Bournemouth reaction and player ratings

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23-08-2022, 09:05 AM
selassie

Quote:

Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

I understand why you say that but you are of course completely wrong. The fact that Xhaka has been allowed that free role is an admission by Arteta that he simply can’t be trusted in a deeper role. Its in fact a sign of the hubris Arteta has whereby in my view he should have been relieved of his job by now.

This isn’t the Bundesliga or Serie A, you simply cannot have a player who has no anticipation or reading of the game, takes too long to get the ball on his preferred foot and lacks positional awareness in central midfield at all. You can get away with it when playing championship level teams like Bournemouth or teams experiencing a crisis of confidence like Leicester.
But otherwise you’re ceding the middle of the park to the opposition, you cannot have a player who gives the ball away as frequently as Xhaka near the team. You might think I’m worried when we play teams like Man City or Liverpool, no I’m worried when we play Fulham. Fulham will not allow us to play the way we did against Bournemouth…a slow player like Zinchenko won’t be allowed to look better than he is and Xhaka giving the ball away like he does could even be fatal.

It’s not hyperbole. Central midfield is the most important part of the pitch….it’s where games are won and lost and if we don’t improve that position before the window closes…we will certainly lose at home to city, home to Liverpool and other games too.

I don't entirely disagree, but you can't say for sure that this will be the outcome with Xhaka without the game taking place. I am not sure exactly where you are taking this conversation now. I have admitted Xhaka has weaknesses and was moved into a position to mask them to an extent...I have said we can upgrade on him...he is not the only player we can upgrade on if we really want to cement ourselves as a top 4 team / challenging team.
23-08-2022, 09:07 AM
selassie

Quote:

Originally Posted by mandela8

So a couple of numpties at Leeds? Hardly "roundly jeered" then, eh? He was cheered everywhere, basically.

As for those performances being "superb", I really don't know what to say about that. As hyperbolic as your "roundly jeered" claim, is about the best I can do..

As for his stats, remove the set piece padding and for the single mainstay in the 3 attackers it flatters to deceive a little. Regardless, I'm naw really one for these stats anyway. I'm more of an eye test guy and the chances that were lost when the ball went to Saka last season was shocking.

As for who from the current squad I'd play before Saka...Pepe, ESR, Viera (who I've never seen play) and Riess Nelson, tbh.

Hyperbole you said?
23-08-2022, 09:31 AM
HCZ_Reborn

Quote:

Originally Posted by selassie

I don't entirely disagree, but you can't say for sure that this will be the outcome with Xhaka without the game taking place. I am not sure exactly where you are taking this conversation now. I have admitted Xhaka has weaknesses and was moved into a position to mask them to an extent...I have said we can upgrade on him...he is not the only player we can upgrade on if we really want to cement ourselves as a top 4 team / challenging team.

It’s not we can upgrade on, it’s their presence in the side is detrimental to that progress. There’s a difference between we can do better than that player, and that player is harming us. We laugh at United for getting done over by Brentford….that would have comfortably happened to us (not necessarily conceding the amount of goals) but we would be under constant threat with the amount Xhaka gives away the ball.
23-08-2022, 12:23 PM
Globalgunner

We can do better than Xhaka for sure and he is now getting to the stage where he has almost no resale value. Typically Arsenal we will keep him and give him a testimonial for doing nothing in a decade except accumulate red cards. Lets hope he has a great world cup and we can offload at Xmas.

He has been ok so far this season, but we havent really had a hard game yet,
23-08-2022, 01:47 PM
selassie

Quote:

Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

It’s not we can upgrade on, it’s their presence in the side is detrimental to that progress. There’s a difference between we can do better than that player, and that player is harming us. We laugh at United for getting done over by Brentford….that would have comfortably happened to us (not necessarily conceding the amount of goals) but we would be under constant threat with the amount Xhaka gives away the ball.

So Xhaka's presence in the team right now is detrimental to our progress? He is harming us right now?
23-08-2022, 01:56 PM
IBK

I don't really get this Xhaka hate. I understand that he has been a lightening rod for fans' disaffection with the club over the past few years, and that he has had his disciplinary issues. I appreciate also that people feel he should be upgraded on. But he has been a first team regular under successive Arsenal managers, and his committment to the club has been really solid - despite his near departure to Roma, and being played in several positions. He has 1 goal and 2 assists so far this season. If he was lacking in effort or disparaging of the club, I could understand it more, but all this hate and opprobrium basically because fans feel he could be upgraded upon makes no sense to me.
23-08-2022, 02:12 PM
HCZ_Reborn

Quote:

Originally Posted by selassie

So Xhaka's presence in the team right now is detrimental to our progress? He is harming us right now?

Yes because you’re watching him against teams that are giving us the time and space we want on the ball and it’s making certain people believe there is a problem. And Xhaka gave the ball away in dangerous positions against Leicester and Bournemouth and that could have been costly
23-08-2022, 02:16 PM
HCZ_Reborn

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBK

I don't really get this Xhaka hate. I understand that he has been a lightening rod for fans' disaffection with the club over the past few years, and that he has had his disciplinary issues. I appreciate also that people feel he should be upgraded on. But he has been a first team regular under successive Arsenal managers, and his committment to the club has been really solid - despite his near departure to Roma, and being played in several positions. He has 1 goal and 2 assists so far this season. If he was lacking in effort or disparaging of the club, I could understand it more, but all this hate and opprobrium basically because fans feel he could be upgraded upon makes no sense to me.

It’s not hate ffs, it’s recognition that it’s madness to have a player like that in your central midfield. Ticking time bomb in the same way Mustafi was. That transitional area between defence and attack is so important in the game, and you need someone who you can rely on to get the ball into the opponents half without being dispossessed, closed down. So far Zinchenko has been able to bail him out but Zinchenko is not quick or technical enough to do that against better and quicker teams
23-08-2022, 02:35 PM
selassie

Quote:

Originally Posted by HCZ_Reborn

Yes because you’re watching him against teams that are giving us the time and space we want on the ball and it’s making certain people believe there is a problem. And Xhaka gave the ball away in dangerous positions against Leicester and Bournemouth and that could have been costly

Right so essentially you are saying Xhaka is detrimental to the progress of our team and harms our teams based on what might happen when we face a better side? OK......
23-08-2022, 03:23 PM
HCZ_Reborn

Quote:

Originally Posted by selassie

Right so essentially you are saying Xhaka is detrimental to the progress of our team and harms our teams based on what might happen when we face a better side? OK......

What time and time again has happened and that we’ve dodged a bullet even a few times this season because of him

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