Tbf we must be the only club in history where the manager controls the board
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Tbf we must be the only club in history where the manager controls the board
That's the key ker-plunk straw in your argument. Take that away and your marbles start tumbling.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ach
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by BOBN
Mug
7+ million a year, don't think he's doing too badly do you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
No wonder he's happy being a 3rd/4th place loser, money talks as they say.
:lol: Bless :console:
:haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
:lol: very true, very trueQuote:
Originally Posted by Ach
Dalglish and Mancini are the only winners - every other manager is a big time loser!Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
Dalglish :bow:
6+ years without winning, 7+ million salary = loser on the pitch winner in the bankQuote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
He's a winning loser.
Winning losers :trophy:
:bow: Alex McLeish
Some of the mealy mouthed defence of Wenger on this board is simply mind boggling. I suspect a few people here acre actually Wengers kids masquerading as fans. Every argument showing how inadequate he is in terms of tactics , strategy, and scouting is obfuscated by blaming the board. Wengers strengths used to be an innate knowledge of the French market. Now Alan Pardew (racist Pardew) knows how to pick a winner from France better than le prof. Face it our players leave us because we dont win stuff any more. At Arsenal Wenger is the HIGHEST paid employee. think about that, before you jump up and down saying what a pawn he is in the grand scheme of thinks.
We finished 3rd :good:Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
It's the whiners that are black and white on this issue. NOBODY is claiming Wenger has no faults - faults that genuinely cost us. But SOME are claiming it's 100% Wenger's fault. That's why they have the piss taken out of them. Because it's a very silly argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
So what!?Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
7 years...
7 million...
7 brain cells...
blah blah blah....
7 Samurai, the Magnificent 7, SClub 7Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm
Who's claiming Wenger's 100% to blame? Most realise that both Wenger and the board are screwing us over. Some people think that Wenger's a victim in the shareholder's rapacious desire for profit maximisation, but IMO Wenger is completely comfortable with this arrangement. I know people laugh at this but he genuinely is a free market fundamentalist. Listen to his statements opposition progressive taxation, complaining about how the free market gets distorted by clubs like Man City, his opposition to any regulation like a limit on squad sizes and a quota on homegrown players etc. He's always said his priority is to get into the top 4 above trophies like the FA Cup, because of the financial benefits from it. In economics there's a theory of principle-agent conflict, where the objectives of the shareholders are in conflict with the interests of the managers. Well at Arsenal that is certainly not the case, because both the board and Wenger are simply treating our club like a private sector enterprise, with the emphasis on servitude to the shareholders.
I blame Wenger entirely for us finishing 3rd...
He put the 'mental' in 'free market fundamentalist'
:lol:
3rd :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Not even the best loser :haha:
3rd is the new 1st to be honest. Who wants to win when you can come 3rd/4th and make a nice tidy profit or get a nice pay day...it would be foolish to try and win when things are so rosy.
We realise that, but from 2002-2005, we won 5 trophies (2 of which were league titles). Since then, we've had no trophies whatsoever. You can say, oh it's because Man City and Chelsea have been taken over by oligarchs, which is fair enough, but that's no excuse for the way we've collapsed so regularly, and going from a position where we were on the coattails of our rivals to barely scraping 4th. Even Man Utd, when there was serious concerns about the Glazers piling on debt and taking money out of the club, were able to challenge for the title and win some trophies during their dark days (like the FA Cup in 2004 and the Carling Cup in 2006). Why haven't we been able to win a single trophy despite being in a few semi finals and finals in that time? That suggests a lack of winning mentality and the buck must stop with the manager.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Wenger is a ****.
This is a certainty with the board because we can see the end result. This is a possibility with Wenger, the fact he's an employee needs to be considered. No compliance, no job. That's the way it works. Let's assume he would rather see the board prosper rather than the club. There's nothing to suggest this but let's assume it anyway. Question is, who is the manager that can come in and change the financial agenda of the club? Which manager arrives, at the very least keeps us near the top and loosens the multi-million purse strings?Quote:
Well at Arsenal that is certainly not the case, because both the board and Wenger are simply treating our club like a private sector enterprise, with the emphasis on servitude to the shareholders.
There are no silly arguments, only silly positions. People should see the facts clearly and make the case without preconditions. We are a team that used to think coming second was a bad thing, now 3rd is a mighty laudable conquest. Our players want to leave, others dont want to come. In any other walk of life RVP SHOULD stay, we have been carrying him for years, Ropey walcott now wants to string us along some more, maybe he will threaten to leave. facts are facts you can either say we are in a long standing holding pattern of 3-4th position or we are building again for an assault on the top.....I dont think it is the latter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
Are we going to be the first club in history where, when things are going wrong on the field, we sack the board and keep the manager?
