Wimbledon 2013 June 24-July 7

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Originally Posted by Arse n Wonga

He never threatens to beat them either though, largely because as stated in my post above he has no big shot to threaten them with.

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That's just plan incorrect Zim, sorry. Watch the Masters final in Miami against Murray (though it was a truly horrific match) and two of the matches against Nadal in Masters events this year. Murray's match against him at Wimbledon last year was a real slog and he was taking it to Djokovic whilst there was bad wind around at the US Open (before the match was stopped and they resumed the following day).

His record isn't much worse than any of the other second tier guys against the tier one guys.

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Originally Posted by Master Splinter

If your point is that he's shit because he's inferior to living legends of the game like Federer, Nadal and Djokovic, then well done.

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I said he's sh* relatively speaking, the reason being because unlike lower ranked players than him he can't challenge the best players. The likes of Berdych, Del Potro, Tsonga etc have a much better chance as they all have big shots, he doesn't and that hurts his chances a lot.

Even those guys you mentioned have only performed sporadically. Del Potro is the one that didn't but then he injured his wrist which took him out for a long, long time.

They might have bigger shots but mentally, they're inferior - look at how David Ferrer took Tsonga apart at the French Open (and Del Potro at Wimbledon last year).

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Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...

That's just plan incorrect Zim, sorry. Watch the Masters final in Miami against Murray (though it was a truly horrific match) and two of the matches against Nadal in Masters events this year. Murray's match against him at Wimbledon last year was a real slog and he was taking it to Djokovic whilst there was bad wind around at the US Open (before the match was stopped and they resumed the following day).

His record isn't much worse than any of the other second tier guys against the tier one guys.

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Nadal beats him every time, I don't think Ferrer has ever beaten him, the score may not be 6-1 6-0 but the point is he always seems to lose. In Wimbledon last year Murray beat him and you never really felt Ferrer was going to go through.

In big matches I reckon his record is worse than some of the other guys, he may win games in some of the smaller tournaments the bigger players don't take so seriously but in the bigger most prestigious events he rarely ever challenges and you never feel he's a contender, ironically though lower ranked players sometimes pull off wins he's unable to against the best players.

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Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...

Even those guys you mentioned have only performed sporadically. Del Potro is the one that didn't but then he injured his wrist which took him out for a long, long time.

They might have bigger shots but mentally, they're inferior - look at how David Ferrer took Tsonga apart at the French Open (and Del Potro at Wimbledon last year).

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I agree they perform sporadically, hence their ranking. Del Potro on his game is awesome though and would blow Ferrer off the court, his injuries have affected him badly though (Soderling is another), my point is players like Del Potro, Soderling, Berdych have a weapon in their game of some form, Ferrer just doesn't. He's a good solid professional who is very consistent but lacks anything special about his game.

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Originally Posted by Arse n Wonga

Nadal beats him every time, I don't think Ferrer has ever beaten him, the score may not be 6-1 6-0 but the point is he always seems to lose. In Wimbledon last year Murray beat him and you never really felt Ferrer was going to go through.

In big matches I reckon his record is worse than some of the other guys, he may win games in some of the smaller tournaments the bigger players don't take so seriously but in the bigger most prestigious events he rarely ever challenges and you never feel he's a contender, ironically though lower ranked players sometimes pull off wins he's unable to against the best players.

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He has beaten him - annihilated him at the Australian Open IIRC and also beaten him on clay but not for a while. We're talking about Nadal on clay here (where they usually meet); losing to him is no great surprise. However you make it seem like he has never challenged them, which isn't true.

David Ferrer has won one Masters, which I am not sure if Del Potro ever has, not sure Berdych ever has and I have doubts as to if Tsonga ever has either. If we're talking about who gets beaten up by Djokovic, Federer, Nadal and Murray the best then it seem to me that most players are comparitively shit - they all have heavy losing records against those guys.

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Originally Posted by Arse n Wonga

I agree they perform sporadically, hence their ranking. Del Potro on his game is awesome though and would blow Ferrer off the court, his injuries have affected him badly though (Soderling is another), my point is players like Del Potro, Soderling, Berdych have a weapon in their game of some form, Ferrer just doesn't. He's a good solid professional who is very consistent but lacks anything special about his game.

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Injuries happen. When you're a big lug, it goes with the territory. David Ferrer's record against Del Potro is 6-2 by the way.

That last line is fine but he is still better than the other guys with those big weapons.

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Originally Posted by Arse n Wonga

I agree they perform sporadically, hence their ranking. Del Potro on his game is awesome though and would blow Ferrer off the court, his injuries have affected him badly though (Soderling is another), my point is players like Del Potro, Soderling, Berdych have a weapon in their game of some form, Ferrer just doesn't. He's a good solid professional who is very consistent but lacks anything special about his game.

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as said above, everyone is then 'shit' comparatively, which is just a ridiculous thing to say. ferrer has a strong head to head with del potro and whilst the guys you mentioned have big weapons, they have areas of their games that they continue to suffer with. ferrer has very few and is a strong all rounder, which is why his ranking is so high. when one of their big plus points isn't working, then they don't have as much to fall back on as ferrer.

the reason the feds, nads and novaks have got to where they are is not because of specific individual parts of their games but making sure all the facets are absolutely sensational. ferrer hasn't achieved near that level - and at his age never will - but he has made sure his all round game is as strong as it can be.

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Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...

He has beaten him - annihilated him at the Australian Open IIRC and also beaten him on clay but not for a while. We're talking about Nadal on clay here (where they usually meet); losing to him is no great surprise. However you make it seem like he has never challenged them, which isn't true.

David Ferrer has won one Masters, which I am not sure if Del Potro ever has, not sure Berdych ever has and I have doubts as to if Tsonga ever has either. If we're talking about who gets beaten up by Djokovic, Federer, Nadal and Murray the best then it seem to me that most players are comparitively shit - they all have heavy losing records against those guys.

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Think we must be going quite a long time for those victories to be honest, nowadays he gets nowhere.

Delp Potro won a grand slam, Berdych got to a final beating Federer and Djokovic so he'e shown he can beat the big guys at big events, Tsonga lacks the temperament but does have a huge serve. In terms of having a chance though, I'd sooner better on those other guys than Ferrer as I think he's got much less of a chance of beating them in big matches than these other players.

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Originally Posted by McNamara That Ghost...

Injuries happen. When you're a big lug, it goes with the territory. David Ferrer's record against Del Potro is 6-2 by the way.

That last line is fine but he is still better than the other guys with those big weapons.

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Delp Potro has had a lot of injuries which as affected his form and record to be fair, whenever he manages to stay fit you start to see how good he actually is, his game is very powerful and he can beat the top guys.