Printable View
It makes my head spin trying to think about what the hell is going on at the club, who is responsible for what, why we haven't spent this summer. I don't believe Wenger is blameless but neither do I believe you can blame him solely. What percentage of blame would you assign to who?
I'll keep this simple by splitting it between 'the board' and Wenger.
Wenger 70%
The Board 30%.
I just don't understand why Wenger would choose not to strengthen his squad. There's literally zero logical reason.
I considered corruption, I just can't bring myself to believe he's that stupid.
I think he genuinely wanted to this year so who is responsible for our transfer dealings and negotiations? How involved does Wenger get? I thought after Graham the manager didn't get too involved but Wenger seems involved in everything we do. Whoever is responsible for our transfer dealings needs sacking, it's been a shambles from start to finish.Quote:
Originally Posted by GayPete
Dick Law does the negotiations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
I don't think Wenger is any more involved in the process than any other manager.
It has to be a mixture of both. The board don't give a fuck as long as the money rolls in and Wenger has no clue how to operate in this modern transfer market. I also think there's a shit load of misplaced faith in this squad, he probably thinks twice about signing a quality player because of how it may affect a player he's worked for a few seasons on.
There's clearly no strategy in place and the entire club has shown itself up this summer.
Wenger, allowing a squad to become to its barebones like now is unacceptable.
the thing is does he give Dick a list of signing to make in a specific order. it seems like we go after 1 person at a time. when 1 fails we have to have a rethink and then decide on another. no quick selection process or speed of thought.
Wenger has a lot of control over transfers he's said as much, in addition he's very frugal with money, he likes value for money and won't pay over what he deems to be the market value for a player. Problem is his market value is often way off and he won't shift from that.
If he can't get what he wants at the price he wants he'll move on, but on top of that his super super quality signings he promises are rarely ever so, so I'd say he's seems to have lost some of his ability at picking up top talents.
The thing is, we dont actually know how involved Wenger is.... He cant be as involved as everyone in here seems to believe, because then we could save millions in wages on all the different directors/leaders/whatever in the club.
If a manager could get whoever he wanted, of course he would he get those players. We've seen this year that we went for a 40m bid on Suarez, do you guys really believe its Wenger saying "lets not go over 40mil" or the people who runs the business part of our club (board/director/whatever)?
I believe our Manager just have enough class to not whine about the utter incompetence of some of his colleagues.
DICK OUT!Quote:
Originally Posted by GayPete
:angry:
Way ahead of you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fist of Lehmann
We do, he's said he has a big influence.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
Not Wenger, he believes in value for money and won't pay over the odds and would rather no sign someone than sign someone and pay more than he should.
I don't think Wenger has shown himself to be that classy in recent years, lots of incidents involving him, lots of lies and on top of blaming the fans plenty of patronising comments. I can't believe the guy still has supporters out there if I'm honest, what would it take to prove he's just not up to the job anymore?
I don’t believe that for a second. Wenger doesn’t separate the business aspect from the technical. If so, then contract negotiations shouldn’t influence the starting 11 and it did last season with Theo. Why did Wenger bench him? Why would contract negotiations influence him to bench his top goal scorer and assister? Shouldn’t he have been able to keep that separate? If he really wanted Theo, couldn’t he have told Dick to pay the kid what he wants so we could focus on football? It’s not as if Theo was sulking either so I don’t get why he’d do that. Also, if Wenger has the ear of Stan Kronke and then he can pretty much overrule whatever anyone else has to say. After over a decade with the club, I find it hard to believe he doesn’t have the final say .Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
I don't care. They have all feathered their nests and left the club in the lurch so they should all fuck off. They are here to do a job and sure they get paid for doing it, but they have taken care of the getting paid well bit and forgot the job bit. Even banksters resign after they have robbed the place. The thing that makes football different is the lock in they have with the customer and boy do they milk it. None of these people are fit to be in charge of a football club.
I wonder how much of that is bluster, I can't believe he seriously thinks this squad is good enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
He can't...can he?! :blink:
Are there any rules against women playing in the EPL?
Wenger all the way. No manager in this age of football would not spend on enhancing thier playing squad, it's unthinkable, fcuk me even league 1 and league 2 clubs have spent more money than the us. I cannot believe the a club like Arsenal with such liquid assets would be holding back the manage from spending the damn money unless the manager refuses to spend it. I dont blame anybody elese but this cuunt.
Who cares whose fault it is now. Quite clearly the whole lot of them are to blame, and each for their own part in the mess.
What matters now, is who is going to put it right, and whether there is any desire from anybody in charge to do that.
The worrying thing, I can't see anyone stepping up.
