Established first team player, international captain. It's the going rate. You might not like it, but that's the way it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
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Established first team player, international captain. It's the going rate. You might not like it, but that's the way it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
ahh come on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm
'established first team player, international captain'.
only reason he's a first team player is because we have a thin squad and the rest of our players are shite. he wouldnt be a first team player at man utd, thats why they offered him a youth contract but we for some reason offerred him a professional contract.
its NOT the going rate, its arsenal's going rate.
and its wrong.
you cant sit there and justify the wages for him. we've approached the wage structure in completely the wrong way and its wrong.
end of.
I don't have to justify anything. A lot of players are on the wrong wage, but he's not one of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
ok so one cross gained three points, what about his lack of tracking back against swansea causing miquel to be horribly exposed costing us 3 points? he has done more harm then good this season, waste of space, unprofessional and good ridance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
you're justifying his wages and its unjustifiable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm
wes brown was on 18k a week at man utd and he had won 5 premier league's, 2 fa cups, 3 league cups, and champions league twice.
o shea was on less than 30k and he has a similar honours list.
im not comparing them outright to ramsey but im just showing you how wrong our wage structure is.
what's ramsey done? was given the armband by speed because he was looking to the future. many said it was the wrong decision.
was out for a year with a broken leg, and has contributed very little/won us fuck all.
as i say, its arsenals going rate, NOT footballs going rate. not one other club pays its youth players the amount we do.
He's been poor no doubt about that, but he's one of our few players who can score a goal or two...we barely have any now.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
I agree with GB though, getting rid at a time when we can't get anyone in is totally ridiculous, we now have to rely on Chamakh. Wenger continues making baffling decisions, there's absolutley no logic behind much of what he does these days.
he came on trial and didnt impress, so what was wenger to do? if he had been good we would have signed him, he wasnt so he didnt. we going to blame wenger for that now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchies
forlan was the worlds worst striker at man united, couldnt hit a barn door, yet leaves united and becomes one of europes top strikers. supsodly ferguson is great at making players be good when they are not, yet he failed.
yes wenger has made mistakes, but he gave us henry, who was crap when he joined and left as the leagues greatest ever striker. he has made many players brilliant, just cos one player failed to impress in at trail then became good doesnt mean we should blame him for that
Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
No he was not
Wes Brown; £50,000 a week
John O'Shea; £50,000 a week
http://www.dbsfootball.com/2011/07/m...wages-how.html
Well he didn't impress Wenger, but then maybe his idea of football wasn't 5 yard passing which leads to no end product.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
He's not a Wenger type player though, he's competitive, tough tackling and likes to win.
Its easy to point that out in hindsight but at the time if he was no good what can you do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchies
one of the players who can score a goal or two? ok, how many has he got this season? i genuinely cant think of any this season, his cross yes got us 3 points granted, great cross etc but for just 3 points out of the whole season. thats crap, we cant carry him, waste of space. would rather be a man down and promote youth like ox who care, might not be world beaters but will contribute more to the team then fat fuck would.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
to be fair if he came to arsenal he wouldnt be half the player he is now.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
you can bet we would have completely killed his ability and taught him how to pass sideways for 90 mins.
bet he's glad he never came.
his brother kolo is not as good a player as yaya, yet wenger signed him not yaya because he impressed more and tbh kolo became a great defender for us, he is an invincble. yaya came good at city, just pure bad luck, not something we can blame wenger forQuote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
Funny that seen as we were playing counter attacking football with the invincbles when he was on trial, and he was not of that quality.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
OK then well at least we can rely on Chamakh, he should get us a good few goals :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
also though, if im right when he was on trial, we had gilberto at the time who was exceptional for us. wenger watched him and he was awful in the trail, decided no point to continue with him and let him go. yaya would have had to been brilliant for us to take him when gilberto was so good, he wasnt. also yaya has been good, dont get me wrong but he was never as good as he is now at barca etc, otherwise more clubs would have bid for him not just cityQuote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
Considering he played for the all conquering Barca team and fitted in well and has been immense at Man City I'd say he was plenty good enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
As for the football, Wenger probably had other ideas already at that time, he must have been planning this youth policy cr*p for years.
