Clear the air talks reaction (Burnley, home)

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Can we start talking about Wenger now? And the permanent damage he did? That was warned about - long in advance?

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Its kind of funny......I remember ages ago, during the last years of AW, when we were wining nothing but he was still quite popular with the Wengerites, having an argument on here with a particular "fan" ( not Letters surprisingly), where I stated clearly that chasing the imaginary top 4 trophy and keeping on with our one man crusade of sustainability and how "football should be " would lead to us crashing out of the top 4 and even falling out of the top 6. I also added that the Spuds (who have always aimlessly aimed for the skies) would one day surpass us if we continued with our madness of re-defining the term "success", not punishing mediocrity and always trying to be the "example". The guy practically spat at me and said these things would never ever happen... especially the Spud part (when was the last St Totteringham day btw )

Eventually Leicester wins the league, AW is gone, I think that poster is gone and yeah I'm kind of out the door too....but that stinking mentality and culture of entitlement remains like a bad stench with this club.

But even then, in my wildest dreams (or should I say scariest nightmares) I could never imagine us, the Arsenal, being in a real relegation fight....Wow.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

While most of the fans were 100% committed to Wenger staying on and doing more and more catastrophic damage every year

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No, they weren't.
Over time more and more fans saw that we needed to move on from Wenger. I admittedly was late to that party but in Wenger's last season very few people wanted him to stay on longer.
You were the one saying he was so bad that anyone would do better and you said that the new manager should be sacked if they didn't get us a serious title challenge within 2 years. Now you're saying that wasn't even possible because of the damage Wenger did. Honestly, the mental backflips you have to do to keep pretending you were right about everything...

In Emery's first season we did marginally better than Wenger's last. We got to the Europa League final and got 70 points - should have been more really.
The squad Wenger left us with did fine. It wasn't spectacular but it was a reasonable base to build on. It's been a complete shit show since then.

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Originally Posted by Letters

Sure.
We can talk about how you said that he was so inept that anyone would come in and do better, if you like.
And now we're in the 3rd season since he left and you're still trying to reframe that as
"well of course no-one could do better because of the damage he did, this is all Wenger's fault".
Probably best to ignore the season after Wenger left when we actually improved marginally.

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Oh and these kind of silly arguments still occur :lol:

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Originally Posted by Letters

No, they weren't.
Over time more and more fans saw that we needed to move on from Wenger. I admittedly was late to that party but in Wenger's last season very few people wanted him to stay on longer.
You were the one saying he was so bad that anyone would do better and you said that the new manager should be sacked if they didn't get us a serious title challenge within 2 years. Now you're saying that wasn't even possible because of the damage Wenger did. Honestly, the mental backflips you have to do to keep pretending you were right about everything...

In Emery's first season we did marginally better than Wenger's last. We got to the Europa League final and got 70 points - should have been more really.
The squad Wenger left us with did fine. It wasn't spectacular but it was a reasonable base to build on. It's been a complete shit show since then.

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Its been a shitshow since we lost that CL final...when will you get this Letters!!!

Rome wasn't built in a day and it's decline definitely didn't occurr in one season...at least thats a well studied historical FACT.

What doesn’t get spoken about enough is also how much of a shit show the club has been behind the scenes. Multiple changes at executive level, in recruitment, contracts etc. None of it is conducive of a club with a strong vision or strategy. Is it really any wonder how we’ve been left with such a dire team.

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Originally Posted by 21_GOONER_SALUTE

Its been a shitshow since we lost that CL final...

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I think that's somewhat over-stating things.
But has it ever been this bad? Not since 2006. Probably not since the mid 80s at least. This is the worst I can remember things.
I'm just highlighting the fact that people who said that anyone would do better than Wenger are now, when that had been shown to be wrong, now saying "well, of course we're worse now, because of all the damage Wenger did". When Wenger left NQ said he'd be expecting a new manager come in and challenge for the title in 2 years. Now he's saying that was never possible? :shrug:

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

What doesn’t get spoken about enough is also how much of a shit show the club has been behind the scenes. Multiple changes at executive level, in recruitment, contracts etc. None of it is conducive of a club with a strong vision or strategy. Is it really any wonder how we’ve been left with such a dire team.

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Totally agree with this and your other post, it really is scary when you think that's there's no-one there whos is wise or experienced enough to sort this out, the club's been hollowed out, everyone has left the hard work to someone else and now there's no-one

Only a big experienced manager can do it

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Originally Posted by Marc Overmars

What doesn’t get spoken about enough is also how much of a shit show the club has been behind the scenes. Multiple changes at executive level, in recruitment, contracts etc. None of it is conducive of a club with a strong vision or strategy. Is it really any wonder how we’ve been left with such a dire team.

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This is the point, the whole club is rotten...and it all started when one man started believing his hype and everyone felt he had the formulae to turn shit into gold at the snap of his fingers.

After his initial success, AW lowered the competitive mentality of this club with bullshit preaching and sour grape ethics once he couldn't compete; unfortunately for us, his model also suited greedy businessmen who don't give a shit about football and just want a safe investement where they spend little but reap a lot , thanks to a large loyal fan base that actually love the club.

We need a fan to buy this club back or we will never get back to what we use to be when we had people with dreams running this club.

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Originally Posted by Letters

I think that's somewhat over-stating things.
But has it ever been this bad? Not since 2006. Probably not since the mid 80s at least. This is the worst I can remember things.
I'm just highlighting the fact that people who said that anyone would do better than Wenger are now, when that had been shown to be wrong, now saying "well, of course we're worse now, because of all the damage Wenger did". When Wenger left NQ said he'd be expecting a new manager come in and challenge for the title in 2 years. Now he's saying that was never possible? :shrug:

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But don't you think Letters, that if we had gone for the best of the best, the Alegris and Simones we were all talking about then; maybe the dream of a fan like NQ would have had a better chance of coming true?

The mentality of this club is the problem, when faced with world class choices we always want to shock everyone by going for the person no one really rates or is untested. Emery was never among the best 10 managers in the world, he was an underdog for the job in the beginning but yet our small time entitilement mentality makes sure we go for the less risky choice... A yes man.

The lazy know-nothing execs were just trying to repeat the Wenger miracle Dein achieved ages ago....that fascination with all things Wenger is still what is killing this club.

I didn't know I'd said we'd be challenging for the title in 2 years. That's news to me. I thought I was saying we'd be mid table and shite. Obviously I got it wrong. Can't believe I paid so little attention to the absolutely horrible attitude Wenger and his cronies infested the club with. That said, I don't think they did it on purpose, as in wanting to fail - although the mistakes they made were deliberate. I believe they though FFP would be a far bigger deal than it turned out to be. And, suiting their cheapskate and second best mentality, that seemed the easiest route to covering their bullshit ideology in glory. Then FFP turned out to be an excuse for rich clubs to be rich and so Wenger and the board turned around and blamed the fans for the inevitable failure. You al remember when that happened, right?