Arsenal vs Man city Sunday 8th April 16:00

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Originally Posted by fakeyank

How do you know he does not want the best for any club? He left Chelsea coz the owner didnt like him, he left Inter after making them European champions and he made Porto CL winners as well. Your statement does not make any sense.

As for his past success bearing no relevance to how you look at him... well, if you are just judging by where Real are this season so far, he is still miles ahead of all managers out there.

And finally, I dont need to bring Mourinho anywhere to make AW look small. AW's achievements and team selection/tactics over the last 6-7 seasons are good enough to make him look super small.

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The problem with Mourinho is that he is too abrasive a character to ever make what he wants (build a dynasty) a reality. Also, the other problem is after he leaves - he's such a cult of personality which is great for when he is at a club but afterwards...players pine to work with him again. Look at Ibrahimovic's quote about Mourinho, saying he brightens a room, whereas Guardiola pulls down the curtains.

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Fair play and you have a point. But should real not have sown up the league by now like City should off.

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No cos its not that simple

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Originally Posted by Syn

I think the Man Utd - Bilbao games were supposed to shed light on the myth that only Barca and Real Madrid are good teams considering Barca/Madrid have to face at least one better team than Man Utd. Personally, I still think it's a lot easier to score more goals in La Liga but it's probably tougher to win games against your average team too.

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Lets be real though the Mancs should have beatern bilbao and had they had a better team like they should have they would have.

Not saying all teams in la liga are bad, but if bilbao were in our league where would they finish?

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Originally Posted by fakeyank

How do you know he does not want the best for any club? He left Chelsea coz the owner didnt like him, he left Inter after making them European champions and he made Porto CL winners as well. Your statement does not make any sense.

As for his past success bearing no relevance to how you look at him... well, if you are just judging by where Real are this season so far, he is still miles ahead of all managers out there.

And finally, I dont need to bring Mourinho anywhere to make AW look small. AW's achievements and team selection/tactics over the last 6-7 seasons are good enough to make him look super small.

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Ok so maybe saying he does not want the best for clubs is wrong, but i don't think he cares for clubs more them himself.
Because everything is about him not the club thats why, all the club he has been at the circus has been about him. he don't give a shit about the future of the teams he left.

As for you using him to belittle AW you, do we know he is a better manager then AW and it would take a brave man(poster) to say otherwise, i don't see why you need to compare them, its like comapring barcelona with Villa.

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Originally Posted by Ach

This

Arteta went against what Wenger commands and took his own decision and shot from outside the area. We won despite of Wenger, not cos of him. I know some think hes the best in the world cos we won 7 in a row in a horrific season up to that point but all thats done is get us back to just about an acceptable level. We can and should do better than acceptable

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This would make sense if Wenger 'commanded' RVP to hit the post, Vermaelen to clear one inexplicably, Benayoun and Vermaelen to collapse in the six yard box and Ramsey to be a palooka. You could easily say we won 'because' of Wenger as he is the one that bought Arteta, someone that does 'take his own decision'.

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Originally Posted by Ach

No cos its not that simple

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Well it is suppose had it been barca who were 10 points clear and Real pulled it back you be branded them bottlers by now. Non?

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Originally Posted by Ach

This

Arteta went against what Wenger commands and took his own decision and shot from outside the area. We won despite of Wenger, not cos of him. I know some think hes the best in the world cos we won 7 in a row in a horrific season up to that point but all thats done is get us back to just about an acceptable level. We can and should do better than acceptable

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Even if W did tell any of his players not to shoot, They should use their brains when they have a chance to shoot and shoot.
But respect to Wenger for buying a player with balls even if it was a panic buy.

Just because he says pass pass does nto mean these lot can't uses their brains.

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Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Lets be real though the Mancs should have beatern bilbao and had they had a better team like they should have they would have.

Not saying all teams in la liga are bad, but if bilbao were in our league where would they finish?

