Arsenal 2-0 Stoke - Match Reaction

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Wrighty made a few good observations on MOTD last night. He showed how Walcott's movement in the centre is almost non-existent and how he only really sparks when he's coming from the wing and cutting in. Walcott is so obviously more effective out there, wonder why he's so determined to play centrally when he's not good at it? Theo wants a run of games so he can establish himself centrally - now many goals will it cost us to give him that run? He has to play wide and Bif has to play centrally. The real problem is Wenger's refusal to choose 2 from Ozil, Cazorla and Ramsey. He's determined to play all 3 all the time no matter the opponent.

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If you ask me where I do I want to play, I'd say centre mid. If you ask me where my best position is, I'd say in goal/CB. The preference to a position never really leaves a professional, they just get on with it in any case. If Theo is playing CF its because Wenger is playing him there but he doesn't have to.

Theo hasn't made a career out of missing easy chances and it is hard to iron out the wastefulness if you're in and out of the team. Adebayor made a name for himself missing easy chances before he scored 25 for us.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Wright said no such thing about movement from wide positions being better. :lol: What were you watching? He showed an example of bad movement where he didn't run to the back post for Bellerin's cross and said he has to learn that. Next he said he made a fantastic run but blamed Ozil for passing to Ramsey. Showed another good run from the centre where he was in on goal but should have shot with his right foot.

Wright was critical and fair. Said he believes Walcott has the tools to play there but needs a run of games to get clinical. Praised his goal for the touch and finish.

We can try Bif up front but he doesn't get the chances on goal. It's rare to see Bif get chances where he can score a hat trick. Very rare and he'd have never scored that first goal.

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Yes that's how I remembered what he said and noted that particular point too. Frankly, I thought his movement was superb, especially his timing of coming back on side shortly before making a run into the space.

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Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice

If you ask me where I do I want to play, I'd say centre mid. If you ask me where my best position is, I'd say in goal/CB. The preference to a position never really leaves a professional, they just get on with it in any case. If Theo is playing CF its because Wenger is playing him there but he doesn't have to.

Theo hasn't made a career out of missing easy chances and it is hard to iron out the wastefulness if you're in and out of the team. Adebayor made a name for himself missing easy chances before he scored 25 for us.



Yes that's how I remembered what he said and noted that particular point too. Frankly, I thought his movement was superb, especially his timing of coming back on side shortly before making a run into the space.

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I like what Wright had to say and if Theo wants any tips on how to sharpen his game, he should put in a call to Ian and study some of his tapes. But I don't think this is a major problem for Theo. Once he warms up and gets confident the goals just start to flow. I'd worry more if he wasn't getting any chances at all.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Underestimate that first touch and finish if you want to. The touch was sublime and set himself up perfectly to take the defender out of the equation and line up a perfect shot. If that had been a Song passing the ball to RVP, people would be creaming themselves over the finish and downplaying the ball from Song. I've seen this before. I'm not taking anything away from any of the players. A beauty of a pass from Ozil but the first touch was important as well.

This whole concept of a striker holding the ball up and bringing others into play is what facilitates tippy tappy play in the first place. It's dragging players like Santi further forward, playing a higher line with the defence and leaves us vulnerable to a counter attack. What you describe is exactly why we have games where we require 500 passes to get into the opponents box. It's what we've been doing for years and we haven't been successful at it with Giroud.

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I agree whole heartedly!

I tend to agree with Wenger on his theory on missing the type of chances we have been recently. It is less to do with your general finishing ability than it is your ability to just be calm in the situation. As we all recognised, Theo scored the most difficult chance of the game with some orc monster chasing him and breathing down his neck. That calmness in front of goal will simply improve with games, familiarity of recently being in simillar situations and having the trust of the manager.

Whilst we have the options we have I don't think the argument for Giroud over Theo at CF....is particularly overwhelming. The only difference is, we've seen Giroud get a run of games there, but we haven't seen Theo get a run despite being here far longer. If the club decides to stop sitting on the cash and sign a world class CF, then by all means, plays him ahead of Theo and see how HE does...

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Underestimate that first touch and finish if you want to. The touch was sublime and set himself up perfectly to take the defender out of the equation and line up a perfect shot. If that had been a Song passing the ball to RVP, people would be creaming themselves over the finish and downplaying the ball from Song. I've seen this before. I'm not taking anything away from any of the players. A beauty of a pass from Ozil but the first touch was important as well.

This whole concept of a striker holding the ball up and bringing others into play is what facilitates tippy tappy play in the first place. It's dragging players like Santi further forward, playing a higher line with the defence and leaves us vulnerable to a counter attack. What you describe is exactly why we have games where we require 500 passes to get into the opponents box. It's what we've been doing for years and we haven't been successful at it with Giroud.

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Except that's not what I described. The idea is you can't solely lump the ball to Theo, you have to have a mixed attack and Bif can provide that. Corners (if we could learn how to take them), crosses (if we could learn how to provide them), these aren't for Theo. And I don't underestimate his touch and finish yesterday, but I do understand he'll do that 1 in 5 at best and the rest he'll fuck up. A truly top striker is a 1 in 2 player. The Cazorla thing has little to do with it, that's another one of Wenger's crackpot plans that is supposedly designed to keep possession in the opposition half and I guess it does achieve that with the one downside being Coquelin often has to be in two places at once.

