explain why it's laughable instead just offering glib meaningless responses
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explain why it's laughable instead just offering glib meaningless responses
:bow:Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss
You have overtaken NQ as my best poster on GW.
NQ :rose:
Well if you hold this to be true then how dare you put the "demise" of arsenal football club entirely on the shoulders of Wenger?Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
The owners, the most senior persons at the club, the custodians, are allowing a destructive policy to continue without intervening, because it makes them a few extra bob in the short term? the people who should know better and who dictate the long-term stategy of the club (20 years +) allow a rogue employee "madman" to sell the club down the river, because of money?
Whatever happens the buck stops at the owners, whichever way you want to twist it, the buck stops at the owners. This is their policy, just as a manager takes the flak for under performers being his players.
Instead of saying Wenger is directly linked to profit, I should have said he is the root of all of the profit we make.Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Tuffnutz
The stadium move was down to his brilliance in the transfer market, and everything about our premier 'product' our business offers (the team) is down to his actions.
He's been here 14~ years and helped shape the club from top to bottom, in the way we're viewed as well as smaller things like fitness, style of play, attractiveness to fans and so on. He's far more influential than some marketing director who decides what stance Theo should be in as he poses for the new shirt.
Not sure how difficult it is to understand why a manager entirely in charge of a club's vision gets far more importance, influence and control than what you'd term a 'low level director' (those of which we also have, and probably decide what colour the urinals in the stadium toilets are).
I thought in a football club, the buck stops with the manager.. Here, our owner or board have NEVER given any signs where they said that they would not allow Arsene to spend money. A fair amount of people have given quotes where AW does not want to spend money yet there is a conspiracy theory in the background.. frankly its retarded! :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by BOBN
People on here are making the board sound like they are Mike Ashley types. They have always vocally come out and said they will sanction moves that AW require yet the board, the american, the random Bangladeshi are all to blame.. AW is the victim!
As for the part about demise- here is how I look at it. Arsenal as a business is flourishing, we are THE best. Arsenal as a football club is falling rapidly. I see posts from Lettuce where he says that we should be 6th, fighting for 4th easily.. WTF! We should be talking about challenging for titles not talking about 4th place as a trophy. See what AW has done to us?! FFS open your eyes... AW has to leave!
The poll is closer than i thought it would be
All of those votes are down to deluded people like Letters who believe Wenger should be here for the rest of his life. a) hope white text still works and b) waits for Letters to say that he's called for Wenger to go earlier this yearQuote:
Originally Posted by Ach
Surprises me too. I thought he'd have 4-5 votes at most. Seems like 'Wenger love-in' flu is going around ever since our loss to Pool.. That has influenced the poll.. however seems like GW as a whole hasnt been affected by this stupid virus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
Wenger even had a say in the design of the changing rooms, and the catering service provided at the Emirates. That suggests this is a man who has a HUGE amount of influence at the club.
I havent read the thread, just voted but i really cant see how anyone can defend Wenger anymore.
Il have to read it and see this delusional defence of Wenger. Need a laugh tbh
YES! YES!! I know this!! I was told about this when I did the stadium tour! A manager who designs the changing rooms.. wow! He is a victim though..Quote:
Originally Posted by Joker
Lettuce, NQ, GB :rose:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
Or people could be concerned at the replacement the board install were he to go right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
NQ and GB were defending Wenger? Thats a surprise.Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
Letters, i expected. Poor guy is hoping against all hope that Wenger changes his way.
Oh the stupid virus is pretty widespread......Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
The stupid virus has a name tbh.
Its called Wengeritis.
Right now, I'd personally take my U-18 coach over him! There are tons out there- Ancelotti, Billic, Riijkard, Pelligrini, Keown, Moyes. You might agree with some or not agree with any of the names but the fact is that we need a change. AW was unknown when he joined us.. may be another unknown person from Japan or South Korea or Bangladesh. I'd take Maradona personally but then thats coz I love the guy and he would piss the English off! :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...
