Winter Transfer Despair and Bafflement.

[Niall_Quinn]

He's a crock.

Incentive based contract makes complete sense.

It makes sense if that's the general policy for all players. Is it?

When did Diaby get a pay cut? What about Theo? Welbeck? Santi? Gibbs? Ramsey plays about half a season.

At a time where money is like confetti, how does this policy help the club? Nickel and dime Jack's contract and then pay shite more to sit on the bench?

Either commit to the player or get rid. This in-between bullshit is so typically Arsenal.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Dortmund now claiming Aubergine is back in favour and they need him.

Or more money, I assume.

So it begins. As the money pigs all head to the ring it's time to see some crazy numbers.

That decision not to offer 50 mill for Lemar back when the summer window opened could be Wenger's worst yet. If Lemar had arrived early Alexis and Ozil could be on new contracts now, and I'd much prefer that to anything that has been speculated so far this window.

We don't actually need a new striker. Laca's a decent player if Wenger could find a way to include him. Don't see how Auba fits in either, not to the tippy tappy shit routine.

And we don't need a winger either, unless Wenger is going to cut out the unique back to goal wing play nonsense.

We need a DM and at least one defender.

I suspect the same is true for most, but I have no idea who Malcolm is. The excitement seems to stem from the fact he's Brazilian. But why don't the gypos or Utd or the big Euro clubs want him? I smell second tier again.

Same question for Auba. Why is he not in more demand if he's all that? We seem to be ready to splash on a player who has been fucking around, isn't wanted elsewhere and will cost a shed load when all is said and done.

Then you see Alexis being fought over by both manc clubs and the chavs with Bayern and PSG already out of the running. And we're talking big fees for a player with 4 months left on his contract. Now that's demand. Alexis is the sort of player I'd like to be in the running for.

I wonder why we didn't offer him the 250-300k when he asked for it? Way, way back? That's what top talent costs.

If this is the beginning of the end for Wenger and he's on his way out in the summer and these proposed signings have been identified by the new team and represent the start of something rather than a panic splurge, okay, that works.

But if Wenger is staying and these are fill the gap options for players on the way out and nothing else is going to change then take the chequebook, lock it away and endure the remainder of Wenger's contract. Get rid of him and start from scratch.

What we definitely don't want is that confused middle option - which is where we seem to be right now. Papering cracks.

I've no idea about Malcom's geniune qualities so I won't speculate on how he might contribute here.

Aubameyang is a world class player though. I was happy with Lacazette last summer as I knew he was a finisher (recent drought aside...hmm?) but I would have much preferred and actually wanted Aubameyang as he is significantly better, isn't so reliant on service, is better than Mane(who most of us would also take) and has pushed Lewandowski in Germany very close on the goals front whilst playing for an inferior team who have nearly all their best players cherry picked by Bayern.

If we sign him we should thank our lucky stars we aren't still relying on the immobile Giroud to steer us to glory and would actually have some forward options with him and Laca. I like Giroud but he isn't the profile of player most ideal for a free flowing attack minded Wenger side (as rare a sight as that may be these days).

But as I said last week I'm still uncomfortable with it all until we've actually signed a decent player. Transfer wise that is.....I realise Wenger is still a major problem and that you think we shouldn't make another signing whilst he is here, but if we're going to make signings, they might as well be quality ones.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I think the devil is in the detail on Wilshere's offer. If the incentive portion of the deal is so substantial that it almost makes the basic package insulting (to a top professional) then I think that is poorly judged. To pluck a figure purely out of the air, I don't think more than 33% of it should be incentive based if we really want to keep him.

If we aren't actually bothered about keeping him then of course we will just offer something that slightly undermines the fact his influence at the club is growing again.

[Niall_Quinn]

I've no idea about Malcom's geniune qualities so I won't speculate on how he might contribute here.

Aubameyang is a world class player though. I was happy with Lacazette last summer as I knew he was a finisher (recent drought aside...hmm?) but I would have much preferred and actually wanted Aubameyang as he is significantly better, isn't so reliant on service, is better than Mane(who most of us would also take) and has pushed Lewandowski in Germany very close on the goals front whilst playing for an inferior team who cherry pick all of Dortmund's players.

If we sign him we should thank our lucky stars we aren't still relying on the immobile Giroud to steer us to glory and would actually have some forward options with him and Laca. I like Giroud but he isn't the profile of player most ideal for a free flowing attack minded Wenger side (as rare a sight as that may be these days).

But as I said last week I'm still uncomfortable with it all until we've actually signed a decent player. Transfer wise that is.....I realise Wenger is still a major problem and that you think we shouldn't make another signing whilst he is here, but if we're going to make signings, they might as well be quality ones.

In truth, the money will be wasted anyway, one way or another. So I don't have an issue with Wenger wasting cash on a fast, mobile striker and then playing him on the wing with his back to goal. I mean I obviously have a huge issue with that under normal circumstances, but have gone beyond caring. So blow the money for a cheap thrill lasting a few weeks until Wenger finds a way to nullify all of the player's strengths. And he will.

