Match Reaction vs Stoke City (away)

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Originally Posted by Delusions of Grandeur

Happy with the game and results to wanting Wenger to sign a new deal should be kept separate.

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I agree

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Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie

Give it a rest. Should fans be miserable even when we play well and win?

Of course things have calmed. But it's possible to be happy when we are playing well and still want Wenger gone (unless it's you of course).

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Give what a rest? I've seen it before and I'm not convinced there'll be anything different this time, it only takes a few wins to convince people things will be different...

Beng happy is one thing, but from previous experience I reckon it's more than that and fans going to matches are content with his performance now as opposed to before when they were highly disatisfied with his performance.

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Originally Posted by Delusions of Grandeur

Happy with the game and results to wanting Wenger to sign a new deal should be kept separate.

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It's not even wanting really Wenger to sign a new deal (they've got no say in that anyway), it's a case of being indifferent when he does and then sugar coating it by looking at the results at the end of the season.

Whether he signs a new deal or not, feeling towards him shouldn't change, but I reckon it will, but that's just my opinion, I reckon the he's feeling less under pressure now after a few wins, he's been noticeably more cocksure in the last few weeks and you can see from what he's saying that he's not overly concerned with what's happened this season.

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Originally Posted by Özim

It's not even wanting rally Wenger to sign a new deal (they've got no say in that anyway), it's a case of being indifferent when he does and then sugar coating it by looking at the results at the end of the season.

Whether he signs a new deal or not, feeling towards him shouldn't change, but I reckon it will, but that's just my opinion, I reckon the he's feeling less under pressure now after a few wins, he's been noticeably more cocksure in the last few weeks and you can see from what he's saying that he's not overly concerned with what's happened this season.

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I give credit where it’s due and I think when you’re vocal about your criticism, especially those on AFTV, I think it’s important that you can show that you can be positive and objective. It’s Arsenal Fan TV at the end of the day. We’re not Arsene FC and shouldn’t have to discuss him all the time. I think AFTV need to show that it’s not always fire and brimstone rants when we lose and can enjoy a victory.

Has anyone seen Wengers latest press conf. delusional does not even come close to describing it
https://youtu.be/Llfmhyrls7g

“if you look at the Bayern game across the 2 games, in the first half, we were already qualified”?

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Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie

Give it a rest. Should fans be miserable even when we play well and win?

Of course things have calmed. But it's possible to be happy when we are playing well and still want Wenger gone (unless it's you of course).

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This is like finding your favourite tune on the radio as the car is heading over the cliff. The fact is, if fans give it a rest then that will be immediately seized upon and exploited. Now is the time for fans to be more vocal than ever. By all means, have a cheer that the team is (eventually) winning a few (against very poor opposition it should be added), but the pressure on Wenger must be maintained if we want to translate these few wins into something useful down the line.

Also remember that the last significant test we faced in footballing terms (rather than psychological terms) was against the spuds. And we were played off the pitch. We absolutely needed a point in that game, at the very least. We failed.

What we are really seeing in these last few games is not progress - far, far, far from it. We are witnessing what is being spun into another glorious failure. 2% away. Almost did it. Nearly. Woulda, coulda, shoulda.

And look at Wenger's team selections. He's learned fuck all.

Here's what the problem is. The standards of the fans have dropped and now approach Wenger's miserable standards. So we mistranslate what we SHOULD be doing anyway, but have failed to do all season, into some measure of success by comparison to a rancid benchmark.

Wenger deserves no credit whatsoever for this rather embarrassing run-in. All we can say, if we are being truthful, is he's a slightly less outrageous fuck-up than he had the potential to be over the course of this miserable season.

And we still aren't playing well by the way. Not by the standards we have set in the past. We are cheering because we have managed to get back to the very basics during limited phases of the last few matches. We can pass again. We can shoot again. We're even getting the odd cross into the box. Hallelujah. Our so-called rivals, that this abusive and money grabbing board suggested we'd be challenging by now, do all that without effort.