Exactly. Going rate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
'Firstly may I start my saying that these are all reported figures in the media of how much the individual players are earning/will earn per week.'Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
well i heard he was on 18k a week:
'United don’t pay their fringe players anywhere near what we do. Wes Brown was on £18k pw, he knew he was part of something special though. We have players who are fat off big salaries. Who play for PAYE not glory.'
http://le-grove.co.uk/2012/02/21/ars...ars-by-arsene/
which proves my point, our wage structure is fucked if mr brown was paid that much and he won as much as he did, yet ramsey gets more and has contributed little.
Easy to say it in hindsight.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
I'd complain more about Squillaci who is on 60k to be fair, he should be paying us to play judging from his catastophic performances so far.....got to be one of the worst Wenger signings and there have been quite a few.
Well apparently Wenger had an eye for spotting a rough diamond if you believe the hype, maybe it was just pot luck?Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
No he was not When he singend his new deal Sky sports said it was 50K and i remember listening to it. Other clubs pay as much as we do only diffrence is their fringe players are not kids.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
For what brown has done for UTD Fergie would never just pay him 18K while the likes of Kleberson got more.
Noone pays kids as much as we do, we know that for sure, otherwise we'd never sign any of them.
Kids must dream of playing for us, instead of being stuck on 10k a week we stick them on 50k.
henry, song, rvp, cesc, kos just to name a few. he made a mistake in not signing yaya but if he didnt impress on trail what can he do?Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
True maybe he was lucky aload of the time, no one knew Henry, Veiria would be Alwsome. Some times you find a gem and your lucky other times you find Theo nuff said.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
no you're speculating as much as i am.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
we dont know what he was on. we are both second guessing.
but it doesnt affect my argument, my point remains, our wage structure is ridiculous and we've got it completely wrong.
but is that wengers fault or the board? yes i know wenger will say i want him so keep him etc but the board can turn around and go no, he is not good enough. surely they have some football knowledgeQuote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
Squillaci, Stepanovs, Chamakh, Bischoff, Diawara, Denilson, Malz, Jeffers, Danilevicius, Reyes, Cygan, Senderos, Rosicky, Walcott....that's just some of his bad signings and there have been plenty.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
I agree we don't know and we do pay suckage wages to dross but so do other clubs we just don't here about it this much. Maybe because were not their fans and don't care.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
I think in the early days he knew the French market better than most other managers, this gave him an advantage....more recent years have shown he's not so good.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner
Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
i dont think we can count reyes imo, he was good when he joined but his head was turned by spanish media fucking about. the rest i agree with.
well thats a completely different debate that can fill 100 pages on the forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
of course the board are also at fault but do you honestly expect anything less from the current pile of draconian ****s?
its more wenger i think. how can a man so (seemingly) intelligent be so ignorant to borderline stupidity?
which is why i think another manager should come in. no-one on this planet would be silly enough to stick by some of the players like wenger has and pay the wages ew do.
His career suggest he wasn't really that good to be honest, what has he actually done since Sevilla?Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsMe
i never said he was great, but he was a good player. remember 04/05 at the start he lit up the league, he did alright for us, could have been brilliant but spanish media fucked that up
true but getting rid of dead wood can be difficult, i mean who will buy bentner? sunderland dont want him apparently, we cant just get rid of them either cos of contract issues. yes wenger fault that but a new man cant just come in and get rid off the shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
He shouldn't be on £50k already. This is his first season as a first team player and he's already on £50k. That's just silly. He hasn't earned that. It's not just Ramsey, it's the policy in general. If Wenger sees you as a first team starter, he'll automatically give you first team wages. It's bloody stupid because if he turns out to be a flop as seen with Alumunia, Denilson, Diaby and Bendy, we can't sell them on. The 4 players I just mentioned equates to around £200k in wages and people say we can't afford to pay superstar money to one player. Rubbish. But they're right if we stick with this bloody policy. This communist regime Wenger is trying to replicate, we'd have to pay all of our star players £200k a week because it sets a precedent and we'd never survive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm
Im sure we can flog him to benfica for 4 mill, Vela can stay where is he for 5 Mill, Denilson can go to a Spanish or Italian club for 7 mill.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
Rosciky ,Almunia and fabianski are all on free tranfers in the summer so they they go who cares.
we can free up a lot of space this summer.
true.Quote:
Originally Posted by ollie the optimist
and thats my other point, how the fuck have we got ourselves in this situation? we've created a pile of underachieving, unsaleable assets (and i use the term assets very loosely).
what is that? its poor management.
what should happen? he should be sacked.
what will happen? he'll stay.
why? because the board are incompetent.