Probably a rational explanation for it, like he was fucking Wengers daughterQuote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Printable View
Probably a rational explanation for it, like he was fucking Wengers daughterQuote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
I thought I read somewhere that Gnabry was going on loan to Herta Berlin. Talking of Gnabry, does he look a lot trimmer now than he used to?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kano
Gnabry will probably be on an extended holiday after his Olympic exploits.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kano
Wenger said he wanted to get him onto a new contract and keep him at the club for 'a long time' so it looks like he as future here. Trimmer? Not sure. Been a while since I seen him play before recently. Still a similar physique to Ox but had a cracking Olympics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goonermarvee
Adzz, I'd be surprised if he is. He played next to no football last season, so he should be more than fresh to crack on one he's back.
Kind of feel gutted for Campbell. Gave better performances than the Ox and Theo last season and unlike those two, you could tell that he really appreciated and valued the opportunity to play for a club of our stature.
From the club point of view it makes sense as with the English/Homegrown quota, the likes of Iwobi, Ox and Theo were always going to have an advantage over him.
Why can't Wenger join Sporting as well?
Then he could loan Campbell back to us where we need him.
Sporting only has 200 staff to pay. What would Wenger do with all the spare time?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw
That. Or he will be injured.Quote:
Originally Posted by adzzzbatch
Count his money and study the stats so he can plan for his next dozens central midfield signings.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
Definitely catching up. The fans and the media are starting to head towards the same page.Quote:
Originally Posted by AFC Leveller
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footba...-means-8651700
The board won't care. The manager won't care. But the sponsors might.
How about a campaign that requires Wenger to leave within 3 months or else no Arsenal fan will fly Emirates and furthermore will encourage everyone they know to uphold the boycott? I'm sure there are other sponsors that can be targeted likewise. Then the board will develop a keen attention.
I'm waiting for a story to come out that claims Wenger has refused to pay 600 Arsenal employees, stating he has no money left after all the transfer activity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
Pressure is getting on the senile goat, and I cannot wait to see this slow moving car crash! Good way to piss on his legacy.
:dance:
Part of that legacy is a pile of trophies, the Invincibles and some of the best football ever seen. That's never being written out of the record books. Which makes it all the more sad the bloke is prepared to carry on. What will be the first thing that comes to mind when his name is mentioned in the future? That's what he has to decide now.
Brian Reade making the point that I've been making for ages and get slated for, Wenger of course is a prevaricating ninny totally out of touch with the modern game but he's served for a long time as a useful lightning rod for those at the top. I fail to understand how anyone can think it could be any other way and that this old dinosaur is a tyrant who everyone is too afraid to challenge, he is kept on because it's useful for the purposes of Kroenke et al to keep him on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
I think people slam me more of our frustration because they want to believe things will get better when Wenger eventually leaves, but realistically they won't. This is the kind of club we are now, Kroenke is going nowhere and even when he croaks it will pass on to his sons.
Arsene Wenger warned that Shkodran Mustafi will cost €50m - Guillem Ballague
:lol:
You are weird...Quote:
Originally Posted by fakeyank
Why would you be happy to see his legacy tarnished further? The things we did in the first half of his time with us, and the style in which we did it, are things I never thought I'd see as an Arsenal fan.
I've said this to you before, read Fever Pitch if you want an idea of what being an Arsenal fan was like in the 70s and 80s.
I don't understand how you (and you are not the only one) can be so bitter.
Over time people tend to look back with rose tinted glasses and remember the good times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
What do people remember about Clough? It's not that he took Forest down.
People will remember what he did for us, and they should. But he won't go down as one of the all time greats as he could have done.
His legacy is the stadium so that's pretty much secure. It's just a shame now people will have to mention the fact he went mental at the end of his tenure.
True. I’ve already heard PHW being revered after he’s gone even though he was a piece of shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
The story Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader. Or Harvey Dent at the end of Dark Knight.:sulk:Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
It's all relative, Hill Wood was an old fart and a relic....a chairman for the days when we were a relatively small club in terms of revenue. Dein was the man he deferred to because he understood the game better than him. The difference is unlike Kroenke, Hill Wood cared about the club it had been part of his family for generations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
I don't know how true this is but my understanding is that Dein was resistant to us moving to a new stadium, I think he felt the money would be better spent on signings. Short termist approach perhaps, but he probably knew that the clubs inate conservative tendencies would prevent it doing what was necessary to make us a dynasty.