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Tbh I genuinely think - on the basis of those two games, mind - that Bilbao are on the same sort of level as Man Utd. Certainly technically, Bilbao are on another level. Maybe Man Utd's grit and Englishness could get them a few more points over the course of the season.

On the basis of those 2 games (...and I don't think Man Utd gave up at any point - they were just completely outplayed), Bilbao would be right up there on our league. But obviously it's not fair to judge them on those two games only - maybe they did put extra efforts into that. Hard to tell. The point was though that there do seem to be some very good teams in Spain. The fact that Barca and Real Madrid are so clear is probably more a reflection of their quality rather than the chasing pack.

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Originally Posted by fakeyank

Oh not denying we werent better. We shouldve won that game 4-0 or 5-0 but when you are in need to score a goal, you dont put a player in a position he does not play in and expect to change proceedings. To be mentioned, this is the same player who was played in that position the previous game and sucked goat balls. Not only was he bad out of position, he has been terrible in his own position, CM!

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To be fair I don't think Wenger is a great tactician or a great motivator. To win trophies he's always needed a strong captain to provide the latter. I think we may have that now (if he stays) and as for great players...well, maybe not like at our best under Wenger but we do look to have the makings of a pretty decent side now. Need a few reinforcements but I don't think we're that far away.
Wenger has failed in some ways in the last 6 years but in other ways he's done well given the amount spent. You really shouldn't underestimate how hard it is to keep a side in the top 4 every single season. No-one bar Fergie has done it, it really isn't that easy. Given that he's done that we should have won some trophies along the way, that is where he has failed. The question for me is whether we're going in the right direction and I'm more hopeful for next season. Right now I am and IMO changing manager would be a far bigger disruption than it's worth, other clubs at our level have changed manager after a few trophyless seasons and it rarely improves things - sometimes temporarily in the honeymoon period but longer term it doesn't tend to.

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Originally Posted by Syn

Tbh I genuinely think - on the basis of those two games, mind - that Bilbao are on the same sort of level as Man Utd. Certainly technically, Bilbao are on another level. Maybe Man Utd's grit and Englishness could get them a few more points over the course of the season.

On the basis of those 2 games (...and I don't think Man Utd gave up at any point - they were just completely outplayed), Bilbao would be right up there on our league. But obviously it's not fair to judge them on those two games only - maybe they did put extra efforts into that. Hard to tell. The point was though that there do seem to be some very good teams in Spain. The fact that Barca and Real Madrid are so clear is probably more a reflection of their quality rather than the chasing pack.

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Your not wrong Bilbao were much better and the Mancs were bad. (this is the team that will win our league). Says how bad our league really is tbh when a UTD will win the league because no one has really challenged them and city bottled it.

But i suppose your right there are a few better teams in spain.

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Originally Posted by Syn

Tbh I genuinely think - on the basis of those two games, mind - that Bilbao are on the same sort of level as Man Utd. Certainly technically, Bilbao are on another level. Maybe Man Utd's grit and Englishness could get them a few more points over the course of the season.

On the basis of those 2 games (...and I don't think Man Utd gave up at any point - they were just completely outplayed), Bilbao would be right up there on our league. But obviously it's not fair to judge them on those two games only - maybe they did put extra efforts into that. Hard to tell. The point was though that there do seem to be some very good teams in Spain. The fact that Barca and Real Madrid are so clear is probably more a reflection of their quality rather than the chasing pack.

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The funny thing about Bilbao is, prior to Bielsa going there, they were far more Premier League-esque in style. Just goes to show what can be done with players willing to play in a different way. And I concur, think they'd be top half certainly, most teams would struggle against their work on the ball - I mean we've got top four in the past by playing football you wouldn't associate with the best way of playing in England. Bilbao are low down in La Liga comparitively but they're competing against teams that are encouraged to keep the ball too and some much better at it, plus they aren't used to coping with two extra competitions (they're in the Copa Del Rey final).