Keep the pressure on because failure to do so will mean failure guaranteed on the pitch. That's probably the outcome regardless, but it's worth fighting against it right up until Wenger's pen hits that contract - if for nothing else than to show that, no, we do not accept these shitty standards.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

This is like finding your favourite tune on the radio as the car is heading over the cliff. The fact is, if fans give it a rest then that will be immediately seized upon and exploited. Now is the time for fans to be more vocal than ever. By all means, have a cheer that the team is (eventually) winning a few (against very poor opposition it should be added), but the pressure on Wenger must be maintained if we want to translate these few wins into something useful down the line.

Also remember that the last significant test we faced in footballing terms (rather than psychological terms) was against the spuds. And we were played off the pitch. We absolutely needed a point in that game, at the very least. We failed.

What we are really seeing in these last few games is not progress - far, far, far from it. We are witnessing what is being spun into another glorious failure. 2% away. Almost did it. Nearly. Woulda, coulda, shoulda.

And look at Wenger's team selections. He's learned fuck all.

Here's what the problem is. The standards of the fans have dropped and now approach Wenger's miserable standards. So we mistranslate what we SHOULD be doing anyway, but have failed to do all season, into some measure of success by comparison to a rancid benchmark.

Wenger deserves no credit whatsoever for this rather embarrassing run-in. All we can say, if we are being truthful, is he's a slightly less outrageous fuck-up than he had the potential to be over the course of this miserable season.

And we still aren't playing well by the way. Not by the standards we have set in the past. We are cheering because we have managed to get back to the very basics during limited phases of the last few matches. We can pass again. We can shoot again. We're even getting the odd cross into the box. Hallelujah. Our so-called rivals, that this abusive and money grabbing board suggested we'd be challenging by now, do all that without effort.

Keep the pressure on because failure to do so will mean failure guaranteed on the pitch. That's probably the outcome regardless, but it's worth fighting against it right up until Wenger's pen hits that contract - if for nothing else than to show that, no, we do not accept these shitty standards.

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:gp: He's clearly feeling less pressure now and with each win the fan pressure has been easing off, now sure I get we got a few results (albeit against not so great opposition as you mentioned), but come on these are results that actually came at a time when there is no pressure on the players, pretty meaningless in my book, as you mentioned the Spurs game was make and break and we were outclassed.....since then it's been a pointless excercise of hoping other teams collapse to let us back in...woeful!

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Originally Posted by Delusions of Grandeur

I give credit where it’s due and I think when you’re vocal about your criticism, especially those on AFTV, I think it’s important that you can show that you can be positive and objective. It’s Arsenal Fan TV at the end of the day. We’re not Arsene FC and shouldn’t have to discuss him all the time. I think AFTV need to show that it’s not always fire and brimstone rants when we lose and can enjoy a victory.

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Let's be fair though, what credit do the team deserve after such a poor season where they have pretty much failed every test they had and really only started getting a few results when the pressure was off and noone thought they had a hope of top 4 anyway?

I can't take these results seriously, because none of them were meaningful game, we were just trying to claw back a few points from the impossible position we put ourselves in and Liverpool finally put the idea that we might get top 4 to bed yesterday. Enjoy the games that's fine, but don't forget that ultimately we've failed so the pressure should not ease off the manager and the club....something that has certainly happened after 3 mere wins.

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Here's what the problem is. The standards of the fans have dropped and now approach Wenger's miserable standards

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I see it differently. I have more of problem when you and Zim say Wenger is going to get a new deal anyway. If that’s the general feeling with fans, why keep up the protest? Why keep the pressure on if it’s out of our hands?

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Originally Posted by Delusions of Grandeur

I see it differently. I have more of problem when you and Zim say Wenger is going to get a new deal anyway. If that’s the general feeling with fans, why keep up the protest? Why keep the pressure on if it’s out of our hands?

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Because ultimately if you're unhappy about things you have to kick up a fuss and hope it works, keeping quiet guarantees no change, but at least is the fans revolts and skip matches etc there's a chance someone might take note (however small). If you put a manager under pressure he's more likely to jack it in at the end of the day, however if you let him have an easy ride and he wants to stay then he will.