It's all a bit confusing. You look at managers like Wenger and van Gaal with all their experience and you think surely they know what they are doing. But then you see Ramsey on the right and Fellaini playing as a central striker and you realise actually, no, they don't. Hard as it is to believe.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

Wenger uses that right wing as some sort of throw away experimental position. He always has. Ljunberg was an attacking midifleder. Played more like a number 10 for Sweden but we play him on that right wing. Wiltord was a striker, turns him into a right winger. Eboue got games there. Walcott gets played there. Ox gets played there. I don't understand what Ramsey will learn from playing there. If he's a central midfielder, what experience is that adding to his game?
This is what I've been saying for the past few weeks and why we need to tear up this team once Wenger leaves along with this brand of frustrating football. Speed isn't enough to compensate for lack of understanding of a particular role, which is why shoving Ox, Theo and Wellbeck out onto the wing will only bring limited success. Especially when every single player we play wide wants to play centrally and when they are on the pitch that is exactly what they do. We got away with it when Wiltord and Freddie were put there because they were smart players, surrounded by others who were playing in their right position. They worked as a unit, together. This current lot - bar Alexis - are useless in comparison and just being pacey doesn't cut it, which is why we need at least one player who understands that wide role properly.
If Ox will play as a central midfielder in the future, what's the point of playing him on the wing? What's it adding? It's the same for Walcott. He was supposed to be developed into a striker and there is this huge question mark over Walcott's ability to play there so I don't know why Wenger does it other than just to fudge his best players on to the pitch all at once.

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This is what I've been saying for the past few weeks and why we need to tear up this team once Wenger leaves along with this brand of frustrating football. Speed isn't enough to compensate for lack of understanding of a particular role, which is why shoving Ox, Theo and Wellbeck out onto the wing will only bring limited success. Especially when every single player we play wide wants to play centrally and when they are on the pitch that is exactly what they do. We got away with it when Wiltord and Freddie were put there because they were smart players, surrounded by others who were playing in their right position. They worked as a unit, together. This current lot - bar Alexis - are useless in comparison and just being pacey doesn't cut it, which is why we need at least one player who understands that wide role properly.

If we beat the chavs they are 15 points behind!!!! In September!! Lord of mercy! What more incentive could we need!

All we need then is to get Flamini to put Aguero out for the season when we play City, Flamini isn't going to get a game otherwise anyway and he's off next summer......then we might fluke the league.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Except that's not what I described. The idea is you can't solely lump the ball to Theo, you have to have a mixed attack and Bif can provide that. Corners (if we could learn how to take them), crosses (if we could learn how to provide them), these aren't for Theo. And I don't underestimate his touch and finish yesterday, but I do understand he'll do that 1 in 5 at best and the rest he'll fuck up. A truly top striker is a 1 in 2 player. The Cazorla thing has little to do with it, that's another one of Wenger's crackpot plans that is supposedly designed to keep possession in the opposition half and I guess it does achieve that with the one downside being Coquelin often has to be in two places at once.

It's all a bit confusing. You look at managers like Wenger and van Gaal with all their experience and you think surely they know what they are doing. But then you see Ramsey on the right and Fellaini playing as a central striker and you realise actually, no, they don't. Hard as it is to believe.

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Your generalising with the amount of chances Theo needs to score. It's not the case with every game as seen by the West Brom hat trick game but that's easy to forget. Same goes for the Newcastle hat trick.

I don't know what your envision for Giroud but he's just off for at the moment. You saw the sitter he missed and he's not the type of striker that gets a lot of chances. It's not as if the West Ham game didn't happen. We had Oxford on the right with Ramsey in the middle but lost the game some how. I'm in no rush to see him back into the team because it's the games where we create nothing with all the possession in the world that bothers me most.

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Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice

If we beat the chavs they are 15 points behind!!!! In September!! Lord of mercy! What more incentive could we need!

All we need then is to get Flamini to put Aguero out for the season when we play City, Flamini isn't going to get a game otherwise anyway and he's off next summer......then we might fluke the league.

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A draw would be a great result too, as long as we don't lose next week that will pretty much end their season or any hope of a proper title challenge IMO.

I have a nasty feeling they are going to turn us over though, we are the perfect team to play to kick start anyone's season!

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Wrighty made a few good observations on MOTD last night. He showed how Walcott's movement in the centre is almost non-existent and how he only really sparks when he's coming from the wing and cutting in. Walcott is so obviously more effective out there, wonder why he's so determined to play centrally when he's not good at it? Theo wants a run of games so he can establish himself centrally - now many goals will it cost us to give him that run? He has to play wide and Bif has to play centrally. The real problem is Wenger's refusal to choose 2 from Ozil, Cazorla and Ramsey. He's determined to play all 3 all the time no matter the opponent.

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How many games did it take Henry , Adebayor , RVP , Anelka ..etc to establish themselves as effective centre forwards for Arsenal ? Didn't i Wenger got bashed for giving them that opportunity ?
Walcott is a CF who had been wasted on flanks for quite long . It would surely take him some time to recover his boots . I would suggest we gave him at least half a season of a good run before making any judgment .