Envy isn't right either! Repent!Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
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Envy isn't right either! Repent!Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
You like the word "stagnating" - you use it a lot. Did we leave Highbury to stagnate, Do we sign new players with a view to stagnate, Do we pay Wenger £8 mill a year to stagnate - ofcourse the answer to this SHOULD be no, but in your own admission "We've been stagnating". The answer is YES which is NOT acceptable, not for any Gooner inc you.
If we stagnate, we will regress because others will improve. You keep on about points totals, compared to last year it is massive regression, not stagnation. The FA cup has turned out to be the worst thing to happen to us for our future success, is getting the monkey off our back worth another 3 years of "stagnation". I personally would have preffered to lose to Wigan in the semi's & finish 5th on the basis that we may now ave a manager who's team shows progress in relation to competing at the top.
:gp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
You must have the 'gift' too!
I know. And it's that which I really didn't see coming.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dein-machine
Others are claiming they did but I'm sceptical that anyone really thought we'd be this crap this year.
Meh, whatever.
Stagnation or Regression - doesn't matter, simply not good enough from a guy paid £8 mill with a promise to fans that we are there to compete.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
:lol: Why are you choosing 2 seasons ago and not last season? Is it to make your beloved Wenger look better?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Let's compare it to last season shall we.
After 15 games last season: 35 points
After 15 games this season: 23 points
Clear regression.
Wenger out.
My post was a response to Mr Letters who seems to argue that we are doing inexplicably shit this season, where as I'm pointing out its just another example of Groundhog season.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
I find it interesting that you can think this is in anyway a defence of Wenger, I don't use the word stagnation as a defence I use it to say there is no difference between not spending and spending with this man....we aren't getting better.
And what part of my message makes you believe I think it is acceptable, I am making the point that this isn't an extraordinary season it's just another turd sandwich....and despite what the media believe the fans don't want Wenger out because of the season we are having, it's because we have seen it one too many times before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dein-machine
I find it odd that people are jumping on my comments even though I agree with them about the manager, getting a bit squirrely you need to either fuck your girlfriends or take a cold shower
I think some people saw the FA cup win, the new finances in place & the Sanchez signing as the dawn of a new era. For others the new era needed a manager with a modern approach to the game & someone who would use the new finances properly, for the good of the team. This was the biggest concern for the Wenger doubters because of history not because of the "gift" & here we are. A defensive mess, no defensive midfielder of any substance & relying on Sanchez so heavily that we will burn him out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
We still have the FA cup win, we still have decent finances, we still have Sanchez BUT ---- we still have Wenger & therefore nothing changes.
You don't even have to look at points, we can all see on the pitch just how far standards have fallen. Even last season when we were winning consistently we were boring as fuck most of the time, most wins were by the odd goal or 2. Effective yes but unrecognisable and rarely convincing.
We are debating over various degrees of shit. It doesn't matter guys, it's still shit.
At least tell me you could see the potential defensive injury crisis after failing to sign another established CB. You can’t be that blind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
It is an extraordinary season because THIS year we were told we would compete on & off the pitch. Our finances meant we could spend big. We bought Sanchez, excellent - but then made the annual Wenger catastrophe by not buying a DM & better defensive cover.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
It is not acceptable for someone on Wenger wage & with his experience to make these errors every year especially when you cannot blame finances. It is gross negligence.
You cannot say "its just another turd sandwich" when you gave the chef money for smoked salmon.
Hmm...it's debatable whether this team is much worse than previous teams, in fact this is probably our strongest squad for quite some time excusing the lack of quality and depth at the back, that's Wenger's problem, he chose to go into the season with gaping holes in Central Defence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grebbo
Money is no longer an issue, you said it yourself, the arguments are now firmly placed on Wenger's head, he's unable to deliver, PERIOD! He has everything he needs now...no time to hide behind FFP or Chelsea or City, it's all there for him to succeed!
I'm not at all surprised that Fans are frustrated, after promising so much post FA Cup win we have delivered so little, in fact we have gone backwards even though he has spent a load of money in the wrong areas?! Same old...same old...
Our poor form is a combination of many things and the fact that we went into the season so badly equipped has pretty much left us in this position.
Wenger keeps telling us the defence is the problem, too right it is, it's a Defence he created and then dismantled depth way...it's mindblowing.
Yep, also the fact that Wenger has failed to address DM or Striker position, how many windows does he need to rectify these positions? :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
He didn't want to kill Chambers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Although he's doing a pretty good job of killing him anyway. The kid wouldn't even be playing this much if he was still at Southampton because it's obvious he's not ready.
Thrown under a bus by a careless manager.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dein-machine
If the chef is shit, no matter how good the ingredients are and how much he has to spend on them, the result is still going to be a dogs dinner...so no not extraordinary at all.
Interesting. I'd forgotten how crap we were two years ago at the start of the season. That was the season though when Van Persie had just left - who had dragged us kicking and screaming into the top 4 almost single handedly the previous season. Last summer we'd ended on a high with the FA Cup win and while we lost a bit of depth in defence we signed some decent players and one outstanding one in Sanchez, we didn't lose any real superstars (arguably because we don't have any, but still). I don't think there was any reason to think we'd be quite this crap this year.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
To sum up where we are with Wenger, this morning a colleague of mine ( who is a Utd fan ) said " After that 1st half, the problem for you lot is that if you had Stoke again next Saturday it could & probably would happen again".
We can have all the in depth discussions we like on this board but even those that don't give a shit about us know the simple truth.
Yes, but would he still be in a job?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Personally speaking I envisaged us eventually dropping away as you can't keep being complacent and keep getting away with it year after year, eventually it catches up with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
If you don't try and progress the likelyness is eventually you'll be overtaken by teams who are trying to.