If you're satisfied with Champions League qualification every season, with the Cups being treated as a mere inconvenience (even when we reach the final stages) good for you but for some fans football is more than just about the balance sheet. If we didn't win anything from 1998-2005 and were midtable throughout that period, then I would give credit to Wenger for improving our state. However, we've gone from being a very successful side (which I give Wenger credit for) to a side that doesn't look likely to win a trophy in the foreseeable future. That is surely unacceptable for a top club like ours?Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Yeah Manyoo have been looking down the back of the sofa for the pennies havent they, apart from the £30mil on ferdinand, £30mil on Rooney, £28mil on Berbatov and so on...Quote:
Originally Posted by Joker
Sack both if you must but don't expect dramatic change if you want to keep the same agenda and merely replace the front man. We've been 3-4 quality players short for a long time now. A little bit of investment could have made all the difference. We built stadiums and flats instead and the shareholders bugged out with half a billion quid in their pockets. The promise was the investment in property would allow us in turn to fund the team so we could continue to compete at the very top level. We have yet to see a penny of that funding. And we remain 3-4 quality players short. But the good news, the shareholders did get their half a billion quid so the strategy hasn't been a complete failure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
Note: No shareholders were harmed during the production of the last 7 seasons.
If Wenger is opposed to the board, then I think he should do the honest thing and tender his resignation, and say he can't work under the financial constraints imposed by the board. That way the fans will know exactly whose to blame, and through supporter pressure could at least put the board under the spotlight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
I know people are opposed to Usmanov, but if the choice is between him and the status quo, I'd go with him because we desperately need change at the top.
Can't wait for Wenger's autobiography, especially if he writes it himself
Why do you expect Wenger to be a martyr? Who do you work for? Do you agree with the agenda of the guys at the top? Do you still take a pay cheque from them? Wenger's a football manager working in the modern game. Which club should he go to where the board devotes itself to the fans and makes all personal financial gain a secondary objective?Quote:
Originally Posted by Joker
Usmanov is a vicious criminal. Provided you are okay with that then it's true, his stolen and blood soaked money could go a long way.
He's bound to have some harsh words reserved for Ach.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flavs
I think we are forgetting the principle of shareholding. The people who sold their share s to kroenke et al, can hardly be expected to sell their shares and pass the cash back to the football club. Our strategy to improve the profitability of the club was not wrong. In fact it was so right that 2 billionaires both wanted the club and 1 won out but not so that he got rid of the other. This situation is not likely to change any time soon. what needs to change is our strategy on the pitch. In our last two games of the season we score in the first 5 mins of each match, but were holding on for dear life at thend of both against middling teams. this is our story for years, what has the board got to do with that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
Really? Why not? They put nothing in and they have taken everything out. Is there zero margin to play with? You don't have to take Stan's money and hand it back, you can negotiate a price and allow the American some room for wider investment. But they wanted the full fruits of the share price they carefully constructed - at the expense of everything else, especially the team. No, unfortunately it is the cut-throat and impersonal nature of the shareholder than has seen us fall behind. In many ways Arsenal is at the forefront of the money revolution in the game. The owners of city and the chavs have had to stump up, they'll probably never get their money back. The are amateurs compared to the ruthless vampires in our boardroom.Quote:
I think we are forgetting the principle of shareholding. The people who sold their share s to kroenke et al, can hardly be expected to sell their shares and pass the cash back to the football club.
Can we save this thread for unrealistic links to C. Ronaldo and L. Messi and keep the whining about Wenger and the board to other threads plsty.
Not sure which side is embarrassing itself more above.
Just got myself a 40 carat gold watch. Fucking love ambition.
This is a silly conversation and we keep having it over and over again. When you lose the Carling Cup final against Birmingham, you can't blame it on the Board and the lack of quality signings. We lose games because we can't focus for 90 minutes or we're over confident and think the lower teams will be a pushover. It's a tactical problem, a mental issue and lack consistency. We don't work hard enough to win the ball back and over the past few years we've all said how poor our off the ball movement is. We work our socks off against City and Chelsea but take it easy against teams like Swansea and Norwich.
Ignoring such problems and expecting it all to be fixed with a few key signings is foolish. Look at Arshavin as an example. How comes he never looked match fit? If his fitness was really and issue then why has Wenger got this 30 year old with no engine playing on the flanks where defensive discipline is mandatory and demanding? How comes Wenger couldn't get his fitness level up to play that role or just shift him further up field to take the pressure off his legs? That's one example of bad coaching and there are several other examples. Don't forget the RVP's frustration at seeing the Ox subbed off the Arshavin. He makes questionable decisions and we can't afford to have a coach that seems out of his depth when we're competing against teams that can outspend us.
As for funds, they're being swallowed up by huge wages. There is a huge imbalance on that side of things. There are players available that are within our price range and can do a lot better than the likes of Ramsey, Squallaci, Gervinho, Park, Chamakh.....we just don't go for them. There were plenty of players that we missed out on this year and last year.
You can if youre in the Wenger can do no wrong camp as a few are on hereQuote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Hazard says Gervinho is the best player he has ever played with.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...rvinho?cc=4716
Says it all about the quality of the French league, I'm afraid.
Joe Cole :haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss
When it's behind a side who spent a billion quid to get to the top and a side who have the best manager around it's not that bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
Especially when some people were saying that Spurs squad was better than ours in every way. :lol: Man do they look silly now.
Them :pal: