Gazidis is a waste of fucking space.

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Originally Posted by Fist of Lehmann

from the SwissRamble
...Arsenal splashed out £53 million on new players. Of course, they still ended up with net sales proceeds of £18 million, as players leaving brought in £71 million. If decent offers had come in for the likes of Nicklas Bendtner, Manuel Almunia, Sébastien Squillaci and Denilson, this sum may well have been even higher.




Substantiation?




So Wenger has too much power, not enough pressure, the board allow him autonomy in football matters...but they decide to buy some random players while his back is turned?

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After the Man Utd debacle, Gazidis must have had a word with him and told him the score. He had to concede because he could see for himself that the team were in no fit state to play. I don’t think they did it behind his back, but I don’t think after the result he went running to the board room and banged on Gazidis’ door demanding we sign these players.

It doesn’t matter that we made a profit as usual because that has always been the case even when we were at Highbury. That rep of earning money for the club is a rep that Wenger has proudly built and boasted about over the years.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

After the Man Utd debacle, Gazidis must have had a word with him and told him the score. He had to concede because he could see for himself that the team were in no fit state to play. I don’t think they did it behind his back, but I don’t think after the result he went running to the board room and banged on Gazidis’ door demanding we sign these players.
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How do you know what happend after the manc game it seems your letting personal bias getting in thr way of your judgement. It was common sense to anyone after the Manc game we needed to spend. These were obvioulsy panic buys not 1st choice buys which the board and Ivan are happy with as they keep saying.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

After the Man Utd debacle, Gazidis must have had a word with him and told him the score. He had to concede because he could see for himself that the team were in no fit state to play. I don’t think they did it behind his back, but I don’t think after the result he went running to the board room and banged on Gazidis’ door demanding we sign these players..

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Oh ok. Sure, you're welcome to speculate as much as you like. Wenger did say that he could have written a book about about this summer. I suspect the the truth here is likely to be stranger and more convoluted than your fiction, or mine.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

It doesn’t matter that we made a profit as usual because that has always been the case even when we were at Highbury. That rep of earning money for the club is a rep that Wenger has proudly built and boasted about over the years.

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Not the point I was making. You said that the board are still getting the blame despite the fact we spent money. Yet overall, we made money.

Besides, even if that were not the case, it wouldn't be conclusive in apportioning blame either way.

Just read through that Swiss Ramble and I don't see how you guys can read that and ignore certain key points.

For starters, we made a profit, but Gazidis has said we purposely held some money back for January transfers and next summer. If Wenger comes out and hints that he won't be forced to spend when that time comes, whose at fault for that? This has been Wenger's way from the beginning and I would love to see a comparison or a detailed report on how we operated when Wenger first arrived and we were still at Highbury. This sort of detailed analysis has only started since we've moved to the Emirates. As the article points out though, it's very rare for a football club to make a profit. But anyway.... come January, if we look slow to do business again, we'll be back here again talking about the Board being reluctant release funds even though Wenger has always operated on a shoestring budget.

Last season, Wenger said failing to qualify for the Champions League is no disaster. Gazidis comes out and says the same thing even though we'd lose money, yet I'm still hearing that the Board are trying to fatten their pockets before jumping ship. If that were the case, shouldn't they be putting serious pressure on Wenger to qualify and actually win the thing? Wouldn't that make financial sense instead of allowing us to drop out of the top four which actually harms our stance when renegotiating our sponsorship deals?

The article pinpoints our commercial revenue deals as a reason why we're lagging behind the competition. Man U's income trumps ours and even Spurs have a better shirt sponsorship deal than us. The idiots on the Board that signed those early bad deals get the blame for that but we needed money for the stadium....fair enough. How are we going to cope....the cynics will say we're now a selling club and that's part of the strategy. Maybe. But we could have held out for more money when Barca came in for Cesc and Wenger in the end told the Board to sell him on the cheap. Now, if these guys were that greedy and cut throat, they'd have told Wenger to stay out of it and that we need to raise more money to fatten the pockets. They didn't happen and they allowed Cesc to go on the cheap. Thay conceded on that issue. We had a similar situation with Henry when we could have sold him for more but gave him a bumper pay rise only to sell him on the cheap a year later. The image doesn't add up.

As for the ticket price hike... check what the article says on Wenger's stance on that issue.

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Arsène Wenger made the reasonable point that the 6.5% price rise was necessary in order “to increase our income to fight with the other clubs”, but there would have been other ways of making a similar sum.

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Why is he trying to dangle a carrot in front of our faces with that one? It was the same with his argument about moving to a new stadium, he toyed with the idea of us being able to compete with Madrid and Man U, but now the tunes sounding different and he's trying a new dance. You look back on the things Wenger sayx and he's right in there when it comes to misleading the fans. If the Board are taking the piss, this guy is right there in on the joke.

The article rightly goes on to say that we didn't have to raise ticket prices and success on the pitch would actually generate more income, but we'll leave that alone for the minute. Now look at our wage bill.

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Given the magnitude of Arsenal’s wage bill, it seems strange that they do not pay top dollar to their star players, but this is due to a couple of factors. First of all, Arsenal have a very large squad with a vast number of “young professionals”, but more importantly they operate an equitable wage structure, which means that the best players are not particularly well remunerated (by modern standards), while fringe players like Abou Diaby, Thomas Rosicky and Marouane Chamakh are handsomely rewarded for their efforts. Not only does this reduce the money available to attract world class players, but it also makes it difficult to move on under-performers, hence loans for Bendtner and Denilson.

This approach needs a root and branch review, as it cannot be adjusted for an individual player or others will soon demand equivalent pay rises. This is a concern with some key players entering the final year of their contracts like Robin Van Persie, Thomas Vermaelen and Theo Walcott. Van Persie has already complained that Arsenal will not pay “enormous amounts of money”, hinting that this encourages a player’s decision to “go elsewhere.” This issue was tacitly confirmed by Wenger, “I cannot today say that if we go to the maximum we are sure to sign a player.”

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Why do we have such a huge squad that pays so much to young players and fringe players? We just signed Ryo, Campbell, Jenkinson and Oxo and we keep acquiring youth players even though they may end up like Denilson, JET, Vela, etc. Surely this has to be addressed and it's something Wenger can easily sort out. This youth project is his baby and he loves developing young players but he won't put his obsession in check and it's hurting us. Every year we signed young players and end up moving them on (or loaning them out) because they're not good enough.

Also, check Wenger's strategic RVP comments? Why do it and why is he prepared to part ways with players like that yet unwilling to curb this bloody youth project? Given the amount we're spending, shouldn't this way be cheaper? But it's turning out to be damn expensive and I'll blame the Board for not cuffing Wenger round the head and telling him to cut out this nonsense. Someone should be looking at those numbers, then the quality on the pitch and scratching their head. You can't justify those numbers and whoever is signing those checks must be getting the seal of approval from someone in the coaching staff. An accountant shouldn't be able to put a value on a football player, that's down to Wenger and his coaching team. He saying certain players are good enough and worthy of new contracts, that's his call.

Anyway, I've gone on long enough. This doesn't add up. If we're a club looking to fatten the pockets, then none of this makes sense. If you still hold that view, then you can't ignore the fact that Wenger is in on it. He happily shifts the attention away from us and on to other clubs like City and Chelsea and at the same time promotes what the club is doing and talks about the unfairness of financial doping.

I don't think the Board is out to pull a fast one. They're too dumb for that. But there is a lack of direction and I hope new faces like Gazidis and Stan start to see the light. This idea of Wenger being the Warren Buffett of football management is disturbing. That sort of accolade just shows how much influence Wenger has on this club. It's not 100% his fault, but they've given him too much power and trying to wrestle that back is a tall order.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Just read through that Swiss Ramble and I don't see how you guys can read that and ignore certain key points.

For starters, we made a profit, but Gazidis has said we purposely held some money back for January transfers and next summer.

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Okay. Why do that?

Why defer money to future transfer windows when it was apparent we needed strengthening this June?
Why split the expenditure into many lower value purchases rather than fewer high value ones?

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Last season, Wenger said failing to qualify for the Champions League is no disaster. Gazidis comes out and says the same thing even though we'd lose money, yet I'm still hearing that the Board are trying to fatten their pockets before jumping ship. If that were the case, shouldn't they be putting serious pressure on Wenger to qualify and actually win the thing? Wouldn't that make financial sense instead of allowing us to drop out of the top four which actually harms our stance when renegotiating our sponsorship deals?

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But then again:

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

The Board need to pressure Wenger, but I don't think they'll do it in public and they shouldn't either. That's one of the dumbest things they could ever do.

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So if I understand this correctly, if the Board were trying to fatten their own pockets that would lead them to do 'one of the dumbest things they could ever do' - publically apply pressure instead of alleviating it by playing down the importance of the CL.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

The article pinpoints...

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Oh FFS PnG I haven't got all night.

Let's just assume I answered all of the rest of your post and made many excellent points.

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Originally Posted by Fist of Lehmann

Okay. Why do that?

Why defer money to future transfer windows when it was apparent we needed strengthening this June?
Why split the expenditure into many lower value purchases rather than fewer high value ones?




But then again:


So if I understand this correctly, if the Board were trying to fatten their own pockets that would lead them to do 'one of the dumbest things they could ever do' - publically apply pressure instead of alleviating it by playing down the importance of the CL.



Oh FFS PnG I haven't got all night.

Let's just assume I answered all of the rest of your post and made many excellent points.

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when will you get with the programme ffs?

wenger holds all the cards and the bar to which the board have to jump over, except when they decide that they are the ones in control of everything and effectively ruining the club.

jeeeesus, you ask too many questions

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Originally Posted by Fist of Lehmann

Okay. Why do that?

Why defer money to future transfer windows when it was apparent we needed strengthening this June?
Why split the expenditure into many lower value purchases rather than fewer high value ones?




But then again:


So if I understand this correctly, if the Board were trying to fatten their own pockets that would lead them to do 'one of the dumbest things they could ever do' - publically apply pressure instead of alleviating it by playing down the importance of the CL.



Oh FFS PnG I haven't got all night.

Let's just assume I answered all of the rest of your post and made many excellent points.

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Nah, let's a assume your a lazy git. :lol:

Telling the world that we need to qualify for the Champions League in order to stay afloat is dumb. It weakens our position as a club and if true, it's a fact that Wenger already knows, so making that news public won't make a blind bit of difference to his performance as a manager.

As for holding back funds...I don't know. Maybe because we did our business late and couldn't identify our targets quick enough.

@Terry

Not saying Wenger holds all the cards. Just saying you have to look at Wenger's role in this if you're saying the Board are fleecing the fans. He has the power to influence the wage bill with the type of players he signs, but he chooses not to. Our squad doesn't have to be that big and we don't have to have so many young players in the team. That is something he can manage and control. That's his area.

Second, he doesn't have to dangle the carrott with talk of the ticket price increase enabling us to compete with clubs like Chelsea and City. That's a lie. Better sponsorship deals would do that, but he has no problem directing the attention away from his and the Boards incompetence and placing the blame on big spending clubs like City and Chelsea. The financial dopers.

If we're going to look into this stuff, be fair and look at Wenger's role in all this. Don't paint this picture of a guy sitting back while greedy money men take us over. He's right in there playing his part and helping to mislead fans. He doesn't have to do that.

Also, Terry....why do you think this Billy guy compares Wenger to Warren Buffett?

I have to say with his poor understanding of what is neccessary to succeed at a club of our stature, he simply has to be replaced.

This attitude at the club will see us struggle in the coming seasons.

If they simply make excuses about the lack of a winning mentality then I personally have to think whether I can invest my time and effort.

Players like Van Persie will not stay at a club that is not in the Champions League. Its that simple.

We will not be able to attract the players that will be able to compete to enable us to get there.

A business model that ensures we will be in a financial good place if we do not qualify for the Champions League is missing the point massively. Bullshit is rife right now from the top to the bottom. We have players that constantly spout bullshit about being stronger every game and that mistakes will be rectified. The manager is constantly telling the media that as a club we cannot compete financially. Gazidis has not got a clue in my opinion. He has in no way helped the club with any decisions other than to ensure we become mediocre.

As a club we are slipping down the league and this will continue without doubt.

All I hear is lie after lie after lie from these idiots in charge of the club.

I have little faith left anymore. If I could turn my back on the club because of how it treats its fans(which is disgraceful by the way)I would.

I now begrudge buying shirts for my sons, and my missus had to convince me to buy a new kit for the 6 year old, I really didnt want to.

Sick to the pit of my stomach with the fools that run the club. We have become also rans that can no longer compete.

I do not profess to knowing the ins and outs of the current political/financial intrigues of the club I support but I do find some of the comments made by Gazidis to by irking to say the least.
He says the a failure to qualify foe the CL is not the end of the world and that we will still be able to compete!

Well he is right on one point, yes the earth will still spin in such an event but the other point is interesting, well at least the use of the word 'STILL' is, he means that he believes that we are competing atm, I do not call what I see our team plsying 'competing'. . . .

I will give him the benefit of the doubt, maybe he meant in the transfer market as I seem to recall him saying at the beginning of the summer that areas had been identidied and strengthened accordingly. . . .but now we hear that money has been kept back for January or next year! . . . .why?

So that we can buy the same players we were after before for 50p lesss. . , FFS. . .the season does not start in January for most it is actually over by then! which we are in danger of finding out soon enough!
keepibg the money back, only makes sense if we are thinkibg of givibg a starting kit to a new manager. . .but that doesnt look to be the case
Was the business we ended up doing in the last few days of the transfer window a reflection of our ambition , if so, he sums up the meaning behind Gazidis statements that we should not pretend to be anything more than a 'bit part' running by a group that puts football second.

Everytime I write something negative I pray that I am proved wrong. . .but changes are the only way I can see working both on and off the pitch

Everytime I write something negative I pray that I am proved wrong. . .but changes are the only way I can see working both on and off the pitch[/QUOTE]

Everyone feels the same