But say we were genuinely trying to undo the damage now and start again. You don't let the person who made the mess run the show do you? And yet Wenger is still here, so I guess we have no intentions of fixing the problems.

It's a lose/ lose. But I accept, your version of lose is more entertaining than mine. Short term at least. So why not? Might as well. Generates a spark of interest where there was none.

Provided we don't hear fans claiming Wenger has turned a corner and deserves a new contract.

[Niall_Quinn]

I think the devil is in the detail on Wilshere's offer. If the incentive portion of the deal is so substantial that it almost makes the basic package insulting (to a top professional) then I think that is poorly judged. To pluck a figure purely out of the air, I don't think more than 33% of it should be incentive based if we really want to keep him.

If we aren't actually bothered about keeping him then of course we will just offer something that slightly undermines the fact his influence at the club is growing again.

He was on 90kpw with incentives taking it to 120kpw. Now he'll been offered 80kpw with incentives taking it to the same 120kpw. So it's a straight basic pay cut.

According to the newspapers. So all of that might be completely wrong.

The thing is, what are the incentives? Stay fit? Win the PL? Qualify for the CL? He can't guarantee staying fit, no player can. And the big incentives are so far out of our reach as to be classed as fantasy.

If the incentive is to turn up and give a shit then I guess he'll do pretty well. Wish all our players were on a contract like that. Half of them would starve.

[Niall_Quinn]

Btw, I'm talking relative terms here. 80 thousand quid a week is still a ludicrous amount of cash and far from a disgraceful offer. But this is football, the land of the lunatics. Absolute dross players are on 80k these days. Even worse players are on 120k, cough, cough, Theo Walcott.

[Özim]

It's ironic Wilshere has for the 1st time in his career managed to stay fit and perform when he's almost out of contract, reminds me of a few others, then when they get their new contracts they go back to being injured and performing awfully.

Incentive based is based for Wilshere, doesn't deserve any different, he's not performed over the years and has been injured consistently, that's ignoring his off the field antics.

We might not have applied the same rules in the past but you have to start somewhere.

[Power n Glory]

This is a disgrace. Jack has been loyal, he's Arsenal through and through, he actually wants to be here and he gives it everything when he's on the pitch. Yes, he's been desperately unlucky with injuries, but how is that different to any of our players? The likes of Walcott and Welbeck are earning more than him and deliver as much as Jack has done while stuck in the treatment room - nothing. Who else is getting a pay cut? And what is the point of bonuses at Arsenal when there's no chance of us competing? Jack can't make us competitive on his own. You might as well agree to pay such bonuses in Monopoly money because they'll never happen anyway.

Now we end up with a player who knows an injury hits him directly in the pocket. I wonder how that will work out? Good job Ozil's not on a contract like that or we'd never see him.

Joke club. If they can get it wrong they will get it wrong. Either pay him what he's worth, which is a damn sight more than Theo Walcott or Danny Welbeck btw, or tell him he should leave. He might leave anyway I suppose, now he's been kicked in the nuts at a time when every other fucker in the game is raking in the cash.

Shouldn't the goal be to try and keep as many of our decent and half decent players as possible? Because who else are we getting? Messi? Unless we win the Europa I doubt we'll even be in Europe next season, and then who wants to come here?

If Jack is happy to take a pay cut…it’s fine by me. As long as he stays at the club. But his representatives can’t advise him to sign that thing without certain guarantees. How can he? How can he play freely and secure if he knows once bad tackle could have effect his earnings? If he has a slight twinge in his ankle, does he play through the pain or try to rest to avoid getting injured? Or does he push himself recklessly because he’s incentivised by money? Also, Wenger is not the best when it comes to managing fitness. Will it just be Jack responsible for injuries or will his lawyers get involved if injured and they feel he’s been overplayed? Say it’s the reverse and Wenger does that shit where he won’t let a player finish a game or keeps them out of the team because he’s trying to avoid activating a bonus? It’s not beyond him to pull such stunts because we’ve seen it happen with Walcott and Ox when they first signed.

[Globalgunner]

It makes sense if that's the general policy for all players. Is it?

When did Diaby get a pay cut? What about Theo? Welbeck? Santi? Gibbs? Ramsey plays about half a season.

At a time where money is like confetti, how does this policy help the club? Nickel and dime Jack's contract and then pay shite more to sit on the bench?

Either commit to the player or get rid. This in-between bullshit is so typically Arsenal.

I think this is a symptom that the new guys are getting involved in these things. When the other deadweights contracts are up they will face the same changes.

[KSE Comedy Club]

It makes sense if that's the general policy for all players. Is it?

When did Diaby get a pay cut? What about Theo? Welbeck? Santi? Gibbs? Ramsey plays about half a season.

At a time where money is like confetti, how does this policy help the club? Nickel and dime Jack's contract and then pay shite more to sit on the bench?

Either commit to the player or get rid. This in-between bullshit is so typically Arsenal.

Exactly.

It's absolutely fine if this is our policy with players and it is across the board.

When you just bring it in now when our player/contract situation is fucking abysmal and with the one player who actually seems to care and wants to stay at the club - fine it is not.