I would think they will think of him as a fairly slightly above average manager looking at his management record alone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
I think that's generally true but the caveat is how long this period carries on for. Clough left immediately after they were relegated and in the years previous to that was still getting to FA and League Cup finals - which we know were a much bigger deal back then. No one can ever take away the glory of the first ten years of Wengers time here and people are sadly bitter if they try to distort what happened with the squad and players at his disposal then. But if he was to carry on for another few years there would be a danger that people would look back and say "Wenger was great, won this, won that, until...". Ideally he needs to knock it on the head after this season to ensure he doesn't begin to damage how people look back on him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters
Prepare yourself for a world of disappointment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
Historically a manager is judged by his greatest achievements rather than the totality of his career, for Managers like Ferguson he comes up well whichever way you look at it. Clough on the other hand will always be remembered as the quotable, abrasive, arrogant but charismatic character who achieved something unprecedented with Notts Forest and rightly so.
He wouldn't have cost that much if he'd been looking to strengthen earlier n the transfer window. In my opinion we need to buy a new CB for this season anyway. Per is slowing, Kos can make howlers and we finished Chambers of before he got started. (I really don't know why Chambers hasn't been sent out on loan to learn his craft in a less pressured situation.) I haven't seen enough of Holding to know how good he is. (I do know that he didn't cost 55 mil so he can't be that good :whistle:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchies
So we're down to 9 days to go before the transfer window closes, so of course anyone we're in for now is going to cost more than they should have. Unless a club desperately needs the money they hang out for more.
The longer it goes on the more damaging it will be but the last 3 years have been:Quote:
Originally Posted by Kano
Won the FA Cup and finished 4th
Retained the FA Cup and finished 3rd.
Finished 2nd.
He's not exactly 'done a Moyes'. The issue is he's not making the most of our considerable resources. The fact I feel we should be competing for the title is down to Wenger, but the fact we're not is too and it's increasingly apparent he's not the man to push us on. In time though his legacy will be appreciated.
He's going to cost closer to that because Valencia know we're desperate and we have money. Had we moved earlier right when Per got injured it would have been £25 max.
Wenger's dithering once again costing us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
:lol: Hill Wood is part of reason why we're in this shit. He booted Dein from the Board, advised the Board to sell their remaining shares to Kroenke once Jabba came on the scene and then Lady Nine and Richard Carr left because of PHW.Quote:
'Thoroughly ignorant people seem to have a say nowadays.
'It is a few hotheads jumping up and down thinking they are being clever.
'It is the most ridiculous way to behave really because normal people are forever saying boards act too hastily when they get rid of a manager.'
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...#ixzz4I3RomNZD
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
He cares for his investment and own survival.
I think that's the world he lives in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw
Bit like MrsL :cool:
:(
Again my point was to look at it relatively, Hill Wood booted Dein from the club because he recommended Kroenke in the first place and Hill Wood refused to countenance giving him a place on the board. Fiszman also sold his shares to KSE before he died, because he mistakenly believed he was doing the right thing because he represented less of a risk to the club's stability than Usmanov.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
I think they were wrong to sell their shares but Hill Wood himself owned a very nominal amount of shares and didn't massively financially benefit from Kroenke's majority ownership. Was he the best owner ever, no like i say he was an old Tory fart whose grandfather took on the club as blue chip stock, certainly wasn't open to change said of Kroenke "we don't want his kind here" but compared to an absentee owner who purely looks upon Arsenal as just another asset in his collection, PHW was preferable.
I personally think it's a bit of both TBH, I think the mess we are in is because both the board and Wenger are in complete agreement over our flawed recruitment policy, it's not just that though is it, Wenger is in complete control of the Technical side so is a "law to himself", it all starts and ends with him, he's in complete control and is questioned by nobody.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
In regards to our recruitment policy Wenger isn't forced "not to buy", the issue isn't even that he needs to spend irresponsibly, he just chooses to use this argument as a deflection tactic, it's straw man and quite frankly ridiculous TBH.
No amount of excuse making by Wenger about his reluctance to recruit will wash with me, he's leaving holes in the squad every single season and it's negligent, he's basically not doing his job properly and needs to be called out on it until he addresses it. If he feels buying players like Rob Holding resolves issues in the team/squad then I'm cool with that if these signings deliver and immediately improve our team, but until I/we see tangible evidence that his recruitment policy is successful then people have every right to question him.
I'm actually quite bored of the whole thing, he won't listen, anybody who dares to question his methods is marked down as "stupid" or "easily influenced", we are all wrong to even dare to suggest he should improve the team by paying the "market rate" to buy players who are better than what we have.
Wenger is pretty much on his own crusade with his issues with the market. The market won't change just for him.