Yes! NQ is blaming the board and of course the American. GB wants AW to leave but doesnt want anyone call him a c*nt coz that makes the poster 'fickle'Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
:ilt:
It has swung significantly in favour of "Wenger out" since last season though. This was the result when I first started the thread back in March of last season:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
http://z13.invisionfree.com/goonersw...howtopic=47393
GB also asked the question at the end of last season:
http://www.goonersweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=46
Results for that poll are similar to this one, surprisingly.
Naming a string of coaches isn't the point I was making. The point I was making is more at the prospect of what the board would do; it'd be a legitimate concern if it were true given whatever you think is happening with Wenger over the last few years has been happening under their stewardship.Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
I think the board would get a new coach if AW left.. :unsure:Quote:
Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...
Like I said, unless AW changes his ways, he needs to leave and after that what the board does in terms of replacing him is secondary. Our primary concern should be to get AW's head straight or get him out of his job as manager of Arsenal FC.
I hope I got your point this time.. :unsure:
Read the first couple of pages, got bored.Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
NQ is half right. Blame the board and Wenger tbh.
As for the cunt thing, its a lack of respect thing. If he keeps playing the fans like fools then he'll get abused.
IMO Blame %- AW= 80%, Board= 15%, Bad luck = 5%Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
Agree about the respect part. I wanted him to leave 2 seasons back but I started calling him a c*nt towards the end of last season. I guess I have had enough of him.. soon a lot others will too.. inshahallah!
I've said repeatedly Wenger should have been sacked last season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
But hey, you can all keep ignoring that if you like.
Of course they would get a new manager in, the doubt creeps on to who they'd want and whether it would actually represent any real change. If they're comfortable with just finishing the top four season in season out based on the financial benefits of it, then why the assumption that a new manager is just going to mean they'll think "right let's get this new guy to push us on to a new level"?Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
Man, I am confused! :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
So what are you saying here? I do get the point that there is something bigger (conspiracy theory IMO) going on behind the scenes but the important question is... do u want him as manager? If you wanted him sacked last season, what has changed your mind this season? Or do you still want him sacked? :unsure:
In March? We were in the midst of our awful run but i assume most of the Wenger fans back then were in the mindset that he will sort out all the problems in the summer which of course he hasnt. He hasnt even attempted to tbh hence we see more people wanting him out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joker
Ive wanted him out since the start of last summer. I turned on him at the end of the 09/10 season but was willing to give him that summer for him to get some quality players in. We didnt and ive wanted him out since and that hasnt changed.
This summer is as bad as last years and has done nothing to lift the mood of the fans.
Yet you defend him to the rafters when someone else says they want him sacked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
You've probably done it in this thread if i cba reading it
I guess we can never know till AW walks or is fired or moved on to upper management. What I do know is that we need a change footballistically.. we need to stop the rot and it should start with AW.Quote:
Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...
Yup I've made that point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
If you want someone sacked and believe they should be, you don't then look for all kinds of excuses for the problems.
I agree the board is to blame, but AW has a lot of blame to shoulder too....and definitely has to take a lot of blame on the transfer front.
That must never happen eitherQuote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
Ok you want wenger out, who do you think are in a position to make that happen?Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
Even with the one thing that nobody could argue isn't in the hands of the board, an action which you see as necessary for the sake of the club, you refuse to criticise them one iota.
The only virus on here is the blind cock fondling of the board from people like you. Shall we call it boarditis?
New manager: Arsene I want to sign "Atopplayer"Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
Arsene: How old is he
New manager: 26
Arsene: Do you not think he's a bit old, it doesn't make a lot of sense economically
New manager: He's got quite a few years left Arsene and is already a top player who has delivered at the highest level
Arsene: What about the future, we need to build for the future...do you think he will still be around
New manager: I don't see why not Arsene he's got a fair few years and will most likely play on into his 30's
Arsene: We don't like keeping players in their 30's, will he accept a pay cut and one year contract
New manager: I'm not sure Arsene
Arsene: Is he super quality?