So the board, his bosses, have just sat by and watched him asset strip, not invest and achieve the bare minimum each season?Quote:
Originally Posted by BlindFaith_8
Even if that's true they've done bugger all about it. What manager at any other club at our level would have retained his job this long without winning any trophies?
I doubt he thinks the squad is good enough but I do believe he gets more satisfaction from developing a player. Which to be fair there's nothing wrong with, I just think he's guilty of not knowing when the right time to strengthen is. There's got to be a balance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Letters, they are all business men in that board room including Wenger, he literally runs the club from top to bottom, all the rest are bean counters and yes men to Wenger and Stan. We all know Stan has given wenger cart blanche to run the club how he see's fit. The puppets in the board room wont resign or walk way as they are making far too much money and Wenger know's nobody can challenge him as long as Stan is the main man at the club. The board I am sure have suggested to wenger but it apepars he has rejected the option to spend as he feels the squad is strong enough for 4th place and I wouldnt disagree. My beef is I want an Arsenal team to compete with Chelsea, Man U and City for the league and Bayern, Madrid and Barca in the Champions league, but the current squad is simply to weak.
We’ve seen massive changes at Board level and ownership. Wenger remains and we have the same problems. As said before, I don’t get how and why the Board would be open to the wage bill going up to a silly level and approving deals for kids based off potential. Who’s telling Dick Law to sign Jack, Ramsey, Ox and Gibbs to long term deals for massive contracts? Who else can tell the them the potential of a player? Before Dick was even here, Wenger signed up Bendy and Denilson to stupid contracts. That’s when he was doing Dein’s role.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
I'd go along with that. Wenger is just one man and as much as some may believe he does, he doesn't have the time nor the capability to micromanage every single small detail at the club. That's why there are other people working there.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
Personally 70% of my fury is directed towards Gazidis, Dick Law and the other nameless overpaid executives conducting the transfer negotiations. Total fucking incompetence and ineptitude. No planned strategy, no negotiating talent, no gravitas in the market leading to a lack of respect received from other clubs, inability to understand modern day valuations of players .............. their list of failures is endless. As much as Dein was a mong for the whole Wembley thing the guy had the stature, respect and power within the football community to make the transfer window work for us, something we've desperately missed this summer.
And 30% to Wenger for accepting the situation and not doing more in his considerable power to demand and force through transfers instead of just being content to pick up his 7 million a year and focus on his pet project of bringing in through another team of youngsters.
We won't know how the club operates unless someone publicly spills the beans which won't happen unless someone resigns and decides to go public, but I'd imagine it's something like this:
- Wenger and Gazidis/Law discuss possible targets
- Wenger gives rough estimation of his valuation of the target player
- Gazidis/Law go to work initiating contact with players representatives/clubs enquiring about availability and table a bid
- If a club rejects bid, they go to work again tabling another bid until it's accepted or they give up and try another target
I don't believe the theory either that Wenger personally vetoes any transfer that he feels that are over his valuation. We've overpaid for players in the past pre Emirates move, so I don't see that being a massive issue to Wenger.
Yes, we’ve overpaid in wages for shit players and that was before Gazidis and Dick Law. It would be nice to get down to the bottom of what happened when we were spanked to Man Utd and went on the first panic buy. Who hit the panic button and who came up with those targets?
Jesus, we're becoming a global icon for greed and stinginess. Won't be long before, "Don't be an Arsenal", or, "What a Wenger!", enters the vocabulary as a plea to selfish little kids who won't share their sweets.Quote:
Originally Posted by AKBapologist
The question is who is to blame? Reasonable observers conclude the entire company management should take a share of the recriminations. This is just common sense devoid of the simple thinking that imagines all we have to do is change the manager and all will be well. Your thinking is flawed. Just because the board has changed doesn't mean the intent of either board differs. To be brutal about it, very different characters can participate in a gang rape but they all have the same intention as they wait to abuse their victim. The change in board coupled with the disrepair of the squad being pushed beyond the pale does signify one thing though, evidently Wenger goes along with this. No manager could ever approach the season so badly prepared unless it was either by design or sheer incompetence. If the latter then the board is 100% to blame. If the former, shame on Wenger and he can stop telling us how much he loves the club.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
50/50.
Our dealings over the last eight years have been fine but this is the last straw.
#everyoneout #mental!!!breakdown #signaliadiere
Have done a lot of methodical research into the whole thing and it turns out....it's your fault.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
That doesn't surprise me at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
I knew deep down in my heart of hearts that it was the case but i felt better to do the paperwork and draw the same conclusion rather than go on gut instinct.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
LETTERS OUT!!!!