I'm looking at it relatively and PHW sparked our demise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
It goes back to the question of why we built the stadium in the first place and what was the intention? Dein invited Stan so he could invest from the outside and we’d share Wembley stadium instead of building a new one. Why? Maybe he didn’t want to see us suffer for 10 years on the football pitch. I don’t know if that was the smart business move or how that would have worked out but there are footballing reasons behind that. He may have saw what was about to occur.
What were PHW’s reasons for wanting the stadium? Stan has his shares but his association with Dein means he’s frozen out. So the pair go their separate ways. PHW stepped in and welcomed Stan on to the Board. Why and how? Dein called upon Stan to be an outside investor and back the club on the field with his money but now PHW has got in his ear and Stan’s now on the Board after saying he wasn’t welcome. Again, how and why? I suspect the self-sustaining model PHW pitched had Stan skipping and shouting ‘yeeha’ after picturing the money rolling in. I don’t know but I suspect it’s possible.
Why has PHW sat comfortably with the way the club has been run under Kroenke? You have scorn for Stan but nothing for the man that invited him to the house and most likely pitched the idea and vision? Lady Nina has said she regrets selling her shares to Kroenke and wants Dein and Usmanov to run things. Pretty shocking. So she feels mislead and is unhappy about the club but PHW isn’t. Why?
You do realise Kroenke didn't get involved in Arsenal until 2007 where he bought up shares that were sold by ITV....we'd moved into the Emirates stadium long before Kroenke had any involvement at the club so i don't get the first part of your statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Plus would you really want Arsenal playing at Wembley so far away from Islington?. I think it was one of those instances where Dein was wrong. We were right to build the stadium, just think there has been a total failure to build upon it.
PHW has stayed quiet about the state of the club since he stepped aside, so hard to know what he thinks. You seem to think i am defending him, but first of all there is no comparison between him and Kroenke because PHW was never the owner as we never had an owner at Arsenal before Kroenke, and Hill Wood was as i've repeated a remote old fart who was totally out of touch for the modern era of football...but yes on balance i think he had the interests of the club more at heart than Kroenke does, he was a merchant banker so no doubt money was more important to him than football but during the days of Highbury there was at least a connection between him and the manager and the players.
I don't disagree with anything you have said about Wenger, but that's not the point....he's an employee.....unless he is blackmailing someone to stay in charge he isn't unsackable.....the fact that no-one has looked to get rid of him shows that they are happy with how he's performing and therefore those are the people who are to blame.Quote:
Originally Posted by selassie
Why would I need to do that :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw
PHW was another horrible little man, I remember people supporting him when I was calling him up for what he was.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
We seem to have had a few pompous guys like him at the club who think they are above everyone else.
Why is 2007 and when Kroenke got involved relevant to my post?Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
It boils down to two opposing ideologies on Board at Arsenal. Dein wanted outside investment, PHW wanted a self sustaining model. My post above is about how Stan was introduced to the club in the first place and how he's seemed to switch from Dein's agenda over to PHW's.
The Wembley vs Emirates stadium question is irrelevant as well. We don't know how that would have turned out but since you say this club is screwed under current conditions draw your own conclusions.
Is this not a defence of PHW over Stan? :lol: You were making a case that he cared for the club more than Stan. How? Because he inherited it? How does he have the clubs best interest at heart when he's invited Stan to the Board and has no intention of letting Wenger go. He's happy with the way things are run here. That quote I posted was from December 2014. That's after he's stepped aside as Chairmen and he only stepped aside because of health issues.
I don't necessarily think Dein was ever opposed to the self-sustainability model....even when seeking outside investment i don't think he was looking for a sugar daddy who would make all our signings for us, he was looking for someone to give us the means to expand and Kroenke certainly didn't change his mind as that is always how he's run sporting enterprises.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
The point i am making is that Hill Wood was wrong to persuade the board to sell to Kroenke and his attitude about it now obviously shows that he is still out of touch, but the point is as chairman he had a demonstrably more hands on relationship with the club than the current majority share holder. I never denied it was a defence of Hill Wood over Kroenke it's abundantly clear that whilst i am not overly fond of either of them, i prefer the former to the latter.
Again a hypothetical, but do you think Kroenke would have cared enough to remove Bruce Rioch from his job for not being ambitious enough?
A lot of people thought the stadium was the way forward and in that sense Dein was the one dissenting voice, were all of those individuals...including Ken Friar, Danny Fiszman et all just totally obsessed with money?.
"Dein invited Stan so he could invest from the outside and we’d share Wembley stadium instead of building a new one"
Those are your words which suggests that Kroenke's involvement pre-dates the move to the Emirates, i was thinking unless you knew something i didn't that, that was an error on your part.