New manager: I'm not sure what you mean Arsene, but he's top class and has performed in the CL and was great at the World Cup and has also been consistently good in Spain
Arsene: How much will he cost, we can't buy players for 50 million you know
New manager: He's available for 16 million Arsene, I know it seems a lot but he's proven at the highest level
Arsene: You can make them an offer of up to 8.2 million but start at 5 so you can bid up, we don't want to spend more than that as we have to live in the real world and we have many young players which we don't want to kill
New manager: I'm not sure we'll get him for that Arsene
Arsene: We've got all summer, just keep negotiating and we'll get him at the right price, the deal needs to be right for Arsenal
New manager: If you say so Arsene
I'm conflicted.Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
It's not a conspiracy theory to suggest that this mess is not entirely Wenger's doing. We have a board who have some influence on the club and we have Wenger who does too. I take the point that Wenger arguably has more say in things than a lot of managers but the suggestion that he is COMPLETELY in charge of things and thus solely to blame for the mess is just plain wrong. IMO. As for how much say Wenger has...well, none of us really know but the board sit above Wenger and I would suggest if there are disagreements about how to do things (and there are some rumblings that there are) then the board would have the final say, not Wenger. The board employ Wenger, not the other way around.
The collapse last season was entirely down to Wenger, the mental weakness in the squad, the lack of defensive organisation. I blame him solely for those things and I think he should have been sacked for that. The utter balls up that has been this summer's transfer dealings. I'm not convinced that is entirely down to him.
As for whether I want him sacked now...well, like I said I'm conflicted. I think you're being naive if you think a new manager is going to come in and we're going to start spending big and everything will be great again. And I think some people are under-estimating how hard it is to keep a club top 4 while other clubs with far bigger spending power than us throw money around - many managers have tried and failed to spend big to get and keep a team in the top 4, how much has 'Arry and other Spurs managers spent and while they did sneak in there one year they didn't sustain it (mostly 'cos of City, but still).
In brief, I'd never disrespect the man 'cos I remember what things were like before he came and he's taken us places I never dreamed we'd go. I've seen the Double, twice. The unbeaten season. A few other trophies and a style of football in the early noughties I never thought I'd see us play. We're in the new stadium because of Wenger. We see a finish outside the top 4 as a major disappointment because of Wenger. That shouldn't be forgotten.
There is certainly less to lose by sacking him now though, top 4 is going to be a real scrap this year. I wouldn't write us off. We'll probably lose on Sunday but it's a long season so we'll see. I wouldn't cry if he left (as I would have done in the good days) but it wouldn't surprise me if we end up getting worse still when he goes.
NoQuote:
Originally Posted by Ach
</discussion>Quote:
You've probably done it in this thread if i cba reading it
Pretty much.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
So basically you say you want him sacked, but you're not actually sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
So everytime you tell us you think he should be sacked, it's not really true. Your argument makes more sense now, that's fair enough and up to you but you can't keep saying you said you wanted him sacked when actually you're not sure he should be.
Sounds to me like you're behind him and want him to stay.
I just want us to try! If AW bought the necessary players, changed tactics and we didnt succeed, I'd say we tried but we are not even trying. Assuming the board has given AW backing to spend then its criminal what AW is doing (I believe in this theory). A new manager would do things differently.. Youth policy not working, get experienced ones, defense looking like a leaking oil spill, get it sorted... GIVE IT A FUCKIN TRY AT LEAST! Thats all I ask..Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
I don't think that change is going to come unless there is a change at board level. In any case, voting yes certainly isn't the blind stupidity you make it out to be!Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
Just skimmed through a few more pages and i see the board being blamed quite a bit rather than Wenger.
They are both as bad as each other.
Also does anyone seriously think Wenger isnt in total control? Really? If he wasnt then he'd walk. You just have to look back to what hes said to whenever hes been linked to the Real Madrid job, a club where the president runs the show and the manager gets the critisism if it goes wrong hence they have had 50 managers in the past 10 seasons or something.
Wenger is totally to blame for the footballing side of things such as on the pitch shit and the buying or to be more accurate the lack of buying players etc
Board is to blame for not putting pressure on Wenger to produce and just sitting back and see the money rolling in from the most expensive tickets around.