FT 1-2
We robbed them. Shittiest performance I have ever seen, since our previous performance and the one before that. Wenger really doesn't have a clue any more. The Belgians are a very basic team but they played much, much better football than us.
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FT 1-2
We robbed them. Shittiest performance I have ever seen, since our previous performance and the one before that. Wenger really doesn't have a clue any more. The Belgians are a very basic team but they played much, much better football than us.
"Same old Arsenal, taking the piss..." :lol:
Fucking awful performance. Sanchez was shaking his head as he left.
He's much too good for this team. Should be an ideal player for any team but we've found a way to compensate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Pretty embarrassing to nick that..... stealing a living the lot of them....just for you NQ.
Passing was just horrible and Welbeck looked so soo blunt tonight. Don't get me started on the defence.
he wants a new manager as badly as we do, quite clearly. he's sussed the cesspool he's landed himself in ...still fucking better than going to liverhoofQuote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
What did you think about the defence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice
Leave it! He said don't get 'im staaarted! :handbags:Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
I don't want to slander your mate Napoleon dynamite...seeing as you are so fond of him.
Oh don't start that. Do you even go to games?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
yesss, last match i went to was the galatasaray oneQuote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
i just ask because i think it is quite peculiar for a fan of a club, to want that football club to lose a match
Plenty feel the same on the likes of twitter. Does it not show how dissatisfied and disillusioned we are with the current regime?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
I'm disillusioned. That said, I never want us to lose, yet I don't care that we won tonight. I didn't bother to watch, but I've read a fair bit of the match thread.
I haven't seen any highlights or the goals. I won't go out of my way to see them nor will I make an effort to avoid them.
Because right now, Arsenal aren't worth an effort either way.
A win that will not catapult us into anything whatsoever this season.
So utterly pointless.
Yeah, wish we lost and went into Europa instead. More our level.
No not really, first of all I regard my support for Arsenal as unconditional.....no one can be happy with how things are going but it seems perverse to want things to get worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
Last season I wanted Wenger not to sign a new contract and in the FA cup semi final with 4th place having been taken away from us and ten minutes from defeat by Wigan I felt this was the closest we'd come to the end of his reign, but I got no joy out of this and was hugely relieved when we equalised and won on penalties. My love of the club and wanting us to win games far outweighs my frustration with l'ouisseau.
The AGM shower proved that the board are a bunch of clowns who don't care about the footballing aspect of the club, and a replacement to Wenger coming as a result of results that leave us in crisis would be grand folly.
It is not good enough that we persist with a manager who sees the pinnacle of his achievements as finishing in the champions league qualifying places to make the club more revenues, but as long as that still continues to happen I am happy to wait till 2017, when Wenger goes and leaves the club in a good state for a fresher younger manager to push on and have us challenging and winning major honours.
:haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
What utter drivel.
You apologists sure know how to paint a rosy outlook in times if frustration, don't you?
Looking at our team getting shitter and shitter, what good state do you expect Wenger to hand over things in to a new manager after 2 1/2 more seasons? What will be better then than now?
That manager will have some task rebuilding this team, adding some bottle and instilling a winning mentality in and around the Club. As such, I say we get on with the job early. Ideally, Wenger Out by the time the January window opens.
Has it? We've started this season very poorly but is there a clear negative trend going back longer term?Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
We've stagnated, we've not declined.
Sometimes the only way things get a whole lot better is when they get a whole lot worse first - totally with She Wore on this, he can't possibly do a better job at 65 years of age as to when he was 50. Things like dementia set in which may explain how he has forgotten to entertain or how he forgets he has substitutes to use. I used to jump on the Northern line at Morden & go to Highbury on my own as a 10 year old, meeting my uncle at the ground. I did this for the best part of 25 years before work took me abroad. I'm Arsenal through & through but if losing games is going to effect some kind of change in Wengers outlook or to how the board view his position then so be it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Stagnated?Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Really?
:haha:
Ok.
Knowing how you are heavy into stats, now would be an ideal time for you to reel out some.
Letters :haha::haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
Wenger :haha: :haha:
Letters and Wenger :haha:
Sitting on a tree :haha:
Tossing eachother off :haha:
:haha: :haha:
OK :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
Our points tally over the last 4 seasons - in brackets the gap between us and the eventual champions:
2011 - 68 (12)
2012 - 70 (19)
2013 - 73 (16)
2014 - 79 (7)
So fine, not stagnated. We've clearly improved over the last few years.
Your turn.
:coffee:
Letters :haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Has absolutely lost it.
You do realise that if your only going to respond to one sentence of a two three paragraph post it would be easier for you to merely cut and paste that sentence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
I didnt know I was a Wenger apologist, but then compared to someone who wants us to lose games just so the manager gets the push I suppose I must be.
The argument of most Anti-Wenger people (and a view I tend to agree with myself) is that the manager is the one not getting the best out of the players, and actually in terms of personnel we need one (I'd argue two centre backs) and at least one combative midfielder, so if Wenger went today doesn't exactly leave his replacement with a dire mess to sort out. My rationale for him not going, is that when most likely we will finish in the top four it seems rather churlish to upset the apple cart to replace when a season is in progress and no club other than Chelsea would sack the manager after only one league defeat in eight games
This may be crazy talk but how about trying to respond to the point :tiphat:Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
Explain how a rising points tally over the last 4 years is us getting "shitter and shitter"
In terms of quality and performance there has certainly been a clear decline, regardless of results.