No but then again if he can't make something palatable out of cheaper ingredients probably shouldn't have been given the keys to the pantry in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dein-machine
We can blame injuries, or lack of quality as much as we like but we know that this guy can't deliver no matter how much he was given to spend
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKoq8dJCMAE0Sxp.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
:lol: Good analogy.
Why keep going to a restaurant with a dodgy chef that serves up weekly dishes of food poisoning? Notice in the pic how the chairs are empty? It’s getting to the point where the Board and fans have to take some sort of action.
There was clearly a risk of that. What I really don't understand is why we're so crap going forward, so slow and laboured. We have plenty of quality in midfield and up front. Ramsey is suddenly rubbish again, Ozil is patchy at best, only Sanchez is doing the biz.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
But we haven't been :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
EDIT: Liverpool are an example of a club who are 'trying to overtake us'. Have they managed to? Last year plenty of people spent all season lauding Rodgers, some of us were suggesting that there were some factors in Liverpool's success such as not being in Europe and having one player who was in ridiculous form. They lost said player and now they're in Europe and they've been even crapper than us, astonishingly. Spurs too have spent plenty of money trying to overtake us and never succeeded.
I definitely couldn't see us being so shite this season. I wouldn't go as far as to say I expected us to progress, but I was certainly hopeful.
The lack of cover at CB was a glaring mistake that everyone bar Wenger could see. But apart from that we had a lot going for us in terms of momentum from the FA Cup and signing some good players in the summer. This is our strongest squad we've had for many years, even with the injuries, and the fact it is so badly underperforming only points to one person.
Oh Wenget, what have you done.
Couldn't agree more although I think in this case the Chef certainly deserved the pantry keys in his early years. Forget all the obvious things regarding money, arrogamce, tactics etc - there isnt a job in the world that you can do better at 60 than when you were 40.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Everything has been said and repeated ad nauseum. Letters doesn't like the fact that quite a few of us told anyone who could listen that Wenger in an inadequate manager who more often than not gets lucky and scrambles over the line rather than marches over. You can check the old Goonersweb forum, the arguments to and against Wenger are no different to what we have today, only that the pro Wenger believers were more vocal back then. Many of us told you that we would NOT progress as a club under Wenger simply because he is too dogmatic, inflexible and more than anything does not want to compete. Most top managers are driven by the will to win, but that isn't the case with Wenger. He makes up his own parameters for success and tenders the final judgement that whatever he achieves is the highest possible for the club. He is a cowardly man who has found the perfect oasis for never do wells under a board of ineptitude.
Screaming and shouting at the sidelines when things are going wrong does not show a will to win only a frustration that the game he played out in his head is not materialising on the pitch. If you do not plan for a win as we mostly do. It is most likely you wont.
"He is a cowardly man who has found the perfect oasis for never do wells under a board of ineptitude"Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
This is simply "Sentence of the year" on GW. Its so good it could be from a Shakespeare play - oh & by the way every bit of it 100% on the button.
Global for PM.
:haha: HELLO?! His first name begins with A and his surname begins with W.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Andy Williams, writer of "Moon River"? :unsure:Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
I think even when we were winning things Wenger was stubborn, dogmatic etc and in many ways I think it was a barrier preventing us from being more dominant.
I think most people knew deep down that he wasn't able to take us forward. Since 2007/2008 I was convinced Wenger didnt have it in him to win us the top prizes, for me the title should have been ours that year but we evaporated, it wasnt injuries it was just a total inability to find form.
A lot of the pro Wenger argument is based on loyalty to a man who took us to extraordinary feats a long time ago but is perpetually hitting his head against a wall.
As much as he frustrated me, for me I lost faith in him totally after the 8-2 game at United since that day I'm constantly doing what the board should be doing, looking at managers at other clubs and wondering who could do a better job.
The reason we are crap going forward is because the ball isn't getting to our attacking players quick enough, we don't do enough to prevent the second ball and engineer breaks from central midfieldQuote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Just say it wetters. I know it really really hurts and you can't bring yourself to say it but just admit it, it's all wengers fault.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
We are a money bags club. You look at the wage bill compared to nearly all of Europe and we will always be in the top level of clubs. I was confident going into the season but worried about lack of defensive options. We are defensively weak, Mert has been poor and we should be looking for a first choice CB not a 3rd or 4th choice one. Especially if they knew about Koscielny injury.
Why has Wenger changed approached though? We used to be built around big strong quick players. But the transition from Vieira to Fabregas seems to have got us into this position. Wenger doesn't need to get up to date with modern football because our successful teams would still win the league now. Buy players that fit that mould and go with it.
You've got more chance of Wenger admitting its all his fault.Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
The arrogance, dog-eared determination to blame all but himself, unrivalled master of his little kingdom, surrounded by yes men ( Bould & MS ) - is it any wonder Letters won't have a word said against his hero - he's modeled himself on him.
All Wenger's fault? So the players don't take any responsibility?Quote:
Originally Posted by She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
President Harry S Truman had a placard on his Oval Office desk that says the buck stops hereQuote:
Originally Posted by Letters
The players are performing badly and aren't taking responsibility, but ultimately when this is happening who is taking control of the situation and trying to address it.
We are told in no uncertain terms that Wenger is the generalissimo when it comes to football aspects of the club, so yes ultimate power ultimate responsibility when it goes tits up
OK...and who employs Wenger...?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Our build up play has been like this for seasons.The difference is the defence being out of sorts. Swap Ramsey's form for Sanchez's and we're still looking at a team being carried by one individual on attack with dodgy strikers leading the line.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
If you had to race Oxford in the boat race & you chose to put mediocre rowers in the boat instead of the obvious quality required, who's to blame for the loss?Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters