become something else. Bit like how the remains of prehistoric creatures become fossil fuel after centuries of tectonic pressure

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

So then... where does our season go after it has died? Like it did last night?

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Dubai apparently. After that, we'll see.
I haven't given up yet. I don't think the players have either. But having another look at the league table - Liverpool have won 3 more games than us having played 1 game less. It's not looking promising.

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Originally Posted by Letters

Dubai apparently. After that, we'll see.
I haven't given up yet. I don't think the players have either. But having another look at the league table - Liverpool have won 3 more games than us having played 1 game less. It's not looking promising.

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Not pleased at the result or the likely outcome for the season. But don't condone sending the players to hell for it.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Not pleased at the result or the likely outcome for the season. But don't condone sending the players to hell for it.

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Pre-pandemic I used to get fairly regular work trips there.
Hated it the first time I went but grew to quite like it. It's not a real place of course and I definitely wouldn't live there.
For a short trip...it's alright.

The gypos are suing us for voting against their fake sponsors. I think they are suing everyone else too, but so far nothing through my letterbox.

Aren't they allowed to put their own cash in directly if they want to? Why do they have to wear disguises and pretend to be sponsors?