However last year was an improvement statistically, probably because we didn't drop many points against the teams we "should" be beating. Lots of narrow and ebbed out victories which didn't exactly fill anyone with confidence.
This year, well, fuck knows whats happened.
That's pretty much my feeling about this season so far.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
In terms of decline, we're certainly far worse than we were, say, 10 years ago. I'm not sure we're worse than we were 4 years ago though, I think that was the season when RvP bailed us out and we were bloody awful for much of the season, we looked like a real mid-table team with one quality player who dragged us into 4th.
If we had declined as steadily as some are suggesting we'd have been in mid-table years ago. The truth is we've bobbled around for years, sometimes getting a bit better, sometimes getting a bit worse. There hasn't been a clear, consistent year on year decline.
Indeed people speak about huff and puff football with no end product as if its only come into being where it's been part of the Arsenal way even to an extent when we had the likes of Pires, Vieira, Henry in the side.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
However I think the issue seems to be that either the players aren't fit or they are not motivated to play for this manager (or indeed both) and nothing suggests to me that Wenger is addressing this malaise.
Our average points over the past 6 seasons has been (rounding up a bit) 73.
We've never been wildly different from that number either, the worst was 5 below it on 68, the best was 6 above it last season on 79.
Pretty much the definition of stagnation.
The exchange between Özil's Panoramic View and Letters pretty much sums up the internet.
"Come on and use your shit stats to refute my water-tight argument if you're hard enough."
Letters uses basic stats and proves point simply enough.
"LOL @ Letters."
Letters, you can trump up all the stats you want - except for a comparative of how we've fared this season thus far against past seasons :haha: - all one has to do is watch the turgid shit being served up to realise we are getting shitter and shitter.
Excellent post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
He hasn't compared me to the Nazis yet. Once he does that I think we're done here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Splinter
You guys are like the Republican Party, you live in a bubble and can only conduct proper discourse amongst yourselves and you characterise people who don't agree with you as something they are not. Like calling me pro Wenger except if you knew me or saw any of my posts on Facebook you'd know that's not the case).Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
The football isn't great at the moment but its been pretty much the same for the past five years, so I don't know why your getting your panties in a twist about Wenger needing to be extricated from the club.
We aren't going to win the title whoever we have, and whoever we buy in January.....results and performances are pretty average but we aren't in crisis, and until such time it seems pointless turfing out a manager mid-season.
Do I wish there was someone different at the helm?....ideally yes as much as I still like Wenger on a personal level he's given us all he's got and there is no room for sentiment in this game. My issue runs deeper than him though, and I harbour a lot of resentment towards David Dein without whom I doubt any of us would have ever heard the names E.Stanley Kroenke and Alisher Usmanov.
YOU lot think Wenger is still the right man for the club, 10 years after he's done anything of note, and WE'RE the ones living in a bubble??!!
:haha: :haha: :haha:
Yep. That's exactly what HCZ said. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
Good win.
You lot stick up for him when it's now clear it's all his fault, and always has been.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Huge triumph for the wenger out lot on goonersweb. We were right all along :haha:
Except that no one has claimed the bit in bold, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
All we are saying is, the sooner we start the rebuilding process under a new more tactically astute manager, one who sees the obvious squad deficiencies and takes steps in the transfer market to address them, one who studies the opposition and comes up with a game plan accordingly, and one who doesn't make predetermined substitution comes in, the better.
Been saying ever since I joined this forum that Wenger is a spent force living off past glories and buoyed by a cult following. Was mocked, ridiculed, derided and patronised for that bit.
Glad to see some blinkers coming off now.
Ffs u know it just is no longer worth fighting for when even our dear friend Ollie has tossed in the towel. :haha:
GW. :rose:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Özil's Panoramic View
You really don't need to quote my entire post if you are only going to criticise a sentence of it.
Again you seem to misunderstand what the point is, I don't think for a second those who have your opinion believe we will win anything big if we ditch Wenger, the point I am making is that as much as you want to make out the club is in crisis it really isn't, in fact Letters statistics back up the stagnation argument things aren't getting worse but I think we all agree that it's not acceptable that things aren't getting better.
But for me a club has to be in crisis to countenance sacking its manager mid season and it would set a terrible precedent. Do I really want Wenger here till 2017, not really but looking purely from the boards point of view there certainly isn't any grounds for dismissal either.
Maybe he will get fed up and walk away at the end of the season, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
Well if you only respond to what you think people say as opposed to what they are saying then you aren't ever going to be wrong because essentially your only arguing with yourself.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
I certainly don't know anyone who believes Wenger can take the club forward, I just don't see anyone say this?. People like me say the following
A) The results this season are pretty average but they do not constitute the kind of crisis that would make the instant dismissal of the manager in the middle of the season warranted or desirable, to properly replace a manager this is best done at the end of the season.
B) Whatever we want, we all know that Wenger and only Wenger will decide how long he remains manager at the club. If however there is any suggestion in a year or so of him extending his contract post 2017 than you will find me jumping ship to protest with you guys. However I don't think that will happen I think within 18 months I believe he will make public his plan to retire in 2017