If the Board can't see by now that he's incompetent then they deserve all the flak because they've handed him the money and he still makes excuses about other billionaire clubs. I've explained this before but I can understand why the Board have been cautious. For starters, the manager has been able to mask his failings by hiding behind the 'financial doping argument'. I'm sure when our commercial deals / revenue is discussed around board meetings, some folks around that table must sit with their head low and totally embarrassed by some the deals made. They haven't been doing a good job of supporting the manager financially in that respect. How can that level of incompetence point the finger at the manager for not delivering silverware? In that respect, the Board should be chastised for poor financial management, slow to innovate or react to the modern game. That's a fair argument and criticism to be leveled at them. But we're moving past that stage because we have money in the bank and even with the little Wenger has been given, he's been very careless.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
But back to the Board. None of them are football men and don't know a damn thing about the game, so when Wenger comes with his 'project youth' blueprint and tells them Bendy is worth £52k a week and Denilson is the next big thing out of Brazil, whose going to question a man like Wenger with his record? It's a sound strategy if the man can deliver it, plus we've got to pay down the Emirates debt so why not? At Board level, investment level, you have to think long term, 5 years, 10 years, 15 years.....the trophy drought is not on their mind and they're probably right to have that mentality because we need to make sure we keep a roof over our heads. This is short term pain for them and we've only just started to see the end of the tunnel from the transition period. Wenger didn't guide them wrong when suggesting we improve facilities, buy the training ground and get a bigger stadium. He's managed to keep us in the Champions League throughout this period so it would be crazy to for them to sack him. Why get rid of him for a check book manager who needs oil money backing to win? I really can't fault them for that either. It's way too risky at a time when we can't afford to take such risks. Now that we look more secure and to actually boost revenue, we need silverware and better players, they should be putting pressure on the manager and that moment may have just come. Gazidis has thrown the spotlight on Wenger this season. Maybe they now know they don't need him as much. I hope so anyway.
I expect the Board to be cautious and think more long term but I don't expect that from the manager. I don't know how he is able to keep his pride and dignity in check with that horrendous record unless he's delusional. I think he is. All that 'not getting enough credit' talk and 4th place trophy talk is how he makes it through this period. He's on another planet. If the years of defeat had hurt him as much as hurt the fans and some of our players, he'd have been banging on doors years ago demanding key signings like players have done to him. No way would have benched Theo and then talk about Gnarby as the next wonderkid because Dick Law had fucked up contract talks. He should have been demanding answers on why they haven't secured his services, why have they let player A,B,C's contract run down. I place a huge portion of the blame on Wenger because he's not acting his role. I don't get his intentions or what motivates him. Where is his pride and self interest? He's either corrupt or an imbecile. He's a football manager and his pride should come from winning and building great championship winning teams. This is like watching a striker that doesn't want to score goals or hasn't got the balls to take a penalty. It goes against the nature of the beast.
I am very torn in all seriousness.....i do very much believe that Wenger equates spending to cheating and he'd have spent even less in the last eight years if the board and the top players he sold hadn't pressured him into selling them.
But the board i think have been inert they aren't interested in the day to day running of the club, they leave the commercial side to gazidis and leave the footballing side to wenger without any oversight and because he has been able to get the champions league revenue they don't have to wake up and realise that the only profit they are making is player sales. So in that sense Wenger has been the perfect manager because by taking on unprecedented responsibility because they don't actually have to do anything themselves and can spend board meetings smoking conchas and drinking remy martin and talking about the different exotic women they've fucked.
Typical short-termist approach because when there is no-one left to sell, they will wonder why they aren't posting record pre-tax profits anymore.....and might be forced to ask Gazidis why they are paying him for.
Sounds about right to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
If we sack Wenger we'll be 70% better off that means....hang on let me work this out
................
..................
Potato/10.
No sorry let me try again..............
.............
we'd have won the treble last season if he had been sacked last summer, well would you believe it :faint:
Well surely wenger tells them who he doesn't want in the squad anymore so he's responsible for the outgoings, that's a dead cert.
I'm also pretty sure that Ivan wouldn't have come out an said we had shitloads of money to spend on players and wages if they had no intention of doing so. Wenger could easily have come out and said they were lying and stitching him up in the process.
So that leads me to believe that it's wenger who's fucking about, not spending the money he is being offered to strengthen the squad.
He's also 100% responsible for the endless shit we see on the pitch every week. He's single handedly looks like a bunch of retards trying to fuck a doorknob.
Are you pissed again?Quote:
Originally Posted by Arse n Wonga
Wenger 80%
Board 20%
Main gripe I have with the board is they don't get rid of Wenger. They have said money is available which it clearly is for Wenger to spend.
He doesn't.
agree 100% with this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cripps
Similar to what I said
I would have done an 80/20 split too but I think Kroenke looks like a Walrus and I don't like them so I added an extra 10% for that.